# Real honey vs sugarwater honey?



## Champy (Jan 24, 2019)

New hives this year and my supers are packed full of capped "honey". How do I tell if this is really honey or just sugarwater backfilled and capped?


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## AR Beekeeper (Sep 25, 2008)

Did you feed the colonies sugar syrup after you put on your surplus honey supers? If you did it is probable that there is syrup stored in them. If you had a good nectar flow in your area the stores will probably be a mix of nectar honey and sugar syrup. You can use this for your own use, but I would not sell any because you would be passing syrup off as honey. It is probably best to use what you have as food stores for the winter.


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## Champy (Jan 24, 2019)

So does it taste different? Different texture? Color? Is there a way to test it? I'll probably leave it for the winter stores...I'm dying to have a taste though...but would hate for it to be crappy.


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## AR1 (Feb 5, 2017)

It'll taste like honey, maybe a bit bland. I'd go ahead and use it myself, but not sell it. Depends on how much was fed sugar and how much foraged, and what was foraged. 

Why don't you just dig a spoon into a comb and taste it?


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Sweet, bland and no aroma.
Taste for yourself.
Feed to the bees.
In the future - add dye to the syrup so you know what is in the comb.


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## COAL REAPER (Jun 24, 2014)

did you label your supers "HONEY" so the bees know not to put sugar syrup in those boxes?


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## Champy (Jan 24, 2019)

COAL REAPER said:


> did you label your supers "HONEY" so the bees know not to put sugar syrup in those boxes?


Nope - I labeled them "SUPER"......so my bee's have really high self-esteem and make great honey.


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## dd33 (Jun 20, 2019)

If you have stored/capped 1:1 in the broodbox and the bees haven't used it all by the time supers are added, what are the chances they would move it to the super?


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## AR Beekeeper (Sep 25, 2008)

Once the syrup in the brood area is capped the bees are reluctant to uncap and remove it. Most movement is from cells that are still open when supers are added. This is why it is best to check food supply well in advance of adding supers. If feeding is done in a way that the bees are allowed to slowly take in the syrup most of it is eaten as a daily ration and not stored.


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## little_john (Aug 4, 2014)

dd33 said:


> If you have stored/capped 1:1 in the broodbox and the bees haven't used it all by the time supers are added, what are the chances they would move it to the super?


You'll never find capped 1:1 syrup - it would ferment at such a weak concentration, just as nectar would ferment if it wasn't dessicated. It's far more likely around 3:1.
LJ


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## Champy (Jan 24, 2019)

So I took a frame off and crushed the honey. Smells like honey; sticky and tastes fine too but it’s really clear and light colored.


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## ericweller (Jan 10, 2013)

That sure looks like syrup.


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## Champy (Jan 24, 2019)

I’m new and don’t know how to tell.


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## edzkoda (Aug 9, 2014)

Any doubt, feed back


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## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

How much "honey" are we talking about? If you have say 30#, I would keep it for personal consumption and feed what I did not use back to the bees in the Spring. While lack of color can be a clue, I thought that your area was known for producing Extra Light Amber (ELA) honey so that might not be a reliable indicator. Best bet going forward is to stop feeding before the supers go on and manage the frames of syrup still in the hive.


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## Champy (Jan 24, 2019)

JW - since these are 2 totally new package hives I'm planning on leaving everything for them over the winter. Both hives are fully built out with 2 deep brood boxes and 1 Med super each. I scraped and crushed two Super frames off each hive and got a total of 16 pints. I've been feeding 1:1 so they could build up comb. Once the supers were built out with comb I stopped feeding...so not sure if they simply shifted syrup around or not. Either way it looks, smells and tastes like honey (well better than store bought) so I'm keeping these first ones for me. BTW - my hives are in very remote farmland with nothing but open fields of clover, buckwheat, and wildflowers and no competition for miles.


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## dudelt (Mar 18, 2013)

Find a few cells that are darker in color than the rest of the capped cells. Break them with your finger and taste it. Now you know what real honey tastes like. The lightest capped honey in the hive is probably from the sugar water. If you taste the sugar water honey, it will taste just like cheap store bought honey. The darker honey should be the real thing. Bees will not move honey from the brood frames to the supers but will move it from the supers to the brood frames. Next year, when the supers go on, stop feeding. Only extract from the supers, never from the brood frames. FYI, buckwheat honey is VERY dark with a very unique taste.


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## Bigdog6554 (Jun 26, 2019)

So did I harvest sugar water also? Stopped feeding before 3rd deep was added. This was harvested from that deep after they filled it all.


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## Gray Goose (Sep 4, 2018)

Champy said:


> JW - since these are 2 totally new package hives I'm planning on leaving everything for them over the winter. Both hives are fully built out with 2 deep brood boxes and 1 Med super each. I scraped and crushed two Super frames off each hive and got a total of 16 pints. I've been feeding 1:1 so they could build up comb. Once the supers were built out with comb I stopped feeding...so not sure if they simply shifted syrup around or not. Either way it looks, smells and tastes like honey (well better than store bought) so I'm keeping these first ones for me. BTW - my hives are in very remote farmland with nothing but open fields of clover, buckwheat, and wildflowers and no competition for miles.


ok so now you are adding some pertinent information. Once you stopped feeding the filling of comb is likely the nectar. IF you swapped brood boxes and they rearrange stores and have super space available they would also likely move some Syrup to the supers. Your PIC looks like a 1/2 pint. 8 quarts from 4 frames is a good yield  wink wink. I would go ahead and use it as honey. next year as soon as they start in the supers stop the feeding, or slow it to a trickle. the medium frames generally run close to a quart a frame, depending on spacing. Enjoy the honey and think about the winter needs of the hives . soon you will need to prep the hives for winter.
GG


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## Gray Goose (Sep 4, 2018)

Bigdog6554 said:


> So did I harvest sugar water also? Stopped feeding before 3rd deep was added. This was harvested from that deep after they filled it all.


stopped feeding prior to adding the box you took the honey from. if yes, then likely most of the 3 deep is honey. only if they moved some around would they re-store syrup it up there. When you feed there is always a chance some of the "stored" honey has Sugar water in it. I would not sweat it too much, the Chinese do it all the time with Rice Syrup, "only for export" however. In MN you could likely stop feeding when the dandelions are in full bloom.
GG


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## drummerboy (Dec 11, 2015)

I feel certain that this question/concern has been going on for as long as we have been artificially feeding bees. 

Not wishing to start another debate, but I suspect that any colony that has been fed syrup likely has some syrup mixed with their honey.

...and yes, sugar syrup the bees have been fed and have capped will still taste like honey. Enjoy!!


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## Gray Goose (Sep 4, 2018)

drummerboy said:


> I feel certain that this question/concern has been going on for as long as we have been artificially feeding bees.
> 
> Not wishing to start another debate, but I suspect that any colony that has been fed syrup likely has some syrup mixed with their honey.
> 
> ...and yes, sugar syrup the bees have been fed and have capped will still taste like honey. Enjoy!!


+1 I concur, drummerboy. And for home use, cooking, canning it likely does not matter. Selling it....... I guess that bridge we all need to cross. Some will some won't. I guess I am "lucky" I do not feed, here in mid/north Mich from Dandelion to golden rod there is likely always something in bloom.
GG


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## drummerboy (Dec 11, 2015)

Gray Goose said:


> +1 I concur, drummerboy. And for home use, cooking, canning it likely does not matter. Selling it....... I guess that bridge we all need to cross. Some will some won't. I guess I am "lucky" I do not feed, here in mid/north Mich from Dandelion to golden rod there is likely always something in bloom.
> GG


Yes, we are lucky to have a short season that provides as long as the weather also cooperates, followed by a very long winter, so our bees must be fat and healthy right NOW (mid-August) and busy bringing home the remaining nectar....our blooming season is nearly over. 

We tend to only feed (honey if we have it, sugar if not) light colonies in preparation for winter 'if' the goldenrod doesn't provide enough and then again upon prepping for winter we use dry sugar (4-6 lbs per hive) placed on top of the inner cover as insurance. If bees have found the sugar come early Spring we will feed then also, but usually its honey frames that we've set aside for the purpose, not sugar.

You know, I've been reading for several years that as much as 80% of domestic honey sold in Americas stores are 'adulterated' with other ingredients. Could at least some of the adulterations be all the syrup we feed our bees? 

Maybe, we should all be taking less honey and leaving more for the bees, resulting in fewer feedings of syrup and less questions/concerns about the purity of our honey? Just wondering.


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

drummerboy said:


> ...and yes, sugar syrup the bees have been fed and have capped will still taste like honey. Enjoy!!


It will not taste like goldenrod honey. So that test will fail.

Anyway, if people don't care, just send some sugar through the bee gut, collect the proceeds and call it done.
Who needs the flowers?

All in all, if people heed the advice and start tainting the syrup, many of these questions will just fall off.
Who likes the blue Cool-Aid?


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## drummerboy (Dec 11, 2015)

GregV said:


> It will not taste like goldenrod honey. So that test will fail.
> 
> Anyway, if people don't care, just send some sugar through the bee gut, collect the proceeds and call it done.
> Who needs the flowers?
> ...


Folks taint honey precisely because it is extremely profitable....humans do all kinds of despicable things for money or power.

LOL...while pretty stinky when bees are removing moisture (to me its like getting a big dose of mayonnaise) Goldenrod honey isn't as different to 'most' consumers as any other honey. I personally believe that most consumers cannot tell the difference between pure honey and artificially honey flavored corn syrup. It is the rare consumer along with probably the majority (?) of beekeepers that can tell the subtle differences in regional/seasonal honey's. 

That all said; we generally stop taking any honey by mid to late August (about now), giving our bees roughly a month to 6 weeks collection time before the first killing frost ends all blooming. 

With our summer season growing a bit longer each year that means we could reach temps in the 60's-70's (bee flying weather) and dipping well below freezing the next day, fluctuating extreme temps right up through November into December, when bees in northern WI s/b inside instead of outside seeking that which won't arrive for another 4-6 months. We had pouring rain last year with thunder and lightening in both Dec and January. The ground was frozen already so anyone can guess the issues that all provided. We also lost 60% of our bees ;( last winter despite low mite counts and plenty of honey.

As the Mayan predicted; Changes will be (are) coming at us at an ever increasing pace around the globe. Will we be able to keep up?


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## Champy (Jan 24, 2019)

Gray Goose said:


> ok so now you are adding some pertinent information. Once you stopped feeding the filling of comb is likely the nectar. IF you swapped brood boxes and they rearrange stores and have super space available they would also likely move some Syrup to the supers. Your PIC looks like a 1/2 pint. 8 quarts from 4 frames is a good yield
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Goose - you’re 100% right and I messed up. They’re half pints. Good God what a mess if it had benn Full pints!!!!


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## roddo27846 (Apr 10, 2017)

Champy said:


> So I took a frame off and crushed the honey. Smells like honey; sticky and tastes fine too but it’s really clear and light colored.


Can't tell by looking at it. Honey runs the gamut of colors from almost clear to dark as molasses. If it tastes good, eat it.


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