# Foundation color



## gunter62 (Feb 13, 2011)

Black is helpful for brood comb as it makes seeing eggs and small larva easier. Either will work for honey and pollen storage.


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## Hobo (Mar 4, 2014)

Do the bees have a preference?


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## beegum (Dec 9, 2014)

Hobo said:


> Do the bees have a preference?


Well, I don't know. That would be why I asked.


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## drlonzo (Apr 15, 2014)

Queens like darker brood comb to lay in. I've found with my bees that the queens will usually pick a newly drawn RiteCell comb to lay in before they will a wax foundation comb that has just been drawn out in the same hive.


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## beegum (Dec 9, 2014)

drlonzo said:


> Queens like darker brood comb to lay in. I've found with my bees that the queens will usually pick a newly drawn RiteCell comb to lay in before they will a wax foundation comb that has just been drawn out in the same hive.


Thank you for some helpful info. I'm so new that sometimes the obvious gets me. thanks. SKEETER


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## JWChesnut (Jul 31, 2013)

I don't see any substantial difference in the preference of the bees between natural and black.
If you are planning on grafting cells, the black makes locating and lifting the new larvae a lot easier.


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

I have not noted much difference in laying preference either. I think it more a matter of position. I like the black because it is purty with the nice contrast while being drawn out. I don't think the bees see much difference in the pitch black of the hive. Maybe they can but I think bees go a long way out of their way to turn my white extracting supers black with cocoons EVERY chance they get!


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## dleemc1 (Dec 31, 2012)

I use all natural for honey and brood. just what I like!


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## Hobo (Mar 4, 2014)

beegum said:


> Well, I don't know. That would be why I asked.


My question was directed to the others, not you. Like you I have a lot of questions.


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## WBVC (Apr 25, 2013)

I prefer the lighter foundation but that is based on aestheics not function.


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## brownbuff75 (Jul 1, 2013)

This last spring I did a side by side test between black and yellow foundation. It was small test 2 hives each so there are definitely other factors could be involved. In the first week after installation of the packages the black foundation had 1 to 2 frames more being started on. In the second week 2-3 more frames being drawn with 1-2 more being fully drawn. It keeper this trend until the second brood box then things started to slow down and by end of summer they ended up being equal. Take this for what you will


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## blueskybeesupply (Dec 11, 2007)

We have always found the bees to draw black (American Made) Pierco plastic foundation the best out of all plastic color/foundation. We use it for both brood and supers. White in your supers will make it a little easier to grade the honey color in the comb.

Of course the bees will draw out natural wax foundation just fine, but commercially rendered beeswax used in making foundation these days is so full of chemicals and disease potential--we avoid it. This is a fact.


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## beegum (Dec 9, 2014)

Hobo said:


> My question was directed to the others, not you. Like you I have a lot of questions.


Take no offence (sp?) I didn't want to offend. Just didn't know. Thanks to all who offered any input.


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## Dave Burrup (Jul 22, 2008)

I prefer the black for two reasons. The eggs and larvae are easier to see against the black background, and the reflected light off of the natural frames, when the comb is new, is really hard to look at. I need strong reading glasses with clear lenses, and the sun coming from behind me to see the eggs. The bees do not care what color the frames are.
Dave


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## johng (Nov 24, 2009)

I like the black and it is all I buy. Makes seeing eggs so much easier. Other than that I really don't think color makes any difference at all to the bees.


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## Michael B (Feb 6, 2010)

I believe it is the beekeepers preference to foundation color. The bees "seem" not to care. I only had a couple hives reject black. I give them a frame of natural and they would draw it out nicely. Black nothing......add another black nothing...only happened once.


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## psfred (Jul 16, 2011)

Bees strongly prefer used brood comb, but I don't think it has anything to do with the color. Unless there is a difference in chemical perception by the bees between light and dark plastic foundation, I doubt they can tell them apart in a typical have, it's dark in there.

Experience by most of my local beek friends indicates that the bees around here tend to prefer wax foundation over plastic, at least in their hives, and can get rather creative with the plastic foundation later in the season. During the spring flow they draw anything nicely, but when the flow drops off they do fun things like short strips of comb perpendicular to the plastic, or start on the plastic and switch to the edge of the frame and build a comb between two sheets of plastic. 

Might just be the bees though -- I have one buddy who collected a swarm three years ago and they STILL make wonky comb, even on was foundation!

Peter


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## MichiganMike (Mar 25, 2014)

I am older and have vision issues. I started with the light frames and was unable to see eggs. Now I only buy black. I doubt the bees care. My guess is that as the light frames age eggs will be more visable.


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## enjambres (Jun 30, 2013)

I'm only a second year beekeeper and still experimenting with various types of foundations and frames.

Black Pierco frames are by far the easiest to see tiny egges and larvae. Black foundation sheets are similar. I had good luck with my bees drawing out a number of foundationless brood frames, but they are really hard to see eggs on.

For plastic frames in my honey supers I use white Pierco ones. I think honey on a white frame is very pretty. This also makes it easy to see at a glance which size frame a particular one is: all my blacks are deeps and all whites are mediums. 

However, I also have many wooden frames in use, some with full foundation, some with just starter strips (and next Spring some with Lauri Miller-style partial, but full-depth, slabs of foundation). I will be color coding the top of the various frame/ foundation combos with colored thumb tacks so I know what's hanging below w/o removing it.

I have not observed (but, then, what do I know since I've only been at this for two years?) any resistance to the bees' drawing out of Pierco frames. Mine seem to make exceptionally neat and even comb on Piercos, certainly vs the foundationless frames, which were much more varied, though aesthetically more pleasing and amazing to see. 

Enj.


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## capitalbeesupply (Jul 28, 2013)

beegum said:


> I've searched and probably to my own fault still need help . I'm planning to use wax coated plastic foundation. My question is, white or black and why?


As you've read in the other posts, black is nice initially for seeing eggs on the comb. Once they are drawn and used for a season even the lighter colored foundations will be darkened. Some will say that black foundation can be too "hot" in certain parts of the US, but where we are too hot isn't an issue typically..and I don't know under what circumstances the foundation would be an issue that way, but the issue is raised on occasion. I do know that if we have new black, undrawn frames out in the sun when we are inspecting a hive or adding a box on in the summer the wax can become liquified. But that is only if we have them out of the box in direct sun. I haven't had that happen with a drawn out frame on black foundation where we are..... 

We use black for brood (either Pierco or Acorn...we use/sell both, Pierco for the one-piece frames and Acorn for the snap-in to wood frames because the Acorn deep snap-in is ever so slightly larger which fits our wood frames better than the Pierco does. But both companies are good...Acorn/Gencon was the molder for the Pierco until the sale/split and Pierco moved their molds and molding. Acorn made their own molds and became a competitor of Pierco). What we have really come to like this past year is the medium green drone frames from Acorn which we use in our honey supers for honey production (we originally had asked Pierco about molding medium drone a few years back to accommodate our customers who wanted to do drone trapping for IPM and who were running all mediums. But it wasn't until the split when Acorn stepped up and began molding medium green drone primarily for honey production moreso than for the IPM reasons we initially were after them for from what we understand. We tried green drone in honey supers this past year and were pleasantly surprised by the results. Long story short, the bees don't seem to care about the color of the frames.....


Rich
Capital Bee Supply, LLC
Madison, WI


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