# This is great



## benstung (Mar 20, 2011)

Long time friend of my family Steve Ellis way to go. 
I want to be one of the plaintiffs.

http://minnesota.publicradio.org/display/web/2013/03/21/minn-beekeeper-joins-lawsuit-against-epa


http://www.bouldercountybeekeepers.org/beekeepers-sue-the-epa/


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

It will be very interesting how this one pans out. Ill be watching,

It said five environmental groups joining the effort, so my question, is this about the bees or is this about "anti chemical" going against chemical with the mask of the bees ?


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

just for the record, it wouldnt hurt my feelings if they quit using this stuff. 
but bringing back the crop dusters does not do us any justice either


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## benstung (Mar 20, 2011)

this is about the bees.
These bee keepers like Steve Ellis and Jeff Anderson have been at this for years. spending countless hours for the sake of saving the bees.
A law suit of this extent may need more than just a few crazy beekeepers.


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## benstung (Mar 20, 2011)

Ian said:


> just for the record, it wouldnt hurt my feelings if they quit using this stuff.
> but bringing back the crop dusters does not do us any justice either


crop dusters never left.


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

maybe they will achieve the right angle at the issue going after the government instead of targeting the companies themselves


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

benstung said:


> crop dusters never left.


neonic treatments offset a lot of aerial spraying


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## Solomon Parker (Dec 21, 2002)

Ian said:


> maybe they will achieve the right angle at the issue going after the government instead of targeting the companies themselves


Only government has the power to do anything about this. And a good lawsuit can goose EPA into doing its job.


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## Riskybizz (Mar 12, 2010)

"“Litigation is the basic legal right that guarantees every individual its decade in court” ...David Porter


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## Solomon Parker (Dec 21, 2002)

I really wish there were a better (read "non-lawyer") way to do things, but this is how it works at this point in history.


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## deknow (Jul 17, 2006)

Solomon Parker said:


> I really wish there were a better (read "non-lawyer") way to do things, but this is how it works at this point in history.


Really? Torches and pitchforks come to mind...but at least they got rid of the witches, right?

As pointed out in another thread (and quoted from Catch the Buzz):


> "The coalition, represented by attorneys for the Center for Food Safety (CFS), seeks suspension of the registrations of insecticides that have repeatedly been identified as highly toxic to honey bees, clear causes of major bee kills and significant contributors to the devastating ongoing mortality of bees known as colony collapse disorder (CCD)."


...repeatedly been identified as:
1. Highly toxic to honeybees- Well, that isn't a mystery...it says so right on the label.
2. clear causes of major bee kills- Yup...there are well documented large kills, generally from dust while planting treated seed. This shouldn't be happening, but there are lots of dangerous substances that are handled properly that don't cause a lot of damage.

3. and significant contributors to the devastating ongoing mortality of bees known as colony collapse disorder (CCD)- Really? Certainly there is a belief that this is true, but many cases of CCD cannot be linked to pesticides. In cases (like point 2) where dust has caused overt pesticide poisoning (ie, it is obvious to any observer that there is pesticide poisoning), the bees died from pesticide poisoning....not CCD. In the cases of other bee deaths where pesticides aren't implicated, we get "researchers" making up stuff about imidacloprid being present in HFCS (and for those bees not fed HFCS, they must have encountered corn nectar and/or pollen)...but the data isn't there to support this point.

The obvious thing to do is to sue the farmers who misapply the pesticides that have actually killed bees.

I don't doubt the sincerity of most (if not all) of the people involved in the lawsuit....but eariler posters are correct, this is about a "green" movement to fight the large agribusiness corporations. No one has come up with a better plan. No one is suggesting that if these pesticides are banned that less pesticides will be used. No one has even come up with an impact statement about what will happen if these pesticides are banned. More aerial spraying, more overt hive poisonings, more pesticides....not better ones, not cheaper ones, not safer ones...just more.

deknow


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## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

deknow said:


> Really? Torches and pitchforks come to mind...but at least they got rid of the witches, right?


Ya gotta give ‘em credit Dean…..they devised a surefire test for witches. Dunk them for 5 minutes and those that survived were surely witches.


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

benstung said:


> I want to be one of the plaintiffs.


Can't sue youself for ^%@#$ so got to sue somebody. Yep, beekeeping here at it's best.


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