# "Bee's have a pattern" = LIE... Assistance requested



## Spratkid (May 31, 2016)

Last week I down sized one of my hives from 2 deep supers to just 1. On several occasions I had drawn brood from the hive to support other, weaker hives; this hive had about 4 frames in its bottom box that only had some drawn comb on them with the other 6 be occupied by brood and honey, the top box had only about 4 frames with substantial progress made on them. So, I figured that the hive would do better if I downsized. I took out the four empty frames from the bottom and replaced them with the better ones from the top (Note that even with this there was still substantial room left on the outer 2 frames, on either side, for development). 
2 days ago a group of bees swarmed from this hive, the group was small, 100-200 bees. They didn't go far so I recaptured them, and placed them in a nuc, they swarmed again the following day, I repeated the process. They swarmed for the third time today, while I pondered what on Earth to do, the group did something very odd, they took to the air (as if they were to travel to their final destination), and then they traveled a full ten feet, and started bearding... at the base of their ORIGINAL hive! Trying to open up other options, and partially fearing a fight between the swarm and their homeland hive, I place a deep super with 10 empty frames right next to the swarm and hive, and to my surprise, the swarm slowly but surely enters the empty super. Note that the original queen was still in her original hive and no swarm cells were present prior to the swarm. 

Has anyone even even remotely heard of such an occurrence or have any suggestions? And more importantly, this is a very small group of bees and I have my doubts about them surviving the winter at their current numbers and supposedly without a queen. Help?

:s


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## AR Beekeeper (Sep 25, 2008)

I would guess that the small swarms are caused by either a high varroa population or starvation. I have seen small swarm this time of the year from colonies with very large adult populations, but they had a queen and you say that yours does not. You are out of time to build adult populations for winter, I would write off this small swarm. You could shake the bees into rubbing alcohol and do a varroa mite count, that might tell you if they are carrying large numbers of varroa. If you have not treated the colony they came from you may want to do so, also I would start feeding if you are not already doing so.


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## DavidZ (Apr 9, 2016)

I'd stack the deep they went inside, it's not a super, (keep your terms correct) on to the original hive top to recombine and leave the deep on. Then start feeding for winter.

another thing you may have a tiny virgin queen that snagged a few hundred, I had that happen last month, she kept swarming the same way box to tree 5 times, and finally I let them go on their way. They went down hill to the flat. Next spring I may do a little beelining once it warms up here in the mountains.


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## tech.35058 (Jul 29, 2013)

I had a nucs "slimed" by hive beetles, & a swarm appeared. Nearby.
I thought it came out of the nucs, which had not been checked in a while, in the process of requeening itself.
They kept going back to the branch, I gave them a frame of brood, & they stayed in the box this time.
(I also gave the slimed box a frame of brood & they cleaned up the slimed combs, much to my surprise, but the brood comb attracted so many sub that I sacrificed it to get rid of that many sub. I found a queen in the slimed box, maybe I can go through the swarm box later today. I made sure these donor frames had eggs, just in case.. these will be small clusters, over wintered nucs at best


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