# no capped honey in either tbh. we are in trouble



## coffeedad (Apr 10, 2012)

I just remembered i did find both queens the one queen was on brood comb and the other queen was in the front of the hive walking around on a comb with uncapped honey in it. why would she be there?


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## fin (Jun 3, 2012)

My first year top-bar had almost no stores 3 weeks ago the adjacent Langsroth hives had some but not a lot.
I guess they used all their resources making comb and bees. I fed them by putting a Boardman feeder inside the hive(it was slightly raised w 2 1/2 inch strips of wood after i saw beetles hiding under the feeder). 2 weeks of that and it looked much better.


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## brettj777 (Feb 27, 2013)

I am in a similar spot with one of my top are hives I plan to feed sugar in a 2 to 1 ratio until it gets too cold this fall.


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## coffeedad (Apr 10, 2012)

Maybe the bees don't have capped honey yet. How many capped honey combs do you have ?? maybe they will rapidly make and cap the next month ?? I'm thinking of putting bottom boards on with the cooler nights. this may help regulate temps within the hive and ease up the workload of making heat for the hive.


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## chr157y (Feb 14, 2013)

Coffeedad - I'm right near you. I started feeding heavily. I have a HUGE party bowl, like a huge chip bowl. I fill it to the top with 2:1 and the bees have been guzzling it down quickly. There are tons of sticks floating in the top. After 2 bowls full of sugar water, they have built out some new comb and there's of syrup drying out. I also have a comb of drone brood. This morning I saw all the drones on the bottom of the hive floor. I can't find any info about it.... Wondering if it's the beginning of eviction or a swarm??


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## coffeedad (Apr 10, 2012)

I'm going to start feeding again today. i made up some sugar water this morning and its cooled down now. I hope they put it to good use. down to the hive i go. I bought some poultry feeders at tractor supply they work great. I float a few pine bark pieces in the trough to keep the drowning to a minimum.


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## chr157y (Feb 14, 2013)

Not sure where you buy sugar, but Costco has it for less than $20 for 50 lbs. So much cheaper than 5 lb bags at Giant. I hear Aldi is cheap too, but the bags are smaller.


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## flhultra (Jun 14, 2013)

Coffeedad are you using poultry waters ?
be careful of the hole that lets the water out, I tried it and used pea gravel to completely cover and fill the bottom of the bowl. 
it worked great a couple of times, then I found they had pushed most of the rocks out.
2 inches of dead bees in a quart jar is not a happy sight.


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## coffeedad (Apr 10, 2012)

I had a similar problem with hungry bees inside the container when i would go to fill them. i had some screen door material so i hot glued it to the hole. this solved the problem.


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## Tango Yankee (Mar 15, 2013)

Coffeedad,

I'm in southern Ohio and have the same issue regarding a lack of honey stores in our two TBHs, also first year. According to a newsletter from the local association we belong to it seems that most everyone is seeing a lack of honey stores at this time.

Regards,
Tom


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## Ennui (Jun 6, 2013)

I'm in SE PA also and I have very little capped honey. However Goldrenrod flow is still going here and the hives are packed with nectar with several bars looking close to getting capped.

I'll check the hives after the Goldenrod flow ends and see if I need to feed them at that point. The nights may be getting cooler, but many of the days are still 90°F.


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

coffeedad said:


> I had a similar problem with hungry bees inside the container when i would go to fill them. i had some screen door material so i hot glued it to the hole. this solved the problem.


yip I use plastic cross stitch material that I hot glued over the hole, I also cut out some in a donut shape to fit in the trough, it floats on the syrup and you can feed a crap ton of bees in a short amount of time, I one gal water trough will last 20-30 min after they get used to going to it every day.


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

chr157y said:


> Not sure where you buy sugar, but Costco has it for less than $20 for 50 lbs. So much cheaper than 5 lb bags at Giant. I hear Aldi is cheap too, but the bags are smaller.


 Ruler foods 4 lb bags $0.79 / bag


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## bkristanne (Sep 25, 2013)

I am also in a capped honey shortage. My bees struggled early this season with losing a queen, so I think that put them behind. They have been doing great the last two months, but I'm worried about how to feed them through the winter. I have been giving them sugar water 2:1, as well as half of a pollen patty. They were throwing out brood and they only thing I came up with was a food shortage. I haven't seen it since I feed them the patty. 

I've read that giving them honey in a shortage is good??? What do you guys think?


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## coffeedad (Apr 10, 2012)

Honey is ok is you know where it came from. i would worry about contaminants. I'm going to frame out a follower board and pour a fondant block for each end of the hive insulate well and hope for the best.
dave


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## bkristanne (Sep 25, 2013)

I am definitely going to be doing fondant boards... I never occurred to me to do it on each end of hive. Great idea! When do you think they should be put in the hive? The bees might, and I mean MIGHT have two top bars with honey as of now. 

Do you have a recipe for fondant that I can use or a link to one? I've read where people have had them turn to mush and I don't know if this is the recipe or just the timing of when they were placed in hive. Thanks!


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## coffeedad (Apr 10, 2012)

Hopefully someone knowing more than me might chime in as i'm a first year beek. i'm going to make fondant from http://www.bamboohollow.com/fondant-recipe.php i'm going to increase temps a little to make fondant harder and add bee-pro to the mix. I've read about it melting to a goo and hope that maybe that happens more with langs but i'm not sure. another idea i had was to cut a slit the length of a top bar that a bee could get through and place a fondant block above the bars (in the attic) in a container. this might move the bees from the comb and away from brood. i need to read more about it and visit a top bar aviary.


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## bkristanne (Sep 25, 2013)

Wonderful! Thank you!


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## WBVC (Apr 25, 2013)

I am anew beek..is there an issue with uncapped honey? Can't they eat uncapped honey or cap it if they feel it is of a desirable moisture content to do so?


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## Tango Yankee (Mar 15, 2013)

WBVC,

This is my first year as a beekeeper as well. The issue isn't that the honey is uncapped, the issue is that capped honey is the colony's stock for surviving the winter. No capped honey, no bees come spring. It's been a big concern this year, at least in the club we belong to. The summer wasn't very good for honey in our area. We're feeding in the hopes that will help them build up enough stores to survive on.

Regards,
Tom


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## WBVC (Apr 25, 2013)

Sorry...can't the bees utilize uncapped honey? Is there risk of it fermenting at low temperatures? Won't they simply cap it if/ when it is ready or use as is?


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## Tango Yankee (Mar 15, 2013)

Uncapped honey is (and if I'm wrong, someone will correct me) isn't actually honey yet--it's processed nectar that is being dehydrated to lower the moisture content before capping. Yes, I'm sure they can use it but the thing is that the bees process the nectar and work on making it into honey that can be capped as it comes in if there is enough coming in to be able to build up stores. Will uncapped honey (nectar) go bad? Yes, I'm sure it can. Consider the capping to be akin to humans canning food. Until we put the lid on and go through the sealing process the food is vulnerable. It's not considered part of the winter stores until the process has been completed. 

Capped honey is food for the bees that they don't currently need to use--a surplus. If you don't have capped honey, it means there hasn't been a surplus of nectar--the bees have been using most of the nectar as it comes in. Just like with humans and canning food (before there were grocery stores and the means to ship in food from all over the world) not having enough of a crop to create a surplus for canning or capping means the likelihood of surviving winter (depending on where you are and what winter is like) will be low.

Regards,
Tom


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## coffeedad (Apr 10, 2012)

i'm told they can and will eat uncapped honey, i just wonder if it will ferment over winter or if cool temps. will inhibit fermentation.


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## oldreliable (Jan 29, 2011)

many here in Indiana are talking about little or no winter stores..flows were minimal this year and bees have to eat too. They consumed and fed to young what they brought in. One problem we have when feeding later in the year is they may not get it dried and capped well..going into winter with wet stores can cause humidity and moisture..so I have been told???


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## coffeedad (Apr 10, 2012)

finally my bees are getting things together. there is about 10 bars capped honey per hive. i guess the damp summer kept the honey from curing. i'm feeding now to add more stores to the hive. hopefully they will be ok for the winter. i will insulate and do a wind break in the near future. it was 41 here this morning. winter is coming


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## chr157y (Feb 14, 2013)

coffeedad said:


> finally my bees are getting things together. there is about 10 bars capped honey per hive. i guess the damp summer kept the honey from curing. i'm feeding now to add more stores to the hive. hopefully they will be ok for the winter. i will insulate and do a wind break in the near future. it was 41 here this morning. winter is coming


Are you using hay bales for a wind break? I'm thinking I should probably do that. 

When do you plan to stop feeding syrup and "winterize"? I put in the last bowl of syrup today. I blocked off 1 entrance, but they still have two more. I also bought pink foam insulation today. I'm going to put in the candy board and follower boards, foam insulation, and reduce entrance to 1 hole next weekend. Temps have been crazy here in SE PA. I'm wondering if it is finally going to stay cold.


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## Stan1951 (Apr 9, 2013)

What is a comfortable number of bars of honey that they bees need to make it through the winter. I'm a first year TBH beekeeper and my bees have 10 to 12 bars of capped honey going into mid-Fall here. I don't see any more nectar available this year but they're still hauling in pollen.


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