# Natural vs. black Rite cell or Plasticell foundation



## HeritageHoney (Feb 28, 2013)

I'm about to make an order for a large number of preassembled deep frames. I have used Dadant's natural plasticell up to this point with good success. Was thinking about trying Mann Lake's rite cell since it's a little sturdier. My question is regarding color. Have any of you compared the black to the natural? I realize seeing eggs for a quick check would be easier with the black background, but what advantages or disadvantages have some of you seen when comparing the two?


----------



## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

What color is black in the dark? In a closed colony I doubt that the bees know or care what color the foundation is. I just got 6 1/4 one piece frames for $1.611 apiece and 9 1/8 for $1.98 delivered. That was the cyber Monday price and hope you can match it. Just keep in mind those are 4.9MM and the bees wobble a bit regressing to that size especially if you draw them mixed with other size foundation. At least that is what has happened in my colonies.


----------



## Michael B (Feb 6, 2010)

I use natural rite cell. I find my bees tend to draw that out before the black. The only advantage with the black is egg spotting and 1-2 day old larvae for queen grafting. It's really a beekeeper preference.


----------



## dynemd (Aug 27, 2013)

Vance- Are you saying the Mann Lake Rite-cell foundation is 4.9mm? I didn't know that if that's true.


----------



## HeritageHoney (Feb 28, 2013)

Gotta good deal from Dadant and just went with the natural Plasticell. Maybe I'll try some black in my mating nucs that I'm gonna graft from this Spring/Summer.


----------



## johng (Nov 24, 2009)

I like the black because it is easier to see eggs and young larva. The bees don't seem to care


----------



## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

No their rite cell is not! I was talking about pf one piece frames. Sorry if I was confusing-----or confused.



dynemd said:


> Vance- Are you saying the Mann Lake Rite-cell foundation is 4.9mm? I didn't know that if that's true.


----------



## Fishman43 (Sep 26, 2011)

I have black and natural Ritecell from my first purchase. Now I only buy black, I like it better, the bees don't care what color it is, and I can't seem to find any reason or need for the natural color. It is plastic it isn't natural, get what works best for you.


----------



## catbackr (Jun 5, 2010)

I've used both and don't see much difference at all. The bees don't seem to care.


----------



## Lauri (Feb 1, 2012)

I love BLACK rite cell. Heres some pics so you can see for yourself:










This photo is a new package after about 2 weeks, installed on new frames. No flow..just fed syrup and protien patties:





































Compared to natural rite cell color:










Compared to a starter strip of black rite cell, foundationless below the strip. NOT what I am looking for however You can see why I like the reliability of using foundation.










Once it is aged you can't tell the color of foundation as much, but it sure looks pretty when it is freshly drawn. Easy for anyone, especially beginners and folks with less then youthful eyesight to easily see eggs and larva.


----------



## Riskybizz (Mar 12, 2010)

I like the black foundation because its easier to see the melted wax that I roll on to assist them with starting to draw. I use a 4" foam roller and just make a couple passes on each side of the frame. No need to try to coat every cell. Works for me anyways.


----------



## philip.devos (Aug 10, 2013)

Riskybizz said:


> I like the black foundation because its easier to see the melted wax that I roll on to assist them with starting to draw. I use a 4" foam roller and just make a couple passes on each side of the frame. No need to try to coat every cell. Works for me anyways.


How do you melt your wax and keep it molten while you are applying the wax?


----------



## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

I roll frames much the same way. I was using an old deep fat fryer with a good temp control but I decided to start melting wax with a cheap microwave oven. Very short wait and no danger of an overheating accident unless you are a total bozo.


----------



## Riskybizz (Mar 12, 2010)

I use an old croc pot that my wife no longer needed. Once you use it to melt wax forget ever using it for anything else. Every now and then I'll heat the croc itself on a hot plate to start the melting process and then set the croc back in the croc pot to hold the temperature. I use small blocks of clean wax that I have already melted and run through a cloth. Be careful heating wax as its very easy to overheat and it is flammable. Never leave it alone while your heating it and low heat is best.


----------



## catbackr (Jun 5, 2010)

Lauri, those are great pictures!


----------



## TheBuzz (Feb 8, 2012)

Pierco at least is also a 10% larger surface area.


----------



## melliferal (Aug 30, 2010)

Lauri what kind of camera did you use to take those photos?


----------



## Dave1958 (Mar 25, 2013)

Ive used a little of all these in my short time beekeeping. It seems the bees draw wax faster than plastic. The bees will also make "walkways" through wax to get between frames. They also build wax off the plastic. The major thing I see is if I find a queen cell and want to make a nuc, I can cut off the wax without removing a whole frame.


----------



## Kamon A. Reynolds (Apr 15, 2012)

Use Wooden frames and wax. I've use every plastic product mentioned here but nothing works as good as good combs made out of solid wax.

One day you may want to recycle your combs, make candles, lipbalms, make your own foundation. Hard to do that with plastic frames. Then there is the issue of what the bees prefer. Sure bees will work in it. 
Also some plastic frames violate bee space. Plastic frames are too solid and make it more difficult for bees to maneuver as they see fit. it could also interfere with the natural spread of the queen smell.

Plastic frames and cells wont kill a hive but bees do not prefer it. It stands to reason that it does stress them to a small degree.

I try to eliminate any stressors possible. 
That said a lot of successful beekeepers use plastic.


----------

