# Taylor Queens



## Ben Little (Apr 9, 2012)

What are your experiences with Warren Taylor Queens ? I had a mean bunch of bees from Australia a couple of years ago and requeened them all but they were from a different supplier.


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## Honey-4-All (Dec 19, 2008)

When the Aussie packages were allowed into the US we had some......... Never again... 

Put it this way. If you gave them to me for free I would burn the whole buch on the spot. I'm sure many others would agree!


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## jean-marc (Jan 13, 2005)

Sometimes it is just best to spell it out, so there is little room for misunderstandings.

Jean-Marc


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## Ben Little (Apr 9, 2012)

Okay so no one has anything good to say about These Queens ? It's strange that they are substantially less in price, maybe that is why..?


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## Honey-4-All (Dec 19, 2008)

Get ahold of some beeks in Australia. ????


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## high rate of speed (Jan 4, 2008)

You pay for what you receive.


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## Ben Little (Apr 9, 2012)

I will do some re-evaluating on our early queens. 

Well just to clarify HALL, do you mean "you get what you pay for" because I have paid well for poor quality more than a few times  That is why I ask questions


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Good question, Ben.
It is better to get some good answers before
putting in your order for the wrong queens. 
I thought they don't have the Africanized bees down under.
Yes, finding the early queens is so hard these days. I'll 
bee doing my own grafting soon as the weather permits.
Can you evaluate your breeder queens to do some early grafting too?
Any drones flying or in the making when you feed them early in the booming hives?


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## Ben Little (Apr 9, 2012)

There is no way for me to have early queens other than my nucs I winter. I will just have to winter more nucleus colonies for my own use this year and have to settle for whatever I can get for now.


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## JSL (Sep 22, 2007)

Sometimes it is a matter of choosing the lesser of all evils...


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## Honey-4-All (Dec 19, 2008)

Ben Little said:


> I will just have to............................. settle for whatever I can get for now.



Would love for you to PM me in a year from now if you go beyond seriously considering utilizing queens from this outfit.. Thats if they are the same ones that came through the Weaver brokerage network back in the mid 2000's. If things have not changed you will be in for a world of sad surprise. 

As I mentioned previously about those packages....... Gangbusters to viral villains in a matter of months. 

I also bought 100 extra loose queens to do splits in the almonds in the same time frame. The 100 loose queens seemed to have been of a total different lot ( breeding line) than the ones in the packages. I've always wondered if they just "sourced" them and passed them off. They were thee most awful queens that I have dealt with in 35 years of keepeing bees.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Then you have to think creatively to help your operation expand.
If like Mike Palmer to overwinter his operation with nucs then this is the way to go
for some early queens. Have you seen those 4 way nucs to overwinter? A long time ago and still is, I
wonder what if I have to live in a norther cold and snowy region to keep bees alive. What would I do
differently to mimic the success of the larger commercial operations. The environment is the same only
the techniques by the keepers are a bit different to keep them there. It is not a matter of cannot do but a
matter of how to do it right. Have you selected your breeder queens yet? Here the keepers took their bees to
the almonds but left behind their breeder hives. This is my chance to get some nice Spring queens. Then during the
late Fall when they brought back their hives was also the time for me to get some mite resistant genetics into my after the
solstice queens. It's time for you to make some serious thinking and planning for the early queen issue.


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Ben Little said:


> settle for whatever I can get for now.


Is Nova Scotia involved with the Chilean queen project? I know some beekeepers using those queens.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Ian, I don't know much about the Chilean queen project.
By any chance that these queens got infected with the Africanized genetics 
during that time?


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

I think the Chilean queens are all Africanized and I really doubt they will winter in cold country. I bought some queens from an outfit in Mississippi in the seventies and not a single one of 50 colonies wintered and a lot of other people must have had similar results as the company went broke. It was rumored that they had used Africanized bees in their breeding program. At that time the conjecture was that the Africanized bees lacked body hair and couldn't hang onto each other in a cluster well. But I don't know that for a fact, I only know I wont buy queens for zone 3/4 that I suspect may have African genetics.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Thanks, Vance.
Now I know!


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## JSL (Sep 22, 2007)

Vance G said:


> I think the Chilean queens are all Africanized and I really doubt they will winter in cold country.


Whoa, I think this is pretty speculative. I do not have any first hand experience with this project, but there are/were some large outfits and respected queen producers involved with it. Perhaps you might contact those involved before stating the Canadians are/were importing AHB.


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## Ben Little (Apr 9, 2012)

I have my queen program figured out for next year, but I didn't have enough resources for this coming spring's expansion for pollination, instead of buying package bees we are going to split every one we can and feed heavy. We are running around 20-30 double nucs this winter (that are buried in snow as I speak) and hope to see good results because they were purchased queens from a local breeder that uses a Buckfast strain, I didn't have the time to make my own queens last year because I still had a day job but now I am 100% devoted to the bees and have more time to focus on things. 
As far as the early Queens, I said in a previous post, I was hoping to get a different type of Queen imported but it looks like I will just have to go with the consensus.
I like to try different things to see how they work out but it is a lot of money to gamble with.

So my options look like Olivarez and Kona


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

beepro said:


> Ian, I don't know much about the Chilean queen project.
> By any chance that these queens got infected with the Africanized genetics
> during that time?


No Africanized genetics in Chili, they are so tight with their boarder imports that they will not allow drone sperm in from Canada. It that vast mountain range along the coast line that has kept their bee stock isolated form Argentinian honeybee population. Chili has ideal weather for breeding and the queens are as good as any other stock that can be bought. Its just a long way up to come.


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## dgl1948 (Oct 5, 2005)

We use Chileans every year for our early splits. They have been excellent producers for us. We have had far better results from those than the California ones.


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

dgl1948 said:


> We use Chileans every year for our early splits. They have been excellent producers for us. We have had far better results from those than the California ones.


How do these bees winter? Outdoors or indoors and how do they do?


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

have managed them indoor and outdoors


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

You folks sure know how to source your early queens.
Too bad we cannot import some of them here. That is
Ben's answer on this Spring I supposed. How to?


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## jean-marc (Jan 13, 2005)

Chile had two suppliers. I believe one was a large cooperative fruit and veggie growing outfit that had recently acquired beehives. The other, I dunno really. Those queens went to Manitoba and from reports people were generally pleased. The other outfit was another story. 5 years ago, a friend made an 900 hive increase at the beginning of march. Got the queens accepted and laying. Between 800-850 got superceded soon after starting to lay and he went from almost bragging (because it was an exceptional accomplishment) to a catastrophic almost financial ruin because an opportunity did not work out. His part was done correctly, unfortunately there were issues with the queens.

Probably safest with Olivarez and Kona. They are reasonably good, but they will not put a big hurt on you like others previously discussed.

Jean-Marc


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

beepro said:


> Too bad we cannot import some of them here.


you can, but you have to get them through Canada.


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## Markt (Feb 8, 2012)

Ben Little said:


> So my options look like Olivarez and Kona


I got a couple hundred Olivarez Italians to make the deadline for pollination last year and was pretty impressed with their buildup, can't speak to their wintering yet though. I really think that your best bet is probably to import something and then requeen it sometime after pollination with your own stock. I've heard a lot of bad things about imported bees and Canadian winters and you've got a resource in your own genetics that are currently overwintering well in your area. Just a thought


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## Ben Little (Apr 9, 2012)

Yeah I know there is a flaw in importing, that is why I intend on raising my own as much as I can from now on. It just seems a little odd to invest into something and then destroy it, it's like buying a new car and then purposely smashing it shortly after getting it and then go out and get another one. LOL 
I will invest in my own bees more this year, that is why I am not buying package bees, I will be splitting every single one that can be split, only difference is I will have to add an imported queen


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## Markt (Feb 8, 2012)

That queen is likely to be dead by spring either way, only difference is whether you let the hive go with it. Look at it as a cost of early expansion in Canada. Maybe try requeening half and see how the others fair?


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## dgl1948 (Oct 5, 2005)

We winter everything outside. Last winter was the coldest on record. Our losses run from 6% in the best yards to 15% in the worst yard. We have been using the Chile queens for early splits for 5 or 6 years. We have had no problems with them and they are good producers. They let us do early splits. We raise our own for late nucs.


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## Ben Little (Apr 9, 2012)

dgl1948 said:


> We winter everything outside. Last winter was the coldest on record. Our losses run from 6% in the best yards to 15% in the worst yard. We have been using the Chile queens for early splits for 5 or 6 years. We have had no problems with them and they are good producers. They let us do early splits. We raise our own for late nucs.


What is the name of the queen producer you use ? are they Nunez ? Here is what I am looking at for Early Queens if I go with them http://www.earlyqueenarrivals.com/


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## dgl1948 (Oct 5, 2005)

Ben Little said:


> What is the name of the queen producer you use ? are they Nunez ? Here is what I am looking at for Early Queens if I go with them http://www.earlyqueenarrivals.com/


We get our queens through Bee Maid Honey Coop. We have a standing order with them so we get the same number every spring. I am not sure of all the producers they use. I believe Nunez and Pacific are two that are used. We try to do our splits with them in April, long before we can start producing our own. We have not bought packages for a lot of years. Other than the early queens we are self sufficient with our bees.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

It is interesting to learn how others source their early queens.
I will be doing some grafting here as early as possible.
What is the earliest time when you get your early queens?


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Local queens are about 2-3 weeks too late for our main split. We catch that early spring time buildup to split off which is sent directly into the flow a few weeks after. Local queen stock is generally used to make nucs. 

Getting that early graft going is finicky as cold weather can cause poor results and not reliable enough to sit your honey crop on. 
I know guys here that do manage a closed apiary with an in house breeding program. Gotta move work load around and set up splits with cells. Which is fine as long as mating weather prevails. Progress can be simple and fast, to being slow and failure.

It's about managing growth and risk


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Then how feasible it is to raise some early queens under II or AI?
I know that the bees will brood up early if provide them with patty and syrup even in the cold of winter.
In a strong colony they will make a queen if they are queen less with good larvae.
I'm thinking that using an incubator will help with the queen selection process too. What do you think?


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

beepro said:


> Then how feasible it is to raise some early queens under II or AI?
> What do you think?


I bring in 600 queens Mid May. The queens coming in from California are too good to think about projects like that.


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