# Never buy used hives



## Specialkayme (Sep 4, 2005)

Sorry to hear the bad news. It sucks.

But I'm not sure the lesson learned is "NEVER buy used hives." Instead I think it should be "buyer beware." Get them inspected, know your diseases, keep new hives in isolated (as much as you can) outyards. 

Even if you get a bad buy, if you make 4 good buys it still might be worthwhile. I've bought out three beekeepers in the past and got really good deals. If all the signs are good, I'd do it again.


----------



## Dan the bee guy (Jun 18, 2015)

It sure does suck. I had foul brood this year too but I don't know where it came from. Burned 5 full size hives and some nucs that I made this year. Just keep on making nucs with the hives you have. I only had 3 hives left after I got it cleaned up and after the all the nucs and splits I made I ended up with a dozen.


----------



## Branman (Aug 20, 2003)

I cannot believe anyone sold hives knowingly having AFB. That seems borderline illegal. Could you sue and get your money back, plus any other hives lost?


----------



## Specialkayme (Sep 4, 2005)

Branman said:


> Could you sue . . .?


Depending on the state's laws . . . maybe. 

If the seller made some representation that was knowingly and intentionally false, you may have a cause of action for fraud and/or unfair and deceptive trade practices. But if the seller didn't make any representation, or the property was sold "as-is" then it's up to the buyer to verify and check (get that inspector out there).

Whether you have a cause of action or not, the odds are it'll be a small claims action. The filing fee alone (not counting the day in court) may make a suit not worthwhile. But assuming you get past that hurdle, AND you win, collecting on the judgment may be a whole other issue.


----------



## Lburou (May 13, 2012)

I would think your State bee inspector would want to know of the location of AFB sources.


----------



## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

I assume you inspected them prior to purchase and found no AFB? To then have that many get AFB makes me wonder if he was concealing AFB by using antibiotics.

So if he was using antibiotics but made no mention of that, he would know you would get AFB, if it could be proved, there ought to be a case. But as per others, it's about the cost of that case.

You say you found out the seller knew they were infected, how did you find out?

An experience of my own, when I was the "bad guy". I sold 50 hives to someone, he and I inspected all of them for afb the day he picked them up, all looking good. Then a month or so later I discovered that a nearby apiary had an AFB robout shortly before I sold the hives. So I contacted the purchaser and told him, he checked them again, called me back and said they were all good. But around 9 months later he contacted me and said he had just found 8 of them with AFB and had burned them. To be of good conscience, I refunded him the money. He also told me he was worried because by now he had split the 50 hives into around 300. So a few months later I made the 5 hour drive to where he is, stayed with him a couple days and we thoroughly checked all the hives, no further AFB found. Phew!

But anyhow the point of the story is I believe the seller should be responsible, and I'll put my money where my mouth is. So should anyone else.

Oh, karma does go around. That guy now has built up to 3,000 hives plus has built a plant extracting honey for other commercials and has outlets in China, so is becoming well known. We still talk and are friends and because the initial problem was dealt with properly, will recommend me to others.


----------



## MikeJ (Jan 1, 2009)

syrup man said:


> A person I thought was a good friend that I've known for over 15 years had a older friend that was selling some of his hives ........ I knew I shouldn't but the price was right so I bought ....... long story short I have destroyed and burned 7 hives because of American foulbrood the sad part is I found out the seller knew they were infected ......


How do you know he knew?
Did you inspect before purchase?


----------



## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

"New" beekeepers ... never, ever, buy used equipment. Start from scratch. 
My 2 cents.


----------



## clyderoad (Jun 10, 2012)

Mike Gillmore said:


> "New" beekeepers ... never, ever, buy used equipment. Start from scratch.
> My 2 cents.


I tend to agree. 
It's not always the fun and games many imagine it to be.


----------



## syrup man (Aug 23, 2015)

The person I bought the hives from I found out is being sued by his once beekeeping partner because his hives infected his partners hives I don't know the whole story but he knew his hives were infected and he was treating them


----------



## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

I'm so sorry to hear this, you really got shafted. Don't let this deter you, hang in there.

Your painful experience is why I am so adamant about new beekeepers staying away from used equipment. It's like playing Russian Roulette, not worth the risk in my opinion. You never "really" know what you are getting.


----------



## snl (Nov 20, 2009)

Mike Gillmore said:


> "New" beekeepers ... never, ever, buy used equipment. Start from scratch.
> My 2 cents.


Unless you can get a really great deal and then have the equipment immediately irradiated.


----------



## Specialkayme (Sep 4, 2005)

snl said:


> Unless you can get a really great deal and then have the equipment immediately irradiated.


Or unless its a really great deal AND they're inspected, with an emphasis on the first part.

I see people who are looking to get out of beekeeping trying to sell their hives for $350 or $450 a hive. I laugh. No way is it worth the potential infection at that price. But at $100-150 a hive . . . with adequate precautions . . . maybe . . .


----------



## syrup man (Aug 23, 2015)

I paid $90 a hive but I'm paying for it but I learned my lesson


----------



## Branman (Aug 20, 2003)

Specialkayme said:


> Or unless its a really great deal AND they're inspected, with an emphasis on the first part.
> 
> I see people who are looking to get out of beekeeping trying to sell their hives for $350 or $450 a hive. I laugh. No way is it worth the potential infection at that price. But at $100-150 a hive . . . with adequate precautions . . . maybe . . .


You never know...there are new beeks that don't know any better. I looked through a new beekeepers hives for him and he paid $400 per. They were pretty mite ridden with moderate to advanced PMS and a ton of terrible, janky foundationless comb. I didnt have the heart to tell him he overpaid by 100% or so...


----------



## MikeJ (Jan 1, 2009)

I see no problem buying used hives - but as SpecialKayme said, inspections.
THEN do not move them in with you hives. Quarantine for a season until you see what goes on with them.


----------



## Specialkayme (Sep 4, 2005)

Branman said:


> You never know...there are new beeks that don't know any better.


Which is why I don't find as many deals as I used to.


----------



## Fusion_power (Jan 14, 2005)

I bought out a beekeeper 25 years ago getting about 40 colonies in 3 yards along with all his extracting equipment for $1000. It was a steal. Until I found that one of the yards had AFB. On a positive note, the rest of the colonies were healthy so I just culled the 5 colonies in that yard.


----------



## heaflaw (Feb 26, 2007)

Years ago, I traded out for a bunch of old unused hives, then got scared of AFB. I spent about 3 days with a flame thrower and a propane torch killing any possible spores. My inspector told me they should now be safe to use and I have not had a problem. But I wouldn't do it again


----------



## Ravenseye (Apr 2, 2006)

I've had pretty good luck. Perhaps it's just that...... Luck.


----------



## FlowerPlanter (Aug 3, 2011)

You did get a lab test to confirm your diagnosis?


----------



## heaflaw (Feb 26, 2007)

nevermind


----------



## syrup man (Aug 23, 2015)

Yes I sent in a sample to the bee lab and it was positive for AFB


----------

