# New CA Dollar per Hive Tax



## Jam (Jun 17, 2010)

So they think a per Hive tax will bring MORE hives to California? They might be hitting the Medical Marijuana a bit hard out there...


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

I see the CSBA supports this..... Another good reason not to support the CSBA.


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## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

loggermike said:


> I assume out of state too?
> 
> Any opinions?


They stated that 65% of the beekeepers or beekeepers combined together that have 65% of the bees "Kept" in CA will be notified for their response to the bill

To me it sounds like a bill that will add to the cost of the beekeepers coming from out of state. While the in state beekeepers will also be taxed but they don't have the extra expenses associated with the out-of-state'rs. 

How is taxing each hive(1 million hives are needed for almond pollination alone), costing large beekeepers $2,000-$5,000(some much more) each, going to improve the beekeeping industry in CA? It is already costing us(each beekeeper)thousands of $ to keep our operations running. Taking losses that are caused by others with no compensation. We gamble our $ every year trying new stock, different locations, new "treatments"(which are all funded by beekeepers), etc.

We know were that extra $2 million will go. Maybe CA should concentrate on keeping all their money from going back to Mexico!


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

Beeslave said:


> but they don't have the extra expenses associated with the out-of-state'rs. .


Really?


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

It'll probably cause beekeepers to claim the existence of fewer hives. Don't you think? Who is going to count them? When? Where?

Yes Keith, I'm writing a book.


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## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

Keith Jarrett said:


> Really?


Trucking, travel expenses, lodging, broker fees, etc


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

Oh Please, then you go back to a flow, stay out here in the desert for 12 months, you will get a chance to put on 30 pounds of sub & 10 + gallons of syrup on a yearly basis.

Not to mention Living in one of the most TAXED states. That is btw the thread.


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## jrbbees (Apr 4, 2010)

Hive rental rates for pollination will go up $2. to cover it.

That's government! Tax beekeepers because farmers and seed companies can use pesticides that kill bees.


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

We all have big expenses. Some pay more for trucking. Some have huge feed bills. But it seems like a bad idea to add more taxes on top of all that. Its not like we aren't already being taxed to death.


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

*Re: New CSBA Dollar per Hive Tax*



Keith Jarrett said:


> I see the CSBA supports this..... Another good reason not to support the CSBA.


Can we look forward to seeing you at the Oregon conference this year then?
Your friends (ask Randy) will tell you its worth the trip.


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## Honey-4-All (Dec 19, 2008)

And some people don't think who they vote for makes a difference.

Senate bill 510 and now this. 

The best thing to happen to beekeeping in Ca in the last 30 years was when WE got rid of the AFB inspection fee or whatever it was. Never did see the point of that one.

Knowing our dear state the administrative portion will increase to the point were the "fee" needs to be increased. Thank you SENORITORA EVANS and all who voted for it. IF you don't want this either vote NO or don't vote at all. 


"Referendum turnout must be at or above 30%."

One of the 4 districts will be seated to someone not from "here". 

Any of the Almond growers (myself included) who think this is going to decrease the expense incurred in pollination have got to bee fooling themselves. With the "new" 7% tacked on (for out of state folks) plus this the costs will be heading north.


Looks like people will be looking to bail out of the almonds early. Maybe we can start negotiating a discount for a early release date. :shhhh:

(b) The assessment shall be levied annually on all bee colonies in
California on March 1 of each year and not be more than one dollar
($1) per colony.

The only benefit of this date is that all those dead-outs won't count if your not making up your increase early. 

Every law passed has some unintended consequences. 

Anyone have any ideas as to what might come from this one?


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

Maybe Harry, Talked with Randy yesterday.

Did you read where the "bill" also know as a TAX, is to help keepers keep better bees, gee all they had to do is put on some XXXXX sub.

Why is it up to the good keepers having to buy the toilet paper for the bad one.


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## ChristopherA (Jul 20, 2010)

Nothing will come from it.

Cali is so far in debt they are doing what they can do to scratch every dollar out. They do not have the money to pay the public workers and lost over 1/3 to 1/2 of pension funds.

This only suppliments the need for money.

Logic, you do not tax a die'n industry. I also noticed they stated beekeepers in Cali, not just residents of Cali, so I take that as anyont housing colonies in cali.

I guess we can expect prices on fruits, nuts, honey veggies to go up even more.

Time to start growing your own food people....

Arg :doh:


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## chillardbee (May 26, 2005)

Hey guys, I'm canadian and of course this doesn't apply to me, but I feel for ya. I believe there's enough research being done on all this already that CA doesn't need to implement a seperate research team. And like enough of you guys said already, you all are spending your dollars on trying to keep them alive. I can see how that would be very fustrating to my fellow beekeepers south of me. My take on this is that beekeepers aren't the only ones who need bees nor the farmers who rely on bees for the pollination of their crops, but anyone who (and I mean everyone) relies on all agriculture for their food, rich and poor alike. In my opinion, if I was going to get taxed a dollar per hive, I wouldn't be sending them to that state or provence and find an alternative (if there is one). I'm sorry, I'm just p'd off that they would even consider taxing a group of people who have already given so much.


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## LSPender (Nov 16, 2004)

Hello All

I have actully been on the committee that drafted this stuff for the CSBA

Why you might ask am I on the committee, 

BECAUSE I WANT TO KILL THIS THING AND THE ONLY WAY TO DO THIS IS BY BEING INVOLVED.

2 and 1/2 years ago this was started by LeRoy Brandt, and a quick vote was taken at the CSBA annual meeting in Tahoe. At the time almond pollination prices were rising and a bunch of beek were googly eyed over money and thought no big deal. A vote was taken in the general meeting with 85% of the ATTENDING member voted in favor of this as it was presented. I WAS ONE OF THE FEW AND VERY VOCAL ABOUT OPPOSITION TO THIS PROPOSAL. But it passed 

What was presented - That we need research money for our industry and everyone was needed and that the OUT OF STATERS needed to pay also. ( in fact one the large queen breeding families from northern CA made it sound as if she wanted to punish those out of states because they caused the problems, even though this family sells queens to everyone and one family member migrates to Montana with 12,000 hives each year, I have pointed this hypocracy out many of times.)

Currently the CSBA have spent $10,000.00 to follow thru on the legislative process, but we will have a chance to vote on this as beekeeper soon, HOPEFULLY TO KILL IT.

I have been waiting until we have word when the vote will be to gather more support to kill, ie vote NO

I have verbal commitments from many large and small Beeks already. The vote will be counted in 2 ways, by number of hives and # of beeks.

Note: I encourage all of you to be involved so as to prevent things like this from happening, and I find it irresposible for people to say not to support the CSBA because of this. I will remind everyone of the work done by the CSBA, specifically Mr. Gene Brandi on the manderine issue and right to farm issue.

Thanks


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

Thanks Larry. That was just where I thought this was coming from-lol.
I will vote against it. We had this back in the 70s and it wasn't popular then either. I thought it had died.:doh:


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

I believe if this tax is not voted out that many beeks will be telling wonderful little lies and finding ways to hide their bees. It seems as though maybe California is more desperate the NY for tax money at this point.


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## Matt Beekman (Dec 15, 2007)

Meeting the minimum 30% turnout for the referendum will be a challenge. Getting 65% of any group of beekeepers to agree on something will be even harder. I give this very little chance to come to fruition. In the rare event it does pass, I move to appoint Keith Chairman. Do I have a second?


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## LSPender (Nov 16, 2004)

Matt, the problem arises when you define 65% of what & who. Its 65% of the regestered beeks. Its in the details. 

And if passed, changing a president in the CSBA will do nothing.

The last Marketing Board 1970's & 1980's that involved Beeks to about 5 (five) years to shut down and a lot of time and effort, more than was needed to set it up in the first place.

We must stop this now!

I need more CA beeks involved to keep the CSBA in order so we can profitably run our businesses.


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## Honey-4-All (Dec 19, 2008)

From the bill it looks like

30% need to participate in the vote, that is, " from the list" 


and 

either one of the following options must happen for this to pass:

65% of those voting affirmative must be those with 50% of the numbers involved


or

50% of those voting affirmative with must run 65% of the numbers involved


The best "thing" is that in reality over 60% of the vote clout will come from out of state voters. 

Sounds like the UN.


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## LSPender (Nov 16, 2004)

Please remember guys, This was not started by the government, it was started by beekeepers, funded by beekeepers, and is being followed thru by beekeepeers.

That is why we need beekeepers to squash it at the vote.

I was hoping to stop it in committe, but had no other support then.

So what we need is votes to stop it.

I will do my best to keep everyone informed.


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## BEES4U (Oct 10, 2007)

Hmm,
Doesn't Paramount Farms and Joe Traynor donate a % of the contract to research.
Ernie


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## LSPender (Nov 16, 2004)

Yes, That is correct.

The doller per hive typically goes to Pam research a private organisation

If the Marketing/ Research board passes the funds would be in addition and directed by a board appointed thru the Research order, ie. someone else directing were the money goes not the beek who is paying the money.


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

I'm all for research. But I don't want to be forced to fund research that I think is a waste of time and money.We should be free to donate to whom we please, not be forced to by a tax that will be enforced by a gun. We have enough of that already. Since it looks like the out of staters are the main target, they need to know whats going on.
Guess I better join CSBA so I can keep up on this stuff.


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## Scrapfe (Jul 25, 2008)

Honey-4-All said:


> ...Every law passed has ...unintended consequences... Anyone have any ideas ...what might come from this...


Well it it makes you feel any better, it could help California move its almond orchards to New Mexcio where I hear most of the U.S. pecan crop is now produced.


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## JohnK and Sheri (Nov 28, 2004)

The subject is this particular bill, please.
Sheri


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## LSPender (Nov 16, 2004)

To all posts that were deleted, please refer to posts # 17

"This was not started by the government, it was started by beekeepers, funded by beekeepers, and is being followed thru by beekeepeers."


I will reiterate, Beekeeper driven.


Further infor to explain Marketing Orders in CA

If you click on the web site for the Ca State Food & Ag site and select MARKETING DEPT.


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## LSPender (Nov 16, 2004)

My last post is imcomplete, some how I prematurly did something.

Will finish in next post.


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## LSPender (Nov 16, 2004)

OK, in CA we have some laws pertaining to Marketing orders/ Commissions that can be set up by indutries to work within guidlines to advertise, promote, educate and research as a whole industry. The CDFA administers them for a fee to cover costs. The laws were enacted long ago ( 1937) by industry so as new producers came along they could not just ride the coat tails of the industry currently paying the bill to advertise etc...

A example would be the CA dairy commission, or the Specialty crop commission and more.

Currently listed on the CDFA site their are 59 commissions from alfalfa seed to figs and peachs to walnuts, a lot of crops are supported by their respective industries.

Typicaly the commission work similar to the National Honey Baord a small % paid in by the first processor in the distribution chain.

Many of the commissions have been very successful, ie. the Avocado commission.

To give another current example of a commission that is being started now is the Blueberry commission. One reason that this commission will go forward is that 95% of the blueberry growers were in the same room when the idea was hatched and presented this past year, and will be following the typical funding as other commission about .001 % of the growers field price.



Please go to the CDFA site linked below to read for yourselves



http://www.cdfa.ca.gov/mkt/mkt/


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## Skinner Apiaries (Sep 1, 2009)

hey keith, you alright? I see you're getting thrown under the bus (repeatedly) heehee

As to my opinion, I'm broke but I donated some money this year, in this case to the honey defense fund. Waste of money maybe, but I did it of free will. I don't see why this needs to be a law, free markets will take care of this; if you in fact make alot of money working bees you probably support research via donations or simply by giving business to people that do, i.e. vsh queens to any of the breeders, minnhyg, back to Marla. Seems like some dumb beekeepers trying to dictate law. Dosen't matter, laws take money to be enforced. And if you believe the law to be unfair, skirt it. I dont see how several things in this country are constitutional, and if you need a good method, I'd say false brands, or shell companies. Easy to make, easy to use. Hard to enforce. Where is Rick Sutton?


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## suttonbeeman (Aug 22, 2003)

I"m in Galveston Tx at North american Beekeeing Conferance......Not going touch this with a 10 ft pole.....all politics and someone tinking they can get something for nothing!


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## 67630 (Jul 17, 2008)

Forcing people to pay for something they didnt/dont want is exactly what got us in the condition we are today. If you need money for something, go out and raise it through donations or fund raising. Not a tax. Less is more. Just think, if you collect enough taxes off this you can hire someone to go out in the field to make sure everyone with bees knows how to count. Wouldn't that be great.


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## simplyhoney (Sep 14, 2004)

Tax all dem dad-gum Cali. Beekeepers. They're the only ,ones makin any money any who.


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## kilocharlie (Dec 27, 2010)

I'm with you, Larry. Please post any meeting information and I'll work on address lists, a mailing, and spread the word on all other sites. PM me and I'll give you what time and effort I can.


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## Rohe Bee Ranch (Feb 12, 2008)

So glad I don't live there anymore. This most likely will have a negative affect on CA beekeeping. :scratch:


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## LSPender (Nov 16, 2004)

Remember this is not just about beeks that live in CA, its about beeks who bring their bees to CA for any reason. If passed you will pay based on # of hives in CA on March 1 st each year.

As a reminder the vote is based on registered beeks that vote.

For more details go to current post: Vote, CA appiary COmission.

Link is in post to CA dept ag to register


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## Daniel Wasson (Jun 2, 2010)

AP Article from today out of Fresno on this.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_food_and_farm_bee_tax


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