# Betterbee Issues



## SeanHebein (Feb 17, 2021)

Creating this post partially because I am frustrated with Betterbee and want to see if anyone else has had this experience with them and also wanting some opinions on where to source some stuff.

I have spent quite a bit of money with Betterbee this year and I’ve had a couple of instances where they forgot to send something, sent the wrong thing, or just took forever to ship. A few weeks back I ordered a gabled roof and when it arrived it was destroyed due to haphazard packing. When I sent in pics, their customer service agent (not naming names) suggested that I should glue and nail the affected pieces and mend it myself. As soon as I saw that message I called and they offered to ship a replacement. To their credit, they did promptly ship a new one, to the wrong address. When I noticed it, I called them and they adjusted the delivery address the day before it was supposed to be delivered so it went from NY>CA>CO. Overall not super impressed with how all over the place they seem to be and lack of follow through.

I placed an order of $8500 for 25 additional hives on September 22nd. Got a call today asking for $500 more for freight. Not upset at the amount but why did it take so long to figure that out? Cancelled the order.

long story short, looking to get away from Betterbee. We really likedtheir 7/8” thick, 10 frame deep brood boxes though.Anyone have a recommendation for boxes that they like? We have bought from Mann Lake and not sure if we got a bad run but their boxes weren’t the greatest for tolerances.

Hive Mind, please give me your recommendations!

Thanks!

Sean


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## G3farms (Jun 13, 2009)

WOW!! $8,500 worth of product and they did not pick up shipping!?!?

The only thing I buy anymore are frames and foundation. 
In my opinion the best frames were Brushy Mountain, sadly out of business
and the best wax foundation was Walter Kelley, sadly bought out by Dadant.

Sorry but really can't help you out........good luck.


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## Zippy69 (Sep 5, 2021)

Better bee has always been fine with me, sorry for your experience. I. On the east coast so shipping is a straight shot And as I’ve said I’ve ordered for like 19 years from them and it’s like Amazon timing for delivery. Never ordered 8k worth but I’ve ordered a 20 frame radial extractor with truck delivery and no issues.


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## SeanHebein (Feb 17, 2021)

G3farms said:


> WOW!! $8,500 worth of product and they did not pick up shipping!?!?
> 
> The only thing I buy anymore are frames and foundation.
> In my opinion the best frames were Brushy Mountain, sadly out of business
> ...


Well, I wasn't expecting them to pick up the shipping, I did pay $350. I was more irritated at how long they took to contact me. Overall just bad customer service.

Thanks for the message regardless!


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## SeanHebein (Feb 17, 2021)

Zippy69 said:


> Better bee has always been fine with me, sorry for your experience. I. On the east coast so shipping is a straight shot And as I’ve said I’ve ordered for like 19 years from them and it’s like Amazon timing for delivery. Never ordered 8k worth but I’ve ordered a 20 frame radial extractor with truck delivery and no issues.


Living on the east coast has it's advantages if you order from Betterbee for sure!

Do you order exclusively from them?

Sean


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## Muddy creek (Jun 25, 2019)

SeanHebein said:


> Creating this post partially because I am frustrated with Betterbee and want to see if anyone else has had this experience with them and also wanting some opinions on where to source some stuff.
> 
> I have spent quite a bit of money with Betterbee this year and I’ve had a couple of instances where they forgot to send something, sent the wrong thing, or just took forever to ship. A few weeks back I ordered a gabled roof and when it arrived it was destroyed due to haphazard packing. When I sent in pics, their customer service agent (not naming names) suggested that I should glue and nail the affected pieces and mend it myself. As soon as I saw that message I called and they offered to ship a replacement. To their credit, they did promptly ship a new one, to the wrong address. When I noticed it, I called them and they adjusted the delivery address the day before it was supposed to be delivered so it went from NY>CA>CO. Overall not super impressed with how all over the place they seem to be and lack of follow through.
> 
> ...


You can buy 25 apimaye ergo 10 frame hives with free shipping from apimaye USA. 
I have ten of them and they are great. They are fully insulated and heavy duty.


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## Zippy69 (Sep 5, 2021)

SeanHebein said:


> Living on the east coast has it's advantages if you order from Betterbee for sure!
> 
> Do you order exclusively from them?
> 
> Sean


most times yes if I want it soon. I used to keep 35 hives back in the day and ordered quite frequent….before marriage and children.lol Now I have 12 in my backyard. It’s a Forrest so my honey flow is early and mostly tulip poplar and black gum. Out of 10 strong hives I got 650 in honey. Mind you we are 18” above in annual rainfall and the years not done.


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## quiters (Mar 29, 2020)

You might try beeline woodenware. They have a facility near me in Michigan that has great prices and great quality. They also have a production facility in Pueblo, Colorado that might work for you. Check them out. Honest folks here that will go out of their way to make things right. Beeline Apiaries & Woodenware - Quality Beekeeping Supplies for All 50 States (beelinewoodenware.com)


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

G3farms said:


> ... the best wax foundation was Walter Kelley, sadly bought out by Dadant.


FYI, just to keep the record straight, Kelley was bought by Mann Lake:





CATCH THE BUZZ – MANN LAKE ACQUIRES KELLEY BEEKEEPING | Bee Culture







www.beeculture.com


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## SeanHebein (Feb 17, 2021)

quiters said:


> You might try beeline woodenware. They have a facility near me in Michigan that has great prices and great quality. They also have a production facility in Pueblo, Colorado that might work for you. Check them out. Honest folks here that will go out of their way to make things right. Beeline Apiaries & Woodenware - Quality Beekeeping Supplies for All 50 States (beelinewoodenware.com)


Going to check these guys out! Thanks for the tip!


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## Lee Bussy (May 28, 2021)

Not experienced that from Betterbee (only ~5 orders so far.) Mostly smaller orders, but no issues. On your NY>CA>CO shipping issue, that's just the nature of shipping these days. FedEx will divert things to strange places just to keep them moving.


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## G3farms (Jun 13, 2009)

Rader Sidetrack said:


> FYI, just to keep the record straight, Kelley was bought by Mann Lake:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



OOPPPPS my bad I meant Mann Lake


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## SeanHebein (Feb 17, 2021)

LBussy said:


> Not experienced that from Betterbee (only ~5 orders so far.) Mostly smaller orders, but no issues. On your NY>CA>CO shipping issue, that's just the nature of shipping these days. FedEx will divert things to strange places just to keep them moving.


I wish that was the explanation but it isn't. They shipped to my California house instead of my apiary in CO and then waited to change it which added nearly a week on the shipping.


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## Lee Bussy (May 28, 2021)

Oh ... yeah, then that's not it.


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## Beejiujitsu (Oct 1, 2021)

Good to read an Apimaye endorsement.

I have a Apimaye Queen Defender hive to raise my own queens/have backups when needed. I haven’t bought a standard hive from them yet but plan to buy one in the winter for a scheduled spring package delivery.

As far as Betterbee goes, I order 2x 10 frame deep with bettecomb. Not only did they reach out to coordinate delivery during cool weather, they gave me a heads up in case FedEx pulls some tomfoolery and takes longer than expected to deliver.

The order went out on a Friday scheduled for Monday. I got a notification over the weekend that it had been rescheduled for Wednesday, then another update it had been rescheduled for Monday again, and it arrived fine yesterday.

I just wish they would use UPS, as I’ve never had good experience with FedEx. Most recently, a tiny SIM card to a week to arrive when it was only supposed to take 2 days. I couldn’t use my new phone until it arrived.

When it finally did, the envelope was clearly open/unsealed.


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## Fivej (Apr 4, 2016)

I am a small time hobbyist, but have dealt with Betterbee exclusively because I received superior products and customer service. I am about an hour away so most people around here buy from them and everyone thinks they are great. I would give them a call and ask to speak with Jack, one of the owners and tell him about your experience. I believe he would want to know and will try to set things right. J


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

SeanHebein said:


> Creating this post partially because I am frustrated with Betterbee and want to see if anyone else has had this experience with them and also wanting some opinions on where to source some stuff.
> 
> I have spent quite a bit of money with Betterbee this year and I’ve had a couple of instances where they forgot to send something, sent the wrong thing, or just took forever to ship. A few weeks back I ordered a gabled roof and when it arrived it was destroyed due to haphazard packing. When I sent in pics, their customer service agent (not naming names) suggested that I should glue and nail the affected pieces and mend it myself. As soon as I saw that message I called and they offered to ship a replacement. To their credit, they did promptly ship a new one, to the wrong address. When I noticed it, I called them and they adjusted the delivery address the day before it was supposed to be delivered so it went from NY>CA>CO. Overall not super impressed with how all over the place they seem to be and lack of follow through.
> 
> ...


Try Blue Sky, in Ohio.


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## WillH (Jun 25, 2010)

Never had an issue with Betterbee. I get mated Carni queens from them in the spring with overnight delivery. Very gentle and good honey producers.


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## dleemc1 (Dec 31, 2012)

SeanHebein said:


> Creating this post partially because I am frustrated with Betterbee and want to see if anyone else has had this experience with them and also wanting some opinions on where to source some stuff.
> 
> I have spent quite a bit of money with Betterbee this year and I’ve had a couple of instances where they forgot to send something, sent the wrong thing, or just took forever to ship. A few weeks back I ordered a gabled roof and when it arrived it was destroyed due to haphazard packing. When I sent in pics, their customer service agent (not naming names) suggested that I should glue and nail the affected pieces and mend it myself. As soon as I saw that message I called and they offered to ship a replacement. To their credit, they did promptly ship a new one, to the wrong address. When I noticed it, I called them and they adjusted the delivery address the day before it was supposed to be delivered so it went from NY>CA>CO. Overall not super impressed with how all over the place they seem to be and lack of follow through.
> 
> ...


i use mann-lake/


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## codonnell (Jul 7, 2020)

While I have never had an issue with Betterbee, I just wanted to mention that Betterbee's woodenware supplier is Humble Abodes in Maine. They make the 7/8" boxes.






Humble Abodes


Humble Abodes : - Foundation & Hardware Hive Kits Boxes Frames Hive Components Nuc Boxes & Components Gift Certificates Bees (Nucleus Colonies) Tools & Equipment Protective Gear Pest Management Feeding Bees Harvesting & Extracting Bargain Barn Honey Containers



www.humbleabodesmaine.com





I am not sure Humble assembles, you would have to ask them if you need that. I think assembly is a Betterbee value-add. I prefer to assemble my own so it has never come up for me.

In any case, you can just give them a ring. They are a small outfit, but I find the fit and finish of their boxes better than Mann-Lake or Dadant.

Best,

Chuck


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## Chrishagwood (May 10, 2015)

G3farms said:


> The only thing I buy anymore are frames and foundation.
> In my opinion the best frames were Brushy Mountain, sadly out of business
> and the best wax foundation was Walter Kelley, sadly bought out by Dadant.


According to employee of BM, they didn’t make their own frames, they resold someone else’s.


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## G3farms (Jun 13, 2009)

Do you know whose they were?
BM would not let you see into there wood working facility.


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## Fivej (Apr 4, 2016)

codonnell said:


> While I have never had an issue with Betterbee, I just wanted to mention that Betterbee's woodenware supplier is Humble Abodes in Maine. They make the 7/8" boxes.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I believe Betterbee bought Humble a few years ago. The woodenware is outstanding. J


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Fivej said:


> I believe Betterbee bought Humble a few years ago.


Yes. See this page:





About Us : Humble Abodes


Humble Abodes : About Us - Foundation & Hardware Hive Kits Boxes Frames Hive Components Nuc Boxes & Components Gift Certificates Bees (Nucleus Colonies) Tools & Equipment Protective Gear Pest Management Feeding Bees Harvesting & Extracting Bargain Barn Honey Containers



www.humbleabodesmaine.com


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## joebeewhisperer (May 13, 2020)

Bought a few Lyson poly nucs from Betterbee twice. No problems, but not playing in your ballpark.


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## ZooBee (Dec 11, 2020)

Cloverdale said:


> Try Blue Sky, in Ohio.


Blue Sky charges as much in shipping as the stuff your buying. 200 worth of bee box and 150 shipping ugh. They charge full freight on Fedex so, no ty.
I have never had a problem with Betterbee, online or in person. I went down there this summer and picked up frames and foundation and talked to Nick, the guy who was making the frames. NIcest ppl ever. I buy from BB and Perfect Bee and also my local shop. Perfect Bee shipping is really best cost, never had a problem with them. 
Apimaye hives are awesome and free ship as noted earlier but too heavy for me.
In defence of BB, when I was there this summer, Nick told me they are moving into a bigger place down the road so part of your problem may have been with that and its still hard to get ppl to work there cuz the Mead Rd facility is in gods country AFAIC ;-).
Hope it goes better for you somewhere,
Zoo


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## PCTBeeman (Oct 11, 2021)

I have ordered dozens and dozens of times with BetterBee and know them well...and have NEVER had a problem with customer service...there must be more to this story than what is being provided. BetterBee takes pride in its customer service and strives to be the best in the industry...which has clearly been my experience, and I have plenty of experience with Mann Lake, Dadant, Blue Sky, Kelley, and others...BetterBee is, by far, the most responsive and easy to deal with....


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## Foxhound (Feb 19, 2015)

Hey Sean - I would love to try and earn your business. All of our wood is cypress wood and it's made out of 7/8-inch boards, so it's really great equipment. I've been selling equipment for years, but recently opened up a retail store in Birmingham, Alabama. We can ship supplies to you by UPS ground or by freight. If you are getting a lot, we would much rather ship it by freight to you.

Please take a look at our equipment, we would appreciate the chance to help you. 

-Adam Hickman
www.foxhoundbeecompany.com



SeanHebein said:


> Creating this post partially because I am frustrated with Betterbee and want to see if anyone else has had this experience with them and also wanting some opinions on where to source some stuff.
> 
> I have spent quite a bit of money with Betterbee this year and I’ve had a couple of instances where they forgot to send something, sent the wrong thing, or just took forever to ship. A few weeks back I ordered a gabled roof and when it arrived it was destroyed due to haphazard packing. When I sent in pics, their customer service agent (not naming names) suggested that I should glue and nail the affected pieces and mend it myself. As soon as I saw that message I called and they offered to ship a replacement. To their credit, they did promptly ship a new one, to the wrong address. When I noticed it, I called them and they adjusted the delivery address the day before it was supposed to be delivered so it went from NY>CA>CO. Overall not super impressed with how all over the place they seem to be and lack of follow through.
> 
> ...


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## tikkay (Feb 10, 2017)

PCTBeeman said:


> I have ordered dozens and dozens of times with BetterBee and know them well...and have NEVER had a problem with customer service...there must be more to this story than what is being provided. BetterBee takes pride in its customer service and strives to be the best in the industry...which has clearly been my experience, and I have plenty of experience with Mann Lake, Dadant, Blue Sky, Kelley, and others...BetterBee is, by far, the most responsive and easy to deal with....


I couldn’t agree more!
And I’m on the West Coast.


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## linkin979 (Jan 6, 2022)

SeanHebein said:


> Creating this post partially because I am frustrated with Betterbee and want to see if anyone else has had this experience with them and also wanting some opinions on where to source some stuff.
> 
> I have spent quite a bit of money with Betterbee this year and I’ve had a couple of instances where they forgot to send something, sent the wrong thing, or just took forever to ship. A few weeks back I ordered a gabled roof and when it arrived it was destroyed due to haphazard packing. When I sent in pics, their customer service agent (not naming names) suggested that I should glue and nail the affected pieces and mend it myself. As soon as I saw that message I called and they offered to ship a replacement. To their credit, they did promptly ship a new one, to the wrong address. When I noticed it, I called them and they adjusted the delivery address the day before it was supposed to be delivered so it went from NY>CA>CO. Overall not super impressed with how all over the place they seem to be and lack of follow through.
> 
> ...



I would HIGHLY recommend giving Mannlake another chance. I ordered 30 boxes from them last June. The condition of the boxes as well as the construction was definitely up to my standards. Although I will say approximately 3 of the boxes if I was visually looking at them I would not have chosen them. I used to do a lot of business with da Dant. Unfortunately, they're not on top of their business , customers , or customer service like they used to. I had also placed an order with them in June the same time I had ordered from Mann Lake. I received my shipment from Mann Lake within 5 to 7 days of ordering it. But yet still had no tracking number or response from da dant. 

Best of luck!

-MaTT


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## SeanHebein (Feb 17, 2021)

PCTBeeman said:


> I have ordered dozens and dozens of times with BetterBee and know them well...and have NEVER had a problem with customer service...there must be more to this story than what is being provided. BetterBee takes pride in its customer service and strives to be the best in the industry...which has clearly been my experience, and I have plenty of experience with Mann Lake, Dadant, Blue Sky, Kelley, and others...BetterBee is, by far, the most responsive and easy to deal with....


I promise you that I am not unreasonable. I have had 3 orders that were shipped to wrong addresses and the addresses were put into the system correctly. It's just frustrating when you order stuff, wait the shipping time and then have it go to the wrong address and take an additional week to get where it needs to go. I am glad that you have had a great experience but it hasn't been my experience. Between the incorrectly shipped product and also damaged merchandise (ordered a cedar 10 frame roof that arrived poorly packaged and was damaged) it's just too frustrating.

Recently ordered all of the stuff for a new hive from Mann Lake. Going to give them another shot!



Foxhound said:


> Hey Sean - I would love to try and earn your business. All of our wood is cypress wood and it's made out of 7/8-inch boards, so it's really great equipment. I've been selling equipment for years, but recently opened up a retail store in Birmingham, Alabama. We can ship supplies to you by UPS ground or by freight. If you are getting a lot, we would much rather ship it by freight to you.
> 
> Please take a look at our equipment, we would appreciate the chance to help you.
> 
> ...


I ordered a bunch of entrance reducers from you and they are super legit! Will be getting more! I'll take a look at your woodenware too. I'll be getting a bunch of new hives and nucs setup so will be needing a lot of stuff soon!

Sean


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## gator75 (Apr 21, 2021)

Foxhound said:


> Hey Sean - I would love to try and earn your business. All of our wood is cypress wood and it's made out of 7/8-inch boards, so it's really great equipment. I've been selling equipment for years, but recently opened up a retail store in Birmingham, Alabama. We can ship supplies to you by UPS ground or by freight. If you are getting a lot, we would much rather ship it by freight to you.
> 
> Please take a look at our equipment, we would appreciate the chance to help you.
> 
> ...


Your products look very solid. I'm going to stop by next time I'm in B-ham.


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## quiterps (Oct 25, 2021)

SeanHebein said:


> Creating this post partially because I am frustrated with Betterbee and want to see if anyone else has had this experience with them and also wanting some opinions on where to source some stuff.
> 
> I have spent quite a bit of money with Betterbee this year and I’ve had a couple of instances where they forgot to send something, sent the wrong thing, or just took forever to ship. A few weeks back I ordered a gabled roof and when it arrived it was destroyed due to haphazard packing. When I sent in pics, their customer service agent (not naming names) suggested that I should glue and nail the affected pieces and mend it myself. As soon as I saw that message I called and they offered to ship a replacement. To their credit, they did promptly ship a new one, to the wrong address. When I noticed it, I called them and they adjusted the delivery address the day before it was supposed to be delivered so it went from NY>CA>CO. Overall not super impressed with how all over the place they seem to be and lack of follow through.
> 
> ...


You might check into www.beelinewoodenware.com
There are 3 production facilities around the United States. I have one in Michigan about 25 miles away and they are great. The quality is great, helpful and friendly family run operation, beekeepers and willing to answer questions. I know they have bulk discounts too. Good luck.


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## Muddy creek (Jun 25, 2019)

Miller bee supply in North Carolina has been good


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## jimbo3 (Jun 7, 2015)

I ordered 6 frame feeder shims from Betterbee. I somehow had a brainfart and put together 5 and couldn't find the 6th, so I was convinced I was short-changed. Called them up, they issued a refund for me to only find the 6th shim a few days later. I felt horrible, e-mailed them and said to reverse the refund or bill me. They wouldn't have it and said thanks for being a good customer. They'll always get my business with that attitude. 

That being said, Mann Lake has some stuff that Betterbee doesn't, and vice-versa. The deeps for what looks like the same quality, are 26.96 for Mann Lake and 21.55 for Betterbee. Betterbee has bucket feeders, which I can't find on Mann Lake. Also, Mann Lake has one bee escape (other is out of stock), Betterbee just has the whole inner cover, but no single bee escapes. Mann Lake has butyric acid (at a whopping $43 for the smallest amount), while Betterbee doesn't. 

I've tried Blue Sky Bee Supply in the past with good success from what I remember, but their website search function sucks. Type in "bee escape" and get 211 results - 209 being basically unrelated. The pail feeder gives no indication as to what size it is. 

Anyway, it looks like I'll be ordering from both and not get any free shipping


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## jimbo3 (Jun 7, 2015)

jimbo3 said:


> I ordered 6 frame feeder shims from Betterbee. I somehow had a brainfart and put together 5 and couldn't find the 6th, so I was convinced I was short-changed. Called them up, they issued a refund for me to only find the 6th shim a few days later. I felt horrible, e-mailed them and said to reverse the refund or bill me. They wouldn't have it and said thanks for being a good customer. They'll always get my business with that attitude.
> 
> That being said, Mann Lake has some stuff that Betterbee doesn't, and vice-versa. The deeps for what looks like the same quality, are 26.96 for Mann Lake and 21.55 for Betterbee. Betterbee has bucket feeders, which I can't find on Mann Lake. Also, Mann Lake has one bee escape (other is out of stock), Betterbee just has the whole inner cover, but no single bee escapes. Mann Lake has butyric acid (at a whopping $43 for the smallest amount), while Betterbee doesn't.
> 
> ...


Betterbee is appx. 100 miles up, and 100 miles back from me. It would cost me around $45 to get there and back. It's less than $22 to ship it UPS, so still worth it without the free shipping.


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## Plannerwgp (May 18, 2019)

Chrishagwood said:


> According to employee of BM, they didn’t make their own frames, they resold someone else’s.


So what. Is there a problem with the frames????


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## rdimanin (Jan 17, 2020)

Muddy creek said:


> You can buy 25 apimaye ergo 10 frame hives with free shipping from apimaye USA.
> I have ten of them and they are great. They are fully insulated and heavy duty.


I've been running Apimaye, Anel and Technoset poly hives for 4 years now. I will never go back to wood & my boxes will last a lifetime.


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## kilocharlie (Dec 27, 2010)

A lot of folks around here like Shastina Bee Girls for woodenware.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Note that the Grey Whale has swallowed Shastina Millworks too . . .



> Mann Lake also owns and operates Shastina Millwork, a leading beekeeping wood product manufacturer, and D&I Pure Sweeteners, a leading processor and distributor of sugar. In 2018, Mann Lake completed a management buyout with the support of Grey Mountain Partners.
> 
> _See the PDF here:_
> 
> ...


And just in case that PDF gets deleted/moved on the Grey Mountain site, I have attached a copy here.


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## AHudd (Mar 5, 2015)

Grey Whale.  

Alex


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