# Goldenrod blooms up north before it blooms in the south?



## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Ok, I know this season has been a not so normal one but I'm wondering about something...

I've always thought that plants start blooming first in the southern states and then the bloom moves northward. I've been hearing folks in the northern states and even up into Canada talking about goldenrod already blooming. Here in south central Alabama I haven't seen any blooming yet. We've been getting more rain than normal this summer in our local area, really nice for a change. I'm wondering if this is holding the goldenrod back. So, is the goldenrod blooming up north before it blooms in the south "normal"?

Thanks,
Ed


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## casinoken (May 6, 2012)

LOL, no Ed, that's not how it works. The fall blooming plants bloom earlier in the north due to their shorter summers. Here in Mississippi, u won't see goldenrod blooming until late August-mid September, because of our longer growing season. I'm sure it is the same in Crenshaw. Plants bloom according to sunlight and/or temperature. That is why the northern states have earlier late blooms than we do.


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## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

From the smell, our goldenrod flow started on August 6. Yesterday the fragrance was a bit much. In a normal year, the flow starts about the 15th and ends before the middle of September. I expect the flow will last until late August this year. As with eall the flows this year, it's a week or two early.

Not only does goldenrod flow period vary from north to south, it varies east to west. My flow will be winding down, and over Buffalo way it will be just starting.


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## scrapiron (Aug 18, 2011)

Its blooming here in SC


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## DBF (Jul 17, 2011)

Everything was a month early this year here in Kansas the I started to see goldenrod blooms three weeks ago.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

I think it has to do with moisture and not temperature so much. When the moisture gets dryer entering fall the bloom initiates. Most vegetables bolt when it gets dry.


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## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

casinoken said:


> LOL, no Ed, that's not how it works. The fall blooming plants bloom earlier in the north due to their shorter summers. ...<snip>


Thanks casinoken! Duh, I feel like a real dunce, now.  But I get over things pretty quick.  That makes perfectly good sense, but I've never thought about it. Thanks for my continuing education! 

I just looked at some goldenrod photos I took last year, they were in full bloom with the dates ranging from 9/10/11 to 10/04/11. On 10/12/11 I took some pictures of some asters and tarweed that looked pretty good and then on 10/27/11 I made some pictures of some wild aster but they were beginning to look a little tired. So if I go by these dates and consider the seasons are about 2 weeks ahead of schedule I should have goldenrod in full bloom by the last week in August? I have looked at some grod and there is some swelling of the buds. It will be interesting to see when it starts blooming this year...hopefully it won't be too early.

Ed


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## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Michael Palmer said:


> <snip> Not only does goldenrod flow period vary from north to south, it varies east to west. My flow will be winding down, and over Buffalo way it will be just starting.


I checked a map out and there is 2-degrees latitude difference between Buffalo and St. Albans....could that difference along with Buffalo being situated on the shore of Lake Erie cause the difference in bloom times rather than the difference of latitude? Just thinking... 

Ed


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## [email protected] (May 12, 2010)

Most general rule, After the solstice, the northern latitudes and altitudes speed up and surpass the lower ones. Think about it, the plants need to beat the oncoming winter.


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## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

I got it, Adam...thanks for the reinforcement. Amazing isn't it? God knows what he's doing whether we do or not. 

Ed


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## JRG13 (May 11, 2012)

Moisture has little to do with flower signaling. It's typically a temperature and day length respsonse. Some crops even need to reach a number of 'heat units' before flowering is initiated as well, others need cold vernalization. Water stress can initiate flowering at times but it's not ideal. Lot of plants fall under a short day or long day category as well but it's actually the length of darkness that's critical. Even short bursts of light at night can prevent flowering.


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## mulesii (Jun 10, 2012)

This is an interesting thread. I have not yet seen any goldenrod blooming here in South East PA.


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## luka (May 23, 2012)

goldenrod started blooming here in Eastern MA end of july beginning of August and so has the Asters
girls really starting to turn up the activity now


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## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Ok, just today I spotted a smattering of goldenrod blooming...more to come.


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## sammyjay (May 2, 2011)

I think it blooms in the north before it does in the south. Our goldenrod is already been going into seed for a little while. I am a little bit further north than 52 degrees latitude.


Nathan


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Intheswamp said:


> Amazing isn't it? God knows what he's doing whether we do or not.
> 
> Ed


A. You seem surprised.
B. What's GOD got to do w/ it?


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## jmgi (Jan 15, 2009)

God is at the control panel pushing all the buttons and levers, are you surprised at this? John


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

I'm surprised when someone brings GOD into a Forum on bees and beekeeping. I'm also surprised when people reduce GOD to a Technical Theatre Manager.

This is a Thread about Goldenrod Blooming, not GOD.


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## Hokie Bee Daddy (Apr 1, 2011)

sqkcrk said:


> I'm surprised when someone brings GOD into a Forum on bees and beekeeping. I'm also surprised when people reduce GOD to a Technical Theatre Manager.


I'm not surprised. Reverend Langstroth brought God into beekeeping in "The Hive and the Honeybee" very eloquently so to do so is normal and continues the legacy.

On the subject of Goldenrod, aren't there many different varieties of Goldenrod and will this not explain some of the blooming difference? Most on this forum talk about how great the fall goldenrod bloom is and how much nectar the bees collect but I get nothing but pollen here - year after year. I asked a local beekeeper and they said it was our variety - whatever that is.:kn:


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## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

sqkcrk said:


> A. You seem surprised.
> B. What's GOD got to do w/ it?


A. Not a bit.
B. Everything.
C. ...and we've both revealed a bit about ourselves,


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## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Hokie Bee Daddy said:


> On the subject of Goldenrod, aren't there many different varieties of Goldenrod and will this not explain some of the blooming difference? Most on this forum talk about how great the fall goldenrod bloom is and how much nectar the bees collect but I get nothing but pollen here - year after year. I asked a local beekeeper and they said it was our variety - whatever that is.:kn:


I've yet to experience the local goldenrod blooming while having bees. My mentor has that there is definitely a honey flow during the bloom cycle. With the rains that we have been getting I'm expecting a good flow...there are lots of plants here and there and they're all very green and yellowing.lightening in the upper branches. Interestingly, most of what I saw today was located in a river bottom where it probably the moistest. I did see a little bit on more upland ground, but mostly in the bottom. I just had some heavy orientation flights taking place the other evening...all three hives at once. I think I'll have a good bee population when it kicks in. We'll see. 

Ed


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## Rob Hughes (Apr 23, 2012)

Hokie Bee Daddy said:


> I'm not surprised. Reverend Langstroth brought God into beekeeping in "The Hive and the Honeybee" very eloquently so to do so is normal and continues the legacy.
> 
> On the subject of Goldenrod, aren't there many different varieties of Goldenrod and will this not explain some of the blooming difference?


I think this is the main reason for regional differences. My Audubon plant guide says there are 125 species of goldenrod in N America. Here (46N) 'goldenrod' has been blooming for several weeks, and is about 10 days head of normal.

Rob


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## Keth Comollo (Nov 4, 2011)

Speaking with several oldtimers they say the earliest goldenrod doesn't do much as far as nectar which is what I am seeing this year. Three days before going to EAS they started to bring in some serious amounts. I threw supers on quite a few hives. Looking forward to inspections and treatments tomorrow and see what they have done in the last week.


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## Adrian Quiney WI (Sep 14, 2007)

Ours has started to bloom over the last week, but no "stinky sock" smell yet. Anyone in WI seeing a flow from Goldenrod yet?


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## WWW (Feb 6, 2011)

The Goldenrod has been in bloom here in southeast Ohio since the beginning of August which is several weeks early, however the lack of good rains has kept the nectar flow to a minimum, lots of pollen though. I am thankful for whatever the bees can get access to......Bill


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## Eddie Honey (May 30, 2011)

I just returned from vacation. I was in Acadia National Park, ME. I was amazed at the amount of goldenrod and and another flower that was purple/lavender. It just lined all the roadways and fields. Of course I had to see if I could find some honeybees on the stuff and lo and behold....


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## jmgi (Jan 15, 2009)

The purple flower you saw may have been New England Aster, we have it here and the honey bees love it. John


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## thenance007 (May 25, 2011)

Intheswamp: Don't feel too bad about your question--I thought it and just didn't ask it. And I've been gardening North and South for about 60 years. Just not at the same time, so never paid attention to fall blooms being earlier in the North. Thanks for being the "dunce" and enlightening (I bet) a lot of people in the process!


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## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

thenance007 said:


> Thanks for being the "dunce" and enlightening (I bet) a lot of people in the process!


<chuckle> I play the part well.


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## HTC (Mar 17, 2012)

I find the information interesting, here in central Florida my last year notes were that the Golden rod was in full bloom at the end of October and stopped by the end of November. I looked at the lot near me and the Goldenrod is not yet full grown this year.
I wounder if it is a day length thing? Day length in the North is very different then in the South.


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## Eddie Honey (May 30, 2011)

jmgi said:


> The purple flower you saw may have been New England Aster, we have it here and the honey bees love it. John


These flowers were like long spears all along the interstates and roadways mixed in with the goldenrod.


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## Beewildered61 (Apr 5, 2012)

thenance007 said:


> Intheswamp: Don't feel too bad about your question--I thought it and just didn't ask it. And I've been gardening North and South for about 60 years. Just not at the same time, so never paid attention to fall blooms being earlier in the North. Thanks for being the "dunce" and enlightening (I bet) a lot of people in the process!


 I was wondering the same thing... I haven't seen any goldenrod around my house, but I have noticed the bees coming in with bulging orange/gold pollen sacks....


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## Ledge (Dec 15, 2010)

Dupilcate


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## Ledge (Dec 15, 2010)

Eddie Honey said:


> These flowers were like long spears all along the interstates and roadways mixed in with the goldenrod.


Lupine probably.


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## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

Lupines bloom early summer. New England Aster isn't blooming yet...only Small White Aster, and that just started. 

The purple, spikey flower you saw is most likely Purple Loosestrife.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Which was going to be my guess, but I waited until Michael spoke up, since there was no mention of there being any damp soil.


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## mudlake (Nov 26, 2007)

A "fact" I heard last year is that Goldenrod is a salt water marsh plant. It has been a long time since we had salt water around here. Great Lakes area. Tony


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## thenance007 (May 25, 2011)

There are over 150 species of Goldenrod, growing in every imaginable environment. Among them is a "beach" goldenrod, a "bog" goldenrod, and a "coastal" goldenrod, so they apparently are referring to one of the many varieties.


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## Ben Franklin (May 3, 2011)

Most plants that flower Bloom by the number of Light Hours.
Golden Rod has been in bloom here for a week or so. The first variety does not seem to attract bees. The second variety blooms weeks later and this is what the bees work. It is just now showing color.


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## Keth Comollo (Nov 4, 2011)

We have quite a bit of Aster here and within the last week I see a ton of Birdsfoot Trefoil. It's everywhere.

Goldenrod smell showed up in my hives today.

Knotweed still looks a week or so away.


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