# Canola polination



## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

I have come across a farmer about 5 miles away with about 15 acres of canola planted and I would like to see if I can get some colonies there in the spring. I believe bees could enhance the yield up to 20% so there could be some mutual benefit for myself and the farmer involved. I would also have to consider any spraying of fungicide or insecticide . So can any of you guys that work canola enlighten me a little on the pitfalls I might encounter. I believe that 1 colony per acre would be the minimum required so I would be prepared to put out about 15 colonies and see what honey could be gained from this exercise. Any helpful advice would be appreciated.
Johno


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## Tenbears (May 15, 2012)

Oh you will get plenty of honey from canola, the trick is to extract it before it crystalizes, the stuff is worse than pure goldenrod.


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Once it's ready, be sure to extract it
Makes great creamed honey


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## pleasantvalley (May 22, 2014)

Seed canola is pollinated at a rate of 1.5-2 hives per acre. Canola will only bloom for a few weeks when there's heat, so make sure you have alternate forage or plan to move the hives when it's finished. The maximum benefit for the farmer is when the hives are in the middle of the field, but with such a small acreage, I don't think you need to worry about it. You will definitely want to ensure that any spraying is done before bloom or very early morning/late evening.


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Thanks for the input guys, I can leave my colonies on the canola until the end of April that's when my crimson clover will start to bloom then on about the 5th of May black locust should be starting to bloom. So I will have empty supers on the colonies when I put them into the canola and when I move them out I will extract what is in the supers and see how it goes. I will not be charging anything for pollination as I would like to encourage local farmers to plant more canola which I think replaces wheat in their 3 crop rotation. As for creamed honey I have never made that before so will look into that if and when I have some honey from canola. Is there any truth in bee pollination will increase canola yield, Ian should know, as I need to convince the farmer that there will be something in it for him.
Johno


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## dgl1948 (Oct 5, 2005)

Canola grown for oil production in the prairies is self pollinating and will gain very little from bee pollination. The beekeeper is the one who gets the benefit.


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## pleasantvalley (May 22, 2014)

dgl1948 said:


> Canola grown for oil production in the prairies is self pollinating and will gain very little from bee pollination. The beekeeper is the one who gets the benefit.


Check this factsheet Besides increased yields from germination, one key benefit of honeybees is a shorter bloom period of 3-4 days which reduces potential for certain diseases. Shelly Hoover, researching in Lethbridge, AB presented some updates to this research at our November AGM in Edmonton.


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Thanks for that factsheet, it certainly is in favour of pollination. I did not know that all canola or rape was self pollinated and even so honey bee pollination still does increase yields. I will get the factsheet off to the farmer concerned and I am sure he will be interested. Thanks again.
Johno


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## dgl1948 (Oct 5, 2005)

There are several studies on the benefits of bees and the pollination of canola. Shelly Hoover's results show as little as a 5% increase in some of her work. The results are all over the map. But still the real benefit of bees in canola go to the beekeeper.


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## pleasantvalley (May 22, 2014)

dgl1948 said:


> There are several studies on the benefits of bees and the pollination of canola. Shelly Hoover's results show as little as a 5% increase in some of her work. The results are all over the map. But still the real benefit of bees in canola go to the beekeeper.


I can't argue the point that much of the benefit go to the beekeeper. But if I was a canola farmer and a beekeeper told me I would get the potential of even a minimum 5% increased yield for no effort on my part besides a few unfarmable square feet at the edge of my field, I'd take that every day of the week.  BTW, she does state that maximum yield increases come when the bees are in the center of the field....makes sense, but it'd be a hard sell to most growers.


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

For all the $$$ farmers spend on fractional production improvements, they are very receptive to hear about fractional production improvements from zero investment. My farmers are more than accommodating to have my hives close to their fields


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Yes I would think the farmer in question would be interested in a 5% gain in yield at no cost to himself. I gather that the yield increases would depend on weather and the colony density per acre, I think some of the higher gains have been due to about 4 colonies per acre which might be good for the farmer but not the beekeeper, think 4 times the work and not much more honey than from 1 hive per acre. This is the second year the farmer is doing canola so he could have an idea of any gains after harvesting.
Johno


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Considering all the variables, fractional increases are impossible to measure... big ag spends billions on showing us those gains


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## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

Johno, I am in the exact same boat you are. I have a farmer a few miles up the road from me that has grown canola the past couple years. Last year i got in touch with him and he agreed to let me put some hives on about 80 acres. The place I am putting them is literally the corner of the field. I only have a few hives so I am basically just using the canola to jump start splits and use as an outyard. I am hoping that I can get a density good enough so he sees a difference on his yield monitor. I'm hoping if things go well with him I can use his reference as a way to get pollinating contracts in the future. Luckily for me the farmer across the street from me decided to plant 100 acres of canola as well so my home apiary should get a boost too.


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## Riskybizz (Mar 12, 2010)

More canola more bees....opcorn:


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Jason for the farmer to really benefit from pollination you would need at least 1 hive per acre. Anyway good luck.
Johno


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## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

I understand, i would just assume that the plants closer to the hives would get better pollination then on say, the other side of the field. Maybe he will be able to tell come harvest time. Hopefully in the next 3-4 years i will be able to build up enough to fully pollinate the whole field


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## bendriftin (Nov 1, 2010)

Please do not take my word as gospel but I put bees on conola grown for seed. In that situation you have small rows of all male plants and large rows of female plants. The male plants get mowed down some before the bloom ends to ensure there are blooming males for the duration since they typically bloom first. Only a few days. Anyway oilseed canola I believe is all female plants therefore pollination is a mute point. If you do pollinate seed canola from my observations and one Canadian study I read states that there is a benefit to not having bees on during the first part of the bloom. By stressing the plants by not pollinating them they put out more blooms thus more pods. Last year as soon as bees were placed it rained a lot for 2 weeks and little flight time, and we had the highest yields.

On a side note not all varieties produce as much honey so if you only get 30 lbs per hive do not be surprised. I did get 60 lbs on a few hives but most will say the average is 30 and less than that on some of the newer varieties. 

Another thing, there is a fungicide often sprayed on canola that I believe is called squash. Makes bees really pissed off. There is also worm that gets into the pods so some fields may get sprayed with a pesticide if this happens get yours bees out before hand but stay in contact with the farmer most will let you know but often loose your number somehow lol


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Thanks for the info bendriftin, how long were your bees on canola. I am lucky to get an average of 45lbs of honey per hive over the spring flow so if I can get 30lbs off 2 to 3 weeks on canola I will be laughing all the way to the bank, by the way that spring flow is all I get for the year.
Johno


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## AstroBee (Jan 3, 2003)

johno said:


> I can leave my colonies on the canola until the end of April that's when my crimson clover will start to bloom then on about the 5th of May black locust should be starting to bloom.


This is interesting. So, when are the expected start and end bloom dates for the canola? I would like to squeeze in a strong flow before the 1st of May. However, I absolutely wouldn't want an agricultural flow to conflict with the main spring flow. Our main flow, Tulip poplar, typically starts near the end of April.


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Hi Astro, I planted a little oil seed rape last year and it started blooming on April the 15th. The main flow started around 12 days later with crimson clover on April 29th and black locust on May 4th, I have a feeling we will be a little earlier this season. I did not get a date for tulip poplar last year but will try to get one this year. The other thing about the canola nearby is that they are farther advanced than the rape I planted so could flower earlier than the rape did last year. Another thing to bear in mind is that the 12 hives taken to canola also have access to flowers of the main flow in the canola area and still leave me with 20 hives at home. Those 12 hives will then go on to outhive sites.
Johno


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## AstroBee (Jan 3, 2003)

AstroBee said:


> However, I absolutely wouldn't want an agricultural flow to conflict with the main spring flow.


My point with that statement was that our spring honey has such nice flavor and hardly ever crystallizes, I'd hate to mix it with anything else.


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Astro, I will pull off all supers on those 12 colonies before locust bloom move them away re super them and extract anything I get from canola. If I get anything worthwhile I would try to set up a creamed honey line and see how that goes locally.
Johno


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## bendriftin (Nov 1, 2010)

Our canola does not bloom until about the end of June but it al depends on planting date, I think it is 6-8 weeks after planting for our canola to bloom. It lasts usually 4-6 weeks. I think bloom period is temperature dependent we seldom get over 85 degrees in the summer had have excellent luck growing canola. In Nebraska I have heard it does not produce there because it is too hot during the blooming period. Good luck, I would be interested in hearing how much honey you get


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Bendritin the canola that I found down here has replaced the winter wheat and is planted in Sept. or Oct. then goes through the winter and flowers in the early spring. A local farmer is trying about 15 acres and I have never seen it planted here before so have no idea what I will get out of it. I will report on the results in due course.
Johno


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Well the canola a few miles away is in full bloom but was a wasted exercise, I contacted the farmer on numerous occasions, emailed him with papers on the benefit of honey bees pollinating the crop and he stated that he would call me when he was ready and has never called. My window is closing fast so it will not be worth while moving in a bunch of hives for less than a week.


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## bendriftin (Nov 1, 2010)

Can you move onto the neighbors?


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Too many residential properties around the canola, besides if the farmer is not interested in a 5% to 15% increase in yield why should I be bothered to cart 15 hives around for a week on canola when my main spring flow is just around the corner. It seems a lot of farmers seem to farm Washington subsidies instead of trying to get better yields
Johno


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## johnbeejohn (Jun 30, 2013)

Johno there gas got to be a neighbor semi close to there for next year 5 lbs of "fresh local honey" can get you in alot of places


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Did you offer to give him a tithe of honey for placement?


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Ian if I could have had a real discussion with the guy when he could of shown where to place the hives on the farm land we could of come to some agreement. But as I said I did all the chasing and he never came back to me when he said he would. For me that's the end of the story for this guy. Why I mentioned people farming Washington is from one word "Pigford"
Johno


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## bendriftin (Nov 1, 2010)

Well first of all unless there is only 2 acres 15 hives will not produce a 5-15 percent yield increase, figure a minimum of 2 hives per acre. Secondly most farmers grow canola as an alternative crop, it is a broadleaf so you can spray to kill out grasses like rye and wild oats. If he typically has raised wheat or barley he may have gone with canola to control something that has been creeping into his field. Also that canola should bloom for three to four weeks and the less it gets pollinated the longer the bloom. If you could get the bees within a mile they will find it and maybe even two miles. The canola pollen is really good for hives but I am not sure I would give up a good flow of something else for canola honey since it crystallizes so fast


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## johnbeejohn (Jun 30, 2013)

2 miles is to far to make it worth it if you can't get them a half mile away u would not waste my time moving them


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

johno said:


> Ian if I could have had a real discussion with the guy when he could of shown where to place the hives on the farm land we could of come to some agreement. But as I said I did all the chasing and he never came back to me when he said he would. For me that's the end of the story for this guy. Why I mentioned people farming Washington is from one word "Pigford"
> Johno


Key word , neighbour


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## high rate of speed (Jan 4, 2008)

Persistence works as well.very well said Ian.


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

First of all Bendriftin, according to a paper from Manitoba research in Quebec showed an increase of 46% with 3 hives per hectare and 13% if some bees were present. So 3 hives per hectare is close to 1 1/2 hives per acre so 5% to 15% increase in yield is not out of the question with close to 1 hive per acre. The other problem is the farm land is practically surrounded by 1 acre residential properties so I would not have much time to canvass these folks that I do not know to allow me to place 15 hives on their property. Furthermore I am an independent type of guy so if I go out of my way to set something up for mutual benefit with another party and they could not even bother to communicate as they said they would I tend to walk away and will no longer pursue that avenue. I do not have to kiss any ones butt for mutual benefit, besides I am now preparing my hives for the spring flow.
Johno


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

If there was an increase of 46% farmers would be paying


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Hey Ian , those are not my figures I got those from Canola watch. But whatever the gain it is obviously not enough for this farmer.
Johno


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Lol he must not like honey. 
My land owners are more than obliging. 
Regardless who's numbers those are, they are exaggerated. We grow 1500 acres of canola each year. Yields come from fertility and weather, as goes my honey crop.


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

Ian google Sabbahi et al 2005, he has a paper that compares canola without insect pollination to canola with bee pollination and comes up with those figures. Of course there will be little canola grown that does not have some insect pollination I think that is where the 13% increase over no insect pollination. However his tests show that with 3 colonies per hectare the increase would be 46% over non insect pollinated canola. So the bottom line is that bees are good for canola.
Johno


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Ha ha ha, wonder why his study never got traction? 
Our combine yeild monitor does not increase 46% as we work past my bee yards. Canola is open pollinated, wind pretty much covers all its pollination needs. I like to tell guys there are marginal gains for having that bee yard in their field, increase of seed set an weight. But marginal benefits are very hard to measure unless it's done for seed production


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## bendriftin (Nov 1, 2010)

Not trying to fan any flames over benefit of bees or not, but I just thought of something. We grow canola for seed so we have male and female plants and we cut the female plants down before they set ripe seed. So most of the seed sold to joe blow farmer would be female seed correct, that is why your yield monitors don't show a big increase is due to the fact their is no male to female pollination. Another question for you Ian, somewhere I read that the male canola plant produces pollen and the female nectar, do your bees gather a lot of pollen from the canola?


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## high rate of speed (Jan 4, 2008)

A few miles away?Bees on the east coast must be wingless


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Bucket loads of pollen and nectar
These plants are self pollinated


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

The canola in question is about 5 miles away as the crow flies, so go figure.
Johno


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