# bee-vax



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

Does the bee-vac work well. I have read that if you regulate it properly that it saves the bees lives. Then I have heard that it kills a lot of them. Which one is it. I have a tree full of bees that i was planning on vacuuming.I was just wanting to hear some views on using the bee-vac


----------



## tarheit (Mar 26, 2003)

It really depends on how strong the suction is. If it is too strong it turns them into mush. I adjust the vent on mine to it just has enough suction to suck them up and it works just fine with very few dead bees.


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I've had it work well and I've had it kill a lot of bees. I prefer to avoid them unless I can't see any other easy way to accomplish the task at hand.

I have put a damper on a regular vac by cutting a hole and putting a piece of plywood over the hole swiveled on a screw. I've bought a bee vac (it doesn't come with the vacuum) from Brushy Mt. I used to have an old shop vac that didn't have much power that worked really well.


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

I dont really know another way to get all the bees out of that tree without using the vac. I am trying to start a hive with the bees. I dont think that I would be able to capture the queen or anything like that because I am brand new and alone on this. I quess that I will use my vac with the damper all the way open. If it is still too much then I will add another damper hole.


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

I am currently cutting a big window out of the side of the tree using a ax. I plan to open the tree like it has a doorway cut out of it. Then i can vacuum and get to the brood before I cut the tree down. It is only about 4 feet off the ground. I am hoping that this way will work better than just cutting the tree and letting it fall. Being new, I am trying to avoid the chainsaw for now. I am getting used to seeing and hearing them hit my veil. Every few minutes one would come out and pop my veil and try to find a way in. I found myself blowing them. Ha Ha. Kind of nervous is what I am. I wished that one of you could be here to give me support.


----------



## dcross (Jan 20, 2003)

If you're whacking away at their tree with an ax and not getting stung, you're doing just fine. Just remember that if it gets hairy, they'll be there tommorrow


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Chopping is a rough way to go. A chainsaw would probably do less to make them angry.

It is difficult to cut your way into a hollow tree. I tend to do the cone method to depopulate the hive first and then try to work with it.


----------



## SilverFox (Apr 25, 2003)

Or use a circular saw, Ricpucating, or even a jig saw. Not quit as much noise as a chain saw but if used properly can be just as effictive if elect. power is avaible.


----------



## wayacoyote (Nov 3, 2003)

Wow, 
having just done this to 2 trees last year, I don't envy you. The hollow went much deeper into the roots than I would have invisioned. And the tree wood was thick. Anyway, one method I used before was to cut into a wall, pull out all the comb except a bit at the top. Then returned later after the bees quit flying, their all there to be vacummed to "scooped" out. If you can't find the queen, you'll need to save some eggs so they can raise a new queen just incase the queen gets killed or lost. Otherwise, you'll have to purchase a replacement or waste your time.

Incidentally, there is a lot of interest in "natural comb". so I would save a few pieces intact. You might get some questions regarding their deminsions and orientations, etc... Photos are nice too

WayaCoyote


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Lol. I keep meaning to take a lot more pictures of what I'm doing, but it's hard to remeber to take pictures when you're focused on the job at hand. Now doing your first tree is pretty much a consuming project. We'd love to see pictures, but I doubt you can afford to lose your focus. Like Wayacoyote says, though, you can save some of the comb and take some measurements and pictures later. But if you have someone brave enough to help and take pictures, we'd love to see them.


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

I plan on documenting everything with my digital camera. Yes, I do back off when about five or more are attacking me. Lol. I got nervous then would back off smoke a cig then go back for more. I am using the axe because i can control not hitting the nest better that way. I might have to still use the chainsaw some to get around it a little better. How would i put pictures on here to show you. I have some pictures now of the tree.


----------



## Ross (Apr 30, 2003)

I still have bees in a log I harvested last summer. I plan to split the log this spring and move them out. I used the chainsaw to cut the log section, rolled it into the front end loader on the tractor, and drove it down the street to my yard. I nailed a piece of plywood on the bottom and stood it up, and there it still is.


----------



## dcross (Jan 20, 2003)

http://www.imagestation.com/tour/upload_images.html

I've never used this, but maybe someone else here has.


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

Hey Ross, that sounds kool. I have seen it before and I am going to do it also. I have a tree full of bees that I am working on. I go over there every day and chop on it some. Lol, that is until they get really hot on me, then I go home. I am cutting out a square in the side of the tree like a door. I plan to open it up like a door and start vacuuming. Anyway, when I finish my job, I am planning on cuttting the section out of the trunk then taking it home and placing the square door i cut out of it back on it with hinges. Lol. I really think it will work. Then I will put a bottom board on it like you did. I hope that some bees will go in it and start one since it already is waxed inside. Then I would have a natural gum hive with a openable front door. Lol I think it will bee kool.


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

How do I get my pictures on here to show everyone watt i am doing. Can i use a regular kitchen strainer to strain the honey? Or is pantyhose acceptable?


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I've had the best luck with a double bucket strainer. You can use nylon window screen for a filter, or panyhose seems to be popular. You probably should take them off first.  

http://bwrangler.litarium.com/honey-strainer/


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

Well the deed is done. I have successfully robbed a natural hive. The bee vac did a wonderful job on getting them out of the tree. I have a bunch of pictures to show, but dont know who to send them to. I think there must have been 10,000 bees in that tree. I tied in some brood and hope that the queen is there. I was trying to find her, but I never did see her. There was just too many bees around to find her. Maybe she is there. How long should I wait before i open it up and check them out. I did see some little black beetles in the combs. Should i medicine them now or when should I try to medicine them.


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

If you have some open brood they will raise a queen if there isn't one. If you see queen cells in a couple of days then she's not there, but there will be a laying queen in 24 to 28 days.

The black beetles were in the comb with the bees? Do you have SHB there? How small? There are always some debris beetles in any natural hive.

Here are some pictures of SHB:

http://www.csl.gov.uk/science/organ/environ/bee/factsheets/SHB.pdf
http://maarec.cas.psu.edu/pest&disease/sl58c.html
http://maarec.cas.psu.edu/pest&disease/sl58a.html
http://maarec.cas.psu.edu/pest&disease/sl58b.html


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

The beetles were small black ones. They were running around on the comb when i pulled one out. I didnt notice but about 10 or so. Is this bad? Do I need a medicine to wipe em out or what should I do? They look like the ones that you have sent me.


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

I have pictures but dont know who to send them to unless i send them to you Michael. Then, you could use them to show on the website if you would like. I would like to share them with everyone, but I dont know how to.


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

If you have a place you can post them, such as yahoo, then you can post a link here. You can set up a yahoo id (if you don't have one already) and that will allow you to post pictures there. Also there are other sites that will let you. But I'd love to see the pictures if you would like to send them to me. I'm at:

bush at inebraska dot com


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I have never seen a live SHB yet. So I have NO personal experience fighting them.

As far as medicating, you'll have to decide what you want to do about the SHB. CheckMite in little cardboard traps seems to be popular, but I don't like that in my hive. Several suppliers (Dadant, etc. have Small Hive Beetle traps that are a bottom board with a tray for them to fall in. If you have sandy soil, you may also want to spray the ground with GaurdStar. Again, I don't like pesticides much and it is a pesticide that will kill most insects. But it will kill the SHB larvae (Small Hive Beetle). Brushy Mt. sells what they call a Beetle Swatter. It's a folded piece of cardboard that you put a half strip of CheckMite in. The beetles try to hide in the cardboard and die from the CheckMite.

Pretty much if SHB are in your area, you will have to live with them from now on. You probably need to devise a strategy for them.


----------



## dcross (Jan 20, 2003)

At the AHPA convention, a speaker recommended the new JZBZ queen cages as SHB traps. Apparently they have larger holes in them which the beetles can fit through but the bees can't. 
Fill the candy tube with roach bait, make sure it's capped and put the cage on the bottom board. The beetles hide inside and eat the bait, which the bees can't reach. 
I've only seen one beetle, but I would be nervous about ten in a hive that's just been cut up and moved.

http://www.countryfields.ca/images/pricelist/queencages.jpg


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

I havent got a picture of one of them beetles. But, I might find one while cleaning my wax. So, lets hope that i find one to take a picture of. I found my queen yesterday. I was very proud to see her. She was atop the queen excluder, so I brushed her down into the bottom. So far, so good


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

I have several beetles in a jar. If anybody wants one i will mail it to them. lol


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

hi everyone. Is the queen cage that is offered by mann lake the same as the one that dcross is showing a link to? If so, kool they are only 16 cents a peice. I need to get some kind of control started for the shb. I was going to try out the queen cage baited with roach bait instead of candy. Anyone, wanna input on this subject? Bout u Michael?


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Yes it is the same queen cage.

I've never had to deal with SHB so maybe I'm not the best person to ask, but I'm not ready to put roach bait in my hives.


----------



## dcross (Jan 20, 2003)

<<Is the queen cage that is offered by mann lake the same as the one that dcross is showing a link to?>>

I'm not sure that it is, the one on their website looks like it has the small holes. You would need the new ones with holes big enough for the beetles to get through. If you try it, make sure the workers can't get in.

And I would probably just get a trap from Dadant.

http://www.dadant.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=724&osCsid=8846789eca3f163d466e1b7bbaf50454


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

I have ordered two beetle traps from brushy mountain. They use a checkmite strip inside instead of roach poison. I didnt like the sound of poison in my hive either. I found about 20 dead bees inside my feeder that is in the bottom brood box. They are the dumb ones that i guess dont know how to climb up the sides that are ribbed. I hated to see it, but I must feed them. If i see if again, I think that i will put some of their honey combs in a empty super on top and remove the inside feeder. I hope that i dont lose my bees to drowning. Honey in a feeder is a sticky mess so i changed to sugar syrup. I plan on examining today to see if anything has changed for the better or not.


----------



## Antero (Jan 9, 2005)

piroqueman-I use a float stick on my frame feeders that helps a lot.


Terry


----------



## David Stewart (Jan 22, 2005)

As an alternative to roach bait or other poisons, how about cutting off a strip from one of those sticky traps used to catch insects/mice and placing it in the cage. Never tried it and the effort needed to simply cut a strip and get it loose from the scissors/knife and into the cage may make it impractical. I am well aware that they stick to anything and everything, but if you could pull it off, I'll bet there isn't a bug one that could get away from it...

David


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Of course the trick to the sticky trap would be the right size hole so the bees can't get in but the beetles can. It should work though.

If you have one of those typical frame feeders, I think you need to put some kind of tie in them so they don't swell you fill them, line it with screen wire so the bees have a ladder, cut a stick to make a float and accept that some bees will still drown.

I bought the ones from Brushy Mt that are made of masonite and wood. They have less room for the bees to get in and a ladder. They still drown, but in much smaller numbers. It only takes one honest frame space and you can close it off when you're not using it and leave it in the hive for a follower. That's my favorite frame feeder. Not my favorite feeder.


----------



## piroqueman (Nov 24, 2004)

What is your favorite feeder? I have some more of their honey in the combs in my freezer, I thought about adding a empty super and putting some comb up there. Will that bee ok for feeeding? Place them right on top of the top board? I dont think i have but about two or three weeks until stuff starts really putting out. My pears are already making little buds gettin ready to bloom. I bought the beetle trap that takes a checkmite piece of strip inside. The checkmite comes in contact with the beetles. It is supposed to work. I will also probably try the rat stick method. Anything sounds better than roach dope. Lol


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

If it's in combs, just put them back in the hive. They will use it. My favorite feeder is a Rapid feeder. You fill it without facing any bees. It holds 1/2 gallon of syrup, which is just right for my back yard where I can check them every day. If they were larger I'd have more moldy syrup. If they were smaller they wouldn't last long enough.

http://www.beeworks.com/usacatalog/subcat33.htm


----------

