# Workers moving eggs



## Beee Farmer (Aug 11, 2008)

They probably crowded and making room for honey. Add a second deep with drawn comb or at least a honey super so your numbers dont get down if they are.


----------



## Bizzybee (Jan 29, 2006)

Think you'll hear a lot of yes and no on bees moving and stealing eggs or larva beeslave. In the past I have heard overwhelmingly no they won't.

I have had queen cells produced in hives I know for a fact didn't have larva or eggs in before, but only twice that I am aware of. Where did they come from? Your guess is as good as mine?

Can they move them? Absolutely! I have witnessed more than once, bees on a frame seeing me removing larva on a grafting needle, grab the larva from the needle and place them back into the cell.

Will they move a larva to a cell cup? I have never seen it. Can they? After seeing them take larva from the grafting needle and put them back, I would have to say that yes they can. If they will, is another question I can't answer. I'm not sure why they would when they are perfectly capable of making a queen cell anywhere on the frame.

I have watched bees move honey many times to make room for laying. But never have I seen them move larva or eggs to make room for honey. Certainly wouldn't be the first time I learned something new though!


----------



## NeilV (Nov 18, 2006)

*Fwiw*

The "do bees move eggs" question got asked to Larry Connor at a recent queen rearing seminar. His answer was, "No, bees don't move eggs or larvae, but sometimes they remove and/or eat eggs and larvae." He did make the point that if bees moved eggs, queen excluders would not work.


----------



## Bizzybee (Jan 29, 2006)

I might be convinced but the example of the excluder doesn't get it for me.

I don't see the bees moving eggs and larva around for the sake of moving them. I really can't see any reason they would have other than to possibly move one of either to a cell cup. But like I mentioned before, why would they when they don't need to?

I have no doubt that they have the ability. Whether they do on occasion for one reason or another I don't know. But I don't think that it is a common occurrence and may only happen in what they might consider an emergency such as making a queen?

Moving eggs and larva in mass from one place in the hive to another, I haven't ever seen it and seriously doubt that they do.

Will be interesting to hear if anyone has any actual first hand knowledge of them moving around.

opcorn:


----------



## Dragonfly130 (Dec 12, 2008)

I have not physically witnessed workers moving larvae or a broodless colony raise a queen as Bizzybee has but I do have firsthand experience with bees moving an egg or young larvae to an empty queen cup within the colony.I've had empty queen cups when splits were made and larvae showed up in them shortly thereafter.:scratch:There would have been eggs and larvae available nearby to raise a queen when the splits were made so it would have been an easy transfer for them.It would have to be more efficient to move an egg or larvae a couple inches to a prebuilt cup rather than rebuilding one in another location on the frame.These were Russian or possibly russian hybrids.

It could be a genetic trait that occasionally expresses itself and an occasional beek will take notice.Why not a trait for moving an egg or larvae to where it's most needed.


I've never heard of a similar experience with this until your post here Beeslave.

Thanks for sharing


----------



## twd8711 (Feb 2, 2008)

i did split about a week ago, saw the queen and left her in the old colony for more splits, today i checked new colony and had the same situation capped queen cells on bottom of frame, im guessing ill let it ride.


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I've watched hours every day in my observation hive and never seen them move an egg. Huber (his assistant of course) spend months watching and never saw them move an egg. I don't believe they move eggs. I think there are many possibilities more likely for any given scenario. A worker laying a fertile egg HAS been observed on several occasions over many years while workers moving eggs has not.


----------



## Radical Bee (Feb 25, 2009)

i caught a swarm this year but failed to find the queen. Checking back 12 days later just in case i found 6 capped supercedure cells on a frame and 5 w/larve partially capped on another frame. No other brood, larve, or eggs visiable in the hive. I have not a clue but i have made splits and am hoping it was theylekoky.


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>I have not a clue but i have made splits and am hoping it was theylekoky. 

I wouldn't count on it:

http://www.bushfarms.com/huber.htm#maleeggsinroyalcells

And

"Speaking of females laying male eggs alone, I have already expressed my surprise that bees bestow, on those deposited in royal cells, such care and attention as to feed the worms proceeding from them, and, at the period of transformation, to close them up. But I know not, Sir, why I omitted to observe that, after sealing the royal cells, the workers build them up, and sit on them until the last metamorphosis of the included male. (Translators note: It is difficult to discover whether the author thinks, as some Naturalists, that bees are instrumental in hatching the eggs. T.) The treatment of the royal cells where fertile workers lay the eggs of drones is very different. They begin indeed with bestowing every care on their eggs and worms; they close the cells at a suitable time, but never fail to destroy them three days afterwards."--Francios Huber, New Observations on the natural history of bees.


----------



## mrpush (Jul 7, 2010)

This is what I experienced:

I was putting med frames in my brood box to get quick draw of wax. A couple of these frames ended up with some eggs in them. I moved them up to HS with Excluder. 

I noted larva in the center of one of these frames on a later inspection. A week later, on my next inspection, the entire frame was uncapped honey. Both sides, same frame.

So, one of 2 things happened, as 21 days from egg did not transpire.

Either they moved the larva or they got rid of them by any of a few means.



Not sure which.

MP


----------



## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

*Re: Fwiw*



NeilV said:


> The "do bees move eggs" question got asked to Larry Connor at a recent queen rearing seminar. His answer was, "No, bees don't move eggs or larvae, but sometimes they remove and/or eat eggs and larvae." He did make the point that if bees moved eggs, queen excluders would not work.


I'm friends with Larry and I respect what he has to say, but....I'm not sor sure they don't.

I see eggs in queen cups all the time. In my cell building, I isolate unsealed brood above an excluder 10 days before grafting. This is to create a cell builder with only sealed brood. The day before grafting I check the entire colony for rogue queen cells and remove them. I often see queen cups containing eggs on the bottom bars just above the excluder. 

Larry may be correct, I don't know. I suppose the eggs could have been layed by worker bees...they do try to start cells under laying worker conditions...but my cell builder is hardly a real laying worker condition. Some day I'll allow one to advance to maturity. If it's a queen then the bees carried an egg. If it fails to mature then it's probably a worker egg.

Some day when I have nothing else to do.


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Bees are well documented to dispose of eggs. They eat them. Laying workers can certainly account for eggs. There are always laying workers in any hive... and theylekoky could explain the rare success of such eggs in raising a queen.


----------

