# plywood tops and bottoms



## GaryG74 (Apr 9, 2014)

I have several solid bottom boards made from exterior grade 3/4" plywood with 3/4" strips around the sides and back. They have one coat primer and two coats exterior latex paint on them. Only one or two have had issues with de-laminating. I use them mainly for hiving swarms until I can get them settled, then I switch to screened bottom boards so I can monitor for mites (swarms don't seem to like screened bottom boards--too much light, in my experience). The 2"x2" would work if you put concrete blocks under them. I agree that 2"x4" would be better if setting on the ground. I would paint the treated 2"x4" boards too, to keep carpenter bees from boring into them. The CBs bore into un-painted treated wood here, so I paint my treated hive stands.


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## JWChesnut (Jul 31, 2013)

I build tops and bottoms at 16 1/4 x 23" with identical 2 x 2 cleats. I use the bottoms with boxes with a single borehole entrance -- these are "super nucs". The cleats face up on the bottom. The filled box can be sold and transported by screening the borehole. A borehole entrance for a starter hive reduces rob-out.

Making tops and bottoms completely identical reduces inventory and construction cost for boxes that are sold to customers. Many of these "super nucs" are medium depth boxes- where 8 frames of comb area are equal to 5 deeps. The boxes can be simply placed on the customers full-sized hardware -- without "complicated" frame moving to install. This is ideal for the newbie hobby beeks. "Just plop it on top" is the sum total of the installation instructions.

Plywood warps terribly. With light cleats it will pull to the outside when used as a top. Floor underlayment or the pricey Avantec are more stable. You can stabilize ply by rimming all four sides -- but the advantage of a migratory top design is lost with that reinforcement. 

The warp up of the tops when constructed as a migratory out of ply opens a poorly defended upper entrance that lead to robbing issues -- the warp is dynamic and the bees have trouble closing the gap.

Tops from funky OSB with end cleats work. I have a huge stack of these -- drilled to accept mason jar feeders. When I stop feeding, I put on winter competent solid tops.


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## RichardsonTX (Jul 3, 2011)

Stinger........I haven't been beekeeping near as long as most folks in here and have actually mostly taken off from active beekeeping but one thing I did learn in my first year is to that making good, very detailed, decisions on how you want to build your equipment is very, very important from a cost stand point and if you want it to all work as a system. Where you are located and how you'll use your equipment will be things to consider. For example, if you will be moving your equipment around you might want to consider migratory lids and where you are located I don't think that would be a problem. But, if you are going to keep hives in an area where they'll have melting snow on top of them and you aren't moving them then you might want to use a telescopic lid to keep water from seeping in at the sides. A telescopic lid is best for protection. If you use migratory lids because of transportation reasons you want to make sure they work in combination with the bottom board in such a way that the bottom boards and lids all touch if you have your hives lined up tightly one in front of the other. Some migratory beeks use just a piece of 3/4" plywood cut the size of the hive body and that's all. Their hive body also fits on a pallet that is set up to serve as the bottom board too. 

Whatever you do I really recommend thinking long term about all your beekeeping equipment and making sure it fits in with a long term plan. And paint your boxes with one more coat of paint than you think you'll need. It's worth it to do from the start. 

Oh yeah, for bottom boards, I use 1x12 #2 SYP (Probably Fir or Spruce, in your case) boards nailed to 2x4 #3 SYP and a 3/4" scrap rim. Cheap, quick, and easy to build. Just paint it good and use sacrificial material for it to sit on.

Also, if you use plywood for the lid make sure to use MDO plywood. Don't use anything else. It's worth it. As always........paint it good.


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## shannonswyatt (May 7, 2012)

I've been testing Advantec like JW mentioned in his post above, I even made some boxes out of it. It doesn't take paint very well, I primed it with an oil based primer. It started flaking off within a few weeks. On the other hand so far it has held up very well. I'm going to stick with it for all my tops and bottoms. It is pretty heavy, so my tops really don't need to have a weight on them to keep them in place.


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## timgoodin (Mar 10, 2007)

StingerMcStung said:


> On bottom PT 2"x2" to keep it off the ground (still pondering PT 2x4's here) with a 3/4"x3/4" rim 3 sides for body/opening.


I built some screened bottom boards from PT 2X4" a few years ago, the full 2X4" are pretty heavy. I also ripped some 2X4 to 2X2 and love these screened bottom boards, light weight, serve the same purpose as the heavy ones. Plus the wood goes twice as far. I would recommend the 2X2"


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## StingerMcStung (Apr 27, 2015)

Very helpful, thank you all.


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

I just use 3/4 exterior grade plywood cut to exact box dimensions and only paint one side. The bottom gets 3/4 in shims stapled on 3 sides. The top just lays one with a brick or a couple of bricks if they start to warp. The bees glue them down and there is no problems with gaps. in a pinch I have use 1/2 and eve 1/4 in for tops and they warp rapidly.


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

I have used Advantech for tops and bottoms for hives and nuc's and painted the outside surfaces with latex paint without a problem, I used to use ply before but had problems with warping even with cleats.
Johno


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## shannonswyatt (May 7, 2012)

John, how did you prep the advantech? I read that it required an oil based primer. I used oil primer in a spray can (Kilz)


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Shannon I just prime with Kilz latex then follow up a few hours later with an exterior latex that I get from Ace hardware oops bin for $5.00 per gallon. I have had some stuff out for 2 years now and have no warping or other problems.
Johno


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## shannonswyatt (May 7, 2012)

I'm not having problems with the Advantech other then getting it to hold paint. I think I will try Kilz latex next time. The primer is what is pealing off, and taking the top coat.


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## jwcarlson (Feb 14, 2014)

shannonswyatt said:


> The primer is what is pealing off, and taking the top coat.


Well it would be pretty special top coat if you could get it to penetrate the primer and hold it down on the surface it is trying to flake off of. 

I keep wanting to pick up a sheet of Advantech, but I haven't even called the semi-local supplier that keeps it in stock. I might like to make some DCoates style nucs out of it to see if I can keep them from warping. About how much does it run for a 4'x8' sheet?


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## shannonswyatt (May 7, 2012)

I think that Johno is saying that he used plain laytex primer, whereas I used an oil based primer. It really isn't necessary, the stuff seems to shed water. 

I got a sheet at Lowes, I don't remember the cost other than it cost more than other stuff. And it is heavy.


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## texanbelchers (Aug 4, 2014)

I just cut, assembled and primed 12 8-frame migratory tops. I used Zinsser oil based primer; we'll see how it does. Huber also specs Polyurethane glue, so I used original Gorilla. Latex top coats are next. It's probably overkill; others are using the product without any paint and not adding cleats.

I purchased it for about $31 a sheet. They make a 7/16" zip system panel (same stuff with a vapor barrier), but the thinnest sheathing is 1/2".

It is very dense stuff. 1 1/2" 1/4" crown SS staples were not always penetrating completely. They recommend screwing for proper flooring jobs.


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## shannonswyatt (May 7, 2012)

I ran into the same thing with staples. I glued it though and I may have used some long finish nails


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## BEES4U (Oct 10, 2007)

16-1/4" X 21-1/2" ( Can make some nice 8F bottoms and or covers.

Regards,
Ernie


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## PAHunter62 (Jan 26, 2011)

John Pluta posted a YouTube video on making combo top/bottom boards with pressure treated plywood ... I'm thinking of making up a bunch of these for my custom 6 frame medium NUCs.

https://youtu.be/Hnt4Gb_c7aw


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## AAIndigo (Jun 14, 2015)

Pressure treated plywood will warp.
I just made a few nucs and top covers with 1/2" MDO. This is a dense plywood with a paper face used by sign companies. You can get it at a lumber yard. Comes in 1/2 and 3/4". I used cleats on my top covers, glued and screwed. I sunk the heads and used car bondo. Sanded and painted.

Nice looking stuff. Time will tell


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## j.kuder (Dec 5, 2010)

AAIndigo said:


> Pressure treated plywood will warp.
> I just made a few nucs and top covers with 1/2" MDO. This is a dense plywood with a paper face used by sign companies. You can get it at a lumber yard. Comes in 1/2 and 3/4". I used cleats on my top covers, glued and screwed. I sunk the heads and used car bondo. Sanded and painted.
> 
> Nice looking stuff. Time will tell


 I had been in the sign business for 35 years and used mdo(medium density overlayed) ply. for all my tops and bottoms. double face is better single face warps. don't buy preprimed their primer sucks use good oil base primer and soak the edges.


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## jwcarlson (Feb 14, 2014)

PAHunter62 said:


> John Pluta posted a YouTube video on making combo top/bottom boards with pressure treated plywood ... I'm thinking of making up a bunch of these for my custom 6 frame medium NUCs.
> 
> https://youtu.be/Hnt4Gb_c7aw


I've been kicking that idea around... but don't the rails cause pooling and puddling on the top?


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## shannonswyatt (May 7, 2012)

If the hive is tilted it should have much puddling.


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## texanbelchers (Aug 4, 2014)

jwcarlson said:


> I've been kicking that idea around... but don't the rails cause pooling and puddling on the top?


Put the rails down which provides a top entrance and a flat top. You can use the same entrance reducers or make full blocking strips, if you want.


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