# Mite Elimination Thermotherapy



## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

I find it interesting that the other advertised use for this device is a winter hive warmer. Isn't that what beepro was advocating and getting a lot of flack for? Just thinking out loud.


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

I think all honey bees, at least apis mellifera, get ready for wintering. I would think this would disrupt their normal cycle by having the hive temps the same all year. Plus it seems they didn’t apply the OxA in a timely manner; treated once and that was it.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Cloverdale said:


> The owner of this Company posted some dialogue on our Bee Club face ebook page. If anyone wants to take a look it’s Western Catskill Mountain Beekeepers of NY. I would want SNL to take a look at this as she (the owner) says she “had dinner with the OA rep. for north america, per the OA instructions you never use this product when brood is present we have tested 6 weeks after OA and terminated 100's of mites. in Europe the best practice is to cage the queen in August when the mite population peaks break the brood cycle before treatment. American's have gone crazy mis applying this product, Temperature is more natural than chemicals...”


I'm not Larry (snl) but I follow oxalic acid quite closely.

If that quote is representative of the vendor's opinion accuracy, I would stay _far away_.

There is no "OA rep. for north america", and "per the OA instructions you never use this product when brood is present" is not accurate either.

Furthermore, its unlikely that *ALL* varroa would ever be removed from a hive by *any* product. At a minimum, bees drift between hives, and varroa ride along with them. Even if one was to somehow eradicate every varroa in all of your own hives, the notion that there are not 'other' bees/colonies within flying range of virtually all hives in North America is _highly suspect_.:no:

The *ONLY* OA "instructions" are those on the EPA approved label, here: https://www3.epa.gov/pesticides/chem_search/ppls/091266-00001-20151013.pdf

What that EPA label does say regarding brood is "Use only in late fall or early spring when little or no brood is present. Oxalic Acid Dihydrate might damage bee brood. Oxalic Acid Dihydrate will not control Varroa mites in capped brood. "


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

Agree, there were a few more statements that I felt were incorrect and she did not provide me with the name of the OA representative for north America that I asked for. Thanks Graham.


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## Fivej (Apr 4, 2016)

Sounds like more BS. Their website is very vague, but it appears they are suggesting you can use their product to heat your hive to 106 degrees for 160 minutes and all the mites are killed. As others have pointed out on similar products and claims, hives in the south and west (US) are frequently this warm and it does not kill the mites. I see no test results on the website. J


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## rwurster (Oct 30, 2010)

Fat Bee Man just released a video on one of these contraptions. I don't know if he's endorsing it or helping these folks out or whatever. Two and a half hours per hive 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrC3cFR5awA


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## Virgil (Jan 14, 2018)

Cloverdale said:


> [..] says she “had dinner with the OA rep. for north america, per the OA instructions you never use this product when brood is present we have tested 6 weeks after OA and terminated 100's of mites. in Europe the best practice is to cage the queen in August when the mite population peaks break the brood cycle before treatment. [..]


People misquote the LASI study endlessly. 

In their 2013 study measuring the effectiveness of different methods of oxalic treatments, they found that sublimation had the highest mite kill, lower acid dose and no increase in bee mortality.

As part of their method, they also removed all the brood from the hives by scraping them out. Hence the recommendation that OAV should be done when bloodless. Anecdotal evidence from beekeepers who treat three times, five days apart, so the bees are exposed through a brood cycle suggests you can use OAV with brood if you change the application regime. 

I do think we OAV people over apply it and don't follow basic IPM methodologies and use a broad range of treatment in the odd belief that varroa won't be able to adapt to OA. Given we don't know the mode of action that would be foolhardy.

As to the claim that temperature is a more natural than other treatments I have to wonder what heating a social organism that is highly proficient at maintaining homeostasis in its colony does it the bees?

For the price I'd think a better investment would be a varro monitoring kit.


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

I asked a friend who had bought a few of these here is his response


> I did, and wasn't that impressed. They have a winter mode which is supposed to help making brood earlier, I am going to try later, tword the end of February just before maple


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

Vague claims, such as meeting the (un named) oxalic acid rep for America, seem to be a feature of the way a certain mentality of people promote dodgy products on their web sites. It implies, in this particular case, that the oxalic rep is beholden to this awesome new product, and is done to impress the unschooled new player who knows no better and will then buy the product. 

I take these type claims as a warning. It does seem that in this case, the product may actually work (i THINK), albeit with quit a bit of time input from the beekeeper per hive.


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

wildbranch2007 said:


> I asked a friend who had bought a few of these here is his response


Keep us posted.


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