# Alfalfa flows



## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

The alfalfa flow depends on soil type and moisture. If you can't check them frequently leave more supers than you think they will need. It will also depend if there is another beekeeper in the area you are not aware of.


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## Tom G. Laury (May 24, 2008)

Alfalfa is without a doubt the single most important honey plant in North America. That being said, sounds like a lousy location. I'll put some there first for a while and check it out for you.


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## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

Hold on there Tom. There is at least 6 other commercial beeks that I know that could be in that area.


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## Tom G. Laury (May 24, 2008)

Just trying to help.


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## DRUR (May 24, 2009)

How about me, maybe I can move some up from Texas and help you cover that crop. Then you could bring your bees back here to winter .
Reckon I could sell it as "Local East Texas Honey"?

:scratch:What else can I throw in to make this deal.

Seriously, hoping everything turns out good.

Kindest Regards
Danny


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## WI-beek (Jul 14, 2009)

Beeslave said:


> Hold on there Tom. There is at least 6 other commercial beeks that I know that could be in that area.



There are two in my area, one north and one south. Not near close enough to this yard for anyone to get exited. Closest one I know of is at least two miles away. Land owner say he never sees honeybees anymore. My uncles buddy down the road has a plane. Ive been meaning to stop over and see if he will give me a ride so I can be sure about the area. Either way, everyone knows each other around here and Im sure Id know if a local had bees on his land.


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## WI-beek (Jul 14, 2009)

Can anybody answer bloom time. Does it bloom for a long period or is it a couple week? Every time I have seen it bloom it is cut right away. Hopefully Ill find out I guess.


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## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

Like I said, it depends on soil type and weather conditions. 2 weeks easily(most times). We want hot drought weather for the alfalfa to produce lots of nectar but we want that after the hot moist conditions for the clover.

A couple hives won't matter for another beek to much but I sure wouldn't want someone putting 40 hives 1-2 miles away from mine unless I've discussed it with them and we studied terrain and nectar sources.

I've scouted out bee yards and asked the landowner and neighbors if they know of any other beekeepers in the area. I was told no and I found out later there was-1 mile away.


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## belsbees (Apr 1, 2010)

Alfalfa can actually bloom for a long time. Here where I am at in Eastern Washington alfalfa is produced for seed production. We are anticipating the bloom to begin here in a week or two and should continue for a month at least. They just put out the leafcutters on them and I have about 200 acres within 2 miles of my 6 colonies. Being my first year on this I will update how it goes but my experience in ag is that you have a good time period for a bloom. Course it is also depending on the environment and the length of the growing season on that crop and the variety of alfalfa you are on. If they cut it for hay anticipate a 2 week period before the plant puts on enough growth to start blooming again.


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## merdoc (May 4, 2010)

Alfalfa honey is the best I've tried so far good luck.


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## merdoc (May 4, 2010)

Wish it grew around here.


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## oregonbeek (Mar 30, 2010)

I live in Central/Southern Oregon and the entire community farms alfalfa. I just put 2 hives in the middle of 2000 acres of mostly alfalfa, grass and a 100+ acres of peas mixed in for good measure.

I barely know anything about bees (I've been a beekeeper for 6 days and am afraid I may be queenless), but we've been farming alfalfa before I was born. We get 3 cuttings a year from alfalfa and rarely do we ever let it bloom. Alfalfa quality is better if you cut it before it blooms. BUT there will always bee alfalfa on the edges of fields that won't get cut for whatever reason, as well as random weeds that grow in and around the fields. 2000 acres sounds like the holy grail of beekeeping but in all reality, 97% of it will never bloom. I'm hoping the remaining 3%, pea blossoms, and infinite rabbit brush/sage carry me through the season. If a field ever goes to bloom for whatever reason (late cutting or bad scheduling etc), then that will free up 120 acres of alfalfa bloom near the bees.

I'm hopefully with alfalfa anyway. 

Now I just need to find out if I have queens...


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## WI-beek (Jul 14, 2009)

They usually get four or five crops here. I think the only reason so many is to get it before it blooms. Sometimes they cut it when its a bit short to achieve this. The farmer looked at me with a smirk and said the professional farmers cut it before it blooms but he only takes three crops so if it blooms it blooms. Sounds great to me. Last year all the alfalfa near a yard bloomed when short near fall and I got a good week of it. They nearly packed mediums with it but it was cut before they could bring in enough to cap it so I left it for the bees. I hope to be luckier with this yard.


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## oregonbeek (Mar 30, 2010)

Yea I feel like my nectar flows will be extremely heavy but short... and rather late in the season. Therefore my theory is to try and get the hives built up and their numbers as high as possible so that when the flow is on they can be out harvesting hard and fast =)

We'll see how that all works out lol...


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## WI-beek (Jul 14, 2009)

The Alfalfa flow has been killing me. I need someone to donate about 45 supers so I can keep my bees from swarming. 

Anyone else been having luck with alfalfa this year. I have had about three weeks of flow now. If only I had more boxes.


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## NasalSponge (Jul 22, 2008)

> alfalfa is produced for seed production


Nice, here they want to get at least three cuttings a year and then maybe they let it go to seed.


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## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

Extract them and put them back on the bees.


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## NasalSponge (Jul 22, 2008)

For sure...that is one case I would definitely be slinging honey!!


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## pom51 (Jul 28, 2008)

wish I had that problem ,I could use some more honey


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## Swobee (May 18, 2007)

the property we just bought had an interesting run of flowers this spring and summer until just recently. Clover bloomed from mid-May until three weeks ago. The alfalfa has been blooming non-stop for three weeks and we are in dire need of rain. An inch two weeks ago gave it the boost it needed. I predict another one or two weeks of bloom maximum. By then we'd better get some rain for the coneflowers, wild sunflowers, etc. to prosper or we're going to see the hives go down hill for the rest of the season.

So many conditions will dictate floral bloom periods. Had our weather not turned to 100°F+ and dry conditions, we would still have some wild clover blooming and the alfalfa that is allowed to full bloom would go longer.


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## garprob (Jan 20, 2009)

I hve 4 or 5 alfalfa fields which are used for seed production within 1.5 miles of my hives. Our alfalfa bloom started about the 3rd week of June this year (about 2 weeks behind usual). The seed alfalfa will be allowed to bloom all summer until September I think. There are also lots of other alfalfa fields which are cut for hay close by as well. Our farmers usually get 3 cuttings- the plants usually bloom for a few days or a week before each cutting.

Last year was my first year with bees- I started with 2 three pound packages and harvested 75 pounds of honey. Alfalfa honey is a delicious, light, almost buttery tasting honey. I sold it all in a week by word of mouth to my co-workers at the hospital where I work. All winter and spring I had people wanting to pre-order for this year.


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## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

WI-beek said:


> The Alfalfa flow has been killing me. I need someone to donate about 45 supers .


I could bring a load of hives to set by yours so they aren't getting so full or I could trade you empty supers for full ones.


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Beeslave - how you sacrifice for your fellow Wisconsin beekeeper. What merit.

Roland


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## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

I'm just poking a little fun at Morgan.


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## smith (Mar 7, 2009)

I'm sort of in the same boat. I have a great hay farmer bordering my yards. Real professional, not much chemical use. He lets it go to flower shortly before cutting. Some years, the rain delays cutting and I benefit from his misfortune. But what I wonder about is the mixed clover that's in with the alfalfa. There's white, alsike and ladino. All good for bees. But what really does the best is the larger red clover which the bees don't seem to be able to use but dairy cows love. A lot of our CRP land also is heavy with red clover. It would be nice if another more bee-compatible clover could be substituted for the red. I'm sure the nature of mix is centered more on the cow than the bee, but for CRP land, why not plant toward bee support?


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## WI-beek (Jul 14, 2009)

They like to cut alfalfa when ten percent of buds have flowered for maximum protein content. Not sure what delayed they cutting of three different farmers alfalfa but I was not expecting it. As of tuesday I still had two left, and another farmers about to start flowering.

Next year I will have a few acre field of mixed clover about 100 yards from my bees. My uncle rents all his tilable land to a guy who grows corn and soybean every other year exept a few acres which he kept for corn for deer. I asked if I paid for the seed if I could plant clover. I did not even have to pay for it cause his brother in law who plants for him said he had a clover mix and next thing I know my uncle said that he planted it. So this year the cover crop is oats and next year it will be clover. I think Im spoiled.

By the way, how long does soybean flower and does it make much honey? Got plenty of it and it started flowering last week and its growing the best Ive seen in years with all the rain. i just hope the aphids are not a problem. Year before last they had to spray for them. My uncle said it was the first time he ever seen them have to do that so I hope its the last.


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## StevenG (Mar 27, 2009)

On a different thread re: Soybeans, seems the beans up north don't produce honey, only in the fertile flatlands/flood plains of the south.

My experience with Alfalfa is that if cut for hay, I didn't get a whole lot of honey. If they let it go to seed, got a lot more. Sigh, wish alfalfa was near me... I envy you your location!
Regards,
Steven


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## WI-beek (Jul 14, 2009)

Well Saturday I pulled some more honey and noticed the last of my alfalfa fortune was cut and drying. Oh well all things must come to and end.

Today I went and put supers back on and headed out, looked out my window and noticed another field of alfalfa in bloom not more than a quarter mile off.

Sorry for beating a dead horse here folks but I just cant believe it. Im guessing this is one of those things I will cross my fingers for every year and never see again. The sad thing is I have been a day late and a dollar short on supers all summer and I dont think I have one colony that did not swarm on me. I lost quite a bit of honey that I was waiting to be fully capped only to come back and see they swarmed and uncapped most of it. If my luck goes like usual, Ill have enough supers next year and they will collect dust for all my efforts.

Listen to me wine, ehh!


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

At least you won't have far to go to get a little Cheese for your whine. I do not understand why people worry about one field of alfalfa, when the bees fly to cover several square miles? What percentage of several square miles is that one field? I am not trying to pick on you, just looking for an explanation to a very commonly held view point. 

Sorry to hear about your swarms. 

Roland

P.S. If the rain doesn't stop soon, we will be in dire straits, no solid flow yet. 7 1/2 inches one day last week.


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## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

Good clover and alfalfa flow today. 4 yards I checked today put on some good weight the last 13 days.


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## WI-beek (Jul 14, 2009)

I am well aware of the distance the bees fly for forage. I am very pleased with alfalfa however and am glad to see more of it in easy reach of my bees. In my area there is as much woods as there is field and most of the tillable land has now gone to cash crops of corn and soybean because dairy farmers have closed shop and rent there land to the big crop farmers to cover their property taxes. If it were twenty years ago I would have over twenty different dairy farmers property in reach of the yard I speak of. Now its 6 or 7. Still not bad considering many areas one would have lost everything to corn and soybean.

The main reason however for my excitment is the fact that last year I caught a whole week and a half of alfalfa after pretty much nothing after blackberries. I have heard commercial beeks complain about rain but I really dont think the record rain is much to complain about this year. We have had nice warm sunny weather when its not raining and everything is growing and flowering like crazy. Farmers have already got three alfalfa crops and a week after they cut it, its foot tall already. 

Its about as good as it gets I think when you have several farmers around you that dont all cut their hay the same day. By the looks of it I have another field of alfalfa ready to pop. As long as it stays wet and warm, I can see the farmers having trouble keeping up and that means me lucking out with a good flow. 

Sorry to hear about your lack of a flow and overwhelming amounts of rain. We have had many rounds of inch to two inch plus but dont seem to slow anything down. Im glad we are getting it after so many years of so littlel. I just dont care for the wind. I have had a few covers blown off with ten or fifteen pound rocks on them. Thankfully no hives tipped over.

Hope your flow picks up, and your bees stay healthy Rolland. 

Thanks
WI-Beek


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## Ozone (May 24, 2011)

Anybody know specifically what causes alfalfa to flower? Is is a bit of stress, ie drought?


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## Joseph Clemens (Feb 12, 2005)

I'd guess it would be sexual maturity. Brought on by sufficient moisture, temperatures, nutrition, and sunlight.


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## rwurster (Oct 30, 2010)

The alfalfa around here is cut before it flowers (late budding) to 2 or 3 days after it flowers to keep its nutritional value high. A 2 acre plot of alfalfa that the neighbor always lets go due to its horrible location has been in bloom for the past 2 weeks and in those 2 weeks my bees have put on at least 15 pounds of honey per hive. My apiary sets dead center in the middle of 200 acres of alfalfa which, if let to go its full bloom time, I would dare to say that each hive could produce 15 - 35 pounds or more of alfalfa honey per week for the duration of the bloom.


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## oregonbeek (Mar 30, 2010)

It basically blooms after x amount of days (it's just part of the growth cycle), but if it's stressed it can bloom prematurely. The edges around fields always tend to bloom a bit quicker than the healthy center of the fields. Straggler plants that are extra stressed always seem to be smaller, yet bloom quicker as well. 

P.S. I'm an alfalfa farmer. 

rwurster is right as well. You want to cut alfalfa right before it blooms or after a certain percentage of bloom. After it blooms it loses it's nutritional value and basically "goes rank".


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Ozone, it is my opinion that time after cutting is the most important factor in determining when it blooms. If it is dry, and the alfalfa does not grow enough, it can all bloom before it is tall enough to cut again. Some fields are in that situation now.

Crazy Roland


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## Ozone (May 24, 2011)

I'm raising the alfalfa for the bees. I have deer that have taken most of the blooms off, (as well as the tops of a lot of plants). I am on sandy soil, and well irrigated at the moment. I'm at a loss as to what to do next. I could brush hog it, or ?.....

Thanks!

PS the deer do a good job of keeping the tops trimmed.....


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## papamoose (Apr 7, 2010)

I have a few hives on a CSA, and I got 90 lbs of pure alfalfa honey from 1 hive. The CSA owners didn't even know there was any around their 900 acres. But I was able to confirm there is plenty around in the 2 surrounding miles. The stuff is incredible. Processed two weeks ago and almost sold out already.


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

An old study by North Dakota State University found that alfalfa in full bloom can put down sixty pounds of 60% saturated sugar per day per acre. If you are fortunate enough to get hot days and cool nights and enough rain to keep the soil moist, amazing things can happen. I will not make any wild claims but when farmers cut it at 40% bloom instead of 5% now, the North Dakota state average honey production was around 150 pounds per hive. I have three yards sitting in Conservation reserve program alfalfa fields. One more good soaking rain and I am going to be a happy boy.


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## WI-beek (Jul 14, 2009)

Best thing that can happen when alfalfa starts popping is rain every other day for three weeks strait so they cant get a long enough stretch to dry it before bailing it. Lazy farmers are great too! The goal is to cut at 15% bloom to get highest protein content. I blooms here at about 12-18" usually. I can get nice heavy flows sometimes, other time it dont do squat.


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## NDnewbeek (Jul 4, 2008)

I have hives on alfalfa here in ND. One HUGE field gets cut three times per year. The other posts are right - the farmers want to cut it just before it blooms. I get very little off of that field unless it stays warm and wet after the third cutting. Then, right at the end of the year, the bees finally get to work the blooms. I have other hives on fields where the farmers are only cutting hay for their operations. This means one or two cuttings per year only. The bees make more honey off of those fields.

Mike


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## Myron Denny (Sep 27, 2009)

I got a phone call to come look at a field of alfalfa that is blooming. We are extremely dry in northern Oklahoma and the temperature is 100+ daily. I checked the soil temperature yesterday at the field, it was 130 degrees. There is some insect activity, bumblebees and millers. There is a large creek next to this field that is dry, I think I need to have a water source close by for the bees. I am going to move some hives to this field, anyone had any experience with dry alfalfa, will it produce nectar? I am feeding these colonies syrup now. Any suggestions before I move?


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## Riskybizz (Mar 12, 2010)

While alfalfa is the most important honey producing plant in some states, clover is still the most important honey producing plant in the US. At least according to the National Honey Board.


http://www.honey.com/nhb/about-honey/honey-varietals/


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## RogerCrum (Jun 19, 2011)

Myron,
Alfalfa produces nectar long after other plants have turned to dust. The alfalfa plant has a root system that is 18 feet deep. The problem with alfalfa raised for feed is that the farmer usually harvests it before it all blooms to catch the protein level at its peak. Alfalfa raised for seed is naturally not cut and goes through full flower and sets seed. Such fields produce large honey crops.


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