# Queen Cell protectors??



## CWBees (May 11, 2006)

You use them to prevent the first queen to emerge from destroying the other queens assuming that all the queens are still in the finishing hive when they emerge.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Actually a "cell protector" is to keep the workers from tearing it down before the queen emerges. It has the end open. A "Hair curler" cage is to keep the other queens from destroying each other as they emerge into the cage.

I bought a bunch of "cell protectors" and tried them a few times. I did not see that they accomplished anything and I have not used them since. I'd sell them cheap if you want some. 

I do use the hair curler cages sometimes. I should use them more often than I do...


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## CWBees (May 11, 2006)

I stand corrected. The cages I have are called hair curler cages I just assumed they were cell protectors.


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

I'll secong what MB said. I bought the cell pretectors, used them once, and thought they were a waste. The hair rollers cages are used over and over many times and are worth the money. They saved me many times from losing queens when time was backed up.


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## bee_wrangler (Jan 21, 2007)

*re more ???*

Thanks for the replies !! I am thinking about trying to rear my own queens for next year. What about mini mating nucs? Why are thry so small? I was thinking about using standard deep frames in some 4 frame nuc boxes. Or is a small population in a mini prefered?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>What about mini mating nucs? Why are thry so small? 

The concept is to minimize the resrouces needed to rear a queen. If I have to set up 100 mating nucs (and I do) and each takes four deep frames, then I need 400 deep frames to setup those 100 mating nucs. If I use two medium frames (and I do) then I still need 200 medium frames to setup those 100 mating nucs. With mini mating nucs (which i have not tried) you'd only need 100 cups full of bees to set up 100 mating nucs.

I like the two frame medium nucs because it's less resources than a four or five frame, less resources than a deep and it's the size frame I use. A frame of open brood, a frame of honey and a frame of bees shaken in makes a nice nuc and they usually stay long enough (2 days) for the queen to emerge from the cell and get established. Once established they usually are good for the season and then I can put all those frames of bees and brood together for nucs or hives for overwintering.

The other up/down side of lager/smaller nucs is that the smaller the nuc is the more quickly it fills with bees and brood and has to be split or otherwise adjusted. Also the more quickly it fails and the bees abaondon it. The smaller the box and the number of bees the more boom or bust it is.

Jay Smith on the size of mating nucs:

"The Question of Mating Hives... Many think that most any kind of box made of thin material will do. Nothing is farther from the truth, for the size and the way it is made is very important for best results. I have in the past, in an experimental way, made 16 different styles of mating hives. I have made them in sizes as small as the on shown in the cut, which used a single individual comb honey section about one inch square, and from that up to a two-story jumbo hive. In Indiana we used a mating hive that held three four-by-five comb honey sections with a division board feeder at the back. It did very well in Indiana but was a complete flop here in Florida as I rather expected it would be. Here is the general rule: The smaller the mating hive, the less number of bees it requires and the less feed it takes to operate it. However it requires much more labor to operate it as constant care must be taken to see that it does not run short of stores and to see that it does not become too weak in bees or that it does not become too crowded with bees or stores, for if any of these conditions are present, the bees will abscond." --Jay Smith, Better Queens

http://www.bushfarms.com/beesbetterqueens.htm#The Question of Mating Hives


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## peggjam (Mar 4, 2005)

I'm trying mini's for the first time this year. Jay Smith is right that they will go boom or bust in a quick hurry. So far I have mixed feelings with them. 

I personnly like 2 frame mediums or deeps, but it takes a huge amount of resources to set up 100 or more of them. But the upside is you can split them when they get to robust.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

bee_wrangler said:


> Thanks for the replies !! I am thinking about trying to rear my own queens for next year. What about mini mating nucs? Why are thry so small? I was thinking about using standard deep frames in some 4 frame nuc boxes. Or is a small population in a mini prefered?


"Why are they so small?"

One guy that I work w/ who raises queens uses a five frame nuc box w/ a ply wood devider down the center. So there are two 2 frame nucs in this one box. He also has a piece of plastic one the top so that when you are looking for the queen in one side the other side is still closed. They seem to work well for him.

Another friend and I were talking about queens and acceptence yesterday and he feels that introducing a queen into a small colony, such as a 4 or 5 frame nuc w/ two frames of bees and brood, plus 3 more empty frames, increases your chances of acceptence far and above introducing a queen into a larger population of bees such as one would find in a full size colony.


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

If I was in the deep south where perhaps I could keep mini nucs going (all year?), I could see doing it. In the north, I think having the ability to combine at the end of the season should be considered.

I like having my nucs made with standard frame sizes, both deep and mediums. My favorite for queen rearing is three frame mediums. I can take the third frame out, which is usually a builder frame (foundation), and then can serperate the other two frames to slide my queens cell down between the frames. I use the wooden cell cups (Kelley), and they take a little more room in getting them down between the frames.

I also like being able to swap frames as they become full, need to add honey or brood, etc. I just don't see the advantages of mini's in the north. Taking a couple frames of mediums to get each one started in the spring is no more than shaking bees and getting mini's going.

Full size nucs, whether deep or medium, have advantages to me that outwiegh any claims of "less resources" in using mini's.


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## Velbert (Mar 19, 2006)

*Mini Nuc's*

I have those from bee works out of Canada. Out of 1 good hive of NWC I started 35 Mini Nucs A 1 8oz cup of bees 1/2 pint of HFCS and a queen cell and you are on your way. Most of my Mini Nucs are on their 3rd queen for the season. Figure I will get at least 2 more per MH as of now I have about $1.00 each in feed for them. going to try over wintering them will have about another $1.50 into each one by fall. Now this is not counting any fuel for travel. At the years end I will figure up the yearly total and post it to give you some idea per Mini Nuc or per Queen cost


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