# What to plant?



## cdevier (Jul 17, 2010)

clovers - white and sweet.
Charlie


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

This is just a suggestion on my very small scale compare to 2 acres. I planted the dwarf teddy bear sunflowers the last time. Harvested lots of seeds at the end. They only grow to 2 feet tall, free standing with multiple flower heads and not take up much space. My bees were on them all summer long. Not sure about the nectar produced but for sure they have pollen on my bees. Imagine 2 acres of sunflowers. Wowww! What a sight. And the chicken like them too. I'm sure other animals will.


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## Andrew Dewey (Aug 23, 2005)

Great question - unfortunately I don't think there is one proper answer.

Questions that you need to answer include what is the current state of the soil and what kinds of equipment is available to prepare the soil, plant the seed and potentially harvest whatever you decide to grow.

Then you can ask yourself is there a particular time of year that you want to provide forage for. Here in Maine we have lots of things (like apples and blueberries) blooming in the 2nd half of May, but not so much in the first half of August before Goldenrod comes on strong.

Once you've answered these questions you can start deciding what crops will work for you. Around here Buckwheat is often grown as a green manure and bees make good use of it. Various planting techniques (mostly breaking a large parcel into smaller sections) can make for a long bloom period. The clovers can be excellent if they are not harvested for hay before flowering.

It sounds like your landowner wants to do a one and done - meaning that they are willing to do something once to improve the land. In that case you ought to be looking at self seeding annuals or perennials.

I encourage you to talk with your local Cooperative Extension or Soil and Water Conservation folks to come up with a workable informed plan.

I encourage you too to have the soil tested before planting anything.


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## Joseph Clemens (Feb 12, 2005)

I would have him plant Sainfoin.


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## mdadams1 (Apr 17, 2012)

Anything in the mint family. Easy to grow, perennial, and bees really seem to love it. Esp mountain mint.


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## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

rmdial said:


> I live in No. Idaho, today's high is 17 with a low of 12. Garden planting is not recommended til May 15.


There are lots of garden crops that can and should be planted before the middle of May in the north. Onion sets, onion transplants, lettuce transplants, lettuce seed, Brassica transplants, beet seed. Spinach seed should be up and growing well before the middle of May. …Just to name a few.

Many people can't grow head lettuce and spinach because they're planted too late.


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## Sticky Bear (Mar 15, 2012)

I would recommend borage if it will grow in your area self-seeds and sprouts along with dandelions and blooms until first hard frost. My bees love it.


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## The Valley (Jan 21, 2014)

I agree and am foregoing any produce garden this year to plant more Sainfoin.


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## The Valley (Jan 21, 2014)

Joseph Clemens said:


> I would have him plant Sainfoin.


I agree. I am going without a produce garden this year so as to have more room to plant Sainfoin.


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## rmdial (Jun 30, 2009)

Thanks for all the input. I have thought about the labor and equipment needs and the landowner has both to accommodate the project. I am going over to talk to him this week to talk about what it will actually take to do this and make sure we both understand the practical side of what needs to be done.

Also, Sainfoin has been on my radar for a couple of years but I do not think it will work as a green manure. I may be wrong so I will check further. I am trying to make a strong effort that what we do will improve soil conditions for any future project the landowner chooses to do. I also know bees love Borage but some Noxious Weed boards have it on their list as unwanted. 

I am also aware not all seeds are equal and I will have to research sources to insure the best quality I can find.

Sounds like, as suggested, a trip to the Extension Office is in my future.

Don't stop if you have other comments.

Thanks again.


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## PyroBee (Dec 14, 2013)

Japanese buckwheat will work as green manure.


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## justin (Jun 16, 2007)

dandelions, white dutch clover, sweet clover, i plant borage but it gets tall and unruly, vetch, hearing more and more about mustard as a green manure and bee forage. is there a time when nothing else is blooming? i could use more forage the last couple weeks of june, i'm good till then and good after that. think about when it would be the most beneficial and chose plants that bloom then, or plant for a bloom then.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

From my experience spinach, chard, and lettuce the bees don't like. 
They like the mustard and canola.
Maybe you can plant something like tomato, cantaloupe, or watermelon. I am sure the bees can benefit from these as well. 
If your zone is short season then you have to find those for your area to grow. Some of these will come back the next year
if they reseed. So look for that also if that is what you like.


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## sky_guy (Jun 25, 2013)

> I would have him plant Sainfoin.


I also agree. I know I talk a lot about sainfoin on this forum and I'm sure everyone's getting sick of it, but it's a fascinating plant. As long as your soil conditions are right (well-drained, high pH), I think it would fit your situation nicely. It can be planted in the spring and will produce forage this season. I know sainfoin grows best along the Rocky Mountains, especially Montana, so it should thrive in northern Idaho. Does well under dryland conditions too as long as you get at least 12-14 inches of annual precip.



> Also, Sainfoin has been on my radar for a couple of years but I do not think it will work as a green manure.


It should, it's a nitrogen-fixing legume like the other popular green manure crops. I don't have any experience with anyone who uses it that way, but I know it's used in Europe (its native region) as green manure. The seed can be expensive, so it might not be practical to plant just to till under when there's other cheaper options. Most folks plant it for long term use. It can be used for livestock grazing since it's non-bloating or cut for hay with a nutrient value similar to alfalfa.


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## quietman (Jul 1, 2013)

Try to determine what part of your season the bees experience a dearth and plant something that will get them thru a tough time. Buckwheat works here in pa where we get a midsummer dearth often between the spring flow and the fall goldenrod/aster flow.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

white sweet clover
yellow sweet clover
birdsfoot trefoil
white dutch clover
alfalfa
ladino clover
chicory
goldenrod
dandelions


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## heaflaw (Feb 26, 2007)

My climate is very different from yours, but my bees liked Niger better than Borage. And it's prettier.


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## Waggle (Mar 7, 2013)

heaflaw, where did you get viable Niger seed from? I would also like to plant some this year.


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## heaflaw (Feb 26, 2007)

Waggle said:


> heaflaw, where did you get viable Niger seed from? I would also like to plant some this year.


Here's the link if I did it correctly. American Niger Seed Co.

http://www.nigerthistle.com/buynigerseed.html

http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?257188-Niger-for-Nurse-Crop&highlight=niger


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

I don't know much about the niger seeds. Are they selling the Guizotia abyssinica niger seeds?

http://www.fabulousfinch.com/cart/products/American_Grown_EarlyBird_Niger_Seed-184-21.html

Looks like somebody shut it down. If they are heat treated for obnoxious weed seeds will they still grow? The link said heat treated the seeds
so that will not affect their sprouting rate?

And do the flowers look like this one?


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## Waggle (Mar 7, 2013)

heaflaw said:


> Here's the link if I did it correctly. American Niger Seed Co.
> 
> http://www.nigerthistle.com/buynigerseed.html
> 
> http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?257188-Niger-for-Nurse-Crop&highlight=niger


The American Niger Seed Co. no longer is in business. I have tried using niger seed sold as bird feed but the germination rate is very low. Does anyone have another source for viable niger seed? I am hoping to try some this year.... if I can find some.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

I got mine already. They are invasive though. 

You can still find them on the net if you know where. HINT: What are the 2 biggest online stores that you
can do a search and order from?

The heat treated seeds from the store will kill majority of the viable seeds. So no good for growing.


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## heaflaw (Feb 26, 2007)

Wilhite Seeds will sell live Niger seed. I bought 4 lbs for $7.50 per lb.


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## biggraham610 (Jun 26, 2013)

I plant buckwheat for the deer and turkeys and quail. The bees love it and its a simple planting with quick returns. For my perrennials, I like white clover, sanofoin and alfalfa. G


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I planted a 650 lbs of Hubam clover (thanks to the beesource people who pointed me to where I could find some). We will see how that goes. I've heard good things.


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## biggraham610 (Jun 26, 2013)

650 lbs of clover................wow.............thats alot of acerage isnt it?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

If I had a drill (too expensive) and that was all I was planting it would be about 7 to 14 acres (10 to 20 lbs per acre). But, alas, I only have a broadcaster and I also planted, trefoil, white dutch, white sweet, yellow sweet, alfalfa and hairy vetch (about 450 pounds of all of those put together) and I was planting 18 acres. To be honest, I probably have about 200 pounds left over (of all of that put together). I'll use it before the year is out though. So I guess I planted about 900 lbs of seed at about 50 lbs an acre.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/519a4DPSTpL.jpg


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## biggraham610 (Jun 26, 2013)

Yeah, I broadcast my perrenials too, then cultipack for seed soil contact. I usually plant my perrenials in the fall. Have several spots I am working now for fall planting. Will plant a cover crop of annual such as buckwheat to hold the ground, keep weeds down and then till it under for fall plantings. Here the hot droughts we get in mid summer make it hard for clover to take a strong hold. In the fall they concentrate on their root systems and usually come out powerful in the spring and with proper care last 4-6 years at least.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

heaflaw said:


> Wilhite Seeds will sell live Niger seed. I bought 4 lbs for $7.50 per lb.


Yeah, the niger seed is not invasive on further research. But the earwigs really like them. I have to plant
them in gallon pots still they got the leaves and mowed off the top killing them. Many still survived though.

Potted one gal. niger seeds:


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