# Queen prices



## louborges (May 16, 2009)

I'm starting to look at placing an order for a half dozen queens for April and it looks like prices are going up. Has anyone notices this? I think they are about $25 on average.


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## Broke-T (Jul 9, 2008)

They are like coffee. My grandfather said that coffee would never cost what it was worth. Good queens are worth a lot.

It may have something to do with SHB in Hawaii.

I am starting to raise some for sale this spring, so they probably will drop to nothing.

Johnny


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## KevinR (Apr 30, 2010)

IMHO Queen prices aren't too bad 20 bucks for the amount of work required to make them.

Now for someone with 9k hives, I can see this being an issue. However, you should be making your own. Or have enough profit to pay for them.

For the hobbyist, I think the 20 dollars is pretty reasonable. Assuming you get a known good laying queen.

I'm going to try my hand at raising them this year, but I'm going to buy a few random queens for something to start with/judge against.

As for prices. I've seen from 15-35 per. More for breeders.

Broke-t... Pick me out a nice fat, egg laying machine when I place my order. *grins*


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## Buffalolick (Jan 26, 2010)

Lol! Johnny. I know what you mean.


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## louborges (May 16, 2009)

I guess what I was trying to get at is if prices are going up, is it due to increased demand ? I read that there is a ban on importing queen bees and packages from Australia.


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## fat/beeman (Aug 23, 2002)

ya;all right prices are going up,for my self I have stayed same price for yrs.no plans to raise prices. got my customer

base now.
Don


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## Monk (Jun 15, 2005)

and good queens


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

I would say around $20 plus shipping is norm. Maybe $15 for Georgia Italians. 

Mike


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## MARBIS (Jun 10, 2010)

Arround here $20 - $30 average from reputable breeders, italians beeing ~$20, carnies ~$25, and buckfast ~$30. If queen is a good layer, she can't be expensive. IMO


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## Specialkayme (Sep 4, 2005)

I've talked with local queen producers every season for the past couple years. Each winter they talk about how many queens they'll have extra, how they are going to be able to fill all the orders, and so on. Each spring I'll call them up looking for an extra queen (emergency or last minute split) and they are all out. Every one of them. They all tell me it'll be three weeks at best before they can get me even one queen. So much for all the extras.

It's a seller's market for queens. The more queens a breeder can make, the more they sell. End of story. Demand goes up and supply stays the same, in the end economics calls that a shortage. Shortage = price goes up.

But hey, I've learned my lesson. Five years ago a queen was $10-15 (and you could get it on the spot). Today queens are $20-30 (and you need to order 6 months in advance). This means this season I'll be making my own queens, and keeping a half dozen nucs on hand for requeening and emergency cases.


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## rrussell6870 (May 14, 2009)

louborges said:


> I guess what I was trying to get at is if prices are going up, is it due to increased demand ? I read that there is a ban on importing queen bees and packages from Australia.


Yes, that has a lot to do with it. HI has been shut out this season, Australia too, then you take in account the effect that SHB has not only on raising the demand, but also on the mating nucs, and the southern breeders... 

Basically, breeders have never been able to raise more than they can sell, and that was with HI, Australia, and all of the other places that "piggy back" through Australia... 

More expense, 3 times the demand, and lots of investments into new technology and stock... Last year our packages were 46-48... this year 70-90... and we didnt make any extra from the increase, it levels out as always. Of course, last year we made 9,700 packages, and this year only 5,200... SHB forces you to change your operation a bit... what you would normally sell, you decide to hold on to in case You need it... that also drives up costs, as the queens and bees become more valuable to the producers themselves.

Hope this helps!


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## Broke-T (Jul 9, 2008)

Anothere problem is age. Most queen breeders in MS are 60 + years old and no one to take over business. Robert is one of the few to take up family business. As producers get older they cut back or quit. Who will take their place?

Johnny


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## rrussell6870 (May 14, 2009)

Very true. It seems that there are many Great breeders that are backing out, and those that are in line to replace them are starting from scratch and will take many, many years of trial and error before they truly learn the "dos and donts"... not to mention accumulating enough stock and equipment to provide enough queens to make a dent in the demand.

Many people seem to be turning towards these new graftless systems, which will certainly slow their productivity... also many are turning towards II as the equipment becomes more affordable, which is far too slow and costly to provide for the majority of the demand...

As producers leave the industry, it seems that more slow and expensive operations will be entering... this will create a huge supply/demand issue for our near future... causing more to start producing their own queens... causing more inbreeding and lowering production averages... causing higher prices on honey, wax, nucs, packages, and of course Queens...

Its seems to be a downward cycle for the industry... this is the reason that I am hoping to steer the next generation of breeders in the right direction for large production, grafting, and genetic selection for diversity.


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## Specialkayme (Sep 4, 2005)

And being in that next generation, I'm very appreciative of your help and your work.

When is your book supposed to be finished? :lol:


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## KQ6AR (May 13, 2008)

I heard, "good luck finding queens under $18 this year"


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## Specialkayme (Sep 4, 2005)

Sure you can find them. But they won't be worth it.


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## Bodhi (Aug 30, 2009)

Would they be worth it if one could get cheap queens to make early season splits and then requeen 3-6 weeks later when the local queens became available? 

It's something I've heard mentioned and I wonder if it's a good decision.


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## rrussell6870 (May 14, 2009)

Not really... you will end up spending more that way. There are plenty of good northern queens that are raised in the south for early production. I would say check around first and when ordering local queens be sure that they are not from the same lineages that you have already.


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## Velbert (Mar 19, 2006)

Was looking for some Midnight Queens 



The Midnight hybrid is a combination of both the Caucasian and Carniolan races.


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## rrussell6870 (May 14, 2009)

I have them... Both first and second gen midnights... when ordering them, just order our caucasians and be sure to Say "1st or 2nd Gen Midnights" in the special instructions... extremely gentle bees... I have also crossed primorsky and pure VSH with the 1st gen... stout offspring.


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## Specialkayme (Sep 4, 2005)

Bodhi said:


> Would they be worth it if one could get cheap queens to make early season splits and then requeen 3-6 weeks later when the local queens became available?
> .


Listen to Russell. Too expensive. I'm not interested in paying $15 for a queen that I use for 3-6 weeks then moving with a $25 queen after that. The queens just cost $40.


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## Beewrangler (Feb 20, 2010)

rrussell6870 said:


> Its seems to be a downward cycle for the industry... this is the reason that I am hoping to steer the next generation of breeders in the right direction for large production, grafting, and genetic selection for diversity.


Have you considered teaching a class or two or three that would cover this? If the price was right I would seriously consider a trip to MS for the queen breeding class.


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## rrussell6870 (May 14, 2009)

We have student workers each year that earn experience, an income (although its a small one), and while they are working with us...we are working with them to build their own apiaries so that by the time they have the experience to operate in a commercial market...they have the bees and equipment to do so.

My operation (and my 3 kids..LOL) keeps me tied down, but next winter I will be traveling to speak at several associations and clubs. We had discussed creating a few courses, but as you may have noticed, I can be somewhat long-winded. lol. So I fear that the courses would be too long for anyone other than the extremely serious. 

I also feel that after theory and mechanics have been learned, "hands-on" is the only way to truly make sure that your students are ready to use what they have learned in their own operations. So we are talking about a pretty long course... I will inform everyone on the forums if we decide to offer it.

Also, I have been adding these subjects to the forums on my site and adding to them as I have time.


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## kilocharlie (Dec 27, 2010)

Has anyone seen a price on Russian queens? I'm looking to get on a waiting list for Russians and / or VSH queens, and appreciate leads, too. Thanks, KC.


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## KevinR (Apr 30, 2010)

**Has anyone seen a price on Russian queens? I'm looking to get on a waiting list for Russians and / or VSH queens, and appreciate leads, too. Thanks, KC.

~$23 per on the ones I bought.


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## Velbert (Mar 19, 2006)

I hope rising Queen prices don't end up like the end product of rising gas prices it seem like the higher gas prices went the worst gas mileage my little pickup gets. Or like the postal service the higher price shipping got, it seem the longer it took to get your packages.

http://vlwbeequeens.webs.com trying this web builder to see if you might like it better


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## camero7 (Sep 21, 2009)

Nice site Velbert!


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## Velbert (Mar 19, 2006)

why Thank you

Was doing some remembering back in1970 had a friend in Blythe his dad had a bunch of Hives and i remember him telling me
They fum gated the honey house used some kind of sulfur burning type of application 

And the 200 queens they the had received to make splits or requeen was for gotten and got killed they cost around $2.50 to $3.00 each queen 
they had 10 frame deep splits with laying queen for $20.00 Each 

So at todays price of queen at $20.00 to $30.00 Each this would make a 10 frame Deep Split with laying Queen. costing $160.00-$300.00 This is compared $2.50 Queen 10 frame deep Split at $20.00 1970 prices


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## JBJ (Jan 27, 2005)

http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl

I have read references in bee literature about queens prices in the $7.50 price range in 1975. Price adjusted for inflation that would be over $30 bucks a queen in today's economic terms. Seems like few are actually keeping up with inflation and by most accounts beekeeping was a bit easier in the 70's. 

The price of a queen can be driven by many things. Consider the costs of production; labor, feed, fuel, supplies, etc. However this is only part of the equation. Also consider that there are no real substitutes for a good queen. I would bet the demand curve for queens is relatively inelastic, meaning they will still sell well despite higher prices as long as the quality remains decent. 

In our operation each queen has become VERY important to us and I do not want to part her unless it is really worth it. There is so much intrinsic value in a good queen, one would almost have to be nuts to part with her or have way more bees honey and wax than one knows what to do with, which very rarely can be the case.


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## Countryboy (Feb 15, 2009)

_I would bet the demand curve for queens is relatively inelastic, meaning they will still sell well despite higher prices as long as the quality remains decent._

As hard as it is to get early queens, I would bet they would still sell good regardless of quality, and in spite of higher prices.

Just out of curiousity - when was the last time anyone heard of a queen producer throwing away unsold queens at the end of a season?


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## Birdman (May 8, 2009)

Beewrangler said:


> Have you considered teaching a class or two or three that would cover this? If the price was right I would seriously consider a trip to MS for the queen breeding class.


Purdue university has a 3 day course.


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## rrussell6870 (May 14, 2009)

Trouble with that is, three days wouldn't even cover the basics. Again, I feel that its the poor instruction that causes such poor results amongst queens... most are simply taught how to make a hive draw cells... but the most important lessons should be in selection, record keeping, drone production, and diversity.


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## Specialkayme (Sep 4, 2005)

And genetics. I've got alot to learn about genetic selection and cross-breeding.


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## rrussell6870 (May 14, 2009)

Great point... start by learning all you can about the bee breeds... then dig deeper into the regions where they come from, how they differ and why... study the "cause and effects" of their history. This will give you the insight to know how climactic, agricultural, predation, and urban development can cause stresses that alter the course of the noticeable traits of a strain... and in turn you will learn what strains can be used and how they should be implemented to create the best bees for each of our industries many environments....

Warning!!! There is no exit from this rabbit hole! Once you fall in... you will be forever lost in the wonderland of the bee kingdom. 

The roller coaster will have many "ups" and many "downs", but all you have to do is just stay on the ride... which of course is much harder than jumping while its at its lowest point... but its the only way to reach the reward at the end.


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## Specialkayme (Sep 4, 2005)

Funny you should mention that Russell. As I type this "In Search of the Best Strain of Bee" by Brother Adam is sitting on my coffee table with a bookmark in it. Lol, I was doing exactly what you suggested two hours before I saw your comment.

But from there, I need to understand HOW to select for certain traits. I'm sure it's covered more in depth in Brother Adam's third book . . . 

Who ever said there was anything wrong with going further down the rabbit hole? I'd always choose the red pill.


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