# A swarm in August is worth...



## Beebeard (Apr 27, 2016)

Got called to a big swarm yesterday. Probably a 7 pounder. They had not been there long. We have had one heck of a swarm season here, but it has tapered off quite a bit. This was in a park tree in the heart of downtown Cincinnati, right on the river. There has to be some mega hive in one of our old high rises around there, this is the 4th one in that area this season. 1other one was at least this big, and 2 smaller ones. I'll be feeding this one like crazy, and combining it with a full nuc whose pissy queen I gave an alcohol bath to last night.


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## Spur9 (Sep 13, 2016)

:thumbsup:


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## RedBarn (May 31, 2017)

What didn't you like about your nuc queen ?


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## aunt betty (May 4, 2015)

Next year you should try to get permission to put a trap or two in that area. It's way easier when they're already in a box. Have to be vigilant or you'll end up with a swarm in the tree and one in the trap. It happens.


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## Live Oak (Oct 11, 2008)

Beebeard said:


> Got called to a big swarm yesterday. Probably a 7 pounder. They had not been there long. We have had one heck of a swarm season here, but it has tapered off quite a bit. This was in a park tree in the heart of downtown Cincinnati, right on the river. There has to be some mega hive in one of our old high rises around there, this is the 4th one in that area this season. 1other one was at least this big, and 2 smaller ones. I'll be feeding this one like crazy, and combining it with a full nuc whose pissy queen I gave an alcohol bath to last night.


The "swarm" you called to was probably not what I would call a swarm. Yes it was a large cluster of honey bees. What very likely happened is that the hive this "swarm" of bees was previously located in was overwhelmed with varroa mites to the point that the bees abandoned the hive and abscond. I was would strongly recommend treating this "swarm" for mites immediately and be highly suspect of a heavily infested mite count. In view of the high temperatures and humidity, suggest Apivar. A swarm in my opinion is a healthy and natural part of the honey bee's reproductive process and typically happens when the hive becomes over crowded. This rearly happens in August. Treat them and feed them and you may be able to get them through the Winter.


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## Beebeard (Apr 27, 2016)

Nuc queen was from an earlier smaller swarm. They built up well, but are way too aggressive. Not going to let them get any bigger. Adding their resources to this hive should give me a full size hive to overwinter instead of 2 smaller nucs.


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## Beebeard (Apr 27, 2016)

Live Oak said:


> The "swarm" you called to was probably not what I would call a swarm. Yes it was a large cluster of honey bees. What very likely happened is that the hive this "swarm" of bees was previously located in was overwhelmed with varroa mites to the point that the bees abandoned the hive and abscond. I was would strongly recommend treating this "swarm" for mites immediately and be highly suspect of a heavily infested mite count. In view of the high temperatures and humidity, suggest Apivar. A swarm in my opinion is a healthy and natural part of the honey bee's reproductive process and typically happens when the hive becomes over crowded. This rearly happens in August. Treat them and feed them and you may be able to get them through the Winter.


Kinda what i figured when i got the call. Planning on hitting them with oav in the next day or two since there isn't any brood yet.


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## Beebeard (Apr 27, 2016)

aunt betty said:


> Next year you should try to get permission to put a trap or two in that area. It's way easier when they're already in a box. Have to be vigilant or you'll end up with a swarm in the tree and one in the trap. It happens.


I run traps in other parts of town. This is too high profile an area. Fortunately I work in the park and will get the call when they show up. Even got to use the bucket truck to retrieve this one.


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## Live Oak (Oct 11, 2008)

Beebeard said:


> Kinda what i figured when i got the call. Planning on hitting them with oav in the next day or two since there isn't any brood yet.


This time of year, I would go with an Amatraz treatment of some sort that will be a continuous treatment to cover emerging brood which will be Winter bees. Apivar works well for this. I used oxalic acid/glycerin/paper towel method that Randy Oliver has been writing about in American Bee Journal for the past several months in early Spring and throughout the nectar flow since this treatment does not effect honey supers. This treatment does work well PROVIDED the hive is strong enough to chew and shred the shop towel. If they do not, the treatment does not work well. Half of my hives did shred the blue shop towels and were VERY strong. The other half did NOT and some are struggling or moderate in strength. I will switch to the regular Bounty type paper towels which are much softer and easier to shred for future treatments. OAV does work but it is VERY hard on queens.


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## cervus (May 8, 2016)

Live Oak said:


> OAV does work but it is VERY hard on queens.


This is the first I've heard of this. Please explain?


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## Hickory Point Hollow (Mar 23, 2017)

I would let bees be bees and not treat. If they are highly infected with anything, they genetically are weak and should not continue to produce bees that cant take care of themselves. Why is it some folks would rather dump chemical after chemical on their bees while not attempting to raise a better bee. Congrats on your new addition!


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## Marti (Jun 29, 2014)

> OAV does work but it is VERY hard on queens


I have not experienced this.


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## huskermonster (Sep 28, 2016)

I too got a large swarm last week and have been feeding them like crazy, lots and lots of bees, I am sure there are more bees in this swarm that half of my colonies, they have two boxes slammed full, I put 1 box of drawn comb and a top feeder on that pushing 2:1 syrup, what else do we do with such late season swarms to get them to spring?


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## Beebeard (Apr 27, 2016)

Resurrecting the thread for an update: they built out a deep and 2 mediums and packed away enough feed to see them through the winter. They appear healthy and strong, but are not happy. Unless going ballistic when I open the hive makes them happy, then they are pleased as could be. I will be using them for resources to build nucs soon, and requeening.


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## FlowerPlanter (Aug 3, 2011)

You may have some ferial survivors that don't need pesticide's to survive.

That mostly what I catch. They can be more aggressive, I find they are quit nice during good weather and a flow.


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## fieldsofnaturalhoney (Feb 29, 2012)

So a swarm in August can be worth an overwintered deep & two mediums worth of bees. Sounds like you traded a pissy queen for a ballistic one In my yards, there is definitely a correlation between the ballistic ones health, honey collecting, & their ability to live one with the mites without treatments


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## Beebeard (Apr 27, 2016)

I may not end up pinching her. All my hives are feral sourced from swarms and cutouts, or splits from the same. Seems like about every 3rd wild hive I collect ends up being overly defensive. Up until very recently I have just been running a backyard apiary, and couldn't afford to have the grumpy ones around. I got more hives than I had yard for, and the local zoning compliance officer got wind of it. Now everything is in a nice rural out yard where they hopefully won't be bothering the neighbors, or she who must be obeyed.

I do mite washes and do treat when the numbers climb, but not every hive ends up needing it. I had one hive washed 28 mites in a half cup sample; they got treated. I have one hive that at its peak washed 7. Decided not to treat that one, and it is booming now. That will be one I graft from. I can't remember what the mite loads were on this hive, but I'll check soon enough. I keep a couple of Palmer style double nucs on hand for comb building and brood resources, so they will probably end up there. My little 20 hive apiary won't save the beekeeping world, but I figure if I multiply from those mythical low-mite, high-productive, less-defensive hives, I can move the needle a little bit for me, and anyone who ends up with one of my nucs.


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## FlowerPlanter (Aug 3, 2011)

:thumbsup:


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## robinh (Jun 19, 2014)

(OAV is very hard on queens) Never heard or dealt with this either:scratch:


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