# Farmers market single frame observation hive question



## Mefco

If I am bringing a single frame of bees to a farmers market as a display for 4-5 hours (or more) in a single frame observation hive, should I:
1. Definitely bring the frame with the queen on it
2. Definitely NOT bring a frame with queen on it (leave queen with hive) or
3. Just grab a frame and go and not worry if queen is on it or not

And how long can a frame be out of the hive like that? It will be well ventilated and out of direct sun. Should I plan to feed them? Water them?


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## rookie2531

I'm interested in the answers too. Now these are just my opinions and I have not had the luxury of an o.h. yet, but working on one.

I would bring the Queen. I think that is the number one reason for O.h. coolness and will make more people look longer and when people are circling, more will be interested. More people, more money.
And yes to the water and syrup.

Now that's my opinion. Others may change my mind, but I do plan on using one this season.


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## Brian Suchan

Bring the queen and make sure she is marked.


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## RayMarler

Make it up with all young nurse bees, no older foragers.
The frame should have some stores in it.
Give them water once an hour at least. I dribble a few drops in the vent screen.
Yes, put the queen in it. 
Single frame Ohives are great for a single day excursion.


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## ruthiesbees

yes, definitely bring the marked queen. That is the number 1 question you get when people walk up, "where is the queen". If you can tell them to look for the one with the colored dot, then you have there attention for a number of seconds and can start in on the sales pitch.


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## RayMarler

One humorous thing I've noticed is that most of the people think the queen is born with the coloured mark. You'll have to inform them that you painted that mark on her. Anyone else notice this happen?


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## AstroBee

RayMarler said:


> Anyone else notice this happen?



All the time.


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## FlowerPlanter

How long will it take for the original hive to start queen cells in absence of the queen?


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## MissHoney

FlowerPlanter said:


> How long will it take for the original hive to start queen cells in absence of the queen?


They'll notice her absence quickly, withing an hour. They will start queen cells within 8-24 hours normally, if they don't find her.


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## Brad Bee

If I were going to do that very often, I would definitely set up a small nuc to pull the queen in and out of. A 3 frame nuc at that. I don't know how many you could pull her like that for a day at a time before she got superceded.


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## ruthiesbees

FlowerPlanter said:


> How long will it take for the original hive to start queen cells in absence of the queen?


I can take my queen out of a topbar hive and replace her with a QMP lure and they won't start cells for the 3 days I have them out. And so far, I haven't had trouble adding her back to the hive without caging her first. I do prefer to pick on a small nuc though, when I have that option just so I don't disrupt a big hive for those 3 days.


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## whiskers

Does Swarm Commander have QMP or some synthetic analog in it? Will it hold off queen cells for a bit?
Bill


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## RayMarler

Brad Bee said:


> If I were going to do that very often, I would definitely set up a small nuc to pull the queen in and out of. A 3 frame nuc at that. I don't know how many you could pull her like that for a day at a time before she got superceded.


Yep, the nuc is the way to go. We used a five framer.


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## lemmje

I'm not advertising, but this is what I use. Pull the frame with the queen up and close the shutters. The nuc has a frame feeder, and the top has a queen excluder keeping her up there in the glass. Pretty slick. Not cheap, but i really like it. 

http://www.brushymountainbeefarm.com/Ulster-Observation-Hive/productinfo/U501/


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## JTGaraas

I have successfully used Mann Lake's version of the 5-frame observation hive for six (6) days straight at the annual Red River Valley Fair in West Fargo, North Dakota, the last two (2) years. It was part of a Ag Education program about food sources. If lucky, the observable frame will have emerging bees on several days. I have been exchanging the observable frame mid-week just to show a different view/stage of development. Put small locks on the latches, and have a good magnifying lens available. People love it. After last year's fair, we used the bees to start an apiary on the fairgrounds as part of a pollinator wildflower garden (thanks to Bayer's FeedABee program). We also hand out a packet of Bayer's wild flower seeds. Women and children love the idea of planting the seeds, and I get quite a few chuckles as a bald-headed 68 year old offering flowers to their husbands or boyfriends.


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## Tim KS

RayMarler said:


> One humorous thing I've noticed is that most of the people think the queen is born with the coloured mark. You'll have to inform them that you painted that mark on her. Anyone else notice this happen?


My brother in St. George, UT had a swarm hanging a tree in the back yard. He called a keeper come & remove the swarm. He watched as the guy removed the swarm & asked how can you tell the which one was the queen. The keeper said, "she's the one with the little crown on her head." ....and my brother said he actually started to look closer as the keeper began laughing.......


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## MonkeyMcBean

Whiskers, I've heard Michael Bush say he makes his own QMP by putting his retired queens in a jar of alcohol. After a while, the pheromones dissolve in the alcohol and then you can dip a qtip in. It'll take a while to accomplish if you're not running thousands of hives, but it might save money in the long run.


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## Michael Bush

>Does Swarm Commander have QMP or some synthetic analog in it? 

No.

>Will it hold off queen cells for a bit?

No.

I just take the queen, and put that frame back in when I get home. It has never caused an issue. If I'm doing it regularly, I try to have a couple of five frame nucs I can steal the frame from and alternate nucs on subsequent days (assuming a weekend of farmers markets).


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## SWM

Since observation hives are for "observing" then ideally you want a frame that includes as much as possible. Brood in all stages of development...eggs, larvae, sealed brood, also honey and pollen. Again, that's ideal but not always possible. A marked queen is a must because that's what everyone will want to see. A flashlight makes it much easier to see in the cells and observe other details.

Also, I would never leave an observation hive unattended, especially at a farmers market. Someone needs to be assigned to that task to answer questions and secure the hive while someone else is selling honey. I've never had an incident with an observation hive but the first time some kid knocks yours over and the cover pops off, things will get exciting rather quickly!


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## AlisonT

I also have a question about this... the county extension office wants me to man a booth at the farmers market (I'm the local 4H Honey Bee project leader) and bring the Ulster observation hive.

Question: I'm in Moscow Idaho and it's rainy and 40 degrees today - typical spring weather. Is there a temperature below which I shouldn't use the observation hive? I'm worried about the brood and queen getting chilled in the observation window while on display, and thinking I should wait until the weather improves.


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## ruthiesbees

single frame observation hives are tough on brood. I will try and get mostly capped brood with emerging bees so the kids can watch a bee crawl out of the cell. If there are a few cells of open brood or eggs, that is nice to have that to show all stages, but I will frequently see the worker bees dragging those out of the cells before the end of the 2 days at the county fair. They just can't regulate the temperature and humidity well enough in an observation hive to keep them growing. But remember, the 10 or so larvae that you will lose are far outweighed by the educational value of what the kids take away from observing the bees up close. Just don't pick a frame of all open brood.

I have taken an observation hive when it was about 45 degrees out and attached a heating pad to the back of the hive. Had a temperature probe in there to watch how warm it kept it, and it was a balmy 80 (still not warm enough for raising brood but kept the ladies moving around)


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## D Coates

lemmje said:


> I'm not advertising, but this is what I use. Pull the frame with the queen up and close the shutters. The nuc has a frame feeder, and the top has a queen excluder keeping her up there in the glass. Pretty slick. Not cheap, but i really like it.
> 
> http://www.brushymountainbeefarm.com/Ulster-Observation-Hive/productinfo/U501/


I don't know how to do a thumbs up emoji but lemmje get one here. I use one of these for when I'm presenting at schools or garden clubs. The hive stays relatively calm being corked up but because they can smell their queen and they've got syrup to work it's much less stressful on the nuc. The wide base and the weight of 4 full frames and 1 feeder make it very stable as well. The only additional thing I'd recommend on it though is adding another layer of screen under the bottom. The first one is countersunk and bees can cling to it and get food and fly out at inopportune times. Putting another layer of mesh on the bottom creates a gap that won't allow them to get food or shelter from the bees inside the nuc. If I did farmers markets (especially once or twice a week) I'd bring this one, no questions asked.


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## Greeny

Several years ago, at a Louisiana state fair, we were admiring an observation hive, with the queen, the largest bee of the bunch, marked with a bright pink dot. As we were looking on, an obviously experienced beekeeper walked up, took a quick glance, and said that wasn't the queen, it was a drone! The OH owner immediately said yes, it was too hard on his hive to pull the queen for an extended period.


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## AlisonT

Thanks Ruth, that's very helpful! I'm down to 2 hives right now and they're still trying to build up, so unless it's a nice mild day I think I will wait until June to use the observation hive. I'm not willing to suffer the losses after the winter we just had, and there will be more opportunities to show off the girls in following months


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