# Possible Mite Control?



## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

Has anyone got any information on this? Some Canadian beekeepers are claiming varroa mite control using it.

http://www.appliedbio-nomics.com/products/stratiolaelaps


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Fascinating


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

News to me. Seems like there was some other type of biological control a number of years ago that apparently never panned out but I am struggling to remember the specifics. I would guess one of the issues is that bees just don't tolerate intruders of any kind in the hive.


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## JBJ (Jan 27, 2005)

The biocontrol agent from a few years ago was a fungus... Metarhizium anisopliae. I have wondered about predatory mites before as they can be effective in horticultural settings. The question is would Stratiolaelaps live and reproduce in a hive? It is a very specific environment to be adapted to and does not appear to fit into its natural life cycle. I could be wrong and maybe they are very adaptable.

What are the sources of these reports from beekeepers?


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## gmcharlie (May 9, 2009)

Any idea what the application protocol would be???


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## oblib (Oct 28, 2011)

gmcharlie said:


> Any idea what the application protocol would be???


Just a WAG on my part. I don't think they would stay in the hive so if broodless then dump them in and done, if not broodless would prob need to dump them in every week for 3 weeks. Again just a wild ***** guess.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

If it does help, we would have killed them off years ago with the acaracides... there were 30 some mites that used to live in harmony on bees before we started treating for Varroa.


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## JBJ (Jan 27, 2005)

Michael Bush said:


> If it does help, we would have killed them off years ago with the acaracides... there were 30 some mites that used to live in harmony on bees before we started treating for Varroa.


The same is true in horticulture, however there are IPM strategies that specifically plan for care and consideration of the beneficials such as species specific treatments and host plant nurseries to name a few. If these things did work affordably for Varroa clean comb would be necessity. Study of the the culture of predatory mites is part of how I stumbled into bees.

Who are these Canadians making these claims? Anything published?


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Michael Bush said:


> If it does help, we would have killed them off years ago with the acaracides... there were 30 some mites that used to live in harmony on bees before we started treating for Varroa.


...or one could conclude if they had helped we wouldnt have needed miticides. 30 mites living in harmony on bees? Hmmmm. Dare I ask for more information on this claim that they once existed and no longer do?


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## JBJ (Jan 27, 2005)

http://chrissladesbeeblog.wordpress.com/2013/02/17/how-are-the-mitey-fallen/

a report of some success


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

The article Linked to by Michael Palmer states these are a soil predatory mite. Perhaps releasing them into the soil around the hives would help reduce mites instead of putting them inside the hive? Since they are soil predatory mites, maybe they would work for control of small hive beetles?


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## Kieck (Dec 2, 2005)

Do these mites eat early instar bee larvae? The photo in the link from the initial post shows a mite preying on a beetle larva. The description suggests that these mites are general predators and will kill and eat anything small enough for them to subdue.

If it works, it sounds like a good option to get inflict some predation on a pest that seems to be lacking a predator or parasite in this country.


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## billabell (Apr 19, 2010)

I emailed the "breeder" Applied Bio-Enomics and asked for info. His reply to me

"Yes, Stratiolaelaps works very well.
There is ongoing research in Niagara and a new trial scheduled in Pennsylvania"

Brian Spencer

I emailed him back asking for more details and contact info at the 2 sites mentioned. I will pass along any further info he provides.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>Dare I ask for more information on this claim that they once existed and no longer do?

I guess you did.

I got it from Nancy Ostiguy in a presentation to Kansas Honey Producers in their March meeting in 2006 and I'm sure she said the name of the study where she got the number, but I wasn't quick enough to write it down. I can give you a few of them:

Acarapis dorsalis
Acarapis vagans
Acarapis externus
Tarsonemus apis
Sennertia shimanukii 
Sennertia faini
Aceria litchii

She said that was in the hive. I'm pretty sure that is not necessarily on the bees, so I'm sure some live in the debris, some on the combs, some in the pollen, and some on the bees. She said 33 different mites.


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

Michael Bush said:


> Sennertia shimanukii


If you look at this page, you'll notice a link to a map next to "Distribution." They may have lived on the bees, but it's clear that not all 30 of them lived on bees in the same place. 30 different mites that lived on bees across the world.

http://insects.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/beemites/Species_Accounts/Sennertia_shimanukii.htm


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Actually here is a study that says:
"Abstract: A list of mites newly found in nests of Apis mellifera. Till the present, the acarine fauna of A. mellifera includes over 170 species."

http://www.landesmuseum.at/biophp/arti_det.php?litnr=10335&artinr=13954

So there used to 170 species logged and they have now found more...


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

To clarify, you're saying that worldwide, there have been some number (170) of different mites found in nests of Apis mellifera, not that there are that many different ones found in a hive at once?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I'm not saying it. I'm just quoting an abstract, but that is probably a correct statement that that is what has been cataloged. Probably before acracides, around 30 was a more likely number.


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## billabell (Apr 19, 2010)

Here is the email reply from Brian at bio nomics:
"I need to know who is asking first.

I reason I am asking is that we have found considerable roadblocks doing this research. The research in Canada has been largely secret because of this. Once I know who you are, I will pass your contact info on to the researcher, who will then decide whether or not to contact you.

It is hoped that the Pennsylvania research will be out in the open, but nothing has happened yet."



Brian



From: Bill Abell [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: February-20-13 10:46 AM
To: Brian
Subject: Re: [Applied Bio-nomics contact] Varroa Mites



Thank you. Can you give me any details on either or both. If possible a contact person name, phone and address. Much obliged.
Bill Abell

On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 1:18 PM, Brian <[email protected]> wrote:


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Michael Bush said:


> I'm not saying it. I'm just quoting an abstract, but that is probably a correct statement that that is what has been cataloged. Probably before acracides, around 30 was a more likely number.


I can accept that. What do we know, though, about the survival of these mites in the post varroa time frame. Are there more or less, were they susceptible to miticides or did they develop the same resistance varroa did. Arent we just assuming that these mites lived in harmony simply because they were in the hives? Perhaps some were detrimental. Lots and lots of variables wouldnt you agree?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>What do we know, though, about the survival of these mites in the post varroa time frame. 

Again, just an opinion from Nancy Ostiguy in the same talk with no reference to known facts, she believed they had mostly been wiped out by the acaracides. I know the bee louse (which is not really a louse or a mite but part of the fauna of the hive) is almost unheard of now and used to be fairly common. Most of those mites are microscopic so I'm sure no one noticed if they were or were not missing unless they were seriously looking. Scientists usually don't keep track of the "bystanders."


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

Did they only live in hives? If not, their survival would not be threatened by varroacides. Do they still exist in the feral hives that (i'm told), have been around for years and never been treated? Some areas apparently (i'm told), have thriving feral populations that go back to pre varroa times and have never been treated, and claims are even made of whole bee populations with a different, so called, "feral" breed. If it's all true, these symbiotic mites should be alive and well, we need have no fears.

As few of them ever lived on the bees but just the hive environment, be it ****** in the wall, rubbish at the bottom, or whatever, could any suitable environment house these mites, bees or no bees?

Did they move to new hives by travelling with a swarm? Or did they just invade the new hive from the surrounding area?

Did all hives have them? or was it of no consequence to the hive wether any of these mites moved in, or not? I mean other than the bee louse, that could be a nuisance to the bees if numbers got too high.


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## Kieck (Dec 2, 2005)

Quite a few mite species are specific in their habitat requirements. I'm no acarologist, but from the species names given to those that Michael Bush posted here, they suggest a high degree of specialization. Ant colonies are hosts to a wide range of mites, beetles, flies, and other animals. I think that bee colonies would be the same under "natural" conditions. In ant colonies, quite a few of the other species living there feed on detritus, or simply are present and tolerated in the colonies. A few feed on the ants themselves, and some are fairly general feeders. Starting with that array of species, any given ant colony may be host to a few or quite a few of the range that may be found in one area. I think finding all of the inquilines and social parasites and predators and parasites and symbionts found in a geographic area in a single colony would be unusual.

Off topic a bit -- does anyone here find bee lice in their hives even occasionally? Bee lice are flies (wingless, but still flies). I'd like a few dead specimens in good condition if I could get them, but I've yet to find any in my hives.


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

a post yesterday on bee-l about the mites and test in uk. so there are some good posts coming out of the UK.

http://community.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-LSOFTDONATIONS.exe?A2=BEE-L;c7f13bdf.1302

The main part of Emily’s presentation was concerned with an experiment
she is conducting with the help of the Buckfast Bee Lady, Clare
Densley, who was present, to see whether the mite, Stratiolaelaps, that
attacks the red mite that afflicts poultry, will also attack the Varroa
mite. With the aid of powerpoint and and Excel bar chart she was able
to show us the results so far.These are exactly the same mites that are
used by The Chicken Vet.

Whereas the graph of the controls showed the expected steeply rising <---this was the untreated colonies
curve, that of the treated colonies showed an undulating wave along the
bottom of the graph showing that the treatment works.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Kieck said:


> Off topic a bit -- does anyone here find bee lice in their hives even occasionally? Bee lice are flies (wingless, but still flies). I'd like a few dead specimens in good condition if I could get them, but I've yet to find any in my hives.


I will keep an eye out. A bit better description perhaps? Size, coloring etc.?


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## Kieck (Dec 2, 2005)

Bee lice are about the same size as _Varroa_ mites, and about the same color. Bee lice probably look more round or long, rather than the oval, wide appearance of _Varroa_. I've read that bee lice adults may be found on queens, they may preferentially seek out the queens, but they do no real harm to the bees.

I've only ever seen a few pinned bee lice in person. I keep looking for some, but have yet to find any.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

https://www.google.com/search?num=1...urce=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=4XEvUaXHDern2QWhl4H4CA

The above will give you hundreds of pictures of braula coeca (bee louse). If you see one on a bee they in no way resemble a Varroa. A Varroa is flat and you never really see their legs without a magnifying glass. The bee louse is more likely on the head or just behind the head their legs are very noticeable and they stand up off of the surface, where a Varroa looks more like a freckle ON the surface.


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## Kieck (Dec 2, 2005)

Have you seen any recently, Michael? I am completely serious that I would like to obtain some specimens, preferably frozen.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>Have you seen any recently, Michael?

I have not seen any for more than a decade at least.


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## Kieck (Dec 2, 2005)

Too bad. I keep hoping to find some. If anyone comes across any in their bees, please let me know.

I started into keeping honeybees after _Varroa_ were already widespread, and bee lice were likely pushed out by the combination of the more competitive mites and the chemical treatments used against those mites.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Braula coeca are not mites. They are not really lice (although that is their common name), they are actually wingless flies...


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## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

Michael Bush said:


> If it does help, we would have killed them off years ago with the acaracides...


I wonder why we seem to have such great success in killing off the beneficials but seem unable to make a dent in the parasites?


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## jfb58 (Sep 10, 2013)

I find this thread a little frustrating--a cheap biological control, but nobody seems inclined to plop down 45 bucks to dump these critters into a couple of infested hives, and share the experience. People who keep snakes and marijuana growers have more experience with hypoaspis miles than beekeepers! I first read about this today. Ordered some mites here.


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## bee crazy (Oct 6, 2005)

jfb58 said:


> I find this thread a little frustrating--a cheap biological control, but nobody seems inclined to plop down 45 bucks to dump these critters into a couple of infested hives, and share the experience. People who keep snakes and marijuana growers have more experience with hypoaspis miles than beekeepers! I first read about this today. Ordered some mites here.


Well I for one plan to do a test hive just as they start the build up on dandelions.
I understand the skeptism, look at all the latest can't miss remedies we've seen the last 10 years.
But this makes so much sense. I'm ready


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## Axtmann (Dec 29, 2002)

What's happen if I have 2000 of this bugs in my hive and they eat all mites in a few days, do you think they will go outside in the soil to survive and come back to check for more mites? It says, they living in soil, how can they survive in a hive? I have no soil in any hive, my bees have a good cleaning behavior. 
I hope they are not going into the cells eating the eggs and the few days old larva's if the varroas are gone. We already have a scientist made problem .......with the African honey bees.


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Michael Bush said:


> If it does help, we would have killed them off years ago with the acaracides... there were 30 some mites that used to live in harmony on bees before we started treating for Varroa.


just like the varroa mite was killed off??


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## JRG13 (May 11, 2012)

I dropped some in 4 hives yesterday, will update what I see.


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## bee crazy (Oct 6, 2005)

JRG13 said:


> I dropped some in 4 hives yesterday, will update what I see.


hay, thosearth quakes didn't shake all them mites out of those hives, did they?
Hope you guys are ok out there.


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## JRG13 (May 11, 2012)

Not up here, we're getting some rain though finally.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>I wonder why we seem to have such great success in killing off the beneficials but seem unable to make a dent in the parasites? 

We face the same dilemma with all pesticides and poisons. The target is always a pest that reproduces rapidly (which is what makes them a pest). Their predators never reproduce as fast (or they would all starve) so when we try to kill the pest we always end up with more pests and less of the pest's predators.


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## jwcarlson (Feb 14, 2014)

bee crazy said:


> Well I for one plan to do a test hive just as they start the build up on dandelions.
> I understand the skeptism, look at all the latest can't miss remedies we've seen the last 10 years.
> But this makes so much sense. I'm ready





bee crazy said:


> hay, thosearth quakes didn't shake all them mites out of those hives, did they?
> Hope you guys are ok out there.


What happened, bee crazy?


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## minz (Jan 15, 2011)

The Oregon State bee lab gave a short video on putting mites with what looked like these in a dish under a microscope this fall conference. They showed that they did attack the mites legs and started chewing them off. Since it did at least engage the mites they were going to continue testing. I do remember that mites dumped outside the hives had no legs but it was unknown if it was the method of the bees removing them or the mites.


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## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

JRG13 said:


> I dropped some in 4 hives yesterday, will update what I see.


Any news to report? Brilliant success? Total waste of time? Something in-between?


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