# MAQS - Full Dose /Half Dose



## Spur9 (Sep 13, 2016)

I think a half-dose will reduce the potential negative effects of the formic acid (brood death / queen loss). Just because there is less substance in the hive to gas out. But you also run the risk of a less effective treatment. 
I treated with MAQS last year using the full dose (early September). Made sure lower entrance reducers were off and I also run upper entrances. I did not experience any queen losses out of 19 hives treated.


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## aran (May 20, 2015)

im using formic pro and doing 1 strip every 10 days x 2 treatments which is on the packaging as a legitimate treatment approach.
I just put the second strips on yesterday and the hives look fine after the first 10 days. No bearding outside at all.


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

aran said:


> im using formic pro and doing 1 strip every 10 days x 2 treatments which is on the packaging as a legitimate treatment approach.
> I just put the second strips on yesterday and the hives look fine after the first 10 days. No bearding outside at all.


were on the same schedule, just put the second on today. did you notice that some of the pads that you were taking off still had the formic smell, and a few still had some liquid in them. I like the pro much better than the original MAQS.


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## aran (May 20, 2015)

yup i agree...seem easier on the bees. And yes def a few were still moist with faint smell of formic acid.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

Thanks, I might take a look at the Formic Pro.


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## Spur9 (Sep 13, 2016)

Mike Gillmore said:


> Thanks, I might take a look at the Formic Pro.


I believe Formic Pro is the same product as MAQS, just a new name with a longer shelf life. 

If you are only going to be gone for a couple of weeks, you may want to think about using Apiguard. It's thymol based and advertised as no issues with queen loss. Using it will require you putting the 1st treatment on and then 2 weeks later, a 2nd treatment.


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

Spur9 said:


> I believe Formic Pro is the same product as MAQS, just a new name with a longer shelf life.


It may be the same acid, but the internal structure is completely different, very similar to the cardboard like structure that Mite away II 's had. also I don't think the bees would be able to remove this stuff at all.


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## aran (May 20, 2015)

yup i agree with Mike its definitely different looking to the MAQS. None of the strips had been even partially removed by the bees after treatment round 1.


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## Branman (Aug 20, 2003)

I did half treatments on all the hives this summer when we had a break in the weather and did not notice any harm done to the bees or queens even at the top end of the temperature range.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

Well, decided to go with the Formic Pro. I'll be adding two pads to each hive next weekend for 14 days and then removing them the first of September, right before I have to leave town. I'll report back on how it works out. 

Thanks for everyone's thoughts.


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## MJC417 (Jul 26, 2008)

I've never used formic acid. By the posts, it sounds like you don't need a mask or respirator when handling it. Is it less hazardous to breath in as opposed to oxalic acid?


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## AHudd (Mar 5, 2015)

The cautions on the packaging say otherwise. 

Alex


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## MJC417 (Jul 26, 2008)

Just looked at the cautions and there is no mention of using a respirator, it just says don't inhale it. So I'm guessing you would have to stay away from your apiary for the 14 or 20 day treatment.


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## Fivej (Apr 4, 2016)

I use a respirator. While the instructions may not say that you need to use one, the fumes are very,very strong. I can't hold my breath for the time it takes to unwrap the pads, put them on and close the hive up. Once the hive is closed up, the smell is not that bad. I wouldn't put my nose up to the hive and inhale, but you can certainly be in your apiary during the treatment period. J


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## AHudd (Mar 5, 2015)

While there is no specific mention of respirator it does state to avoid breathing vapors and to stand upwind. There is also mention of a mask, among other cautions, because it causes irreversible eye damage. I think I would in the least wear safety glasses while opening the package.

I should have been more specific. I printed out these cautions from their website. It is probably an insert in the packaging.

Alex


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

I too started with the Formic Pro today, doing the one strip at a time 20 days. Did a previous OAV on the 2nd. What puzzled me was I did not get any significant mite drop at all, which prompted me to do the formic instead of continuing the OA, yet today some of the hives had 15 +- mites in a sugar roll. The Oxalic Acid did sublime, we could see the vapor. First time that it didn’t work for us.


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

Cloverdale said:


> The Oxalic Acid did sublime, we could see the vapor. First time that it didn’t work for us.


which device did you use??


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

wildbranch2007 said:


> which device did you use??


You know, I think it was the first one that SNL was selling. The first wand.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

Put 2 strips of Formic Pro on all of my hives yesterday morning. According to our local long range forecast it looks like the high temperatures should be running between the mid 70's to mid 80's for the next couple of weeks. I'll have the 2 week treatment completed September 1st before I have to head out of town. 

Keeping my fingers crossed that this works out all right. I drove by the hives in the afternoon and there was a little bearding, but not as much as I was expecting. We'll see how this goes. I'm probably worrying too much, time will tell.


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

Mike Gillmore said:


> Put 2 strips of Formic Pro on all of my hives yesterday morning. According to our local long range forecast it looks like the high temperatures should be running between the mid 70's to mid 80's for the next couple of weeks. I'll have the 2 week treatment completed September 1st before I have to head out of town.
> 
> Keeping my fingers crossed that this works out all right. I drove by the hives in the afternoon and there was a little bearding, but not as much as I was expecting. We'll see how this goes. I'm probably worrying too much, time will tell.


I was worried too treating with Formic Pro. My hives received the one strip last Sunday, with the second one due to be applied on Tuesday. Some bearding but not much. I’ve seen more with the humid weather we’ve been having. We are going away tomorrow so will wait till Friday to apply the second strip.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

Cloverdale said:


> I’ve seen more with the humid weather we’ve been having. We are going away tomorrow so will wait till Friday to apply the second strip.


Same here with the bearding. When we were humid and in the upper 80's + they were bearding and washboarding pretty heavy during the heat of the day. 
Wish I could have done the single strip application, but the timing didn't work out for me on the second application.

It will be interesting to compare notes with you when we do post treatment inspections mid September.


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

Sounds good. I was able to visit/work (minimally ) at Mike Palmer’s apiary with NY Bee Wellness founder/director Pat Bono, an honor regarding both beekeepers. I’ve never seen an operation like his work so well together with his employees, it’s like they’re married, anticipating every step that is needed during the queen rearing season (we were there in late June) it was fascinating and impressive in my humble opinion. They work very hard from morning to late. He is a kind-hearted man as is his crew. Bee Source is lucky to have him participate like he does.


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## aran (May 20, 2015)

Cloverdale said:


> Sounds good. I was able to visit/work (minimally ) at Mike Palmer’s apiary with NY Bee Wellness founder/director Pat Bono, an honor regarding both beekeepers. I’ve never seen an operation like his work so well together with his employees, it’s like they’re married, anticipating every step that is needed during the queen rearing season (we were there in late June) it was fascinating and impressive in my humble opinion. They work very hard from morning to late. He is a kind-hearted man as is his crew. Bee Source is lucky to have him participate like he does.


Was MP using formic pro?


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

It was queen rearing time, so did not see anyone doing treating.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

Day 9 into treatment and the temps went up to about 90 today, looks the same for a few more days. I drove by the hives this afternoon and it didn't look too bad, normal bearding for 90 deg temps. Time will tell.


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## aran (May 20, 2015)

i put on a double strip Formic pro treatment 3 days ago on a large swarm i had caught 2-3 weeks back.
Really felt i had little choice but to treat them since every other hive in my apiary is being treated now.
Supposed to get up to 91 in Skaneateles today-> hopefully all will be well


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

aran said:


> i put on a double strip Formic pro treatment 3 days ago on a large swarm i had caught 2-3 weeks back.
> Really felt i had little choice but to treat them since every other hive in my apiary is being treated now.
> Supposed to get up to 91 in Skaneateles today-> hopefully all will be well


I think you’ll be alright, being you ar3 at the end of the 3 days. Hopefully you put them on in 5h3 AM. from NOD: “Outside daytime highs should be between 50 - 85°F on day of application. Hot temperatures (≥92°F during the first 3 days) may lead to excessive bee, brood and queen loss.”


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

Mike Gillmore said:


> Day 9 into treatment and the temps went up to about 90 today, looks the same for a few more days. I drove by the hives this afternoon and it didn't look too bad, normal bearding for 90 deg temps. Time will tell.


Day 5 on second strip. Just had a swarm, not sure which hive yet (16 here) but think it’s a Saskatraz queen hive. Out of 5 queens, 4 of them made swarm cells; all have extra room and great laying patterns. Two have very low mite counts. I don’t attribute the swarm to the Formic Strips. I am puzzled on why they are making swarm cells.


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## minz (Jan 15, 2011)

I usually do formic but ran out so picked up some formic pro for the last couple of hives. I put on a single strip an the weatherman missed another hot patch within the 3 day window (we have been getting crushed with hot weather 3x the normal number of 90+ days). I did not replace it after day 10 since we got another bank of hot weather but put it on this last weekend. The strips were separated and glued down hard. 
I will be screwed without queens this time of year so here’s to hoping.


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## Heinlein (Aug 28, 2018)

aran said:


> i put on a double strip Formic pro treatment 3 days ago on a large swarm i had caught 2-3 weeks back.
> Really felt i had little choice but to treat them since every other hive in my apiary is being treated now.
> Supposed to get up to 91 in Skaneateles today-> hopefully all will be well


I just applied two strips of Formic Pro yesterday. The manufacturer does show both the 14-day and 20-day treatments as acceptable, yet gives no indication as to why one would be used over the other. Any thoughts about that?


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

I think past experience with MAQS and queen loss has scared some beekeepers so they are going the more “gentle”route of treatment to knock down the mites till they use something else later on.


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## Heinlein (Aug 28, 2018)

I suppose I will check in with my experience in a couple weeks. I had some dead bees on the entrance ramp this morning, and have seen some light bearding thus far. Long live the queen!


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## aran (May 20, 2015)

Heinlein said:


> I just applied two strips of Formic Pro yesterday. The manufacturer does show both the 14-day and 20-day treatments as acceptable, yet gives no indication as to why one would be used over the other. Any thoughts about that?


i did the 20 day treatments on several hives and the 10 day on others...a small number comparison of sorts. It seems the 20day approach is probably easier on the bees but the mite drops will tell the real story.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

Update.

I'm back in town now and had a chance to check the hives today. 8 of the 9 hives looked really great. They had original queens still laying and brood in all stages, including capped brood and eggs. Only 1 of the 9 hives had a few open queen cells with larvae. Very testy, it was obvious they were queenless. We'll see how that one turns out.

That's better than I had expected, we'll see how it goes later on. I'll probably give them a shot of OAV at the end of the month to see what kind of mite drop I get. Always a chance for a spike in mites due to the bees robbing out collapsing hives.

This has been so much better than my past experience with Formic. Several years ago I used some of the original Formic Pads and it was unacceptably hard on the bees and queens, had me a bit gun shy trying it again. Looks like the manufacturer may have worked out the bugs. Keeping my fingers crossed.


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## Cloverdale (Mar 26, 2012)

6 hives treated with Formic Pro, one strip at a time, 2 have swarmed. I don’t think it is related to the treatment (we are having the best honey year here in our little corner of the Catskill Mtns. ) There were mite drops on the drawers of the hives, but I didn’t do a new sugar roll yet, but it looks as though I would use this again. The hives are very healthy.


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