# Using Oxalic Acid



## bluescorpion (Sep 6, 2012)

I used Oxalic Acid in a vaporizer a few days ago in two of my hives. This is the first time i've tried it. It definitely killed any mites that were present but I also noticed some dead bees in the front entrance of the two hives. Is this normal? I counted roughly about 30 dead bees at one entrance and about 40 at the other hive. 

Thanks for any input.


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## drlonzo (Apr 15, 2014)

When vaporizing during warmer weather the bees aren't clustered as tight and they get too close to the pan. I normally find a few after each application on the landing board.


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## rookie2531 (Jul 28, 2014)

30-40 seems really high. I usually get one or two burnt bees out of 10 hives and a few that happen to be on the landing board as I throw my wet towel down to block the entrance.

Use your smoker to move them out of the way and it also gets their head in a cell of nectar. Gets the queen moving too, if she's down there.


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## enjambres (Jun 30, 2013)

I, too, have begun giving them some smoke to loosen any cluster (it's already cool/cold here in the mornings) and move them up from the lowest positions on the bottom of the frames before treating. I haven;t had any fatalities since I started doing that.

Enj.


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## bluescorpion (Sep 6, 2012)

The next clear day we have I'll try smoking the entrance first and see if that helps. I'll keep you guys posted on the results. Thanks for the input.


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## snl (Nov 20, 2009)

bluescorpion said:


> The next clear day we have I'll try smoking the entrance first and see if that helps.


It will, but you'll still have a couple of "cooked" bees that just can't resist the vaporizer. You certainly kill more than that when opening and closing a hive....


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## crofter (May 5, 2011)

Smoke hard in the entrance and then push something into the hive to knock down any ladder comb that is in the path of the vaporizer pan. You will get fewer bees and less baked wax in the pan.


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## lamarcarama (May 3, 2015)

If you have a screened BB you can OAV from under that. Then no bee-bbq even with no smoking.


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## thehackleguy (Jul 29, 2014)

lamarcarama said:


> If you have a screened BB you can OAV from under that. Then no bee-bbq even with no smoking.


Better have something other than plastic under your screen if you are doing that. One of my plastic inspection trays is partially melted because it had a slight bend up in the middle and was to close to the pan.

I did have one treatment in one hive that a few days later I had a few, maybe 100, bees dead in front of the hive. I honestly didn't link it to the OAV treatment, I figured it had something to do with being fall and down-sizing of the hive. I wonder if they may have been bees that were already weak from age or mite damage :scratch:

And I always seem to have ONE bee in the pan when I pull it out of the hive, like each hive has that one bee saying "I CAN'T TAKE IT ANY MORE!"......I'm surprised it's not a drone :lookout:


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## enjambres (Jun 30, 2013)

Vaporizing from under the screen is problematic at the low end of the allowable ambient temperature range. Perhaps as low as at 50F or below. I thought it would a fab idea, too, but I found last fall that the screen itself was so cold that it chilled the vapors on contact and all I had was a lot of snow. When I switched to using the wand above the screen, that was completely resolved. No snow since then. I also had more crisped bees when I was using the Varroacleaner model, than I now have with Varrox unit. I'm not sure why as my technique hasn't changed. In fact I haven't cooked a bee since I started using the Varrox. It's possible it heats faster.

Enj.


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## Mr.Beeman (May 19, 2012)

Wierd that you brought this up. Just yesterday, I treated half my hives with OAV. Odd thing is that the hives I didn't treat had dead bees out front but the treated hives had none. Wierd.


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## rv10flyer (Feb 25, 2015)

I just finished 120 OAV treatments. This time of year more bees are dying and sometimes the undertaker bees are overwhelmed getting rid of them, especially as it gets colder. I never see an excessive amount of dead bees after treatment.


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## bluescorpion (Sep 6, 2012)

Hi All. Just wanted to follow up. I smoked the front entrance on two of my hives before vaporizing and it made a BIG difference. I only found 3 dead bees on the landing board of 1 hive and only 2 dead bees on the other hive. Thanks for the tips gang. :applause:

Now that I'm vaporizing, how often do you pros do it? I was planning on once in the fall and once on the back end of winter; late february or so. What do you think gang? Do you guys vaporize more or less than that?


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## snl (Nov 20, 2009)

bluescorpion said:


> Now that I'm vaporizing, how often do you pros do it? I was planning on once in the fall and once on the back end of winter; late february or so. What do you think gang? Do you guys vaporize more or less than that?


At this time of year with the bees brooding, once every 7 days for three weeks. Then once in your least broodless period...sometime between Thanksgiving and Christmas.


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## rv10flyer (Feb 25, 2015)

bluescorpion said:


> Hi All. Just wanted to follow up. I smoked the front entrance on two of my hives before vaporizing and it made a BIG difference. I only found 3 dead bees on the landing board of 1 hive and only 2 dead bees on the other hive. Thanks for the tips gang. :applause:
> 
> Now that I'm vaporizing, how often do you pros do it? I was planning on once in the fall and once on the back end of winter; late february or so. What do you think gang? Do you guys vaporize more or less than that?


Do a sugar shake about March 21 to ensure you have 3 or fewer mites out of 300 bees or 1/2 Cup. Treat 3X every 5-7 days if necessary and install supers around April 15th. Remove supers about July 15. Mite check again and treat 3X if needed. One final treatment on a 40F+ day near Christmas on all hives. I normally do sugar shakes on 1 or 2 hives in each yard.


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## mgolden (Oct 26, 2011)

Finished my third OAV treatment. Doing OAV every 7 days.

Counted 160 mites after first day and a further 20 mites after second day. A few more after third day, but not noticeable with the 20 on the sticky board. Are mites under control?????

Bees are in a double deep and I'd guess maybe 40,000. Haven't checked brood for some four weeks but am thinking it is minimal.

200 mites is 0.5%. Thinking this is acceptable as likely less than 1%???? Prefer not to do alcohol test, as would have to open up hive and disturb burr comb and prefer not to kill bees. 

Appreciate any advice and comments.


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## rv10flyer (Feb 25, 2015)

My threshold is 1% max. 3 in 300 bees in a sugar shake. My 24 hr sticky board threshold is 10 mites max. The lower the better.


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## bluescorpion (Sep 6, 2012)

I'm taking notes. Thanks guys..... :thumbsup:


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## tonyp (Mar 16, 2008)

Just a quick question about mite drop counts. Does all of the dead mites drop the first night? I did a double deep 5 frame hive last night around dark and pulled the aluminum foil I used to catch the fallen mites this morning and counted around 150 or so mites. Or will they keep falling for a couple of days?


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## rv10flyer (Feb 25, 2015)

First, what did you treat with? and when did you finish treatment?


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## tonyp (Mar 16, 2008)

Savrogan brand oxalic acid. I vaporized them last night just before dark. I counted the mites on the foil and went out and seen some more on the bottom board. I was just curious if all of the mites fall the first night or if they will fall over the next few days or whatever. Probably closer to 200 to 250 mites killed so far. This hive was treated with apiguard in August.


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## rv10flyer (Feb 25, 2015)

Alrighty now I can provide some useful data comparisons close to your area. Yes, FIVE days after 1st OAV treatment on my 29 hives...5-200 mites found on sticky board. Sorry, I did not go back out until next treatment schedule. These numbers slowly decreased after 3rd or 4th treatment...showing 0-8 mites after 24 hours(the last OAV I did go back and check at 24-72 and divided accordingly). I did some sugar shakes and sticky board checks after 30 days and 15-20% of my hives are back up to 11-15 mites on sticky board in 24 hours and 4-5 on a sugar shake. These numbers are slightly over my threshold. Treated those once more with OAV. All hives healthy as a horse and appear to be much gentler. We'll see if it pays off next April.


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