# My Feeders



## bobbarker (May 23, 2012)

I meant to put this up last year, but I decided to wait and see if it worked out well, and then I kind of forgot.  Anyways, right after hiving my first two packages, I was headed out of town for a weekend of camping, and since I couldn't convince anyone to come over and feed my bees for me, I had to come up with a solution that would keep them fed from Thursday morning to Monday afternoon/evening. I had tried the baggie feeder, but that only lasted about two days. My solution? Chicken waterers!










They hold a gallon of syrup, they have shallow trays which I fill with small/medium sized rocks to give the girls something to land on/hold on to/crawl out of the syrup if they fall in, and the best part is that sitting them on the top bars with an empty deep above they fit perfectly inside the hive. I had zero bees drown in them, and they last much longer than the baggie feeder, they don't leak, they're plastic (so, durable). I have not yet figured out any downside to using them, and they cost around 5 dollars if you can catch them on sale. Maybe it's not an original idea at all, maybe lots of people do it, but I'm putting it out there anyways.


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## beeman2009 (Aug 23, 2012)

BB,

You said you have had zero bees drown, how did you manage that? :scratch: I use those quite often but have to make a screen to block hole in feeder to keep bees from crawling inside & drowning. It looks like yours might be a little different, mine don't have wire handles.


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## bobbarker (May 23, 2012)

I don't see any way they could crawl into the hole on mine, so maybe that's the difference. By the time the syrup level gets low enough that they _could_ crawl in, there's really no syrup left in the top at all, just in the tray. The rocks in the tray prevent them from drowning down there, because I leave such small gaps between the rocks that they would really have to work to get down in there. I used these for about 2 months until there was a good flow on and they stopped taking it, and each time I'd pull them out to fill them I'd look for dead bees, and never found one.

Edit: http://www.tractorsupply.com/harris-farms-poultry-drinker-1-gal-capacity-2167654 is a link to the feeders I bought at Tractor Supply. You can't see the hole in this picture either, but if you're near a TSC, you could look at them and see if there is a difference in the flow system.


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## Markwell (Jan 17, 2013)

Some people use bird feeders. Never heard of chicken feeders hehe! What materials are they made of?


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## tefer2 (Sep 13, 2009)

I've used a few different brands of chicken waterers on my hives lately. Some models you have to block the hole with screen. When the jar becomes empty, the bees climb in and die. I have been using a coil of 3/4 nylon rope in the tray instead of rocks or marbles. Makes it easier to refill.


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## bobbarker (May 23, 2012)

The rope is a fantastic idea, tefer. I finally got tired of loading the rocks back in after every time I filled it so I glued them in place. I didn't have the bees dying inside the feeder as it got empty, maybe this has a larger opening or something that they can get back out of easier. They were definitely in there, and in fact I had to pull burr comb out from inside the feeder a few times.


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## JClark (Apr 29, 2012)

I've used the same feeder for water but w/ sand in it to prevent drowning. The only thing I didn't like was having to dump the sand every time I added water. Guess w/ the rocks it's not as much of an issue.


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## virginiawolf (Feb 18, 2011)

I am with you bobbarker. I used gallon versions of these that I got from Cutler Supply. They are good. I used hop twine rope to keep the bees from drowning. Sometimes I got lazy and had no rope and some bees got inside mine when they were empty but they were still alive for the most part when I noticed. If the syrup dries in the threads they can be a bit tough to open. Overall I had the best results feeding with these. The bees take the syrup out of these feeders the fastest of anything I have used and they are easy enough to fill and carry. They were recommended to us from an old school beekeeper.

I prop the feeder on two little sticks so I don't crush bees. I marked where the holes are with a sharpie so I could put it facing uphill since I angle my hives a little bit. If you face the hole opening downward and the hive is on an incline it can run out. I have used them for open feeding too in way early spring. Here is a link

They have good customer service Top Notch!!! I like their website too

http://www.cutlersupply.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11_60_61&products_id=840


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## virginiawolf (Feb 18, 2011)

Yours feeder is a little different I just noticed in the tractor supply link. So are the holes too small for bees to get inside the main part


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## ralittlefield (Apr 25, 2011)

Another method is to use gallon paint cans and puncture the lid. Mason jars are often used this way, but paint cans are larger and more durable. Home depot has unsused cans for about $5. Sherwin-Williams has them for about $4.50 each.

I plan to give them a try this spring.


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## bobbarker (May 23, 2012)

Virginia- The hole is plenty big enough for the bees to get in, but it's below the level of the fluid (in this case syrup) in the tray until most of the syrup is gone, and then I assume they have no problems walking around in it without drowning.


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## tefer2 (Sep 13, 2009)

The ones at Tractor Supply is what I used. You have to wrap a 3/4 wide piece of hardware cloth around the opening. When empty, they will find a way in if you don't.


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## virginiawolf (Feb 18, 2011)

bobbarker, I will order a couple of the ones from your link and try them. :thumbsup: I like the metal handles on them. Tefer 2, That is a good idea Perhaps I will modify my feeders with hardware cloth. I should have thought of that.


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

I tried chicken feeders years ago, but, I like the hog troughs better. Can be made from scrap wood., Virtually no drowning.

For open feeding I make them 24 inches. To put them inside a deep super, on top of the hive, make them 12 -15 inches long. Here is a photo of them before filling, and after filling. This one is open feeding, but works just as well inside a deep super.

















cchoganjr


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## lazy shooter (Jun 3, 2011)

Cleo:

How far from your hives to you open feed?

Lazy


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

Winter time about 20 feet from center of 14 hives. Summer time about 50 yards from center of hives. I will try to get a photo tomorrow and post. I have two feeders about 20 feet from center of these hives. I feed any time the temp is 50 degrees or above. Normally 1 1/2 gallons per feeder.

Won't be any feeding for a few days. Last week it was in the 70's, this week it is in the 20's.

cchoganjr


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## FlowerPlanter (Aug 3, 2011)

Cleo
What keeps them from drowning? sloped edges? Do you get some sticky bees that can't leave right away?

It looks easy enough to make out of scrap wood.


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## bobbarker (May 23, 2012)

Yeah, I rather like that design for open feeding. With as much expanding as I'm planning the next several years, feeding each hive individually is going to get to be a real chore. I'm going to keep that one on the back burner (but I've got the same questions as FlowerPlanter.)


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

FlowerPlanter.... I can't say for sure what keeps them from drowning, but, they don't. I believe it is the fact that the landing area is large, and the bees land there and walk down to the syrup's edge, fill, crawl back up to the top, then fly back to the hive. They don't have to lift and fly vertically, up out of the feeder, resulting in some falling back into the syrup, because they are too heavy to take off. To witness that, place some sugar syrup in a five gallon bucket and watch what happens, Large numbers try to rise and fly, only to find they cannot, then fall back into the syrup. Even if you place rocks or floats in the bucket, the bees cannot take off vertically and sustain their flight.

When the feeder is first filled, there will be some bees who get in the syrup. As the level decreases, fewer bees become ensnared in the syrup. There are two important considerations when using this system. 

1. Fill the trough from over the edge at one end. Do not let syrup get on the sloped edges except as it rises as you pour the syrup in. If you pour over the slope area, that area will become sticky and bees will be ensnared in the syrup. 

2.. Only put in the feeder the amount of syrup that the bees can be expected to carry off by 3 PM. That will leave about 2 hours for the bees to lick off any bees that have become ensnared in the syrup. The sloped edges allow the bees who do get into the syrup to crawl out, and later be licked dry by other bees.

Last Friday and Saturday we had 72 degree and 63 degree days. I placed 1 1/2 gallons each, in two feeders, about 20 feet from the 14 hives at the Stovall Lane facility. On Sunday it began to turn cold, only reaching about 45 degrees, so I did not feed. On Monday our high was 36 degrees and I turned the feeders over so they would not collect rain or snow and possibly crack from freezing and thawing. I counted the dead bees in the two feeders. One had 12 dead bees, the other had 8. Not bad for 14 hives 20 feet away. Looking at the photo above you can see how many bees were visiting the troughs.

In Summer these feeders should be located futher from the hives to prevent robbing. I like 50 to 75 yards from the hives. In summer you do get a few wasps, bumblebees, and yellow jackets, however, I have found that the large number of bees at my facility, will keep these intruders at a very minimum.

If you have specific questions, I will be happy to answer. It is just one method for open feeding. It is faster than opening the tops of hives and installing feeders on individual hives, when, at the most you are only expecting to be able to feed one or two days. If I am going to have several days available for feeding, I will feed each hive individually, plus the open feeders. The open, hog trough type, feeders are quick, safe, and give the bees a shot at feeding which may not be practical for just a day or two of feeding individual hives.

cchoganjr


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

bobbarker...Hope my response above answers your questions, if not, let me know and I will expand my answers.

cchoganjr


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## bobbarker (May 23, 2012)

Nope, that was great. Thanks!


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## beeman2009 (Aug 23, 2012)

> For open feeding I make them 24 inches. To put them inside a deep super, on top of the hive, make them 12 -15 inches long.


Cleo, I assume you mean length on that 24". What is the width/depth of the feeders. Also do you do anything special to seal the troughs?

Thanks


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

Yes length is 24 inches. I use 1 X 12 cypress, oak, or poplar. The two side boards are nailed/screwed/stapled at a 90 degree angle, then the ends, 1 X 12 are nailed,screwed/stapled to the two boards joined at the 90 degree angle. You can also use 6 inch or 8 inch boards, just won't hold as much syrup and less area for the bees to land and walk down to the syrup. 

Sometimes you get a leak if the nails/screws/staples do not seal the pieces together. Sometimes the syrup will seal a leak. If not, you can either seal with food grade silicone sealant, or spray the back sides with a non toxic, rubberized, sealant. I have in the past sealed some with fiberglass. Any way to make them hold syrup.

cchoganjr


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## virginiawolf (Feb 18, 2011)

Thank You Cleo, Your an inspiration to me. ]
Your photos always leave me feeling reminded of the mystique of the bees and also trying think outside the box when thinking about bees.
Despite many people posting how bad of an idea it is to open feed, I have done a little bit of it.
I did it too close to the hives i think in hindsight toward the end of last season... The bees went from some equipment I was letting them clean up and rob out and then proceeded to move right along to a nuc and completely take it over. Fortunately I was able to deal with it and got that under control but I realized the benefit of keeping the open feeding away from the boxes further. I will try it with your guidance to do it 50 to 75 yards away when in the summer. I may even try to build a feeder like you did and fill it with just the right amount of syrup like you said so that the bees can clean up eachother of they get sticky. My positive thoughts on open feeding is that since the bees are collecting it and bringing it back to the hive that the workers will be experienced with brining it back and sending the messages around so it gets stored in a more natural way then when it is inside the hive. I don't know if that is true but it is just what I imagine. I'll re read your specs on building a feeder similar to yours and if I have any questions I will message you. I think it is exciting to be networked with other beekeepers and get to try some of their designs and ideas. I shared a bee watering idea last year and it was fun to see that someone else had built one like mine and had success. This is fun. Thank You, Nice work, Jeff


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

virginiawolf said:


> I will try it with your guidance to do it 50 to 75 feet away when in the summer.


virginiawolf....Perhaps this was a typo, but, summer feeding should be 50-75 yards, not feet. For the very reasons you outlined, robbing. I have never seen robbing in Winter when open feeding for only a day or two at a time.

Thanks. cchoganjr.


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## virginiawolf (Feb 18, 2011)

Thank you Cleo I messed up my translation of the facts. I had success during a warm week in winter last year open feeding too no robbing but in august I had bees clean up some extracting equipment and not my bees but some bees from somewhere else came through the air like the fleet of a foreign army and they meant business. It taught me to be careful about open feeding. Thanks for straightening out the distance I need to use. I appreciate it.

On that feeder does it just come down to a v or is there a straight ledge in the center that sticks up. for the bees to stand on?

Another advantage I can think open feeding would have is that by not having to open the hive the bees don't get disturbed from us opening the hives and maybe even needing to use some smoke.

This was one of my open feeding set ups when it was cold still, not the one that resulted in robbing. I gave each hive a frame from a dead out and put some of the acorn shaped feeders out too. It was an early spring snack.

http://youtu.be/-b0Gb7A3j2M


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

The feeders are just a "V" , formed by nailing/screwing/stapling two boards at a 90 degree angle.

Those feeders work well also. It is just that the hog feeders are cheaper to make, and you can make them 10 foot long if you want to, depending on how much you plan to feed. Different lengths depending on how many you plan to feed.

If you have other bees in your area, open feeding may not be a good idea, as you will be feeding someone else's bees. There are very few feral bees, and there are no other beekeepers in my area.

cchoganjr 

cchoganjr


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## FlowerPlanter (Aug 3, 2011)

Thanks Cleo


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## virginiawolf (Feb 18, 2011)

Thank You Cleo, I will make one and test it out. I really like the way the bees look all over it.


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## mmmooretx (Jun 4, 2012)

Cleo,
I still like your open trough design, but live in a neighborhood on maybe 1/3 acre total, so the 70 yards away from the hives will not work for me. I have been using top feeders and if I went with an open feeder it would have to be within 20-30 feet of my hives in my raised bed garden area. Would you advise sticking with top feeders in this case?
Thank you for your time and support.


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

Mike...Put a piece of 4X8 plywood or some other obstruction, so the bees have to rise and fly over, around, the open feeder to get back to the hive. In other words, cut off the direct flight which puts them into a frenzy from the trough to the hives. Two or three bales of straw, a hugh cardboard box, etc. This should work.

cchoganjr


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## LSBees (Sep 24, 2009)

I bought paint cans from Sherwin Williams for less than that however the lids start to rust on the first use. Maybe thats okay but I didn't like it.


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## westernbeekeeper (May 2, 2012)

I've always wondered: is rust inside a feeder harmful to bees?


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## mgolden (Oct 26, 2011)

Cleo, have you ever tried adding floating materials such as straw, twigs, or wood pieces in the hog trough? Some local commercial bee keepers use 45 gallon drums with floating materials and open feed syrup.

Have built a hog trough to try this year.


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

mgolden said:


> Cleo, have you ever tried adding floating materials such as straw, twigs, or wood pieces in the hog trough? Some local commercial bee keepers use 45 gallon drums with floating materials and open feed syrup.


Yes, I have a piece of 2 X 2 floating in each of them, (most of the time). I cut them with about a 30 degree angle on a table saw and the bees can crawl up on them if they get into the syrup. I guess they don't show in the photos or I didn't have them in that day.

EDITED... It is in the trough of the first photo. Have to look close as the sun and shadow make it kinda hard to see.

cchoganjr


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## papar (Apr 10, 2007)

I have used similar chicken feeders but found the quail feeder to be better, the trouth is small so no need to add rocks etc.. but I did need to put a screen over the entrance hole in the trouth. The reason I stopped was that at times the bees would build comb right off the feeder or off the top bars so I started to have to put news paper over top of the feeder and push it down close to the trouth. This method seemed to work but I eventually moved to frame feeders as my hive numbers increased. I do like the quail feeders when hiving packages on foundation, be careful though when the bees stop taking the syrup and you have to remove the feeder when it's partially full, especially when the bees have glued the base to the top bars, it can make a mess and drown some bees


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