# Soilid or Screen Bottom Board???



## jdpro5010 (Mar 22, 2007)

I believe most will tell you to use a screened bottom board. I personally use solid bottom boards. SBB are nice to use to check your mite drop with and do provide the extra ventilation you need in July and August.  They do not add to any significant amount to mite removal from the hive in my opinion and they are more of a pain in the butt to maintain as far as painting and such and are more expensive than a solid bottom board.


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## StevenG (Mar 27, 2009)

Plans on Bee Source show how to make a sbb http://www.beesource.com/build-it-yourself/ipm-screened-bottom-board/

I eliminated the bottom groove into which slides the closure, or the sticky board to test for mites. Instead, I build the sloped front stands, and nail a block on each side in the center of the side rails of the stand. Those scrap pieces of wood then supports the sticky board, or a piece of plywood for winter closure.
Regards,
Steven


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## Oldbee (Sep 25, 2006)

Assemble and paint/weatherproof the Solid Bottom board if that is all you have now. For a new package there is plenty of time [early summer] to prepare and use a Screened bottom board later if you decide to use one.

Just a few years ago it seems that the screened boards were seperate items and were placed on the older solid boards. Now it looks like they are in one piece from the suppliers. Not sure about that though.


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## eba1225 (Nov 23, 2009)

Ahhh...so you have a modified screen bottom board, basically a screen bottom with a winter feature. :applause:


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## eba1225 (Nov 23, 2009)

I have separate boards, one screened and one solid. I can always modify the screened to make it a dual screen and solid.


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## honeydreams (Aug 10, 2009)

I use a SBB the only time I close it is when I am doing a mite count, It gets real darn cold, requeening, or placing a package in. out side of that its open year round. I live on the Olympic Penisula on the raininy side were we get 7-9 feet of rain per year and have high humidity levels. my bees do great. Also the queen will lay all the way to the bottom of the frames with a SBB. 
But that is my opinon. Others may vary.


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## iwombat (Feb 3, 2009)

Honey, you're probably not doing yourself any favors opening up the bottom board around here. Mites prefer a cooler hive, and leaving it open is probably increasing your mite counts. I leave mine closed all year round.


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## mike haney (Feb 9, 2007)

"...a cooler hive.."
the bees will controll the temperature to be the same regardless of the type of bottom. brood have a very narrow temperature range for survival. good luck,mike


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## mike haney (Feb 9, 2007)

eba1225 said:


> Good Day all.
> This is my first year .... I have this one nagging question and I can't seem to find a defiinitive answer.:scratch:
> 
> Do I use a Screened Bottom Board or a Solid Bottom board?
> ...


mostly depends on 2 things
1-do you have a lot of humidity in your area? an open screened bottom and a top vent will HELP the bees a lot. they can do it themselves but will spend a lot of energy that could be used elsewhere-like gathering nectar.
2-they (commercially made ones) make it easier to check for mite drops. you just slide out a solid board that fits in grooves made into the bottom. or you can do the same with a solid bottom- you just have to take the boxes off to get to it.
good luck,mike


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## honeyman46408 (Feb 14, 2003)

I use SBBs all year around, I can close them and they are fitted with a pan that helps catch SHBs larva and some adults in oil I have the option of useing the pan or plastic cardboard to close them but mostly I let the snow close them in winter. I leave the opening @ 5/16" so no mouse guards either.


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## honeydreams (Aug 10, 2009)

Iwambat, I don't have a mite problem my hives are strong in great health and the last nice day I have good brood and eggs and larva. my mite counts are very low and I atribute it a sbb. Other beeks that live local to me lost most of their hives this year every one used a regular BB now does that meen a SBB is the cure all no I just see the benifits for me and my bees.


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## iwombat (Feb 3, 2009)

Honey, that's good! Just thought I'd drop in a warning. There's quite a bit of research showing open sbbs and an increase in mites.


Just one from the Tucson AHB/Mites Conference RIFA Control

"Temperature seems to have more of an impact on Varroa reproduction than most people thought. While 95ºF is “brood nest temperature,” that temperature fluctuates some with climatic conditions. By carefully controlling temperature, Varroa were found to reproduce best at 93ºF. Performance was a bit worse at 88-91 and 95º. At the lower than brood nest temperatures, the post-capping period is extended about one day per 2ºF. At higher temperatures the post-capping period is not shortened significantly. However, at “brood nest” and higher temperatures, mite reproduction drops way off. In the same study it was shown that 53% of the mites on brood held at 59-68% RH (normal) reproduced normally but at humiditys of 79-85% only 2% of the mites reproduced. *Hot, humid brood nests are tough on Varroa.* Studies of Apis cerana brood nests showed drone brood is reared at 92ºF (perfect for Varroa) and worker brood is incubated at 96-98ºF (too hot for Varroa). *Purposely cooling the brood nest in Apis mellifera colonies by using a “thin” hive lid, open bottom board, simulative feeding to spread brood out, and splitting the brood nest with frames of foundation doubled the numbers of mites on the bees.*”


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## mike haney (Feb 9, 2007)

thanks for the quote on the research. i was not aware of that. good luck,mike


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## peacekeeperapiaries (Jun 23, 2009)

Its really your call, I know lots of beeks who use solid BB's and many using SBB's. We have SBB's on everything and although I question their ability to reduce mites, in our heat the ventilation is surely a benefit. Our SBB's are not slotted for a slide in solid board but we do mite drop counts by placing the plastic sign (sticky with PAM) material under the hive and pull it out when time to count. There are plenty of beeks using SBB's in northern climates who also leave them open YEAR ROUND as cold usually does not kill bees but moisture in the hive, again ventilation being the benefit of SBB's and no pooling of the moisture on the solid BB as the condensation drips off the inner cover. :thumbsup: good luck


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## Eaglerock (Jul 8, 2008)

I have always liked a solid BB....  Just depends on you.


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## jmgi (Jan 15, 2009)

Solid bottom boards were used for over 100 yrs. without anyone complaining, now, as a result of the varroa mite, screened bottoms are in style for mite counting and increased ventilation. I'm sticking with the solid bottoms myself.


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## hoodswoods (May 15, 2009)

An SBB above an oil trap allows me to better understand what's going on in my hives without having to pull boxes and frames. I don't see a problem with drafting because the oil pan pretty much shuts that off, and there is little evidence that top or bottom vents contribute to cold weather issues - but seem to help with hot/humid summer conditions.

Here in the south, I wouldn't set up a hive without one above an oil trap. They are an added expense, but I remember what I went thru adding one last summer - it wasn't so much the process as the anxiety. Making hardware changes is never pleasant. Come up with a good plan (with easy backout scenarios) then other than the necessary maintenance and crisis management...


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## CentralPAguy (Feb 8, 2009)

I use SBB and Solid BB as they have their minuses and plusses.

I took 39 hives into winter and 37 are coming thru. Most of my hives are on SBB. My two hives that died and several that are rather weak are on SBB. These were strong hives going into winter. I am just suspicious that it let too much cold enter the hive and I will be trying something different this using solid bottom board.

I think that a solid Bottom Board would trap the heat in in order to allow Brood to occur sooner in Feb timeframe.

I love the SBB for ventilation. I particularly didn't like my girls washboarding even if it did look neat. I want them doing functional work inside the hive.

The other thing that I'd like to believe is true is that an SBB allows mites that were groomed off the bees to fall to the outside thus never getting another chance to climb back up on your bees.


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## jbw (Mar 8, 2009)

If logic prevails I feel it makes no sense to have the mites drop and then have the bees enter from below and pick them back up on the way in and out. I use SBB and top entry.


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## eba1225 (Nov 23, 2009)

Guys,

Thanks :thumbsup:for all of your insight and as expected this is a hobby of Trial and Error.:scratch:

So thanks for the info and the wisdom that you all provide. 

I am still not sure what I will use but am leaning to the solid bottom, don't ask why just have a feeling.

Again thanks for the info.

Erik


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## Yuleluder (Mar 2, 2005)

My nucleus hives use solid bottom boards, but my full hive use SBB's. The only thing I really notice between the two is that the SBB provide better ventilation and you can also view anything the bees are dropping. Screen bottom boards are pretty cool during the winter months because you can get an approximate location of the cluster if you place a piece of cardboard under the hive the uncappings point to where the cluster is.


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## Bodhi (Aug 30, 2009)

StevenG said:


> Plans on Bee Source show how to make a sbb http://www.beesource.com/build-it-yourself/ipm-screened-bottom-board/


I just built four of these and like the way they came out.


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## Reid (Dec 3, 2008)

I'm with Iwombat on this one.
Screened bottom boards close year round (though I did open them up on those days over 95 last year when the bees were bearding all night).
My only complaint about screened BB's is the pollen I notice getting scrapped off, or otherwise lost) through the screen. Yes, not a big deal with a so many loads coming in, but I'm trying to help them not hinder them.

Anyone know how small a screen you can get away with and still allow the mites to fall through? Maybe a slightly smaller screen would minimize the pollen getting snagged. Or are the bees accidentally dropping it? 
Anyone know of a tiny, propolis-proof camera? 
~Reid


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## Fred Bee (May 5, 2007)

Erik,
If you decide to go with a solid bottom board, remember the common practice of slightly tilting your hive forward so if moisture gathers on the solid bottom board it will run out of the hive. With the screened bottom board the hive can be level (or tilted for that matter) as the moisture will just drain out through the screen.


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## honeydreams (Aug 10, 2009)

hey reid,
I live on the coast and get way more rain then you in king county. I keep my SBB open year round never hurt my bees one bit. infact i think its helped them.


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## eba1225 (Nov 23, 2009)

Fred Bee, yep am well aware of the tilt of the hive forward. This is the first question that I have had as most of my questions have been answered by my readings.

As was said in other posts READ...READ....READ.

I may build one of those that Bodhi provided a link to for use next year.... maybe.


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## Reid (Dec 3, 2008)

honeydreams said:


> hey reid,
> I live on the coast and get way more rain then you in king county. I keep my SBB open year round never hurt my bees one bit. infact i think its helped them.


 Honeydreams, the reason I blocked up the back doors to my bottom boards is not because of rain, but wind (but maybe less windy where you are in Brady with those winds comming off the coast). 

Last year I was running 4 hives with top and bottom entrances. I live up on a hill that gets pretty windy and 3 of the hives were on an elevated carport roof completely exposed to winds from all directions except east. The stack effect generated by the two hives with both bottom openings (front porch and back mite board access) combined with a full width top entrence, which was probably helpful in the summer, was significantly more than I expected in the winter. Based on my measurements with a thermo-anemometer I borrowed from work, the air velocity coming out the top entrances of these two hives during a steady wind was twice that of the hive with only the front porch opening at the bottom. The orientation of the openings also played a significant role, but plugging up mite board opening was the easy fix given the season. 

Basically I made it too drafty for my bees. An open SBB mite board access area is probably not that big a deal with only a bottom entrance as the airflow just skips across the board and out the low front porch opening (or visa versa). Put a top entrance on that hive and you can get (based on opening orientation) all kinds of air being pulled out the top or all kinds of cool air being pull in through the top. Either way, an exceptionally unnatural situation and likely a bad deal for the bees.

~Reid


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## Adrian Quiney WI (Sep 14, 2007)

JMGI is right in that SBB's are in style, and in some ways it's a matter of confidence, and comfort level. One poster, in reference to unproven mite controls and organic-type practices, mentioned "Faith Based Beekeeping". He appeared to be somewhat sarcastic about it. Yet I am comfortable with that label, and last year used screened bottom boards and sugar dusting as my mite controls. My hives are still alive, are they going to thrive this summer? Who knows? :scratch: My bees are giving me pleasure, maybe I'll even get honey this year. 
For me the use of SBB's came down to a niggle, if I am not using them I'll always be wondering if the bees would be better off if I did. The logic of falling mites not being able to get back up to the cluster is appealing. Until science proves, or provides evidence to refute the hypothesis that SBB's help I'll keep using them.
FYI, I looked at the available designs and thought they were a little elaborate for my junior wood working skills. Instead I made a frame the same size as a hive body base out of 2 by four. I nailed a 3/4 strip to it on three sides, leaving room on the front for the excluder. Then I stapled the screen onto the top of the edge of the 2 by 4 that wasn't covered by the 3/4 strip. I didn't put in any kind of fancy drawer to slide in and out sticky boards. This SBB/hive stand sits directly on pavers.
I won't even say "works for me" because in all honesty I haven't been keeping bees long enough to draw definitive conclusions. I'll just say "works for me - so far"  Adrian


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## honeydreams (Aug 10, 2009)

reid, Now I see thatnks for the info.


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## James R (Jun 17, 2009)

I leave the SBB open year round. It defintley helps keep the condesation down in the winter and helps cool in the summer.Not sure how much it helps with mite control although I have not had a problem for the 2 years I have been BEEK.

James R


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Both work fine. I have about half and half. the SBB stays dry, allows more ventilation when you want it and helps monitoring mites. The solid bottom board lets you double it as a feeder...

http://www.bushfarms.com/beesfeeding.htm#bottom


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## Chick (May 21, 2009)

I use solid bottoms with West beetle traps on bottom, which work for mites, as well.


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## Chick (May 21, 2009)

Does anyone beside me, notice that "Solid Bottom Board" and "Screen Bottom Board", both use the intials SBB?


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## honeyman46408 (Feb 14, 2003)

:lpf Chick


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