# HELP! Fleeing hive.



## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

I installed my first hive about a week ago and things seemed to be going well, but just a few minutes after I took a small peak into the hive the entire colony flew away! Including the queen as I saw her little blue dot sticker right before she took off. They are now flying around the top of a cedar tree 30ft up. What do I do?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

It's a good idea to keep lemongrass essential oil around and when installing bees into new equipment put about four drops in to help anchor them. If you already have bees, a frame of open brood is a great anchor. Now you have the problem of trying to bait them back to the hive they already rejected. Anything you can stack the deck with I would do. Lemongrass oil, QMP (pseudoqueen or "queen juice" from retired queens), old dark brood comb...

Probably they are gone. But these sometimes work.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

I unfortunately have none of those as it is my first hive. I set the package I bought them with as close as I can to the swarm after spraying it with some sugar and putting some wax they left inside, hopefully they might decide to try and make that into a home. If I can I will try and capture them.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

The swarm is still on the tree too far out of reach, but I'm seeing a lot of bees eating from the feeder on the hive. Is there a chance they might decide to move back in?


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

man what is up with the bees this yr, there is a guy that posts on the JP the beeman FB group that has lost 50% of his swarms and cutouts to absconding.


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## fieldsofnaturalhoney (Feb 29, 2012)

titankore said:


> I installed my first hive about a week ago and things seemed to be going well, but just a few minutes after I took a small peak into the hive the entire colony flew away! Including the queen as I saw her little blue dot sticker right before she took off. They are now flying around the top of a cedar tree 30ft up. What do I do?


A week ago? Have you looked in the hive they left to see what is inside the frames? Do you have a network of beekeepers/a local association? Someone may have something tall, or a vac with extensions, to help you out.


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## Slow Drone (Apr 19, 2014)

Are you using a screened bottom board? If you are, did you put the debris tray in when you installed? If not it's not uncommon for the bees to leave as such.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

A bunch of bees keep going from the swarm to the feeder on the hive and back. I'm hoping that they might decide to move back in or at the very least move closer to the hive so I can catch them.


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## gezellig (Jun 11, 2014)

Given your circumstances I'd remove a few frames to make your hive appear more like a swarm trap. Run to the health food store and grab some lemon grass oil and do as the others said. IF you get them to go back in, then place a queen excluded below your bottom box for a couple of weeks .


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## WBVC (Apr 25, 2013)

Someone recently posted a video of fellows getting a bunch of bees from way in a tree. They shot a cord over the bees using a bow and arrow. Then pulled the cord till looped the branch. They gave the cord a sharp tug, violently shaking the tree limb and the bees tumbled down into the bed of their truck.
Or...maybe this is the moment to test Swarm Commander
Good luck.


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## ksirovy (Mar 26, 2013)

I don't know if yours will return, but I had this exact thing happen to me with my first set of hives. They landed about 30 feet up behind the hive, while I was running around trying to figure out what to do, about an hour later I found myself in a swarm of bees by the hive, could not understand what was happening. The next thing I know they are all back in the hive. This wasn't a package and it wasn't just drones so the only thing I can figure is the whole hive went with the new queen. Guess she wanted everyone to watch! In the end I'm glad I got to see it.


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## Ottersbugs (May 3, 2013)

You could always go old school and try tanging...


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

if you don't have lemon grass oil, lemon pledge works in a pinch. I used some last week on a trapout to help the disoriented bees find the new entrance.


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## JRG13 (May 11, 2012)

What was your hive set up? Did they draw any comb while in the hive?


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

JRG13 said:


> What was your hive set up? Did they draw any comb while in the hive?



They made about 2 square inches of comb before this. It's a slightly modified Longsthroth hive.


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## tech.35058 (Jul 29, 2013)

Hmmm, I have no experience here, but maybe a lemongrass oil scented sock on a pole ( think tv antenna pole ) would lure them away from their branch, & then you could get them back in the hive.
IF you try this , all the "antenna pole" precautions about power lines, etc, apply.
Let us know how this works out.
Good Luck, ... CE


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

I put a few drops of the oil inside the hive and also in the package I got them in, hopefully they will go for one of the two. A lot of foragers keep showing up at the bee feeder so I'm hoping that between that and the lemongrass oil they will come back home.


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## gezellig (Jun 11, 2014)

Will a swimming pool net reach the cluster?


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

40ft up and my tallest ladder is only 20ft, so I can't reach them. My only hope is either they come back home or they move lower.


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## snapper1d (Apr 8, 2011)

I think tech had a good idea.A pole or anything you can put up near them.Even up on that ladder something with a drop of lemongrass oil.If you can knock them loose they would become attracted to it and you could then bring them down.Just be careful on the ladder up that high.At 20' you can break lots of things from a fall.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Day two: The swarm is in the same place on the tree, going to try the pole thing if I have one.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

tech.35058 said:


> Hmmm, I have no experience here, but maybe a lemongrass oil scented sock on a pole ( think tv antenna pole ) would lure them away from their branch, & then you could get them back in the hive.
> IF you try this , all the "antenna pole" precautions about power lines, etc, apply.
> Let us know how this works out.
> Good Luck, ... CE


I put a couple drops of the lemongrass oil in a clean spray bottle and water then gave a rag a good couple sprays. I put it on a pole within 5 ft of the swarm. Hopefully they start going for it.


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## McBee7 (Dec 25, 2013)

I havn't tried this, but have heard that if you put a garden fork in the ground in an open area, with a queen in a cage tied to the handle, it will attract the swarm to where you can collect them from the handle,,, of course 
for you just starting, having a queen in a cage is an issue,,,,maybe beg: borrow: or buy: anyway good luck.

==McBee7==


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Day three: Bees still up a tree, converted a hive box into a trap, sprayed it with lemongrass, put in they tiny bit of comb they made before in it, and some actual honey.


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## Billboard (Dec 28, 2014)

I like this, it's a nail bitter. Better than watching TV. My packages come Monday so I'm excited to see what happens. I'm keeping a eye on this thread, keep us updated!!!!!!


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## Brad Bee (Apr 15, 2013)

FYI, people get stung messing with 3 day swarmed bees. 

Do you own a chainsaw? That'll get em down to working height.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Billboard said:


> I like this, it's a nail bitter. Better than watching TV. My packages come Monday so I'm excited to see what happens. I'm keeping a eye on this thread, keep us updated!!!!!!


Well, I better go into a little more detail then. Taking the top box from the hive I converted it, baited it, and otherwise made it as appealing as possible for the house hunting colony as I know how, even went so far as to buy some honey to entice the former tenants back home. So far they have sent a few dozen bees either to eat up the bait to bring back to mobile command or to see if it is a prospective home.

The sun is setting and hopefully the next day they will move from their lofty position.


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## McBee7 (Dec 25, 2013)

Tanging the bees.
https://youtu.be/pUIjiZWWDn0
There are some other references here on BS in reguard to tanging or thumping or something of the sort...I'll try to find it and post it...

==McBee7==

Here are LOTS of threads on tanging bees using search bar here on BS
https://youtu.be/ok7SiHgzp04

Woops: try this link.
http://www.beesource.com/forums/search.php?searchid=6281569


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Day 4: The swarm moved to another one of the cedar trees and I can't see them but bees keep visiting my trap box and then flying back up afterwards. I am leaving it alone for now. 

I have been looking around for possibly getting a replacement package if they don't come back, but unfortunately almost all of the local sellers are sold out for the next month or so.


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## snapper1d (Apr 8, 2011)

If they are visiting the box they may move in when they get ready.


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## bevy's honeybees (Apr 21, 2011)

opps, duplicate


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## bevy's honeybees (Apr 21, 2011)

Mcbee7, thanks for the video. I have never tanged because it doesn't make sense to me, but in his case it appeared to work...or would they have gone back to the box anyway? 

Even if titankore loses the package bees, I recommend leaving the bait box as you might get some other swarm to move in sometime over the next month or more. Especially if you can't find a replacement package soon. I have 3 swarms this year so far, and I'm checking other bait hives today I may have more. 2 of the swarms are from within the last couple weeks. 

I had an odd thing last week. One of my back yard hives looked like it was going to swarm. At first it looked like orientation flight but then a lot of bees were coming out, flying around and a lot hanging out on the front of the hive. Lots of bees in the air. I had 3 empty hives at the same spot so I refreshened the queen juice and lgo in 2 of them. The 3rd is a 4 framer that was left over bees from when I moved a big hive about a month ago. I then leave a box with a frame of empty comb for the foragers to return to. I had noticed the traffic never did completely end at that one as is usual (that the traffic stops soon after) when I do that kind of a hive move and box replacement. Anyway, during this what appeared to be one of my hives swarming, or practice swarm as they never did go to a tree but all went back into the hive within 45 minutes, during that time there were a lot of bees checking out those three boxes. The 4 framer may have had a swarm move in without my knowing at some point in the past month, I have not opened it yet to see what's going on. The other 2 hives had bees checking it out for the rest of the day. I had to work the following day so I couldn't track what was happening that day. On Friday, I looked and there is a swarm that moved into the bait box that is right next to the original hive. I still don't know if original swarmed or not. Everything looks fine there. 

I also am following your thread to see what happens.


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## emrude (Mar 23, 2015)

I am also waiting to see what will happen. I have a package coming in a couple of weeks and this has given me one more thing to worry about.
I hope they move back to your box.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Day 5...maybe 6, yesterday bees would regularly visit and I saw a few today. The weather is calling for rain this afternoon so I'm really hoping they move in before it does.

Still looking around for new packages or nucs that are nearby in case things go further south.


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## WBVC (Apr 25, 2013)

Really hope this story has a happy ending. They seem to really like that tree.


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## gezellig (Jun 11, 2014)

I'd be so aggravated by this point that I'd have to reconsider wanting their rogue genetics in my apiary.


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## jwcarlson (Feb 14, 2014)

WBVC said:


> Really hope this story has a happy ending. They seem to really like that tree.


It seems unlikely that "everything is OK" with the bees doesn't it? They almost certainly have queen issues, I'd imagine.

Maybe they've started building comb up there at this point? Or maybe they don't have a queen at all? They didn't make some comb and then take off for no reason.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

jwcarlson said:


> It seems unlikely that "everything is OK" with the bees doesn't it? They almost certainly have queen issues, I'd imagine.
> 
> Maybe they've started building comb up there at this point? Or maybe they don't have a queen at all? They didn't make some comb and then take off for no reason.


The queen was fine when they fled, I spotted her as the rest were flying off, easy to find with a big blue dot on her back.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Update: After reading up some more on bait hives I moved my box higher onto the roof, added some honey onto one of the frames, and gave it another spritz of lemongrass scent. Hopefully now it will attract the **** swarm. Also I'm starting to think there is another swarm nearby as some of the bees that visit the box head off to the woods while most go up towards the top of the cedar tree.


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## snapper1d (Apr 8, 2011)

You may need to knock them loose from that tree.If they stay too long they will set up house there and may have already done that.If you knock them loose they may be more attracted to the lemongrass oil and go to it.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

snapper1d said:


> You may need to knock them loose from that tree.If they stay too long they will set up house there and may have already done that.If you knock them loose they may be more attracted to the lemongrass oil and go to it.


Too high up to poke them but I wrapped a rope around as high as I could and shook the tree for a couple minutes as hard as I could.


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## Brad Bee (Apr 15, 2013)

Do you have any buddies that work for a power company, phone company or tree service? See if you can get them to come out in a bucket truck and grab the swarm and put them in the box.

I can't wait to see how this plays out. I check this thread twice a day....


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## gezellig (Jun 11, 2014)

I keep checking this thread too, to see how it plays out, but darn they are stubborn. Since they love that tree so much, can you put a bait hive in that tree? One of this pulp type traps baited with lemon grass oil?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I bait swarms out of trees (not colonies--swarms) often. I use an old hive with four drops of lemongrass oil and four drops of queen juice (QMP). You can buy the QMP as Pseudoqueen from several of the bee supply places. If you use the Pseudoqueen, cut the strip into quarters and use one quarter of a strip with the lemongrass oil and some old brood comb in an old hive if you have one. They almost always move in. Of course by now they may have drawn some comb and they may not leave that...


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

12 GA with turkey loads usually gets them down if you are not in town


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKvl-qQArlk


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

I found them and managed to cobble together a stick long enough to poke them, between that and shaking the tree hopefully they will move. I would have given up by now if it were not for the fact that all local NC bee suppliers are sold out of bees...
;~;

I'm at my wits end.


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

can you fix a bucket to your stick and knock them into the bucket. Get a water cooler jug and cut the bottom out and duct tape it to the end of your pole.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Harley Craig said:


> can you fix a bucket to your stick and knock them into the bucket. Get a water cooler jug and cut the bottom out and duct tape it to the end of your pole.


I really wish I could but the pole can barely take its own weight.


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## gezellig (Jun 11, 2014)

Take a hose pipe and spray those stubborn -------!!!


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## crabbydad (Apr 29, 2012)

do you have a pool skimmer like the one in my pic that you can use or attach to your pole? they aren't that expensive and they sell them at any pool place or walmart.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

crabbydad said:


> View attachment 17139
> do you have a pool skimmer like the one in my pic that you can use or attach to your pole? they aren't that expensive and they sell them at any pool place or walmart.


Tried that the pole threatened to snap and they are protected by a couple branches on the cedar tree so I can't get close enough with the skimmer on to scoop them up.


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## robertbdj (Sep 19, 2013)

extension ladder? or have a truck..., put a ladder in the bed. all dangerous of course...but worth throwing out there.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

SOMETHING IS HAPPENING!
The bees are really buzzing up there and I'm getting more visitors to my traphive. I can't check it without possibly scaring them off again. If they move in should I wait a few days before moving the trap hive so they can build up some comb and such so they are less likely to abscond again?


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## WBVC (Apr 25, 2013)

This is sounding good.


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## jms86233 (Mar 18, 2015)

Things are starting to look better


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

titankore said:


> SOMETHING IS HAPPENING!
> The bees are really buzzing up there and I'm getting more visitors to my traphive. I can't check it without possibly scaring them off again. If they move in should I wait a few days before moving the trap hive so they can build up some comb and such so they are less likely to abscond again?


Normally I would say yes move them once they are all in, but with these little turds, I'd say wait at least untill you see pollen coming in, you can always deal with wonky comb later. Good luck!


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Harley Craig said:


> Normally I would say yes move them once they are all in, but with these little turds, I'd say wait at least untill you see pollen coming in, you can always deal with wonky comb later. Good luck!


Heh, from an earlier post from someone apparently a lot of package bees this season have taken to absconding, so yeah, better to play it safe and let them establish themselves in the box, if they move in.

Ugh, I really wish I knew what they were doing...


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

dang I figured it's dark there by now and would be in....sheesh maybe tommorow, but at this point I wonder how viable they will be.


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## JRG13 (May 11, 2012)

Might be fueling up before take off....


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## Tortuga (Dec 17, 2014)

bwahahaha, i've been glued to this post for 5 days now. these girls are stubborn.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Harley Craig said:


> dang I figured it's dark there by now and would be in....sheesh maybe tommorow, but at this point I wonder how viable they will be.


It was dark when I responded, between work/school/and working to get them it takes a few hours to respond.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Tortuga said:


> bwahahaha, i've been glued to this post for 5 days now. these girls are stubborn.


I find it somewhat hilarious that a thread about my bee problems is almost as popular as my webcomic.


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

Ha ha if you spent that much time looking for a new package they probably ly would have been there by now lol I know you said local packages are sold out but if you are in a bee club I bet you could still buy a nuc or a split off another member end up may early June


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Harley Craig said:


> Ha ha if you spent that much time looking for a new package they probably ly would have been there by now lol I know you said local packages are sold out but if you are in a bee club I bet you could still buy a nuc or a split off another member end up may early June


Actually yeah, by sold out I meant for this month, there is a few available till May/June but I really wanted to start sooner rather than later.


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

At this point a fresh new one next month will probably be better off


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## jwcarlson (Feb 14, 2014)

Harley Craig said:


> At this point a fresh new one next month will probably be better off


That was kind of my point earlier. Not saying they couldn't possibly survive, but they would be so behind the 8-ball at this point. Stranger things have happened I suppose. 

We had a package last year reject the queen outright (cluster left her overnight on 30 degree night). Replacement queen from package supplier went drone layer very soon on after install. They failed to raise a new queen. Purchased a queen for them since I was buying one already. This was June now after install first week of April. Had purchased 2 more packages installed early May. Both blew past original hive in about a week. 
Donated some emerging brood a few times from other package and purchased queen laid whole hive up really well. They were finally looking "good". Then during an inspection the queen ran off the combs and went buzzing into long grass. She never made it back. Had another queen available and threw a hail mary introducing her. 
They over wintered and her pattern looked great a few days ago when I took a quick peak. I say all that to say this... What a dang needy hive. It was my first year and I'd take more of the blame if I didn't go 5 for 5 overwintering the first year and never having had issues even remotely as goofy as that one hive. Sometimes I think they are just destined to fail. 
Two hives is really a must.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Well, I'm sad to say that they did not move into the hive and are now gone. Plus I seem unable to find any local place that isn't sold out of nucs and packages... I may have missed my chance this year ( ;~; )


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

still some available here it looks like. Im sure there are many others, this was just the first one I found I have never used them http://mountainsweethoney.com/bees/


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## gezellig (Jun 11, 2014)

Awe!!! Well if I lived close Id give you one, the following of this thread has been worth it!


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## Knot Wiring (Jan 15, 2015)

Harley Craig said:


> still some available here it looks like. Im sure there are many others, this was just the first one I found I have never used them http://mountainsweethoney.com/bees/


I got my package through them...great service. These bees are wide open. I'm brand new to this this year, I know things can go wrong anytime, but so far they are strong.


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

Thank you, I placed an order today, hopefully this time things will work out.


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

good luck


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## titankore (Apr 2, 2015)

I took down the trap hive and was setting it back up into a regular hive but found about 20 bees inside, are they scouts or have just been left behind by the rest of the colony?


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## Billboard (Dec 28, 2014)

Sorry about your loss, i would not wish that upon my worse enemy. Congrats on finding a nuc. Hope this one works. Im first year. My installs went good. I just hope my package changes thier mind about thier custom home i built. Scary thought. Im going into mine soon. 
Again congrats on finding a nuc.


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

probably scouts or forragers that returned after the cluster took off


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