# Virgin queen, few bees



## GFWestTexas (Jul 10, 2021)

Capped brood will get the numbers up, I would go with at least two frames. Restrict your entrance. You can make follower board out cardboard, but restrict their space, give more space when needed. You want to make sure the brood get covered. Lastly I would feed both sugar syrup, and pollen at least until the colony has foragers, laying queen etc. I often make splits, and won’t have forager for two weeks, they do fine, so long as they aren’t robbed out and have food. You really do have multiple options with this where you are located.


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## jwcarlson (Feb 14, 2014)

Once the new queen starts laying (about a month after you did the split, so figure out when that would be), you can swap the positions of the weak one with the stronger one. And/or give them capped brood. Trying to shake bees in is just about useless. Open brood they aren't likely to be able to care for. 
I wouldn't do anything else until I saw that she's laying. Then you can start with the swapping positions or brood moving. You don't want to swap now because it might cause the queen to go back to the wrong hive and that might cause you some real issues.


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## gator75 (Apr 21, 2021)

Yeah, think I will sit tight till I see her return and laying. Once she does, there won't be many bees to cover the eggs, though. I think I'll add capped brood at that point. If I add bees with the brood frame, will the hive accept them? There are foragers coming back with pollen. But I will continue to feed. They shouid have plenty of pollen stored 2 weeks from now when they need it.


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## GFWestTexas (Jul 10, 2021)

gator75 said:


> If I add bees with the brood frame, will the hive accept them?


Never had a issue with any fighting, nurse bees will stay, if you take a forager or two they will head home.


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

So, just how many bees is a few bees? That will make a difference on what you can do to boost population. The hive is in a critical stage right now, with the virgin queen not laying yet. If there's enough bees, like at least one frame covered both sides, then it might be better to wait until she is mated. 2 covered frames would be much better but at least one fully covered. 

You can shake bees from open larva frames onto the top of the lid. Any older bees will fly back home, young nurse bees that have not had an orientation flight yet will crawl down and into the hive. This is one way to be sure you are boosting with younger nurse bees that can be an immediate help to a weak hive. But if you have at least one full frame covered with bees now inside, then I'd wait until the queen is mated. If it's less bees than that, then I'd shake more onto the top of the lid now.


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## gator75 (Apr 21, 2021)

I think 1 full frame at least. Have 2 bee wide opening and guards are doing a great job of keeping intruders at bay.


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## GFWestTexas (Jul 10, 2021)

Edited, sounds like a plan. ( Didn’t want the thread messed up)😀


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

Let us know how this works out for you, whatever you do.


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## gator75 (Apr 21, 2021)

I got a laying queen! Now I need to add bees!


Or, I'd really like to combine her with a larger hive that is queen less but has a frame of queen cells. Can I remove the queen cells and do a paper combine? I'd hate for her to be killed. I'd really like to save the larger colony and she needs a lot more bees. So it makes sense. Larger colony has been queenless probably 30 days. There were two open queen cells but no sign of a queen. So I added a frame of eggs and now there are 6 10 day old q cells.

Maybe keep those queen cells in a 2 frame nuc for insurance incase they kill this queen? My goal is to over winter two hives. I have a large one kicking that is good. Then this small nuc with new laying queen, and a deep and super with plenty of bees and stores, but no queen.

Other options is to keep her in nuc. Add bees, and see if large colony can make a new mated queen. Problem there is bees are dwindling and it will be at least 12-14 more days.

advice?


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

Flip a coin. 
If your are going to join, better do it today, 10 day old queen cells might emerge tomorrow, for sure by the day after. You might not have such good results if you join and the one hive has a fresh virgin running around.

I myself prefer waiting until you newly mated queen has emerging sealed brood. I think she's more stable then, but I can see the need for joining her with your other hive also. 6 of one and a half dozen of the other. Flip a coin.


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## gator75 (Apr 21, 2021)

If they are that close. I'll let them hatch out. I can get this nuc going strong in the meantime with some sealed brood.. Still gives me a week to combine. Just won't be very many bees in the old hive if that queen is eaten by one of the thousand dragon flies in my yard.

I can alway overwinter this nuc and roll with three queens. Yep. Going that route.

thanks!


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

You can still do the join some time later if the new queen cells don't work out. I think you are doing it the more correct way, but it's a fine line to decide. I'd have done it like you are doing myself.


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## gator75 (Apr 21, 2021)

She hatched and is laying well. Inside 24 days from split.


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

Very Nice!
Thanks for the update.


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