# my first graft for myself



## onlygoodSHBisdeadone (Sep 10, 2005)

If they were humming they don't have a queen.


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## Kris^ (Jan 10, 2006)

Ah, OK. When I opened my cell starter that I'd closed up last night, it was noisy as all heck. Normal, then.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>If they were humming they don't have a queen. 

I'd say queenless varies from a bit of a "roar" to a dissonant "keening". Humming they do all the time. Normal conditions it's a harmonious sounding humming.


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## onlygoodSHBisdeadone (Sep 10, 2005)

MB agreed. By his statement >humming load< I'm assuming >roar<. I should have been more spacific.


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

when is the best time to be able (time wise) to inspect and see if any of the grafts took? other words, when can I do my first inspection on the queen cells if any are there?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>MB agreed

Yes, I'm just trying to differntiate the normal harmonious hum from a queenless dissonant hum.


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## tecumseh (Apr 26, 2005)

twt ask:
when is the best time to be able (time wise) to inspect and see if any of the grafts took?

tecumseh suggest:
well there certainly is no rule, but I generally look in formally 2 days later. I have taken a peak after 1 day, although the started cell are a bit more difficult to distinquish.


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

thanks tecumseh didn't think I was going to get a answer, isn't it a rule not to turn the cell cup upside down? if anyone has any rule of not to do with handling queen cells post them please, Im just want to see what else I can learn... Thanks again...


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## honeyman46408 (Feb 14, 2003)

"" isn't it a rule not to turn the cell cup upside down?""

YES


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I thought queen cells were always upside down.


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## honeyman46408 (Feb 14, 2003)




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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

well, to a peak today to see if any took on my first try and looks 18 out of 30 took, might be 1 more or less because I just took a quick looks and count, they almost have the whole cells drawn out, shoot and I was hoping to get about 7 or 8 and now I have to build more equipment so I don't waste any queens cells, I didn't know they would draw out a cell this fast, this is the only the 3rd day since I grafted.... might be a start to a beautiful career.... now I hope I get that many capped.... what is the odd's of not all drawn out cell's making it to be capped?

[ April 01, 2006, 03:26 PM: Message edited by: TwT ]


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

I think I know where I might have messed up though, I have heard people say they fill the nuc starter hive with nurse bee's and I only shook about 6 full frames in the hive, It look like more than enough bee's but after a couple days, it might not have been enough, I know the forager bee's will return to the old hive but maybe I had enough and just some didn't take, I didn't roll any larva and the larva I grafted was in royal jelly already.


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

Ill post a pic in a few days as soon as they are capped........ I fell like a new daddy ....


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## power napper (Apr 2, 2005)

TWT--are you passin out cigars?
Congrats on the success so far!


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

no cigars, but I fell good with that number for my first time, and I want to Thank FatBeeMan for showing me how to do this, I grafted 10 cells at his place the other week and it was kinda cool that day and he was just teaching me, don't know if any of them cells took but this was the second time I grafted but first time for myself and I did it all alone. He must be a good teacher because I feel good with those results....


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

are those results or odds good for a first timer??????


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

ANY cells are good for your first try. I didn't get any my first try. But that was because I didn't put enough bees in the cell starter.


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

thats what I was thinking MB, if only I would have put 10 frames of bee's in the starter I might have done better but who know's, I think thats where i messed up!!!!!


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## wayacoyote (Nov 3, 2003)

Ted,
Have you looked into the Cloake board method or Floor Without a Floor for getting cells started and finished?

Waya


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

no, never have read or heard to much about it...


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## BerkeyDavid (Jan 29, 2004)

Hi Ted.

Congrats!

Sure hope my first time goes as well! Keep us posted!


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## tecumseh (Apr 26, 2005)

*snip*
"" isn't it a rule not to turn the cell cup upside down?""
YES

tecumseh ask:
boy now I never heard that one. anyone care to clarify. and yes what is exactly meant by up and down in regards to a queen cell?

twt ask:
what is the odd's of not all drawn out cell's making it to be capped?

tecumseh adds:
well one of the most common reason for queen cells being terminated is lack of resources (pollen and nectar). if you do not feed the starter box in a constant manner then some cells will be terminated, or at least this is my experience.

and l8 out of 30 cells for a first time effort twt is in my mind is quite spectacular. perhaps as you have already discerned the stocking of the swarm box is the critical first condition in this process. as the name should suggest you are simulating swarming, so to maximize success you really need to stuff the box full of bees (and yes as you have also determined bees shaken from frames of green unsealed brood also increases your odds of success).

anyway here is a toast to your success.... and hopefully many more.


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

what I was asking about turning is the frame, I was just wondering when it would be ok to turn the frame upside down or if I even could until a certain day?


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## tecumseh (Apr 26, 2005)

twt ask:
what I was asking about turning is the frame

tecumseh replies:
yep I certainly am having difficulty intrepreting honeyman's wink, wink reaction. so I can only assume ???? that the rule againist inverting the queen cells is a bit of a ha, ha. 

the only reservation that I can recall is that the cells should not be jostled at the latter end of development which might cause the queen pupae to lodge in the bottom of the cell.


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

well checked on them today and I only had 12 capped off, guest being wishful made me have double vision, well 12 out of 30 for my first. dang wanted to set a record for a rook :wink:


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

here's a pic of my queen cells.....only 11 showing, the 12th was to the left under my hand, they are 8 days since I grafted, going to put in nucs this weekend 

http://www.beemaster.com/beebbs/viewtopic.php?p=26985#26985

[ April 05, 2006, 03:18 PM: Message edited by: TwT ]


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## George Fergusson (May 19, 2005)

Way to go Ted


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

thanks George, but look at all them empty cell's, maybe one day ill get them all capped but im still feeling good about raising my own queens.... heck even if it was just one atlest I know I have raised a queen bee. I'm glad I got into beekeeping, its been real fun and alot of learning, and I still have so much to learn, I'm not doing this to sale queens or nuc's but just to know I can raise some for myself but maybe one day I might sale a few  ...

[ April 05, 2006, 04:14 PM: Message edited by: TwT ]


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## eaglesbee (May 3, 2004)

what did you make your grafting tool out of? do you have a picture of it?


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

got 5 cells cut out today and put in nuc's got 6 more cells to put in nuc's as soon as I can get some frames and enough bee's to get them going, going to do the rest Sunday, suppose to rain all day tomorrow... just keeping yaw posted one my adventure 
_________________


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

eaglesbee, Ill take a pic of it, found it in some of my junk and thought it would make a good tool, It has amp on it so it must be some kind of electrical tool, think something else went with it, Ill take a pic soon...


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## honeyman46408 (Feb 14, 2003)

""tecumseh replies:
yep I certainly am having difficulty intrepreting honeyman's wink, wink reaction. so I can only assume ???? that the rule againist inverting the queen cells is a bit of a ha, ha."" 

My reaction was to Micheal Bush`s coment.

As for the ha ha I got my info from Ms. 
Sue Coby during her basic queen rearing class last year


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## tecumseh (Apr 26, 2005)

honeyman sezs:
As for the ha ha I got my info from Ms. 
Sue Coby during her basic queen rearing class last year 

tecumseh humble ask:
just seeking clarification honeyman (and that is why I put all those ???? into the statement) might I assume that this rule is somewhat time specific? for certainly when the queen cells are very green (as in double grafting) this prohibition would not apply (unless you are suppose to do this process upside down). So I quess what I would like to understand is when does this rule apply in regards to the development of a queen cell?


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## Chef Isaac (Jul 26, 2004)

TWT:

So did you make up your mating nucs yet? If so, where are you at on the queen timeline?


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

I think a cold snap we had got most my queen cells, (I grafted on march 30) all 12 cells capped after 7 days that was last Monday or tuesday went out the following saturday and took out 5 cells and put in nuc's with nurse bee's but it was still kinda cool, rain and cold all day sunday, went out monday and 2 cells have done hatched and held the cells that wrern't hatched up toward the sun and could only see 1 queen in the cells moving so I put that cell in a nuc. the other 4 cells I cut open and the queens were in the purple eye stage, guest they died then from cold, dont know? so Im not going to count the queens until I see them laying, they still have to survive there mating flight.... I'll graft me some more here soon now that the clod snaps might be gone......

[ April 13, 2006, 12:23 AM: Message edited by: TwT ]


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