# Processing for top bar comb honey



## Arno (Oct 23, 2015)

Hi, we're processing comb honey from top bar and log hives and are looking at mechanizing our production line. 

At the moment we strain the loose honey from the comb and then press the comb in a fruit press with cloth to extract the honey from the rest of the comb. Typically from the honey which comes in we get 80% honey, 5% wax and 15% other stuff by weight.

Just seeing if anyone had some recommendations for a mechanized set up where we could just feed the buckets of honey in directly and separates the honey from the wax/other.

Cheers,
Arno


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

What amount, in lbs or Kgs, are we talking about here?

Crazy Roland


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## Arno (Oct 23, 2015)

Hi Roland, 

Around 50 MT, so a little more than you want to be doing manually.


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Is a Cook and Beales out of your price range?

Crazy Roland


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## Arno (Oct 23, 2015)

Not if it works, which piece of equipment would be suitable for comb honey though? It seems that all of the commercial equipment is optimized for frames.

I saw the paradise honey wax/honey press and was considering that as an option, but not sure if it will work with comb.


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## jean-marc (Jan 13, 2005)

The wax presses should work with comb. I mean they work after the hot knife cuts the comb off the frames. I cannot imagine why it would not work with comb. Comb does have the 2 surface. There might be a slightly higher percentage of honey left in the wax from comb vs honey left in the wax from cappings, on account of the honey being inside the comb, vs the honey on one surface only of the cappings. I said should earlier because I have not used one myself.

Jean-Marc


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## grozzie2 (Jun 3, 2011)

would a spin float work with comb cut from top bar style hives ?


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

I would assume it would work if you first ran the comb through the agitator tank we used with an early spinfloat. That one liked a consistent mixture, not too thin, not too thick(or was that Goldilocks?)

Crazy Roland


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## Arno (Oct 23, 2015)

Great thanks all. Do you have an example of that type of agitator? Would you then pump directly from that pump into the honey/wax press?


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Gee, that was back in the 60's. The mixer may have been made at a weld shop. About the foutprint of a 55 gallon drum on it's side. Imagine you took the drum and slit it at 12 o'clock as view from the end(on it's side). Then the curved parts from 9 to 12 and 12 to 3 where bent to go straight up to form a "U" ,agian as viewed from the end. The mixer shaft went through the "old center of the drum" , and had "T" shaped paddles like an cement mixer.

If you where realy sharp, you could use gravity with no pumps. Yes, mixture gets pumped, metered into seperator.

A Cook and Beales is a centrifugal seperator, not a press. 

For all this expense, it would seem to be cheaper to convert to Langstroth hives. You would get more hooney that way also.

Crazy Roland


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## Fusion_power (Jan 14, 2005)

Roland, I don't mean to steal your thunder, but please remember that Arno is working with an African race of bees, either Scutellata or possibly Monticola, that become unworkable in Langstroth hives. Topbar hives are a better solution. This is particularly true if running a variant of the Jackson Horizontal hive design. Topbar hives by their design reduce stinging because honey can be harvested without opening the brood nest.

Please read this thread on the UK forum to see some comments and reasons a horizontal hive design works best in Tanzanian conditions.

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=15493

Arno, May I suggest contacting Crispin Jackson since he has direct experience working hives under your conditions.

http://www.rupertshoney.com/

From his description, and I would rather you get this direct from him, he pulled frames from the hive and sliced the comb off into a 55 gallon drum in such a way that the weight of the comb crushed the wax as it fell into the drum. When full, lids were put on the drums and they were rolled onto a truck and transported to a bottling facility. Rolling the drums tended to break up any remaining intact comb. The drum was placed on its side and the bung hole opened which allowed the honey to drain into a strainer. After a couple of days, most of the honey drained through the strainer leaving the drum of wax which was melted. If a lot of the comb was still intact, the drums could be rolled a few times which would break up the pieces and let more of the honey drain out.

This is a low tech method of processing honey that requires plastic food grade drums, a good strainer and bottling system, and a way to melt the wax. It was used in a 1500 hive operation which is approximately the scale you are at. It is possible to wash the crushed comb with water and use it as input to make honey beer.


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## Arno (Oct 23, 2015)

Great, thanks very much for the advice everyone. I'll do some more investigation on your advice and let you know what solution we end up with.

Cheers,
Arno


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

No problems Fusion, no offense noted or taken.

What variety of bee is the OP working with?

Fusion - Could he not work with Langstroth combs in a horizontal hive? 

Crazy Roland


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## Fusion_power (Jan 14, 2005)

Roland, From a map, Arno has pure scutellata with Monticola in the nearby mountains and Jemenitica to the West and North. See if you can get to page 68 of this document. I wish I could go see this area, it would be a pleasure to see Monticola in the native range.

https://books.google.com/books?id=4LHrCAAAQBAJ&

Langstroth frames are not the best choice for a top bar hive. There is a frame made for this type equipment. It has a solid top bar with ears, heavy dowel rods for sides, and a lighter dowel for the bottom bar. The advantage of this type frame is that it can be constructed with minimal equipment at minimal cost, can be glued together with no nails, and provides a satisfactory frame for extraction. Colonies can be managed with the crush and strain method I described above or if extraction facilities are available combs can be reused after the honey has been extracted.


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## Arno (Oct 23, 2015)

Yeah, it's primarily scutellata here.

We're doing some langstroths in our apiary, however this is primarily for some of the traditional beekeepers in the nearby area who typically work with either topbars or log hives.

It's pretty amazing stuff the way they harvest. In the middle of the night, they climb 10-25m into the tree where the hive is, pull a smoker and bucket up with some rope after them, smoke it then harvest the comb into the bucket whilst they're in the tree without any protective equipment! Impressive stuff.


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

I guess I do not understand how you have money for a Cook and Beales, but not Langstroth frames. Silly me.

Crazy Roland


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## Arno (Oct 23, 2015)

Hi Roland, it's more for the honey which we source from the hives out in the bush. I think long term we'll look at changing them over but at the moment there's a few hundred beekeepers each with 10-200 hives.

Cheers,
Arno


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

I guess your "We" is more than you and the mouse in your pocket(being cheeky and Ian would say). Good luck, your situation is not at all like over here.

Crazy Roland


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