# Old Sol Bees A+



## beepro

How special are those queens?


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## jcase

beepro said:


> How special are those queens?


Im not sure it is any more special than any other queen. I hear good things about them, low mite loads etc but wont know til next year.


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## Flyer Jim

I have gotten a lot of queens over the years from Old Sol, drove up to his place to pick up some breeder queens one year. John is a real good guy, never got a bad queen from them. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:


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## Scottsbee

Jcase 

Which queen did you purchase? 

The Caucasian or the survivor queen? 

The only bees I've bought, so I'm curious how yours are doing. 

Scott


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## jcase

Scottsbee said:


> Jcase
> 
> Which queen did you purchase?
> 
> The Caucasian or the survivor queen?
> 
> The only bees I've bought, so I'm curious how yours are doing.
> 
> Scott


survivor


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## Scottsbee

Keep us posted on how she does. 

Went with the Caucasian, interesting traits. Will be neat to see the difference between my mutts and the Caucasian bees.


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## jcase

Scottsbee said:


> Keep us posted on how she does.
> 
> Went with the Caucasian, interesting traits. Will be neat to see the difference between my mutts and the Caucasian bees.


I would like some as well, but I want to wait until WSU has more pure stock. Right now they are at 80%, meaning if you are buying OM daughters from one of their breeders, those hives are 40%.


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## Scottsbee

Not sure what OM stands for? 

WSU, I was under the impression that the Caucasian bees were bred here in Oregon at Old sol. Though they did start up there, Sue Coby brought the genetics from the Caucas mtns. At least that's what the Old sol site says.


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## jcase

Scottsbee said:


> Not sure what OM stands for?
> 
> WSU, I was under the impression that the Caucasian bees were bred here in Oregon at Old sol. Though they did start up there, Sue Coby brought the genetics from the Caucas mtns. At least that's what the Old sol site says.


Their queens are bred in OR, but the breeders came from Sue @ WSU
OM = open mated

They used frozen germaplasm, and crossing with carnica to get the caucasians.
F1 Caucasian X carnica = 50% caucasian
F2 Cacuasian X (Caucasian X carnica) = 75% caucasian

and so on.

http://bees.wsu.edu/breeding-program/queens/


> 2017 Caucasian breeder queens – instrumentally inseminated. The 2017 Caucasian breeder queens will have greater than 80% genetic origin from Old World A. m. caucasica sources with the remaining genetic background sourced from US commercial Carniolan strains.


For those wanting some new genetics, they are probably a great addition. I want some, but I'm waiting for the 2018 II queens from WSU, assuming they are back crossing them with stored germaplasm again.

I do need to pick up a good number of NUCs next year, or perhaps packages, but if I go the NUC route ill go to old sol, and take whatever queens I can.


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## Scottsbee

Open mated, uh should of known! 

If that's the way it is then I'm kinda disappointed. Maybe I should ask for 60% of my money back since I only received 40% of what I paid for. Hmmmm. 

The Nuc was not what I was expecting and had a queen cage inside. Not planning on buying anymore Nucs, maybe some queens. 

Did Olympic apiary not have queens? Thinking of getting queens from them next year. 

Thank you for the info 
Scott


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## jcase

Scottsbee said:


> Open mated, uh should of known!
> 
> If that's the way it is then I'm kinda disappointed. Maybe I should ask for 60% of my money back since I only received 40% of what I paid for. Hmmmm.
> 
> The Nuc was not what I was expecting and had a queen cage inside. Not planning on buying anymore Nucs, maybe some queens.
> 
> Did Olympic apiary not have queens? Thinking of getting queens from them next year.
> 
> Thank you for the info
> Scott


You certainly got what they are selling, I'm sure. You can't expect a II queen for $40-60 bucks. Nothing available in the US is "pure", they are all crosses to some extend. I'm sure you got a 80% caucasian queen, mated with whatever was flying that day. I wouldn't dare ask for any % back, that is just mad.

Olympic Wilderness Apiary? They are good friends, they got me into bees. With the wet spring and the heavy smoke, they didn't have the best year. They are so picky about the queens they release, if they dont think they are mated just right then they dont sell them. I didn't want to take potential stock away from everyone that was waiting. Their queens are my favorite, I've used them for the foundation of my breeding stock. I wanted to bring in more queens from other lines to evaluate, to help diversify my own stock (since im doing instrumental insemination, and not OM, I wanted to ensure my genetics are as varied as I can get).

You wouldn't be disappointed in OWA queens. They have somewhat of a reputation for being "hot" but that dates back to their F1 russian cross from many years ago. They are on par with the rest of my queens for gentleness, and are far from hot. I cull "hot" queens, as I have a 6yr old who works bees with me, I've not culled any OWA related queens. Culled a bunch of Italians for that reason this year.++


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## Scottsbee

Totally a misunderstanding on my part. Just like you, we will see how they winter and build in the spring. Still learning about the genetics side of the beekeeping. 

joking about asking for the money back!


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## jcase

Scottsbee said:


> Totally a misunderstanding on my part. Just like you, we will see how they winter and build in the spring. Still learning about the genetics side of the beekeeping.
> 
> joking about asking for the money back!


ahh I missed the joke, it takes a bit for me to wake up.

OWA queens winter very well in the PNW, I had them in 9 frame medium boxes, singles last winter, and it was one crazy winter here. O and one of those frames was a feeder frame I left in because I didn't have enough comb. 100% came out alive, and are all still sitting in my pasture.


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## e-spice

I've been thinking about getting some queens from Old Sol next season. Can anyone comment about how gentle bees from survivor queens are?


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## jcase

e-spice said:


> I've been thinking about getting some queens from Old Sol next season. Can anyone comment about how gentle bees from survivor queens are?


Haven't had them all that long, but as of last inspection they should all be from that queen. Haven't noticed anything abnormally aggressive.


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## e-spice

jcase said:


> Haven't had them all that long, but as of last inspection they should all be from that queen. Haven't noticed anything abnormally aggressive.


Great - thanks for the info.


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## Scottsbee

E-spice
Old Sol bees is the only hive I work without gloves. Still wear a veil though. Happy so far. 

Scott


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## e-spice

Scottsbee said:


> E-spice
> Old Sol bees is the only hive I work without gloves. Still wear a veil though. Happy so far.
> 
> Scott


Good to hear. I appreciate the info.


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## Scottsbee

Update: Bees made it through winter great and built up strong this spring and swarmed! Ugh! 
They requeened successfuly and managed to still make a bit of honey for me. Definitely like to propilis everything.


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## e-spice

I received a few Old Sol queens this spring. I got both some Survivor queens and some Caucasians. I liked them both but liked the Survivors a little better. Both are good, gentle, productive, hardy bees. I ordered more Survivor queens for next spring.


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## ruthiesbees

Scottsbee said:


> Update: Bees made it through winter great ... Definitely like to propilis everything.


You must have gotten the Caucasian strain. I bought an "unlabeled" one last fall from them at a great price. She made it through winter in a 5 frame nuc and was installed in a 4' topbar hive this spring. Those bees have done great. I've pulled multiple combs of brood to make splits, etc. Even stole some honey and they have filled it all back up again. Good gentle bees (I don't use smoke at all, even full size hives, so they have to be gentle). Mite counts in late July were low. Haven't seen this colony propolize everything like the Caucasian queen I bought from New River Honey Bees this year, so my guess is I got one of his Survivior stock queens, and I'm very happy with it. Did a bit of queen rearing with the Old Sol queen this spring for nucs I sold, and plan to do more next spring with her.


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