# Organic honey?



## seyc (Jul 15, 2012)

This is my first year beekeeping. I have dealt a bit with Organic certification, but not with bees. To have "Organic" eggs or milk, you have to prove the cows and chickens have been eating "Organic" food, or been in fields that have not been treated with non-approved "Organic" chemicals for 7 years, since the day they were born.

How can someone prove that every flower, etc. in a 2-5 mile radius from their hive has been grown "Organically"?

:scratch:


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## Tiwilager (Mar 13, 2012)

Doesn't seem possible. I think a lot of people will say that you can't label your honey as organic, but you can label it as no chemicals used in hive.
You would have to own all the land and not have treated any of it. I think it is close to 9000 acres? Did I remember that right?

That being said, I saw a bottle of honey at Costco labelled Organic. I am sceptical. It said it was a blend of Canadian and Brazilian honey. I can' imagine they know for sure that it is, but I don't know how they get away with labelling it organic.

Edit: Here is their website: http://naturoney.com/en/index.php.
It says they are certified with Ecocert Canada, and that it is certified without pesticides or antibiotics.


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## BeekeepingIsGood (Aug 12, 2012)

In Canada to qualify of Organic certification you need, amoungst other things, a 3km radius from sprayed fields. 

To my knowledge there is only one apiary in Ontario, some in the middle of nowhere in alberta, and the largest organic producer in North America is a dude named Anicet Desrochers who is a good bit off the beaten path in Quebec. There is a feature length documentary(with english subtitles) that follows him around through a season. There a few online videos with him too but they are pretty much all in french.


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## seyc (Jul 15, 2012)

I am glad Canada has something clear as to define what "Organic" is for honey. I have seen it on local honey. Around here, there are too many little pieces of property to keep track of who has sprayed and who has not.


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## activematrix (May 10, 2012)

In order to sell honey as organic in the US, it has to be certified by a USDA registered certifying company. Not only can you not use anything nonorganic in the hive, but there cannot be any nonorganic fertilizers or pesticides in use within a 4 mile radius, nor can there be any "sanitary landfills, incinerators, sewage treatment facilities, power plants, golf courses, towns or cities, land to which prohibited materials are applied, and all other sources of potential contamination". You also have to use foundation made only from organically produced wax.

Basically, if you see organic honey produced anywhere besides the US, Canada or Europe, I would say that it is most likely BS. I have also heard of people selling honey as "Organically Produced" or "Organically Managed" which could possibly lead to you getting into trouble with the USDA - trouble that could get you a $10,000 fine PER infraction. As I understand it, every illegal sale of improperly labelled honey is an infraction.

In short, it's not even worth thinking about unless you have a bee yard in THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE!


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## seyc (Jul 15, 2012)

Well, I know that one of them is a mile and a half from a coal strip mine and power generation plant. Around here, "the middle of nowhere" means surrounded by timber land. The timber companies spray some toxic things on their trees. I was just wondering if it was as impossible as I thought it was to get "Organic" honey.


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## btmurph (Aug 7, 2011)

I've seen mentioned chinese honey labeled usda organic... the cert here in the states is basically a joke


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## activematrix (May 10, 2012)

The USDA relies on outside companies to inspect apiaries for organic compliance. Some of those companies may be more scrupulous than others, and if you consider that the Chinese government fakes passports to get 12 year old girls into the Beijing Olympics... I would question the trustworthiness of a Chinese organic inspection company. As far as apiaries near powerplants in the US, are you sure that is an organic apiary? Same goes for near managed forest land sprayed by pesticides. If so then its definitely not withing the USDA's organic guidelines!


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## deknow (Jul 17, 2006)

activematrix said:


> ....definitely not withing the USDA's organic guidelines!


Which guidelines would those be?

deknow


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## seyc (Jul 15, 2012)

activematrix said:


> As far as apiaries near powerplants in the US, are you sure that is an organic apiary?


I would say that the apiary near the coal strip mine and power plant is not organic, but they stick that label on their honey.


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## Andrew Dewey (Aug 23, 2005)

As has been previously stated, the USDA through their various certifying agencies controls the organic designation in the US. Also as previously stated an organic apiary needs to be able to demonstrate that all the territory the bees may forage is free from chemical application (fertilizers, pesticides etc) and is also free of any automatic disqualifiers such as landfills. The US has reciprocal agreements with several other countries (Canada and I think the European Union) so that whatever is certified there is recognized as organic by the US. Supposedly products originating in other countries need to be certified by a company authorized by the USDA to do so.

An alternative standard to consider is certified naturally grown. CNG standards are based mostly on how the beekeeper keeps bees and handles hive products (honey, wax, etc) The CNG label is not available for queens, nucs, etc., though that may come in time. One farmer I know describes CNG as more organic than organic - a criticism of the organic standard once the USDA got involved with it.

I live in an area with so called wild blueberry production and there is no way I could demonstrate that the forage my bees could fly to is organic. With CNG I would not have to.


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## activematrix (May 10, 2012)

deknow said:


> Which guidelines would those be?
> 
> deknow


These guidelines under which the NOP currently operates where apiaries are concerned.


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