# Interstate Hauling of equipment



## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

It sounds to me that they are talking about either your DOT number (do you have a DOT number) or a CDL. Those are the only two things I know of where you have to claim either interstate or intrastate.

Any single vehicle registered over 10,000lbs is required to have a DOT number. Any motor vehicle that is pulling a trailer with the capacity over 10,000 lbs requires a class A CDL regardless of total combination weight capacity. You can find that in the federal regulations. Most truck stops sell miniature books about the rules.

F450 falls into the category of requiring a DOT number as they are rated at 15 - 16,000 lbs. most dual axle skid steer trailers are rated for 10,000 or more.


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?310912-MAP-21

if your state has agricultural plates see thread.


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## johnbeejohn (Jun 30, 2013)

they have been cracking down very hard in pa here in the last few months here anything over 17000 gvw needs to have dot numbers we have been pulled over in our chevy 4500 truck 4 or 5 times in past never had any problems with dot last week we were followed from the place we were eating lunch by 2 state troopers and told we need saftey triangles or cones fire extinguisher dot number bussines name on truck i need a medical card to drive it


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

johnbeejohn said:


> they have been cracking down very hard in pa here in the last few months here anything over 17000 gvw needs to have dot numbers we have been pulled over in our chevy 4500 truck 4 or 5 times in past never had any problems with dot last week we were followed from the place we were eating lunch by 2 state troopers and told we need saftey triangles or cones fire extinguisher dot number bussines name on truck i need a medical card to drive it


Beekeepers are exempt from medical cards, and as far as I know only applies to those with CDLs. The troopers forget to tell you, that you also need spare fuses in the truck along with triangles. Sounds to me like those troopers are trying to be DOT guys but really lack the formal training in DOT. 

I would fight in court any ticket I get regarding DOT regs from a non DOT certified officer.


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

BMAC said:


> I would fight in court any ticket I get regarding DOT regs from a non DOT certified officer.


wouldn't it just be easier to put agricultural plates on and be exempt from all the bull?


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

I have ag plates on my 5500 and I am not exempt from DOT number or CDL or carrying the required safety equipment aboard.

The Farm plates in NY exempt you from that stuff but you are limited on where and what you can do with the truck. Ag plates let me drive anywhere in the country.


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

I'm not sure how it is around the country, but in Oregon, the Oregon Department of Transportation sets up a meeting with you shortly after you get your DOT number.
They go over every detail of what you have as far as truck and trailer, the weights, intrastate or interstate, equipment, licensing, EVERYTHING.
It is very helpful. And it does away with most of the guesswork.
Well,,,,,until you go to California that is......


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## beeware10 (Jul 25, 2010)

bmac in ny we have a ram 3500 and freightliner f70. we go to sc every winter. we can use either truck with our agr plate. no state sales tax needs to be paid to register the truck or trailer. they give you an additional 10,000 lbs for a trailer. that gives you a gross of 36,000 lbs as long as the vehicles are certified for that amount. all this info was received from a nys dot guy at empire farm days. there is a lot of false info out there and many enforcement people are not familiar with agr plates. all of the above is done with a nys class D lic. been doing this since the 70's.


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

That is pretty interesting and conflicting as there was a NYS DOT guy at once of the ESHPA fall meetings who was NOT saying the same stuff you are stating. Mostly I think it boils down to the guy who pulls you over on the side of the road, and how they interpret the law.


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## johnbeejohn (Jun 30, 2013)

they told me about cones or triangles never said anything about fuses these were dot troopers they said they were like 2 of 5 for our area and i told them i diddnt need a cdl to drive truck they said i need a med card any way


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

if you have agricultural plates this is the best write up I have seen.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/sites/fmcs...Tranportation_of_Agricultural_Commodities.pdf

Section 32934 of MAP–21 created a new set of exemptions for ‘‘covered farm vehicles’’ (CFVs) and their drivers. The definition of a CFV is discussed in the
Background section below. Briefly, CFVs and their drivers are exempt from the commercial driver’s license (CDL) and drug and alcohol testing
regulations; the medical qualification requirements; the hours of service limits; and vehicle inspection, repair and maintenance rules. Vehicles transporting placardable quantities of
hazardous materials are not eligible for these exemptions. The States will have to adopt these exemptions into their own laws and regulations within 3 years
in order to avoid the withholding of certain Federal grant funds

A driver who is not required to hold a CDL as a result of § 383.3(d)(1) is also exempt from the FMCSA drug and alcohol testing regulations [see 49 CFR
382.103(a)(1)]. 

Section 391.2(b) exempts from the rules in Part 391 the driver of a CMV controlled and operated by a beekeeper engaged in the seasonal transportationof bees. The exemption does not apply to a beekeeper’s transportation of honey.

A ‘‘covered farm vehicle’’ (CFV), as defined in Sec. 32934, is a straight truck or articulated vehicle (e.g., a large pickup, a truck pulling a trailer,sometimes a standard tractor semitrailer combination) registered in a State that is used by the owner or operator of a farm or ranch (or an employee or family member of a farm or ranch owner or
operator) to transport agricultural commodities, livestock, machinery or supplies, provided the truck has a license plate or other designation issued by the State of registration that allows law enforcement personnel to identify it as a farm vehicle. Although a CFV may not be used in for-hire motor carrier operations, a share-cropper’s use of a
vehicle to transport the landlord’s share of the crops may not be treated as a forhire operation. If the CFV has a gross vehicle weight (GVW) or gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), whichever is greater, of 26,001 pounds or less, it may take advantage of the CFV exemption described below while operating anywhere in the United States. A CFV with a GVW or GVWR, whichever is greater, above 26,001 pounds, may travel anywhere in the State of registration or across State borders within 150 air miles of the home farm
or ranch—but the vehicle would lose its status as a CFV and the corresponding exemptions if it exceeded these geographical limits.

§ 390.5 Definitions. Covered farm vehicle—
(1) Means a straight truck or articulated vehicle— (i) Registered in a State with a license plate or other designation issued by the State of registration that allows law
enforcement officials to identify it as a farm vehicle; (ii) Operated by the owner or operator of a farm or ranch, or an employee or family member of a an owner or
operator of a farm or ranch; (iii) Used to transport agricultural commodities, livestock, machinery or supplies to or from a farm or ranch; and
(iv) Not used in for-hire motor carrier operations; however, for-hire motor carrier operations do not include the operation of a vehicle meeting the
requirements of paragraphs (1)(i) through (iii) of this definition by a tenant pursuant to a crop share farm lease agreement to transport the
landlord’s portion of the crops under that agreement.
(2) Meeting the requirements of paragraphs (1)(i) through (iv) of this definition:
(i) With a gross vehicle weight or gross vehicle weight rating, whichever is greater, of 26,001 pounds or less may utilize the exemptions in § 390.39
anywhere in the United States; or (ii) With a gross vehicle weight or gross vehicle weight rating, whichever is greater, of more than 26,001 pounds
may utilize the exemptions in § 390.39 anywhere in the State of registration or across State lines within 150 air miles of the farm or ranch with respect to
which the vehicle is being operated. 
■ 7. Add new § 390.39 to subpart B to read as follows:
§ 390.39 Exemptions for ‘‘covered farm vehicles.’’ (a) Federal requirements. A covered farm vehicle, as defined in § 390.5, including the individual operating that
vehicle, is exempt from the following:
(1) Any requirement relating to commercial driver’s licenses in 49 CFR Part 383 or controlled substances and
alcohol use and testing in 49 CFR Part 382;
(2) Any requirement in 49 CFR Part 391, Subpart E, Physical Qualifications
and Examinations.
(3) Any requirement in 49 CFR Part 395, Hours of Service of Drivers.
(4) Any requirement in 49 CFR Part 396, Inspection, Repair, and Maintenance.

good luck:kn:

so both bmac and beware10's dot persons could be correct, but don't go out of NY state with that extra 10,000 lbs as I suspect he was talking intrastate which the state has control over not interstate which the fed's have control over.


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

I wonder if colorado will write into their law something similar and only limit the driver to 1 ounce of marijuana while operating the CFV.


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## HungryBear (May 28, 2012)

I google'd GVWR, and it says that is only the weight of the truck, and its cargo.... blah blah blah. It specifically says, trailer and trailer cargo NOT included...

Does that sound right?

If that is the case, then almost anything can be a CFV, right? And it does not list anything about a trailer or its weight in the map 21, section 390; other then a pickup could be pulling a trailer.

I read section 390, as long as the motor unit is less then 26,000#, then you can go anywhere and be a CFV. Would this be correct, with the understanding that the GVWR is not counting the trailer?

Take all of my statements above as questions... not statements or fact. :scratch:


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## beeware10 (Jul 25, 2010)

gross means total. that includes everything when on a scale. they don't know what a trailer would weigh. when a tractor trailer drives on a scale 80.000 lbs is the basic limit. they don't care at all what your equip weighs. just total.


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## Brian Suchan (Apr 6, 2005)

Steer clear of iowa if you can!!!!


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

I agree. IOWA is one miserable DOT state. Been thru there once with my F450 and holy cow. One 4 hour dealing with DOT in that state and i broke out the maps and took the back roads thru it to avoid those folks.


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## johnbeejohn (Jun 30, 2013)

in pa if u have a trailor hooked to truck it counts as its total weight anything over 17500 combined weight u need it


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

HarryVanderpool said:


> I'm not sure how it is around the country, but in Oregon, the Oregon Department of Transportation sets up a meeting with you shortly after you get your DOT number.
> They go over every detail of what you have as far as truck and trailer, the weights, intrastate or interstate, equipment, licensing, EVERYTHING.
> It is very helpful. And it does away with most of the guesswork.
> Well,,,,,until you go to California that is......


Seems like a good idea to me. Also seems like when one registers a new heavy truck that the DMV would have a handbook of regs available for those who don't know what's required of them.

Years ago I got stopped by NYS DOT because I didn't have a DOT Number. Soon after getting the DOT Number I was stopped for not having the business name displayed. Both were warnings. I told Officer Snow that I didn't mind visiting with him, but was there something else I should do so you don't pull me over again the next time I drive by?


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

BMAC said:


> That is pretty interesting and conflicting as there was a NYS DOT guy at once of the ESHPA fall meetings who was NOT saying the same stuff you are stating. Mostly I think it boils down to the guy who pulls you over on the side of the road, and how they interpret the law.


And who they check with to verify what you assert. They all have computers now days.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

wildbranch2007 said:


> so both bmac and beware10's dot persons could be correct, but don't go out of NY state with that extra 10,000 lbs as I suspect he was talking intrastate which the state has control over not interstate which the fed's have control over.


I never saw any Federal DOT Inspectors enforcing rules and regs, have you?


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

sqkcrk said:


> And who they check with to verify what you assert. They all have computers now days.


Computers are great for verifying laws, but they dont interpret the law and its written in a subjective manner. So there is naturally alot of gray area to laws. Unlike our NYS gun laws that are very explicit.


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

sqkcrk said:


> I never saw any Federal DOT Inspectors enforcing rules and regs, have you?


Yes. Every state DOT officer is a federal compliance officer primary, state compliance officer secondary.


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## high rate of speed (Jan 4, 2008)

Every state goes by gvwr which is the combined weight of bolth bobtail and forklift trailer.


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## high rate of speed (Jan 4, 2008)

Another words the maximum bolth units can haul. Plus the weight of themselves.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

high rate of speed said:


> Another words the maximum bolth units can haul. Plus the weight of themselves.


If you take the maximum both units can haul, plus their own weight, then you are going to be over weight. GVWR means the total allowable weight of the vehicle plus the cargo.

Net + Tare Weight = Gross Just like a barrel of honey.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

BMAC said:


> Yes. Every state DOT officer is a federal compliance officer primary, state compliance officer secondary.


I didn't know that. But they are employed by the State, right?

Then why aren't regs the same from Miami to Bangor on Rt 95?


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## high rate of speed (Jan 4, 2008)

Its the combination of bolth units and how much you pay for registration.


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## high rate of speed (Jan 4, 2008)

This is why a lot beeks that don't have commercial license are deregulating there trailers.to bring down the gross. And to get away from paying ifta.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

high rate of speed said:


> Its the combination of bolth units and how much you pay for registration.


Okay. Both. I get it.

My truck is too small to be worried about IFTA.


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## Faith Apiaries (Apr 28, 2015)

I see a few references to GVWR and it can be confusing to many people. Break down what the acronym is and that will help clear up what it means.

GVWR = Gross Vehicle Weight Rating

Trucks have a stated GVWR. Trailers have a stated GVWR. Cars usually don't have a stated GVWR. The maximum weight a vehicle can weigh, legally. This is stated by the manufacturer and should never be exceeded. Exceeding GVWR is not only illegal but it is unsafe for everyone on the road.

GCWR = Gross Combined Weight Rating

This is the maximum weight a truck and trailer combination can weight, legally. Same thing applies if exceeded. GCWR is subject to jurisdictional mumbo jumbo but it is never greater than the GVWR of the truck + GVWR of the trailer.


GAWR = Gross Axle Weight Rating

Of course, when hauling and towing, you also have to be aware of, and respect a vehicle's GAWR (applies to trucks and trailers). Same thing here, it is illegal and unsafe to exceed a GAWR in any case, any situation. If a person wants to destroy their own equipment, that's their perogative. If, in doing so, they put innocent motorists in jeopardy, then it's everyone's concern so, don't do it.


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## high rate of speed (Jan 4, 2008)

Not exceeding anything just the truth. That's what the federal dot goes by.like it or not. It is what it is.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

high rate of speed said:


> Another words the maximum bolth units can haul. Plus the weight of themselves.


My truck and trailer can each haul more than they are rated for, plus the weight of themselves.


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## Honey-4-All (Dec 19, 2008)

As we "celebrate" Memorial day here in the US in a few days I hate to admit it but this whole subject makes one think that it might be appropriate to consider all those sacrifices as having been at least partially in vain.


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## high rate of speed (Jan 4, 2008)

I'm sure all the interstate carriers comply with drug testing as well.if not its still the law.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Honey-4-All said:


> As we "celebrate" Memorial day here in the US in a few days I hate to admit it but this whole subject makes one think that it might be appropriate to consider all those sacrifices as having been at least partially in vain.


I don't see why. Explain.


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## Flyer Jim (Apr 22, 2004)

sqkcrk said:


> I don't see why. Explain.


And there you have it. :lpf:


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## Honey-4-All (Dec 19, 2008)

Not sure why your asking when the answer is already in your tag line:

"Most of my exercise comes from wrestling with pigs and beating dead horses."

How appropriate! Mine to!!!!!!!

FYI: The last time was when I lost a whole day getting real work done because I was forced to go down to ask the judge ( driving 240 miles might I add) if the evidence that I had presented to the DOT "gentleman" was not enough to rule in my favor. The judge ruled as he should have....... As the law clearly stated which I pointed out in the gip's own manual when I had the pleasure of discussing the issue with him at the "scales."

Guess what happened to the clown who wrote me up after the trail? I'm going to guess he went home with his paycheck in hand as usual to rest up so he could spend another day personally harassing the next citizen who happened to cross his path. Each time done at no expense to himself when he is wrong. 

When those so employed there have their own personal bucks on the line to repay me and anyone else for a wasted day when they go off on their next power trip while acting against the law I will be happy to interact with them.

Until they get over the "let them eat tires" mentality I chose to avoid them at all expense.


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

sqkcrk said:


> I didn't know that. But they are employed by the State, right?
> 
> Then why aren't regs the same from Miami to Bangor on Rt 95?


So its a little confusing with DOT. Yeah those guys are state employees. Somehownthe feds and states worked it out that the state guys first uphold fed regs. So the baseline DOT rules are in fact nationwide. IFTA is amperfect example. Anyone pulling anything over 26K is required to have an IFTA license, or registration. However some states do NOT participate so some states you DONT need IFTA registration. However individual states that do participate enforece that regulation and you can get fined for not having an IFTA license.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

I guess I simply like things spelled out in plain English so I don't have to guess at what was meant. I get it now. Thanks.


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

Honey-4-All said:


> Not sure why your asking when the answer is already in your tag line:
> 
> "Most of my exercise comes from wrestling with pigs and beating dead horses."
> 
> ...


Alot of truth here. I like to make sure all my stuff is in top shape going down the road, and when im moving my bees i focus on leaving on a friday night and having the load at my destination by sunday evening because I know 98% of DOT is home for the weekend.


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## Honey-4-All (Dec 19, 2008)

BMAC said:


> Alot of truth here. I like to make sure all my stuff is in top shape going down the road, and when im moving my bees i focus on leaving on a friday night and having the load at my destination by sunday evening because I know 98% of DOT is home for the weekend.



I always figured if I'm considering it there must be a thousand others out there rowing the same boat. Thanks for the confirmation.

For all those "do gooders" out there who are simultaneously advocating more "safety" regulation while saying doing so will not hurt the economy they have no clue.

How many dollars are left in the trash can because people only have the DOT free time zones to get stuff done. Not just in bee moving situations but in all areas of commerce. From the kid who gets her Koolaid stand shut down all the way to .......... you name it. 

As I stated earlier....... When some jerk has the gall or the authority to shut down some girl scout sales stand because it didn't fork over the funds and fill out the "necessary" permits to fund his paycheck the death of all the Soldiers whose sacrifices we remember this weekend have been a big waste at best. Why celebrate those who fought off the oversees invaders looking to dominate this land when another one of Medusa's other ugly head is popping up in our own pigpen.


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## Leather Jim (Jun 30, 2013)

BMAC said:


> Alot of truth here. I like to make sure all my stuff is in top shape going down the road, and when im moving my bees i focus on leaving on a friday night and having the load at my destination by sunday evening because I know 98% of DOT is home for the weekend.


That won't fly in Ohio, motor carrier enforcement division officers run 7 days a week including holidays and around the clock. They did 85,000 full scale inspections last year and took 25% of those out of service on the spot. They dont play nice either, not sure how they would be with a full load of bees.


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

You say that wont fly in Ohio and that is fine. Apparently im still FLYING under your radar in and out of Ohio as well.:lpf:


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## BMAC (Jun 23, 2009)

Honey-4-All said:


> I always figured if I'm considering it there must be a thousand others out there rowing the same boat. Thanks for the confirmation.
> 
> For all those "do gooders" out there who are simultaneously advocating more "safety" regulation while saying doing so will not hurt the economy they have no clue.
> 
> ...


Ill tell ya its a pretty big hassle when you go down the road and you are empty, everything legal and you still get hassled by these check stations. They certainly dont hand their inspection book out for all to view. If they did put their entire checklist out there then great, but they dont. It is certainly much easier to abide by the law when you are NOT heckled by the random tax accessors running up and down the highway. Afterall DOT is not really about safety on our highways. If it was we wouldnt have the issues we have on our highways. Proven facts in industrial organizations that safety stems from frequently training so its always on your mind.


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

FMCSA has granted interstate bee haulers the exemption from the 30-minute break requirement in the hours-of-service regulations that was requested in January.
FMCSA has granted the exemption for a two-year period, valid through June 19, 2017.

http://www.ccjdigital.com/interstate-bee-haulers-get-hos-exemption/


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## Crabo (Jan 17, 2012)

Here's what ND Highway Patrol told me. Once I leave ND, any farm truck advantages go away. If my GVW is 26,000 or less, I need a dot number, a regular, (D), driver's license, a medical card and a log book to pull a trailer with equipment interstate.


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