# Article from Dr Rodregaz part 1



## clintonbemrose (Oct 23, 2001)

GOLDEN GOOSE IN BEEKEEPING

The whole world is alarmed regarding the latest reports about the disappearance of honey bees. “The picture is alarming – honey bee losses are severe in many countries”. Rogers et al, ABJ, May 2007, p441). Fears are justifiable since honey bees are involved in pollination of most of the foods that humans and animals consume in our planet. Such fears would be even more justified if we were to take into consideration Albert Einstein’s prediction, should honey bees disappear from our planet, humanity would last exactly four years. There is no doubt in my mind that this catastrophe would take place if bees were to disappear, but fear not, it is not going to happen, at least not at this point and time. However, we are in for pretty hard times if the present trend in beekeeping continues. As in every other aspect of the world’s economy, beekeeping is ruled by money, enormous amounts of money. Beekeeping, for some, is becoming the goose that lays golden eggs. As Kirk Webster, a commercial beekeeper, so very aptly quoted Mark Twain, (ABJ, September 2006, p755), “In America, the dollar is our God, and how to get it is our religion.” Unfortunately, this phenomenon applies not only to America but also to the entire world. 
It would take several pages of this publication for me to explain all the factors that I believe to be involved in the process of the disappearance of honey bees. I hope to be able to convey my thoughts in a simple way that is appealing to many readers, especially to beekeepers, and that my dialogue makes as much sense to them as it does to me.

I have been a beekeeper for 70 years and a veterinarian for 45 years and performed research in honey bee pest management for the last 15 years as a devoted nature lover, qualities that I believe make me well prepared to address the factors that I believe contribute to the to the present aliment of honey bees. In order to understand what is happening in beekeeping I believe that a brief analysis of the situation should be made at this point. We have the same diseases and parasites in beekeeping as we had 20 years ago (bacteria, mites, protozoans, viruses, hive beetles, Cape Bees, fungi, moths, lots of stress and definitely, transgenic seeds! Used to be, that if we had an ailment affecting honey bees in a large scale, we would be made aware of it the moment we came near a hive due to the stench of dead bees and one could see a pile of dead bees either in front of the hive or inside on the bottom board. In modern days we have added a convenient phrase to what we used to see in the past, disappearing bee syndrome, an inappropriate terminology. Why? Simply, because it does not exist. (Syndrome: the aggregate of symptoms associated with any morbid process, and constituting together the picture of the disease, Stedman’s Medical Dictionary, p1339). Yes, bees do disappear but it is not a syndrome. It is a condition, not an enigma as it has been made to be. It is an occurrence very easily related to economics. Instead, I prefer the term colony collapse disorder, or CCD, term that describes the situation appropriately.

Pharmaceutical/chemical manufacturing enterprises and the scientific community are enjoying a “windfall” from beekeepers in particular and beekeeping in general who worry at the prospect of going bankrupt, fact amply described in the media. It is not difficult to make a connection regarding money spent about disappearing honey bees and the factors responsible for their disappearance. Beekeepers are desperate attempting to save their bees and livelihood trying all kinds of remedies, commercial or otherwise, hoping to find the “silver bullet,” term commonly used by just about any one speaking about such remedies. Government agencies, institutions, beekeepers and beekeeping associations are spending huge amounts of money; for example, Scientific AG Co. donates $75,000 to California Association, ABJ, September 2006, p723, multimillion dollar funding now in process by United States legislature assigning funds for honey bee research for the next four years, Senate Bill, ABJ, August 1007, p663. Bee research conferences are being held frequently in the United States and in foreign countries, to which private individuals, corporate business, institutions and government representatives converge to discuss their views and findings about this disorder. All of them have a common view; beekeepers are losing great numbers of bees. All agree about lots of contributing ideas; almost as many different ones as there are investigators working on the subject. Unfortunately, in spite of the large number of accomplishments brought to these meetings, everything is not in agreement. Beekeepers in attendance complain that scientists are using different testing methods, times and numbers, (Bill Ruzicka, ABJ, August 2007, p658. Hence the need for an international standard treatment method as could be found in the FGMO/thymol treatment method. On the other hand, these meetings are good for the industry because they show ample range of social impact and human interaction. Proof: read the minutia of honey bee conferences, meetings, congresses and other contributing authors who are jumping into the scene,
i. e. Mike McInnes, linking honey bees, diabetes and stress, ABJ, July 2007, p562. But do they solve the question of CCD? It does not appear to do so because the problem continues unabated.

Honey bees are very sensitive organisms and respond to just about all kinds of variants introduced into their colony. Beekeepers in their desperation are pouring many kinds of chemicals into the hives without taking into consideration that most of these remedies are toxic to their bees and that together with the illnesses affecting the bees, parasites, pesticides, transport to long distances (migratory beekeeping), all these conditions cause stress to honey bees. Honey bees under stress abandon their normal activities including hygienic behavior, an activity of vital importance for hive welfare, the bees many times respond to these factors by absconding. In other instances, chemicals, (especially those that leave residues in the combs), diseases and manipulation affect laying and brood rearing ending with diminished populations. This is especially true during winter months when bees are confined to the hives with little or no brood development. Under these circumstances, disasters such as Colony Collapse Disorder (CCD) are likely to occur.

CCD has given bee researchers a field day with huge money grants. This is also good for beekeeping because I am sure that most of them will discover remedies to the ailments that may be affecting honey bees. Some of them already have. For instance Mariano Higes, a Spanish scientist, isolated a Nosema variant that has been found in a great number of colonies seemingly affected by CCD. I live near Mr. Higes place of work and I have known him for over ten years. He is a talented and dedicated researcher who may have found another contributing factor to CCD. However, We should take into consideration that pathogens can inflict severe damage to their hosts when the host’s strength is weakened as happens when the bees are stressed. Spain had a severe drought two years ago which I am sure was responsible for a great number of honey bee colonies collapsing, and perhaps the newly discovered Nosema strain contributed to their losses but it is doubtful that it was the sole responsible factor. I keep my bee colonies in the area, Guadalajara Province, and my bees are not disappearing. I have fabulous bee populations in my colonies (See attached photograph). This statement is not meant to take credit away from my friend’s work, but to indicate that investigators must look further to other causes if we expect to arrive at a definite solution to CCD.


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## clintonbemrose (Oct 23, 2001)

*part 2*

In my mind the solution to CCD is related primarily to the effect of the combination of factors such as: long distance movement of colonies, chemicals used within the colonies, diseases, parasites, GMO seeds and stress. Genetically engineered crops, (commonly known as GMO’s) are widely used in agriculture as enumerated in several pages of American Bee Journal, Internet, and multiple agriculture related literature. It has been documented that GMO’s actions are not limited to the crops for which they are intended but that GMO´s are also transmitted to adjacent plants in which honey bees forage. Do we need to worry about the effects of transgenic seeds in apiculture? In my opinion, the answer is yes. GMO’s are widely used in agriculture with few or no restrictions. Their presence has been shown in just about every plant that bears flowers hence the likelihood for bees to become exposed and be affected by them. One of the signs that have been noted in bees attributed to GMO’s is disorientation. Presumably, bees feeding on plants from GMO seeds become disoriented and cannot return to their hives. I have personally inspected hives affected by CCD that had no evidence or signs of illness. The brood chamber and supers had abundant honey but few bees; the queens were found surrounded by a handful of bees. There were neither fresh brood nor eggs. Reasonably, the queens had stopped laying.

Conclusion. I have not experienced CCD in neither my colonies in Virginia, United States of America nor my colonies in Spain. I know beekeepers (hobbyists and commercial) who report having great success in their business, all having one factor in common. All, including me, use FGMO/thymol treatments. I have been performing research with FGMO/thymol since 1993. Since then, I have made my findings known immediately after completion each year, and continue to do so for the benefit of beekeeping. I continue to receive phone calls and mail regarding the use of FGMO/thymol. My replies are the same. My work continues to be successful using my established protocol. It is significant that that I have not treated my bees in Virginia since May 2007. In Spain, my partners and I continue to use FGMO/thymol treatments because occasional mites are being brought from weak/sick colonies by robbing bees or wandering drones.
The beekeeping industry is in trouble to say the least. Commercial preparations are expensive, have limitations of application, may be toxic to bees and leave residues in wax and honey while food grade mineral oil and natural plant extract (FGMO/thymol) formula and protocol developed by me does not and the ingredients are readily available at very economic prices. It has been demonstrated by means of strict gas chromatography testing in the United States and Europe that when applied according to my protocol, no residues have been found in either honey or wax even though my formulation is applied during the entire year. Honey bee researchers have expressed their opinion that FGMO/thymol treatments are not recommended by them because FGMO/thymol research has not been “scientifically” researched, alleging that I did not use control hives in some of my research. During nearly fifteen years, only five (known) researchers have alleged that FGMO did not work for them. Reading the description of their test procedures, the answer for their failure was clear and evident. They did not follow the protocol established by me; hence they did not replicate my work. . 

Beekeeping is in dire need of utilization of all resources and tools available to attain unity and progress. For the sake of beekeeping and for what benefit may arise out of it, it is evident that some of the resources that are being spent in research could be dedicated to replicate my FGMO/thymol work. There is no reason for not attaining the same results as I have, provided that my protocol is followed, as required by replication. A lot could be accomplished and very little lost. My whole life has been dedicated to my love for honey bees and it shall remain forever so. I have never searched for wealth, fame or glory for my work hence replication could be called XYZ for that matter. Failure to replicate my work looms as a great disservice to beekeeping and to humanity. 
Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez
Virginia Beach, VA, United States of America
and 
Alcalá de Henares, Spain
August 16, 2007
e-mail: [email protected]


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## iddee (Jun 21, 2005)

Very interesting.


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## mountainvalleybee (May 13, 2007)

*dr. of fgmo*

good article I like it, and good job finding it.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

It's good to hear from Dr. Rodriguez.


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## Jeffzhear (Dec 2, 2006)

ClintonBemrose, Thanks for sharing the Dr. Rodriguez writings. I wasn't a part of beesource when he was here, and now I am using the Thymol/FGMO treatment to help my honeybees as they need it. I for one appreciate his work...and enjoyed reading what you posted.


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## Jim Fischer (Jan 5, 2001)

Where's that "big money" he mentions?

So far, no one has seen any big money.
Funds are being "borrowed" from other funded projects, not an
optimal approach for those who want to keep their jobs.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

>>>>Conclusion. I have not experienced CCD in neither my colonies in Virginia, United States of America nor my colonies in Spain. I know beekeepers (hobbyists and commercial) who report having great success in their business, all having one factor in common. All, including me, use FGMO/thymol treatments.

So what does that mean? That so few use FGMO that the chances of someone having CCD is minimal? Or something else. I know many, many beekeepers who don't have CCD or use FGMO, and what does that say?

>>>>During nearly fifteen years, only five (known) researchers have alleged that FGMO did not work for them. Reading the description of their test procedures, the answer for their failure was clear and evident. They did not follow the protocol established by me; hence they did not replicate my work.

Which protocol are we speaking about? It has changed so many times over the years, its hard to say. I remember once that claims of failed protocol procedure was based on the length of the cord being cut too short. Any protocol that has basis for failure in a cord one inch shorter then another cord showing success, and that was the basis for claiming failed tests, has to be questioned with a bit of skepticism. Does the protocol even still use these cords?

I have been waiting for "The cyclone" vinegar ads to make some claim of CCD results. As well as others. I guess the marketing campaigns will be in full swing soon.

I don't see how anyone can make claims as to CCD. We don't even know what CCD is yet? As of this time, I have heard among other things, neonicotinoids poisoning, viruses, protein deficiency and nutrition, and lets throw in cell phones to keep this post on the lighter side.

I'll start with these four items. Lets assume for a minute that each four were independantly responsible for CCD. Yes, without formal studies, one could always claim we just don't know without the studies. But humor me anyways. Can we take a guess or give an opinion how FGMO would save bees from systemic neonicotinoid poisoning? Or how bees suffering from "low protein deficiency" would be helped by fogging and some FGMO protocol? How much protein is in FGMO anyways? (More humor) 

Come now people. Lets scrutinize this as we do everything else. Nothing gets a pass. And if someone does have a problem with this piece listed here on beesource, then lets not attack the person adding too or asking questions.

Nice observation Jim. I think the big dollars will not be coming though as some had hoped. The boy crying wolf got cuaght with his pants down. No crop went unpollinated. And although that was a good thing for industries such as almonds and apples, I see no real action until the food industry gets hurt and makes the same claim as beekeepers did. Its seems nobody cares if a few beekeepers get hurt while the food industry carries forward.


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## deknow (Jul 17, 2006)

...all the while, it looks like there will be 23million put towards researchng the ivory billed woodpecker habitat...in case it is not extinct.

deknow


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

Mike,
If a bear craps in the woods, and nobody smells it...yes the bear still crapped, but did anyone know about it.

Ok, Ok. Just putting a twist on an old saying.

But the truth is, I for one heard nothing on the news, nothing in the trade magazines, and nothing publicly about pollination shortages. I have not even read anything of the sort in the bee industry magazines. So I ask, do congressman know about these "pockets" of shortages? How about the media? This is certainly the first I have heard such claims. And this is a beekeeping forum that you would of thought such discussions would of been all over the place with such shortages happening.

Yeah, I'm sure there was a pocket somewhere. But without the press, without the chatter, without the congressman knowing about it, without the apple industry publishing it.......I'll stick with my comment "No crop went unpollinated". 

If you want to argue semantics or micro-details of my comments, thats fine. But the spirit behind what I said holds true. That massive food shortages, crops going unpollinated, and all the other doom and gloom comments....equated to the little boy crying wolf, and getting caught. It did not happen.

Its sad to say, but the bee industry will not be seeing the payouts as asked for. The doom and gloom is slipping by the way side. The food industry was hurt almost nothing on a national scale. Thats the bottom line. Sorry about a few pockets. It changes little as to the entire story or comment I made.

Did anyone else see apple growers scrambling for units? Not just scrambling, which does happen, but going without? (And not for going without by choice, but becuase they could not find any bees) I didn't hear of any myself. But I'll leave open the idea that there was a few somewhere.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

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## Sundance (Sep 9, 2004)

Great points Bjorn.......... Nothing is "effective" on something we don't even understand the cause of, let alone a good definition.

Personally I fog with FGMO and Thymol. It is not a silver bullet. I firmly believe that is helps grooming, and especially tracheal mites. It also inhibits molds.

The recent Randy Oliver article in ABJ made a good and very valid point regarding fogging. WEAR A RESPIRATOR!


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

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## Sundance (Sep 9, 2004)

No losses from "CCD" but heavy losses last winter due to weather mainly.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

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## Keith Benson (Feb 17, 2003)

Mike Gillmore said:


> My next question then is... How can you be certain that FGMO/Thymol is NOT the "Silver Bullet"? I personally think it should be critically tested and either confirmed or eliminated from the list of effective treatments against "CCD" .. whatever it is.
> 
> Have there been any documented cases of CCD in your area?


You are right, we don't know. For that matter, how do we know that banging the hive with an old chicken bone isn't the silver bullet for CCD? I think banging on hives with an old chicken bone (from a black rooster no less ) should be critically tested and confirmed or eliminated from the list of effective treatments against CCD . . . wait a minute, what is CCD?

Keith


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## Keith Benson (Feb 17, 2003)

Sundance said:


> The recent Randy Oliver article in ABJ made a good and very valid point regarding fogging. WEAR A RESPIRATOR!


When that suggestion was made a very long time ago it sparked a rather heated discussion about the necessity of such safety gear. As I recall it was taken rather personally as an attempt to impugn the safety of fogged FGMO. 

Keith


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

Keith,
On target.

I have heard, although I'm waiting for the "official" marketing blitz on the cyclone "vinegar machine", that one person I know says that discussion with "other" people have indicated that the cyclone will handle CCD. Although they also claim that it handles afb, efb, v-mites, t-mites, and who knows what else.

I have also heard one breeder who gets russians directly from Harpers make the claim that Charlie has indicated that not one person who he knows that uses his queens has ccd.

So now FGMO wants on the list?

I really don't think research is effective in this approach. 

Heck I don't have CCD. Not sure if its sitting on beesource wasting half the day that makes the difference, or that my bees seem to lick up the minerals from the last time I took a leak on the bush next to the hives. But we better check that out. I could be spraying the miracle fluid that saves all of mankind. 

Where did this article come from? I'm not sure if its a request for support in testing of FGMO, or a marketing campaign for FGMO. It has the usual fear factor and qoutes from a bunch of dead people indicating timeframes we will live once bees disappear, and other such matters.

I know clinton is a longtime supporter of FGMO and has been qouted with his testimonials many times by Dr. R. So was this a reprint from an article? I find it amazing that this is sent here on beesource. I'm sure other more professional approaches and support could be found if he would contact the CCD team himself or take a different path.

Gotta go. Yes, I mean litarally, I GOT TO GO! I'll be back after I pee on my hives and save humanity.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

Mike,
What were your legitimate questions?


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

Mike I did see this one...

>>>My next question then is... How can you be certain that FGMO/Thymol is NOT the "Silver Bullet"? I personally think it should be critically tested and either confirmed or eliminated from the list of effective treatments against "CCD" 

And your point? 

My comments on the cyclone and charlie harpers comments are real and valid, and should be given as much wieght as this piece on FGMO. Sorry if you dissagree. 

I personally feel that its backwards to research FGMO based on someone claiming to have the answer as to the solution based on not seeing it in hives fogged with FGMO. I added the examples to show that there are others making the same claim. I see no reason to waste research dollars and effort when finding the cause is better than seeking a solution and then trying to find what your not seeing to begin with. 

Hows that. Straight forward and to the point. Now I hope you can respect my and other's opinions without your comments of "jerks".


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

Mike, one more thing.

Can you please list and post this "list of effective treatments against CCD."

I am really interested in this particular comment of yours.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

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## Sundance (Sep 9, 2004)

It is well established at this point that thymol is an effective weapon against varroa. The commercially available products that utilize it have been tested and found effective.

Whether the concentrations in the FGMO/Thymol fogging mixture are as effective as the commercial products is open for debate. My bottom line is that I am convinced it helps. But like any treatment, colonies have to be monitored.

Mike G...... your points are good ones. Not knowing much of anything about "CCD" clouds the issue. Until it is nailed down anything is purely conjecture. I am convinced that FGMO/Thymol fogged is very helpful for many things, grooming, tracheal mites, varroa, molds, fungus, etc.

It is cheap, fast, easy and IMO effective at some level.


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## Keith Benson (Feb 17, 2003)

Mike Gillmore said:


> complete jerks with their condescending, ****y rebuttals.


Mmmm - I was re-enforcing what you were saying - or do you really mean that we aught to chase down every cure to a "problem" that no one has yet been able to accurately define . . . at least not that we know of. I am not certain what you are upset with.

Keith


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

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## iddee (Jun 21, 2005)

I fog with fgmo and thymol for v-mites and t-mites. I have healthy hives. That is enough for me. No scientific data, no control hives, just a happy beek.
If I don't have ccd because it isn't in this area, or the fgmo/thymol, or the water savings of going in the yard, it doesn't really matter to me. I just like healthy hives and no contaminated wax or honey. I will continue to fog.


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

Mike,
I actually was upset after the very first post. Its full of presumptions, broad strokes of prejudice, self promotion, fear-mongering, pandering, among others.

Or did you mean to read further than that?..... 

Thats ok mike, you can call me a jerk if you want.

Keith now, you should know better. Nobody is suggesting that we chase down every ****amammy(forgive me, I'm not sure if I ever tried to spell this word before) suggestion. Just this one!

I only wish some were as willing to break down the first post as they are everyone elses posts. That opening post is a doozy to say the least.


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## Keith Benson (Feb 17, 2003)

Mike Gillmore said:


> Re-read this thread from the beginning, and if you have at least an average IQ and just an ounce of common sense, I believe you will figure it out.


Did someone pee in your cheerios this morning? Lighten up. 

Keith


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## Keith Benson (Feb 17, 2003)

BjornBee said:


> Keith now, you should know better.


Thought I did and maybe was missing something given the medium, happens all the time on listservs, email and these types of forums. Of course it could be my below average IQ and lack of common sense . . . ayup.

I am always amazed when people get ripping mad that no one wants to invest time energy and money into their pet theorem. 

PS - weirdly, ****amamie is in the spell checker - go figure!

Keith


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

Ok, Lets see....

We have a possible virus that may be responsible for CCD or a result of CCD. But at least that seems where the research is headed.

And Dr. R thinks FGMO treatments are the reason for not having CCD. Although I'm not sure whether his hives have ever been exposed to such viruses, and he never mentions the fact, he is quite sure FGMO is the treatment for CCD, and is campaigning for research.

If you were a researcher, what questions would need to be asked? Esxample-How does the virus spread? Food sources, egg laying or other? What vectors could be effected by FGMO and how would this defend against the virus or limit the effects.

I'm guessing some basic questions would be asked, then models set up to test such ideas.

Other then getting some CCD hives and begin treating with FGMO, what models or concepts should be given consideration.

I asked before last weeks news about a virus, how would FGMO defend against a virus, earlier in this thread. Nobody made any comments.

Through past research, some knowledge on vectors, treatment impacts, and desease characteristics are known. Basic test models are based on such common sense and knowledge. So using this, how can one see FGMO being tested? How would FGMO be effective in "theory" that would giude you in testing if you were the researcher?

It's raining today. Someone humor me......


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## wbell (Mar 5, 2005)

What is rain?


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

>>>What is rain?

Gods tears from laughing so hard after reading some of the ridiculous crap in this thread.....


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

You're right! I've removed "my" ridiculous crap. 

I'm better now.


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## BULLSEYE BILL (Oct 2, 2002)

*Clavinism*

>I asked before last weeks news about a virus, how would FGMO defend against a virus, earlier in this thread. Nobody made any comments.

It is commonly know that a virus is a miniscule organism that attacks organic cells of the host it has invaded. So when following the very exacting protocols of the famous dr R, the fgmo is vaporized into a very fine droplet the size of a virus. These tiny droplets of vaporized oil are then bombarded upon the virus making the virus very slippery and unable to adhere to or attack the cells therefore making them inert and of no danger to the host.


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## Axtmann (Dec 29, 2002)

Bill do you have an idea whether the oil smoke will kill AFB? I never had it, but just in cast. How much oil must be blown in the hive to make the AFB spores slippery?


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## iddee (Jun 21, 2005)

Everybody likes a little.................
Nobody likes a wise................   

I like fogging, SO THERE !!!!


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## honeyman46408 (Feb 14, 2003)

iddee said:


> Everybody likes a little.................
> Nobody likes a wise................
> 
> I like fogging, SO THERE !!!!


I SECOND that


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## pkwilbur (Mar 20, 2004)

Well, Mike...... I liked your "everything has its season".

I hope to include that thought with the CCD..........as cycles come and then go, in the season, as they have all these years. Let nature take it course and I hope that is what is happening here and we are just trying to control it. ????

Who knows, but I hope. Just like all the other bugs have problems and if we stop interfering....?

Ahhhh, yes.......... Let me think on the lighter side of things please.


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