# AFB in new Nuc, advise please



## Bueff (Oct 17, 2020)

Good morning everyone, I have done a hive inspection on some NUCs yesterday and have discovered that one of them has what appears to be a AFB infection. The cells appear to be relatively normal, some are more sunken than others. So I pocked a matchstick in a few and ended up with stringy slime stuck to the matchstick.
That was a big red flag for me, so I waited for dark and did what I had to and killed off that NUC.
As this is my first experience with this stuff, could I please get some feedback from the more experienced keepers around here. My major concern is that due to the extended wet weather around here, there has been some robbing activity in the yard. I have about 10 well established hives in the same yard.
IF they did rob the infected hive, how long does it take for symptoms to show up in a healthy, strong hive?
I spend most of the evening freaking out and researching this matter. Apparently one way of dealing with it while it is not established yet, is to use all new equipment and shake the bees in front of the new hive with only foundations in it. Let then use up the honey in their stomach and get them to build out new comb.

Would this be a possible preventative option?

I know that I would loose tons of perfectly good brood in the process, but I would like to do anything I can to prevent an infection in my healthy hives.

Next thing is dealing with tools and the like, how do you make sure you are not spreading the bad stuff across the hives? I disinfected my hive tool with alcohol wipes between hives and am taking the recommended precautions of wearing rubber gloves, not mixing boxes from different yards and so on.
How about the honey room. If I extract honey from one yard and then from another how do you reduce the risk of cross contamination?
Sorry about the long winded post, I know it is a very complex issue. Your response is greatly appreciated!


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

It can take a very long time for symptoms to show. Generally after 18 months you can have a high but not total degree of certainty your hives are clear.

I would not recommend replacing all the gear. A good plan is to quarantine all the hives. You do this by numbering them with a felt pen, so for example, hive 1 will have 1 written on all the boxes, and for a two year period you do not shift gear from any hive to any other hive. This way if one does get AFB, it is confined to that hive only.

For honey extracting about all you can do is ensure the frames go back into the same boxes and those boxes go back onto the same hives. When I have had to do this I have left the hives 4 or 5 boxes high all year to ensure they go on the right hives plus avoid having to store them.

All this is very time consuming, but it does work, you will eradicate your AFB.

One thing, alcohol wipes or just alcohol does not kill AFB spores. Bleach does but it takes 15 minutes. Best way is a gas torch. However if the hive you just looked at does not have symptomatic AFB, it is highly unlikely that the hive tool even though it has a bit of wax or similar on it, will give AFB to the next hive. This is a factor of the number of spores that are required to kill a larva and start a symptomatic infection.


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## Boondocks (Sep 16, 2020)

If you have a bee or apiary inspector I would call them and let them know. They may be able to take samples from your other hives and see if they are infected. 
Anyway I would let any beekeepers near you know about this.


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

Oh another thing -



Bueff said:


> I waited for dark and did what I had to and killed off that NUC.


A mistake I often see (I am an AFB inspector in my country) is people find a hive with AFB so kill it. What happens next is if there is any little gap somewhere that bees can enter, the hive gets robbed as there are no bees to defend it.

Unless the AFB hive is very weak, it is best to leave it alive until right before burning. The bees will defend it from robbing and the disease will not spread to other hives.

As obvious as it sounds, I have seen many cases where a beekeeper has killed an AFB hive, blocked it (they thought) but there was a gap somewhere, then when they get back a few days later to burn it the hive has been completely robbed out, and the AFB spread to many hives.


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## Nicksotherhoney (Jun 10, 2017)

This is what I fpuns with a quick internet search

Burning the bees and all of the equipment is the only sure way to be absolutely free of this disease. Burning bees and equipment found to be infected with antibiotic-resistant AFB is mandatory in some Mid-Atlantic States. This should be accomplished as soon as possible once AFB is detected.
Do not attempt to keep any honey from these colonies, as it contains spores and will contaminate your extraction equipment.
The bottom board, hive bodies, supers, and inner and outer covers can be disinfected and reused (see below). However, there is no guarantee that the equipment can be completely sterilized, and the disease may reappear, so you may opt to burn everything.
Plastic hive components pose an environmental hazard if they are burned. Thus, these can be double-bagged using heavy plastic bags, then transported to a waste facility, where burial should be witnessed by you. Alternatively, these hive components can be carefully stored in a bee-free place until irradiation is possible. This method is described above in the "buy new, not used, equipment" section. Note that the frames need to be scraped after irradiation because the equipment will appear to still have the symptoms of AFB even though they will not be infective. Collect all scrapings and dispose of them.
Before burning, diseased colonies should be killed in the evening after all foraging activities have ceased. This can be done by closing up all hive entrances and drenching the bees in the colony with diesel fuel at a rate of 1 cup per hive body. Pour it over the cluster, close the lid and wait at least 10 min to allow the bees to become immobile.
Prior to beginning the burning process, determine whether you will need a burn permit. If so, obtain one before you proceed.
To burn diseased equipment, dig a sloping pit 18 inches deep and wide enough to hold all combs and equipment to be burned (about 3 ft). With water or a fire extinguisher on hand, build a fire in the pit using newspaper or other kindling. Set your unopened hive close to the pit and drop combs and dead bees into the fire, a few at a time. Never leave the fire unattended and allow for 2-3 hours to complete the process. *Be extremely careful with this step to avoid flares from fuel residue.*
After everything (every single frame must be burned; other equipment may also be burned) has been completely burned and the area is cleaned of small pieces >of comb or bees, cover the ashes with dirt.


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

I'm glad that was stuff you found on the net, not your own view. There's a couple of things I disagree with -



Nicksotherhoney said:


> The bottom board, hive bodies, supers, and inner and outer covers can be disinfected and reused (see below). However, there is no guarantee that the equipment can be completely sterilized, and the disease may reappear, so you may opt to burn everything.


Very very bad plan. Just burn the lot.



Nicksotherhoney said:


> build a fire in the pit using newspaper or other kindling. Set your unopened hive close to the pit and drop combs and dead bees into the fire, a few at a time.


This is a very difficult way to do it and also will probably not get a 100% burn. Easier especially if doing a number of hives, is put a couple of blocks of wood on the bottom of the pit, then stack the supers on them. Pour a good amount of deisel on then light. The supers will create a chimney effect and the wood blocks at the bottom will let air enter from below, enabling a hot fire and good burn.

A burn I did recently


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## Bueff (Oct 17, 2020)

Thanks everyone for your input,

I have closed off the hive last night and killed the bees, as it is only a 5 frame nuc, I have wrapped the whole thing with plastic bags ( 3 layers).
The local authorities have been contacted and I am waiting for their call. 
I do understand the significance of this issue and I am ok with loosing that NUC, my focus is now shifting to attending the existing hives which are extremely productive and were chosen for queen rearing and NUC's prioir to this event.

All my hives are numbered anyway, I will go through and number the frames as well, just to be sure we return the right boxes and frames. Would splashing honey in the extractor or while uncapping be a consideration for possible transmission of the disease? If so, I need to get a second set and harvest these hives one at a time. Any further ideas?

I am trying to work out how that NUC got infected, we have a real problem with SHB here this year, due to a mild winter and a lot of wet weather. Would it be possible that the infection is transmitted by SHB? There are a lot of hive being destroyed by SHB here this season. We have lost 3 pretty strong hives at a rate that is unbelievable. 

Anyway that is a matter for another thread. Again, thank you for your input and please continue the conversation


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

Bueff said:


> Would splashing honey in the extractor or while uncapping be a consideration for possible transmission of the disease? If so, I need to get a second set and harvest these hives one at a time. Any further ideas?


The suspect hives should be inspected as the honey is harvested. Any hives that are symptomatic, the honey should not be extracted it should be burned.

The rest of the hives that are quarantined but not showing symptoms at the time of harvest, what some beekeepers do is leave that honey till all other honey has been extracted. Then that honey is extracted. The equipment should then be thoroughly cleaned, the honey can be tested for AFB in a lab. I don't know who does it in Australia but there are a number of labs that do it here in NZ. If you find a zero or very low spore result, that will give you some confidence about the future of your hives.

How to burn honey? In fact it mostly won't burn it runs into the ground. So if burning hives with a lot of honey you dig an extra deep pit. The idea is that if it is inevitable some honey will run into the ground, if you can bury it deep enough, those spores will not make it back to the surface. If at some future time the ground is turned, the honey will have fermented and broken down, there is nothing there attractive to bees.

And yes, the source of this AFB can be a bigger problem than your one infected nuc itself. You may be able to investigate and figure it out, or you may never figure it out.


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## Struttinbuck (Mar 8, 2020)

Bueff said:


> Thanks everyone for your input,
> 
> I have closed off the hive last night and killed the bees, as it is only a 5 frame nuc, I have wrapped the whole thing with plastic bags ( 3 layers).
> The local authorities have been contacted and I am waiting for their call.
> ...


Let the inspector test it then Burn it.


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## AR1 (Feb 5, 2017)

Oldtimer said:


> Very very bad plan. Just burn the lot.


Thanks for posting all the info, Oldtimer. Hard to watch but necessary. Thankfully have not had to deal with AFB.


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## Bueff (Oct 17, 2020)

Oldtimer said:


> The suspect hives should be inspected as the honey is harvested. Any hives that are symptomatic, the honey should not be extracted it should be burned.
> 
> The rest of the hives that are quarantined but not showing symptoms at the time of harvest, what some beekeepers do is leave that honey till all other honey has been extracted. Then that honey is extracted. The equipment should then be thoroughly cleaned, the honey can be tested for AFB in a lab. I don't know who does it in Australia but there are a number of labs that do it here in NZ. If you find a zero or very low spore result, that will give you some confidence about the future of your hives.
> 
> ...


Thanks for all your helpful inside. Have a good night!


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

@Oldtimer,
Just meant to ask - what are practical ways to prevent AFB while still "clean" (or is it even worth it to bother with)?

(Forum is going crazy - double-posting/swallowing the messages.....)


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## psm1212 (Feb 9, 2016)

I have never seen an AFB Action Plan as comprehensive and detailed as what Old Timer has described in this thread. This should be saved, or better yet, submitted for publication in a major bee periodical.


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

GregV said:


> Just meant to ask - what are practical ways to prevent AFB while still "clean" (or is it even worth it to bother with)?


It cannot be prevented and can happen to anyone. Sad thing is, it's sometimes the big healthy and strong hives that get it, because they are the most likely to go and rob other hives and thus bring home the infection.

But the spread between a beekeepers own hives can be prevented by good management practises. So where i am is a high AFB area, for my own hives I have to work under the assumption that any hive might get AFB at any time. So before making splits or exchanging gear between hives they get checked for AFB, and hives are also checked when harvesting honey. That way, I cannot prevent AFB coming into my hives from somewhere else, but I can prevent the beekeeper caused spread of it between my own hives.


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

Just for interest here is a link to the page of the official New Zealand AFB management plan. 

Please scroll down through the first 1/2 of the page which is just NZ specific stuff, but towards the bottom of the page is some good information, videos, etc.

The Management Agency, National American Foulbrood Pest Management Plan New Zealand (afb.org.nz)


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Oldtimer said:


> *It cannot be prevented and can happen to anyone.* Sad thing is, it's sometimes the big healthy and strong hives that get it, because they are the most likely to go and rob other hives and thus bring home the infection.
> 
> But the spread between a beekeepers own hives can be prevented by good management practises. So where i am is a* high AFB area*, for my own hives I have to work under the assumption that any hive might get AFB at any time. So before making splits or exchanging gear between hives they get checked for AFB, and hives are also checked when harvesting honey. That way, I cannot prevent AFB coming into my hives from somewhere else, but I can prevent the beekeeper caused spread of it between my own hives.


OK, figured as much.
Reconfirms to not bother with excessive busy minutia (just don't do the obvious blunders).

But now - there exist "high AFB areas"?
This is an interesting bit.

Where there such particular areas in NZ?
And if yes - then how so?
Where are these in the US OR do they even exist?


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## Bueff (Oct 17, 2020)

Oldtimer said:


> It cannot be prevented and can happen to anyone. Sad thing is, it's sometimes the big healthy and strong hives that get it, because they are the most likely to go and rob other hives and thus bring home the infection.
> 
> But the spread between a beekeepers own hives can be prevented by good management practises. So where i am is a high AFB area, for my own hives I have to work under the assumption that any hive might get AFB at any time. So before making splits or exchanging gear between hives they get checked for AFB, and hives are also checked when harvesting honey. That way, I cannot prevent AFB coming into my hives from somewhere else, but I can prevent the beekeeper caused spread of it between my own hives.


Thank you, I will adopt this method from now on in the apiary where we found this nuc.

I have a had a hot wax dipper made to preserve my boxes as I dislike painting 
As I have read, this device can be used to kill spores if run hot enough, I think it was 150deg C for at least 10min. Have you had any experience with this? Last thing I want is to have spores in the wax and adding them to the new boxes.
Thanks again for your very detailed information!


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## Bueff (Oct 17, 2020)

Bueff said:


> Thank you, I will adopt this method from now on in the apiary where we found this nuc.
> 
> I have a had a hot wax dipper made to preserve my boxes as I dislike painting
> As I have read, this device can be used to kill spores if run hot enough, I think it was 150deg C for at least 10min. Have you had any experience with this? Last thing I want is to have spores in the wax and adding them to the new boxes.
> Thanks again for your very detailed information!


To answer my own question,🤦‍♂️
it is 160 degrees and 10 min duration. 😀







Wax dipping | The Management Agency, National American Foulbrood Pest Management Plan New Zealand


Wax dippingExceptions to destruction by burning The brood, bees and honey from an AFB hive must be destroyed by burning. However, supers, lids, floorboards, queen excluders and feeders can be sterilised with permission from the Management Agency. How to sterilise Non-plastic hive parts can be...




afb.org.nz


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## Struttinbuck (Mar 8, 2020)

GregV said:


> OK, figured as much.
> Reconfirms to not bother with excessive busy minutia (just don't do the obvious blunders).
> 
> But now - there exist "high AFB areas"?
> ...


It mutated. Yea. The virus mutated.
Sorry but i just have a pure hate for anything genetically modified.
Yes strong words go with a strong technology.
Pure hate.


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## Jack Grimshaw (Feb 10, 2001)

Struttinbuck said:


> It mutated. Yea. The virus mutated.
> Sorry but i just have a pure hate for anything genetically modified.
> Yes strong words go with a strong technology.
> Pure hate.


No clue where you are going with this.
AFB is caused by a bacteria and to the best of my knowledge has not been genetically modified.AFB spores can last for many years.
Viruses mutate easily but do not last long outside of the host's live cell.


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## Struttinbuck (Mar 8, 2020)

Jack Grimshaw said:


> No clue where you are going with this.
> AFB is caused by a bacteria and to the best of my knowledge has not been genetically modified.AFB spores can last for many years
> Viruses mutate easily but do not last long outside of the hosts live cell.


You can't prove it either way basically. Its pure trust. I'm sure theres reasons AFB occurs in New Zealand on a regular basis. And I could come up with 1 million and 1 reasons why it does. But now that this technology is out of the bag. Every third world nation has it, every big pharma company has it. This is not how things were talked about in the 90's. 
I'm basically saying noone can prove I am wrong now. Same as they cannot prove you are either. 1 strand of DNA is an entire world of information.
So??? How do you stop Bill Gates from improving the human race by putting his DNA into every human on the planet?
I mean he's a billionaire right? LOL.
What is there that could prevent him from doing that?
Yes I am a very thorough thinker. More than thorough.


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

It is doubtful some evil genius has taken the time to genetically modify AFB. Where would be the financial return.

AFB is a big problem in New Zealand and just why is not fully understood. But contributing factors are that compared to most countries where hives can be widely seperated, honeybee population here is very dense, we have around a million hives in a small country, possibly the densest concentration of beehives of any country in the world. And to take advantage of manuka flows a lot of that is pretty migratory. A perfect recipe for proliferation of disease.

Shouldn't admit this but some slap dash beekeepers also 😕


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Oldtimer said:


> AFB is a big problem in New Zealand and just why is not fully understood.


Possibly the climate has to do with it?

Still wondering how come we don't hear of massive AFB cases around the US - congested, cross-country migratory operations seem to be perfect for it.


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## SuiGeneris (Feb 13, 2018)

Struttinbuck said:


> You can't prove it either way basically. Its pure trust. I'm sure theres reasons AFB occurs in New Zealand on a regular basis. And I could come up with 1 million and 1 reasons why it does. But now that this technology is out of the bag. Every third world nation has it, every big pharma company has it. This is not how things were talked about in the 90's.
> I'm basically saying noone can prove I am wrong now. Same as they cannot prove you are either. 1 strand of DNA is an entire world of information.
> So??? How do you stop Bill Gates from improving the human race by putting his DNA into every human on the planet?
> I mean he's a billionaire right? LOL.
> ...


It is trivial to show whether something has been genetically manipulated and only someone completely unfamiliar with the technology would believe otherwise. The genetic engineering technologies we have cannot simply "write" whatever you want into DNA. There are always "scars" - DNA sequences indicative of editing technology - left on either side of the engineered section. No technology has yet to be invented that lacks such signatures. Restriction cloning leaves palindromes, CRISPR/prime editing is restricted to PAM sequences, transposon or lentiviral intigration cloning leaves long terminal repeats, Gateway cloning leaves Attb sites, etc, etc, etc.

As for Bill Gates, if you don't want his DNA, don't go near his penis. That about the only way he has to inject his DNA into you


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## Struttinbuck (Mar 8, 2020)

SuiGeneris said:


> It is trivial to show whether something has been genetically manipulated and only someone completely unfamiliar with the technology would believe otherwise. The genetic engineering technologies we have cannot simply "write" whatever you want into DNA. There are always "scars" - DNA sequences indicative of editing technology - left on either side of the engineered section. No technology has yet to be invented that lacks such signatures. Restriction cloning leaves palindromes, CRISPR/prime editing is restricted to PAM sequences, transposon or lentiviral intigration cloning leaves long terminal repeats, Gateway cloning leaves Attb sites, etc, etc, etc.
> 
> As for Bill Gates, if you don't want his DNA, don't go near his penis. That about the only way he has to inject his DNA into you


Iran and phizer love the stuff. Of coarse it leaves scars when DNA is manipulated. Can you show us the scars on the viruses China has been working on? You can't? Why not? Electron microscopes cost too much? 
trust them all you want. I have zero trust in any billionaire , corporation or government politicians.


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## SuiGeneris (Feb 13, 2018)

Actually, we can show the scars on the GOF work done in the Wuhan lab...which is also why we know COVID19 wasn't manipulated as it lacks those scars. And you wouldn't use an electron microscope to see them (you use sequencing)...although, ironically, I've just led the purchase of a new transmission electron microscope for our imaging facility, so if you could see them by EM we'd be able to do so.

Maybe you shouldn't be getting your scientific education from Karen on facebook...


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## Struttinbuck (Mar 8, 2020)

SuiGeneris said:


> Actually, we can show the scars on the GOF work done in the Wuhan lab...which is also why we know COVID19 wasn't manipulated as it lacks those scars. And you wouldn't use an electron microscope to see them (you use sequencing)...although, ironically, I've just led the purchase of a new transmission electron microscope for our imaging facility, so if you could see them by EM we'd be able to do so.
> 
> Maybe you shouldn't be getting your scientific education from Karen on facebook...


Maybe you should keep out of books a little more and study the psychology of billionaires, politicians and the way people think they are smart when a degree tells them they are smart.(Boy that school costs alot)
People just seriously don't like condascending people.
Look where the college minds have taken us.
How far is Australia away from the Indonesia Islands?
How was it the Aussie college folks outhunk the American college folks?
Snakeheads, red catfish, asian carp, varroa destructor, asian lady bugs, Lets see what kinds of Algae we can get over here. Lets make American waterways , soils and fertile grounds as worthless as other areas of the world.
So who decided these things? Corporations, rich people and colleges?
Now how do you stop a corporation from sending products from 1 continent to another?
And also what is your cure? Why will you not genetically modify the bad nasties to breed themselves out but you will G Modd all things good? What is up with that?
G MODD varroa destructor and TROPSIALIS Mites.
Breed them out of everywhere but there native land.
Can you do it??? I know you can. So why arent you???


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## SuiGeneris (Feb 13, 2018)

Struttinbuck said:


> Maybe you should keep out of books a little more and study the psychology of billionaires, politicians and the way people think they are smart when a degree tells them they are smart.(Boy that school costs alot)
> People just seriously don't like condascending people.
> Look where the college minds have taken us.
> How far is Australia away from the Indonesia Islands?
> ...


LOL, I teach genetic engineering as part of my job, and use it nearly daily as part of the research lab I run. Far from book knowledge, I'm literally am an "expert user". Psychology is irrelevant - you cannot overcome fundamental limitations of physics & chemistry by thinking about it hard. Most of the rest you wrote is unintelligible, but if I interpreted the end bit right, no we cannot modify AFB to get rid of it or control it. We may be able to do so with varroa, and indeed, such experiments are in progress. Gene drives may actually solve that problem one day.


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## Struttinbuck (Mar 8, 2020)

SuiGeneris said:


> LOL, I teach genetic engineering as part of my job, and use it nearly daily as part of the research lab I run. Far from book knowledge, I'm literally am an "expert user". Psychology is irrelevant - you cannot overcome fundamental limitations of physics & chemistry by thinking about it hard. Most of the rest you wrote is unintelligible, but if I interpreted the end bit right, no we cannot modify AFB to get rid of it or control it. We may be able to do so with varroa, and indeed, such experiments are in progress. Gene drives may actually solve that problem one day.


Your interpretation of something written was so bad, you pretty much changed the whole story.
Psychology of billionaires is your world .
If it wasnt for them, your industry would not exist.
They make creatures glow. They G Modded the Pacific salmon. There have been more G Modds to grain than anything else on the planet.
So help us out.
Whats wrong? No financial interest? Whats up man? What is the next big G Modd project?


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## Struttinbuck (Mar 8, 2020)

SuiGeneris said:


> LOL, I teach genetic engineering as part of my job, and use it nearly daily as part of the research lab I run. Far from book knowledge, I'm literally am an "expert user". Psychology is irrelevant - you cannot overcome fundamental limitations of physics & chemistry by thinking about it hard. Most of the rest you wrote is unintelligible, but if I interpreted the end bit right, no we cannot modify AFB to get rid of it or control it. We may be able to do so with varroa, and indeed, such experiments are in progress. Gene drives may actually solve that problem one day.


So you didnt know that the varroa destructor mite originated in the Indonesian Islands. Did you know Australia does not have varroa destructor? Also is there a closer landmass to Australia than the indonesian islands? Besides Taz and NZ? If there is a closer land mass. The miracle that should be written about is that the college yuppies in the US let varroa destructor into our environment before the Aussies did!!!
That was on the opposite side of the planet!!! There is your billionair and corporate psychology class for the day. 
These folks we have representing us are Soooooo crooked and rotten to the core. Its so nasty and crooked. And all youll ever know is the boss wants you to work on G Modding corn. Lol.
I know not your fault. But don't dupe people by brandishing your degrees either. If you say you dont have a boss. I guarantee your checks are not funded by you.


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## Akademee (Apr 5, 2020)

Well this has certainly been a wild ride


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## Struttinbuck (Mar 8, 2020)

Akademee said:


> Well this has certainly been a wild ride


It's the complex words I use. Along with the complex ideas of politicians and corporate CEO's. Its really hard to follow. I know.
Cheers 
The other point of view is so simple. The combination of words used and technology that takes millions of dollars worth of equipment just to get a look at what they are dealing with. 
Yea. Lotsa trust in these corporations and politicians.
Hey, hey, at least crypto currency was built entirely on anti trust right???
What was it now? Trust no man, trust no machine and trust nothing with your money.
And Bitcoin was born.
But trust the genetic engineers. Purely trust.


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## crofter (May 5, 2011)

I though I had logged onto Tailgater by mistake


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## Struttinbuck (Mar 8, 2020)

Something about having a guy with a phd start their condascending comments to the peons. I just show the same exact respect back that they show me. And I can't get enough of it. And the funny part is that they tell the peons that they know everything about their area of expertise when the only areas they know about are the ones their employer wants them to look into. Wether they own the business or work for an agricultural company. Whatever. So the only people that know the cutting edge of the technology are not employess of bayer or Monsanto. It is the Wuhan laboratories getting money from the US government to do gain of function testing. And once China has something either in their hands or any new technology. The peoples Republic of China own it. Not the company. The Chinese government. 
We need to G Modd snakehead fish, varroa mites, and all the other nasties out of here. And the moment they say it can't be done is because they are not working on it. They have no financial backing to do it. So the PHDs say ( They can't do that )
It truly cannot get any simpler. They sure are financing the jumping over of viruses from 1 species to another.
Its time they help us. Not giant corporations.


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## A Novice (Sep 15, 2019)

Struttinbuck said:


> Maybe you should keep out of books a little more and study the psychology of billionaires, politicians and the way people think they are smart when a degree tells them they are smart.(Boy that school costs alot)
> People just seriously don't like condascending people.
> Look where the college minds have taken us.
> How far is Australia away from the Indonesia Islands?
> ...


Guys.
This has nothing to do with Foulbrood, and nothing to do with honey bees, and if you keep going they will turn off this thread and none of us will have the opportunity to discuss either. Can you take it off line?


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## A Novice (Sep 15, 2019)

Struttinbuck said:


> Something about having a guy with a phd start their condascending comments to the peons. I just show the same exact respect back that they show me. And I can't get enough of it. And the funny part is that they tell the peons that they know everything about their area of expertise when the only areas they know about are the ones their employer wants them to look into. Wether they own the business or work for an agricultural company. Whatever. So the only people that know the cutting edge of the technology are not employess of bayer or Monsanto. It is the Wuhan laboratories getting money from the US government to do gain of function testing. And once China has something either in their hands or any new technology. The peoples Republic of China own it. Not the company. The Chinese government.
> We need to G Modd snakehead fish, varroa mites, and all the other nasties out of here. And the moment they say it can't be done is because they are not working on it. They have no financial backing to do it. So the PHDs say ( They can't do that )
> It truly cannot get any simpler. They sure are financing the jumping over of viruses from 1 species to another.
> Its time they help us. Not giant corporations.


From the fullness of the heart, the mouth speaks (or fingers type)

It is pretty clear you have no direct knowledge or experience in the things you are asserting.


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## Struttinbuck (Mar 8, 2020)

A Novice said:


> From the fullness of the heart, the mouth speaks (or fingers type)
> 
> It is pretty clear you have no direct knowledge or experience in the things you are asserting.





A Novice said:


> From the fullness of the heart, the mouth speaks (or fingers type)
> 
> It is pretty clear you have no direct knowledge or experience in the things you are asserting.


Respectful communication goes a long way. The fact foul brood is so much worse Down Under has to lead to questions. Old Timer came up with a good theory. But is that it? What else can it be? This is how people get to the bottom of such issues. If you are satisfied with FB is bad Down Under and you have no questions then respectfully , your satisfied. Like mentally. other people will not be. 
Did you have any idea FB was worse in Australia?


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## Amibusiness (Oct 3, 2016)

Oldtimers got a lot of good info in here about foulbrood. Let's keep the thread live. So, strutt, whether you are right or not, start a new thread on that. And, novice, don't tell him to go away and then egg him on!!
Edit, strutt beat me to it....


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## A Novice (Sep 15, 2019)

Amibusiness said:


> Oldtimers got a lot of good info in here about foulbrood. Let's keep the thread live. So, strutt, whether you are right or not, start a new thread on that. And, novice, don't tell him to go away and then egg him on!!
> Edit, strutt beat me to it....


I agree. And I don't want him to go away. just stay on topic. It is easy to get distracted, and I can understand why things get off topic. I have gotten a bit defensive myself lately bc somebody implied something I didn't like.

It is interesting that foulbrood is a big problem down under, while it is really pretty rare in the US at this point in time.


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

A Novice said:


> I don't want him to go away.


Takes more than that to scare me away LOL 😄


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Oldtimer said:


> Takes more than that to scare me away LOL 😄


According to the Tailgate saga - YES. LOL


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## A Novice (Sep 15, 2019)

Oldtimer said:


> Takes more than that to scare me away LOL 😄


Hmmm
The danger of using pronouns.
I assumed the him that Amibusiness referred to was Struttinbuck, and my comment was based on that.
To rephrase for the sake of clarity. I do not want Struttinbuck to go away, just to focus on the topic at hand.

He has a good question, which is Why is AFB such a problem in New Zealand, but almost unheard of in the US? (I think that is a fair paraphrase)

Lots of possible reasons. 

Could be that the propolis composition is somewhat different, as the tree species are completely different. Could be differences in availability of antibiotics. Could just be that a crowd draws a crowd.

Could be that the bees have adapted differently. Could be related to the different relationship between the earth's magnetic field and the location of the sun, as bees navigate by both, and they originated in the northern hemisphere.


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## SuiGeneris (Feb 13, 2018)

A Novice said:


> He has a good question, which is Why is AFB such a problem in New Zealand, but almost unheard of in the US? (I think that is a fair paraphrase)
> 
> Lots of possible reasons.
> 
> ...


I think the reason has nothing to do with foulbrood, but rather knowledge. New Zealand is undergoing an AFB eradication program right now, so there is heightened awareness, a gov-funded educational campaign, pretty strict regulations that include mandatory reporting of AFB, enforcement with penalties, etc. America (& Canada) has become lax in comparison, in many states (and provinces here in Canada) not even mandating that beekeeps report cases of AFB to an agricultural or other agency, and with control largely left upto the beekeep.

As an example, random sampling of hives in Canada in 2014-2015 found that in some regions, infection rates of 8-15% were common and consistent over two years. In comparison, New Zealand's "horrible problem" with AFB is less than 1% of hives infected with AFB.

You don't find what you don't look for, ignorance is bliss, etc.


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## Boondocks (Sep 16, 2020)

A Novice said:


> He has a good question, which is Why is AFB such a problem in New Zealand, but almost unheard of in the US? (I think that is a fair paraphrase)


AFB is a lot more common than you realize. 
2019- AFB outbreak in several counties in NW Tennessee Devastating Disease Hits West Tennessee Honey Bee Population - Manuka Honey USA
2018- AFB outbreak in middle Tennessee 
Maryland is using dogs to sniff out AFB in beehives. Meet Mack, a Certified Bee Disease Detector Dog Protecting America's Honeybees
Scotland had an infected hive Bee disease confirmed in Perthshire
Saskatchewan, Canada had some AFB Investigation of clinical outbreaks of American foulbrood in honey-bee operations in Saskatchewan

I think a lot of times the hives are burned and it is not reported in the news.


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Boondocks said:


> AFB is a lot more common than you realize.


But again, why the commercials don't complain of it?
The commercial situation has been all set for a massive AFB breakout (akin to COVID) - for a very long time now.
Why not?
A massive cover up? 

Or read this swarm catching adventure (a good read!)


> - I caught 50 colonies this year.


People like this should be catching AFB right and left.
Swarm trapping should be outright a very risky proposition.
No? 








My 2021 Swarm Adventures


July 9 - I checked about half my traps in the last two days and saw a total of 2 bees at just one trap. The swarm season is getting old, but I suspect the heat wave also put a big kink in the brood cycle for most hives, and that probably has a effect on swarming. However, I am aware of at...




www.beesource.com





Yes - I am suggesting the existence of "AFB resistance". 
Just said it out loud..


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## Boondocks (Sep 16, 2020)

GregV said:


> But again, why the commercials don't complain of it?
> The commercial situation has been all set for a massive AFB breakout (akin to COVID) - for a very long time now.
> Why not?
> A massive cover up?
> ...


The same reason


GregV said:


> But again, why the commercials don't complain of it?
> The commercial situation has been all set for a massive AFB breakout (akin to COVID) - for a very long time now.
> Why not?
> A massive cover up?
> ...


I do not know, you should ask your state apiary inspector. 
I think AFB was more prevalent back in the 1980's and 1990's because they were treating AFB with antibiotics applied to the hives. Then AFB became resistant to the antibiotics and the powers that be decided to just burn infected hives which has slowed down the infection rate. Personally if I ever get it, I am burning the hives and starting over. It is too scary to mess around with.


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Boondocks said:


> I do not know, you should ask your state apiary inspector.


I don't know either.
But there is this feeling of either
1) something akin to COVID waiting to happen (and just being covered up as if a non-issue) or
2) the entire AFB talk is old news and more like routine flu/cold level issue (with a very low probability of death where it mostly can be ignored).


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## Boondocks (Sep 16, 2020)

GregV said:


> I don't know either.
> But there is this feeling of either
> 1) something akin to COVID waiting to happen (and just being covered up as if a non-issue) or
> 2) the entire AFB talk is old news and more like routine flu/cold level issue (with a very low probability of death where it mostly can be ignored).


Do you sell nucs, or queens? If so, would you let prospective buyers know you had some AFB in one of your apiaries this past year?
Do you line your hats with tin foil?


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## SuiGeneris (Feb 13, 2018)

GregV said:


> But again, why the commercials don't complain of it?


To avoid consequences or regulation, perhaps. 

Growing up on a cattle farm, we had a saying about ill animals - "shoot, shovel and shut-up". Easier to rid yourself of an ill animal than of a feisty ag inspector. Here (Ontario) a positive AFB test means that your apiary must destroy all contaminated hives, must prophylacticaly treat with oxytet for 2 years, and the affected beeyard is quarantined (meaning you cannot sell bees raised in that yard, or use them for mobile pollination) for two years. It works - we have the lowest AFB rates in the country - but its also easy to see why a commercial outfit would keep quiet about it. Consequences could be big for a company that makes a lot of $$$ off of bee sales or pollination services.


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Boondocks said:


> Do you sell nucs, or queens? If so, would you let prospective buyers know you had some AFB in one of your apiaries this past year?
> Do you line your hats with tin foil?


I don't do any of this.
However, I am an addicted swarm chaser and wonder when and if I will catch a case of AFB - IF it is presumably so common.


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

SuiGeneris said:


> To avoid consequences or regulation, perhaps.
> 
> Growing up on a cattle farm, we had a saying about ill animals - "shoot, shovel and shut-up".......


This all makes sense, but most any issue, IF significant enough, will eventually spill out.
Just a matter of time.
So it is either the issue is NOT significant enough OR it has not happened yet (which is strange to me - but I guess someone is good at covering up for so long).

Just look at this potential infection concentration - mind boggling:


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## SuiGeneris (Feb 13, 2018)

GregV said:


> So it is either the issue is NOT significant enough OR it has not happened yet (which is strange to me - but I guess someone is good at covering up for so long).


AFB is a relatively slowly transmitting infection and generally occurs over short distances (<2 km). This may be behind a paywall, but infected hives infect 0.02 new hives/day In other words, an infected hive transmits disease to an uninfected hive about once every 50 days. This makes it easy to break a chain of transmission, as destroying an infected hive and simply checking (and removing) any infected hives nearby is generally enough to stop a cluster. AFAIK, AFB is universally fatal to infected hives, so even if a hive is not identified or dealt with, it eventually removes itself as a source of contagion.

Also, most beekeeps do things that would limit spread - e.g. we try to limit robbing, clean up our dead-outs, etc.

EDIT: I should add that the slow rate of transmission doesn't mean that severe outbreaks cannot occur. But it does mean that it takes a long time for things to build up to that level, and that even modest interventions can have a pretty dramatic "dampening" effect on spread. Very different than COVID where in the absence of protective measures, an infected person will infect 3 to 6 others over 7-14 days. Much more explosive growth than AFB, and not really controllable with only isolation of a portion of infected individuals.


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

GregV said:


> I am an addicted swarm chaser and wonder when and if I will catch a case of AFB - IF it is presumably so common.


Re swarms, the risk of catching AFB from a swarm is present, but low.

First, a true story. I was working a bee yard when a hive swarmed right in front of me and the swarm landed in a nearby tree. So I hived it, then went to the parent hive to destroy surplus queen cells and ensure it would not issue any secondary swarms. But horror, the parent hive had AFB. Bummer!! Find out right after I put the swarm in some nice new gear . So I burned the parent hive that night, but decided to put the rest of the apiary including the swarm in quarantine and monitor. Two seasons later I let the apiary out of quarantine, and that was quite a few years ago now and the swarm never did get AFB.

Here's how it works. In a hive with AFB spores, spores get fed to a larva, and they quickly become active and multiply. They line the stomach wall of the larva, and after the 5 day larval period, when the larva stretches out to pupate, the stomach wall ruptures due to damage done by the AFB and the larva dies. The AFB then spread through the whole larva turning it into slimy brown goop, which the bees cannot properly clean and AFB gets spread through the hive.

Now here's the thing. - The AFB spores only have the 5 days of the pupal stage to build up into enough numbers to line the stomach and kill the larva. To achieve this, the larva has to be fed quite a few spores in the first place. If the larva is only fed say, one spore, that spore will not be able to build into enough numbers to kill the larva. The larva survives and is not turned into brown goop, and the disease does not spread.

Just how many spores have to be fed to a larva to give a fatal dose depends on what study you read. But they all agree that an initial dose of quite a few spores is needed.

So a hive can have a low level of AFB spores, but long as there are not enough of them to make it possible for quite a number of them to be fed to one larva and kill it, the disease will not become symptomatic in the hive, and the hive due to cleaning activities will over time purge itself of the spores.

So, to swarms. Swarms usually come from large healthy hives, so a heavily AFB infected hive is less likely to swarm. If a swarm comes from an infected hive it is most likely a lightly infected hive. The swarm then hangs up somewhere for a time, and is then hived by a beekeeper. It then spends several days building comb, the queen starts fattening and then starts laying eggs. The eggs hatch after 4 days. All this gives a time period of (perhaps) a week or so when there are no larvae available to be infected, and during that time the bees are cleaning, and defecating outside the hive. This lowers the amount of spores available to infect new larvae, once the first new larvae become available.

So risk of getting AFB from a swarm is low, but not impossible.


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

Oh, one more thing about that. The (reported) incidence of AFB in New Zealand over a number of recent years has been variable, but sometimes hovering roughly around 0.2%. That's 2 hives out of a thousand.

So the risk of a swarm being infected is presumably similar. Factor into that, that an infected swarm has a probability of purging itself of sufficient spore concentration to produce a symptomatic infection, the risk posed by swarms can be considered low.

All the same, there are some beekeepers who will put swarms in a cardboard box for a week or so, and after that re locate them to a hive. The theory being it gives the swarm even more time to reduce spore numbers before going into a proper hive.


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Oldtimer said:


> So risk of getting AFB from a swarm is low, but not impossible.


Which, btw, also suggests that brood-less splits are also beneficial in the AFB-prevention context.
Nothing but good to split brood-less.
Excited to see how my winter goes based on this method this year.


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## A Novice (Sep 15, 2019)

SuiGeneris said:


> I think the reason has nothing to do with foulbrood, but rather knowledge. New Zealand is undergoing an AFB eradication program right now, so there is heightened awareness, a gov-funded educational campaign, pretty strict regulations that include mandatory reporting of AFB, enforcement with penalties, etc. America (& Canada) has become lax in comparison, in many states (and provinces here in Canada) not even mandating that beekeeps report cases of AFB to an agricultural or other agency, and with control largely left upto the beekeep.
> 
> As an example, random sampling of hives in Canada in 2014-2015 found that in some regions, infection rates of 8-15% were common and consistent over two years. In comparison, New Zealand's "horrible problem" with AFB is less than 1% of hives infected with AFB.
> 
> You don't find what you don't look for, ignorance is bliss, etc.


PLEASE don't confuse the discussion with data.
You are reminding me of a story I read by Richard Feynmann several years ago. It was when he went to accept the Nobel Prize for Physics. I had to go and find it.

_“There was a Princess Somebody of Denmark sitting at a table with a number of people around her, and I saw an empty chair at their table and sat down.
She turned to me and said, "Oh! You're one of the Nobel-Prize-winners. In what field did you do your work?"
"In physics," I said.
"Oh. Well, nobody knows anything about that, so I guess we can't talk about it."
"On the contrary," I answered. "It's because somebody knows something about it that we can't talk about physics. It's the things that nobody knows anything about that we can discuss. We can talk about the weather; we can talk about social problems; we can talk about psychology; we can talk about international finance--gold transfers we can't talk about, because those are understood--so it's the subject that nobody knows anything about that we can all talk about!"
I don't know how they do it. There's a way of forming ice on the surface of the face, and she did it!”
― Richard P. Feynman, Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman!: Adventures of a Curious Character _


New Zealand's program is impressive. (here it is) AFB_Operational-Plan_Nov2021.pdf

It looks like they are trying to completely eradicate it.

In the US, it is don't look, don't ask, don't tell. don't know.


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## Gypsi (Mar 27, 2011)

GregV said:


> Possibly the climate has to do with it?
> 
> Still wondering how come we don't hear of massive AFB cases around the US - congested, cross-country migratory operations seem to be perfect for it.


I seem to remember an AFB outbreak in either Mississippi or Alabama back in winter of 2011-2012? A major bee supplier that was a son of a family company tried to sell me a hive from an apiary that had AFB and I was almost stupid enough to buy it


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## AHudd (Mar 5, 2015)

XXXXXXXXXX

Alex


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## AHudd (Mar 5, 2015)

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Alex


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## Gypsi (Mar 27, 2011)

AHudd said:


> XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
> 
> Alex


I got the original response in my email box. Very funny


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

Looking at those X's I can tell a funny story from many years ago. I was inspecting hives for AFB, and at a site found 2 hives with AFB. I normally marked any AFB hives with a felt marker pen so the owner would know which ones, but I had somehow lost the pen. So the young lady who was with me that day rummaged through her handbag and found a stick of lipstick, and drew 2 prominant large X's on the front of the two hives.

Next day I rang the beekeeper who was also the property owner to let him know, he was very disappointed. He had been told there had been a female on site and when he looked and saw the X's, thought she must have liked the hives and left him some kisses 🙄 😄.


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## joebeewhisperer (May 13, 2020)

SuiGeneris said:


> America (& Canada) has become lax in comparison





Boondocks said:


> AFB is a lot more common than you realize.
> 2019- AFB outbreak in several counties in NW Tennessee Devastating Disease Hits West Tennessee Honey Bee Population - Manuka Honey USA
> 2018- AFB outbreak in middle Tennessee





A Novice said:


> It looks like they are trying to completely eradicate it.
> 
> In the US, it is don't look, don't ask, don't tell. don't know.


Going to answer these collectively. The beek in Paris TN said in the article he was "concerned" for his hives. He did not say his hives had been affected. Tennessee has 7000+ registered beeks managing 42,000+ registered hives, all of which have to be inspected once a year. If you have a single hive in your back yard you are legally required to register. There are 2 basic layers of inspection, one can be carried out by certified bee club inspectors that are required to take a refresher course at the TBA (state org) conference regularly (I want to say annually, but for sure next March as I've seen the schedule). The results of these inspections are turned over to the state apiarist. There is a higher level inspection which must be done by 1 of 3-4 qualified individuals for anyone selling over 10 nucs, or any amount of queens.

Mike Studer (TN State Apiarist) said in a recent presentation given at the University of TN Knoxville's Master Beekeeper's class, that last year (2020) there were "4 or 5" instances of AFB in the entire state. While I generally dislike anyone legislating authority to come on your land and burn your property, that has been the law here since 1995. Mr Studer (and possibly his higher-level inspectors) bear the same rights in this state as game wardens. They are, in effect, law enforcement in this regard. Thankfully they are also beeks first and spend much of their time helping other beeks. The zero-tolerance in this state has led to a site infection rate of 5 of 7000. And this is assuming that every one of these occurrences was 1 hive on 5 different sites. Can't speak for any other area of the world, but AFB in our state is all-but eradicated.


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## Boondocks (Sep 16, 2020)

joebeewhisperer said:


> Going to answer these collectively. The beek in Paris TN said in the article he was "concerned" for his hives. He did not say his hives had been affected. Tennessee has 7000+ registered beeks managing 42,000+ registered hives, all of which have to be inspected once a year. If you have a single hive in your back yard you are legally required to register. There are 2 basic layers of inspection, one can be carried out by certified bee club inspectors that are required to take a refresher course at the TBA (state org) conference regularly (I want to say annually, but for sure next March as I've seen the schedule). The results of these inspections are turned over to the state apiarist. There is a higher level inspection which must be done by 1 of 3-4 qualified individuals for anyone selling over 10 nucs, or any amount of queens.
> 
> Mike Studer (TN State Apiarist) said in a recent presentation given at the University of TN Knoxville's Master Beekeeper's class, that last year (2020) there were "4 or 5" instances of AFB in the entire state. While I generally dislike anyone legislating authority to come on your land and burn your property, that has been the law here since 1995. Mr Studer (and possibly his higher-level inspectors) bear the same rights in this state as game wardens. They are, in effect, law enforcement in this regard. Thankfully they are also beeks first and spend much of their time helping other beeks. The zero-tolerance in this state has led to a site infection rate of 5 of 7000. And this is assuming that every one of these occurrences was 1 hive on 5 different sites. Can't speak for any other area of the world, but AFB in our state is all-but eradicated.


That's great, All I could find was the news reports on when the AFB was first reported in Tennessee. I could not find any follow up stories or articles.


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## joebeewhisperer (May 13, 2020)

Boondocks said:


> That's great, All I could find was the news reports on when the AFB was first reported in Tennessee. I could not find any follow up stories or articles.


This should open to page 285 of a 1914 Tennessee Agriculture Magazine article where J.M Davis of the TN Beekeeper's Association gave a talk on cleaning up an AFB infestation in 100 colonies during a single season while still producing a large comb-honey crop.








Tennessee Agriculture






www.google.com





Here is a publication from the TN Ag Dept in 2013 which gives some good info on page 10 on AFB.


https://ag.tennessee.edu/EPP/Extension%20Publications/Beekeeping%20in%20Tennessee.pdf



In the late 80s, Dad treated his hives with terramycin to kill out both types of foulbrood. I sometimes thought what he did was overkill, but it's what the county Ag departments recommended.

I usually don't mind some propaganda if it furthers my own interests. So when my wife's classmate who moved from TN to Los Angeles in the 1980s tells her "Your husband is saving the environment.", I just take the win without telling him there are 2 million registered hives sitting 350 miles from his home.

I'm not offended that you believed a headline. If I had only read that and wasn't involved here, I would have taken it the same way. But folks have angles, and it's hard to draw clicks with "Tennessee bees among the healthiest in the nation, possibly the world." or "A piece of state legislation that actually accomplished it's purpose. State nearly free of deadly bee disease." -- OK, maybe I would read those as well.


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## AHudd (Mar 5, 2015)

Gypsi said:


> I got the original response in my email box. Very funny


Thanks, it was meant to be fun, but I made those comments before I had read far enough down to see how contentious the thread had become. I didn't want to fan the flames.

Alex


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## A Novice (Sep 15, 2019)

Good for Tennessee! In Wisconsin hive inspection is voluntary, and hive inspectors have no real authority. I assumed that was true for the rest of the USA. My apologies to Tennessee, and other places in the USA that have similar regulations in force.

Most beekeepers here in Wisconsin are responsible, but I was informed confidentially by someone who had reason to know (don't want to finger anyone) to avoid one local beekeeper because he has foulbrood in his hives. He runs a lot of hives (for 1 guy with a pickup truck) and is prominent, well liked, and respected. A good guy but a bad beekeeper. He would give you the shirt off his back, but don't take it.

I'm speculating that he keeps things sort of under control with antibiotics.

Thankfully, I am pretty isolated from other beekeepers, except for the wannabeekeepers, and most of them wash out in 2 years or so. I hope never to know more about foulbrood than I can learn by reading.


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

A Novice said:


> He would give you the shirt off his back, but don't take it.


LOL A Novice that's a good one, I'll have to stash that little snippet in my memory bank 😉


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## Litsinger (Jun 14, 2018)

The latest Kentucky Beelines had a good write-up on AFB (attached) and makes reference to an outbreak in the Commonwealth last summer 😬.

There is also a reference to this good video from the Dyce Lab:






Thought it worth hanging somewhere.


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## Litsinger (Jun 14, 2018)

Litsinger said:


> The latest Kentucky Beelines had a good write-up on AFB (attached) ...


And an update this month from our State Apiarist- I was not aware of this assay technique:




As a follow-up to Dr. Leonard Davis' fine article about American foulbrood, I'd like to remind beekeepers of another "tool" in the toolbox when identifying this disease. When the disease has progressed from bacteria to spore-stage (i.e., "scale"), as can happen if beekeepers go on long vacations or get busy during summer and cannot check their hives in a timely manner, beekeepers can detect the presence of AFB spores by using a UV flashlight, using at 365 nanometers (nm), but preferably 400 nm. Although the beekeeper does not need to be in complete darkness, the beekeeper will find it much easier to see the teal-green color of the spores in shaded areas.​





These UV flashlights can be purchased at big box retail stores or hardware stores for approximately $15-20.00.​

















As always, beekeepers should be very cautious when handling diseased equipment, use disposable gloves, disinfect equipment, and wash beekeeping jackets. I strongly discourage accepting used equipment because infected equipment is one of the primary methods by which American foulbrood is spread.​

















A frame of American Foulbrood seen without UV flashlight. Photo courtesy of Don Hopkins, North Carolina State Apiarist​

















A frame of American Foulbrood seen under a UV flashlight. Photo courtesy of Don Hopkins, North Carolina State Apiarist​


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## G3farms (Jun 13, 2009)

Thanks, that is something I did not know!


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## HaplozygousNut (Dec 30, 2015)

Cool! I will try looking for American foulbrood with UV flashlights. I haven't noticed any symptoms of AFB in our hives before, but I have wondered whether bees could be resistant to it and so AFB could be present in our hives without causing illness. I have read that a person in New Mexico tried infecting hives with AFB and failed after several attempts. But that person's hives with old black comb would get sick with AFB.


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