# Hardeman's



## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

South GA had a very late freeze about the time your order was due. Tremendously high winds the next week. Over 6 weeks without any rain. A major wildfire was raging as of last week. I picked up packages from a different supplier down that way a week ago. They told me they were scrambling to meet their orders. My three pound packages looked a little light. So, if the Hardemans claim that the weather has delayed your packages I'd be inclined to believe them.
I've done business with them before and they're a good outfit.


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## JD (Aug 18, 2006)

I think that is where my middle man is getting them from. Ship date was first of the month (april), they are saying they should now ship first of next week, we hope


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## bee crazy (Oct 6, 2005)

*They are there, I saw them*

I actually picked up some packages from them last week. I know they are two weeks behind. They are scrambling to get caught up but the weather has been bad for them. I was pleased with the size of the package but the queens were small and are not yet laying. I hope they get with the program really soon.

So they are there and working hard, hope you get your order soon. I did order in late January and had scheduled a pickup then also to coinside with my vacation and they were able to accomodate me.


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## Jesse (May 15, 2006)

They were the supplier for the bees that were sold on Ebay. I just got mine two days ago - just when the Ohio distributor promised. They were the Russian/italian hybrids - and arrived in very good condition.

Very few bees dead and the queen looked happy and ready to get to work.


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## BeeAware (Mar 24, 2007)

I know there was a late freeze, we got it too. I was willing to give them the benefit of the doubt but it is curious that other suppliers in the same area are on schedule. I know they are because I also ordered packages from them. Now Hardeman's tells me they don't know when they can ship. They've got the last order from me. I only ordered from them in the first place because a couple of guys in our local club recommended them. Now those same guys tell me they got lousy queens from them the last two years!! Thanks a lot guys.


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## NW IN Beekeeper (Jun 29, 2005)

*Were they smiling?*

[and the queen looked happy...]

I wondering if you send some photos, my queens always look... well look busy!

-Jeff


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## Jeffrey Todd (Mar 17, 2006)

My past experience with Hardeman's was always good. I would give it a little longer; plus if they are good about returning your calls or emails, that is usually a sign of a good business.


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## Ellen (Dec 25, 2006)

Other Georgia sellers are also delayed due to weather. The nucs I ordered from another supplier in Georgia will be shipped today. (Yippee)

I've always had good luck with Hardemans. 

Ellen


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## BeeAware (Mar 24, 2007)

All the other Georgia suppliers have shipped, and on schedule. Hardeman's can't even give me an estimated ship date. Yesterday and today I tried many times to phone them and they would not answer. Tried to send them a fax and the fax machine would not answer. As far as I am concerned, they can keep their bees and refund my money. I regret that my very first experience with them was totally negative. I will advise all members of our local clubs to avoid Hardeman's, as most of them have already learned to do. The cold weather in Georgia was about two nights of lows in the upper 20's to lower 30's, certainly not severe enough to have caused all the problems that are being blamed on it.


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

I had the pleasure of sitting down with John Hardeman on the first of April. One of the things we discussed was the lack of help this year. Seems that in the past, there was ample help from certain groups more than willing to get paid for a days work. He said that in past several years, its been harder and harder to find people actually willing to show up and work . John had indicated that the family members were working themselves to death and he mentioned that restructuring their business in the coming years may be needed.

Much of some of the bigger outfits use much labor from south of the border. Some outfits such as Wilbanks use labor from south america.

Seems finding good labor for hard work is a problem.


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

Beeaware,
I will not bad mouth another supplier, but you are dead wrong about "other suppliers" not being late. Perhaps you recieved other shipments from other suppliers, but thats not rationalization to be used to bad mouth another supplier when the facts are clearly wrong. I have had many dicusssions with others about other Georgia suppliers being late with postcards being sent and delays a plenty.


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## BeeAware (Mar 24, 2007)

I did not claim to know what others have received from Georgia suppliers. My own orders have been filled with the exception of Hardeman's. As far as bad mouthing them goes, I'm not hesitant to report poor service, regardless of who is involved. I do not run my business this way, and consider it bad business on their part. I stick to my position.


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

Help me out BeeAware. I tried finding another thread that you started in praise of all the other suppliers that shipped on time. I have found none. I hope your not just the complaining type. As hard as it is for suppliers in this industry, I hope you find the time to be positive and actually comment about the bright spots. If you know what I mean, unless your business that you mention knows nothing of the matter. 

So who else did you order from? Anything actually positive?


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## Limey (Feb 10, 2007)

I doubt many people would have a problem with packages being late.. however, the key to keeping your customer happy, and a return customer, is to keep them informed. You can delay delivery of products and services and still have happy customers as long as you are honest and keep talking to them.

In this case, BeeAware, is not being kept informed. That is bad service regardless of the problems the company is having. 

I recently ordered from Draper. No bees came and when I called them, they were not the slightest bit interested in tracking down when they would ship. I won't use them again. Is that bad mouthing them? no, because it is based on facts. Personally, I don't care what problems the company have, that is not my problem. I just want to be kept informed.


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## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

I, too, agree with BeeAware. If they're a month overdue and not offering answers, he's due a refund and an apology. From what its worth, I also understand Hardeman's problem. It was more than the freezing weather. South GA hasn't had any appreciable rain in over 10 weeks. It is an area that depends on agriculture and this will be a devastating season for many. The freezing resulted in lost blooms from a number of wild flowering plants. The lack of rain has driven nectar production to zero for many others. Farmers haven't been able to plant cotton, another important bee forage in that area, because the ground is too dry. For many bee producers this season will be just as devastating as it will be for most other ag.


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## BeeAware (Mar 24, 2007)

I rarely post anything negative about anyone and did so in this case with the hope of sparing someone a negative experience. I don't know why but it seems that customer service is almost a thing of the past. I run a business and have done so for several years. When I cannot complete a transaction for any reason, I notify the customer, explain the situation, and offer them a refund or an alternative solution, their choice. In this case, I got no notice of late shipment, first two weeks when I called I was told shipment would be made "next week". When it was not, I called again and was told that they had no idea when shipment could be made. I waited another week and decided I just wanted a refund. Tried two days in a row and no one answered the phone, tried to fax and the machine was not working. What would you have thought at this point? Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I was taught to do your level best to keep your obligation and if you can't contact the other party and see what can be worked out. But don't just ignore the situation and hope that all will go away. By the way, I still don't have the bees nor a refund.


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## Jeffzhear (Dec 2, 2006)

Bjorn, how big is Hardeman's? From what I gather they are a bit bigger then a mom and pop shop. I wonder how come there are no other complaints on this thread about them? One persons complaints about someone is just that...not enough to form an opinion, one way or another.

Course, on the other hand, no one is saying, hey, I got my honeybees from Hardemans on time with no problems....


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## JD (Aug 18, 2006)

Jeffzhear said:


> Course, on the other hand, no one is saying, hey, I got my honeybees from Hardemans on time with no problems....


One guy did, he got them off ebay I think he said

I have an order to hardemans, but getting them from am middle man dealer. Last week he said the bees are starting to act right, then big wind storm blew over some of his queen boxes. So he is working on everything and I think is starting to ship. But as of 4pm last night our orders had not been shipped yet.

I do know my middle man dealer is able to get in touch with them every other day. But if I had a bunch of back orders I would not be in the office or on the phone. 

Plan and simple it was a jacked up winter and a worse spring. Nothing is going right unless you live in NC. You can not beat mother nature.

Don't get me wrong, I am mad that my bees were not here first week of april, but if they had come then they would be dead. I want my bees NOW but as of now I do not blame Hardemans or have hard feeling towards them. Stuff happens and the weather is what happened this year


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## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

Jeffzhear said:


> Bjorn, how big is Hardeman's? From what I gather they are a bit bigger then a mom and pop shop.



The Hardeman's are pretty big. If you order bees from Walter Kelley, those will be Hardeman bees. I was told by a reliable source that they sold over 60,000 queens per year.

While not a mom and pop shop, they are a family operated business. John is the founder, I believe. He is mostly retired. His sons and grandsons operate the business and provide most of the labor.


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## NW IN Beekeeper (Jun 29, 2005)

*Reseller, not the supplier*

[One guy did, he got them off ebay I think he said]

Hardeman's bees are being resold on e-bay, its not them directly. 

But in order for that reseller to have them on time, the reseller must be receiving them on time, or leaving a large enough window to allow for a little delay. 

This might be aligned with the discussion on lack of staff. 
If I was a supplier, I might neglect a few small orders for the sake of my big profit customers (just to make the most profitable use of my staff). 
While this doesn't sound nice, it does make good business sense. 

-Jeff


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## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

NW IN Beekeeper said:


> If I was a supplier, I might neglect a few small orders for the sake of my big profit customers (just to make the most profitable use of my staff).


I would expect that Kelley gets the first cut. They've had a long term relationship and likely some form of written contract.

Once again, if the Hardeman's are 4 weeks (or longer) behind for individuals, then they ought to be in touch offering refunds. BeeAware, you didn't mention, but did you pay via credit card? If so, have they already charged it?


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## bee crazy (Oct 6, 2005)

Jeffzhear said:


> Bjorn, how big is Hardeman's? From what I gather they are a bit bigger then a mom and pop shop. I wonder how come there are no other complaints on this thread about them? One persons complaints about someone is just that...not enough to form an opinion, one way or another.
> 
> Course, on the other hand, no one is saying, hey, I got my honeybees from Hardemans on time with no problems....


I ordered mine in January for Sunday April 15th, and I got them Mon April 16th. I did do a pickup as I was comming back form Florida. BTW the queens have matured and now laying wall to wall brood. I'm very pleased. This is my first experience with Hardemans. I'll go back!


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## BjornBee (Feb 7, 2003)

Yes, John is the owner. He has three sons who are the family work force. They have a staff of about 12, with my discussion with John centered around "9" showing up and being at work on a good day.

Certainly the long standing orders that are in the hundreds take priority. With that said, I do agree with bad service and non-returned phone calls. It is something that I fight daily being my own phone operator of my own business. Hardeman's has an office girl who handles phone calls. Except for a busy signal, and then its just a 5 minute wait...all my phone calls were taken once the phone rings. Although I do not leave messages which I realize can be forgotten or "lost" when left after hours, I have never had them NOT pick up the phone during business hours.

I challenge anyone to call next week during the day and actually see if any picks up the phone. I find it absolutely absurd for someone to suggest or claim they won't answer the phone, when I have had them answer the phone EVERY time I have called.

For the record.... They started taking orders on December first last year. I had them on the phone the first hour they started taking orders. I was in contact with them as my order approached. I have dealt with them in the past. They know me, and I know them. I felt welcomed into thier home on Saturday (Mar 30th.) night and had a good chat with John. My order as well as those whom I traveled to georgia were filled on time.

Now perhaps they have caller ID, and know when certain people call......


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## Ellen (Dec 25, 2006)

One of the things I used to like best about ordering from Hardeman's was talking to Mrs. Hardeman, because she was the one who took orders then. Very old school--referred to her husband as Mr. Hardeman. I would always forget and order late, and she would be absolutely firm when I tried to wheedle an earlier delivery date from her.
Lovely (and very tough) woman.


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## BeeAware (Mar 24, 2007)

No doubt they are all very nice people who are having some problems. However, they have lost most of the future business from all us in this area.
My ship date was to have been April 9. Here it is May 7 and no bees and no word on when or if they will ship. Neglecting to fulfill obligatiions to customers, or at least inform the customer, is never good business whether customer is large or small. Small customers become large customers only if they receive the service they are promised. Unfaithful in small things, unfaithful in all things.


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## Fred Bee (May 5, 2007)

I received my 3 lb package of bees right on time today. (May 7) I ordered them through Walter T. Kelley Co. but the package said "Hardeman Apiaries" on it. Tonight, those bees are in their new home (hive).


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

I dont know if yaw seem my post but that last cold snap set most back about a week, also I was told that Hardemans got hit by a Tornado and lost about 1100 hive's from there queen rearing yards, that is why they are running behind, some times thinks happen you can't control and you just have to go from there, they are very nice people that have a good reputation so I they will catch up......


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## dug_6238 (May 9, 2007)

*Waiting patiently too...*

I have two sets of packages ordered from Hardemans. One was ordered through a gentleman in Southern Maryland, and was expected to ship on April 7th, (I needed to drive down to MD to pick them up) and the other was ordered to be shipped to PA around the 7th of May. To the best of my knowledge neither has been shipped yet. I didn't know when I ordered from the gentleman in MD that he was getting his from Hardeman's, so I talked to Robin about shipping my two packages along with my other order and saving me 7 hours of driving. She was very nice about it and promised to help out. I'm sure things will work out when they get everything put back together, but Iwas curious if any of you have started receiving packages yet. I wouldn't want to tick Hardeman's off as they've been very accomodating to my situation. I'm in PA so I haven't totally missed the spring buildup, but if I don't get going soon, I will. The apples are starting to blossom. On a positive note, I ordered two packages through Craig Cella and they came in March. I don't know who they were from, but other than one losing/killing its queen  and having to raise another off a frame of eggs from the queenright one, they're doing great. This is the first year that I've done packages, and I'm very pleased so far, even considering my problem with the one hive's queen. Looing forward to those other 5 packages arriving...


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## BeeAware (Mar 24, 2007)

My ship date was susposed to have been April 9. As of today, still no bees. Finally got through to them again by phone on Wednesday and got the same line as before. They said "We're hoping to ship sometime next week". Hope they do. Sure is late to be starting a package.


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## BeeAware (Mar 24, 2007)

*Finally Arrived*

To give credit where credit is due, I wish to report that the packages from Hardeman's finally arrived on May 19, just 40 days after the original ship date. One package had a queen cage with a few attendents and NO queen. No queen, dead or alive! The other two had living queens.


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## Jesus_the_only_way (Mar 17, 2006)

Maybe they read this thread and decided to stick it to ya' 
Tom


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## BeeAware (Mar 24, 2007)

Jesus_the_only_way said:


> Maybe they read this thread and decided to stick it to ya'
> Tom


If so, they better give it their best shot because they'll never have another opportunity. Worst experience I've ever had with a bee breeder!


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## bee crazy (Oct 6, 2005)

Beaware, keep us updated on their progress, I started mine as 5 frame nucs six weeks ago(April 18th). Ten days later after the queens proved them selves I moved them to a Deep hive box. Todays inspection eight of the ten packages the queens have laid up the bottom hive box, is between 6 and 8 frames. (10 frame deep) And the second stories foundation is over half drawn out and the middle frame is almost ready for the queen. They are ready to explode in one more brood cycle. I wish you would have gotten your bees on time but I hope your as impressed with it as I am. But do give that queen a good week to start up. My other two packages, one queen arrived dead and the other package the queen went missing.


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## dug_6238 (May 9, 2007)

*Still "Still Waiting Patiently" but now impatiently...*

Well if it's any consolation, that little deal that I mentioned back on page 3 that was to save me 7 to 8 hours of driving blew up in my face. They held my two packages of Russians and said they'd throw them in with my second shipment that was being sent directly to us, and that that order would be shipped very shortly. 

Last week they promised the kind, honest, 84-yr. old fellow that shared this order with me that even though they were running a little late, they'd ship May 21st or 22nd. Well, after weeks of being told that it'd be "either later this week or sometime next," today I got...

"Well, it'll be either late this week, or sometime next week, but we should definitely be caught up by next week."​
This second order was to be shipped the first week of May. Our payment was sent literally months ago now. A few weeks ago when trying to get an update, we had pressed as to what the status was (because the check hadn't been cashed yet.) The answer - "Oh, it's here in this stack of papers on my desk, we'll get that put through right away for you." 

Today the lady tried to claim that the payment wasn't sent until May 5th. 

Mismanaged customer expectations, checks/payments not cashed/processed until after the originally-promised ship date, no updates, 'sliding' ship dates...

???


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## dug_6238 (May 9, 2007)

*Still no bees...*

Still waitin'.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

dug_6238 said:


> Still waitin'.


They told me yesterday that my May 7th delivery should be sent out next monday.

"We should be caught up by the end of the week." The same reply that I have gotten for the last couple of weeks.

They did have frost at Easter and a tornado, not to mention the GA fire.


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## Limey (Feb 10, 2007)

There is no freaking way I would except a package at this time of year.. even if you still had a good flow on, I would seriously question the quality of the package as they tried desperately to catch up..


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## Jesse (May 15, 2006)

*Sorry to say*

Hi guys,

I am very sorry you haven't gotten your packages yet, and maybe you don't want to hear this - but, out of 3 different suppliers of packages I received this year, the hardeman's are doing the best. Again I got mine on ebay from a distributor in ohio that had trucked them from hardeman's - if i get any packages again next year I may very well try the ebay route. 

Good luck with the rest of your year

Jesse


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## okb (Apr 16, 2007)

I really think there gonna wait and give you a suprise  on Christmas morning!


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## Curtis (Jun 25, 2005)

I saw someone at Dadant in Virginia that received his nuc yesterday.
Good Luck to everone.
Curtis


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## Limey (Feb 10, 2007)

From everything I have read, it appears the best thing to do is to order from a 3rd party. A company who places the big order with companies like Hardmans. Hardmans will go all out to complete those orders and to keep it's big customers happy at the expense of any small orders that they have directly.

This year I had placed an order with Drapers Bees and received them only 10 days late. Had I gone direct to the supplier, I would probably still be waiting.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Limey said:


> From everything I have read, it appears the best thing to do is to order from a 3rd party. A company who places the big order with companies like Hardmans. Hardmans will go all out to complete those orders and to keep it's big customers happy at the expense of any small orders that they have directly.
> 
> This year I had placed an order with Drapers Bees and received them only 10 days late. Had I gone direct to the supplier, I would probably still be waiting.


I understand what you are saying, but what's the point of having an ad in the bee mags if they aren't going to service their customers? I ordered 100 queens, not 1 or 10. But it shouldn't matter. Unless they want you to order their queens from a third party. If so, they should say so. Are third party queens cheaper than those from the original supplier?


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

My queens came today. A month late, but they got here. Maybe they will do better next year. Though I think I'll order from more than one supplier at a time.


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## dug_6238 (May 9, 2007)

*Still no bees, maybe this week? Let's hope...*

Still holding my breath, but I'm beeing told that I'm starting to turn blue...

, it's just a little too funny at this point to be 

Maybe after this is all over I'll write a nice objective review here about my experience, but I think I've been doing that along the way...just maybe not in 25 words or less...


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## dug_6238 (May 9, 2007)

*Wait no longer...they arrived!*

My packages arrived Thursday. Not very many dead bees in the bottom of the packages, but a couple of the queen cages had more dead attendants in them than I would have expected. One only had one live attendant left in it.

I was concerned that the Russian queens looked a little small and slim compared to my Italians that I've gotten, but one gentleman explained that they Russians will look a little smaller and slimmer. Entomology is not my strong point...

Will post later to list how the packages are doing. There was some more confusion on the shipping. I asked for a tracking number and was given a number that turned out not to be a tracking number, but rather just a delivery confirmation number. I checked back with Hardemans, they said they checked with the post office, and claimed that they were told that the packages had been delivered. This was a little frustrating being that neither of us had received our packages yet, and neither had our local post office.

We did find out later that day that our packages had made it to the regional USPS Distribution Center, so we just drove down there ourselves to pick them up there.

A little alarming though to have packages be 1 and 2 months late and then be told by the vendor that they've been delivered...but not have anything in your hands to show for it.

Let's hope performance of the end product can make up for some of the bad points in this experience. I'll post pics later too.


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## BeeAware (Mar 24, 2007)

*Tracking*

I had the same experience with another Georgia supplier. Told me the packages were already delivered and gave me a number. The Post Office had not received the packages and said the number that I was given was invalid.
When I phoned the shipper again to explain this, they said that was between me and the Post Office that they were finished with the transaction. I think many of the bee breeders are better bee breeders than they are business people!


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## okb (Apr 16, 2007)

dug_6238 said:


> Still holding my breath, but I'm beeing told that I'm starting to turn blue...
> 
> , it's just a little too funny at this point to be
> 
> Maybe after this is all over I'll write a nice objective review here about my experience, but I think I've been doing that along the way...just maybe not in 25 words or less...


 I think you could have beelined a swarm by this point maybe more than one.


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