# Topbar design feedback



## Colleen O. (Jun 5, 2012)

Nice CAD work. Off the top of my head, I would be concerned that there isn't enough play between your lid frame and your bars and that your cavity is a bit deep. I just changed my box dimensions a bit with my new nuc to be a little wider to fit Lang bars but shallower at the same time (now 8 7/8" dp). In essence the same volume as before but more versatile. I did have a few comb collapses with the old size but that wasn't what drove the change. My other concern is the Small Hive Beetle hiding spots at the bottom because you aren't able to chamfer the boards. I have really been working at giving them nowhere to hide. I know some don't worry about that but if it were me I would try to get them chamfered on the bottom if possible. I think they are fine at the top though.


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## Duncan Thacker (Feb 4, 2014)

there are better and easier out there. I build and I wouldn't bother with that.


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## cnt (Jun 8, 2013)

It's amazing how good CAD programs are these days 

According to wikipedia (not sure how accurate that is) We don't have SHB here one the west coast (where I live and my packages is coming from. But since that cavity is screened it may still be a good idea to keep other critters out. If its just two ripcuts I could probably convince a work friend to do it for me.

OTOH a small cavity could help me with mite counts (if I put a white sticky sheet on the bottom board)

Whats a good interior depth? 8.5" 9"? 

For a 19inch top bar should the top interior width be 17 giving an inch over hang, or should I make it 18 giving half an inch overhang?


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## cnt (Jun 8, 2013)

Duncan Thacker said:


> there are better and easier out there. I build and I wouldn't bother with that.


better and easier what?


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## Colleen O. (Jun 5, 2012)

If you don't have SHB that is great and then I wouldn't worry about adding the chamfer. I made a temporary hive last year and used 10" boards for the sides because that is what I had on hand. I never had a comb collapses with that one but since I have only had two with the deeper cavities it could be a moot point. Michael Bush has a really simple design on his website, you might take a look at that for ideas. Philip Chandler has a free download of his hive design on the biobees website you could look at too. You might check out Les Crowder's design too. I think deknow posted it or part of it in a thread a while back.

I would now size the interior to take a Lang comb with the wood frame sides removed but the ones that came on my first hive (that is the one I purchased) were 17.5" long and the wedge was around 15" or 15.25" long.

I didn't like the screen bottom so I have solid now, and I didn't like having the bottom middle of the side entrances so I moved them to the top of the side near the ends. Lots of different opinions on this, seems to really depend on the person.


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## cnt (Jun 8, 2013)

Michael Bush's design (http://www.bushfarms.com/beestopbarhives.htm) is mostly where I started from (1x12's for the sides, 1x6 for the bottom), I just made the top wider to accommodate 19" bars vs 15" bars, which is what his design uses. Assuming he uses the same "one by twelves" and -"by sixes" that I can get (11.25" and 5.25") that would put his hive at 10.464" deep


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## AugustC (Aug 7, 2013)

My first hive was as per phil chandler free plans and then subsequantly I have messed around with them. I didn't use a table saw at any point in producing my hives (mostly because I can only do this stuff of an evening and my wife think it would wake the kids  ).

You don't need a squared frame for a hinged lid.







As you can see the lid (when closed) sits on the tops of the legs. There is a strip along the back to screw the hinges into. 
For an entrance this one has a periscope entrance to help with 1) heat retention 2) reduce mite drop onto returning bees 3) confuse wasps.














This one was achieved by just boxing in the legs giving a low outside entrance coming in high on the inside. By putting it on the end this hive is long enough to have an entrance on each end so will take two medium size colonies. The only problem with doing the entrance this way is the leg cannot easily be removed if want to. The next hive I made had a periscope entrance made by routing out the back of a piece of 2/4.





















This makes the entrance much more defensible for the bees and means I can still remove the legs should I want to. 
Putting the floor on is often easier once the sides are attached to the ends. You can do this be making a 2X follower boards (dummy boards) the size of your expected comb attach them to topbar and place them upside down (this is illustrated quite well in phil chandlers designs. You then lay the sides onto the followers boards and fix the end. You can then attach the bottom without worrying about it impacting on your dimensions. I do it this way anyway as I use mesh flooring. Good luck!


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## Mr.Beeman (May 19, 2012)

The entrance to this TBH I built a few years ago was just above the bottom board on the ends. I also built a custom entrance feeder that I could install on one of the ends. The bottom board was screened by removing the center of the board and stapling screen to the opening. The roof was completely removable due to the fact I like my fingers a lot. A quick burst of wind and the hinged top may come crashing shut on whatever is in the way. Bees don't like extremely loud noises either. 
One more aspect I should cover..... ventillation. I built a dummy top bar with (2) 3/4" holes and covered it with screen. Then I drilled a 3/4" hole on each end of the gable and screened them. This way you get ventillation thoughout the hive.


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## Colleen O. (Jun 5, 2012)

cnt said:


> Michael Bush's design (http://www.bushfarms.com/beestopbarhives.htm) is mostly where I started from (1x12's for the sides, 1x6 for the bottom), I just made the top wider to accommodate 19" bars vs 15" bars, which is what his design uses. Assuming he uses the same "one by twelves" and -"by sixes" that I can get (11.25" and 5.25") that would put his hive at 10.464" deep


So it sounds like the depth is just fine then. Comb collapses are miserable so I was just trying to help.  At any rate, less work on this one is probably better. No matter what you do you will find things about it you would like to tweak (going by the fact you modeled it) after you get bees in it and it is being used.


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## Duncan Thacker (Feb 4, 2014)

cnt said:


> better and easier what?


Designs and plans. Like the title of the thread suggests.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

The only angled cut in my design is to make the comb guides. The sides, the ends, are all square cuts. None of the boards are ripped. Basically, not counting the bars, there are five cuts to make the entire hive and all of them are to length. If you want it wider, just use a one by eight or a one by ten instead of the one by six and add the difference to the ends. i.e. the ends are 15" with the one by six. If you use a one by eight, make them 17". If you use a one by ten make them 19".


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## Colino (May 28, 2013)

Michael Bush said:


> T If you use a one by eight, make them 17".


I prefer my bars to be 17" by 1-1/4" because they can be easily be converted to fit in a Langstroth. I just screw a 1"x 3/8" x 19" piece onto the top bar and add frame ends and a bottom bar. I do this because my swarm traps are all mini topbar hives and it makes it so I can move my swarm catches into either a lang or top bar hive without cutting comb.


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## Snookie (Dec 13, 2013)

Here's how I rolled:}

http://www.biobees.com/build-a-beehive-free-plans.php

Turned out YALLOW lol


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## J-Rat (Dec 10, 2013)

I really like to see every ones hive designs. they are all a little different, but a lot the same. I am new to beekeeping. 
After watching countless u tubes on how to build a top bar hive. I followed (wranglerstar.com) on my plans. Making changes
that I wanted. I only used a sliding compound saw to cut everything.
For the starter strip on the bars I set the angle at 30 degrees and ripped a 1 x 12 flip the board rip again and you have a triangle.
Glue and nail to your bars.
I ordered a package of bees, due in april. I can hardly wait.


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## ruthiesbees (Aug 27, 2013)

I'd highly recommend a viewing window. TBH lends itself perfectly to this and it's wonderful to be able to look inside the bee world. (your kids will love it too). With this crazy winter we have had, I can take a peak and see what is going on inside the hive without having to guess if they are ok. This is a picture of my window. Long glass is expensive so I went to the thrift store and bought one of the large pictures. It gave me enough glass for 4 hives.


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## AugustC (Aug 7, 2013)

My next model will definitely have a viewing window. Though I need to ensure there is still sufficient heat retention (it gets cold here).
In the meantime I was think of making follower boards with perspex windows so I can check in on the colony from either side without ever breaking the propolis seal, and it is an easy retrofit.


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## cnt (Jun 8, 2013)

ruthiesbees said:


> I'd highly recommend a viewing window.


I'm keeping bees mostly because I think they're really interesting/amazing. So I'll definitely take that advice. 



ruthiesbees said:


> Long glass is expensive so I went to the thrift store and bought one of the large pictures. It gave me enough glass for 4 hives.
> View attachment 9139


I was thinking about where to find glass. I found out that tempered glass shelves come in pretty nice sizes for viewing windows and can be really cheap (I found an 8"x36" tempered glass shelf for $6 online). Since I live near an Ikea I may just drive out there and buy a shelf from them.

I also plan on installing a camera on the follower board so I can watch them over the internet


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## ruthiesbees (Aug 27, 2013)

cnt said:


> I also plan on installing a camera on the follower board so I can watch them over the internet


Please post more about the camera when you get it going. I've been trying various (inexpensive) cameras and I've not found one that I like. I even borrowed my mom's birdhouse camera, but couldn't get the focal point just right.


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## cnt (Jun 8, 2013)

ruthiesbees said:


> Please post more about the camera when you get it going. I've been trying various (inexpensive) cameras and I've not found one that I like. I even borrowed my mom's birdhouse camera, but couldn't get the focal point just right.


Will do. It'll be a semi-custom (but easy) job so I plan on making a write up.


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