# Which wax to buy to coat plastic foundation



## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

Which wax should I buy if I want to add additional wax to my plastic foundation? 

I would like it to be as clean/healthy as possible.

I should have been more clear...

#1 I don't have any wax; this will be a new colony started from a nuc.

#2 I was surprised to see that there was just a slight mist of wax applied to the PF-120's.

#3 I read the articles in the new issue of "Bee Culture" concerning the acceptance of plastic foundation and since I'm a hobbyist I can take the time to "tinker around".


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## Brent Bean (Jun 30, 2005)

Why buy it? Let your bees make it for you, that’s what I do with my wax capping’s after I extract honey. If your hives are healthy they will be clean. 
If you currently don’t have any bees buy the wax coated foundation until you do get your own wax it would probably be more cost effective than buying wax and applying it yourself.


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## bleta12 (Feb 28, 2007)

BeeCurious said:


> Which wax should I buy if I want to add additional wax to my plastic foundation?
> 
> I would like it to be as clean/healthy as possible.


I woud not add anything to the plastic foundation. 
The best results are achieved only if you put these foundations on a honey flow or when you are feeding them syrup.

Good luck Gilman


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## BEES4U (Oct 10, 2007)

How are going to coat the foundation?
FYI, I have dipped foundation and I have not. No detectable difference.
I have painted the wax on the foundation.
Have the bees draw out the foundation above the lower brood chamber as they draw out foundation best where it is warm and they can cluster.
Use a high quality capping wax.
My bees have drawn out case after case of Pierco foundation.
Regards, Ernie


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## MichaelW (Jun 1, 2005)

Plastic foundation performs poorly with the bees most people use around here, including myself. One beekeeper here used a short roller to paint wax on plastic foundation for 500 frames and every frame was drawn out perfectly. I'll be trying it this year.

You need beeswax for the plastic foundation. If you can't purchase some from a beekeeper or somewhere else, I would recommend buying wax foundation until you can save up some wax yourself. Generally, plastic foundation and beginning beekeeping don't go well together. Waxed plastic should work fine.


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## Brent Bean (Jun 30, 2005)

I’ll have to disagree with MichaelW, I have used both wax and plastic foundation and have had equal results with both. But the advantages to plastic are better. 1) wax moths won’t destroy it, if you get wax moths in the drawn comb scrape it off and re-use it. 2) It won’t collapse in the extractor. 3) It won’t fall apart in cold weather. 4) if your frames are damaged by mice or just go bad pull out the plastic foundation and install it in a new frame.
I have found that bees seem to draw it out faster by brushing on some wax, but I think the reason is honeybees will rob wax from some areas to build comb in areas that they want comb building to take place. So by having a little wax on the plastic foundation they will use it to start comb. Even tho I have had many frames drawn out without coating them with wax. 
I have switch over to all plastic and as the wax foundation goes bad or gets rotated out because of age it will go away for good.
If you are just starting out chose either plastic or wax and stay with one or the other, I have found that if you mix them in the same hive they will work one and virtually ignore the other.


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## Grant (Jun 12, 2004)

If your conditions are ideal (strong colony, good flow) plastic is not an issue. Lots of guys have great luck and wonder what all the complaining is about.

The rest of us just seem to struggle in our ignorance and the plastic frames end up in a box in the garage.

For starting out nucs/packages, I would really recommend conventional wax foundation, or additional wax coating on plastic. Since you're beginning, I would go with conventional wax, then use your cappings to coat additional frames of plastic as you expand.

If you're convinced you want plastic all the way, do you have a beekeeper with healthy hives who would sell you enough wax to get started this first year?

Grant
Jackson, MO http://www.makingplasticframeswork.homestead.com


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## joekurm (Sep 23, 2007)

*How to coat*

I actually have 2 questions. 

1. I bought some plastic foundation from a apiary and was wondering what brand it is. It is white and hac the design embossed on it and is wax coated. Is this pierco? or are there other brands? There is no nombers or name on it.


2. Is it that easy to roll or brush on the wax for uncoated plastic? What is the procedure if there are any tricks. I waas told to keep it wrapped until I use it so that the smell of the wax would be strong and the bees would accept it better.


Thanks


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## WVbeekeeper (Jun 4, 2007)

Does anyone use the Bee-O-Pac plastic frames? If so do you coat these with 
wax or just starve the bees for space until they start building in them?
From this link it look as if the frames were not coated. 
http://www.beeosphere.com/Photos/tabid/754/Default.aspx
I'd like to try some but have never used the plastic and I really don't wish to 
invest $54 on something that won't work for me. Does anyone have anything 
encouraging to say about using Bee_O_Pac frames?


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## Allen Martens (Jan 13, 2007)

Why not buy plastic foundation that is already coated with wax? Save you a lot of hassles and work. I agree with several of the other posters, if you have a decent honey flow or are willing to feed syrup, acceptance is not a problem.



Brent Bean said:


> But the advantages to plastic are better. 1) wax moths won’t destroy it, if you get wax moths in the drawn comb scrape it off and re-use it. 2) It won’t collapse in the extractor. 3) It won’t fall apart in cold weather. 4) if your frames are damaged by mice or just go bad pull out the plastic foundation and install it in a new frame.


For all these reasons I doubt if I'd go back to wax foundation. It's a treat having no blown frames in the extractor, especially if the frames have some granulation. I also like being able to take drawn plastic foundation from a broken frame and transfer it to a new frame with relative ease.


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## MichaelW (Jun 1, 2005)

They don't put enough wax on the plastic. Its not surprising that Brent would have different results. I've heard various results from different people, but in our area no one I know of has excellent results with it. It could be the sometimes intermittent'ness' of our spring flow.


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## Brent Bean (Jun 30, 2005)

MichaelW:

I agree that they don’t put enough wax on the foundation, that’s one reason I quit buying it, what they charge, it wasn’t worth the extra money. Especially when I had enough of my own wax to do the job. I coat them with a generous amount of wax and haven’t had problems with bees drawing out plastic. I have heard lots of beekeepers not having luck with plastic and I don’t have an explanation for that. Different nectar flow, perhaps?


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## Allen Martens (Jan 13, 2007)

The local supplier I buy my foundation from sell coated and uncoated frames for the same price. I noticed quite a large price difference for some of the US suppliers. I've built about 10,000 frames with plastic foundation in the last 5 years and the bees have built them out quickly and nicely for the most part. That being said, we do have several decent to intense flows in our area most summers.

If you are coating foundation, how many can you do in an hour?


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## FANNBEE (Jun 19, 2007)

*bee culture*

Bee Culture Feb 2008 magazine has a good article on addign wax to plastic foundation.


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## Oldbee (Sep 25, 2006)

"which wax to buy to coat plastic foudation"?---------WAX PRODUCED BY HONEY BEES!

"I would like it to be as clean/healthy as possible"----find/call someone in your state/area that you "believe" has chemical free wax! Very simple.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I've been using the PF120s with no added wax with good acceptance.


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## Mabe (Mar 22, 2005)

Ditto to the comments that the bees accept plastic and draw it out well during a good honey flow, but a very simple way to add wax at other times is to warm up a wad of fragrant, clean wax and crayon it onto the plastic. The heat of the hive smoothes it out nicely. I have brushed molten wax on and used a small roller and the crayoning technique is the easiest, least messy, and the bees seem to like it just as well as the more labor intensive methods. By the way, I use Pierco black.

Mabe


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## BGhoney (Sep 26, 2007)

If you want good bees wax, just join a bee group in your area, I'm sure someone will hook you up for a song. The story in Bee culture, says to heat the wax to 155 degrees and paint it on the plastic frames, with a 4 inch foam brush.

I haven't tried it yet but I will. If you feed with sugar water, or are in a good honey flow, they can draw plastic. It seems to be harder than wax, but a light coating of extra wax could help.

Good luck, and welcome


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## trapperbob (May 27, 2007)

The real question here is are you going to extract or crush and strain if you are going to crush and strain cut that plastic into starter strips and just cut the comb out into a bucket and your ready to to get started. But if you really want to wax from cappings are probably best to coat the foundation.


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## kenpkr (Apr 6, 2004)

Just in case, I'm re posting Grant's website about plastic frame acceptance because it is good reading- http://plasticfoundation.homestead.com/
Thanks Grant! 

Fatbeeman sells chemical-free small-cell foundation, I believe. He may have some wax cakes he'd sell you. http://www.geocities.com/fatbeeman/


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