# Western honey bees likely came from ASIA, not Africa as once thought



## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Western honey bees likely came from ASIA, not Africa as once thought











Thrice out of Asia and the adaptive radiation of the western honey bee


The western honey bee originated in Asia before adaptively radiating into Africa and Europe.




www.science.org


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## Litsinger (Jun 14, 2018)

Thank you for the post, GregV. I was surprised to read, _'The researchers said that they hope that their study will finally lay to rest the debate as to where the western honey bee originally came from — freeing up future research to explore further how the insects adapted to different climates.'_

The other thing that puzzles me about an Asian origin for Apis mellifera is this would suggest that they likely would have traveled through the range of Apis cerana and presumably would have been exposed to varroa long before the last hundred years or so...


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Litsinger said:


> The other thing that puzzles me about an Asian origin for Apis mellifera is this would suggest that they likely would have traveled through the range of Apis cerana and presumably would have been exposed to varroa long before the last hundred years or so...


Not really.
It is proposed that the region of Western Asia/Asia Minor is the cradle of the A. mellifera.


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## Litsinger (Jun 14, 2018)

GregV said:


> It is proposed that the region of Western Asia/Asia Minor is the cradle of the A. mellifera.


Thanks for the feedback, GregV. I may have to bone up on my geography, but it would have helped if the authors would have better defined what they meant by 'Western Asia' as it seems there is no defined consensus as to what the exact geographical extents of this area is:









Western Asia - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org





If one considers Iran a part of Western Asia then the historical origins of Apis mellifera come very close to the extents of Apis cerana.

Looking at the references for an Asian origin for Apis mellifera, I noted that Ruttner's:

BIOMETRICAL-STATISTICAL ANALYSIS OF THE GEOGRAPHIC VARIABILITY OF APIS MELLIFERA L.*

Notes, _'The results of this analysis indicate that the group sahariensis - lamarckii - syriaca represents not only the morphological but also the genetic and historic center of the species Apis mellifera.'_


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Litsinger said:


> If one considers Iran a part of Western Asia then the historical origins of Apis mellifera come very close to the extents of Apis cerana.


That maybe.
Which is not the same as
.........they likely would have traveled through the range of Apis cerana.........

But none of these matter in the context of species formation that took place over the millions of years 
Remember, the Varroa is a very recent invasive parasite as far as both A. mellifera and A. cerana are concerned - talking 100-200 years at most.


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## Litsinger (Jun 14, 2018)

GregV said:


> Remember, the Varroa is a very recent invasive parasite as far as both A. mellifera and A. cerana are concerned - talking 100-200 years at most.


Thanks, GregV. I was not explicit in my response but I was agreeing with you that it was a stretch for me to suggest that a Western Asia origin for Apis mellifera would have required them to travel through Apis cerana territory to spread North and East.

That said, I am not sure that varroa is a recent pest to cerana- while I cannot find any estimate as to timing, they are often referred to in terms similar to, a '...co-evolved ancestral host'.


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Litsinger said:


> That said, I am not sure that varroa is a recent pest to cerana-


To be honest, by now I don't even remember all the details anymore (if I ever read all way down).
Very well you could be correct, Litsinger.
Maybe I am thinking in the context of A. mellifera and getting mixed up.


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## Litsinger (Jun 14, 2018)

More context on this study courtesy of the February 2022 ABJ (attached).


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## Litsinger (Jun 14, 2018)

And a good (and readily understandable) update from Dr. Jay Evans in the February 2022 Bee Culture:


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