# "Don't buy trucks, forklifts or equipment; buy more bees. and boxes."



## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

I started on a shoestring. Worked off my extracting bill with a commercial neighbor. Ran 300 non migratory colonies with an Armstrong loader onto a 1968 cornbinder ton truck with no duals. It was all paid for when I had to sell out and I had built it in under eight years. Not everyone is fortunate enough to be well financed and a lot of YAGOTTAWANNA makes the difference.


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

Vance, I started on a shoestring as well,
I think that is a really good way to begin.
Grow your outfit with no debt and at a pace that allows one to learn as you go.

Thousands of hives on a shoestring?

If you were in Salem Oregon I could show you several properties that have mountains of dead-outs from good people that have tried that.
Sorry to say.


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

HarryVanderpool;1442666
Growing your operation slowly said:


> Very well said, Harry


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## Bkwoodsbees (Feb 8, 2014)

Very well said Harry. Datsun pick up? Haven't seen one of them in years.


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## Pinchecharlie (May 14, 2014)

If you had all the money for all the gear and equipment, you wouldn't need to keep bees, you'd already be rich. I want to know how you can even find land enough for a thousand hives. I'd like to have 60 and even that's hard here. My friend said,"buy it at auction and get a good deal cause that guy went under. Then you can give someone a good deal when you do." It's kindov a sad state of affairs if you ask me. I must be doing something really wronge not to be able to buy a 70k truck!? mean while addee lost 50,000 hives last winter. How can you recover from that? I dunno? Slow and steady wins the race ? Shoestrings would be nice, I haven't had those in awhile.


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Build the bees, buy the Equipmemt
Bees die, equipment holds value, borrow on the assets that can't disappear


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## Broke-T (Jul 9, 2008)

In the last 10 years we have gone from a dozen hives to 650 currently. It is a big investment. We raised all the bees and bought equipment to put them in. We were lucky that we were already farming and had a lot of machinery we could share between operations. As you grow there are times you must buy bigger than you need if you plan to keep growing. We have borrowed no money to build the bee operation. It would be very hard to do this if we weren't already farming.

Johnny


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## RichardsonTX (Jul 3, 2011)

"In the business world, the rearview mirror is always clearer than the windshield." Quote by Warren Buffett.


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

RichardsonTX said:


> "In the business world, the rearview mirror is always clearer than the windshield." Quote by Warren Buffett.


Good quote.
I suppose that one of the most valuable aspects of BeeSource is our ability to report what we see in the rear view mirror to those that are just starting down the road.
Also, in beekeeping and business, there are many different roads one can take.


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## EastSideBuzz (Apr 12, 2009)

HarryVanderpool said:


> Oh, and keep your day job as long as possible to hedge the funding.


Very important line.

I fund my hobby from my tech job. Daughter in Catholic school, college looming and a mortgage payment. Beekeeping will never pay for that. I run 2-300 hives and pollinate several fruits pays for the operation. The build up and expansion is excess day job money.


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## ApricotApiaries (Sep 21, 2014)

'79 Datsun pickup with flatbed and stake pockets and about 100 supers ready to paint. 

soooo...
I fully agree that bees are what makes the revenue so spend money on that. However, I also FULLY agree with Harry that certain capitol investments are needed in order to properly care for your bees. 
Don't get me wrong. I love my Datsun truck. It worked fantastic as our only bee truck up to about 60 hives. To feed we would mix as many 5 gallon buckets as would fit in the back, go out and work until they were empty then come home to mix more. Yard size was limited to 11 hives because that is what fit on the bed. But we knew we were going to grow, and a good deal on an F450 came our way so we jumped on it. I absolutely do not regret it. We now are just shy of 200 hives. There is no way we could have made that growth out of the back of our Datsun and maintained any semblance of sanity. I also think we are able to be better beekeepers for the investment. 
Shortly thereafter I found an outstanding deal on an old Bobcat forklift (older than my Datsun). My wife was pregnant at the time. I was previously borrowing a forklift from a guy an hour away, or borrowing a bulky Kubota farm tractor/loader with pallet forks that could barely maneuver in some locations. Or hand loading. Our son was born in October, there was absolutely no way I could ask Liz to help hand load bees. Driving to pickup the lift I was borrowing was more time away from the family. Needless to say, I am very happy with the purchase. I was still borrowing a trailer from a friend, but that was much closer to home. Recently I found a good deal on a trailer sprung for it. 
The bottom line is that taking good care of an increasing number of bees means getting around to them in a timely manner. It means being able to carry enough feed and enough equipment to keep you busy all day. It means being able to move bees in and out of new pastures or pollination contracts in a timely and effective manner. It means having the extracting and storage space so you can pull your crop and get around to your mite treatments in a timely manner. But that's just my sophomoric opinion. 
Overall, the beekeeping community is very supportive, or at least has been with us. There is a lot of collaborative effort, but in many situations, independence is better. An example of this is the forklift I used to borrow. Because I was borrowing from another beekeeper, Chances are that if I needed to move bees out of apples, he also needed to be moving out of apples. 

Now we are in the next phase of needing to match our investments with our scale. A shop. It is really hard to think about the expense, but very easy to see the benefits and again buying ahead does make a lot of sense (isn't that what beekeeping is all about? Being pro-active not reactive?). Right now, I build equipment at home in a one walled carport. It is very cold in the winter when I need it most. I store equipment in a neighbors shed. It is open on one side so I have to put truck nets over everything to keep the bees from robbing on it. I am outgrowing this shed. I am extracting honey this year in a different neighbors garage. I paint in yet another neighbors building (that's why the Datsun has 100 unpainted supers on it) so I can get out of the weather. It all works but none of it works well.


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## johnbeejohn (Jun 30, 2013)

Man ur neighbors must really like you or ur honey hahah


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## RichardsonTX (Jul 3, 2011)

I use to work for an older guy, until he retired, who *every* time he came to the facility I managed for him told me he wanted, "consistent, steady growth", not big leaps. Sound advice. He also taught me the importance of having viable short-term and long-term plans on paper that were based on sound knowledge and experience, not fantasy. I've found out that those principals are valuable even in my personal life.


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## DirtyLittleSecret (Sep 10, 2014)

Harry-
Funny, this is exactly the conclusion I've come to over the past year and invested strategically for 2 year in advance (keeping it in the black and its paying for itself for the most part). Its also helping me commit to making those decisions more seriously which changes how one manages the yard, friends, fellow beeks and customers. BTW: would love to come see your apiary sometime as Im frequently in Salem.


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

DirtyLittleSecret said:


> Harry- BTW: would love to come see your apiary sometime as Im frequently in Salem.


But then I would have to give up all of my dirty little secrets!!!


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

Yeah, I want to see how many strapping tools Harry got.


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

Keith Jarrett said:


> Yeah, I want to see how many strapping tools Harry got.


That would be "has".

I want to see how many strapping tools Harry _HAS_

Now get back under that bus, Keith!!!


Keith >------> :bus


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## Woodside (Aug 10, 2010)

I used to run 700 hives with an old 1/2 ton and flatbed ball hitch trailor... I just rented out extraction and rented a forklift when i needed it... If you can come back with more than 700 hives the following year, then its time to buy equipment


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