# Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hives)



## Allan S. Christensen (Apr 14, 2015)

*Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hives)*

Thought it might be of some interest:

http://www.fromfilmerstofarmers.com/blog/2015/april/dont-go-with-the-flow-go-with-the-wax


----------



## JRG13 (May 11, 2012)

*Re: Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hi*

Nothing was really interesting about that.


----------



## beeware10 (Jul 25, 2010)

*Re: Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hi*

just selling a book.


----------



## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

*Re: Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hi*

A well written, highly distorted reality, of beekeeping and the challenges the industry faces.

I would like to see the movement and setup of top bar hives to pollinate almonds, oranges, pumpkins, and all the other vine crops, so necessary to the continued existence of mankind. 

Does anyone really believe top bar hives can supply the approximately 300 million pounds of honey consumed in the U.S. each year. And I am not talking about just honey and biscuits, but the multitude of uses of honey in our everyday lives.

In my opinion, and that is all it is, "my opinion". (your's may be different), top bar hives do have a place in modern beekeeping, but, it is not in the world of serious honey production or pollination. It is a labor intensive, hobby, individual, attempt at beekeeping.

Time will disclose if the Flow Hive is a success or not. Don't hold your breath until the top bar hive replaces modern beekeeping.

cchoganjr


----------



## Allan S. Christensen (Apr 14, 2015)

*Re: Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hi*



Cleo C. Hogan Jr said:


> A well written, highly distorted reality, of beekeeping and the challenges the industry faces.
> 
> I would like to see the movement and setup of top bar hives to pollinate almonds, oranges, pumpkins, and all the other vine crops, so necessary to the continued existence of mankind.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that (and for not thinking that I'm simply trying to sell a book).

You're right that top bar beekeeping is "a labor intensive, hobby, individual, attempt at beekeeping," but to a certain degree, so would the Flow™ hive be as its expense means it isn't going to get used for large-scale ventures either.

Where I would differ with your comment is in thinking that we need to figure out how to pollinate all the almonds, etc., with top bar hives, or that we need all the honey we currently produce. That is all based on a massive industry subsidized with cheap fossil fuels, and so localized farming (and small-scale, localized beekeeping) will end up becoming more of a reality whether we like it or not, due to diminishing supplies of fuel (peak oil). But that's a whole other topic, and I don't think it's my place to go on harping about that here.

Cheers,

Allan


----------



## Ravenseye (Apr 2, 2006)

*Re: Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hi*



Allan S. Christensen said:


> Thanks for that (and for not thinking that I'm simply trying to sell a book).
> 
> You're right that top bar beekeeping is "a labor intensive, hobby, individual, attempt at beekeeping," but to a certain degree, so would the Flow™ hive be as its expense means it isn't going to get used for large-scale ventures either.
> 
> ...


I've moved this entire thread to the Top Bar Hive forum because a) it's really about Top Bar Hives and b) we already have a forum area to discuss the Flow Hive. It's a good discussion but it belongs here.


----------



## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

*Re: Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hi*

Allan... You are certainly right. 

I also see the Flow Hive as having huge problems, but, it is new and different. Guess time will tell. I am willing to give it a chance. 

Unless and until, we can figure out some way to dramatically increase the number of feral colonies in the world, we will need to provide managed pollinators and honey producers. I don't envision the world changing their demand for honey, or the absolute need for pollinators for certain food and non food crops in the near future. 

cchoganjr


----------



## djjmc (Feb 6, 2015)

*Re: Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hi*



Cleo C. Hogan Jr said:


> A well written, highly distorted reality, of beekeeping and the challenges the industry faces.
> 
> I would like to see the movement and setup of top bar hives to pollinate almonds, oranges, pumpkins, and all the other vine crops, so necessary to the continued existence of mankind.
> 
> ...


Agreed.


----------



## Colino (May 28, 2013)

*Re: Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hi*



Cleo C. Hogan Jr said:


> A well written, highly distorted reality, of beekeeping and the challenges the industry faces.
> 
> I would like to see the movement and setup of top bar hives to pollinate almonds, oranges, pumpkins, and all the other vine crops, so necessary to the continued existence of mankind.
> 
> ...


:thumbsup:
I believe that when Cleo C. Hogan Jr talks people should listen.


----------



## Apismellifera (Oct 12, 2014)

*Re: Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hi*



Cleo C. Hogan Jr said:


> Unless and until, we can figure out some way to dramatically increase the number of feral colonies in the world, we will need to provide managed pollinators and honey producers. I don't envision the world changing their demand for honey, or the absolute need for pollinators for certain food and non food crops in the near future.
> cchoganjr


The problem is one of monoculture. Vast deserts for bees have been created with single cropping over large areas. Until that changes, the importation of pollinators will continue, I guess.

Breaks my heart. There's a reason for hedgerows.


----------



## Dawnrellim (Sep 20, 2014)

*Re: Don't Go With the Flow, Go With the Wax (comparison of the Flow hive & top bar hi*

I think that the flow hive is a neat concept however I am greatly concerned about the plastic mechanism that is used to store the honey. Many plastics today are very harmful to humans, so harmful that they disrupt the endocrine system in extreme cases leading to breast, prostate and uterine cancer. Now if these plastic are affecting humans so greatly I cannot even imagine what it would do to a tiny honey bee. Also I looked to see if the plastics used in the flow hive were of the safer variety and didnt find anything that was reassuring. If it were BPA, PVC or phalate free it would be labeled as such for it would be a selling point. Correct me if I am wrong but when I was looking into the flow hive I didnt see any "safe plastics". I also think that top bar hives are much better for the bees than langstroth hives. Mainly because they are more natural to the honey bee. Today being more nautral and "creature friendly" is what many people are striving for. I wouldnt be concerned about top bar hives not being able to pollinate monsanto's round up ready soy and apple farms because many consumers are buying only organic and local produce. People dont want to buy honey in grocery store any longer they want to support their local honey bee colonies. Change is comming and its headed towards an all organic and local food. Why do you think General Mills recenly bought Annies Homegrown. And as for the book The Thinking Beekeeper it is an excellent book and I would rather have new and aspiring beekeepers buying that book than Kim Flottums, The Backyard Beekeeper who apparently is buddy-buddy with Monsanto and has been bought over.


----------

