# Langstroth Build



## 2PUPs (Nov 6, 2010)

This is the point I am at in the build so far , I still need to make some medium bodys . Also need to make the tops and inner cocers as there is two units . Put one of my mug in with them .

Jeff


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## fish_stix (May 17, 2009)

Nice job! Just seal the end grain on those corners real good with paint or whatever else you plan to use and put some of those bee thingys in them.


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## 2PUPs (Nov 6, 2010)

Could anyone tell me what is a good clear finnish to use on the wood to keep the wood natural looking .


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## Roadstar (Nov 1, 2010)

About the best you can do for a clear finish for outside use would be Spar Varnish. It will hold up better than a polyurethane product. There are other Tung Oil based products that you can use for exterior use, but you will have to reapply these every so often.

I would think you would need to be careful with VOC based products around the bees. 

I have seen some Log Home wood finish/sealers that wore like iron, but I have no experience with them. The excellent ones are probably a bit pricey too!


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## 2PUPs (Nov 6, 2010)

I think I will just seal and paint them , believe it will be easier to maintain .


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## 2PUPs (Nov 6, 2010)

I made the top cover and one medium super , also played with the hive entrance reduced opening this morning . I need to make one more medium super and a bottom board and stand , also need to make some inner covers . Below is a couple pics of it so far .


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## peacekeeperapiaries (Jun 23, 2009)

nice looking set up there 2PUP!! :thumbsup:


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

You really should cut some hand holes in the supers, not having them can be a pain.

Nice bottom board, and got to say, one of the best finished hives I've seen! Even been sanded?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Or add some cleats for hand holds...

Nice.


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## Countryboy (Feb 15, 2009)

Dipping the boxes in wax and rosin seal them and leave the wood looking natural.


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## Roadstar (Nov 1, 2010)

Your boxes look nice! I'm a woodworker too, and spent a few hours in the shop today making some hive components. I built a couple of bottom boards, and will be building some medium supers tomorrow morning.

I built a new fence assembly for my box joint jig, to enable me to cut 3/4" pins and did a few test cuts. I was considering dovetails, but I have much better dust control with my cabinet saw, so I decided to go with box joints instead. I'll post some pictures tomorrow when I get the supers cut and assembled.


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## 2PUPs (Nov 6, 2010)

I will be addind some sort of hand holds for lifting , Roadstar , looking forward to see your build , considering I,m a structual welder by trade , I think I did ok with the build . I will be making more hives this winter and will use finger joints or box joints which either you call them . If I knew someone localy that could dip them I would go that route , but will seal and paint these .

Jeff


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

Wouldn't rush into finger joints, boxes made that way rot a lot quicker. Rebated joints will last longer and are plenty strong.


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## MARBIS (Jun 10, 2010)

Michael Bush said:


> Or add some cleats for hand holds...
> 
> Nice.


Nice work. After my first harvest I decided to go with cleats on all of my boxes. Huge difference . Honey is a very heavy thing. Plus, cleats make every box much stronger.


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## Rolande (Aug 23, 2010)

Hi 2PUPs,

I totally agree with Oldtimers comment about boxes with finger joints rotting quicker.
I've got many boxes which are 40 or 50 years old -I bought them from a (then) 76 year old beekeeper who had himself sourced them from a major British Honey Farm when it closed it's doors, so their history is pretty certain. The interesting thing is that while they are showing their age the best ones are those with the simplest butt joints such as you've already used: no rot or movement, as square as the day they were made.

Best,
Roland


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## Roadstar (Nov 1, 2010)

Rolande and Oldtimer, I agree that finger joints would have a tendency to deteriorate quicker, due to the amount of end grain exposed. A proper and well fitted rabbet joint, coupled with modern adhesive and fasteners, would hold up just fine. I often wonder why commercial boxes are still offered with box joints, other than tradition and ease of construction and squaring by the consumer that is assembling the unit.

I may rethink my jointing, and use a rabbet joint instead. Pictures later, on whatever I decide!


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## 2PUPs (Nov 6, 2010)

I`ll stick with butt joints and seal the ends really well and paint them . When painting , you just paint the outside , what about the edges that each box sits on , paint them or not . 


Jeff


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## MARBIS (Jun 10, 2010)

2PUPs said:


> what about the edges that each box sits on , paint them or not . Jeff


Not exposed to weather, no need to paint


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## Roadstar (Nov 1, 2010)

Here's the result of my shop time yesterday. I managed to build 2 medium supers, and 2 bottom boards. I decided to try a rabbet joint in these supers, and I think they will work out well for durability. Everything was glued with Titebond III, clamped, then nailed with Maze Nails. Once primed and painted, I think they will weather fine. I may do some with box joints at some point too, just for grins!

The lifting handles are 6" x 2", with a 30 degree opposing angle for drainage, and a better grip for lifting. I glued and screwed the handles.

On one bottom board, I used some Eastern Red Cedar for the band board, just to see how it will hold up compared to Pine. Red Cedar is pretty rot resistant, so time will tell.

The bottom board planks have ship lapped joinery, to eliminate gaps should the boards move or shrink. 


































(I'm sorry about the original photo size, I should have read the size limitations before I posted them. Always hate to cause Mod's more work!)


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

MARBIS said:


> Not exposed to weather, no need to paint


I disagree...water sits on the top edge of the boxes and rot starts there. I paint top and bottom edges, use spacer sticks between boxes while paint is drying. The only thing that keeps the Golden Gate Bridge from rusting is constant maintenance to keep it well painted.


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## waynesgarden (Jan 3, 2009)

I'll stick with the faster-deteriorating finger joints. I'll be needing something to do 20 or 30 years from now.

Wayne


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## 2PUPs (Nov 6, 2010)

This is the finnished pic of langs all painted . I have some handles that will be put on the boxes , I made a few extra supers for the person that is getting this . I hope to be going up this weekend Saturday 
to give it to him . I also have ordered all the hive frames for each one for him . Now I need to make my own Langs. Below is a pic of it .


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

Well I hope he appreciates it!

Looks so clean you won't want to let any messy little bees near it!


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## rrussell6870 (May 14, 2009)

2pups... looks great! Suggestion.. cutting handles into the supers helps greatly when standing supers on end to work the hives... exterior handles will make them tip over or have to be propped up causing a messy situation... if you were to cut handles into them, how much??? Keep in mind that I order hardware in lots of a thousand at a time. ;-) 
Ps... how did you post the pic??? I have been tryin to figure that one out myself...


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

rrussell6870 said:


> exterior handles will make them tip over or have to be propped up causing a messy situation


I have exterior handles on hundreds of supers for 40 years and most do not tip over when stood on end. Mediums and deeps are fine, shallows can tip over as there is not enough super below the handle to make for a support. I install the handle near the top of the super but low enough as to not interfere with a telescoping cover. At the right height, access can often be had below the handle into the cut out hand hold. I put a slope on the top and bottom of handle, which makes it possible to grab empty supers one handed. I think a lot of complaint about supers being too heavy is becasue they don't have handles, the cut outs are useless for a full super, fingers tips are not that strong. This pic shows the handles.

http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t7/odfrank/7-07002.jpg


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## rrussell6870 (May 14, 2009)

I also have a few hundred supers with handles like those... to each his own, I just have over sixty locations and most are very uneven ground with lots of leaves and/or pine straw and sticks and such... to me the flat surface is easier. I handle grooves supers with one hand just fine, even when they are loaded, but my grip has come from a lifetime of handling them and is probably a little more stout than most. Lol. Nice tower by the way.


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## Roadstar (Nov 1, 2010)

The hives look great.........any Bee would "bee" happy to call those home! Thanks for sharing the picture........nice work!


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## MastoDon (Nov 29, 2010)

It appears from your first few photos that you built a solid bottom on the base, rather than a screened bottom board. Am I missing the screen? or did you decide not to do the screen? If the latter, can you share your reasons for making that decision?
thanks.


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## AstroBee (Jan 3, 2003)

Definitely paint the edges. Water does sit in between boxes and will accelerate rot.

FWIW, I too prefer boxes without cleats. When I build my own boxes, I just set up a dado blade to the proper width and height and cut the hand hold - not as nice as factory hand holds, but not bad.


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## George Heath (Nov 28, 2010)

2PUPs said:


> Could anyone tell me what is a good clear finnish to use on the wood to keep the wood natural looking .


Boiled Linseed Oil


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

Astro Bee. You can make the factory look handles with a skill saw very quickly, easily, and safely.

Send me your e-mail address and I will send you the plans to build the jig and instructions. Costs about 50 cents to make the jig, then takes about 30 seconds to make each hand hold. If you are making your own boxes, it is the fastest, best method, I have found to make commercial looking hand holds.

[email protected]


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## tommyt (Aug 7, 2010)

*Cleo C. Hogan Jr* 
Could I get a copy of how you cut the handles

Thanks
Tommyt


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## Darxus (Aug 23, 2012)

Video of how Cleo cuts his handles with a skill / circular saw: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaWRjpJ5f0w


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## cerezha (Oct 11, 2011)

Rolande said:


> Hi 2PUPs,
> 
> I totally agree with Oldtimers comment about boxes with finger joints rotting quicker.
> I've got many boxes which are 40 or 50 years old -I bought them from a (then) 76 year old beekeeper who had himself sourced them from a major British Honey Farm when it closed it's doors, so their history is pretty certain. The interesting thing is that while they are showing their age the best ones are those with the simplest butt joints such as you've already used: no rot or movement, as square as the day they were made.
> ...


Interesting
I was observing a few discussions on this matter on beesource. The conclusion was that old box/finger joints are the best for beehives. I was never able to understand the reason, but many people voted for box joints.

2PUP - great job, very nice woodwork!

Sergey


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## psfred (Jul 16, 2011)

Box joints, when properly cut, assemble easily (and square and flat) and when drilled and nailed, are very strong -- try taking one apart some time if you doubt that.

They will rot faster only if the joint is not sealed -- it's not the end grain exposed that causes the tendency to rot, it's the open space between the "fingers" that allows water to penetrate and keep the wood saturated. If you glue them with TiteBond III, and cut them to fit very well (they should require a bit of effort to got together, not just slip and rattle) and then prime and paint them properly, or heat treat with a wax/rosin mixture, they should last a very long time. 

The main reason box joints are standard is that before the development of modern waterproof adhesives, nailed box joints were by far the strongest joint available. 

I will repeat, rot prevention has everything to do with preventing water penetration of the joint and little or nothing to do with joint design. Sealed off from water and not abused, bee boxes should last indefinitely.

Peter


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