# Heating Honey But Not Pasteurizing



## Tom Brueggen

How warm can I heat honey and not pasteurize it? I know this can be a touchy subject. I'm not trying to play games. I have a 5 gallon bucket of honey, almost solid! I can cream the whole batch as I've recently learned, but I have folks asking for liquid honey. I got a jar of it to go back to liquid but it felt pretty hot when it was done. I could still hold the jar in my hand so I doubt it was too hot, but it sure was a lot hotter than I've felt it when harvesting out of the hive. 

I have a pail heater that says it's set on on 125° but keeps shutting off and won't heat the bucket up. Seems I have to set it much higher than it actually is heating. So setting at 125° may only heat to 100°, I still haven't honed in on it. 

Anyway, given that example, if I set it at 125° and it really does heat to 125° (worst case), will that pasteurize it? I though pasteurization was something like 160°F but maybe that varies with the product being pasteurized. 

So just to be clear, my intent is to reliquefy without pasteurizing.


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## gww

I am really new. Why is pasurizing bad? I had read the other day that it takes pasturized honey longer to cristalize. So when I get honey this is something I don't want to do?
Not trying to be a thread steal but seemed a perfect place for a point of imformation. If it is out of line I am sorry.
Thanks
gww


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## Tom Brueggen

Raw honey contains natural bacteria and enzymes credited as being beneficial from a health standpoint. Raw honey sells at a premium to pasteurized honey. Sure it may crystallize faster. But crystallized honey is just fine. The only bad thing about crystallized honey is having to explain to consumers why it's NOT a bad thing.


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## gww

Tom
Thank you for the explination
gww


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## Michael Bush

I think the solution to crystallized honey is to educate your customers...

>How warm can I heat honey and not pasteurize it?

I don't know why the term "pasteurize" comes up in honey discussions. The purpose of pasteurization is to kill all the bacteria in a product. The lowest temperatures and times I've seen listed are 140 F for 20 minutes. I don't know anyone producing honey who is doing that for the purpose of killing bacteria, they are heating it to destroy crystals so it won't crystallize. They usually flash heat it at 160 F for one minute to melt all the crystals and make it run well. This does less damage to the honey than heating to something more moderate for a much longer time.

Here is some info on crystallization:
http://www.montcobeekeepers.org/Documents/Honey_Crystallization.pdf


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## WilliamsHoneyBees

Higher temps also causes the honey to loose a lot of flavor in my opinion. We have an upright freezer that we converted to a hot box. We set the temp to 110F and in 1 to 2 days a solid bucket of crystallized honey will be liquid again. It is heated by 4-60 watt bulbs on the bottom and a small fan at the top to keep the air moving. Temp controller can be bought a few places online. Ranco ETC-111000 controller.


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## WilliamsHoneyBees




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## Tom Brueggen

Thanks Dan. I definitely know I need to build a hot box. And I know I can educate people. I find I can sell the crystallized honey easy enough, especially if I cream it. But I like to retain some good liquid honey just for quick easy sale. Plus it leaves more options open. Someone looking to add a cup of honey to their beer recipe for example gets skiddish about the jar of "solid" honey I offer. Anyway, on the hot box, I went looking for a dead fridge on Craigslist one day. NONE! Normally CL is littered with free crap people are hoping someone else is dumb enough to haul off. And not a one to be had! Maybe CL was just broken that day. I'll try again. 

Back on topic, I'm hearing no hotter than 140°F and it's still considered not pasteurized. The only reason I mention pasteurized as a problem is because I market my honey as raw, and at a premium for it.


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## WilliamsHoneyBees

We never go above 110. I don't see the need.


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## Michael Bush

Since there is no legal definition for "raw honey" you can boil it and sell it as "raw". But that's not the point, of course. I would say anything above what the bees would have had it in the hive is too hot to call it "raw" within the meaning of what people want when they buy "raw honey".


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## sqkcrk

pine_ridge_farms said:


> Higher temps also causes the honey to loose a lot of flavor in my opinion.


My honey gets heated to 150 degrees before straining. I don't find a lose of flavor. My customers seem to love it.


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## sqkcrk

Tom Brueggen said:


> Back on topic, I'm hearing no hotter than 140°F and it's still considered not pasteurized. The only reason I mention pasteurized as a problem is because I market my honey as raw, and at a premium for it.


There is no such thing as pasteurized honey. Do you put "Unpasteurized" on your label? Do you strain your raw honey?


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## Barry

sqkcrk said:


> My honey gets heated to 150 degrees before straining.


It really needs to be 150 in order to strain?


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## sqkcrk

Michael Bush said:


> Since there is no legal definition for "raw honey" you can boil it and sell it as "raw". But that's not the point, of course. I would say anything above what the bees would have had it in the hive is too hot to call it "raw" within the meaning of what people want when they buy "raw honey".


If honey isn't "raw", is it cooked?


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## sqkcrk

Barry said:


> It really needs to be 150 in order to strain?


It also clears all crystals. But I don't find that much lower than that, that the honey will go through the nylon strainer very fast.


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## Barry

> Honey may be moved through the strainer by pressure (pumping) or by gravity flow. When cloth strainers are used in a pressure system (fig. 5), a pressure switch should be installed in the honey line to prevent excessive pressure that could rupture the strainer cloth.
> 
> 
> 
> Heating the honey to 115° will greatly facilitate the straining process. This increases the fluidity of the honey without softening the wax particles appreciably. Higher temperatures will soften the wax so that it may be forced into or through the straining media.


http://www.beesource.com/resources/usda/honey-removal-processing-and-packing/

150 degrees seems excessive to me. I would think one would want to heat honey only enough to "do the job."


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## Rader Sidetrack

sqkcrk said:


> There is no such thing as pasteurized honey.


That is a very curious statement.:scratch: The _National Honey Board_ does not agree with you, Mark. See this FAQ from them ...

http://www.honey.com/images/downloads/shelflife.pdf


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## deknow

Wrong. Talk to antone in charge of a kitchen that prepares food for immunosupressed folks. They will not use honey that has not been pasturized (to kill the yeasts and other microorganosms).

The term is often misused by beekeepers and those promoting honey...and it's clear that often pasturized just means heated so it flows better....but talk to a nutritionist at your local hospital or meals on wheels kitchen.


sqkcrk said:


> There is no such thing as pasteurized honey. Do you put "Unpasteurized" on your label? Do you strain your raw honey?


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## Rader Sidetrack

>> Anyway, on the hot box, I went looking for a dead fridge on Craigslist one day. NONE! 

I suggest using IFTTT to automatically monitor your local Craigslist for you.
https://ifttt.com

Its free, and easy to set up to send you a message when an item that you want is posted to your local Craigslist. IFTTT is very visually oriented, so when you set up your 'recipe' keep in mind that the Craigslist logo looks like a 'peace sign'.


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## sqkcrk

Barry said:


> http://www.beesource.com/resources/usda/honey-removal-processing-and-packing/
> 
> 150 degrees seems excessive to me. I would think one would want to heat honey only enough to "do the job."


When I liquify my buckets in the hot box the temp in the box is 120, which doesn't always liquify all the honey in the bucket. Then it gets dumped into my MAXANT Bottling tank to further liquify it. If I heated it to anything less than 150 it would crystallize in the jar sooner than it has so far. I've dealt with enough of that. Also, if I strain at much lower temps it passes through the strainer much more slowly. So I do what I do.


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## sqkcrk

Rader Sidetrack said:


> That is a very curious statement.:scratch: The _National Honey Board_ does not agree with you, Mark. See this FAQ from them ...
> 
> http://www.honey.com/images/downloads/shelflife.pdf


Okay, guess I was wrong about that.


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## deknow

Barry, I dare say that for the majority of honey sales in the US, keeping the honey from crystailing on the shelf is "the job"....taking product back doesn't pay very well.


Barry said:


> http://www.beesource.com/resources/usda/honey-removal-processing-and-packing/
> 
> 150 degrees seems excessive to me. I would think one would want to heat honey only enough to "do the job."


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## beemandan

Tom Brueggen said:


> How warm can I heat honey and not pasteurize it?


From Wikipedia:

*HTST milk is forced between metal plates or through pipes heated on the outside by hot water, and the milk is heated to 72 °C (161 °F) for 15 seconds.[27]:

A less conventional, but US FDA-legal, alternative (typically for home pasteurization) is to heat milk at 145 °F (63 °C) for 30 minutes.[30] 
*
I would think if it is effective for milk, it would probably be for honey as well.



Tom Brueggen said:


> I know this can be a touchy subject.


No foolin'. Not only touchy but opinions run the gamut.


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## Barry

In this case, "the job" we (Mark and I) were talking about was straining. Heating it to prevent granulation is a whole different matter. I personally don't try to prevent this natural process.

Mark, 120 degrees will completely re-liquify honey. That's the highest I ever heat my honey after it has granulated. It won't prevent it from granulating again though.


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## deknow

150 will cook an egg by any standard.



sqkcrk said:


> If honey isn't "raw", is it cooked?


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## sqkcrk

Barry said:


> In this case, "the job" we were talking about was straining. Heating it to prevent granulation is a whole different matter. I personally don't try to prevent this natural process.
> 
> Mark, 120 degrees will completely re-liquify honey. That's the highest I ever heat my honey after it has granulated. It won't prevent it from granulating again though.


Well there ya go.


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## deknow

"We" are discussing several issues related to heating honey....straining is one of them.

Mark explained what he does and why....crystallization among the reasons.

The same document you cited to show that heating higher than 120 is unnecessary also states:


> Honey selected for bottling should be from floral sources that granulate slowly. Proper heating in the processing and bottling operation also will help retard granulation. Commercial packing plants put much of the honey prepared for the liquid honey trade through a pressure-filter process. Any bottled honey in a sales display that shows signs of granulation should be replaced immediately.


and 


> crystallization? During processing, several steps are taken to prolong the liquid state of honey. Pasteurization delays the process of crystallization by dissolving any crystals that may be present in the crude product. Pasteurization also affects yeast cells which considerably reduces the possibility of fermentation. Recommended pasteurization treatments include flash pasteurization (170 °F for a few seconds) or heating at 14


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## sqkcrk

I can take a crystallized 5 lb jar of honey and set it against the window at the southern end of my house and it will liquefy. If that's all you want to do, and have the time to spend, it works. 

Barry says that 120 degrees will work. If you have the time, 110 probably works.


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