# Losing lots of hives this fall



## benstung (Mar 20, 2011)

We seem to be losing a lot of hives. some yards fell apart in a matter of 10 days. 
any one else seeing this?
top deep plugged with honey and a fist full of bee's
clean bottom board

bad year for mites but seems like there is more to it.

old queens is one thing but jeez all these failing new queens is scary


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

benstung said:


> bad year for mites but seems like there is more to it.


Ben, sounds like V mites. When was the last time you treated? hope things work out.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Benstung: I don't like the sound of that. Our bees seem to be holding up really well. Did all of your bees get a brood break this spring? I have been concerned about this year being bad for varroa because of how early things were but so far that hasn't been the case for us. Has this problem been in just select yards or have you been seeing it across the board?


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## benstung (Mar 20, 2011)

treated spring with formic but a low dosage. same formic treatment few days after honey was pulled. it was killing lots of mites, i checked.

most hives got a break in the brood cycle, one load was neglected.

some yards have a few blank spots and others are 50% loss.

i am looking at some frames from banged out hives today and it looks like we have foul brood. and mites


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## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

Not an operation on a scale of yours, I'm sure but...in June I noted that 30+% of the drone brood I uncapped had mites and a substantial number of those were multi-foundress infestations. The numbers were so much higher than I normally see at that time, that I did a midsummer round with hopguard. I blamed the high levels with a lack of brood break during the winter.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

benstung said:


> treated spring with formic but a low dosage. same formic treatment few days after honey was pulled. it was killing lots of mites, i checked.
> 
> most hives got a break in the brood cycle, one load was neglected.
> 
> ...


Was the "neglected" load worse? The queen loss thing is puzzling since I felt there were some ideal mating conditions down south this year. We haven't seen the usual attrition that I would blame on poor matings.


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## benstung (Mar 20, 2011)

Yes it seems that the bee's that were split with a mated queen as well as the old queens are worse off. (but they made alot of honey)
yards today were much better but still think its a bad year for mites.

the fact that they started the summer with a higher mite count even if it was only %3 was the difference. but im sure it was the same last year and the bee's looked alot better???????


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

benstung said:


> same formic treatment few days after honey was pulled. it was killing lots of mites, i checked.


 Formic can give inconsistant results from one hive to another. If it was killing lots of mites, (there were lots available to be killed), then it's highly likely there'll be a percentage of hives still with decent mite numbers at end of treatment.


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## Brian Suchan (Apr 6, 2005)

ttt 
anything more to it than just mites????


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## benstung (Mar 20, 2011)

i think in my case its all mite problems


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## jean-marc (Jan 13, 2005)

I would have to agree with you benstung, especially when you started out a 3% varroa in the spring. I think that is just below the treatment threshold for western Canada. Looks like you werew sounding the alarm bell in late september, so that would have been another round of brood and mites past when the guys are treating here. This would explain your situation.

I do not understand how come you would start pulling honey in the end of september? I thought honey flows ended early in texas. Any golden rod there or asters?

Personally I like to get our work done as soon as possible to avoid these kinds of unpleasant surprises. That way if there is trouble the bees might have a small opportunity to recover.

Jean-Marc


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## LSPender (Nov 16, 2004)

APP, Accute Pesticide Poising!

Dought bring grasshoppers, brings spray rigs from state spraying growth regulators.

APP!


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## benstung (Mar 20, 2011)

jean-marc said:


> I would have to agree with you benstung, especially when you started out a 3% varroa in the spring. I think that is just below the treatment threshold for western Canada. Looks like you werew sounding the alarm bell in late september, so that would have been another round of brood and mites past when the guys are treating here. This would explain your situation.
> 
> I do not understand how come you would start pulling honey in the end of september? I thought honey flows ended early in texas. Any golden rod there or asters?
> 
> ...


We only winter in TX
Actually we make honey in MN and pull honey in Aug. the hives were all treated with formic with in one week of honey being pulled. Bee's looked good still when we went back to treat. (looked good) they were so infested with mites that the formic couldnt kill enough with one treatment.
and before you know it, poof the hive is gone.
not so sure MAQS can cut it financially and time wise on a year with high mite loads.


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## soupcan (Jan 2, 2005)

Lots of callers talk of 50% and up loss already.
Seems this deal is 6 weeks ahead of time so to speak.
Anyone else??


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## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

Well I can recall some months back at the beginning of the season, everybody saying wow, what a mild winter we had, what great survival I got.

Then others came along and were saying lookout, good winters make a lot of mites, get ready!

As per usual, the increasing hive population in spring masks mite damage, then in fall you get crunch time.

Be interesting to see results of those who took an extra proactive approach to mites this year, in theory anyway, they should still be OK or at least be doing better.


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## Tim Stewart (Jul 19, 2009)

Your not the only one in that boat benstung. My bees dropped back in the past 2.5 weeks, were 2-3 boxes of bees, now some are down to 2 frames while most are 6-12. Looking for a way to get them south in December to get them going again. Dave Hackenberg says there have been many of the same report lately. Treated for mites with Apiguard, lower does, but it did a good job, mid July. They were brooding exceptionally well into the first week of september, but now there is little capped brood, a lot of PMS and I am dry feeding pollen sub (lots of beetles) and they are picking up the brood rearing again, don't want to treat the decent ones for fear of hurting them, but the ones that are really bad I want to treat so the viruses don't get spread around when they finish collapsing.

Tim


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

Oldtimer said:


> Then others came along and were saying lookout, good winters make a lot of mites, get ready!
> Be interesting to see results of those who took an extra proactive approach to mites this year, in theory anyway, they should still be OK or at least be doing better.


Very well said OT. The same can be said about sub feeding on dry years, not that I would know or anything.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Oldtimer said:


> Well I can recall some months back at the beginning of the season, everybody saying wow, what a mild winter we had, what great survival I got.
> 
> Then others came along and were saying lookout, good winters make a lot of mites, get ready!
> 
> ...


My best guess is that the Oldtimer is pretty much on the mark here. Most everyone's bees were way ahead of the calendar this year, add in the additional stress of a hot dry summer with little to forage on through August and September and it isn't real surprising to hear some are seeing bees in early decline. I have heard a few bad reports as well. We did our usual spring "restart" and are seeing pretty low mite numbers though cluster sizes are down slightly from last year but surprisingly good considering the conditions here this summer.


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