# How long until you get relief?



## TurtleSpider (Mar 27, 2018)

I have read a bit about bee sting therapy to reduce pain and am thinking of giving it a try. 

How long does it normally take from the sting until you feel some relief from pain? I know it may or may not work for me and my condition, but after I get the sting if it doesn't do anything how do I know if I need more stings or if I should just wait a bit longer? If I do several stings should thye all be at the same site or how far apart should they be spaced?


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## ruthiesbees (Aug 27, 2013)

Please do some more reading before you jump in. Are you already a beekeeper and have you been stung by honey bees so you know that you are not allergic?

Anyone considering bee venom therapy needs to have an epi-pen and liquid benedryl on hand. People who use the apitherapy products prefer that people start with the "softer" products like propolis, bee pollen and royal jelly first to see if those make a difference in your condition. Even if they don't have a direct affect on the acute pain, they are working behind the scene to address other issues and help the bee venom work better once you do start that. One doctor even thinks the propolis helps you not to have a reaction to the venom.

Now to answer your question, I use BVT for osteoarthritis in specific spots like my knee and hip. Within 5 minutes of a sting or two, I get relief from the pain and can walk up and down my stairs without issue, but later in the day I might not be so spry on the steps. I only do actual stings once a week or so. They are not like pain pills where you keep popping them until the pain is dulled, this is a different mode of action. 

For injuries with scar tissue, you might work up to 2-3 stings in the area every other day, and those issues would take longer to resolve and be pain free because the venom is actually breaking down the scar tissue and you have to regrow normal tissue in that area.

Lyme patients that are treating systemic conditions sting with up to 10 bee stings near their spinal column every other day, 3 times a week for a total of 30 stings per week. They do this for 2 years in order to eradicate the pathogens that have entered their brain and other organs and are resistant to the strongest of antibiotics. You would never intentionally do more than 10 stings per day, and that is extreme for just something that is achy. And you would never start out with 10 stings all at once. You can expect some extreme swelling in the area where you sting for the first couple of times that you do it. This reaction will get less and less as time goes on.

You are welcome to send me a private message if you want more details. I am not a doctor, but I love talking about the apitherapy products. I have a brief apitherapy page with hyperlinks to more detailed documents on each of the hive products. I also moderate the facebook group on apitherapy.

http://www.hamptonroadsbeekeepers.org/apitherapy.html


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## TurtleSpider (Mar 27, 2018)

Hi Ruthiesbees,

Thank you so much for your reply! 

I am not a beekeeper but have been stung a few different times over the years and have never shown a reaction. 

I broke my spine a dozen or more years ago and it is degenerating slowly. I get nerve pain and migraines that are increasingly difficult to control. I take painkillers and other meds but am reaching a point where they are no longer working and I am worried that they are doing bad things to my overall health. 

I am still in the research stage and am not about to jump in blindly, which is why people like you are a totally invaluable source of information. I will read through your link and will probably message you when I have more questions. Thanks again!


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## ruthiesbees (Aug 27, 2013)

One thing you will find with taking the other hive products like propolis, is that your pain meds are more effective so you can get by with less. Propolis, royal jelly and bee pollen also help your liver to detox the chemical ****tail of medicines.

One thing you can try now as you are still in the research phase is a topical bee venom cream called Venex. Manufactured in Canada by Michael Simics. Also available from Amazon. Apply it along the spinal column and neck. It heats up for about 30 min as it has pepper oil in it to get down into the skin, but then you don't notice it. I like to apply it right after a shower when the pores are open.


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## blackowl (Jul 8, 2015)

How does it work?


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## TurtleSpider (Mar 27, 2018)

So, after a lot of research I started bee sting therapy. I was getting one sting every second week, then started to get one per week, and it halved the medication I needed to take. Each sting showed no reaction and was less painful. I find that the muscle that is stung is relaxed, which means it stops hurting other things.

Today something odd happened that has me worried. I accidentally got sting on the tip of my finger. I also got stung in the back as normal and that has been normal and not reacted + has given me relief, but my finger is swollen. It is difficult to bend the finger, which is odd as I never react to stings.

Should I be worried? Have I given myself an allergy? How long until I can try another sting (it would normally be a week or two from now)? I don't want to stop the stings as it helps and has decreased the medication I need, but I also don't want to rick things if I have induced an allergy.


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## ruthiesbees (Aug 27, 2013)

TurtleSpider said:


> ..., but my finger is swollen. It is difficult to bend the finger, which is odd as I never react to stings.
> 
> Should I be worried? Have I given myself an allergy? How long until I can try another sting (it would normally be a week or two from now)? I don't want to stop the stings as it helps and has decreased the medication I need, but I also don't want to rick things if I have induced an allergy.


After 4+ years of beekeeping and apitherapy for my hips and knees, my fingers still swell up like yours. It is not an allergy to have the sting site swell. If you get an accidental sting again on the finger, immediately remove the stinger and put apple cider vinegar on it. Also reduce the movement of it for a number of hours so the body can metabolize the venom. 

I got a sting once on the finger while mowing my yard around the hives. Treated it with the ACV and topical Benadryl, but I continued to mow for another 30 min. Due to the mower vibration, that finger was pretty swollen 4 hrs later, and stayed that way for 24 hrs.


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## Saltybee (Feb 9, 2012)

TurtleSpider said:


> I take painkillers and other meds but am reaching a point where they are no longer working and I am worried that they are doing bad things to my overall health.


My stage 3 kidney failure says you are right to be worried (NSAIDs, always as prescribed). If you do not know your GFR and how it has changed (or not) get a new doctor. Now.

Pain makes pain; fear of pain makes a lot more. Changes blood flow, changes healing. Find a Physician or a PT that gets that. Do not take the 20 + years I took to find them.


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

ruthiesbees said:


> If you get an accidental sting again on the finger, immediately remove the stinger and put apple cider vinegar on it..


I would not even worry about a swollen finger.
A local reaction will go away on its own in 2-3 days and is only a minor nuisance, if that, in the grand scheme of events.
Local reaction is common and normal (unlike systemic reaction).

Besides, who walks around with a bottle of apple vinegar in a pocket everywhere (just in case) - mostly nobody.
It is never there when you need it.
I got five bee yards to run between and traps all over, to remember of yet another little thing.


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## ruthiesbees (Aug 27, 2013)

GregV said:


> I would not even worry about a swollen finger.
> A local reaction will go away on its own in 2-3 days and is only a minor nuisance, if that, in the grand scheme of events.
> Local reaction is common and normal (unlike systemic reaction).
> 
> ...


Glad you don't find it necessary to do anything about a swollen finger, but I work a day job on a computer keyboard that requires full use of my fingers. My hands stay swollen for 5 days after a sting and some people may like to know what a good remedy is for an unintentional sting. (and I DO carry a bottle of ACV in my beekeeping kit in the car)


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

ruthiesbees said:


> Glad you don't find it necessary to do anything about a swollen finger, but I work a day job on a computer keyboard that requires full use of my fingers. My hands stay swollen for 5 days after a sting and some people may like to know what a good remedy is for an unintentional sting. (and I DO carry a bottle of ACV in my beekeeping kit in the car)


Suppose computer use maybe affected some by a swollen finger.
I have to admit I use gloves most of time as my bees are somewhat feisty and have limited patience.
So to stay focused on task I prefer to just put something on (leather or nitrile).

It is the nuc inspections where I get lazy and squeeze a bee and get nailed for that.
Occasional prick in a finger is good for me.


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## TurtleSpider (Mar 27, 2018)

Thank you so much for your replies! 

This is the first time I have ever reacted at all so wasn't sure what to expect. I have a bit of a cold at the moment, and the end of the stinger broke off in my finger, so that may have caused it to react (locally) more than normal. My back was stung later that day and has had no adverse reaction.



GregV said:


> I would not even worry about a swollen finger.
> A local reaction will go away on its own in 2-3 days and is only a minor nuisance, if that, in the grand scheme of events.
> Local reaction is common and normal (unlike systemic reaction).


This isn't a game, and there are inherent risks, so I am being careful to monitor anything that happens out of the ordinary. Like I mentioned, I have never reacted in any way before so wasn't sure that this was normal. The swelling has mostly gone and I feel much calmer now. 

The bee stings were helping me reduce my pain medication so I would like to continue them if possible.


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