# Help! Neighbours bees attracted to our Ipe decking



## Tilly&roo (Apr 25, 2015)

I am by no means anti-bees but I need to find a way to deter our neighbours honey bees from laying on our decking. They seem to either come there to die or to just lay on it. They completely ignore all of our plants/flowers so it's definitely the ipe decking they seem to like. I have 2 young children who are too scared to go in the garden in case they step on a bee. One of them gets hives easily and is sensitive to other insect bites so I'm worried she might be susceptible to a bad reaction if stung. I can't keep them inside all summer so was hoping there might be some sort of knowledge out there for a good deterrent? I don't want to kill the bees (although they seem to be coming to our garden when sick/near death) but would love to hear if there is a harm-free detergent. 

Many thanks.


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

The only deterrent I know of is what we use to push bees off of honey. Honey b gone and bee quick both smell like almonds and bees don't like it. Stay away from Beego that smells like vomit. It will only be a temp solution . Need to figure out why they are visiting your deck and talk to your neighbor about him providing it elsewhere the only thing I can think of the bees would be getting is moisture or they are using it to rest in the sun


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## Andrew Dewey (Aug 23, 2005)

I'm trying to figure out what is attracting the bees to your deck and will hope others will speak to deterrents. I don't envy the position you find yourself in. Has the lumber been treated with anything?


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## Tilly&roo (Apr 25, 2015)

Andrew Dewey said:


> I'm trying to figure out what is attracting the bees to your deck and will hope others will speak to deterrents. I don't envy the position you find yourself in. Has the lumber been treated with anything?


Thanks for your replies. I don't think it's liquid they are after as they seem to be getting that from the kids sandpit :0 equally, not sure it's just for sunbathing as they are there a lot even when the sun isn't out. They seem to either lie still or crawl around on it. 

To give some context, the decking is about 20m2 and covers most of our garden apart from flower beds around the border. Most days I will find 8-10 dead bees on the decking and maybe 5 live ones crawling around/laying down. 

I don't think the neighbours can place it elsewhere. It's as far away from our garden as they can get it but we live in London terraces which means it's only 5m away from our garden. They are lovely neighbours and I don't really wants ask them to remove it completely. I would prefer a different solution if possible. I'll look into the bee deterrents mentioned. I'm guessing they would was away in the rain? Any other suggestions greatly appreciated!

Many thanks


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## Tilly&roo (Apr 25, 2015)

Ooops, forgot to answer your question. No the deck hasn't been treated with anything (no oil or varnish) as we prefer the silver colour of ipe.


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## snapper1d (Apr 8, 2011)

I have used ipe decking and have bees here and never have I seen a bee on it.You may try washing it with a detergent and see if that helps.There was probably something spilled on it sometime.


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## justin (Jun 16, 2007)

my first thought would be something in or on the flowers is messing with them, and thats just where they land.


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## JRG13 (May 11, 2012)

Either that or it's at the right distance the sick bees and the dead get dropped off.


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## virginiawolf (Feb 18, 2011)

I highly doubt that those bees will sting anybody unless you stepped on them barefoot. I am around bees quite often and don't get stung unless I am working in the hives. Cleaning the wood with detergent as snapper1d mentioned is an idea. I would just try shaving off some pieces of bar soap like ivory and mixing it with water for a cleaner. They may be after something like sap in the wood or my initial guess would be they are drinking water off of it. I had to look up Ipe decking and it sounds like some delicious wood. Your neighbors might know what is going on. Communicating with them and having them over to observe the bees will probably explain it. Good Luck!!


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

Crawling bees are sick bees and If they they are dying I'd have to ask have you treated your garden for any ttype of pests like with seven dust ? If so they are being poisoned try to fly and can't so they plop on your deck and crawl


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## sjj (Jan 2, 2007)

Tilly&roo said:


> ... To give some context, the decking is about 20m2 and covers most of our garden apart from flower beds around the border. ...


Is this the first year of having the ipê deck?
Bees are looking for a source of warm water.


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## jonathan (Nov 3, 2009)

Harley Craig said:


> Crawling bees are sick bees and If they they are dying I'd have to ask have you treated your garden for any ttype of pests like with seven dust ? If so they are being poisoned try to fly and can't so they plop on your deck and crawl


It's more likely that the neighbour's bees have a varroa problem and it is deformed wing virus or paralysis virus making them crawl.
You could invite the neighbour over to see what's happening.


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## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

A few photos would help us to understand what is going on.


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## Tilly&roo (Apr 25, 2015)

Thank you so much for your replies. Yes the decking is fairly new (5 months). We haven't treated it with anything and haven't sprayed any pesticides in the garden that could be killing them. I guess it's possible that the wood was pre-treated with a chemical so will try to scrub it with a detergent to see if that helps. We haven't really used it much yet so there's no spillage on it for them to eat and they are spread out across the whole deck so not in one concentrated area. It could possibly be as one poster said (sorry can't access name as I'm typing) that it is the "graveyard" for sick/dead bees as I have sen a few being carried across by other bees. No sure how to deter that?! 

Also, I understand that they will probably only sting if stepped on which I have endlessly tried to explain to my 4 year old but for some reason he is absolutely terrified and will hardly go out in the garden. I'll upload some photos tomorrow.


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## rwlaw (May 4, 2009)

See if the hive entrance is pointed in your direction, if your deck is in they're flight path then it might something as simple as turning the hive.


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## Bee Bliss (Jun 9, 2010)

No offense meant, but are you sure they are honey bees?


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## Tilly&roo (Apr 25, 2015)

Bee Bliss said:


> No offense meant, but are you sure they are honey bees?


@rwlaw - I'm not sure but will check in the morning. 
@ bee bliss - I'm no bee expert but they live in a wooden beehive and I'm pretty sure the neighbours collect honey. I've seen them all suited up to check them.


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## snapper1d (Apr 8, 2011)

Ipe decking is not a treated wood.Its so dense it cant be treated.We use it in building bows.Its a super strong,rot resistant wood.If there has been nothing spilled on it and the bees are just sitting there they are probably sick from being poisoned.


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## Bee Bliss (Jun 9, 2010)

It would be a kindness for you to tell the neighbor what you noticed and that they seem to be sick. If they have been poisoned, he should be made aware of it. He may already be though. In any event, he can check it out further.


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## Tilly&roo (Apr 25, 2015)

I've got some photos of the bees. I've just noticed that there are lots of little (2mm) holes in the deck that weren't there before. Surely the bees can't eat their way thru the wood? Also the hive is facing away from our garden (sw).

Anyone know how to post photos?


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## Mr.Beeman (May 19, 2012)

Honey bees dont chew wood. Carpenter bees that look VERY similar to the honey bee does.


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## Tilly&roo (Apr 25, 2015)

Ok that looks exactly like the holes we have!! And I'm not a bee expert but the bee looks pretty similar to that too. Are carpenter bees part of the hive? How to I get rid of them in a kind way?


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## enjambres (Jun 30, 2013)

You need to identify the insects (which may not be honey bees, at all), first.

In the US we have agricultural agents (County Extension offices) who would be able to help you. In the UK, I would try local DEFRA offices for a start. They may be able to steer you in the right direction.

Insect exterminating companies may not be the best resources because they are in the business of killing bugs, so any bothersome one is, to them, a business opportunity. Plus what they may spray to rid your deck of the "bees" could be exremely harmful to your neighbor's bees.

It's possible the bugs and the holes came with your new decking and are just hatching out. So another thing to do is to contact the deck wood supplier, and again also DEFRA, as you may be observing something that requires better attention to import quarantines. The risk of importing wood-pests is a large one and it nevers happens on purpose. I live in the northeast of the US and we are battling a couple of very serious, exotic insects that are killing some of our most important forest-tree species. These bugs got their start here in the US because people didn't notice their first occurrences and report them when the problem was still containable.

You do have a problem, but I doubt it is from honey bees as honey bees do not bore holes in wood. It is fairly common for people to mis-identify other insects as honey bees. I'd start by visting your neighbor with a sample of the dead bees from your deck in hand. I can't imagine a beekeeper who would be upset at that kind of approach since it may be vital inforation that they need to know about. And they have a stake in the resolution of the problem. If it is honey bees (and which might not be from their hive as many bees live in a feral state) they can try things to change the flight paths from their hive. If the bees are not honey bees, and are dong damage to your deck, they also have a stake in what you choose, or may be required, to do about it, as well. They will need to protect their bees from any treatments needed, for instance. Protection might invlove choice of chemicals, timing of treatment, moving their hive or temporarily shutting it in. 

Four-year olds can get ideas and fears stuck in thieir minds, I know. But it is a pity that your child has now become afraid of these "bees". Many bee-looking things do not sting, and many more, like honey bees, generally only sting in defense of their home, or when stepped on in bare feet. You child is getting his ideas about insects from people around him. Maybe some visits to childrens' exhibits about bugs would help calm fears and eradicate false beliefs about insects. Many children are absolutely fascinated by insects as when looked at closely they have a certain other-wordly weirdness that appeals to kids' taste for the bizarre. I'm sure in London here are opportunities for kids to learn about bugs.

Enjambres


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## scorpionmain (Apr 17, 2012)

This why neighbors, especially over protective parents suck.
Those are carpenter bees. They have nothing to do with a honeybee hive.
Quit blaming you neighbor just because you see a bee.
Put some shoes on your kids or keep them in a bubble and never let them venture outside.
Insects & other animals exist outside. Better teach your kids to deal with it.


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## Cyan (Jan 27, 2015)

I have to agree with the consensus on those possibly not being honey bees. On the farm I'm seeing quite a few carpenter bees looking for new nests. They appear to be almost identical to honey bees except that they are somewhat darker, like a brownish yellow. Hard to explain. But my brother is already on the "your bees are looking for places to nest because they are inspecting every little hole in the wood they can find" kick. Sorry, but that's not typical honeybee behavior.


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## Ross (Apr 30, 2003)

To be clear, while those are bees, they are not honey bees and did not come from your neighbors hive. Carpenter bees bore into wood to make their nest. They will continue to damage your deck until you have it treated.


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## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

Move along folks. Nothing to see here except an over-protective mom projecting her irrational fear of honey bees onto her children.


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## kaizen (Mar 20, 2015)

I am new to this beekeeping thing but I really think that you experts and even amateurs like me should avail yourselves to helping and not insulting people that come for help. Yes people fear bees. But everyone has their own fears. This particular Brit asked respectful and knowledge seeking questions and as a result knows its not her neighbor's hive and now has a course of action. She is a lot better then the last person asking how to kill a hive on their porch. Just like each varoa killed each person educated will save this species


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## dsegrest (May 15, 2014)

Tilly&roo said:


> I've got some photos of the bees. I've just noticed that there are lots of little (2mm) holes in the deck that weren't there before. Surely the bees can't eat their way thru the wood? Also the hive is facing away from our garden (sw).
> 
> Anyone know how to post photos?


Is the deck lighted at night? If so these could be zom-bees that come to the light and you find them dead on deck in the morning. If that is case the beekeeper needs to treat for phorid flies.


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## Tilly&roo (Apr 25, 2015)

Thank you Kaisen, I couldn't agree more. I really wasn't looking for parenting advise scorpionman & shinbone or I would be on a very different forum. I would expect this kind of cattiness from mumsnet and the likes but for some reason had bee keepers down as "nice" people. Clearly I must stop generalising! I was asking for sound advise on how to deal with these bees. I made it clear that I wasn't blaming my neighbours and I certainly don't have an issue with them or their bees for that matter. If it wasn't for my son's irrational fear (absolutely not something I have encouraged if you must know) I wouldn't even be on this forum. But actually I am very glad I did come on here as certain kind and helpful people have helped me to confirm that this isn't the neighbours honey bees after all, it is very likely that they are carpenter bees. 

So thank you to Ross, Cyan, Enjambres, Mr Beeman for your advise. I have contacted the local bee expert to see what his advise is but in the meantime I sprayed the deck with some homemade citrus water which so far seems to have deterred them although I'm guessing it will need to be reapplied after every rain shower!


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## Mr.Beeman (May 19, 2012)

Scorpionmain and shinbone, you should ashamed of yourselves. That IS NOT how you act towards someone merely asking for advice. You MAY know a little something about bees but most do not. We need to educate those that don't know but who wish to be educated in our endeavor. 
Tilly and roo, please accept my apology for those who have may not have acted accordingly on this site. Please know this is not tolerated by me and many who believe this site to be one of the best beekeeping sites out there.
I hope you find this information helpful and maybe you will be rid of the carpenter bees soon.


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## tanksbees (Jun 16, 2014)

Tilly,
If you have dead bees on your deck, collect them in a jar and bring them over to your neighbor with the beehive, they will be able to identify them and tell you if they are honeybees or not.

Carpenter bees are an entirely different species of bees, which eat wood, and are destructive to buildings, and have nothing to do with your neighbors hive.

Most beekeepers are nerdy and LOVE talking about bees and other insects so if you do have a carpenter bee problem your neighbor might be be able to help you figure out what is going on, and enjoy doing it too.

Maybe invite them over for a coffee or a beer to look at some bees on the deck. You might get some honey out of it


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## Brad Bee (Apr 15, 2013)

Tilly, I don't know what species of carpenter bees you have in England but the ones here in the US bore a hole close to 1/2" in diameter. Without going out to measure one, I'd guess it would be in the 10-12 mm range. Or course, as enjambres wrote, the bees could have come inside the wood. That happens here from time to time. But a 2mm hole doesn't sound right for a carpenter bee or any bee that I know of.

Regardless of what kind of bee it is, they shouldn't be dead or crawling around on your deck. If they are honeybees, then as posted earlier then your deck may be the drop off point for the bees carried out of the hives. 

Like mentioned above, I'd ask the neighbors to take a look.


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## virginiawolf (Feb 18, 2011)

Tillyandroo, they make beesuits for kids. Maybe this was meant to happen so that your son can meet the neighbor beekeeper and check out the bees up close and see how awesome they are. Honeybees are awesome and unique and important. Maybe your son could overcome his fears with the help of your neighbor. We have kids in our bee club and they really enjoy beekeeping. There could be a twist in all of this and it may lead you to getting closer to the neighbors bees perhaps. Like tanksbees said the beekeeper would probably enjoy talking bees with you and your son. It's thrilling to wear a bee suit and get very close to the bees. I'm glad that this seems to have resolved. You came to the right place for answers. 

My neighbor got into bees so his son could overcome his fear of bees. He got a Boy Scouts merit badge for Beekeeping. I just looked it up and it looks like people are trying to bring back the Boy Scouts Beekeeping Merit Badge.

http://robo.bushkillfarms.com/boys-scouts-beekeeping-merit-badge-update/


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## Cyan (Jan 27, 2015)

I find myself with yet another case of mistaken identity, lol What I'm seeing on the farm are red mason bees. Here is a picture- real close to honeybees aren't they? Mason bees are another type of solitary bee that really don't bother with people.


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## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

Mr.Beeman said:


> Scorpionmain and shinbone, you should ashamed of yourselves.


I simply stated the truth.

This person saw flying insects on her deck and immediately blamed her neighbor because he has a bee hive in his yard. She is so afraid of bees, rather than first identifying what the insects actually are, she goes on a beekeeping forum and asks members how to get rid of the honey bees coming from her neighbor's hive. 

She is so afraid of honey bees, she would publicly accuse her neighbor that his bees are terrorizing her family and threatening her children's health, instead of first taking and posting a simple photo of the insects and asking us beekeepers if they are bees. In her mind, it is faster and easier to just blame the beekeeper and let him deal with the fall out. Oh yes, she is a fine person and setting a good example for her children, and we should hold her hand while she does this.

If anyone on this forum had made any kind of statement suggesting that these unidentified flying insects might be honey bees, you can bet she would have been immediately complaining to her neighbor about the problems "he was causing" and would have been escalating this matter to the local authorities as well. She would be insisting that the neighbor either kill or remove the bee hive from his property. 

Additionally, this helicopter-mom, without any supporting information, is instilling fear in her child of honey bees. An example of really bad parenting!

You side with this overly-protective woman going off half-****ed? What about the unfairly targeted beekeeper? What about her poor child being filled with irrational fear of the natural world? How would you feel if you or a friend were the unfairly targeted neighbor?




.


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## rmaxwell (Apr 23, 2014)

kaizen said:


> I am new to this beekeeping thing but I really think that you experts and even amateurs like me should avail yourselves to helping and not insulting people that come for help. Yes people fear bees. But everyone has their own fears. This particular Brit asked respectful and knowledge seeking questions and as a result knows its not her neighbor's hive and now has a course of action. She is a lot better then the last person asking how to kill a hive on their porch. Just like each varoa killed each person educated will save this species


Amen!!! It gives a bad perception toward all of us. At least they are trying to resolve their issue in a civil way.


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## scorpionmain (Apr 17, 2012)

virginiawolf said:


> Tillyandroo, they make beesuits for kids. Maybe this was meant to happen so that your son can meet the neighbor beekeeper and check out the bees up close and see how awesome they are. Honeybees are awesome and unique and important. Maybe your son could overcome his fears with the help of your neighbor. We have kids in our bee club and they really enjoy beekeeping. There could be a twist in all of this and it may lead you to getting closer to the neighbors bees perhaps. Like tanksbees said the beekeeper would probably enjoy talking bees with you and your son. It's thrilling to wear a bee suit and get very close to the bees. I'm glad that this seems to have resolved. You came to the right place for answers.
> 
> My neighbor got into bees so his son could overcome his fear of bees. He got a Boy Scouts merit badge for Beekeeping. I just looked it up and it looks like people are trying to bring back the Boy Scouts Beekeeping Merit Badge.
> 
> http://robo.bushkillfarms.com/boys-scouts-beekeeping-merit-badge-update/


Now, that's a good ideal.


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## scorpionmain (Apr 17, 2012)

Mr.Beeman said:


> Scorpionmain and shinbone, you should ashamed of yourselves...


Meh, maybe I was a bit grumpy but it's I've had to deal with too many of these hover-parents.
I understand she is just trying to take care of her kids, but let kids be kids and stop being so overly protective.


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## larryh (Jul 28, 2014)

Sorry to say, but I doubt the holes are new. I've built quite a few decks with Ipe and have seen MANY 2mm bug holes in it right off the boat. I believe they are from bugs in the tree or logs before milling.

WRT the kids' fears- I used to be terrified of bees too, until 2 years ago when I met a very entusiastic bee keeper and learned just a tiny bit from him. His passion for the bees rubbed off and I am hooked with 4 hives: two new colonies, a cutout colony (my first time handling bees :0) and a small swarm I caught in a bait hive. 

I bet taking the kids over to see the bees would be AWESOME for them.. and you..and the bee keeper neighbor!
Here's a fun video that might be good to show the kids..notice how nobody gets stung? 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igkEMhs6QiU


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