# Messed up split?



## Gray Goose (Sep 4, 2018)

they should be fine unless they got really soaked.
when it warms you need to go thru the old hive again.
with several cells it could still swarm.

may need to split again, try to find the queen, and then put the cells in the other split.

GG


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

It sounds like the hive was already in swarm mode, so if you didn't move the queen away to simulate a swarm, then the old hive may still swarm. Try finding the queen and moving her out in a split, if there are still queen cells available for them to requeen the original hive. If there are no queen cells left, ie you moved them all away into the first split, then leave the queen, they most likely won't swarm without queen cells to leave behind to continue on the hive.

Oh, and yes the first split you did should do fine. A little bit of wet on bees, they will take care of it pretty quickly.


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## nekatlla (Jun 17, 2021)

Gray Goose said:


> they should be fine unless they got really soaked.
> when it warms you need to go thru the old hive again.
> with several cells it could still swarm.
> 
> ...


I went over today ( I forgot to put weight on the cover and wanted to make sure i didn't loose the top too) they were in the box buzzing around sounded good so I didn't peak! I also found the queen , marked her, and took her with the split. I was told this would "mimic" a swarm and the old hive would re-queen while the new hive would continue as if they did swarm. I took a look at the old hive also and there were bees on the landing board so now we wait 2 weeks and then check again and hope for the best. Thanks for giving me input. I'm a bit more relieved now....


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## nekatlla (Jun 17, 2021)

RayMarler said:


> It sounds like the hive was already in swarm mode, so if you didn't move the queen away to simulate a swarm, then the old hive may still swarm. Try finding the queen and moving her out in a split, if there are still queen cells available for them to requeen the original hive. If there are no queen cells left, ie you moved them all away into the first split, then leave the queen, they most likely won't swarm without queen cells to leave behind to continue on the hive.
> 
> Oh, and yes the first split you did should do fine. A little bit of wet on bees, they will take care of it pretty quickly.


I did find her and move her with the split, leaving 1 or 2 queen cells in the original hive, they were not capped over yet but definitely had larger larvae and a lot of royal jelly plus they were quite long like they'd be capped over in the next couple days. It was amazing how fast they went from nothing to cells with larva in them. Makes you realize why you must do inspections every couple weeks. Thanks for the input I did put my ear to the box earlier and heard them in there so I'm hopeful I got away with it!


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## nekatlla (Jun 17, 2021)

So both these hives are doing great now, but I was wondering how long is too long in the split before I see signs of a queen ie eggs larvae etc??? I checked at 9 days and thought I saw an emerged queen cell, and 2 queen cells that were torn down. There was also one queen cell that was still capped over, I assumed that one was killed and would be torn down shortly. Yesterday I reinspected on day 15 from the split and that capped queen cell was still present and capped. There were no eggs or larvae and I did not see a queen when inspecting the hive. It has been a rough 2 weeks with only 1 or 2 days suitable for mating flights. However with that capped queen cell I'm kind of leaning towards a queen has not emerged yet? Whats everyones thoughts on.......
1) how long should I wait until I purchase a new mated queen and re-queen?
2) should I check that cell again at day 18 and if opened assume that was my emergency queen?
3) if #2 is yes how much longer is the maximum time without evidence of a queen before I have to re-queen?

I was told that at 21-23 days without a queen you can get laying workers and queen acceptance goes way down, is there truth to that and is that the time I need to beat?
Also if my split without the queen is queen less for 2 weeks is there a chance I could cage the old queen and move her back to the split without a queen leaving the other half to possibly raise a new queen on their own? I guess the problem with that is there would now be 2 hives that are way behind going into honey production mode?
Thanks again this is such an interesting experience, and a little nerve racking.


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

I check 5-7 days after making the split to make sure queen cells are being made. Then I keep myself out of the split completely until 28 days after the split. I find that my intruding into the queen cell emerging and virgin queen maturing and making orientation and mating flights tends to reduce successful queen mating and laying eggs for me.

I know it's exciting and we like to get inside the box and see what's going on, but really, this is a period of time where the bees will do much better without any intrusions from us.


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## nekatlla (Jun 17, 2021)

RayMarler said:


> I check 5-7 days after making the split to make sure queen cells are being made. Then I keep myself out of the split completely until 28 days after the split. I find that my intruding into the queen cell emerging and virgin queen maturing and making orientation and mating flights tends to reduce successful queen mating and laying eggs for me.
> 
> I know it's exciting and we like to get inside the box and see what's going on, but really, this is a period of time where the bees will do much better without any intrusions from us.


Thank you that puts me about another 2 weeks to stay out of the hive now then.


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