# Combining a Queenless Hive with a Small Queenright Hive



## dhmacmu (Mar 9, 2014)

I have two hives that are not doing as well as expected. Both are Langstroth 10-frame using two deeps each as the hive body. The first hive is small, but queenright (I observed open brood and capped brood). This is a new queen I purchased and introduced since the original queen died several weeks ago. The second hive is apparently queenless -- I missed something a couple weeks ago during my inspections and should have caught this. Today I only saw capped drone cells which I can only assume means I have laying workers. I did not observe the queen nor did I see any larvae, eggs or capped brood.

I would like to combine these two hives to make one with a larger population. My question is, how do I do that? Has anyone done this before and can recommend the proper method to introduce both hives? Thanks in advance for you help!!!!!


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## Billboard (Dec 28, 2014)

Why do you assume laying worker right away? The queen could have laid the drones before disappearing. How long has the hive been queenless? If it is for sure queenless do a news paper combine. Lay 1 sheet of newspaper on the queen right hive and put queenless hive on top. By the time they chew thru they will be friends. If it is a laying worker do not combine. Laying worker hive most likely will kill the queen.


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## AR Beekeeper (Sep 25, 2008)

The safest way is to put the queenright colony over the queenless colony using the newspaper method. The queen and all the brood above lessens the chance that a forager passing through the brood area will happen upon the laying queen and attack her. It helps with the laying workers if most of the new brood in the queenright hive is uncapped brood.

I usually remove the laying worker brood and freeze it to kill the drones and varroa that will be in the cells. If I don't have the spare comb to use to replace it, then I just let the LW drone brood remain and just live with it.

If you have never joined colonies using the newspaper method it is simple to do. Remove the inner cover and put one sheet of newspaper on top of the colony, make some small holes or slits in the center of the paper and put the new colony on the top, and replace the covers. The bees chew the newspaper away and will usually not fight each other. Usually it works, but I have had it fail on about 3 occasions.


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## dhmacmu (Mar 9, 2014)

I guess I am not sure if there are laying workers. I have just never seen drone cells with no regular brood also being present. That along with not finding the queen led me to believe I have laying workers. I do not know if how long the hive has been queenless, since I must have missed this hive two weeks ago during my last inspection. So (assuming it is truly queenless) it could be as long as 4 weeks. So if the hive does have laying workers, I should not combine with another hive? Does that mean they are doomed?


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## Billboard (Dec 28, 2014)

No Ar beekeeper says you can combine follow his directions


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## dhmacmu (Mar 9, 2014)

Makes sense, thanks. I do have several deeps of drawn comb available to replace the drone brood. After reading a couple of these responses I am hesitant to combine because I don't want to lose both hives. I may wait a couple weeks so the smaller colony strengthens and allow me to confirm I have a laying worker hive. Or is that a bad idea?


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

If the drone brood you see is in worker sized cells, then it's most likely from laying workers. If the drone brood you see is in drone sized cells, then it may be from a failing queen. If you don't currently see multiple eggs per cell and large fat drone larva, then chances are you don't have laying workers yet. A lot of the diagnosis is timing dependant, which you are not clear on in the posts of what you've seen when. If you decide to combine, I agree with AR Beekeeper, put the queen right hive on top of the questionable hive using newspaper combine. I would also though, go through each hive and reduce them down in size so that the combined hive was no taller than 3 boxes, if you can. See if you have one box worth of combs between the two that are not being used and is mostly empty. If most combs in both hives are being used and utilized, then combine and make it four boxes tall, the bees will join and rearrange things as they like over time.


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## Riverderwent (May 23, 2013)

dhmacmu said:


> Today I only saw capped drone cells which I can only assume means I have laying workers.


You likely saw the capped drone cells 22 or 23 days after the queen failed. Drone pupae take a little longer to emerge than worker pupae. Wait three days and see if there are more or fewer capped drone cells. Then combine. In the mean time, you may consider adding a frame of eggs and very young larvae to the hive if it is available. This will delay the development of a laying worker and let you see if they make an emergency queen cell.


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## Riverderwent (May 23, 2013)

Any update?


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## dhmacmu (Mar 9, 2014)

Sorry for the late reply! I am happy to report my attempt to save the queenless hive!!!! I was extremely lucky and was able to obtain a free queen from a friend who received one too many. I placed her in the hive along with two frames of eggs and brood (and attached bees) from two of my other strong hives. I also moved a honey super (and the attached bees) from a strong hive to the queenless hive. I had my doubts that this would be successful but I had nothing to lose. I was counting on the confusion of all the bees from different hive and a the scent of a new queen to help with her acceptance. A little bit of in-fighting, but things settled down rather quickly. I now have nice brood patterns and an nice healthy hive! I may have to feed going into winter though, but my experiment was a success. 

Also, my other weak hive appears to now be doing quite well! Perhaps it just took some time for that new queen to get going. Thanks for all your help, and sorry again for the late reply!!!!


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

I'm glad to hear the good news of your success, and thanks for the update.


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