# In the Orange Groves



## Mbeck (Apr 27, 2011)

You boxes look nice.
Glad to hear everyone is safe.
How do the trees look?


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## matt1954 (Sep 8, 2010)

Trees look great. Grapefruit is about finished and the orange trees are beginning to bloom early.


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## DC Honeybees (Mar 9, 2011)

Thanks Jerry! The whole trip was lots of fun and we made strides in spite of a few setbacks!


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## westernbeekeeper (May 2, 2012)

Glad you're OK. Nice pics!


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## Davidnewbeeboxbuilder (Oct 6, 2012)

Where are ur plans from there


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

lost your tractor! Dam ,


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## matt1954 (Sep 8, 2010)

David, not sure what you are asking.


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## Brian Suchan (Apr 6, 2005)

Holy ratchet straps! How do u handle all those uneven pallets? Thanks 4 the pics that green grass and trees look beautiful this time of year!


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## Laurence Hope (Aug 24, 2005)

Sorry for your loss. I hope your Orange Blossom honey makes up for it. Thank you for the pictures. I grew up in the Florida orange industry. Your pics make me homesick!


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## RAK (May 2, 2010)

Those harbor freight straps come in handy...


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## Davidnewbeeboxbuilder (Oct 6, 2012)

Where you moving to next almonds.


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## matt1954 (Sep 8, 2010)

No Almonds this year, perhaps in two years. 

Regarding the uneven boxes, they were even when we departed and the honey supers were loaded on seperately. We put them on once we arrived in the groves.


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

So when does the main flow usually start for oranges? I always thought it was just after almonds.


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## ddb123 (Jun 20, 2012)

How did you lose the tractor?


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## matt1954 (Sep 8, 2010)

Mike, it does, but the bloom is coming a bit early this year. We decided to move them into the groves early. We lost the tractor when we went around a bend and it slid off the trailer. It was strapped in well, or so I thought, but apparently we hit an ice patch or I am just a non-driving **** and we lost it. Insurance is taking care of it and the 20 Nuc boxes I had on the trailer as well as the trash pump we lost.


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

Thanks for the info.I was just wondering if the bloom was coming early enough to conflict with almonds. 
Sorry about losing the lift. That has to suck. A friend told me once about towing a lift and looked in his mirror to see it sailing out through a field. The pintle hitch had broken.


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## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

Nice pics, Thanks for sharing!
Makes me want to go out and shovel the snow out of my yard! lol 
Sorry to hear about the loader. Bummer!


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

We want pictures of the tractor spill.


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## Trevor Mansell (Jan 16, 2005)

Is this your first year going to the orange?


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## WilliamsHoneyBees (Feb 17, 2010)

odfrank said:


> We want pictures of the tractor spill.



He said it, but I was thinking it! opcorn: HAHA


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## matt1954 (Sep 8, 2010)

Sorry, I didn't take any. It was raining and cold and Law Enforcement just wanted the area cleaned up. The Tractor Was towed to a local shop for the INsurance Adjuster to examine. Fortunately, it is covered by insurance. 

Yes it is my first time in the groves.


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## RichardsonTX (Jul 3, 2011)

Thanks for sharing the pictures.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

matt1954 said:


> Mike, it does, but the bloom is coming a bit early this year. We decided to move them into the groves early. We lost the tractor when we went around a bend and it slid off the trailer. It was strapped in well, or so I thought, but apparently we hit an ice patch or I am just a non-driving **** and we lost it. Insurance is taking care of it and the 20 Nuc boxes I had on the trailer as well as the trash pump we lost.


What? No unsecured load ticket?


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## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

Sounds like Mark joined the darkside when he got pulled over going to the south!?  lol


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

I don't know why you said that. If you are going to play in the Majors you should be subject to the same benefits and penalties. Matt is lucky that damage to his tractor and equipment was all that was damaged. Fortunately no one died. Luckily. As I am sure he knows.

I lost 3 barrels of honey off thge deck of my truck and the State of VT sent me a Bill for an unsecured load and the cleanup.

I would advise matt and DC to keep their loads level across the top and covered by a net, noty a tarp, held down by full sized ratchet straps, not those light weight ones he now has. Also, stop and check the load, ratcheting down the load as it settles, especially when you stop for fuel.

Just a cpl suggestions. Things you will learn yourself if you continue, but can avoid learning the hard way if you will take my advice. Things others would tell you too.


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## mmiller (Jun 17, 2010)

odfrank said:


> We want pictures of the tractor spill.


Yup


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

sqkcrk said:


> I held down by full sized ratchet straps, not those light weight ones he now has.


I love my heavy duty ratchets, no spring in them AT ALL


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## matt1954 (Sep 8, 2010)

Mark, thank you for the advice and as we grow we certainly will heed your words.


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## Adrian Quiney WI (Sep 14, 2007)

It would be interesting to see what other suggestions the veterans have so that what sounds like a 12 hour trip would go better. It sounds like there are some basics that need to be covered that are elementary to the commercial guys, but are not on the radar of the inexperienced. It's -6F here right now. I wish I was in Florida for a week.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

matt1954 said:


> Mark, thank you for the advice and as we grow we certainly will heed your words.


My wording is often undiplomatic, so I hope you know I just want you and your bees to travel safe and arrive unmolested. I'm sorry you lost your tractor. Looks like a small Bobcat would do you well. But I'm sure you will find something fitting to your nbeeds.


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## toad (Jun 18, 2009)

Jerry,
I would suggest hive staples and netting rather than tarp. By your video all of your hive bodys slid as well as your tops. Staples are cheap and would have prevented that from happining. Chains and binders for your tractor!


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Even though I never use them, I agree w/ toad about the staples. Especially since you went thru and inspected the hives soon before loading and transporting. I nail my lids down too. Spreader boards help to hold the load down to the deck of the trailer, instead of pulling everything into the middle.


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## matt1954 (Sep 8, 2010)

Mark, you actually nail down the covers? Have you had any weakening of the boxes, tops as a result of repeated nailing?I know I need a Skid Steer and it seems as we are growing that I really do need to invest in my infrastructure. 

Also, I am retired law enforcement. I have dealt with far worse un-diplomatic comments, writings, and statements. No worries.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Aha, so you know how to talk to VA State Troopers. That explains things. 

My covers are sheets of plywood. Most migratorys I know don't nail down covers. Though I have seen some really big operations that do. They use the same nail hole in the cover each time. Boxes don't deterierate that fast. From my experience.


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## matt1954 (Sep 8, 2010)

I also have special "get out of jail free" license plates. Worth thier weight in gold!


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## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

I use 2 deck screws in my covers so the threads bite each time (just don't spin the screw by over tightening our it's all over). I use a dewalt cordless and go from pallet to pallet when I first get to the yard and loosen everything up and give them a little smoke at the same time.

Matt: how do I apply for one of those plates!? Ha Ha!


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

matt1954 said:


> I also have special "get out of jail free" license plates. Worth thier weight in gold!


I know how that works. I have a friend here in NY who is a retired State Trooper. Privledges of Service. Thanks for doing it.


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## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

Mark I thought someone told me you were a retired state trooper that took up beekeeping??


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

I don't know who that could have been or why they would have said that. Because I am not. Niether retired or an ex-State Trooper. I did play Officer Krupkie in my High School's production of West Side Story. That's as close as I ever came to being a Policeman and wearing a uniform.

Maybe they were talking about Joel.


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## rkereid (Dec 20, 2009)

Jerry- Thanks for sharing the details. It's interesting to see how it goes since a lot of us might want to do this one day. We all learn from the successes and failures. 

Richard in Blacksburg


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## dback (Jan 8, 2012)

Matt.....

We move 3-500 hives nightly from just after almonds until the first part of Nov. so we have some experience at it. There are as many (successful) ways of loading/tying down and transporting bees as there are beekeepers. I often unload for other folks in the almonds so I get to see how others do it also. We do not use hive staples, bands, smoke, nails and I hate "W" clips. I expect two of my guys with a single forklift to load, net and tie down a semi (556, weight allowing, 8 frame) in 1 1/2 hour. We lift stacks of 3 or 4 pallets high at a time (again, weight allowing)......this is not something you can do with your tractor. If you look for a skidsteer.....only do it if you can get it set up like Benstung has his....with mast and 5th wheel, otherwise look for a reasonable swinger (my opinion).

It is important to have all of your pallets level.....all doubles, triples or singles but not on the same pallet. Our equipment is all exactly the same.....4 way pallets have two "stringers" that hold the (cleated) tops of the hives below in place when loaded. This only works if you are level. I hate "W" clips for two reasons......first, the "space" collects 'mulch' = retained moisture = prematurely rotted boxes. Secondly, we tie loads down from front to back with 2" straps....one strap per row of hives tightened like a banjo string.....you can't do that using "W" clips due to the "space" between hives so we use only "U" clips. Tarp is a negatory (I'd be surprised if you told me yours made it to Florida)....get a good net made for your trailer.......we tie down over the net, v-boards front and back and for longer trips we use a few v-boards on the sides with two straps per v-board but not nearly as tight. Locally.....we use the 4 straps and nothing else......no v-boards, net or side straps. We tie down semi's the same way except 4" straps instead of 2". Loads must be as level as possible!!!!!!!!! 

This is how we do it.....it works for us. I've seen it done lots of ways and I have reasons I don't do it that way. Maybe some of this will be useful to you. Also .... we don't break hives apart just prior to shipping and we give them a day to settle before working them after the move.........just my 2 cents.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

That's a pretty good synopsis for moving bees dback. Not much to add or take issue with (I won't get into the W clip argument). I use a 20' bed and go 5 single pallets high when distributing pallets into smaller summer locations. After an incident where I dropped into a deep pothole and severely shifted the load I began to always keep a cross strap on the back pallet and another over a middle pallet on top of the front to back straps. They serve to not only give you more stability in rough terrain but also to hold the front to back straps in place when you loosen them to remove another row. It saves the aggravation of having them slip down between the pallets (I hate it when that happens) particularly in windy conditions.


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## virginiawolf (Feb 18, 2011)

Mark you were a state bee inspector right? maybe that is why someone thought you were a policeman. This is an interesting post about transporting hives and stuff. I have never driven a rig .. One time a large uhaul truck... or even a forklift so I am impressed that you guys can use that equipment and stuff. It's really cool. I know it is dangerous to be in trucking. I have seen several wrecks over the years on the interstate. 


Is there a bunch of legal paperwork to move hives across state lines. How could an inspector look through all of those bees?


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## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

dback I have been told the same by some of the commercial folks about the W clips. But then they also stated when they pull into inspection at CA going for the almonds that the inspectors sure like it when they can look between the hive boxes and see clean spaces in the W clips and they pick everything apart when they see a load of U-clips pull up.
Sounds more like a governed thing?? 
I use U clips myself and have really been debating about going with the W's, but I sure like running my straps front to back and cranking everything down tight and not have to worry about the load or boxes sliding.
I must also say though that I am a small fry sideliner and do not have the experience that the commercial folks do that are on this forum and I do not run big trucks just small 1 ton trucks.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

I have a wooden deck on my truck and trailer. When I lost my barrels of honey they were on a steel deck and I wasn't smart enuf to have cardboard under them and then there was that left turn I took fast from a stop. I really recommend a wood deck or a composite deck. It's really hard on the bottoms of pallets to try to slide shift a pallet of beehives on the steel deck of a semi.

Yes, virginiawolf, I was an Apiary Inspector. Maybe that's the source of confusion. No badge or uniform. Only a hat w/ the State Ag and Mkts Logo on it.


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## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

Mark that was probably where I was confused and got my stories crossed (that seems to happen more and more as the bee seasons pass by, the old thinker must be wearing out).
My apologizes for the mix up!


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

No problem. I don't mind being mistaken for those held in higher regard.


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## matt1954 (Sep 8, 2010)

dback, thank you for the information, I wll certainly use it in the future.


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## G B (Nov 6, 2009)

I enjoyed reading your post Larry until I looked up at the time of night you wrote it well after 8 pm.cant believe an old codger like you could make it to the computer that time of night. all the other beeks here in AZ tell me that you and the Live Tiny sorus Rex you have had since a child went to bed early... Cya in CA in a couple weeks and Its my turn to buy ...cya:lookout:





dback said:


> Matt.....
> 
> We move 3-500 hives nightly from just after almonds until the first part of Nov. so we have some experience at it. There are as many (successful) ways of loading/tying down and transporting bees as there are beekeepers. I often unload for other folks in the almonds so I get to see how others do it also. We do not use hive staples, bands, smoke, nails and I hate "W" clips. I expect two of my guys with a single forklift to load, net and tie down a semi (556, weight allowing, 8 frame) in 1 1/2 hour. We lift stacks of 3 or 4 pallets high at a time (again, weight allowing)......this is not something you can do with your tractor. If you look for a skidsteer.....only do it if you can get it set up like Benstung has his....with mast and 5th wheel, otherwise look for a reasonable swinger (my opinion).
> 
> ...


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## dback (Jan 8, 2012)

Smart butt kids......lucky for you it was digital....had it been analog, you'd still be trying to figure out the time 

If someone has the time and techno wizardry...in the time it takes to eat a slice of pizza at Flying J you could get pics of ten different loads and show how they tie down.....might be interesting.


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