# Safe to do a direct release of the queen?



## reminniear (Apr 7, 2014)

Just picked up some packages from the post office. They shipped on Wed. Plan on installing tonight Fri around 5pm. 
Is this enough time for the package bees to get used to the queen and do a direct release?
Or should I leave her in the cage?

Thanks!


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

only the bees can tell you that. If they are not biting at the cage and stuck like Velcro then you will probably be fine.


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

There will be those that tell you to just peal back the screen and pitch the queen into the cluster.
But will they buy you a new queen when that procedure fails?
Why take chances?
What's the hurry?
Hang the cage with the candy exposed.
DO NOT touch the hive other than to quietly fill the feeder for at least 10 days or better yet two weeks.
After that, go in and queen check, remove the cage and keep syrup supply uninterrupted until all of the comb is drawn out.
There are very few things in beekeeping easier than successfully installing packages.
But every year the board is LOADED with stories of problems.
We start up all of our brand new hives every year with packages that we shake for ourselves.
NO problems.
Keep it simple and put the odds on your side.


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## KPeacock (Jan 29, 2013)

over the last three years, I have installed 12 or 15 packages and direct released all of them with no trouble. That's not to say one can never have trouble doing this, but I have had no issues. I remove 4 frames from the hive, shake all the bees in, replace the frames, and then coax the queen to run down in between a couple of the frames, put the lid on and give her a couple of weeks to get busy laying eggs.


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## djjmc (Feb 6, 2015)

KPeacock said:


> over the last three years, I have installed 12 or 15 packages and direct released all of them with no trouble. That's not to say one can never have trouble doing this, but I have had no issues. I remove 4 frames from the hive, shake all the bees in, replace the frames, and then coax the queen to run down in between a couple of the frames, put the lid on and give her a couple of weeks to get busy laying eggs.


Agreed - direct release is the way to go:
Quote "The bees have either accepted the queen after three days, or (if they kill the caged queen) there is likely to be a queen already lose in the package" MB.

I direct released this year with no problems. As long as the caged queen has been in the package for 3 days then I just direct release.


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## Tenbears (May 15, 2012)

Well I donno. I have many times done a direct release with no problem. However I hear of a whole bunch Of people talking about Packages absconding lately. Although it has never happened to me in all my years of beekeeping. In light of this new found information I would reconsider a direct release. Leaving the queen caged for a few days could be the difference between keeping the bees or not. In the long run what is it going to hurt to leave her in the queen cage a bit longer! Nothing! If you peal the screen back and she flies off what you going to do?


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

been hearing about alot of packages and swarms absconding this yr too, 99% of the people i've asked hived them on a screened bottom board.


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## Mbeck (Apr 27, 2011)

HarryVanderpool said:


> There will be those that tell you to just peal back the screen and pitch the queen into the cluster.
> But will they buy you a new queen when that procedure fails?
> Why take chances?
> What's the hurry?
> ...


What he said.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>However I hear of a whole bunch Of people talking about Packages absconding lately

Every time I've done packages in recent years I've done a few queens in cages as a control group, but direct released most. In my experience they will leave the queen behind in the cage just the same as they leave her behind when she is out. They just move next door. If I go the next day I find the loose queen still in the old hive and I find the caged queen still in the old hive. I don't see that direct releasing changes the odds any. The quality of queens has just plummeted. Leaving her caged does not improve that. Another contributing factor is screened bottom boards. A new swarm will often abscond from a hive with an open screened bottom board.


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## Mbeck (Apr 27, 2011)

Oh it frustrates me to no end when I hear "but Michael Bush says" not that your advice is particularly bad just that they cherry pick it.

"Micheal Bush recommends direct release"
I feel like like telling them "but Micheal Bush didn't make up this package 45 minutes before you pulled in the driveway".


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## spammy_h (Jul 2, 2014)

So what's the theory behind the bees absconding from a hive with a screened bottom board? I'm relatively new and hadn't heard that before.


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## Beepants (Apr 1, 2015)

I installed two packages in my TBHs on Saturday and I was wondering about the bees clinging to the queen cage. I really had to shake them off to get to the cork. I wasn't sure if they were smelling her or throwing tomatoes like that scene from The Princess Bride. I'm getting from this thread that it was the latter.

I marshmallowed per instructions by my beepeddler, so this thread is interesting.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>>So what's the theory behind the bees absconding from a hive with a screened bottom board? 

Too much ventilation


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## spammy_h (Jul 2, 2014)

OK - That makes sense. So would it be appropriate to close the bottom board before installation, and then after the hive is established, pull the closer for SHB control?

I installed 2 packages last year with SBBs, and both succeeded, but they were pretty late in the season, and it was pretty warm, so I could see that having helped my situation, in spite of not knowing that issue.


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## reminniear (Apr 7, 2014)

Update:

I have to say that I much prefer a direct release, which I did 3 years ago. I hung the queen cages on Friday, between old straight brood comb. Monday after work I removed the queen cages. There was comb built up around the queen cages but I was able to cut them out easily. 

I'm glad i had old straight comb to act as a guide. 

Do I recommend direct release or hanging the queen cage? I just do whatever feels right at the time. I've done both methods and they both seem to work.
As Harley Craig said "Only the bees can tell you that"

Gotta listen to the bees, then hope you heard them right.


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## deknow (Jul 17, 2006)

I've generally had good luck with direct release...but for a new beekeeper, I would suggest you do things the way your supplier recommends...they are the ones that are most likely to help fix any problems that come up.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>OK - That makes sense. So would it be appropriate to close the bottom board before installation, and then after the hive is established, pull the closer for SHB control?

I don't have SHB... I would close it to install and leave it in. Always. Summer. Winter. All the time. Too much ventilation is not to the advantage of the bees...


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## spammy_h (Jul 2, 2014)

Ok - Thanks for the advice.


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