# Queen mating



## AndrewSchwab (Dec 9, 2005)

So how cold of temp have people seen a queen be mated? I asked because for some reason 1 hive decided to dump there queen and raise a few new ones. The temps are only getting into the mid 50's during the day. To make matters worse there are not alot of drones out yet either. 

Hoping that at least one of the queens will be mated to tie hive over until new queens come in the mail.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Flying weather for a queen to mate is at least 50 F and that's pretty iffy. You also have to have drones.


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## Hook (Jun 2, 2002)

Well I don't know how your climate runs, but in PA, I think it is way to early. My bees have flown, but there is not a whole lot out there to gather. I saw them bringing in pollen, probably from pussy willow trees, but thats about it. I usually wait until the dandilion flow starts. By the time the queen is ready to mate, there are more than enough drones.


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## tarheit (Mar 26, 2003)

Everything I've read indicates it needs to be 68-69 degrees for mating queens. I suppose they might fly when it's a bit cooler, but it would have to be very calm and sunny.

You may have some luck though, if they are just cells now they have some time before they hatch, then the queen can wait several weeks before the weather breaks before mating. They only need a day or two of good flying weather.

-Tim


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

>>>>then the queen can wait several weeks before the weather breaks before mating. They only need a day or two of good flying weather.<<<<

Not to flame you Tim, but are you sure about that?
I have asked about the length of time a virgin can be confined due to bad weather and have been told that after 2 weeks; its over.
She'll start gaining weight and shooting blanks.
We need to confirm the "right" answer on this.
It's important.
Thanx!


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## Dick Allen (Sep 4, 2004)

FWIW, Mark Winston writes in his 'Biology of the Honey Bee':

"Queens can postpone mating flights for up to 4 weeks after their emergence if weather conditions do not permit flight, but beyond that time they begin to degenerate and lay drone eggs."

Winston also writes the desirable weather conditions for mating flight include temperature above 20º C, little cloud cover, and winds less than 20-28 km/hr.


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## Dick Allen (Sep 4, 2004)

....but then Ronald Ribbands ('The Behaviour and Social Life of Honeybees') writes that Huber in 1792 noted virgins which mated when they were over 21 days old became drone-layers.

[ March 24, 2006, 01:00 AM: Message edited by: Dick Allen ]


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## Finman (Nov 5, 2004)

There is no clear line or upp to point. Difficulties start from 3 weeks old and become bigger.

After one month possibilities are very bad. In some point queen starts to lay eggs.

There are situations too, that some queens do mating flight if tempereture is 18-20C and most do not.


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

wouldn't all this depend on what temps drone's fly, I'm sure queens will not fly without drones being in the air, it would be a waste of energy and time.... so what temps have any of you seen drone's fly?????


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

let me rephrase that, queens might fly without drones in the air, think this happened to me this year, had a vergin queen hatch before any of my hives had any drones.

[ March 24, 2006, 09:27 AM: Message edited by: TwT ]


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

"In my Journal, I find a detail of many experiments on the retarded impregnation of queen bees, so many, that transcribing the whole would tedious. I may repeat, however, that there was not the least variation in the principle, and that whenever the copulation of queens was postponed beyond the twenty-first day, the eggs of males only were produced." --François Huber 1789

Details of his experiments follow this statment in "New Observations on the Natural History of Bees"

http://www.bushfarms.com/huber.htm


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## JBJ (Jan 27, 2005)

I have read somewhere that queens not mated after 3 or 4 weeks will become drone layers also. Interestingly, the researchers in this study found that such drone layers still could be instrumentally inseminated after this has occurred and subsequently produce workers. I have successfully mated a large number of queens and the weather was only in the mid to upper 50s. Drones were also plentiful and dark at this time.
JBJ


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## tarheit (Mar 26, 2003)

Of course research has also shown that queens instrumentially inseminated that late won't be as good as those inseminated at the normal time frame.

The exact number may vary a bit, but the general concensus seems to be 3 weeks/21 days in everything I've read. I don't have my queen rearing books handy but I'm sure they say the same and others have quoted some of the other sources.

-Tim


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## JBJ (Jan 27, 2005)

Nothing beats a properly mated queen for sure. I just found it fascinating that it could even be done after haploid egg laying had initiated. Must have been a wild hair to provoke that experiment.
JBJ


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## Finman (Nov 5, 2004)

To Twt

Queens fly often before mating flight from it's nest. You see when you throw queen to air and it returns quickly to it's entrance hole.


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## Nick Noyes (Apr 28, 2005)

Andrew ask your dad he would have the answer to this question.


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## AndrewSchwab (Dec 9, 2005)

Nope he was there when it was discovered. Promptly looked at me and ask "What the hell I did to cause this."

Don't you have bees to go feed.


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## wayacoyote (Nov 3, 2003)

A guy in PA told me he's had them breed as cool as 54 degrees.

waya


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