# TBH Design-Anyone here using this 'model'?



## David LaFerney (Jan 14, 2009)

That's kinda cool, but it looks to me like the endless design would be rather fragile. If the sides spread a little bit the whole mess could collapse.


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## Ozarkhighlands (Nov 13, 2011)

I'm not sure what you mean by endless? It does have ends, they are removable...I don't think you leave the end off all the time?


LaRae


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## David LaFerney (Jan 14, 2009)

The ends aren't structurally attached though. Take a shoe box and cut the ends lose - but leave them in there so you can say it still has ends - and see how flimsy it becomes. Now try to strengthen it up with gussets, and brackets, and any kind of creative cardboard engineering you can imagine - you will find that it is very difficult to ever make it as structurally sound as it was with attached ends.

I'm not saying that it sucks - but I wonder if it will last for years of bee keeping. Of course if there is ever a problem it would be pretty easy to just attach some ends.


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## Ozarkhighlands (Nov 13, 2011)

Hmmm I guess I figured the thickness of the wood and how it's assembled overall would offset that...but I don't work with wood much so I am just guessing. Wood shrinkage would probably factor in, so it's true might have to do some retro-fitting later on. 


LaRae


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## taydeko (Jan 3, 2012)

It looks like this hive also has center entrances. I think this type of hive requires a lot more management also, since honey stores can be on either side of the brood nest. Without close management, overwintering can be a little problematic as the cluster goes one way and separates itself from half of it's honey stores. It is hard to tell about the entrances though. Perhaps the entrances are in one of the end boards. The same effect of moveable ends of the hive can be accomplished with follower boards in any TBH or horizontal langstroth if desired, so I don't see these as a great leap forward in TBH technology. I agree that the lack of attached ends makes the hives less stable. I built one of my hives with 2x lumber. It was a lot cheaper. It is very sturdy, but also very heavy.

Ted


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## Ozarkhighlands (Nov 13, 2011)

So what would be another option for a top bar hive? They aren't too common around here so I'm not that familiar with them.


LaRae


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## taydeko (Jan 3, 2012)

> So what would be another option for a top bar hive? They aren't too common around here so I'm not that familiar with them.


I am not sure I completely understand your question. You can make a TBH out of almost anything. I have seen them made from old refridgerators, oil barrels cut in half, split logs or whatever. If you are looking for a place to buy them, they are pretty expensive, usually. One of the advertisers on BeeSource sells them at www.BeeThinking.com. There are lots of other places that sell them too.

If you want to build them, you need to figure out what design you want. There are many options and a lot of experimenting being done with TBHs. I have built very elaborate Tanzania TBHs and very simple Kenya TBHs and things in between. You can have variations in length, width and depth, building materials, cover types, and entrance types and locations. Legs or no legs. Feeder options. The list goes on forever. TJ Carr has a design using a single fourteen foot 1x10. Others use 1x12. I have used 1x12s, 2x6s, and plywood to build hives depending on what they were for and what resources I have available. Lots of people use wood from pallets to build them. I have described some of my hive building techniques and designs at http://wilcoxent.com/mzima/beekeeping.php. Michael Bush has lots of information about TBHs on his site, http://bushfarms.com/beestopbarhives.htm. 

In your area, since it gets pretty hot there, I would build a TBH that was not too deep. A really deep hive could lead to comb collapse in hot weather, which can be pretty messy and really bad for the bees.

I would recommend seeing if there is a local beekeeper group in your area. See if there are any TBH Beeks in it and see if there is a "standard" hive size for your area and build your hives the same size. This allows you to share comb and brood and things with others in the area easily if you want to.

Ted


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## Beev (Jul 16, 2011)

I think thats a pretty neat design. One of the end boards is cut short of the bottom, thats what they appear to be using for a entrance. If you added a small triangular gusset to the sides, I don't think stability would be a problem. Also, by leaving the entrance end back from the end a bit, if you needed to add a bar or two to the broodnest it would be easy, without having to re-arrange everything. The drawback to the removable ends I can see, is it would make it easier for critters to get into.


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## mmiller (Jun 17, 2010)

I like the dimensions but the removable end (like others have stated) would most likely create a weekness and unnecesarrily make it more complex. I like to keep them simple. I do like the thicker wood. I use 2" lumber for my TBH's. They are heavier but I don't move them. Much cheaper to purchase as well.

Mike


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## windfall (Dec 8, 2010)

As David pointed out, this hive is structuraly unstable. It has no resistance to wracking or twisting, and without its lid it wants to open up flat especialy once it fil up and the wieght it bearing on the top.
Unless there is something missing/hidden in the pictures.
A similar design could be made with exterior bracing....but they are not showing that.


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## tommyt (Aug 7, 2010)

Dave builds KTBH and shows it to the world 
I think you may like these instructional videos 
http://www.davesbees.com/

Good Luck 
Tommyt

As for the other design you could use threaded rods as collar ties
on either end,keep the follower or end board inside of them


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I guess he is making the ends removable to inspect the hive. I don't understand the point of that. removing empty bars is easy enough. Even full bars is easy enough. I don't see how that helps me. The whole point of a top bar hive to me is to be simple and cheap. People always seem to insist on making them complicated and expensive.

http://www.bushfarms.com/beestopbarhives.htm


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## Ozarkhighlands (Nov 13, 2011)

Are there others who make the TBH and sell them? I'm not even going to get into making them...assembling already cut hives is challenge enough <G>

Oh and what about the 'second level' on the TBH on the link I posted...is that common to see on TBH?

LaRae


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## Ozarkhighlands (Nov 13, 2011)

I just found the thread about Warre vs Traditional ....the Warre looks interesting but seems like that's alot like what I want to get away from.

LaRae


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## Beethinking (Jun 2, 2008)

LaRae,

There are many others (including me) who sell top bar hives. Our site is in my signature.

Best,
Matt


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## Ozarkhighlands (Nov 13, 2011)

Yes thanks Matt, your site is where I was looking.

LaRae


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## VeggieGardener (Oct 4, 2011)

I have not used the Bee Landing TBH but I have checked one out at a display and they appeared to be very solidly constructed. I would be surprised if there were issues with it twisting or being unstable. The entrance is via the follower board on one of the floating ends.

Another source for pre-built top bar hives is Organic Bee Hives.

I don't have one but love the design and features of Cacklewack's hives. I have purchased one of their top bar nucs and the quality was excellent.


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## GeezLouise (Feb 4, 2012)

VeggieGardener said:


> I have not used the Bee Landing TBH but I have checked one out at a display and they appeared to be very solidly constructed. I would be surprised if there were issues with it twisting or being unstable. The entrance is via the follower board on one of the floating ends.


I have a set of James' plans, and they include 1/4 x 2" steel brackets under the decorative side pieces. Thinking about building a couple 5-footers with ends on them, just to pacify my desire not to have warpage out at the ends, or collect blowing snow on the bottom.


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