# What is this? A swarm? Idk.



## JustBees (Sep 7, 2021)

Robbing, you can't leave honey in the hive unattended.


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

Dang it. Ok. I’ll get it out of there ASAP! Thanks!


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## mtnmyke (Apr 27, 2017)

Yup, if there is honey in there it will be found and stolen by surrounding colonies.

You can specifically tell it's robbing because of the bees around the nooks, cracks, and corners of the hive. They are looking for any and all entrances to run in and steal the goods. When bees go into a robbing frenzy they will also attack neighboring hives, which you can see them trying to access the closer hive in your photo as well.


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

Dang! I tried to get in there. There is so so many!!! I gotta go back at dark. It’s like they’ve lost their minds 😂


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## mtnmyke (Apr 27, 2017)

Night is best! They'll all be back home and you can take the boxes inside to sort through.

Make sure the other hive is strong enough to defend the current size opening on it Tomorrow the robbers with return to find the easy honey is gone and that hive will likely be a target until they give up.


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## lowvisdiving (12 mo ago)

Question? If the hives are being robbed by nearby hives, shouldn't the beekeeper go in and move his hives to a new location. Or is there a better solution?


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

mtnmyke said:


> Night is best! They'll all be back home and you can take the boxes inside to sort through.
> 
> Make sure the other hive is strong enough to defend the current size opening on it Tomorrow the robbers with return to find the easy honey is gone and that hive will likely be a target until they give up.


Omg. Really!!!! Ok I’ll put a reducer on in the morning.

I have one that can cut the opening in half. Or should I use the one that just has a little hole?


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## mtnmyke (Apr 27, 2017)

lowvisdiving said:


> Question? If the hives are being robbed by nearby hives, shouldn't the beekeeper go in and move his hives to a new location. Or is there a better solution?


Robbing can be tricky. The best solution is to avoid it in the first place by making sure the bees don't have entrances larger than they can defend. If the robbers can't get it, they can't go back home and get reinforcements.


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## mtnmyke (Apr 27, 2017)

UtterParadise said:


> Omg. Really!!!! Ok I’ll put a reducer on in the morning.
> 
> I have one that can cut the opening in half. Or should I use the one that just has a little hole?


I'd go as small as you feel comfortable without restricting the colony down too much. You can always do the smaller entrance and open it back up a little after a day or two.

I leave custom entrance reducers on all year. I feel without them the entrance is far too large.


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

mtnmyke said:


> Robbing can be tricky. The best solution is to avoid it in the first place by making sure the bees don't have entrances larger than they can defend. If the robbers can't get it, they can't go back home and get reinforcements.


omg. Great. I do normally have a reducer on. I opened it a week ago because I am doing a mite treatment. Shoot 😭


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## mtnmyke (Apr 27, 2017)

Formic Acid?

In that case just keep an eye on them tomorrow. As long as they are fending off the robbers, long enough for them to figure out there is no food there for them, they will give up pretty quickly.


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

mtnmyke said:


> Formic Acid?
> 
> In that case just keep an eye on them tomorrow. As long as they are fending off the robbers, long enough for them to figure out there is no food there for them, they will give up pretty quickly.


I’m using Hopguard 3. Even though after I bought it a local bee guy says they don’t work. Lol. But I figured since I had it. I’d use it.

it said on the instructions to open the entrance for airflow.

I did have a screened inner cover on the top. That I switched out tonight. I think they were robbing from the top. The bees have been very aggressive. When they are very gentle normally. 
So that should have been my sign. But. I’m so new. I didn’t know. 

I will say this hive is super strong. It’s jam packed full of bees and brood etc. when I switched out the inner cover tonight. I had my bee suit on and one of the guards followed me all the way to my back door and wouldn’t leave me suit for 5 minutes lol 

I did just put a pollen patty in there friday. So I wonder if that attracted them


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

mtnmyke said:


> Formic Acid?
> 
> In that case just keep an eye on them tomorrow. As long as they are fending off the robbers, long enough for them to figure out there is no food there for them, they will give up pretty quickly.


The robbers are back. I have a tiny entrance open only.

should I wait it out. Or I read to close up the hive for a few days?
If I give them water in there. Can I do that?


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## mtnmyke (Apr 27, 2017)

As long as you removed the other hive, and there is nothing for them to rob, they will give up rather quickly.

You said the hive is really strong with lots of bees so just leave it with the small opening for today and recheck tomorrow. Closing them up can cause them to overheat so you do want to give them enough ventilation, but with an opening they can still defend.

You can stare at the entrance for a few minutes and get a good idea of what's going on. If there are bees calmly returning with pollen then everything should be fine. If there is a lot of fighting going on at the entrance then keep it restricted until the fighting stops, then open it up to the larger entrance on the reducer.

Are you close to the almonds? You may be surrounded by commercial hives and since the bloom isn't full on, they are desperate for food.


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

mtnmyke said:


> As long as you removed the other hive, and there is nothing for them to rob, they will give up rather quickly.
> 
> You said the hive is really strong with lots of bees so just leave it with the small opening for today and recheck tomorrow. Closing them up can cause them to overheat so you do want to give them enough ventilation, but with an opening they can still defend.
> 
> ...


Okay. I’m following your advice. I know they can win. Yes a very strong hive. Last time I was in there there was 7-8 frames of brood and about 8 frames of honey etc. 

Yes. I’m literally surrounded by 60 acres of almonds on one side and 200 on the other side. I’m basically in the eye of the tornado in California. The trees are so close to popping the blooms. So you are right.

thank you thank you thank you for your help!


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## gator75 (Apr 21, 2021)

UtterParadise said:


> The robbers are back. I have a tiny entrance open only.
> 
> should I wait it out. Or I read to close up the hive for a few days?
> If I give them water in there. Can I do that?


Can you just staple on some screen to shrink the opening? That way you keep air flow and it's easy to remove.


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

gator75 said:


> Can you just staple on some screen to shrink the opening? That way you keep air flow and it's easy to remove.


Shoot! I can do that! I have some screen! Yes. Thank you!


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## CliffS (May 12, 2021)

UtterParadise said:


> Okay. I’m following your advice. I know they can win. Yes a very strong hive. Last time I was in there there was 7-8 frames of brood and about 8 frames of honey etc.
> 
> *Yes. I’m literally surrounded by 60 acres of almonds on one side and 200 on the other side.* I’m basically in the eye of the tornado in California. The trees are so close to popping the blooms. So you are right.
> 
> thank you thank you thank you for your help!


that means right now your area is flooded with starving bees. I've tried to keep bees near agriculture and its very difficult due to commercial operations flooding the area with bees and starving out literally every other pollinator, including my bees. Is there any way you can get your hives away from the almonds?


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

CliffS said:


> that means right now your area is flooded with starving bees. I've tried to keep bees near agriculture and its very difficult due to commercial operations flooding the area with bees and starving out literally every other pollinator, including my bees. Is there any way you can get your hives away from the almonds?


I wish. But no. All our friends are almond & walnut and olive farmers. So that’s the only place I could take them and they live in the middle of orchards too.
Why don’t the commercial bee keepers feed their bees? I thought everyone at least put a pollen patty in there to really stimulate brood this time of year.

the valley of California literally is covered with 100s of thousands of acres of trees. I’m trying to get my husband to move us to East Tennessee 🤣

I think I messed up because I didn’t have bees last year at this time. I got them in May. So I didn’t realize with it being a dearth right now until bloom. I shouldn’t have opened my hive to treat for mites until the bloom started. I might as well have put up a sign that said. Bon appetite! Then of course I take off my reducer for airflow. So that was bad.

next year I noted to leave the hive alone until bloom.
However I only have bees for pollination in my own 3000 foot garden. I have worked hard to plant a steady supply of food. I have about 50 rosemary and 50 lavender plants in full bloom right now. So I’m confused why that isn’t a good source for the other bees too.


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## mtnmyke (Apr 27, 2017)

Commercial beekeepers generally do feed their bees. If you take note to the pallets of bees in the orchards they typically have a bucket feeder on the top. Many others are stuffed with frame feeders. But, the foragers are still out looking for sources of food and if they find an unattended colony with honey in it, it will get robbed out - even if the flowers were blooming. And adding pollen patties makes the problem worse as in order to process pollen they first need nectar. Although pollen stimulates brood, it's useless without a sugar source.

Learning your area is one of the hardest parts of beekeeping. Knowing when to feed and when not to. It's easy to let them starve, or overfeed to where they are nectar/honey bound and the queen has nowhere else to lay.

As for your mite treatment, it's best to do them going INTO a dearth, not out of. Colonies generally shrink their numbers with the availability of nectar. As things dry up the colony shrinks, but the mite numbers do not. As such, mite counts can really get out of control. If you knock the mites down before the dearth, there aren't as many mites to breed within the colony, as the colony shrinks. Also, most mite treatments are not safe for use during a flow. Even Apiguard which is natural can taint the supers and alter the taste/quality of your honey.

Since you're surrounded by trees I question how much food is there after the spring blooms? You obviously got them through the dry summer. But as to your rosemary and lavender - you could have many acres of these and it still wouldn't be enough to sustain a colony. Keep in mind a colony will forage up to 6 miles (2-3 miles efficiently) and it takes around 2,000,000 flowers to make 1lb of honey. People often underestimate the mass quantity of available food bees need to survive. It doesn't mean your flowers don't matter, it just means they need far more than this to survive.


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

Dang. I didn’t realize it was on that level! Wow. So I need to plant straight acres of wild flower fields. Thanks for all the info. I wrote it all down. And will continue to learn.


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## Lou from Export (Aug 16, 2015)

UtterParadise said:


> The second hive in this photo. Or the hive that’s closest to that water holding tank. It died out this winter.
> 
> 3 weeks ago there was no queen or bees. But 3 frames of honey.
> 
> ...


Hold on a second here son ! You just open that thing up first and make sure you don't have a swarm in there . If you do let me know and Ill tell you what I saw - If not you have nothing ta loose .


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## JustBees (Sep 7, 2021)

If I'm not mistaken you can wade into a robbing frenzy, and you will be fine as long as you don't smash bees.
They will be fairly docile as their focus is to obtain honey.
It's not too dificult to take a fold of screen and wedge it in the entrance as a reducer


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## mtnmyke (Apr 27, 2017)

Lou from Export said:


> Hold on a second here son ! You just open that thing up first and make sure you don't have a swarm in there . If you do let me know and Ill tell you what I saw - If not you have nothing ta loose .


Swarm in February, during a robbing frenzy, that would be a first.


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## mtnmyke (Apr 27, 2017)

JustBees said:


> If I'm not mistaken you can wade into a robbing frenzy, and you will be fine as long as you don't smash bees.
> They will be fairly docile as their focus is to obtain honey.
> It's not too dificult to take a fold of screen and wedge it in the entrance as a reducer


Sometimes! I accidentally left a frame of honey out during the dearth one night and the next day every hive within a mile was on that thing! Dead bees everywhere and fighting like you wouldn't believe. I picked up the frame and when I shook the bees I took about a dozen stings.

So maybe not during a dearth, add other times it's been no problem to stop.


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## JustBees (Sep 7, 2021)

I stopped robbing last year with a sprinkler and a towel over the front of the hive. No stings.


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## CliffS (May 12, 2021)

UtterParadise said:


> Dang. I didn’t realize it was on that level! Wow. So I need to plant straight acres of wild flower fields. Thanks for all the info. I wrote it all down. And will continue to learn.


trees provide a ton of food for bees. Look into drought tolerant trees that can provide forage. Around my area, my bees feed on mostly acacia and eucalyptus


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## CliffS (May 12, 2021)

UtterParadise said:


> I wish. But no. All our friends are almond & walnut and olive farmers. So that’s the only place I could take them and they live in the middle of orchards too.
> Why don’t the commercial bee keepers feed their bees? I thought everyone at least put a pollen patty in there to really stimulate brood this time of year.
> 
> the valley of California literally is covered with 100s of thousands of acres of trees. I’m trying to get my husband to move us to East Tennessee 🤣
> ...


most of them do feed their bees, but the sheer quantity of bees that get shipped into almond pollination is truely mind boggling.


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

CliffS said:


> trees provide a ton of food for bees. Look into drought tolerant trees that can provide forage. Around my area, my bees feed on mostly acacia and eucalyptus


Why have tons of eucalyptus trees!!!! Tons!!!


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## mtnmyke (Apr 27, 2017)

UtterParadise said:


> Why have tons of eucalyptus trees!!!! Tons!!!


Ours bloom from about November through February. Might want to keep an eye out for your blooms! I have a section in my hive log book I write down all the bloom dates. I've even taken the drone up to the tree tops to see when they start/stop. Total nerd status.


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## UtterParadise (11 mo ago)

mtnmyke said:


> Ours bloom from about November through February. Might want to keep an eye out for your blooms! I have a section in my hive log book I write down all the bloom dates. I've even taken the drone up to the tree tops to see when they start/stop. Total nerd status.


Okay. I will do this as well! Wow. I wish I could follow a bee for a day. That’d be cool. I love how dedicated to just life they are. Very inspiring


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## CliffS (May 12, 2021)

mtnmyke said:


> Ours bloom from about November through February. Might want to keep an eye out for your blooms! I have a section in my hive log book I write down all the bloom dates. I've even taken the drone up to the tree tops to see when they start/stop. Total nerd status.


I’ve gotten about 85 pounds of eucalyptus honey so far


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## 3BeeKeepers (Aug 20, 2004)

UtterParadise said:


> Omg. Really!!!! Ok I’ll put a reducer on in the morning.
> 
> I have one that can cut the opening in half. Or should I use the one that just has a little hole?


i used Vicks vapour rubon the nooks and crannies on the hive that was being robbed. It seemed to work actually as well


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## amk (Dec 16, 2017)

are you open feeding on top of your hives?


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