# CNC router - making hive boxes?



## Alex Madsen (Aug 26, 2018)

Has anyone experimented with making their own hive boxes with a large format CNC router? I recently purchased a Maslow CNC router (https://www.maslowcnc.com/) and plan to experiment making my own boxes. Unfortunately they are no longer selling the kits. I would love advice on rabbit joint vs box joint and wood section. Due the radius of the tool box joint require a relief cut in the corners that will leave a small gap. I was surprised I could not find a CAD templates for Langstroth boxes so I am drawing that up now. 

Alex


----------



## Jim_in_PA (May 17, 2016)

I've done some NUCs from Advantec on my Camaster Stinger II 4x4 with no problem. Obviously, the joinery was incredibly precise due to the nature of the cutting method and that made the rabbit joints tighter. We don't generally build "boxes" because honestly, it's less expensive to buy knock-down from Mann Lake than it is to buy material in most cases, but I'd do these NUCs and so forth on my CNC again in a heartbeat.

Don't worry about finding pre-made designs...you can't get more simple than drawing things out for them in whatever design software you use (Vectric V-Carve Pro for me) and the tool paths are simple. Just remember to cut the rabbits first before you do your cutouts and depending on the material you are using, make your tabs thick enough to not crumble if you're using something like Advantec.


----------



## gcolbert (Nov 21, 2017)

I think using a CNC router to make simple rabbits is a bad case of 'thinking in the box.' It really opens up the capability of doing things that were so impractical without CNC that no one has thought about them. OK, you could carve your apiary name in the boxes, or even do an artistic carving of cool artwork on the boxes, but I'm sure there are some real practical new capabilities here. 

Cutting insets on the flat of each of the corners for a metal corner bracket to keep from damaging the woodwork when using a hive tool to loosen the boxes up? Insets on the front for magnets to magnetically attach robber screens? Cutting an inset for screen on the inside for a vent (thinking nuc boxes)? Some kind of flap doodah for OAV treatments? Slanted slot for inserting a strip of corrugated plastic sign as a rain awning over the entrance? These are all marginal or silly thoughts, but I'm sure there are things that can only be reasonably done on a CNC router that just have not been thought of yet.


----------



## Alex Madsen (Aug 26, 2018)

I love the idea of cutting inserts on the flat of each of the corners for a metal corner bracket. that also reduces the need for a box joint. 

Alex


----------



## My-smokepole (Apr 14, 2008)

I know their was a com company that did it that way. If I remember right. The corners of the finger where rounded. He bought by the pallet.


----------



## Tmac (Feb 18, 2018)

Hi Alex
Last winter I did my own boxes out of 7/8” cypress on the CNC. I did box joints and predrilled all of the corners for the clearance issues with a 5mm drill bit then did an offset route on the perimeter. Worked out very good. I used plenty of glue during assembly and the joints are air tite. I have the DXF files from autocad still. I did 8 frame mediums.


----------



## toddjensen (Aug 6, 2012)

Can you share your files. Great ideas!


----------



## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Note that is is possible to share .dxf files (or any other type of file) by putting them inside a .zip (compression or archive)
file and adding that as an attachment to any post. The "attach file" button is available after clicking "Go Advanced" in the default Message Editor that pops up when one clicks "Post Quick Reply". If anyone has difficulties attaching a file send me a PM.

Oh ... and the type of joints under discussion are 'rabbet' joints.  'Rabbit' is entirely something else.


----------



## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

If you had a horizontal spindle, (with the board flat), I could see using a CNC router, especially if it had two spindles.

Crazy Roland


----------



## Jim_in_PA (May 17, 2016)

Roland, CNC is best used for hive bodies made from sheet stock, such as Advantec, but it certainly can be used for solid stock, too, with some careful setup, albeit not as efficiently as with sheet goods. Joinery resulting is typically rabbet construction using CNC because few machines have the capability of holding material vertically for cutting through joinery like fingers or dovetails. "Horizontal" spindle is a very rare thing; generally that capability comes from with an uber-expensive 5-axis machine.


----------



## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Jim - or a person with good dumpster diving skills, a big stack of 80-20, some THK linear rails, and some big dreams. So far it is just a pile of parts, but most of the custom parts are made. Dual spindles good for 10K are finished. I need mount motors and figure out what the carriage should look like.

Crazy Roland


----------



## Jim_in_PA (May 17, 2016)

Sounds like a good plan, Roland...and you cannot beat "finding" good materials like that. The controller system you choose will have a significant impact on how well your machine operates, to choose carefully.


----------



## toddjensen (Aug 6, 2012)

Tmac said:


> Hi Alex
> Last winter I did my own boxes out of 7/8” cypress on the CNC. I did box joints and predrilled all of the corners for the clearance issues with a 5mm drill bit then did an offset route on the perimeter. Worked out very good. I used plenty of glue during assembly and the joints are air tite. I have the DXF files from autocad still. I did 8 frame mediums.


Have you been able to figure out how to share the DXF files?


----------



## aran (May 20, 2015)

i had bought an I box for my table saw to be able to make perfect finger joints and it does just that. Problem is that its so cheap to buy assembled or unassembled boxes en mass that its not cost effective for me to make my own boxes anymore.
I just bought a bunch of deeps for <$15 delivered. I can get them for $15 even assembled locally and cheaper in bulk.


----------



## Alex Madsen (Aug 26, 2018)

aran said:


> i had bought an I box for my table saw to be able to make perfect finger joints and it does just that. Problem is that its so cheap to buy assembled or unassembled boxes en mass that its not cost effective for me to make my own boxes anymore.
> I just bought a bunch of deeps for <$15 delivered. I can get them for $15 even assembled locally and cheaper in bulk.


I found the same problem. My CNC slated racks were a fun project, but they did not save me a dime. My router is relegated to fun tinkering projects.


----------



## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Jim - yes, the drives will be important. I am/was familiar with Virtual Gibbs, a CAM program that can use .dxf or .dwg files from Autocad. I understand Gecko is one route. National Instruments Labview looks interesting. 

It is true that current woodware is hard to compete with pricewise, however if you want woodenware as Root made it, with finer grained Eastern White Pine, proper hand hold heights, "P" metal frame rests, old style number of box joints, and frames with 3/8" bottom bars, you must make them yourself.

Crazy Roland


----------



## Jim_in_PA (May 17, 2016)

Roland, it may be a good idea to try and use a more mainstream CAD/CAM application for your design and toolpathing work...Vectric, Fusion360, etc. The latter is from Autocad and is free for personal use and for small business/startups with revenue under $100K. I use Vectric software because that's what my CNC manufacturer supplies with the machine. But that's not the controller software I was referring to. The controller software is what actually drives the machine...WinCNC, Mach4, Acorn Centroid etc.


----------



## Alex Madsen (Aug 26, 2018)

for a free CAM/CAD/Modeling program, Fusion360 is amazing. It is no SolidWorks or Master CAM, but it is free and does everything most hobbyists would need.


----------



## Jim_in_PA (May 17, 2016)

Alex, Fusion360 goes well beyond just the hobbyist market in both capability and "who is using it". But yes, it's not quite as complete as the super high end packages you mention.


----------



## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Jim, Virtual Gibbs, is actually one of the mainstream CAM programs for metal working machine tools. Mastercam is it's rival.

Crazy Roland


----------



## Jim_in_PA (May 17, 2016)

Sorry, I'm not familiar with the metal working world so those names were equally unfamiliar.  I do get involved with a little aluminum, but my work is focused on wood, composites, plastics and HDU. (sign foam)


----------



## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

No worries. Gibbs is well developed. You can draw in Gibbs, or import a .dwg or .dxf file. I have never tried a .sld file, but I believe it does accept it. One nice feature is that you can see the part being "virtual" machined. Another highlight is that on some machine tools, it can be resident on the machine, and all work can be done on the machine, no network or "floppys" needed.

Crazy Roland


----------



## Alex Madsen (Aug 26, 2018)

You dont want to use stl files with a router. Stl is a 3d format. It breaks down of 2d work.


----------



## Jim_in_PA (May 17, 2016)

Alex Madsen said:


> You dont want to use stl files with a router. Stl is a 3d format. It breaks down of 2d work.


STLs are fine with a CNC router if you want to cut "3D" projects...I made a few grand this year doing just that for an architectural client this year already...but I absolutely agree with you that for bee-hive related CNC machining, 2D vectors are pretty much what are required for most CNC routers that would be used for this purpose.


----------

