# height variations and chances of swarm-capture?



## mlanden (Jun 19, 2016)

I've read all the instructions about where to place traps (at least 15 feet up a tree, maybe 40 feet if possible, 18.35 feet up, south-facing, etc, etc). That said - I'm not handy, and doing labor-intensive things like hammering/cable-arranging don't work for me now (after a pinched nerve episode last year, and a collision [at 75 mph with a kid in an SUV!] leaving me with "concussion-residual").

I made a swarm trap from a deep and placed it 5' up a persimmon tree, made another deep-trap and placed it 9' atop a shed, a trap 5' up in a pear tree (a "swarm tree" from last year) and another on a stand 7' up a dogwood. 

They've been out 2 weeks now, and .... nothing so far. Lots of swarming locally, I'm hearing. I tried smearing an attractant an old-time beek told me about (olive oil + lemongrass oil + wax) and smeared it inside each. That drew the curiosity of bees from the package I lately unloaded into a brood box, but that lasted about a morning.

Is there any chance at all any of these traps could work if left out long enough? I've never tried trapping, and hear lots of epics about traps on the ground that got lucky, or traps left in windows in abandoned houses -- voila!

Anybody else out there with advice, instructional experiences, etc? Feedback's always appreciated.


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## gww (Feb 14, 2015)

ml
I never put mine higher then I can reach from the ground. I don't think I ever will again. It might help being higher but you can catch lower and I am not getting on a ladder and trying to hold a trap ever agian. Take it for what it is worth. I think you are wasting your reasources a bit if you have three traps in one little spot. You should see if your friends or relitives would let you put a trap in their yard and maby look at it for you every so often. Don't get me wrong, I have two traps ten feet away from each other but last year, I caught 3 swarms and each was twelve miles apart. If you only have three traps, you might see if you could spred them out a bit.
Good luck
gww


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## Reef Resiner (Jun 9, 2015)

To add on to what gww said. Traps about 3 1/2 feet off the ground should be fine. Higher didn't produce better results for me.

It sounds like a few things might be going on. Is your trap around 40Liters in volume? Around 40 produces better results. Is a deep trap considered 2 nucs stacked on eachother or a 10 frame deep? And how much LGO is smeared in the trap? Too much bait can put a swarm off. Only 3 drops on a cotton ball smeared around the entrance on top a frame and inner cover is usually a good start.

I personally use swarm commander but LGO should get the job done. Not sure if olive oil effects things positively or negatively.


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

>Around 40 produces better results.

This setup was two five frame baithives set on top of two ten frame bait hives and both of the five frame boxes got filled. Not the ten frame boxes.


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## Reef Resiner (Jun 9, 2015)

Looks like a trick I haven't seen. Cool pic. I've done 4 frame, 5 frame, 6 frame and 11 frame traps not stacked with no luck. Does that mostly work with the 5 frame on top of a 10?


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## Eikel (Mar 12, 2014)

MLANDON, 
No $150 box of bees is worth seriously hurting yourself or exacerbating an existing condition; as with protective gear, go with what you're comfortable with and enjoy the experience (OK, I'm off my soapbox). (If you listen to my wife, I'm getting to old to keep doing what I'm comfortable with; she does have a valid point)

Some years and locations are better than others but most years for my area, I'm pulling bait hives in the July timeframe. By then you're only catching after swarms and end up combining to get enough mass to build sufficiently by winter. As gww said, traps too close together are competing with each other which is great if you have multiple swarms in the area at the same but it's just not something I expect. Spread them out if an option, if not c'est le vie. Swarm season is just starting here so two weeks wouldn't be too concerning for me. Because I tend to catch swarms at the same locations, personal opinion is your pear tree is gong to come thru for you if swarms are out.


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

>Does that mostly work with the 5 frame on top of a 10?

I set up a new apiary at a neighbors and set the 5 frames on top of empty 10 frames just to improve the chances of catching a swarm. I catch swarms in all sizes of traps I use. This is a video of a swarm going into a hive twelve frames wide with combs 19" deep:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3zB61HDtXs


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I tried them at all heights. I never saw any difference between 6 feet off the ground and 40 feet off the ground. I did see some difference between ON the ground and 6 feet off the ground. Maybe if they weren't baited it would make more difference, but with LGO I don't see any difference between 6 and 40.


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## Fishmaster50 (Apr 30, 2015)

All mine are within reaching from the ground. Put 5 out last year and caught 5. Built a few more this year but NONE will be higher than what I can reach.


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

The height of a five gallon bucket worked so well that the swarm caught at that height did not fit into a five frame box. To make it fit and be more stable I graduated it to an 8 frame box on a 15g. bucket.


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## PAHunter62 (Jan 26, 2011)

I place mine about 10 feet off the ground I guess. Mine are all in a remote area. I back my truck up to a tree and stand on the bed side rails (as I get older, I will probably lower them for safety sake). I place them at this height only to get them out of reach of meddling kids. I have good success rates, but strongly feel location trumps everything else.


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## mlanden (Jun 19, 2016)

gww said:


> ml
> I never put mine higher then I can reach from the ground. I don't think I ever will again. It might help being higher but you can catch lower and I am not getting on a ladder and trying to hold a trap ever agian. Take it for what it is worth. I think you are wasting your reasources a bit if you have three traps in one little spot. You should see if your friends or relitives would let you put a trap in their yard and maby look at it for you every so often. Don't get me wrong, I have two traps ten feet away from each other but last year, I caught 3 swarms and each was twelve miles apart. If you only have three traps, you might see if you could spred them out a bit.
> Good luck
> gww


Hi, g -- sounds like the voice of experience to me. Just this morning, I moved my trap from atop the tool shed (9' up) -- and that, even w/o bees, was a wobbly, potentially-disastrous process. Now I can easily see a trap full of the bugs crashing to the ground. Couldn't be pleasant for any involved.

Thx much for the insights ......

Mitch


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## soarwitheagles (May 23, 2015)

Big thanks to Odfrank, Michael Bush, and everyone else that contributed to this post...

I have been asking myself the same question for the last few weeks because climbing up a 10 ft. ladder every day was getting kinda old real quick!

I pounded 1/2 dia. inch nails that are 12 inches long into Eucalyptus trees and hung most of my traps from them...only problem is, I hung em' all over 8 ft. high and it is a big awkward to check em' and re-bait them every week...

I caught my first hive of the year last week. I must have missed seeing the swarm because the only thing I saw this time was a bunch of bees comin' and goin' from the trap. When I opened the lid, sure enough, there was a nice size super gentle swarm.

I plan on lowering all my swarm traps now after reading this post. 

Posting some pics of my traps...I caught the last swarm last week in pic #2.

Cheers!


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## frustrateddrone (Jan 31, 2015)

I am 6ft tall. The swarm I got out of the Oak Tree was about 6.5feet off the ground 30 minutes ago. I just did some trimming of the oak tree branches enough to get a nuc box deep up under it. Shake into the box and set it on a ladder. Basically done in 10 minutes.


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## FlowerPlanter (Aug 3, 2011)

odfrank said:


> >Around 40 produces better results.
> 
> This setup was two five frame baithives set on top of two ten frame bait hives and both of the five frame boxes got filled. Not the ten frame boxes.



Exactly what I have found; The higher position will get the swarm even over a 10 frame box size. I never went more that 20 FT. But those 20 footers most seem to catch a swarm. 5 and 10 frame box size did not seem to make a difference with percent caught or size of the swarm.

I've been saying it for years thanks for proving it.


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## Scpossum (May 4, 2014)

FlowerPlanter said:


> Exactly what I have found; The higher position will get the swarm even over a 10 frame box size. I never went more that 20 FT. But those 20 footers most seem to catch a swarm. 5 and 10 frame box size did not seem to make a difference with percent caught or size of the swarm.
> 
> I've been saying it for years thanks for proving it.


Same setup here. The nuc sized traps caught 2 swarms sitting on top of the 10 framers.


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