# Why do they start cells and not finish...



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

http://www.bushfarms.com/beesbetterqueens.htm#Well-Fed Bees Do Not Tear Down Cells

I've found feeding seems to be the best way to avoid them being torn down either in the finisher or in the mating nucs.


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## beemanlee (Dec 10, 2005)

*Not enought nurse bees.*



Ross said:


> It seems like once they get 3 or 4 they like, they clean out the others. Just wondering.


Ross,
When the bees do this it's one of two things... If you did the grafting right and removed the Queen...

One: You need to have a very strong cell builder hive (two supers) with many frames of extra nurse bees...
Two: You need to feed this cell builder with a frame feeder.

The two things above give the bees a false honey flow and they produce lots of wax to draw out the Queen cells.
Both of them are need to finish drawing the wax and filling the cells with Royal Jelly...
Lee...


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## tecumseh (Apr 26, 2005)

requirements.... lots of bees packed into some small space with plenty of pollen (preferrable in the frame) and a trickle of feed coming in all the time.

there are any number of things that can go wrong... when you are actively doing a bit of queen rearing actually the list seems endless and seems to constantly grow longer.

cool weather can limit the nuc building unit's bioliogical activity and the number of finished cells will be greatly reduced. someone above suggest a frame feeder but in the case of a significant cool snap this is one case where a (and sometimes I use two) boardman feeders placed over the cluster is a better way to deliver sugar syrup.

closed box... I like to use a swarm box that I close up for the first couple of days and then allow them to fly. closed up for too short a peiod and the box seems to loose population. close them up to long and the dead quickly pile up in the bottom of the box.


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

I think many variables go into it as mentioned above. I ask myself "Why will one hive make one or two supercedure cells on their own, and the next hive build ten?" or "Why does one hive build 3 or 4 swarm cells, and the next hive build 25?". I think feed, numbers, and many things go into it. But I still think one component is the bees willingness itself.

I have had three boxes fully prepared with everything you could think of, and they sometimes make less than using a good swarm. I think the swarm is prepared to make wax, and in many ways "willing' to do it. 

I just grafted on Sunday placing two larvae in each cell. Not sure how this will impact my take numbers (Last graft before was 29 out of 32) but am trying to keep the large numbers variables at a low option. It will be interesting to see what this does to overall numbers.


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## Ross (Apr 30, 2003)

They took over a gallon of feed during the time they were making the queens, from introduction of the Jenter cups to capping. Nurse bees could be an issue as I made them queenless a bit early so I could eliminate any volunteer queen cells (bad attitude), but they had a lot of bees. Cool weather could have had some affect, but not much I don't think. The queen was only in the Jenter for 16 hours or so, so timing shouldn't have been an issue. Oh well, on to the next batch.


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## tecumseh (Apr 26, 2005)

if you had a spell of cool weather... access to the feeder can be an issue. this spring I started up a batch of cells (in a 5 frame swarm box) and placed a feed bottle on one end of the top of the starter box. out of 25 possible cells they started 5 and all were on the end with the feed bottle.

removing the feeder before the cells are finished (capped) can also lead to the cells being thinned by the bees themselves.


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

My double graft (two larvae) in each cell, using the same cells that were torn down resulted in 28 of 32 being built again. So the acceptance rate seems fine using the same cells, for at least the circumstances explained previously.


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## beemanlee (Dec 10, 2005)

*You need the young nurse bees Ross*



Ross said:


> Nurse bees could be an issue... Oh well, on to the next batch.


Ross,
You are now getting the picture of what is need most... If you don't have nurse bees, then you don't have the Royal Jelly to smeer on the toast(Queen Cells)...
Lee...


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