# Brushy Mountain Oxalic Acid Webinar - Randy Oliver



## FlowerPlanter (Aug 3, 2011)

Safest for the bees but if might not be so safe for the beek.

A mask with proper rating should be used.

If you watch the youtube videos about 1/2 of the people are not wearing a mask.


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## johnmcda (Aug 10, 2015)

Understand that. It's pretty easy to run a smoker and see the wind direction so you can stay away from the vapor. Wearing a mask is simple as well. 

Other than that, the dribble method he recommends appears to me to be very inaccurate and I don't see how one gets even application on the bees.


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## camero7 (Sep 21, 2009)

I seldom disagree with Randy, but I do about OAV. I have done it for 6 years now with no mask and never had a problem. I'm in the middle of my treatment right now having done 2 of my 4 treatments. If you're observant you won't even cough during the treatments.


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## DPBsbees (Apr 14, 2011)

I wasn't surprised he didn't talk much about OAV since it's very time consuming to do it to several hundred hives compared to dribbling. I doubt most guys with hundreds of hives want to go back to them every week for 3 weeks. That being said, it works well for me in certain situations with 25 hives.


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## minz (Jan 15, 2011)

Could not find it online at Brushy, Scientific or general searches, does anybody have a link?


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

That webinar appears to only have been available 'live', at least for the moment. Here is the registration page:

https://attendee.gotowebinar.com/register/9187833990353252610

As you can see from that page, the webinar is not currently available, but there is an email contact there for Shane (Brushy Mtn Manager), who presumably could add that to other Brushy videos available on this page: http://www.brushymountainbeefarm.com/Resources/Videos.asp

.


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## camero7 (Sep 21, 2009)

DPBsbees said:


> I wasn't surprised he didn't talk much about OAV since it's very time consuming to do it to several hundred hives compared to dribbling. I doubt most guys with hundreds of hives want to go back to them every week for 3 weeks. That being said, it works well for me in certain situations with 25 hives.


If I were large enough to justify the cost I'd buy one of the air powered vaporizers that can do a hive in a few seconds. Much less labor intensive and faster.


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

Randy will be talking about Oxalic acid at the Oregon State Beekeepers Association Fall Conference 2015.
personally, I totally agree with Randy's points.
We have been doing a "fall cleanup" dribble for years and cannot imagine how much time and manpower it would take to do it otherwise.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

HarryVanderpool said:


> Randy will be talking about Oxalic acid at the Oregon State Beekeepers Association Fall Conference 2015.
> personally, I totally agree with Randy's points.
> We have been doing a "fall cleanup" dribble for years and cannot imagine how much time and manpower it would take to do it otherwise.


Agreed, a yard of 40 doubles can be done in a half hour or so. Singles even faster, just flip them upside down and dribble down between the bottom bars.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

HarryVanderpool said:


> We have been doing a "fall cleanup" dribble for years...


I wonder if you could help us understand your normal treatment regimen. When you say "fall cleanup", is that after the GR and late season blooms are spent? Do you use any other treatment methods in conjunction with the OA dribble prior to this, earlier in the season? Just trying to understand how the commercial beekeepers who use OA manage mites through the year.


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## jrhoto (Mar 2, 2009)

I urge everyone using OA to err on the side of caution and use a mask and rubber gloves.It is simple easy and effective.


Honey bees aren't just a hobby but a necessity! So are beekeepers.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

jrhoto said:


> I urge everyone using OA to err on the side of caution and use a mask and rubber gloves.It is simple easy and effective.
> 
> 
> Honey bees aren't just a hobby but a necessity! So are beekeepers.


Aside from the mixing process,which requires a reasonable amount of care, trickling is quite safe without any breathing apparatus. Googles are a good precaution while mixing and even during application though I have never bothered. I have even had a few splashes in my eye through the bee veil and have never gotten more than a very mild stinging sensation.


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

I have a feeling that the commercials use Apivar or Tactic for the late summer treatment and the the OA dribble for colonies that are broodless going into winter. As for the small keeper like myself we use multiple treatments of OA vapor after harvest and then another OA vapor treatment in December when or hives are broodless. As for time for treatments I do 30 home hives in 90 minutes and could possibly cut that even further if I had a 3rd vaporizer. As for wearing protective clothing, I protect myself with common sense. My vaporizer leads are 20 ft long and I seal all outlets with dish cloths and have never had a problem.
Johno


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

Mike Gillmore said:


> I wonder if you could help us understand your normal treatment regimen. When you say "fall cleanup", is that after the GR and late season blooms are spent? Do you use any other treatment methods in conjunction with the OA dribble prior to this, earlier in the season? Just trying to understand how the commercial beekeepers who use OA manage mites through the year.


Mike, I'm glad to give you my answer to your question, but remember that beekeeping is local so the Oregon dates that give you may be of no value in Ohio.

Here in the Willamette Valley we aim to have all of our honey off and mite treatment in by August 15th at the latest.
I aim for august 1st. This year we were done on August 8th.
Later on in the year when the hives are approaching the short broodless period, we go out and dribble them to catch any remaining mites in the hives.
This is, depending on temperature, usually around November 15 - 20.
Optimum temperature is about 40 degrees F.
We DO NOT treat our hives for mites in the spring because, due to a very effective fall clean-up, the mite levels are below detection levels.
Then as the year progresses we do random testing to determine if the honey needs to come off earlier to allow treatment, but NEVER later.
We do not test for mites in the fall because they all get treatment by the calendar.
That is our normal treatment regimen.


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

I have not actually compared the PH but I am quite sure that Coke a cola, or a bite out of an orange or lemon is WAY MORE acetic than 3.4% oxalic / syrup solution.
That is one of the things that I really like about the dribble program; it is probably the safest mite treatment that exists.
Oxalic dribble is safe, inexpensive, fast, no residues, no return o the hive....Can't beat it!


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## jwcarlson (Feb 14, 2014)

So you're using a rotation of *something else* during August and OAD to clean up mites in early winter while broodless. I'd love to get something like that done. I like OAV, but tossing strips in would be significantly less time consuming. My dream of cleaning up the mites around Thanksgiving and then another "warm" December day "insurance" OAV getting me through to the next broodless period is probably just that... a dream.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

This year I will be testing my stationary OAV all year long until the next Spring as
each brood batch that hatched. Figured that would be around every 21 days or so.
Each succession of OA treatment should get rid of the remaining mites if there are any.
Will see how effective this is during the cold winter months. A stationary OAV has many advantage
that you don't have to wear a mask or a suit to protect yourself. I don't use it at all. Rain or shine you can still 
use it. Too bad we don't have the snow here to test out this simple gadget in the snow bound months not too distance away.


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## snl (Nov 20, 2009)

The issue is with OAD is that it's basically a one time shot and you must use other treatments. With OAV, while it is not well suited as of yet for commercial operations, you can safely use it multiple times. It is much more suited to folks who don't mind the time with the multiple treatments. However, for those with multiple hives and several vaporizers you can get a "rhythm" down and treat rather quickly. Many folk like the idea of not opening the hive to treat. 

There are no strips to insert and later remove, it's simple, easy (for them) and effective. It addresses the problem of the beekeeper who hates to go into their hive(s) to treat.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

HarryVanderpool said:


> Mike, I'm glad to give you my answer to your question, but remember that beekeeping is local so the Oregon dates that give you may be of no value in Ohio.


Thanks Harry. Actually our schedules are not too different, I'm just a week or two later than you. 

I'll do one OAV treatment during the broodless period some time between Thanksgiving and Christmas, whenever the temperature is in the correct range. As with you, there is no need for me to do any additional spring treatments because the colonies are fairly clean at brood build up and they out breed the mites in the spring. 

Most beekeepers in my area wait until later in the fall to pull supers, but I usually pull mine about mid August so I can start mite treatments. That's also when the mites are usually at their highest levels of the season. Three treatments Aug - early September and the mites are cleaned out for the next couple of brood cycles of winter bees. If we happen to have an exceptional fall GR flow the supers can go back on in September after the treatments.

I think our strategies mirror each other, but I can understand how a series of OAV treatments in August could be expensive in labor costs and very time consuming for a large scale commercial operation. I've tried dribble in the past in Nov-Dec and found it works extremely well. The issue for me, in my region and my particular situation, are the limited windows of opportunity on when I can safely "open up" the hives to treat with dribble. Those "mild" days always seem to fall during the work week when I'm not able to get away from my day job. I guess everyone has limitations in one way or another, and we need to find what method works best for our particular situation whether we have 2 hives or 2000.


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