# Do you install 1 queen cell or 2???



## TIMER (Apr 17, 2011)

I've had good success (80-90%) installing one cell in my nucs, I'm curious to know if you see much better installing two cells? I have lots of extra cells right now and thought about trying it.


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## Ben Franklin (May 3, 2011)

I would try more,,,unless you feel you don't want to waste a possible queen.


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

I would just candle them and pick the best ones.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

We will put in a second one on occasion if the other option is the garbage can. If for no other reason than simple mathematics, its bound to gain you a few.


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## sjvbee (Dec 27, 2006)

We would use the extra cells up by doubling them 
Up until l started keeping track. My take went down
For what ever reason. So take keith's advice use the 
Best one's


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Do what you think is right. I don't know anyone who raises queens who does that. And they have loads of queen cells.

If I had more cells than places to put them, and no way to make up another set of nucs, I would do that, put two in each of a set. Then try to keep track and see what the success rate is. what do you have to lose?

Except what sjvbee wrote. So I wouldn't make it a habit.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

sjvbee said:


> We would use the extra cells up by doubling them
> Up until l started keeping track. My take went down
> For what ever reason. So take keith's advice use the
> Best one's


Interesting, I would like to hear more. What kind of before and after numbers were you seeing?


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## swarm_trapper (Jun 19, 2003)

i was talking to a beekeeper a year or two ago about the same thing. He told me when he puts two cells in he gets less of a take because if the virgins hatch at about the same time they will find each other and fight to the death, but in the process the one that wins some times will be injured and not be able to mate.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

An interesting theory. I have often wondered if this is possible as well but it's the kind of thing that's hard to either prove or disprove. I have recelled nucs a day or two later. One time, in particular, we had concerns about the handling of the first cells and returned a couple days later with some extras that we used to recell. Those recells ran far better than the others, but of course that is an entirely different scenario. I do remember double celling a little more than half of a 180 nuc yard this spring, the yard ran about 90% acceptance. One batch looked identical to the other.


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## TIMER (Apr 17, 2011)

Keith, 
What type set up are you candling with and what do you look for in your cells?


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## Joseph Clemens (Feb 12, 2005)

Sometimes when I have a larger batch of finished cells than I can immediately place, in queenless mating nucs, I will place 2 or more. But, sometimes I will simply pull the extra cells apart and examine the contents. It's why I've seen cells where the queen was pointed the wrong way, head towards the base of the cell instead of the tip. I've also discovered some where the developing pupae was folded in half, two pupae in the same cell, pupae with malformations, etc. These developmental mistakes were very interesting, though I wonder how common they are. I once heard about a queen producer who opened each cell, at a certain point in their development, he would weight them (discarding any below a certain weight), then return them to their cells to finish developing. Doing that, I could easily have the best queen cell Q.A. going, I could use the opportunity to keep records of mis-developed queen pupae, eliminate them from the cells that are placed, and perhaps increase the percentage of high quality finished queens.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

TIMER said:


> Keith,
> What type set up are you candling with and what do you look for in your cells?


I have seen queen rearers simply hold the cell up towards the window and check the food supply that way. I think they can see the tail end of the queen too. If I recall correctly, Michael Palmer has said on beesource that he likes to see a good amount of jelly still in the top of the cell when he looks.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

TIMER said:


> Keith,
> What type set up are you candling with and what do you look for in your cells?


Some good videos here: http://www.malkaqueens.com/ingles/video/videos.html
Check out handling of ripe queen cells to get an idea of how one producer does it. It's not as easy with plastic, though. Personally I cull anything that looks abnormal compare to the bulk of your cells. A 10 day old cell should be quite fibrous and firm and show little if any visible jelly. If you see jelly and it appears thin or has thin cracks then it is most likely fine. I like to gently squeeze any overly long cells as they are always the most suspicious to me. It is usually a sign that the pupae has fallen away from the jelly.


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