# Critique of my TBH Intentions



## gregsky88 (Mar 21, 2012)

I am a newbee getting my first package to place in my 90% complete built 36" TBH in about two weeks and really want things to go well. I would appreciate experienced TBH beekeeper critique of my below intentions that are mostly based on forum and internet information.
1) I will place my hive in an afternoon shaded, wind protected area anchored to the ground with legs set in cans on oil.
2) I have 1 1/4" and 1 1/2" top bars for brood and honey with a 3/16" wood strip inserted in a routed groove starting 1" in from the sides. 
3) Although I haven't drilled the entrance holes at this time, I intend to have (3) 7/8" holes in the lowest portion of each end of the hive. I intend to cork one end to start with so there is only one entrance. 
4) I do not intend on having a screen in the bottom of my TBH. 
5) I intend to put a divider board half way with an opening to an inverted quart jar with "tiny" pinholes in the metal lid sealed to the divider board with a 1 to 1 sugar mixture on the back side of the divider board. 
6) I have room for about 24 top bars and plan on an even number of 1 1/4" brood and 1 1/2" honey bars. 
7) I intend to place the 1 1/4" brood bars closest to the opening that I initially leave open.
8) I intend on directly placing my clipped/marked queen and package in the hive.
9) I intend on lightly misting the screen of the package but avoid spraying the actual bees due to the low humidity in my West Texas area.
Is there anything that needs adjustment in the above plan. I am scheduled to meet with a local beekeeper that has mostly Langsthrom hives and one TBH but am very open to any experienced beekeeper suggestions.


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## rtoney (Apr 20, 2011)

Here is a link to some pictures of my hive 
http://s1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa345/rtoney12/
I would not drill holes and I think in your area I might put a screen on the bottom other then that many ways will work.
Good luck


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## taydeko (Jan 3, 2012)

This all sounds pretty good. I have comments below.



gregsky88 said:


> 1) I will place my hive in an afternoon shaded, wind protected area anchored to the ground with legs set in cans on oil.


You might want to devise some kind of suspended cover for the oil cans to keep your bees from falling into them. You have to raise them from the top of the cans a little, of course, so the ants can't reach the covers. I used cans for a while, but now I am using heavy grease on the legs.



gregsky88 said:


> 2) I have 1 1/4" and 1 1/2" top bars for brood and honey with a 3/16" wood strip inserted in a routed groove starting 1" in from the sides.


This sounds fine, but you might want to check the distance from the hive wall to the start of the wood strip to see if it stops the bar from falling into the hive if it pushed all the way on one side. I make my bars so that they can't fall into the hive unless they are turned at an angle. It all depends on the length of the bar and the width of the hive.



gregsky88 said:


> 3) Although I haven't drilled the entrance holes at this time, I intend to have (3) 7/8" holes in the lowest portion of each end of the hive. I intend to cork one end to start with so there is only one entrance.


Michael Bush recommends not having any holes in your hive body. The last two hives I built are like that. Just push the bars away from the end of the hive 3/8 to 1/2 inch and voila! An entrance. You could probably do this at either end if you wanted to, although it is a little easier if your hive was built with this extra size in mind.



gregsky88 said:


> 5) I intend to put a divider board half way with an opening to an inverted quart jar with "tiny" pinholes in the metal lid sealed to the divider board with a 1 to 1 sugar mixture on the back side of the divider board.


I am just going to set the feeder into the hive and forget about the divider board.



gregsky88 said:


> 6) I have room for about 24 top bars and plan on an even number of 1 1/4" brood and 1 1/2" honey bars.


I just use 1 1/2" bars and let the bees decide what to do with them. They don't seem to have any problems with that. I think I might get burned for saying that, but that's what I do.



gregsky88 said:


> 9) I intend on lightly misting the screen of the package but avoid spraying the actual bees due to the low humidity in my West Texas area.


I don't really understand this comment. Not sure what the humidity has to do with misting the bees.

I also think 36 inches is a little small. Not much you can do about that. It doesn't give you that much room for growth and probably requires more management. My hives are 42 inches inside dimensions which is recommended by local master beekeepers. I have heard of larger ones too. I don't think it would be good to go much beyond 48 inches though. I don't use screen bottoms any more, and I don't know anyone who does in my area.

Ted


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## Steven Ogborn (Jun 3, 2011)

Hey Greg. 
Everything sounds like it'll work ok.
There is something that I tried this year with my packages last week...You're worried about the lack of humidity
when spraying your bees with syrup to keep them from flying when you install them. Yeah, they can get all crusty
and die from it if they can't clean themselves before they dry out. This year I used just plain water. They were 
walking around in the cage and wanting to bee busy. Then I sprayed them with the plain water and they just
"leafed" down so still just like a cluster of bees in the rain. They looked like little bee leaves hanging from
the top of the cage. Bonked them down in the cage, poured them in the hives and no noticable dead bees
from it. I had very few dead bees in the cage to begin with.


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## Steven Ogborn (Jun 3, 2011)

I still feel it's safer to release your queens from the candy end. So you have to go back and pull an empty
queen cage from the bottom of the hive. You don't have to do hundreds of them. It only takes a couple
of minutes.


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## gregsky88 (Mar 21, 2012)

Here is a link to some pictures of my hive 
http://s1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa345/rtoney12/
I would not drill holes and I think in your area I might put a screen on the bottom other then that many ways will work.
Good luck

I tried to open your pic link but it stated that it was a private album and required a password.


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## gregsky88 (Mar 21, 2012)

Thanks for the experienced advice. I was planning on just spraying the package screen with a sugar water mixture but they should have some mixture left in the package can I suppose so may try only water. I read on one site to use a diluted vinegar mixture in a spray bottle instead of smoke when working them. Have you ever heard of this approach? Do you use smoke or any other calming method while working your TBH?


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## gregsky88 (Mar 21, 2012)

Steven Ogborn said:


> I still feel it's safer to release your queens from the candy end. So you have to go back and pull an empty
> queen cage from the bottom of the hive. You don't have to do hundreds of them. It only takes a couple
> of minutes.


I am such a newbee I don't have a good understanding of the queen cage, candy end, plug etc. I have watched a couple of youtube videos but am still unclear. Can you give me some detail?


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## gregsky88 (Mar 21, 2012)

taydeko said:


> This all sounds pretty good. I have comments below.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you very much for your comments.

1) Greasing the legs sounds like a good idea.
2) We have notched about 1/2" on the end of the bars about 1/8" deep so they sit down on the sides and don't move side to side.
3) So with no entrance holes in the sides do the bees just enter under the ends of the cover? I have 1/2" of polystyrene foam board insulating the top but I guess I can just cut a strip on the end away. Comments?
5) I saw one comment on the forum about a chick water with marbles in the the trough on the back side of the divider board with a hole drilled in the divider board. May go that route.
6) I have seen comments about splitting the difference and making all bars 1 3/8", I guess the bees will do what they do regardless of the width.
I am still a little unclear about broodcomb and honeycomb, where they build (close to entrance), if both are wax and just what they actually look like.
9) I read that really low humidity may cause the sugar water to crust on the bees before they can get themselves cleaned up and consequently disable and kill them.
This is the site we built our TBH from. 
http://beenatural.wordpress.com/plans/kenyan-tbh/
If all goes well, we will adapt this design on our next hive based on what we learn on our initial adventure.


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## Steven Ogborn (Jun 3, 2011)

*Re: methods of releasing queen*

Wooden queen cages(Benton type) are made from a 3/4" piece of wood with 3 holes drilled almost through them.
These holes overlap forming a chamber in that it looks like 3 circles combined together. A small piece of screen
is stapled over the open side of this wooden block. On the end of this block are 2 holes, one on each end.
They're about 5/16" to 3/8". these are filled tiny little corks. There should be some white frosting like stuff
in one of the voids created on the inside of the cage, covered with a little piece of paper, between the
queen candy and the screening. To slow release the queen, you'll pull the cork on the end of the cage
that has the queen candy in the end of it. If you want to direct release the queen you'll pull the cork
from the end that doesn't have the candy on it. Then the queen can just walk out when she wants.
Or, you can just pull the staple out holding the screen on the cage and let her out like that.

Some plastic cages(jz-bz type) have a tube on the bottom of the cage that is filled with candy. Pull the cap off
of it, exposing the queen candy.


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## gregsky88 (Mar 21, 2012)

Steven Ogborn said:


> Wooden queen cages(Benton type) are made from a 3/4" piece of wood with 3 holes drilled almost through them.
> These holes overlap forming a chamber in that it looks like 3 circles combined together. A small piece of screen
> is stapled over the open side of this wooden block. On the end of this block are 2 holes, one on each end.
> They're about 5/16" to 3/8". these are filled tiny little corks. There should be some white frosting like stuff
> ...


Thank you for identifying the different queen cages by name. I was able to google the names and actually find some site with photos...much clearer now and I know what to expect when my package arrives.


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## rtoney (Apr 20, 2011)

Sorry about that.
http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa345/rtoney12/bees6-1.jpg
http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa345/rtoney12/bees7.jpg
http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa345/rtoney12/bees5.jpg
http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa345/rtoney12/bees2.jpg
http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa345/rtoney12/bees8.jpg
Try these we will see if they work


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## Steven Ogborn (Jun 3, 2011)

Sorry, that was supposed to go on the "methods of releasing queen" thread.
Ooops, my bad.
I'm so confused!


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## gregsky88 (Mar 21, 2012)

rtoney said:


> Sorry about that.
> http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa345/rtoney12/bees6-1.jpg
> http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa345/rtoney12/bees7.jpg
> http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa345/rtoney12/bees5.jpg
> ...


Yep...thanks.


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## taydeko (Jan 3, 2012)

gregsky88 said:


> Thank you very much for your comments.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## rtoney (Apr 20, 2011)

Here is a video of my cross comb experence.
http://youtu.be/nn9unz_3S5U

This was a new swarm I had caught and they build faster then one would think.


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## Bush_84 (Jan 9, 2011)

That looks like a mess!


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## rtoney (Apr 20, 2011)

It was at the time but alls good now. My first hive, first swarm, first cross comb. Sometimes you just have to jump in with both feet and see where the honey falls:lookout:


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## gregsky88 (Mar 21, 2012)

rtoney said:


> Here is a video of my cross comb experence.
> http://youtu.be/nn9unz_3S5U
> 
> This was a new swarm I had caught and they build faster then one would think.


Wow...that looks like a mess but it appears that you got it all back on track in a couple weeks or so.
As a beginner, can you tell me how I could avoid the cross bar combing?


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## Merlinspop (Nov 4, 2010)

gregsky88 said:


> Wow...that looks like a mess but it appears that you got it all back on track in a couple weeks or so.
> As a beginner, can you tell me how I could avoid the cross bar combing?


Triangular comb guides appear to have good success rates. Check frequently enough to catch the cross combing before it gets bad. A swarm builds comb faster than a package, generally. If you see them festooning, notice where the two ends of the chain are. Same bar? Probably G-t-G. Across several... prepare to repair. (I just made that phrase up)

Good luck!


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## rtoney (Apr 20, 2011)

Make sure your hive is level and don't be afraid to go in and keep an eye on them. This mess was in about a week and a 1/2. I had my guides on but it did not help here just go in every 3-4 days until you know they are building straight and they will take over from there. I now have straight comb to put in my new hives to give them a start but I did not at the time.


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## JYawn (Dec 6, 2011)

Merlinspop said:


> ... prepare to repair. (I just made that phrase up)


Merlin is a word magician!


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