# provap 110 question



## aran (May 20, 2015)

I have a 2017 honda ridgeline that has an outlet in the truck bed that I can plug stuff into...tv/blender etc for tailgating.
Can i plug the provap110 directly into that outlet and use it?

It says 115V, 150-400 W


----------



## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

The Provap 110 draws 250 watts, so it _should_ work OK.


----------



## Kamon A. Reynolds (Apr 15, 2012)

I have similar plug on my truck and so far it works great.


----------



## sjj (Jan 2, 2007)

Tennessee's Bees LLC said:


> ... and so far it works great.


Is it worth to put a new and extra high quality original car battery in jeopardy because of provap? 
I think it is a wrong decision.


----------



## crofter (May 5, 2011)

sjj said:


> Is it worth to put a new and extra high quality original car battery in jeopardy because of provap?
> I think it is a wrong decision.


:scratch: It should not endanger the battery if used properly.

Unless I am mistaken (using my Toyota owners manual), you have to have the engine running to get 400 watts ac from the auxilliary inverter plug, otherwise it is only 100 watts. You would not want an inverter supplying 250 watts Ac to run very long off an auto battery unless you leave the engine running. It would make no difference whether it is the manufacturers installation, or an add on.


----------



## aran (May 20, 2015)

ok so im confused. I have a small bee yard which isnt too far from where i can park my truck and run an extension cord easily to the hives to use the provap. Is this an ok plan or not? Do i need the engine running or not?


----------



## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

aran said:


> Do i need the engine running or not?


Your owners manual, page 35, here: 
http://techinfo.honda.com/rjanisis/pubs/QS/AH/AT6Z1717OG/enu/AT6Z1717OG.PDF
...says that the power outlet provides 400 watts when the engine is running and the vehicle is in Park, otherwise it provides 150 watts.

So, you need to have the engine running to use the 250 watt Provap 110 plugged into the AC outlet.


----------



## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

You may want to use a heavy duty extention cord. No less than 14 ga. if longer than 50'. Might be overkill, but undersized cords are dangerous.


----------



## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

The Provap will draw little more than 2 amps through your cord and quite frankly for this use a 16 gauge cord will be quite sufficient as 16 gauge will carry 10 amps.
Johno


----------



## aran (May 20, 2015)

awesome thanks guys. I have an 14 G 100foot extension cord and a 50 foot 16g which is probably long enough i think.


----------



## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

Johno, you are right. I prefer heavier cords when running longer distances for my power tools. Wasn't thinking about it only being a 2 amp load.


----------



## snl (Nov 20, 2009)

:thumbsup:


johno said:


> The Provap will draw little more than 2 amps through your cord and quite frankly for this use a 16 gauge cord will be quite sufficient as 16 gauge will carry 10 amps.
> Johno


:thumbsup:


----------



## Kamon A. Reynolds (Apr 15, 2012)

sjj said:


> Is it worth to put a new and extra high quality original car battery in jeopardy because of provap?
> I think it is a wrong decision.


Who would use something this strong and not have the vehicle running?


----------



## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Well that just depends on the circumstances, If I am going to treat 4 hives I would not bother to run the engine unless I knew I had a failing battery If I was going to treat 10 hives without running the motor then I would be stretching my luck a little. Four hives can be treated in about 5 minutes so if the unit is on 100% of the time which it would not be, at a 12 volt draw of 25 amps the ampere hours used would be around 2 ampere hours and I would guess that most stating batteries of small vehicles would be in the vicinity of 80 ampere hours of which you should not go below 50% so 40 less 2 is not too bad but as your hive count increases so does your ampere hour usage and you dont want to push your luck unless you want to push your truck.
Johno


----------



## Groundhwg (Jan 28, 2016)

sjj said:


> Is it worth to put a new and extra high quality original car battery in jeopardy because of provap?
> I think it is a wrong decision.


How in the world do you think it could harm your car battery? You can "run down" the battery but harm it, I do not think so. :scratch:


----------



## sjj (Jan 2, 2007)

Groundhwg said:


> How in the world do you think ... I do not think so. :scratch:


It is a grunge.


----------



## crofter (May 5, 2011)

_Deep _discharges of a battery would have some cost on its life expectancy but then even idling a 300 horsepower engine has some cost in wear and tear and fossil fuel depletion.:no:

Johno's post #14 pretty well sums up the cost/benefit analysis. 

You guys are even worser quibblers than I am.


----------



## sjj (Jan 2, 2007)

aran said:


> ok so im confused. ...


Discover and identify the fuse, that protects the AC power outlet line. 
Buying the spare one, that can be used if it is needed, be sure about the correct amp rating for that circuit.


----------



## Groundhwg (Jan 28, 2016)

sjj said:


> It is a grunge.


grunge 
noun
1. grime; dirt.
2. a style of rock music characterized by a raucous guitar sound and lazy vocal delivery.

What in the world has that got to do with a battery or ProVap 110?


----------



## aran (May 20, 2015)

so i went to plug in my 14G extension cord this am and found the outlet is a 2 prong not a 3 prong outlet which sucks ! Now i will have to get an adapter. Perhaps ill just stick with my lawn tractor and inverter as ive been doing.


----------



## snl (Nov 20, 2009)

aran said:


> so i went to plug in my 14G extension cord this am and found the outlet is a 2 prong not a 3 prong outlet which sucks ! Now i will have to get an adapter. Perhaps ill just stick with my lawn tractor and inverter as ive been doing.


What’s the old saying, “measure twice, cut once...”


----------



## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

I prefer the new saying " I cut it twice and its still too short "
Johno


----------



## Groundhwg (Jan 28, 2016)

aran said:


> so i went to plug in my 14G extension cord this am and found the outlet is a 2 prong not a 3 prong outlet which sucks ! Now i will have to get an adapter. Perhaps ill just stick with my lawn tractor and inverter as ive been doing.


Or just break the ground prong off the extension cord.


----------



## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Groundhwg said:


> Or just break the ground prong off the extension cord.


Well, that is poor advice. 

The Provap 110 is designed by the manufacturer with a 3-prong (grounded) plug, and should be used with a matching 3-wire extension cord. Properly used, an adapter at a 2-prong wall receptacle should have its pigtail attached to the receptacle center screw to complete the ground.


----------



## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

Groundhwg said:


> Or just break the ground prong off the extension cord.


Sounds like someone is in the running for a Darwin Award.


----------



## aran (May 20, 2015)

im just going to continue using the inverter with my lawn tractor. It works fine.


----------



## Groundhwg (Jan 28, 2016)

JWPalmer said:


> Sounds like someone is in the running for a Darwin Award.


Really I bet it is easy to break off. Then of course if you treat early in the morning with lots of dew on the ground than likely you will still have a good ground.


----------



## sjj (Jan 2, 2007)

Inverter earthing is easy to build.


----------



## whiskers (Aug 28, 2011)

Since the truck is sitting on four rubber tires it cannot provide a ground, thus the legal types at the manufacturer probably insisted that the inverter be equipped with a two prong outlet. Nowadays I would think the legal types would also insist that the inverter also provide ground fault protection (check your manual) which should make it reasonably safe to use without the ground attached.
Bill


----------



## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

The "ground prong" issues in this thread started with a comment about a residential outlet/receptacle that only has 2 prongs, likely in an older house. All the inverters that I have seen do have 3 prongs, even though those portable inverters (in a vehicle perhaps) are not necessarily tied to 'earth' ground.

The point of the grounding wire in an appliance is to provide an alternate return path for the current if somehow the 'hot' wire [inside the appliance/tool] comes in contact with the tool [conductive] housing. 

For instance, I have an aluminum bodied Skilsaw that could be very hazardous if the internal wiring failed in a way that connected the 'hot' wire to the housing, so the ground wire provides a safe return path to ground that does _not_ involve going through me. A so-called 'double-insulated' tool (some leaf blowers etc) have a fully plastic non-conductor housing that eliminates the potential shock hazard with an internal wiring failure, so can be shipped with only a 2-prong plug.

Removing the 3rd prong on an extension cord that may see use with a residential electric system can lead to a hazardous situation if the tool gets damaged. Using a damaged tool with an vehicle inverter (connected through a 2-conductor cord or a crippled plug) would seem not to have the same level of hazard issue, as the inverter may not be connected to earth ground, but there is always the possibility that another user with a different tool plugged into that same inverter has done something that connects to earth ground. This could be simply laying a tool with damaged internals on 'earth' ground. Under that circumstance, there is now a return path for the hot current to 'earth' ground that would involve going _through_ the human.


----------



## crofter (May 5, 2011)

Good explanation Rader;

Grounding a portable generator or inverter may sometimes not be a good idea. When ungrounded neither of the power leads contacting the frame of a tool would give it a potential voltage relative to the earth you stand on. I have seen this argued back and forth by electricians and even engineers!

In any case, breaking off the ground connector on an extension cord is bad news.


----------



## sjj (Jan 2, 2007)

AC line with a RCD protection whilst it's in use (appropriate weatherproof outdoor fittings and covers).

https://www.google.com/search?q=rcd...VAKHfnuC3AQ9C96BAgBEBg&biw=1280&bih=857&dpr=1


----------



## crofter (May 5, 2011)

The price of an external double pole ground fault circuit interrupter might scare you. 

If you are using an inverter either from an automobile source or from a battery in a wheel barrow you do not have to worry about getting shocked at your beehives when using a two conductor or a three conductor cord to power your ProVap 110. Using makeshift cords (like with the ground prong removed) when powering from the ground bonded _domestic power outlets_ is more dangerous.

Be very leary of someone that _thinks_ he knows all about grounding and wants to foolproof your system for you!


----------



## sjj (Jan 2, 2007)

crofter said:


> The price of an external double pole ground fault circuit interrupter might scare you. ...


Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter, hier they are called FI-Schutzschalter. About 20$. For outdoor. 
There are also inverter with ready GFCI outlets. 
Do a search on inverter with a ground fault circuit interrupter. Not a big thing.


----------



## crofter (May 5, 2011)

I doubt very much that you are pricing a double pole interrupter. There is considerable difference in what is needed with a floating neutral power supply compared to a ground bonded neutral in a permanent receptacle as used on this continent. I am not familiar with the protocol in European countries and I suspect that we may be comparing apples and oranges. It is not 20$ simple with a remote ac source.

I think we are off topic for the purpose of this thread.


----------

