# Advice needed, second year top bar hive, cross comb and aggresiveness??



## JYawn (Dec 6, 2011)

Unfortunately I dont have an answer for you but one question I will ask, b/c I'm thinking others will wonder the same, how many days has this been going on???


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## ♥Faerie♥ (May 16, 2011)

I opened up the hive on Saturday, around midday (2pmish). So for the rest of the day on Saturday, and all day yesterday, Sunday. I am at work today, so I do not know how they are behaving so far today. Before that, on Saturday, I was out on the back patio, which I would say is about 15 feet away from the hive, around the corner of my house, I was working on some windows, and not one bee bothered me. While I have noticed they are way more active than last year, I have never been concerned about being stung.....


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## robherc (Mar 17, 2012)

First off, if it's only the last 6 bars or so that're cross-combed, I'd just take 'em all out and replace with clean bars + comb guides.
About their aggression, you could well be right that they're just that peeved about your collapsing comb & killing a few bees; did you use any smoke on them? If you didn't smoke them, the alarm pheromone might still be lingering in the hive for a few days, but should dissipate (and their behavior should return to "normal") within a week...assuming there's not some other reason for their increased aggression.

Also, if the hive's completely filled with comb, taking out the last few bars of comb & replacing with foundation might be about overdue as a swarm prevention measure anywise; try to put a couple of the empty bars in between combs in the brood chamber so they can build more space for the queen to lay in.


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## ♥Faerie♥ (May 16, 2011)

I did not use a smoker at all, I think I was still expecting them to be like last year, they were so docile that I would open them up with just a tank top on, and they hardly even took notice of me. They just seem much more on the defense this year, a lot more energy coming off them! 
I am positive that I took a few of them down with my attempt.....so I really am hoping this is the cause of their heightened aggression. 
And Thats was my whole reason for going in this weekend, I thought maybe they needed a little space, so I was going to maybe take a few combs and replace with empty bars, but once I saw all the cross comb my mind screamed "ABORT!!!!". 
So with their aggression being high right now, should I wait a week or so before going back in? I just want my bees to be the happy little creatures they once were!


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## robherc (Mar 17, 2012)

I'd suit up, grab the smoker, and get it over with...you're going to have to do it at some time, and you'll likely cause a bit of a rucus whenever you do it, so better to get it done sooner than later so the bees can start rebuilding IMHO.
Also, a bit of sugar syrup scented with LGO or HBH in a spritz bottle might help mask the alarm pheromone in the hive & get the bees more interested in grooming than attacking, at least for a while. Spritz it in on them (and on the hive near where the alarm pheromone is likely the strongest) when you open up the hive and it might help keep things a little "calmer" while you're fighting the crossed-up combs.

Good luck & happy bees,
Rob


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## ♥Faerie♥ (May 16, 2011)

Thanks for the tips! I will plan on doing this on Sat. Would do it sooner, but work all week. I have one more question though, I have been watching videos, and it seems all the videos I watch, there are a few bees flying about when the person is doing an inspection, but for the most part, they are not flying in the hundreds around the hive. When I opened up my hive this past Saturday, it just seemed like they were hundreds in the air, all around me, kinda like when I first hived them. Is this normal?


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## robherc (Mar 17, 2012)

When I mess with my hives within the first 2 weeks after install and I'm fairly brief with my inspection, often only a few dozen get into the air around me... When I do more meddling with the hive, especially if I'm meddling a lot, and don't use enough/any smoke, I end up with hundreds to a few thousand in the air, but I don't think it makes much more difference than them just gettin' a whiff of alarm pheromone & going out to settle the score.

That said, I'm not exactly an "old hand" so maybe someone with a few years more experience could answer that one better?


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## ♥Faerie♥ (May 16, 2011)

That does make sense, I suppose last year, they were a newer hive, and I rarely messed with them, and when I did, it was very minimal. I have never used a smoker, but think it time to invest in one, as well as a proper bee suit. I have a veil and gloves, but not a full suit. I does make me feel better that you also experience a cloud of bees during certain things. I was worried that this might also be a sign of my hive becoming increasing aggressive.


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## Merlinspop (Nov 4, 2010)

I have a veil (with plastic pith helmet), but primarily use a jacket with hood/veil. I don't have proper beekeeping gloves, but when I'm going to be in there enough to annoy some, I'll put on a pair of latex (dishwashing) gloves. Over the top of those I'll put on a pair of latex food prep gloves. The thought being if the outter gloves get all sticky or goobered up, I can toss them and keep the heavier gloves for later use (after the gallon of sweat is drained out and dried). Maybe I should just buy some leather beekeeping gloves. ;-)


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## robherc (Mar 17, 2012)

lol, you're all too hi-tech for me...I stapled some vinyl/fiberglass screen to the brim of a $10.40 hat I got from wal-mart; sewed a couple plys of cloth to the bottom of the screen for a neck guard/drape to tuck into my "suit"; then wear sweatpants over jeans, 2 sweatshirts, boots & welding gloves. Only time I've ever gotten stung in my "super low-tech" suit is when I screwed up & wore jean SHORTS while cutting out a huge, nasty tempered hive (YEEEOOOOUCH!!!).

...Total cost of my "bee suit" = $10.40 for the wide-brimmed hat & about $8 for a roll of screen...that that's what I call being a cheap-skate! (oh yeah, and I use duct-tape at the waist & forearms to keep bees from crawling into my shirt or gloves)


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## ♥Faerie♥ (May 16, 2011)

Baha, that is awesome! I did buy a hat, but actually made the veil part myself with some tull I had lying around. I got the gloves off ebay for around 10 bucks, so not too bad there. I was doing what you do also, this past weekend. I put on a pair of sweat pants over another pair of pants, and a sweatshirt on over a t-shirt.....I guess maybe if I go ahead and get a "bee suit", it would be a more mental thing than safety thing.....


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## Merlinspop (Nov 4, 2010)

I've heard that Sherwin Williams stores sell cheap canvass coveralls that work well.


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## ♥Faerie♥ (May 16, 2011)

I never even thought to look there, thanks!


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## scook6 (Jun 24, 2013)

1st you need a smoker(use sparingly) then plan ahead exactly what you will be doing in the hive. do it calmly and don't waste time. Try not to kill any bees while working (this is difficult) too many bees squashed and they will start to freak out.
there is a great resource in You Tube, watch "the fat beeman" or is it beekeeper-I forget


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

I cut a hive out of a shed wall without much smoke and for 2 weeks if I got near the hive they would head butt me for about 100 feet if I opened the box they would chase me a 1/4 mile down the road and greet me for days everytime I stepped out the back door. I said that to say this without requeening this is now one of my calmest hives my mentor came over today and he was petting bees with his bare finger in the bottom box so yes a major disturbance without smoke can make even the calmest bees cranky


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