# Hogan trap out question please



## challenger (May 27, 2009)

I have a section of a tree in my bee yard. It came from a tree removal last fall. I worked with the tree company to get the section of tree that housed the bees safely. This was a large oak tree and the section I ended up with weighed at least 250 pounds. When I got it to my bee yard I had to move it from the road to a spot about 400 feet away. I couldn't lift the section myself so I took a chain saw and removed about 50 pounds of wood leaving the hive still well in tact. I then miserably lifted the remaining section off the carrier I have on my truck receiver and on to a hand truck. I took it back and lifted the tree section on to a hive stand where it sat over the winter. I saw no way to get the bees into a proper hive other than to do a trap out. I have done this before so I know the Hogan method works. My issue currently is that the bees don't seem to be able to find the entrance to the deep I have placed over the transition tunnel. I left the transition tunnel on for a few days and there are no other entrances. They were using the transition tunnel just fine. I placed the deep with a few frames of empty brood comb over the transition tunnel two days ago and the number of bees flying all over is impressive but there are only "new" foragers using the hive entrance and the old foragers are just milling around lost while only 1' away from the hive entrance. Will they eventually find the way in?
Thanks


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

Yes they will, instead of trapping them out why not just put a box on top and once the queen moves up put an excluder under it?


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## Riverderwent (May 23, 2013)

Challenger, what do you mean when you say that you placed a deep over the transition tunnel? Was the tunnel connected to the hive body so that the bees have to go in and out through the deep hive body? Do you have pictures?


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## Tenbears (May 15, 2012)

Well you have a chain saw just split the log in half and remove the bees. It will simply be a real cut out!

I have done a bunch of them in my lifetime.


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## jadebees (May 9, 2013)

As Tenbears says, it is easy to do an ordinary cutout on a hollow log. Be sure to have the materials to re attach comb. I have done a few, and, all things considered, it's usually easier than a cut out in a wall or floor of a building.


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## challenger (May 27, 2009)

Thanks for the replies.



Harley Craig said:


> Yes they will, instead of trapping them out why not just put a box on top and once the queen moves up put an excluder under it?


I had a deep nuc on top for a few months and the bees started filling the frames with nectar so I removed it. I figured the queen wasn't going into a honey filled box anyway. I also didn't want to try it again because I am really trying to get these bees out of the tree so fostering the hive with more room didn't make sense to me???



Riverderwent said:


> Challenger, what do you mean when you say that you placed a deep over the transition tunnel? Was the tunnel connected to the hive body so that the bees have to go in and out through the deep hive body? Do you have pictures?


Sorry no pictures yet. I get so frustrated trying to post pictures in beesource that I have sort of given up trying. I know others have no problem by I always seem to.
I attached a tunnel to the one entrance in the tree section. It is made of 3/4" material and is 5"X5"X7" long square tunnel and I screwed it to the section with a couple of cleats. This is the "male" tunnel. I then made another "female" tunnel that has an inner dimension just a little larger than the outside dimension of the tunnel that is screwed to the tree section. This is attached to a single deep hive body so I just slid this deep over the tunnel on the tree. It has a stand and a lid. This deep is not just hanging off the front of the tree section, it is supported on the end where the entrance is. Thanks - I hope this is clearer. 



Tenbears said:


> Well you have a chain saw just split the log in half and remove the bees. It will simply be a real cut out!
> 
> I have done a bunch of them in my lifetime.


Well I really wanted to avoid doing this. I figured it would create such a mess that a trap out would be less trouble. Obviously more time but hopefully less trouble. I have also done many many cut outs, trap outs (although not but one other Hogan trap out), removals etc etc but this is my first from a large tree section that is sitting in my own bee yard.
Thanks



jadebees said:


> As Tenbears says, it is easy to do an ordinary cutout on a hollow log. Be sure to have the materials to re attach comb. I have done a few, and, all things considered, it's usually easier than a cut out in a wall or floor of a building.


As mentioned above, it would definitely be easier than removing a hive from a wall but I am dealing with a couple of things that are different than a normal take out.

I hate to admit this but I've lost 75% of my hives this past winter. I am still trying to figure out the reason but I think it had to do with varroa and me putting too much sugar syrup in the hives which made the hives larger with fewer bees and they got too cold. This tree section hive is the strongest remaining hive I have. The bee activity is like a booming hive in mid flow and we are still a couple of weeks away from the start of our main flow. If this was a regular hive situation with two deeps I'd be thinking about splitting it four ways for expansion. I cannot see inside the hive so this is just an estimation based on the activity. I know this brings up the concern of swarming and it isn't something I am overlooking. I want to not have this hive swarm and, for that reason, I am keeping the chainsaw method as a very possible plan B.
As of now the majority of the bees are using the entrance to the hive I put on the tree section. There are still gaps between the cover I have on the top of the tree and there are always bees looking to gain access through these gaps but there is no way they can. I guess they are smelling the hive easily as well as the other bees inside and this is what is keeping them interested in these gaps. I lifted the top off the deep today and there is a massive amount of bees working on the four frames of brood comb I put in it. I am sure they are filling this comb with nectar. I'm thinking about putting a frame of open brood in this deep to see if it might attract the queen but this may be pushing my luck??

All in all I suppose taking a chainsaw to this tree section will guarantee that they don't swarm out so perhaps I'll set a limit on the number of days I'll keep the status quo. After which the two stroke smoke will replace the pine straw smoke.

Thanks


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