# How is the best way to spot the queen?



## mailmam (May 8, 2014)

I have a hive that isn't doing much, I see some capped drone brood but that is all and I'm concerned that I don't have a queen. This morning I pulled out all the bars and looked but the bees are covering the comb. Should I gently brush the bees off to get a good look? Any other suggestions? Thanks in advance.


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## BooneCtyBeek (Jun 20, 2011)

I don't look specifically for the queen. I scan for movement. She moves differently on the frame than the other bees. This suggestion comes from looking at a lot of frames in a lot of hives over a bunch of years.

And then again, she can be anywhere. I opened a hive this week and there she was on the top of the inner cover! Yes, she will walk on honey, too. I've seen her on a honey frame. But these are exceptions rather than the rule.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Some will only look for the eggs/larvae.
But when the hive is recently queen less you cannot see any difference.
Some will mark the queen for better identification on a hive check.


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## dtrooster (Apr 4, 2016)

Good luck. One hive I've only seen the queen once, she was racing like a form1 car for whatever side of the frame I wasn't looking at. She was pretty tiger stripe from what I remember. Now once I see young larvae or eggs and have checked whatever else I wanted to see I close up and don't bother. The newer hive has a chocolate colored one that couldnt care less, just does her thing. Have seen her every time just mosying along


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## MariahK (Dec 28, 2014)

I don't really look for her I get to the frames with eggs and let my eyes wander and look for the way she moves and the way they move around her. It usually the wierd circle thing the workers do around her that catches my eyes


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## mailmam (May 8, 2014)

Thanks for the great picture, I looked on some websites that had pictures of queens but there were so far away I couldn't tell her from the other bees. I'm anxious to take what I learned here tonight and put it into practice tomorrow.


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## gww (Feb 14, 2015)

I read an old book and the writer said he used an empty super and moved the combs to it one at a time looking at just one side of the frame and then transfered them back looking at the other side and that the queen did not like sunlight and would run around to the dark side. I think it is a free book writen by doolittle. My spelling might mess you up on a search but good luck.
gww


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## dynemd (Aug 27, 2013)

This section of Michael Bush's website has always served me well through my queen locating struggles http://www.bushfarms.com/beesqueenspotting.htm
Especially this part:
Believe There is a Queen
Also, mental attitude makes a difference when trying to find anything from your car keys to hunting deer to finding a queen. As long as you are doing cursory looks thinking it won't be there you won't find it. You have to believe that the keys, or the deer or the queen IS there. That you are looking right at it and you just have to see it. And then suddenly you do. You have to convince yourself that it is there and convince yourself that you will find it. I don't know how to explain it well enough, but you have to learn to think like that.


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## mgolden (Oct 26, 2011)

Take hive apart and place them as singles. Put a cover cloth on each super. You can usually tell which supers do not contain the queen as they get a noticeable roar and fanning happening

Use a cover cloth and flip it back one frame at a time to expose the next frame to be removed. Keeps light out and queen less likely to keep moving back in hive to next frame.

After removing the first frame in position 1, use your hive tool to pry frame 10 away from back wall so it is more difficult for queen to move on to back wall of super if she moves all the way to last frame.

Work smoothly when loosening frames to remove. Vibration will cause her to keep moving on to next frame.

Do a thorough exam of each frame but don't take too long. Too slow just gives queen more time to move to next frame.

Some queens can be tough to find and you may need to come back to look tomorrow,


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## mailmam (May 8, 2014)

I am not working with langs, this is the topbar forum.


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## mgolden (Oct 26, 2011)

Sorry however the techniques to searching for the queen are universal.

And one more. Locate the queen when the hive is small such as a NUC or a few week old package and mark her. Queen is much easier to spot when bee numbers are small and much easier to spot later on when bee numbers gets bigger.


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## gww (Feb 14, 2015)

Mailman


> I am not working with langs, this is the topbar forum.


I have been making this mistake because I always go to the todays post to look at current threads and not to spicific forum topics. If it is any consulation, I like looking at the top bar stuff also. I have two long langs built that are not filled yet, I guess that is somewhere in between. No harm, no foul, just trying to help where I can with not very much to offer. Sorry if it was a sidetrack.
Good luck
gww


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## Rydalch (Mar 29, 2016)

It IS really hard to spot the queen sometimes. I thought I was pretty good at it when I first had my new package because I could spot her every time, then the colony grew! Now I can't find her! Can you see the queen in the picture I attached? This was one month after I installed my new package.


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## mailmam (May 8, 2014)

Yes! I wish mine was that easy!! Perhaps, with practice??


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## Rydalch (Mar 29, 2016)

Practice does help I'm sure...But it's dang hard to find her now that the hive is full of bees!


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## Nordak (Jun 17, 2016)

mailmam said:


> I am not working with langs, this is the topbar forum.


If you don't already have them, you should make some 5-8 bar tbh nucs even if you're not utilizing them as such. On a strong hive, sometimes finding the queen is easier by seperating portions of the brood nest. Much like gww's advice, only replace super with tbh nuc.


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## buffaloeletric (Mar 11, 2010)

When I first got my package and the queen was released I went through the eight bars I had at least 5 times a piece and couldn't find her. She was a marked queen. I thought for sure she had been balled and the body had been taken. I even called the company I got her from to see if they would replace her. I have went through my uncles bees with him several times and could spot unmarked queens pretty quickly so it wasn't just a rookie thing. I waited two more days before placing the order for another queen and checked once more time for good measure. Sure enough, there she was, plain as day.


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## ChuckReburn (Dec 17, 2013)

The top bar gives you space to divide and conquer, you don't need a spare box. 

It's mostly movement I'm looking for and the obviously elongated abdomen. One technique that is helpful is to pull a frame and look ahead at the face of the next comb before examining the one in your hand (queens will often run ahead of you. staying out of the light).

Seeing eggs / young larvae is good enough unless you intend to remove the queen, or remove frames with attached bees and no queen.

Practice is the answer. I find the dark and tiger striped queens harder to find than the yellow ones.


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## Nordak (Jun 17, 2016)

ChuckReburn said:


> The top bar gives you space to divide and conquer, you don't need a spare box.


You do when your hive has two bars worth of space. I would recommend anyone who is planning on keeping TBH's to make nuc size boxes. They are handy for all sorts of scenarios, speaking from experience.


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## Chuck Jachens (Feb 22, 2016)

Queen spotting is sometime an art and other times it is the luck of the draw. I have a very strong hive I split and I have never been about to find queen or her daughter even with help. The hive is crowded and has lots of drones. It would be nice to find her since her daughter seems to be just as prolific. 

I look for larvae (smallest I can find) instead of looking for the queen.

Best advice is to practice, practice, and more practice. It seems once I find the queen, I can go back a week later and find her again.


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## Hokie Bee Daddy (Apr 1, 2011)

Most of the time I will spot her black thorax first. For me it stands out among all the other sights in the hive.


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## aunt betty (May 4, 2015)

Best way to spot a queen is to get someone else to find it for you. Ha Ha.


But seriously once you get 10 or more colonies your queen finding skill goes up just because you got ten more babies to find. Lots of practice and you'll be spotting queens without even looking for them. They really do stand out to the trained eye.


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## crofter (May 5, 2011)

I have very dark bees and there is very little difference in the appearance of the thorax. The workers also do not seem to display the rosette of inward facing worker bees with space around the queen. If the frames are crowded at all the queens will creep and the bees run right over her. It is kind of comical yet maddening to spot one on a frame, lose track of her momentarily and spend two or three minutes or more relocating her on the one frame you have in your hands!

Italian bees I can do a passable job of finding. That is one resolution I presently have to mark all my existing queens. That resolution is getting familiar as I have made it for a few years.


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## Steve56Ace (Sep 5, 2014)

mailmam said:


> I have a hive that isn't doing much, I see some capped drone brood but that is all and I'm concerned that I don't have a queen. This morning I pulled out all the bars and looked but the bees are covering the comb. Should I gently brush the bees off to get a good look? Any other suggestions? Thanks in advance.


1.Back 2.Wings 3.Legs

Legs are the least talked about and often so tellingly different. Especially when she is under around an edge or lots of bees. My girls got some gams!!


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## Steve56Ace (Sep 5, 2014)

The retinue.


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## Steve56Ace (Sep 5, 2014)

gww said:


> I read an old book and the writer said he used an empty super and moved the combs to it one at a time looking at just one side of the frame and then transfered them back looking at the other side and that the queen did not like sunlight and would run around to the dark side. I think it is a free book writen by doolittle. My spelling might mess you up on a search but good luck.
> gww


 Yes when the object is to find her I use other nucs(also during inspections of all kinds) to transfer bars/frames to as I look and watch the girls. I've gone thru a box up to 3 times before finding her but it always works for me. Often times I find her on removed bars as I'm putting them back into the hive. If I don't find her I start again and also watch out for the wall walkers. Found many there too.


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