# Over-wintering in Nucs



## Gray Goose (Sep 4, 2018)

Bluto,

Nice Screen Name BTW.

Why not play the Palmer U Tube if that is the Expert approach you "wanted" 
Then have a brief discussion on the points the group feels need clarity.

Any one who has had bees for 10 Years and Has used NUCs can be the guide and answer most questions.

The concept is not terribly complicated, And well explained by the MP u tubes, and if any one wants a refresher they simply re watch. so notes are online line already.

The need for warm blooded presenter , is no longer here IMO. Beside you are doing a Zoom so what gives, virtual in the presenter as well.

I'll play the Utube and comment for 1000 Bucks. let me know the date. We can book it today 

GG


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## Bluto (Feb 19, 2017)

I understand, but having the talent there to do Q&A after the presentation is of value, something not really possible with a video. If we were just going to play the video, we'd likely get more participation by emailing the link and letting our membership watch at their leisure, no meeting necessary.

I do understand your point. Having a live presenter, with members all logged in simultaneously, provides a bit of the feeling members got at in-person meetings. We are all missing the socializing as well as the information. The zoom sessions with live presenters so far have been a decent substitute.

Your generous offer is appreciated, but I must respectfully decline.  Another aside, the zoom sessions have allowed our clubs to bring in speakers we could never hope to afford to bring in live. The most we've spent so far is $250, and as little as $75. Split between our 4 clubs, it is amazingly inexpensive.

Popeye fan, are you?


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## Gray Goose (Sep 4, 2018)

yes a popeye fan I am.

the concept of the Side by side over winter NUC, is a bit late this season to leverage any gain for members. Up until feb this "could" be a topic for discussion.

Michael is likely in the thick of Honey harvest, then winter prep.

I would back burner this topic ,,continue to try to connect with him for maybe a Jan or Feb Zoom, when he has more bandwidth.
You realize he is a commercial bee keeper Right? and it is August.

Perhaps a Harvest topic or Winter topic would have more relevance now , offering more late summer relevant info now, and still leave your "wish" topic on the table for later.

Good idea , IMO , maybe try for a better time for the speaker.

GG


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## msl (Sep 6, 2016)

you might give Dr Meagan Milbrath with Michigan State a try 
she did a sare grant on overwintering nucs and traveled about as part of the grants outreach portion giveing talks (I got to see her presentation @ a CO state meeting a few years back) 
https://static1.squarespace.com/sta...510002000326/Milbrath_SustainableFallNucs.pdf

Since your in Tenn
have you thought about Kamon Reynolds ?
how you overwinter a nuc in Tenn is going to be different then zone3 VT.. 
also to note in my head this is the kind of talk for spring summer, when people can hear it, go home and put it in to practice while its fresh in there head... they forget things when waiting 6 mounths ...


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## LarryBud (Jul 19, 2020)

Gray Goose said:


> yes a popeye fan I am.
> 
> the concept of the Side by side over winter NUC, is a bit late this season to leverage any gain for members. Up until feb this "could" be a topic for discussion.
> 
> ...


The proper response would be " I YAM"


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## Bluto (Feb 19, 2017)

Gray Goose said:


> Michael is likely in the thick of Honey harvest, then winter prep.
> 
> I would back burner this topic ,,continue to try to connect with him for maybe a Jan or Feb Zoom, when he has more bandwidth.
> You realize he is a commercial bee keeper Right? and it is August.
> ...


Dr. Tom Seely sat in on our recent session with Randy Oliver and said just this regarding Michael Palmer. I imagine I am expecting too much.  I see he has posted on these forums since i've inquired of him, so I thought he might could respond at least to say yes or "buzx off.". I was wanting to schedule him in October, perhaps my idea of what he would or wouldn't be busy doing then is off base. Isn't Vermont snow covered from late September to early June?


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## Bluto (Feb 19, 2017)

msl said:


> you might give Dr Meagan Milbrath with Michigan State a try
> she did a sare grant on overwintering nucs and traveled about as part of the grants outreach portion giveing talks (I got to see her presentation @ a CO state meeting a few years back)
> https://static1.squarespace.com/sta...510002000326/Milbrath_SustainableFallNucs.pdf
> 
> ...


Yes!! I was set to contact her but read on her web page she is not accepting any speaking requests, even via computer, outside of Michigan at present. Bummer!

Kamon Reynolds is a nice young man. I'm not sure he has the experience with the subject matter we are seeking however.

Many folks here have just completed late season splits. so it would seem timely. Wintering in nucs is relatively new here. Double-deeps has been the rule for most.

Bob Binnie is someone I wanted to get to speak to our group, he has a video on checking winter nucs, but I haven't seen where he has a talk on the subject. At present, I'm thinking MIchael Bush or Dr. Larry Connor might be options.


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## Bluto (Feb 19, 2017)

LarryBud said:


> The proper response would be " I YAM"


EXACTLY!


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## Robert Holcombe (Oct 10, 2019)

Bluto "I understand, but having the talent there to do Q&A after the presentation is of value" As a sixth yer newbie I agree with you whole heartedly. Some of the best tips and ideas came from Q&A time - enjoyed Palmer very much. I have an off-the-wall idea for you.

I have an alternate but pertinent idea, I believe, but many may not like it. Peruse your local Universities to see if you can find a speaker, mechanical engineering or physicist who is at least aware of beehives, to address Relative Humidity, it's relationship to temperature, diffusion and material absorption and if possible specualte on the impact to a wintering hive or nuc. When it comes to a nuc, the issue and problems are very likely amplified. I am wintering two single nucs this year which were started in August. I do have contrarian ways. I allso have been reading, searching via Google Scholar and conducting very coarse hive tests. It gets very interesting when you find an article on why a couple of big hives died in winter. Upon investigation in a lab the cause-of-death was concluded to be dehydration. Unfortunately the author/investigator died shortly thereafter. I am working, slowly, on a drop of water's journey through a hive, multiple avenues, out of curiosity. The fact that we do have electronic humidity and temperature sensors as a tool which can fit on a frame cracks open a whole new world understanding.


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## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

Bluto said:


> Kamon Reynolds is a nice young man. I'm not sure he has the experience with the subject matter we are seeking however.


Do not discount Kamon's age. He has been a beekeeper since he was a teenager and knows a lot more than many beekeepers twice his age. I hope to get him to come to Virginia and give a presentation for our bee club sometime in the future. And since he is in Tennessee, his knowledge would be more valuable to your club members than that of someone accustomed to a far different climate. Just my opinion.


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## SeaCucumber (Jun 5, 2014)

I'd like to know when it makes sense. I could overwinter medium size colonies. In spring, I could move frames to make some hives nucs and others large.


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## Bluto (Feb 19, 2017)

Robert Holcombe said:


> I have an alternate but pertinent idea, I believe, but many may not like it. Peruse your local Universities to see if you can find a speaker, mechanical engineering or physicist who is at least aware of beehives, to address Relative Humidity, it's relationship to temperature, diffusion and material absorption and if possible specualte on the impact to a wintering hive or nuc. When it comes to a nuc, the issue and problems are very likely amplified. I am wintering two single nucs this year which were started in August. I do have contrarian ways. I allso have been reading, searching via Google Scholar and conducting very coarse hive tests. It gets very interesting when you find an article on why a couple of big hives died in winter. Upon investigation in a lab the cause-of-death was concluded to be dehydration. Unfortunately the author/investigator died shortly thereafter. I am working, slowly, on a drop of water's journey through a hive, multiple avenues, out of curiosity. The fact that we do have electronic humidity and temperature sensors as a tool which can fit on a frame cracks open a whole new world understanding.


Our club has a member who is a teaching professor at the local university (TN-Chattanooga). She went through our mentorship program 2 years ago and has agreed to lead it in 2021. So we do have a good contact in her. However, I'm thinking our membership is less likely interested in the what may happen and hy something happens and and more about the "do this, do that" that someone with experience offers. Very interesting take, I just don't know how well that might play for our crowd. Thanks for your input!


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## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

Bluto , I apologize for not contacting you. Seeley has it right. Trying to run with a limited crew. Just finishing harvest...should be done next week. But honestly...I’m exhausted. Also, I already have some scheduled presentations...NHS in October and others. Just can’t do any more. Maybe in the winter?


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## msl (Sep 6, 2016)

> Kamon Reynolds is a nice young man. I'm not sure he has the experience with the subject matter we are seeking however.





> Do not discount Kamon's age. He has been a beekeeper since he was a teenager and knows a lot more than many beekeepers twice his age. I hope to get him to come to Virginia and give a presentation for our bee club sometime in the future.


LOL 
We see this time and time again, in many industries. For some reason people feel someone from out of state is better than a local


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## Bluto (Feb 19, 2017)

Michael Palmer said:


> Bluto , I apologize for not contacting you. Seeley has it right. Trying to run with a limited crew. Just finishing harvest...should be done next week. But honestly...I’m exhausted. Also, I already have some scheduled presentations...NHS in October and others. Just can’t do any more. Maybe in the winter?


Thank you for the response Mr. Palmer, we would be happy to have you speak most anytime. I look forward to getting with you at a more opportune time.


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## rkereid (Dec 20, 2009)

Mike Palmer!

edit- maybe I should read the posts first


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## dloucky (May 5, 2020)

I completely agree. Watch any Kamon Reynolds video and you will learn plenty. As a Tennessee beekeeper myself, I follow him more than the others mentioned, since the climate matches mine. He is earning his followers deservedly.


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## joebeewhisperer (May 13, 2020)

I've learned a lot from Kamon (only know him from YouTube). And I'm getting ready to pull the trigger on a 4-way (1/2 frame) 4 over 4 unit to winter 8 queens (instead of trying to bank), based on Mr. Palmer's description in a forum. 

I'm amazed that the more experienced commercial guys have time to do any of the talks, videos etc. I realize it generates business, but I've never met a group of individuals so willing to help at every level. Hope your Zoom goes well, and post a schedule. I am an hour North of Chattanooga in the mountains so definitely interested.


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