# Crimson clover



## GaryG74 (Apr 9, 2014)

The road crews plant it along some of the highways here. It comes back every year. Haven't stopped to look for bees. Most of the soil around here is acidic--not sure of the ph but it grows well here.


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## jrshay (Jul 9, 2012)

Dave
Crimson clover is the only thing I have planted for the bees that they have shown any interest in . In MIssouri I plant it in the fall and have early spring blooms . They seem to really work it.

Jim


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## Jon11 (Mar 29, 2011)

Location definitely makes a difference. Around here I don't know that I've ever seen bees on alfalfa. How big was your plot of crimson? We had around fifty acres this year and bees were all over it.


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## Greenride (Jul 7, 2013)

I've planted areas about 5x10 and see light honey bee traffic on it early in the season. More bumble bees than honey bees. I fall sow and it blooms in the spring.


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## Patrickshmoe34 (Jul 21, 2014)

Could it also be too close to the hive? Im a rookie but im sure someone told me they wont forage within a certain radius of the hive to keep predators from finding the hive.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Patrick, it isn't true that bees will not forage within close distance from their hives. Think of open feeding.
I planted forage plants within 20 feet from my hives. They still forage on them when the dragon fly was hovering
close by. Predator will find them when they wanted to.


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## Patrickshmoe34 (Jul 21, 2014)

Thanks Beepro, I could swear i've heard more than one person pass that nugget of bad knowledge around.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Patrick, there are many misinformation out there. I can only relate my own experiences to that of other beekeepers.
True or not I will find out once I had done my small experiments. Once I found something different from what others had said or done, I can only accept or reject
my own experiences in beekeeping. Then I will keep evidence and records from my own findings. So far after the solstice mated queens proved to be an excellent layer in
building up the Fall nest! I had read it here to decide on a small scale experiment of my own. Dragon fly will find your hives no matter what. Honey bees prefer to forage within close distance to their hives than flying 2 miles away to find the same food source. If we all can do our own little experiments then many misinformation can be put away for good. Take
the Buckwheat for example. They told me here that the plants will grow to produce many more flowers. But the type that I grow only gave off one time bloom and stopped. Things have changed since the old days compare to now. The weather supposed to be cold by now to wear a jacket. Now it is still in the high 90s at day time here. Good thing I took the initiative to plant some bee forage for a Fall harvest.


Nygers and Borage only 30' away:


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## MikeinCarolina (Mar 9, 2014)

I have had Crimson Clover growing as a nectar source for my bees for years. Starts blooming here most years about the end of the first week in April and peaks for 2-3 weeks in mid to late April. My bees work it hard. If you plant it and let it set seed, then till or disc it in it will come up on its own and will actually become a weedy nuisance if you have it in your vegetable garden.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

So when do you usually planted them?
Do they grow well while still in the cold?
These will complement my Borage nicely.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Just make sure it's crimson, not red. Honey bees don't work red clover.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

1) There is the crimson red clover.
2) And then there is the red clover.

I should buy the #1 above, right?


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## Dave Burrup (Jul 22, 2008)

It is not crimson red clover. If red is in the name steer clear. Crimson clover is a big hairy leaved annual or fall annual. Red clover is a short lived perennial. Red clover is nearly useless to honey bees. I have seen them work some of the secondary blooms. The secondary flowers have smaller flowers and shorter corolla tubes, but it is still not worth planting for honey bees.


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## Dominic (Jul 12, 2013)

Dave Burrup said:


> It is not crimson red clover. If red is in the name steer clear. Crimson clover is a big hairy leaved annual or fall annual. Red clover is a short lived perennial. Red clover is nearly useless to honey bees. I have seen them work some of the secondary blooms. The secondary flowers have smaller flowers and shorter corolla tubes, but it is still not worth planting for honey bees.


Red clover isn't a poor forrage crop for bees. Red clover is a good source of pollen. Furthermore, it is also often a good source of nectar, as many other insects will chew at the corolla, making the nectar available to honey bees. Honey bees are a vital part of a good red clover seed yield.

If you have a choice between any clover species, though, favor white and alsike clovers. Sweet clover, vetch, and birdsfoot trefoil are other good legumes to consider.


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## Dave Burrup (Jul 22, 2008)

Dominic apparently location plays a big part in this too. We had a patch of Red Clover for four years. The bees worked the Dandelions growing in the clover heavily. It was unusual to see a honey bee even look at the Red Clover flowers. Others have commented on how good crimson is for bees, but here it is a total waste of effort. Our soils have very high pH levels and I suspect that plays a big part in nectar production.


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## MikeinCarolina (Mar 9, 2014)

beepro said:


> So when do you usually planted them?
> Do they grow well while still in the cold?
> These will complement my Borage nicely.




I am in a 7b or 8a growing zone. It is best planted here about mid September - it will grow slowly over the winter but really puts on a spurt of growth this time of year. My soils are naturally acidic, but I keep the garden area where I grow crimson clover at about 6 - 6.5 ph.


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## Dominic (Jul 12, 2013)

Dave Burrup said:


> Dominic apparently location plays a big part in this too. We had a patch of Red Clover for four years. The bees worked the Dandelions growing in the clover heavily. It was unusual to see a honey bee even look at the Red Clover flowers. Others have commented on how good crimson is for bees, but here it is a total waste of effort. Our soils have very high pH levels and I suspect that plays a big part in nectar production.


Soil may have a part to do with it.

But all of the studies I've read on red clover seed production states that placing honey bee hives is a must, and that despite short tongues, the bees can still access the pollen and, if the corolla is damage, nectar. It's variable from hive to hive, though, and depends on what else is available.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Red clovers have a few types.
I did not know so bought the 'medium' red clover.
I believe that the standard red clover flower is a bit longer that the honey bees cannot
get into the nectar. But the medium red clover as advertised is supposed to bee good
for the honey bees to work on them. What do you think about the medium type of red clover? Is it o.k.?
I also bought the dutch white clover. At 50% of each, should I plant them in the same patch or to separately
plant them? It will be interesting to see which type that the bees prefer when they both bloom.


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