# Tons of Small hive beetles- HELP!!!



## keepcalmandjustbee (Oct 1, 2013)

Hi,
This is my first post on this forum, and also my first year as a beekeeper. I found this forum after desperately searching for advice on what to do about a bad infestation of small hive beetles. I figured my best bet would be to ask experienced beekeepers! I just got my two hives this past spring, and have mostly let them be (no pun intended) all throughout the summer. Today I checked on the inside of them both for the first time in a couple of months. One of my hives is thriving and appears very strong, with lots of capped honey cells. However there are tons of small hive beetles running around. The second hive worries me very much. It is very weak, less than half the size of the other hive, and has triple the amount of small hive beetles running amok. I have IPM (screened) bottom boards, which I understand to be the best for preventing pests. Having just gotten my two hives in the spring, I have never harvested anything nor treated for any pests. With my first winter approaching, I am terrified the beetles will weaken my stronger hive and likely kill the weaker one. Please tell me what I should do to get rid of the beetles and save my hives!!!
Thanks so much in advance!


----------



## Bill91143 (Jun 7, 2013)

I would start by crowding my hive some. If you have more comb than the bees can cover the beetles will surely take advantage of it. If you have very much empty comb pull out some of it, by removing a box or if you are only removing some drawn frames, replace them with frames of foundation. That way the beetles won't have so many cells to hide in. if you do crowd them up you will need to keep a close eye on them so they don't get to crowded.


----------



## Crsswift70 (Sep 9, 2013)

I would also add that there are hive beetle traps that you can buy and/or make yourself. Not hard to find the plans with Google.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_KDPp8H6PU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-rtDZMIQBM

I personally use this one and it works well.

http://www.rweaver.com/popup_image.php?pID=91


----------



## keepcalmandjustbee (Oct 1, 2013)

Great, I was doing some reading online but didn't know that crowding them was a good thing to do! Thank you! They have an entire box that they haven't started using yet. The other hive, being much larger, is already using the super but the weaker one hasn't touched it. I'll be sure to take it off tomorrow! 
I also saw traps online. Does anyone have any experience with Cutts beetle blaster? Does it work?


----------



## keepcalmandjustbee (Oct 1, 2013)

Also, would feeding the weaker hive more be a good idea? Would that help it get stronger to fight off the beetles, or would the beetles somehow take advantage of the feeder?


----------



## Tom Brueggen (Aug 10, 2011)

The mention above to crowd the bees may be the best method in my opinion. I just had the very unfortunate event of going to investigate a friend's hive, only to find the bees absconded this afternoon ( only hours before I arrived with a second box, thinking they were crowded and hoping to make a split). There was nothing left by drone, baby bees and SHB. It's tough to tell a newbie they've just lost it all and there's nothing you can do. This was a STRONG colony, one deep and two mediums. They were not overrun with work. In fact he just harvested about two days ago and became concerned when the bees wouldn't go back in the box. But he said they'd been hanging outside the box for almost two weeks now. Sound to me like the beetles were slowly getting the upper hand and the stress of the honey harvest was the final tipping point. As for the Beetle Blaster traps, he had six of them in the hive and all were full of beetles after only a few days. But it wasn't enough. I ran them in my hives for a while but also found it to not be a cure-all solution and then just a nuisance to always move them so I could pull out frames. 

But I have saved hives by the crowding method. The bees will not overbuild comb they can't manage, so as a last resort you can cut them down on duties. I had a small hive from a cutout that for some reason refused the box, and their transferred combs, and after two days was slimed. But they were still hanging on the inside walls of the hive. So I removed all slimed frames and replaced with bare foundation and put on a feeder. The bees built back well and are now a good size colony! It can be done, but must be caught in time. 

This topic really needs further discussion. I think there is a lot of room to play with IPM for SHB and there is a lot that is still not understood by the avg beekeeper about the pests. I too have several hives that appear overrun with beetles and others that appear just fine.


----------



## tommysnare (Jan 30, 2013)

you said one hive is much weaker than the other one ? i would first off check the status of the queen in the really weak hive. she could have died or what not and thats why the numbers are down in that hive. check for brood in ALL STAGES of growth...especially eggs. eggs show that she has laid recently. also check for a large amount of queen cells (if any) in that colony as well. crowding the hive is a great idea ! what im thinking that will accomplish is make the hive MUCH stronger as comparatively to the hive/box size. a strong hive is always the first defense against any pests. all beekeepers will attest to that im sure. i use SBB's on all of my hives including my top bar hives. im completely sold on them in more ways than i can ever express. this will be my first wintering with them soo im pretty jittery about leaving them open hahaha.

Now,if your weker hive turns out to be unfortunately queenless....i would think your best bet would be to do a newspaper combine on top of the stronger hive. i have to do a few of those this weekend. its unfortunate but this late in the season those bees would surely die because there really isnt enough time for them to rear a new queen and have her cycle into laying...not to mention waiting for a couple brood cycles before winter time. its kind of a bummer. but on the bright side....doing a combine you A) save those bees B)save any brood that may be still emerging in the weak hive and C) it will make that strong hive even stronger !

i would recommend at least one more hive next spring (try and get an early swarm or cutout locally as ferals are the best) because having the resources from multiple hives is priceless. and also, get in those hives more than every other month during the warm season. you never know when they are exploding,ready to crash,starving or need more room because you are in a major honey flow. and swarming is a bummer.....need to do inspections buddy .

Love them..... spend time with them. 
my home apiary is better than any meditaion rock garden in china.....trust me 


sorry about being long winded


----------



## virginiawolf (Feb 18, 2011)

Debbie Delaney http://ag.udel.edu/enwc/faculty/delaney.html was at EAS and she said to go through the frames and kill the small hive beetles by hand like with a hive tool. She said that It was as effective as anything else she had tried. I have been killing any that I see as I inspect. I have used beetle blaster traps as well. They worked well and are not that expensive. Beetles aren't very smart but they are tenacious. And can mess up a hive quick. Try to get on top of them or they may end up getting through your combs. Goof Luck!!!!!


----------



## Tenbears (May 15, 2012)

First let me Welcome you to the forum! 

If you have not deduced this from the advice already offered. it was most likely not the Small hive beetles (SHB) That made your hive week. It was most likely the week hive that created an environment conducive to infestation. A strong hive is able to keep the SHB in check. the bees harass the SHB relentlessly, they corral them and keep them from laying their eggs which are the root of the problem.
With that said you should now understand that to have healthy, productive happy bees requires the bee keeper to take a active role in hive management. 

now that you have joined our community pleas use it to develop a management plan that will make beekeeping a pleasure for you and the girls


----------



## AmericasBeekeeper (Jan 24, 2010)

Welcome KCJB! I hope you have an entrance reducer in the weak hive. I have used the Cutts Beetle Blaster. I may be partial as I know Laurence Cutts and hired his son, Stephen Cutts. August and September are hard months for the bees as adult bee numbers go down and Varroa remain constant or increase. It is the Varroa per bee that weakens the hive.


----------



## Bill91143 (Jun 7, 2013)

keepcalmandjustbee said:


> Great, I was doing some reading online but didn't know that crowding them was a good thing to do! Thank you! They have an entire box that they haven't started using yet. The other hive, being much larger, is already using the super but the weaker one hasn't touched it. I'll be sure to take it off tomorrow!
> I also saw traps online. Does anyone have any experience with Cutts beetle blaster? Does it work?


If you have a box they aren't using, definitely take it off. The beetles will lay eggs in the comb cells, but if you have enough bees they carry out the eggs as soon as the beetles lay them. That is why it is important to crowd them, so you don't have so much comb that you don't have enough bees to police all of it. I also sprinkle salt all around and under my hives. It helps kill the beetle larvae as they exit the hive to burry in the ground where they develop into a beetle.


----------



## NewJoe (Jul 1, 2012)

definitely go through the hives and remove any comb that is not being used. If you have not crowded for winter, now is the time to do it. I would reduce them to the smallest amount of comb they will fit on even if it means going to a NUC box (with a shallow NUC box on top). Give them just enough room for the brood nest and whatever frames that have stores on them. If you find frames that have almost no stores on them, put those above the inner cover and feed it back to them and then take all the empty comb and freeze it...no extra space at all. take the time and energy to kill every hive beetle you see. Then put at least one trap in each hive.

This year has been bad in NC for hive beetles. I am not sure if it was all the early rain, or what lead to them, but they are bad....even in thriving hives this year it is not unusual to see a couple of beetles in there.

You said it has been a couple of months since you were in the hives...that tells me that you must have left them a bunch of unused space.....which in turn led to the beetles getting a strong foothold. If the beetles are not sliming honey already, you have time to fix it but you need to move fast!!! Try to keep the extra space to a minimum during the year....especially after the spring flow. You want them to have room to expand all through the spring and summer and early fall...just not a lot of extra space.

Good luck


----------



## RudyT (Jan 25, 2012)

One tip I don't think was mentioned -- if you remove comb, it could have SMB or wax moth eggs or be attacked. So you might want to freeze it for 2 days or more at zero degrees. OR at a minimum keep a close daily watch on it. Beetles and/or wax moths can destroy comb in a few days if left in a nice dark place. 

There are other great online sources available. Jaime Ellis video, a 20 page PDF sorry I forget author, and some write ups by Freeman, the inventor of the Freeman Beetle trap (a bottom oil trap)


----------



## mdax (Apr 29, 2013)

I live in SHB central. I use a screened bottom board with oil trap, SHB trap/drone frame near brood and beetle traps in the top super. This type of attack would take too much time/money with a bunch of hives though...


----------



## Bill91143 (Jun 7, 2013)

FYI, a week ago I checked my hives and had two that had way more beetles than my other 18 hives. These two are in a different location from the others, so that could be the reason. However I checked these hives and they were about as crowded as I can safely crowd them. So I killed what beetles I could and sprinkled salt all around them. One hive had a solid bottom board so just for the heck of it I sprinkled salt all over the inside of the bottom board. The other hive had a screen bottom so I left it alone. This morning I went back into those two hives to see if the bees were winning or the beetles were. I found only 6 or 7 beetles in the hive with the solid bottom board, but in the screened bottom board hive there was still as many beetles, if not more than at inspection last week. I decided to change that hive to a solid bottom board and sprinkled it with salt. I'm not saying the salt in the one hive had anything to do with the drastic reduction in beetles, but I did change the other one to see if I get the same results, and if it works again then I may think the salt is helping.


----------



## Crsswift70 (Sep 9, 2013)

How does salt affect the bees? Won't they try to clean it out of the hive? I am also curious about the thinking behind a screened bottom board aiding or hindering in HB control. I thought it was mainly used for ventilation and mite control.


----------



## Belewsboy (Jun 6, 2012)

I used to freak out whenever I saw SHB in my hive. But as long as the hive is strong, they never get a foothold. Now I don't worry about the few I see...but I do squash them with my hive tool every chance I get. Also you need to make sure your hives are in FULL sun. This, as much as anything, will help to control the beetle population. Use traps to cut the population as well and remove a frame or two as mentioned above. SHB are a way of life in this area. You just have to keep an eye on them and take action if their population grows.
As far as screened bottom boards are concerned, I have always used them. Yes, I guess a beetle can enter the hive thru the screen, but I have stood and watched beetles fly straight into the main entrance without any problem...the bees don't even try to stop them. So having a screened bottom is of little consequence as an entry point.


----------



## Bill91143 (Jun 7, 2013)

Crsswift70 said:


> How does salt affect the bees? Won't they try to clean it out of the hive? I am also curious about the thinking behind a screened bottom board aiding or hindering in HB control. I thought it was mainly used for ventilation and mite control.


I have been told that salt actually kills the beetle larvae when they come in contact with it. That is why it is recommended to sprinkle salt all around and under hives so that when the larvae come out of the hive they fall in the salt and it kills them. I am not saying and did not intend to give the impression that salt in the hive helped slow down the beetles. I was merely stating that as an experiment I sprinkled salt on the bottom board of the one hive that had a solid bottom board and on the one hive that had the screened bottom I couldn't sprinkle salt because the salt would fall through. The bees had carried about half of the salt out of the one hive but it had almost no beetles and the other hive which I couldn't sprinkle salt in still had a hundred or two beetles in it. It could be, and probably is just a coincidence, but I changed the other hive to a solid bottom board so I could sprinkle it with salt and I will check it again in a week and see what the results are. Again I was just telling what I found in checking both hives again today. The salt may have had nothing to do with that hive having gone from 100+ beetles to 6or 7 in one week, but something drastically reduced the number of beetles in it while the other hive is still full of beetles.


----------



## Robbin (May 26, 2013)

SBB don't help at all with SHB UNLESS there is an Oil tray under it. SHB that fall thru the screen, don't come back if there is an oil tray under it. SBB by themselves help with ventilation and reducing mites as mites that fall to the ground don’t make it back to the hive. If you put a dry board under the screen you will get a bunch of mites crawling around. With a SBB they aren’t still inside the hive where they can get on another bee.


----------



## rweaver7777 (Oct 17, 2012)

Bill91143 said:


> I have been told that salt actually kills the beetle larvae when they come in contact with it. That is why it is recommended to sprinkle salt all around and under hives so that when the larvae come out of the hive they fall in the salt and it kills them. I am not saying and did not intend to give the impression that salt in the hive helped slow down the beetles. I was merely stating that as an experiment I sprinkled salt on the bottom board of the one hive that had a solid bottom board and on the one hive that had the screened bottom I couldn't sprinkle salt because the salt would fall through. The bees had carried about half of the salt out of the one hive but it had almost no beetles and the other hive which I couldn't sprinkle salt in still had a hundred or two beetles in it. It could be, and probably is just a coincidence, but I changed the other hive to a solid bottom board so I could sprinkle it with salt and I will check it again in a week and see what the results are. Again I was just telling what I found in checking both hives again today. The salt may have had nothing to do with that hive having gone from 100+ beetles to 6or 7 in one week, but something drastically reduced the number of beetles in it while the other hive is still full of beetles.


If larva hit the bottom board and are killed, then they came from eggs laid on your frames that they subsequently ate through and pooped in. If there are larva in your hive, it means that it is weak and is well on its way downhill. Their poop makes the honey ferment and seep from the frames. Bees will abandon the affected area which makes matters worse. The larval infestation expands just like the Allied front lines did in Europe after D-Day. An inexorable march to bee defeat.

If you are treating for larva within the hive, you're too late and wasting time on the wrong thing. Keep the adult beetles in check with a strong hive that will clean the beetle eggs out as they are laid (as was said before). A screened bottom board with oil trap underneath will definitely assist. The only adult beetle control methodology to date are physical countermeasures like that - there is no chemical so far that will target the beetle that won't also target the bees or tarnish the honey.


----------



## Bill91143 (Jun 7, 2013)

Gosh I never intended to cause so much controversy. All I was trying to do is say that for some reason a bunch of beetles left one hive and they didn't leave the other. I was just telling what I had done differently between the two hives. I don't want a lecture on beetles. I already know what you are saying. What I would like to know is why one hive has rid itself of most of its beetles and the other has not. Both hives are about the same strength and they are in the same location.


----------



## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

> there is no chemical so far that will target the beetle that won't also target the bees or tarnish the honey.

Check-Mite+ is labeled for both varroa control AND _adult small hive beetle _control. 



> *For beetle infestation: just lay them in.*
> 
> Using CheckMite+ strips to control beetle infestation is similar to the method employed for Varroa mite control, but there are important differences. Prior to use, remove the honey combs and only reinsert them 14 days after the strips have been removed. Cut a strip into two halves and stick these to a piece of cardboard. Place this on the middle of the floor board and attach it with adhesive tape so that the bees cannot eat it or remove it. The strips should be facing downwards. Leave this in the hive for a minimum of 42 days and a maximum of 45 days. The timing of the treatment is the same: prior to initial honey flow in the spring and following the last honey harvest in the autumn. Do not treat the hives more than four times per year for beetle infestation and do not use the strips when the bees are producing surplus honey.
> 
> http://www.animalhealth.bayer.com/3424.0.html



Note that the application instructions quoted above for SHB control preclude the bees from contact with the product, and that application should be made after the last honey is harvested.

I have no experience with this product, and cannot attest as to its effectiveness, but it is labeled for SHB control. I have seen some posts that suggest its effectiveness for _mite _control is not as effective as it was earlier in the product life.


----------



## Honey Hive Farms (Nov 1, 2012)

Hive beetles come from a couple of things: 1. not a strong hive, 2. could be in the shade to much, 3. Possibly to much moisture.
Our opinion is to put your bees in a nuc so they have less room and freeze the frames that do not have larva, eggs or brood and then let the bees regroup then after the numbers go up then move them back into a larger hive. This also depends on you area, if it will be getting cold soon, you may want to combined them with another hive and get rid of the weaker or the older queen. Note: Make sure you know what your doing if you going to merge two hives together. Our farm is in Missouri and we work hard this time of the year to get them ready for winter.
Let us know if we can help, email us at [email protected] or visit our site at www.HoneyHiveFarms.com
Tim


----------

