# Bait hive locations



## Steve in PA

Last spring I put out bait hives with no luck. I think a lot of it was my design. I was using 5-frame nuc and after reading and speaking with people more knowledgable I believe it to be too small. I'm building bigger boxes right now for the upcoming season.

Even though I had no swarms move in, I had two boxes that were thoroughly explored by scouts. I am thinking those are favorable locations for improved boxes this year. Would that be a safe assumption? Places I saw no activity probably won't be revisited this year.


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## charmd2

Four feet off the ground, in a mostly shaded area, within 1/8th of a mile of a known hive, and a noticable landmark, (something different from,the surround environment). Has been my guaranteed success areas.


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## marshmasterpat

charmd2 said:


> Four feet off the ground, in a mostly shaded area, within 1/8th of a mile of a known hive, and a noticable landmark, (something different from,the surround environment). Has been my guaranteed success areas.


LOL - Sounds like the advice I was given and it worked for me.


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## jadebees

What works best for me, is to place them in the dappled shade of a tree. Face the entry towards sunrise. Make sure it is not in midday sun. The bees reject a hot box often, its hard on brood and wax combs. I never place the boxes higher than a 1 to 2 foot branch, usually it's just placed on a common hive stand. Why? It does not help at all, to hoist the hive into a tree. You catch the same bees. Yes they can smell the swarm lure or LGO from the air. An 8 frame deep box, with frames, a ply roof screwed on, and ply floor, also attached, catches well, and when you get it home, it's already a brood box. Just fit an ordinary roof & ect, when you can. You can use 10 frame boxes, but they are bulkier. They work just as well if its what you have. Good luck bee-fishing!


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## odfrank

>An 8 frame deep box, with frames, a ply roof screwed on, and ply floor, also attached, catches well, and when you get it home, it's already a brood box.

How are you adding an entrance to this setup?


I found that placing a rustic piece of firewood on top of the bait hive helps also.


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## Riverderwent

Steve in PA said:


> Last spring I put out bait hives with no luck. I think a lot of it was my design. I was using 5-frame nuc and after reading and speaking with people more knowledgable I believe it to be too small. I'm building bigger boxes right now for the upcoming season.
> 
> Even though I had no swarms move in, I had two boxes that were thoroughly explored by scouts. I am thinking those are favorable locations for improved boxes this year. Would that be a safe assumption? Places I saw no activity probably won't be revisited this year.


Bigger boxes is a good idea. Creeks, bayous, streams, or other natural flyways seem to make a difference. Bees will sometimes markedly prefer one location over another very similar location a short distance away for no obvious reason. I place the box as high as I can comfortably reach. I use to place them higher, but have found no appreciable difference. I orient the entrances to the southeast. Shady but accessible to the bees. When you take one down, immediately replace it. I have collected four to six swarms a year from a single spot at several different locations.


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## jadebees

Oops, it's all in the details, right? I simply drill 3 holes 1/2 to 5/8 diameter in one end , down by the floor. Standard floors and roofs can be used, but you start leaving a lot of costly stuff in the woods and fields. It also keeps people from tampering. They sure will. Mine are also painted a camo color for that reason, outa sight, outa mind. The boxes dont leave if they are not really complete. I've had a few swiped. Some people!


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## Mr.Beeman

I leave the swarm traps in the back of the truck and place an add in the local craig'slist or bee removal sites. THEN, I wait for the calls to roll in (and they do). No driving to the swarm trap site, no wasted time, no wasted fuel, etc.

When I did trap, I used two 5 frame medium nucs with a few drawn combs. Anytime you see activity it is safe to assume it is a good place for the trap. My best place to trap was by an old city park with large trees and in an area of older homes. You'd be surprised as to how many hives are in that little one to two block area.


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## lemmje

odfrank said:


> I found that placing a rustic piece of firewood on top of the bait hive helps also.


Curious on your thoughts as to why this helps?


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## TalonRedding

odfrank said:


> I found that placing a rustic piece of firewood on top of the bait hive helps also.


Same here. I'm not sure why though. I've also found that wood from fruit trees like peach or apple lures bees the best. I wish I knew why.


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## odfrank

FIREWOOD ON BAIT HIVES
I gave three Warre bait hives to an associate to set up at his house, with no instructions other than do not set them on your shed roof like last year. He set them on wobbly cans with a piece of firewood on top. they were filled within a week. I told this to two other trappers, we all put firewood on our traps. In two or three cases, traps that had sat for weeks were filled in a few days. Two bark covered pieces caught two swarms each. You explain it to me, I have no idea.


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## lemmje

That is fascinating! I'm gonna give it a try this spring.


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## JohnBruceLeonard

odfrank said:


> I found that placing a rustic piece of firewood on top of the bait hive helps also.


That is hilarious... Gods above, but the bees are curious beasts. 

TalonRedding, you have had the same experience? Could you say more? 

I am at once amused and intrigued.

John


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## SAS

Great info!

Last spring, was my first attempt to catch a swarm (I set out 3 traps). The only thing I attacked, was ants. 

This spring, I'll try again with what I have learned from this post.


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## JWChesnut

TalonRedding said:


> Same here. I'm not sure why though. I've also found that wood from fruit trees like peach or apple lures bees the best. I wish I knew why.


I have an outyard at the ranch of a wonderful retired librarian. She kept bees with her dad in the "old days" in Georgia. One of the annecdotes she tells me is rubbing the trap hives with peach leaves to draw swarms. This was her job as a child, rubbing the hives down with bundles of peach leaves. 

The peach odor likely functions as a swarm lure.

I notice that bees are really strongly attracted to the sap from gumosis in apricot, cherry and almond. Gumosis is bacterial or Eutypa dieback that causes weeping sap. One must prune it out of the trees. Bees work it hard for propolis, and diseased trees can attract numerous foragers. Sap from cottonwood is also favored. I get cull boards -- western pine -- for nucs. These are often cull because of ugly pitch pockets, and that pitch is highly attractive to foraging bees. I'll fasten scrap made when I cut out the pitch pockets to the traps, or just build with the pitch pockets included.


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## TalonRedding

JohnBruceLeonard said:


> TalonRedding, you have had the same experience? Could you say more?
> 
> 
> John


I don't know what else I could say...


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## Steve in PA

Wow, I ask a simple question and a flood of information comes out. Thanks! I happen to have a bunch of apple and cherry wood from my orchard that I use for smoking meats.

Another question, well two really.

1. Several of the places I work at during the day are in absolutely prime locations at the edges of fields or near streams. The only problems I forsee is neighbors and maybe the company would "officially" frown upon my placing bait hives on the property for liability reasons. My supervisor "knows nothing" as does the building mechanic.

To make things simpler, most of those buildings have generator yards. Usually it's a 12'x12' locked area surrounded by a 6 or 8 foot dogear fence with a small generator inside. Best bet to keep a low profile would be to put the bait hive inside that area on the fence. But, since it is somewhat out of sight would that be a bad spot?

I tried the roofs last year but never saw any activity. Probably too hot being in the sun all day.

2. In locations next to fields at treelines I am finding that there is usually about 10 feet of brambles seperating the treeline from the field. The brambles are maybe 6ft high or so. Would it be a problem as I can't get a ladder into most to put it as high as I can reach? Maybe I could get a small stepstool but that would be about it. 

I guess both questions could be summed up as, "How important is line of sight?".


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## charmd2

You want your traps accessable to you, if they are in or on a locked fence do you have a key? Are they going to be lesticide sprayed? My employer hires a pesticide company that sprays everything on a very frequent basis. It is not safe to put traps near my work property. 

bees need a clear flight path. Line of sight to what? They likely won't search through 10 feet of brambles to find a trap.


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## JohnBruceLeonard

TalonRedding said:


> I don't know what else I could say...


Oh, I was simply curious to hear about your experience more in particular, and how and when you've noticed this correlation between firewood on a swarm trap, and the functionality of the same. I'd even be curious to hear _how _you made this discovery, as I am generally curious to know how other beekeepers expand their knowledge, and whether by fortune or study or trial, or what have you...

John


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## redsnow

Ok, let me try to describe an area where I'd like to place a swarm trap, and you tell me where you think would be best. 

This little place is about 70 acres, there is a river on one side, around 20 acres of hay fields in the middle, and then more pasture and woods, on the other side.

Along the river, (on both sides), there are quite a few black locust and persimmon trees. Near the middle of the hay fields there is a lone walnut tree, it's a big tree, tallest object for probably 3 or 400 yards, in all directions. Now on the upper side of the fields, there is another strip of locust and persimmon trees, beyond that it's all mixed timber.

The big walnut tree should make a good landmark. And the bees should work the locust and persimmon trees too. 

I could place the trap on either side of the river, or both sides.

But as far as placing the swarm box within 1/8th mile from a known existing hive, I honestly don't know of any domestic bee hives within 6 or 8 miles of the area. Early last summer there were honeybees working the clover bloom and fruit trees around the Old Shack. 

So, where would be my best bet?


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## billabell

Sounds like a good place to place several hives then put your swarm trap on the walnut tree or on the shack if you can get shade. Might catch a swarm or 2 from your own hives. If your black locust blooms like ours did last spring you will get plenty of honey.


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## Riverderwent

redsnow said:


> So, where would be my best bet?


I would use several traps and let the bees answer that question. Most likely the best location will be at the edge of the field near the river. Cheers, David


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## charmd2

I would place at least three. One at each prime location and see if any have luck. My best trap location is sitting on the wheel well of a two horse trailer parked on a pasture. The trailer hasn't been moved in years, and I know of no bees anywhere near there, but I get three swarms a year from that location.


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## redsnow

Years ago a family friend kept 3 hives down near the river, his bees made a lot of honey. There is a little island, between the 2 prongs of the river, that's where he had his bees. That's been 30 years ago.

I don't have any hives now, but hopefully I can catch a swarm this coming spring and take it from there.

I also have access to several other properties, places that should be good for bees. Right now I'm trying to scrounge up some hive bodies, for myself.

Or, might just try to find a beekeeper that would be willing to set his hives on our property, so I can watch and learn.


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## gww

I had 12 traps in deer stands along wet weather creeks and field edges and along high lines. I had zero luck. The reason for me to write this is cause on a differrent thread someone mentioned that old abandoned buildings were good. Something I might try next.
Cheers
gww.


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## jadebees

Lots of interesting posts here. SteveinPa, your bramble patches are great areas for a swarm lure. Get a hive stand, and just jam the lurebox in to a patch till it is shaded. Leave the entry exposed, facing east. There truly is no need to get above ordinary hive level, as you will use it. I had 3 boxes, on low hanging branches 1 foot high., one on a boulder knee high, all the rest, on hive stands stuck under a low tree or bush. I didn't even use all my lureboxes. One box caught 3 swarms, I got 17 swarms from 9 boxes, all at ground level. Hived and put right back. The box that got 3, was stuck under a big serviceberry bush, on a hive stand. I rub the boxes with sludgy hive and wax rendering debris, and use good swarm lure I make. And just good placement. All those were combimed into 8 big hives.


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## Steve in PA

Thanks Jadebees. I hadn't even thought about doing it that way. I've been locked in on how to get it in a tree or up above the brambles.



jadebees said:


> Lots of interesting posts here. SteveinPa, your bramble patches are great areas for a swarm lure. Get a hive stand, and just jam the lurebox in to a patch till it is shaded. Leave the entry exposed, facing east. There truly is no need to get above ordinary hive level, as you will use it. I had 3 boxes, on low hanging branches 1 foot high., one on a boulder knee high, all the rest, on hive stands stuck under a low tree or bush. I didn't even use all my lureboxes. One box caught 3 swarms, I got 17 swarms from 9 boxes, all at ground level. Hived and put right back. The box that got 3, was stuck under a big serviceberry bush, on a hive stand. I rub the boxes with sludgy hive and wax rendering debris, and use good swarm lure I make. And just good placement. All those were combimed into 8 big hives.


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## johnbeejohn

have a friend in williamsport that had a couple skids of old boxes behind shed this spring we counted 8 or 9 swarms in them he said he did not have any bees near there in at least a year


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## ljbee

I live in hilly country. What works best for trap locations? Top of ridges, midways down a hill, southern exposure, east, west, in a valley, along a creek bottom. I'm going to set some out around new cut-over with blackberry in various locations and naturally I want to increase my odds.


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## JohnBruceLeonard

ljbee said:


> I live in hilly country. What works best for trap locations? Top of ridges, midways down a hill, southern exposure, east, west, in a valley, along a creek bottom. I'm going to set some out around new cut-over with blackberry in various locations and naturally I want to increase my odds.


I have no personal experience with this, ljbee (yet), but Seeley suggests shady locations, and hives facing south. I have also read from other members of BeeSource that it is useful putting bait hives next to landmarks visible from the sky. I can imagine that this last might be one of the criteria that bees use in their selection of a nest site - namely, a place that is easy to orient to for workers newly promoted to foraging status.

John


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## Himmel-Hund

odfrank said:


> FIREWOOD ON BAIT HIVES
> I gave three Warre bait hives to an associate to set up at his house, with no instructions other than do not set them on your shed roof like last year. He set them on wobbly cans with a piece of firewood on top. they were filled within a week. I told this to two other trappers, we all put firewood on our traps. In two or three cases, traps that had sat for weeks were filled in a few days. Two bark covered pieces caught two swarms each. You explain it to me, I have no idea.


Could you find out what tree species was used and if it was rather fresh cut wood?


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