# Russian bees



## drlonzo (Apr 15, 2014)

I've not bought them from Kelly's, but if I were in your shoes I'd do one thing. Make a phone call to Kelly's and ask them specifically where their Russian Queens were sourced from. Simple as that. Then all you need to do is go to the RHBA's website and see if the source is a certified breeder. If kelly's won't tell you the information, that tells you something. Most places will tell you where they get their stock.


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## mathesonequip (Jul 9, 2012)

drlonzo is correct. I would be real surprised if they are genuine certified.


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## gfbees13 (Sep 25, 2014)

If you want Russian bees, the all-around method seems to be to buy a package of Italian bees and then Re-queen with a RHBA certified queen. That way you get pure stock. (They have much better traits than hybrids) I'm getting mine from www.tubbsapiaries.com Granted, you do have the problem of the Italian bees accepting the new queen...
That's just my two cents.


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## NeilV (Nov 18, 2006)

I ultimately decided that I like Italians and local stock the best for my purposes, but I once bought Russian queens from Mr. Tubbs and they were excellent queens. I'd recommend him as a source for somebody who wants to try Russians. They were good laying, healthy queens and pretty gentle bees too. Mr. Tubbs was helpful in giving advice for requeening a hive with a Russian queen (which basically requires a week before exposing the candy in the queen cage.)


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## rookie2531 (Jul 28, 2014)

With beekeepers all around us and not knowing what is all around us, what is the point?

Are you going to buy queens for, every hive, every year?


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## drlonzo (Apr 15, 2014)

rookie - some beekeepers actually do buy queens each or every other year, but you have to look at it from the other perspective too. Our Russian Queens are producing full blood drones too. So the thought can also be that if I keep getting full blood queens that produce drones and they fly out and cross with other colonies out there, those bees are going to be more russian in time than they are anything else, so it won't be so bad if i have an F1 from one of my hives. JMO


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## BuzzWord (Oct 28, 2014)

Kelly's Russians come from Hardeman's in Georgia they are not certified but definitely show Russian tendencies.


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## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

BuzzWord said:


> Kelly's Russians come from Hardeman's in Georgia they are not certified but definitely show Russian tendencies.


Yep. hybrids. Unless they've changed their approach, the Hardemans bought pure Russian breeder queens, grafted from them then let those open mate in areas that are typically heavily Italian.


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## gfbees13 (Sep 25, 2014)

So in short: If you buy from Kelly's you have a Russian-Italian hybrid. That actually may not be too bad, considering the traits of each of those. Does anyone have a first-hand experience?


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## Billboard (Dec 28, 2014)

Yep Kelly's still gets thier Russians from Hardemans. So you say all i have to do for a purer russian is order a pure queen from tubbs and requeen the hives?


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## gfbees13 (Sep 25, 2014)

Yes, requeening a small package won't be a big deal. Mr. Tubbs will fix you right up. He's a nice guy, know's what he's talking about and he will answer all your questions. His queens are PURE russian. Also, if you are interested in honey production, he says the his bees produce as much or more honey than the Italians.


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## Billboard (Dec 28, 2014)

Ok thanks, how long after i get the hives going should i do the requeening.


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## gfbees13 (Sep 25, 2014)

I would re-queen when you are ready to put on the second deep box. That would be about a month or so. Make sure you call Mr. Tubbs and give him an estimated date on when you want her shipped. Otherwise, when you need the queen, he will be sold out.


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## Billboard (Dec 28, 2014)

Ok. Already sent a email. Waitting to hear back. I know reading all the threads about russians i have to take with a grain of salt. But just starting out and choosing russians. That should be ok im gathering. Whats your opinion


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## gfbees13 (Sep 25, 2014)

There is a quote from _Beekeeping for Dummies_ I want you to hear (just focus on the russian): "What kind of bee do I recommend you start with? Try the Italian or Russian. No doubt about it. They are both gentle, productive, and do well in many different climates. They are great bees for beginning beekeepers. Look no further in your first year." Mr. Blackiston also says this: "I've had good success with Russian bees...they are worth considering." Also, I would call Mr. Tubbs. He has answered the phone every time I've called but I didn't get a response through email.


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

Anecdotal evidence from me. I got some mite resistant queens of Russian derivation. The daughter queens tend to throw some hot bees. I have heard this anecdote enough times to think I might caution a new beekeeper to buy good protective gear or shy away from Russians. I choose not to have to wear gloves and will not tolerate bees that won't let me.


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## Billboard (Dec 28, 2014)

Ok then i belive i made a good choice. And i will call. Thanks again.


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## NeilV (Nov 18, 2006)

The pure Russians I got from Mr. Tubbs were gentle and prolific. They did not start to build up until Dandelions bloomed, and they would shut down brood rearing in August (when it gets hot and dry). The advantage of the Russians is that they are very thrifty over winter. That is a good thing. You could leave less honey on a hive an not worry about starvation and feed less in droughts.

However, where I live, I miss out on a super of honey if bees are slow to start in spring, so that was bad for me. I would add that I am in a city, and my early nectar flow involves a bunch of ornamentals and hollies, so it is stronger than it would be outside of town. In some ways, beekeeping can be very, very local. Russians did not work as well as Italians for me in this specific location. I have beekeeping friends who live 20 miles away in the country who started with and bred from Russian stock mixed with whatever's out there, and they really like the Russians. Again, beekeeping can be very local. If I lived further North, I'd certainly call Mr. Tubbs and get some Russian queens.

I did have some hot hives when the Russians requeened themselves. However, I sometimes get hot hives when my bees requeen themselves. Right where I live, there are some hot, feral bees. On occasion, I even run across swarms that can be hot. So I'm not sure that I blame the Russian genes for the hotness. I think I blame the local bee stock.

The other problem with Russians, in my experience, was that they swarm and when they start swarming they just keep doing it over and over again. When I had Russians, I had not yet really got started with checkerboarding. I suspect, but don't really know, that checkerboarding could make keeping Russians a much better experience. This should not be an issue in the first year, but be aware that those little clusters in February turn into swarms in May.


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## cg3 (Jan 16, 2011)

FWIW- I regretted the Russian hybrids I got from Hardeman's.


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## psfred (Jul 16, 2011)

I got one Russian package last year from Kelley, left over at the end of pick-up day. Boomer of a hive, they were hived on a deadout, so they had drawn comb, but even with that I didn't expect surplus honey immediately, which we got. Took a full super in June, they were up to a full two deep hive with two supers of honey!

Seem to be doing well so far this year, unlike the Italians we got at the same time. Lost one hive to multiple supercedures and the other didn't settle down into normal operation until the second supercedure. 

No more Italians for me. I ordered two Russian packages this week.

Peter


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## Billboard (Dec 28, 2014)

Everything I'm hearing lately, really makes me happy about getting Russians. After getting a pure queen they should be excellent performers then.


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## Deens Bees (Feb 11, 2021)

gfbees13 said:


> So in short: If you buy from Kelly's you have a Russian-Italian hybrid. That actually may not be too bad, considering the traits of each of those. Does anyone have a first-hand experience?


Are we absolutely sure on that. I got a package last spring and was given the choice from Kelly of hybrids or pure Russian. When I picked them up they had a big orange sticker on the crate stating "pure Russian". I would have asked more questions but COVID was in beginning stages so the pickup process was texting them that I was there and they sat them on the back dock for me to pull around and get them. Not disagreeing just wondering. They overwintered and I've been please with them so far.


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