# What a disappointment!



## ruthiesbees (Aug 27, 2013)

do you have multiple hives? Is it possible for you to combine all the worker bees into one hive (minus the extra queens) for winter? Put all the honey stores in the one hive and take care of the extra comb for spring with plans to start over. Also get some sugar bricks in there. If you have 4 hives, don't combine all 3 into the 1. Keep them as 2 separate groups for a few weeks. So combine hive 3 into hive 1 and combine hive 4 into hive 2. At some point combine hive 2 into hive 1. (this is all a theory as IA has a very different winter than VA).


----------



## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

fill the empty combs with syrup and then put a rim on your follower board and make fondant and pour in it, so once they move through the syrup they hit the fondant wall.


----------



## hvacrich0 (Aug 25, 2014)

I had the same problem with one of my hives. We took the drawn empty comb and sprayed it with syrup then filled the comb with dry sugar then sprayed it again with syrup to hold it in. It worked well and the bees are clustered on it with temps in low 30s at night and mid to upper 40s during the days. Too cold and too late to do much else here in Montana.


----------



## mailmam (May 8, 2014)

hvacrich0 said:


> I had the same problem with one of my hives. We took the drawn empty comb and sprayed it with syrup then filled the comb with dry sugar then sprayed it again with syrup to hold it in. It worked well and the bees are clustered on it with temps in low 30s at night and mid to upper 40s during the days. Too cold and too late to do much else here in Montana.


This sounds very doable but what do you mean by 'syrup'? Sugar water or real syrup. Thanks!


----------



## smokin_trout (May 27, 2014)

2:1 sugar syrup


----------



## hvacrich0 (Aug 25, 2014)

As smokintrout says, 2:1 sugar water for syrup, we wanted it as sticky as possible to hold the sugar with adding the least amount of water to the hive in cold temps. Its been two weeks since we did this and the bees seem fine.


----------



## EZride (Jun 16, 2009)

2 parts sugar to 1 part water or the other way around?


----------



## smokin_trout (May 27, 2014)

2 parts sugar 1 water. Check a few videos on YouTube if you have questions on how to make it. If you have a Lowes around you they sell food grade 5 gallon buckets for under $5. They help when you're trying to make a large batch.


----------



## sylus p (Mar 16, 2008)

i wouldn't waste your time or money feeding them. not because time and money are more important than the life of your colonies but because the end result will be the same. sorry i know that sounds harsh. 

if they don't have food now there is something else going on (mites, nosema, queenlessness, etc. etc. etc.) and they aren't going to survive anyways, and its too late to do much about it, unless you're moving to florida or something. they probably wouldn't take syrup even if you gave it to them.

i'd go back and pull the good combs in order to protect them (the combs) from rodents. colonies that truly have no stores i would shake the bees off the combs into a common hive or onto the ground. 

were any of them heavy? 

after i post this i'm going to check where you're from again


----------



## sylus p (Mar 16, 2008)

iowa, you get winter, they're goners, save your comb.

ps, sorry about all that corn


----------



## hvacrich0 (Aug 25, 2014)

My colony got robbed of most of there honey before I got it stopped so its worth the small investment to me to try to save them. Being new to bees I'm trying to learn from the mistakes I make so its a learning experience to me and worth more to try to save them than the little that the sugar costs. You may be right about shaking the bees out but I'm not going to do it and wouldn't recommend it to anyone else either. No offence intended


----------



## hvacrich0 (Aug 25, 2014)

This sounds more like what a commercial bee keeper would do. They cant afford to spend money on bees that mite not make it through the winter. They have the option to pull a split out of one of the hundreds of colonies they have to replace the lost one. A hobbyist bee keeper is looking at 100 or 125 dollars to replace them. Big differance.


----------



## WBVC (Apr 25, 2013)

Perhaps these were healthy hives that were robbed. Sugar for 4 hives is not much money. If you try you crrtainly won't succeed.



sylus p said:


> iowa, you get winter, they're goners, save your comb.
> 
> ps, sorry about all that corn


----------



## Santa Caras (Aug 14, 2013)

If as Sylus suggests that they are goners then you have nothing to lose trying to save them. Stay positive and fill the empty comb with sugar as suggested. if you have follower boards, try lessening the space they need for the winter. Thats what I would try anyway. Glad to hear you are feeling better so there is always an upside.


----------



## hvacrich0 (Aug 25, 2014)

Iv gotten very attached to my bees this summer and will feel better knowing that I tried everything I could to save them instead of just turning my back on them and letting them die. If they do die Ill replace them and start over and thats what Id recommend to anyone else too. For hundreds of years now someone has been standing up telling someone else you cant do that or that will never work. Dont give up on the impossible just because someone else tried it and couldn't make it happen. Good Luck.


----------



## sylus p (Mar 16, 2008)

seriously now. its not about the cost or the time. *at all*. 

there is some other reason they dont have stores. something else is wrong.
so if you dont take care of *that*, whatever *that *is, feeding them is literally prolonging their suffering.

its 39 degrees in iowa city this morning. you can niether feed nor treat nor inspect at these temps without harming them.

as to my advice being "commercial" and therefore questionable(!?), all i can say is, WHAT?ever. 

and i am still curious, were any of them heavy???


----------



## sylus p (Mar 16, 2008)

hvacrich0 said:


> My *colony* got robbed of most of there honey before I got it stopped so its worth the small investment to me to try to save them. *Being new to bees *I'm trying to learn from the mistakes I make so its a learning experience to me and worth more to try to save them than the little that the sugar costs. You may be right about shaking the bees out but I'm not going to do it and wouldn't recommend it to anyone else either. No offence intended
> 
> This sounds more like what a commercial bee keeper would do
> 
> For hundreds of years now someone has been standing up telling someone else you cant do that or that will never work. Dont give up on the impossible just because someone else tried it and couldn't make it happen. Good Luck.


:scratch:


----------



## mailmam (May 8, 2014)

I appreciate all the tips and encouragement, my first thought was, "they are goners" but I've done some research and I think it is worth my time and trouble to try to save them. I have two top bar hives and no, they were not very heavy. I brought them home and they are in a protected yard to give them the best chance. This will start a whole new discussion but I read of someone who put an aquarium heater in his hive over the winter, since the cold seems to be the hardest on them. What do you think of that idea?


----------



## hvacrich0 (Aug 25, 2014)

My thoughts on that are to keep them as close to nature as possible. Make sure they have food and protection and let nature do her thing. If you add heat and they get used to it then it burns out or the power goes off they will get chilled fast and may not recover from it. We can offer a helping hand but at some point we have to realize that mother nature knows best. I will back off and admit that some of the more experienced beeks may be right and maybe this is mother natures way of weeding out the week or diseased colonies. Do what you can, hope for the best and don't regret your efforts.


----------



## mailmam (May 8, 2014)

Thanks from an inexperienced bee keeper! I appreciate you efforts!


----------



## sylus p (Mar 16, 2008)

mailmam, 


the only thing worse than a dead hive, is a dead hive with mice in it so....

pick up some half inch hardware cloth and use it to block the entrances. the bees will be able to get by but the mice won't. 

all of my hives have that stuff jammed in their entrances, because they die sometimes, and i really don't like mice. good luck.


----------



## mailmam (May 8, 2014)

Thanks for the reminder, I did have some hardware cloth and put it over the entrances. I have fought mice on top of the hives until I put some contact paper, sticky side up across the top, under the roof, that fixed the little buggers!


----------



## Mommyofthree (Aug 23, 2014)

As a first season person going into winter with my one hive that is very light. I would try to save the hive. My thought is that if it doesn't work it doesn't but you can say you tried. I have been feeding mine all fall and made up some winter candy and am planning on putting the sugar bricks on tomorrow before the storm we are supposed to get. Good luck to you and I hope it works!


----------



## mailmam (May 8, 2014)

Update - I made several fondant boards getting ready for a nice day. We finally got in the upper 40's so I opened my very active hive and found my bees have not clustered in a ball for winter but were spread out among several combs. I slid the combs apart and slipped fondant boards between them, then covered with an empty top bar. I'm pleased with the amount of bees I have and how active they were. I got that hive closed up and went to the other, not as many bees and they have never been as active. I found the same thing, bees on comb so did the same thing. Last weekend we had another nice day so I checked to see how they were doing and I was very pleased to see that bees are on the fondant boards also. I know it's early but I'm hopeful that this will get my hives through the winter. I'm making another batch of fondant boards to be ready for the next feeding. The best thing about the top bars is that I can open just one at a time, I'm not opening the entire hive to the cold weather. I used 8 x 8 aluminum baking pans to make the fondant, lined them with waxed paper and popped them out when they were cured and stacked in a box. That way I can have several ready for any use.


----------



## BobRagsdale (Nov 23, 2014)

Santa Caras said:


> If as Sylus suggests that they are goners then you have nothing to lose trying to save them. Stay positive and fill the empty comb with sugar as suggested.


I love Santa Caras's attitude and reply. You have nothing to loose and everything to gain by trying to keep them going. Who knows, you might succeed. Wouldn't that be wonderful.


----------



## Mommyofthree (Aug 23, 2014)

Sounds like your hive is doing well so far! Good luck!


----------



## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

A mouse will pretty easily crawl thru 1/2 " hardware cloth. 1/4" for a winter mouse guard would be much better.


----------



## mailmam (May 8, 2014)

I can't believe that a mouse could get through 1/2" hardware cloth unless they were teeny, tiny, which my mice are not! I watch the bees going in and out and I wouldn't want the opening any smaller.


----------

