# Who took my beehives in Gypsum, Colorado?



## beardance (Jun 15, 2010)

A realtor from Prudential that was handeling the illegal eviction of me and my family, lied to a beekeeper and told him or her to come and take anything they wanted in my apiary because I abandoned it. My apiary consisted of 25 double deep Beemax hives with about half that number in live hives, a DOW bear fence with marine battery and fencer and solar charger, about a dozen or more wooden boxes with top and bottom boardsand inner covers, hive stands, 2 wood nucs and some old cardboard nucs not in the best of shape and assorted equipment. She did this all illegally, knowing that I was going to move the apiary. The sherrif deputies knew we were going to move them too. She did it out of spite because I wouln't bow down to her. My son and I spent a full day carefully picking up my $24,000.00 steel building and restacking it after she had it dumped along the road in front of my former residence. Because it was dumped along the road without reasonable care ( the law ), it took a lot longer. My wife called it in to the sherrif that it was stolen. Of course we accused the friendly neighborhood realtor and her husband. We obviously don't put any blame on the beekeeper that came and picked up the hives. We just want them back.


----------



## Gord (Feb 8, 2011)

You may never get your bees back, but I would take the realtor to small claims court.
It's a little work, but it's affordable, and you actually have your day in court (without a lawyer).
Go get the papers TODAY, and start the ball rolling.


----------



## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

beardance - what a bummer! I would think that Beemax hives are relatively uncommon, and so hopefully are easy to track down. I hope you recover your hives and equipment, and I hope you seek full compensation from the realtor for any and all damages she has caused. Perhaps there are criminal charges that can be filed against the realtor, as well?

Just a question: How do you know the realtor told the beekeeper who took you hives that you had abandoned your hives and equipment? That seems to me to be a critical piece of information that you will need to pursue legal action against the realtor.

Regardless, I hope you get your stuff back and that the slimy realtor gets his/her just due.


----------



## Haraga (Sep 12, 2011)

Tell us how it came to be that you were evicted?


----------



## gone2seed (Sep 18, 2011)

Take Gord's advice.If you were illegally evicted you will win.


----------



## Mr.Beeman (May 19, 2012)

There is a lot of this story that is not being said. 

I would think that if eveything was done "illegally" the police would be pursuing this "theft" and there would be arrests by now.


----------



## Saltybee (Feb 9, 2012)

Every state is different. Every set of facts are different.
In Maine even if a tenant leaves valuables behind after the end of a lease I have to pay to store them for at least 30 days. Eviction is only complete after court order and is complete only after being physically done by a sheriff. 
You are correct, realtor took possession by giving them away. 

Check your state consumer protection agency.


----------



## Saltybee (Feb 9, 2012)

No, police try to let private matters settle out before getting in a he said she said situation. Will act when facts are settled.


----------



## Haraga (Sep 12, 2011)

Can you find the guy that has your bees and explain the situation to him and ask for them back?


----------



## Kieck (Dec 2, 2005)

Why was a Realtor involved in an eviction, illegal or legal?

Was the apiary located on land connected to the eviction?


----------



## delber (Dec 26, 2010)

Police I can see depending upon the area could be helpful and could be a major pain. I've read where police have said that it's not their job to "protect the citizen". Really?!? I thought that was their job. But apparently it's not and it has even help up in court. I'd consider taking Gord's advice and look into court.


----------



## bobbarker (May 23, 2012)

I would also try posting some craigslist ads or putting up posters, asking at any local beekeeping associations, and seeing if you can track down the person that came and got them. Like you say, they likely didn't know the whole story, and thought they stumbled into a bit of good luck with a lot of free gear/bees that was abandoned. Hopefully, that individual would do the right thing if they found out that the realtor didn't have the right to give the stuff away, and let you come get it. Some folks wouldn't do the right thing, but I know I sure as heck would, and hopefully, whoever did get the stuff would too, if you can manage to track them down.


----------



## Grant (Jun 12, 2004)

Sorry to hear of these actions. If it was an "illegal" eviction, any good lawyer should be ready to take your case and may do a better job than representing yourself in small claims court. I know they cost money, but my experience has been a good lawyer is worth the cost. I've been through small claims court and I think the judge just looked at length of her skirt before agreeing with her side of the case.

I should have had a lawyer.

Grant
Jackson, MO


----------



## ericweller (Jan 10, 2013)

I'm sorry for your loss.
Now, I'm not a lawyer but I watch one on TV and I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express once......
The bottom line that any judge is going to look at is the date on the eviction order, the date the your items disappeared and whether the items you lost was on the property of the land owner. If those explicit facts are _honestly_ answered, you will know how a judge will rule.
Good luck!


----------



## curios1 (Jul 2, 2012)

delber said:


> Police I can see depending upon the area could be helpful and could be a major pain. I've read where police have said that it's not their job to "protect the citizen". Really?!? I thought that was their job. But apparently it's not and it has even help up in court. I'd consider taking Gord's advice and look into court.


it


----------



## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

The beekeeper who took them would have had some doubts. I know that If I were approached in such a situation, I would have a degree of sympathy for the beehive owner, and would at the least want to talk to the former owner first before removing the hives. Regardless of what the realtor told me I would know there are two sides to every story & sometimes people can fall on hard times.

So the fact the guy just came and took them, shows a degree of being prepared to go with the flow, long as he stands to gain.

At least one person knows who has the hives, and that's the realtor. If legal avenues fail but you can find out who has the hives or where they are, myself, I would not feel bad about stealing them back.

How to get the information, that's the problem. I'm wondering if you took legal action, even if it failed, during the course of the action the realtor may be required to reveal who she told to take the hives and you could use this information later.


----------



## KPeacock (Jan 29, 2013)

I hadn't considered theft of bees and gear to be a problem, especially at the level I plan to operate (less than a dozen hives). Is it worthwhile to incorporate a unique identifier on hives and components? I have fabricated and assembled all of my equipment and could easily incorporate an ID tag into a small kerf in the bodies, or do something as simple as branding. My impression of beekeepers as a whole is a very positive. It just doesn;t seem like the type of group with folks into snathing other peoples things. It seems unlikely that a non-beekeeper would attempt to steal a hive as opposed to vandalizing it in some manner. Is this a worthwhile exercise, or extra work? I'm in a very low crime area, but it only takes one...


----------



## beardance (Jun 15, 2010)

It turns out we have the DA and Sheriffs department doing a criminal investigation as we speak. Thanks everyone for the kind words and concern.


----------



## Rusty Hills Farm (Mar 24, 2010)

KPeacock said:


> I hadn't considered theft of bees and gear to be a problem, especially at the level I plan to operate (less than a dozen hives). Is it worthwhile to incorporate a unique identifier on hives and components? I have fabricated and assembled all of my equipment and could easily incorporate an ID tag into a small kerf in the bodies, or do something as simple as branding. My impression of beekeepers as a whole is a very positive. It just doesn;t seem like the type of group with folks into snathing other peoples things. It seems unlikely that a non-beekeeper would attempt to steal a hive as opposed to vandalizing it in some manner. Is this a worthwhile exercise, or extra work? I'm in a very low crime area, but it only takes one...


Lots of states require all their beekeepers to mark their hives. I know both Florida (where I came from) and Alabama (where I am) require beekeepers to brand their equipment, and the state keeps a record of that brand as part of the registration process. Have you checked with Michigan to see if this isn't the case as well?

HTH

Rusty


----------



## Haraga (Sep 12, 2011)

beardance said:


> It turns out we have the DA and Sheriffs department doing a criminal investigation as we speak. Thanks everyone for the kind words and concern.


Could you give us the specifics of the eviction?


----------



## KPeacock (Jan 29, 2013)

Rusty, I have not looked into MI specific rules o this. I will do so.

Thanks


----------



## alblancher (Mar 3, 2011)

I would guess the only way you will ever find your hives is to go to court and put the real estate agent under oath. If you went through an eviction I can guess no one is in the mood to be helpful or cooperative.


----------



## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Rusty Hills Farm said:


> Lots of states require all their beekeepers to mark their hives. I know both Florida (where I came from) and Alabama (where I am) require beekeepers to brand their equipment, and the state keeps a record of that brand as part of the registration process. <snip>
> Rusty


Rusty, from what I was told by the apiary division you do not have to brand your woodenware here in Alabama...there's no requirement for it. When you register your apiary, though, you do apply for a brand and can brand your equipment if you want to. I have branded most everything I have...bottom boards, top covers, and boxes. I haven't branded frames, yet, though I do "write" my brand on them with a hard-tipped pen to the point of lightly "engraving" the top bars. I've been toying with ideas for a smaller branding iron to mark my frames with and tonight finally decided to cough the money for one of these from Rockler. I'm hoping they get it to me quicker than the 4-6 weeks that they mention.

Just makes me rest better knowing my hives are branded. 

Ed


----------



## KPeacock (Jan 29, 2013)

For all the other folks in MI: in michigan there is no inspection requirement and no need to mark hives. This was easily found with a search of "State of Michigan Apiary Inspection Law " 

I do believe that I'll make a branding iron while I'm forging my hive tool. If the fire is burning, i might just as well use the heat.


----------



## beardance (Jun 15, 2010)

Haraga said:


> Tell us how it came to be that you were evicted?


It all started when the economy tanked and I saw the writing on the wall that the construction business would soon be in dire straits. So, my wife and I contacted Wells Fargo ( after they turned my 30yr fixed into a variable rate mortgage with a fraudulent note, robo signer and all. At the time we didn't know the had a forged note as evidence ) and asked for a loan modification. We had $300,000.00 in equity but at the time they weren't doing any refinances. They told us they would only give us a loan modification if we didn't make a payment for 3 months. We agreed to do that and were stupid enough to trust them. After jacking us around for a few months with the paperwork, saying they never got this or that piece of information, they foreclosed on us. We even told them we'd make payments but they said they wouldn't accept them once we were in the program. HSBC came forward and foreclosed on us. Colorado passed a law written by the owner of one of the largest foreclosure mills in Colorado where any bank or lender doesn't have to produce the note which is contrary to federal law. The foreclosing attorney just has to wave a paper at the judge certifying that they have all the pertinent paper work, which one of their own testified before the state legislature that 9 out of 10 times they don't have the paperwork. The judges never bother to actually ask them to produce it in the first place. They trust the lawyer to actually tell the truth.:lpf: Anyway it's a long story and 2 crappy lawyers later, here we are. We currently have a RICO action against them in state court.


----------



## Saltybee (Feb 9, 2012)

Sorry, the bees are the insult to the injury.


----------



## beardance (Jun 15, 2010)

Got that right!


----------



## Rusty Hills Farm (Mar 24, 2010)

Intheswamp said:


> Rusty, from what I was told by the apiary division you do not have to brand your woodenware here in Alabama...there's no requirement for it. When you register your apiary, though, you do apply for a brand and can brand your equipment if you want to. I have branded most everything I have...bottom boards, top covers, and boxes. I haven't branded frames, yet, though I do "write" my brand on them with a hard-tipped pen to the point of lightly "engraving" the top bars. I've been toying with ideas for a smaller branding iron to mark my frames with and tonight finally decided to cough the money for one of these from Rockler. I'm hoping they get it to me quicker than the 4-6 weeks that they mention.
> 
> Just makes me rest better knowing my hives are branded.
> 
> Ed



LOLOL I guess Alabama is as bad as everyone else, after all, when it comes to giving out accurate info! I was told it HAD to be marked or branded and couldn't be resold with bees unless it was branded (assuming nucs here?). 

Here is the statute:


> Section 2-14-7
> Owners, etc., to mark used hive-bodies and supers; marks, etc., to be approved by State Apiarist.
> 
> To adequately identify used bee equipment, the owner or other person in possession of such equipment shall be required to mark all hive-bodies and supers with an easily identified symbol, which symbol or identifiable mark must be approved by the State Apiarist.
> (Acts 1965, No. 794, p. 1488, §6.)


I always just assumed that if it has bees in it, it is considered "used" thus the required brand. Well, whichever it is, my stuff is branded. Better to err on the side of caution, I'm thinking.




Rusty


----------



## Daniel Y (Sep 12, 2011)

A tip on marking wood that I don''t remember where I learned it or why. When marking don't only burn the wood. that can be sanded off. But compress the wood. this can also be sanded off but the mark can still be revealed due to wood fibers under the mark also having been altered.

This of course only helps if you can actually locate stolen equipment. The only idea I have sen on that note is to instal GPS locators in random hives. In many cases revealing the non visible part of a compressed mark is nothing more than rubbing a wood stain over the area. The compressed fibers take up the stain differently revealing the mark. You can also often moisten the wood over the area and the compressed fibers will expand and show the mark in raised letters.

Anyway just another tip in how to get things marked and keep them that way.

Sorry I can't help with the finding of the equipment part.


----------



## Haraga (Sep 12, 2011)

Wow that is too bad. I bet you have a lot of hindsight on what happened to you.


----------



## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Rusty Hills Farm said:


> LOLOL I guess Alabama is as bad as everyone else, after all, when it comes to giving out accurate info! I was told it HAD to be marked or branded and couldn't be resold with bees unless it was branded (assuming nucs here?).
> <snip>


 You are probably correct and I'm probably wrong in regards to the law. When I first started making my equipment I decided I was going to brand everything. Well, there was a snag when the application got locked up in a drawer in Montgomery over a couple of weeks during Christmas that year.  I was waiting to be sure that I was going to get the brand I had requested so that I could order a branding iron from a guy. As making the brand, shipping, actual branding of equipment would take time, by the first of the year I was antsy. After some emails with the state I tracked down what was happened that caused the delay. Talking with one of the inspectors he told me that they weren't requiring equipment to be branded anymore. I'm like you, I had read the section on branding and as a newbee was trying to "do things right". I think the "not required" is something that the inspectors simply don't enforce (and I think maybe rightfully so) but that can be helpful. The requirement wasn't why I was getting the iron, though, I was getting it to be more "secure". My weak point so far, though, has been the frames...I'm looking forward to checking out the small Rockler iron.

Ed


----------



## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Daniel Y said:


> A tip on marking wood that I don''t remember where I learned it or why. When marking don't only burn the wood. that can be sanded off. But compress the wood. this can also be sanded off but the mark can still be revealed due to wood fibers under the mark also having been altered.<snip>.


You must be making a very light burn...my hive body and super brands could just about be used for a hand grip. 

Ed


----------



## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

beardance, from what I can tell Gypsum has a population of maybe 7000 people and is around 100 miles from the burbs of Denver....kinda set apart from the large crowds. I would put some "ads" in the local "for sale" fliers/weeklies...list them in the farm, gardening, "homestead", or whatever categories. Print some fliers and post them around town at service stations, cafes,...anywhere they'll let you. A small reward noted on the fliers might be helpful. 

7000 people is still a good many people, but people tend to remember who beekeepers are (they think they're kinda strange people ). Ask around...don't necessarily ask if someone has seen some stolen hives but rather "do you know any beekeepers around here" or "do you know somebody to call to get a swarm of bees out of a bush for me?" or simply "Do you know where I can get some local honey?" Some people are hesitant to get involved in something that could involve the law but will gladly share information otherwise just to show that they know something. Also, go into the grocery stores and curb markets and check the shelves for "local" honey...if the beek that got your hives has some size to him he might be selling some of his honey through those outlets.

I'm curious as whether this is a local realtor or someone more distant? As someone mentioned, check with the state and see who all is at least registered in your area...that doesn't mean that's all the beeks around you but will give you some to maybe contact and give a "heads'up" to.

Just some ideas that you've probably already thought about... 

Best wishes,
Ed


----------



## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Link to Western Colorado swarm list including Eagle County and Gypsum at bottom of this page... http://coloradobeekeepers.org/colorado-bee-swarm-hotline/ 

Of course, you may very well already have this in hand, but just in case...

Ed

ETA: Another list of Colorado bee removers. The reason I would look at these types of lists is that if a realtor did not know a beekeeper personally then they would be do an internet search for someone to remove bees and these lists are what they would find. 

http://www.beeremovalsource.com/bee-removal-list/colorado/


----------



## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

beardance said:


> A realtor from Prudential that was handeling the illegal eviction of me and my family, lied to a beekeeper and told him or her to come and take anything they wanted in my apiary because I abandoned it. My apiary consisted of 25 double deep Beemax hives with about half that number in live hives, a DOW bear fence with marine battery and fencer and solar charger, about a dozen or more wooden boxes with top and bottom boardsand inner covers, hive stands, 2 wood nucs and some old cardboard nucs not in the best of shape and assorted equipment. She did this all illegally, knowing that I was going to move the apiary. The sherrif deputies knew we were going to move them too. She did it out of spite because I wouln't bow down to her. My son and I spent a full day carefully picking up my $24,000.00 steel building and restacking it after she had it dumped along the road in front of my former residence. Because it was dumped along the road without reasonable care ( the law ), it took a lot longer. My wife called it in to the sherrif that it was stolen. Of course we accused the friendly neighborhood realtor and her husband. We obviously don't put any blame on the beekeeper that came and picked up the hives. We just want them back.


I was just out to CO to visit my Son in Colorado Springs. I did not take your beehives. Just wanted you to know.

I hope you do get them back.


----------



## Lburou (May 13, 2012)

A raw deal for you, I'm sorry for the turmoil in your life right now. There is a Colorado Realtor Commission that would be interested in this type of activity. The State Attorney General might be interested as well. Get the complaint in writing and have a lawyer write a letter to your Attorney General, the Realtor's Broker, and the State Realtor's Comission outlining the illegal aspects of the eviction and disoposition of your property. Put a verified dollar value on the property and the damage and highlight that section of the law that gives you a grace period to vacate. Promise public legal action for the Broker and ask the Attorney General to get invoved. You will get results when the Broker does not want a public humiliation. Your results may vary, but Good luck


----------



## Gord (Feb 8, 2011)

Beardance:

Do what Lee said (#36).
Then:

Take the realtor to small claims court.

Your real estate issues are not relevant to the issue of the beehives.
The realtor had physical possesion of your hives and disposed of them without your knowledge or consent.
Look up "bailment"; that's what your legal argument is based on.
If you left them there for several months without contacting the realtor, you won't win, but if it's a matter of a week or 3, you will kick his *ss.
And you should.
I don't know how to file where you are, but it will not be hard...might cost a hundred bucks or so, but it's well worth it.
Go the the courthouse, and find the clerk for small claims court.
She will be a wealth of information for you; if not, she will, at least, provide you with the forms.
PM me, and I can help you write a brief.

If you hire a lawyer, you're gonna get screwed, and it is cheaper and easier to let the hives go.
The system can work for the little guy, but you have to be ready.


----------



## beardance (Jun 15, 2010)

As of now we are talking to the crime victims unit of the local sheriffs department, so an investigation is in progress. Thanks for everyones support, I appreciate it.


----------



## sfisher (Sep 22, 2009)

Im with oldtimer on this one!


----------



## beardance (Jun 15, 2010)

sfisher said:


> Im with oldtimer on this one!


 The problem with that is I'd be in trouble with the law if I stole them back. I still haven't located them yet, but I 've got some ideas.


----------



## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Does CO have an Apiary Inspection program? Were your hives registered or their location? Any way to get the State behind you? How can you prove ownership were you to find them?


----------



## beardance (Jun 15, 2010)

No they weren't registered with the state and the apiary inspection program I think is not mandatory.


----------



## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

I'm sorry, mandatory? Which has what to do w/ your loss? Had your hives been registered w/ CO, perhaps you would have had some confirmation that you owned them and lost them. Apiary Inspectors often have an idea of what is going on in their district, who owns hives and what they look like. Which could come in handy when it comes to establishing your ownership.

Were you to locate your hives, how do you plan on getting them back and keeping them?


----------



## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Intheswamp said:


> <snip> I've been toying with ideas for a smaller branding iron to mark my frames with and tonight finally decided to cough the money for one of these from Rockler. I'm hoping they get it to me quicker than the 4-6 weeks that they mention.
> 
> Just makes me rest better knowing my hives are branded.
> 
> Ed


I just thought I'd post these images for anyone interested or considering one of the small branding irons from Rockler. I like it. Crisp letters once you get the technique down good. I can get probably five brands out of one heating and then it only takes a minute or so to bring it back up to heat on my old gas heater. I looked online and found a coupon so the cost was around $53 including shipping. 





Ed


----------



## Javin007 (Mar 14, 2013)

delber said:


> Police I can see depending upon the area could be helpful and could be a major pain. I've read where police have said that it's not their job to "protect the citizen". Really?!? I thought that was their job. But apparently it's not and it has even help up in court. I'd consider taking Gord's advice and look into court.


There's an entire book called "Dial 911 and Die" that's written by a lawyer that addresses this exact problem. The police do not have a duty to protect an INDIVIDUAL but rather have a duty to protect the "public at large." This is purposely worded this way in legal-eeze so as to protect the police force from lawsuits. If individuals could sue an officer every time they got upset, all of the cops would spend 100% of their time defending themselves in court cases. So I get _WHY_ it's set up this way, but on occasion the police will abuse this immunity too. And that's what the book's about. Basically, there's no state where you can go after the cops for not doing their jobs.


----------



## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

Intheswamp,

Looks like a nifty little branding iron! I just ordered one and will be marking my small inventory of equipment.


----------



## Javin007 (Mar 14, 2013)

I'm more of a "stamp" guy: http://www.infinitystamps.com/oscommerce/product_info.php?products_id=77


----------



## honeybeebee (Jan 27, 2013)

Sounds like a good case for judge judy.....and you get a free trip to hollywood...


----------

