# Making a Miller Style Top Feeder - Sealant Ideas



## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

I am going to make my own style of the Miller Design for a top feeder. It says to seal it up with molten wax. Well I don't have any of that. What do you use instead? Some type of food grade caulk?


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

Hambone said:


> Well I don't have any of that.


How much does it require?

contact me at [email protected] maybe I can help you out.

cchoganjr


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## Myron Denny (Sep 27, 2009)

My feeders are wood, full hive size X 3" deep with plywood floors. I used a silicone caulk around the seams, my feeders are 3 yrs old, they have caused no problems leaking. I use a wood float on top of the syrup for the bees to feed from. There are alway a few dead bees on top of the float. I want to do away with the float and use hardware cloth for the bees to feed from.
Has anyone tried this and will it work?


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

>  I want to do away with the float and use hardware cloth for the bees to feed from.

The Miller style feeder plans in the _Build It Yourself_ section uses hardware cloth and no floats:
http://www.beesource.com/build-it-yourself/miller-type-feeder/

The ones I built work fine.


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

This is basically what I plan on making. Just straight cuts and I only have to rip about a 1/4" off a couple 1 x 4's. I am going to put some hardware cloth on the bottom gap so the bees can get through it when the syrup is low.


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## jrhoto (Mar 2, 2009)

Please consider some dado cuts for the bottom of your tray as this will help to keep it from leaking.

www.poorvalleybeefarm.com


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

jrhoto said:


> Please consider some dado cuts for the bottom of your tray as this will help to keep it from leaking.


Can you explain that a little better. I am a wood working idiot.


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## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

Looking at the photo Hambone...it isn't clear to me how the bees will get past the screen to the syrup.


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

The two center boards below the screen allow the bees to go over them into the syrup side. The two outer boards that the screen is attached to don't go all the way to the bottom, thus allowing syrup to the inner boards.


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

The 2 outside 1x4 are ripped about a 1/4" short. So the syrup comes up the bottom gap between the 2 inners boards.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

If you have no beeswax, go to the craft store and buy some paraffin.


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## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

The feeder shown in Post #5 looks like a great design.

Has anyone used this style of feeder and can they comment on the amount of bee drowning they experienced?

I asked because I have used the top feeders with wood floats, and I have huge bee loses due to drowning. I couldn't figure out a way to train bee lifeguards, so I stopped using them. I am thinking of modifying them into the design show in Post #5, so they aren't a total waste of money.


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## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

Barry said:


> The two outer boards that the screen is attached to don't go all the way to the bottom


Does one then place screens below the short boards to keep bees from entering the feeder once the syrup gets low?


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

That's why on the plans here, I show a V shaped piece of hardware cloth that fits down between the two boards where the bees have access. It allows them to go down as the feed goes down, but keeps them from getting into the feed chamber when the level gets that low. Attaching a piece at the bottom would serve the same.


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## Denis Auclair (Jun 5, 2013)

I make my own miller top feeders.

I use BC fir plywood for the bottom, yellow pine for all the rest. Titebond II glue, Dado blades are my friend for this projet...And no wire wesh!

I make flot's that move around pretty easy...Again with pine left overs !!!

Sealer... Parafine!!!

The stuff used for canning. Your can find this in any supermarket ... By the way.Do not melt in microwave or in a directly in a pot... Boiling of this stuff is flammable... and also does not replace skin!!! LOlll

I make a double boiler with and old pirex measuring cup and melt away, I apply 2 or 3 coats with a dollars store paint brush... Sealed until ever or until your scrape it off... You can also make touch up when dry.. Seals on the spot if your stuff is hot enough.

Good luck with you try...

Denis


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## KevinR (Apr 30, 2010)

I've used and like this style feeder... I haven't seen a large amount of drownings.. I see more with the feeders that have the floats in them... 

I tend to use mason jar feeders these days... Although I go back and forth on this styles ability to put a large amount of feed on a one time. 

The downside of these feeders is that they tend to slosh around when you take them off the hive, and you need some where level to set them while doing inspection.


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## AstroBee (Jan 3, 2003)

shinbone said:


> I have used the top feeders with wood floats, and I have huge bee loses due to drowning.


I built several classical Miller style feeders using wooden floats and have no bee deaths. I took a sheet of thin plywood and ran lots of slits using a table saw. The slits stop about an inch from the edges and are spaced about an inch apart. I then added a pine rim around the plywood which faces down to increase floatation. The float is sized to fit with minimal gaps around the edges. I'm not suggesting that this design is better than the one posted above, but it works for me. I used dado cuts and lots of titebond III during assembly. I finished with silicone sealer on the joints in the wet section - no other sealer used. You can get silicone that is safe for food contact. I've been using these for more than 7 years without any losses. 

The design above looks pretty good. Do the bees build wax up into the feeder? On my feeders, the entrance is across the front away from the center of the cluster and I don't have issues with excess comb into the feeder. Of course this may be seen as a negative as bees are less likely to get access during colder temps.


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

KevinR said:


> I tend to use mason jar feeders these days... Although I go back and forth on this styles ability to put a large amount of feed on a one time.


I mostly use mason jars too. But when I start to feed here in a couple weeks when there is a 25-30 degree temp change the mason jars tend to leak. They work great in March and the fall season when the temp around here is pretty steady from night to day.


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## KevinR (Apr 30, 2010)

I've also used the Fatbeeman feeders... If had a solid cheap supply of containers to fit the feeders... I'd consider looking at using them, but with the cost and effort of making the ladder.. I might as well use the miller style from mann lake at 12 bucks per... Since I'd have to make the super in both accounts... 

But who knows, maybe I'll figure out a way to make it all on the super cheap.. = )


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

I use silicone which is real expensive, but it does not leak as I had siliconized caulk do. Halfstepping just makes your legs tired and you don't get anywhere. Do it right the first time. I love the miller feeders. The entrance is in the middle of the frame and some portion of a viable cluster is always close enough to find and use the syrup. I need to build another dozen this winter. 



Hambone said:


> I am going to make my own style of the Miller Design for a top feeder. It says to seal it up with molten wax. Well I don't have any of that. What do you use instead? Some type of food grade caulk?


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## DC Bees (Sep 24, 2009)

I made three of the Miller type feeders and used Camcote to keep them from leaking so far no leaks.
http://www.brushymountainbeefarm.com/images/615-Camcote.jpg
With this type of feeder there is no way for the bees to drown.


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

Are y'all coating the inside with a marine or other type of varnish?


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## mgolden (Oct 26, 2011)

Have some and they work well. Sealed any wood to wood with a bead of silicone as I assembled. Know you said you had no wax, but they work best when bottom and sides of tank and baffle boards are sealed with wax. Otherwise, there will be some black mold growing.

But they are an extra piece of equipment and diffcult to take off if they have any amount of liquid in them as some spilling. Going to try some 1 gallon plastic pails over the inner cover hole.


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## S.M.N.Bee (Aug 9, 2011)

When you assemble the feeder use Gorilla glue. It expands as it cures filling any gaps. I than coat with marine spar varnish. Have one that is four years old and no leaks.

I also run floats. I originally made them out of one eighth pine but had drowning issues as well. I than made some from 1/4" plywood and have not had any issues with these.
Instead of slots as someone had mentioned here I drill about twelve tapered holes in each float. 

John


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

S.M.N.Bee said:


> Instead of slots as someone had mentioned here I drill about twelve tapered holes in each float.


Drilling - That makes me think now. On a side note. I could just drill a few small holes on the bottom of the outside boards to allow the syrup to flow in and not have to worry about ripping the 1x4's down and save on the hardware cloth. Or is there a reason not to do it that way?


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

Now that I am thinking about the design. I have a radial arm saw at work. I can just rip little slots blade width down a 1x and not have to worry about drilling or hardware cloth. I'll do one tomorrow and take pics of it.


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## J&S Farms (Jan 20, 2012)

I use one coat of fiberglass resin. Use a cheap paint brush and wear latex gloves. I have some feeders that are 20 plus years old and still don't leak.


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

Here is what I am thinking about doing for the outside boards. This way I can use 1x3 and 1x4 and just make straight cuts. Took about 10 seconds to turn the wood up and make the slits.


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

Should work, Chuck. You just won't be able to seal the wood completely with those notches. I gave everything a couple coats of poly on mine.


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## Myron Denny (Sep 27, 2009)

I have "junk sugar" (warehouse sweepings) I mixed about 3# with 1 cup of vinegar, plus 1 cup of water and a splash of HBH. It has been sitting in a bucket about 3 hours. I am going to put this in my version of hive top feeder. It is dry enough the bees can crawl on it. I have 1 colony that will not make it to spring without being fed. I intend to put it on today. By the way I do not reccomend the junk sugar, I will not buy it again, it is a pain!!!


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

Hambone said:


> Here is what I am thinking about doing for the outside boards.


Why not just make the outside board 1/4" shy of the feeder bottom? This allows syrup to easily flow under and the bees can't get under it if all the feed is gone. That way you can really seal up the bottom of that board.


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## mgolden (Oct 26, 2011)

Think the window screen V is a must as it makes a ladder for the bees. There will be large numbers of bees drowning other wise.

Need the ladders or floats or there will be large numbers of drowned bees.


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

Now that I look at the original plans I wasn't thinking straight. I can just use 1x3's for the outer boards and that will give me the clearance for the syrup to go under.


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## marios (Nov 20, 2012)

my buddy has 1400 hives and uses 4 ml plastic staples the top once he has folded it down into the cavity , works for years for him.


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## danno (Dec 17, 2007)

I have a bunch of these feeders. One change I made was to cover the whole top with 1/8 wire not just the center. When I first started using these the biggest problem I had was with even a small gap between the cover and the feeder caused massive drowning. The 1/8 solved this.


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

Danno that is a good Idea. I use the soundboard winter inner covers to keep bees out but when filling and checking I always get some suicides. The easiest way to crank out miller feeders is to sacrifice a deep hive body and cut it in three pieces. They hold a lot of syrup and I use my old cull boxes and can usually get a couple out of a damaged box. I liked the suggestion someone made about using fiberglass resin for inner coating. I usually just silicon the edges and corners and let the wood swell.


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

Got six of them made. They are real ugly but they work.  Maybe they will look better after I paint them. Best part is after I cover them in hardware cloth I will only have about $6 invested in each one.


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## Handloader (Aug 16, 2013)

I have used spray on bed liner with very good success. I'm sure that you could use the roll on And apply with a brush with the same results. Not the cheapest but if you use cedar or cypress it should last a lifetime.


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