# Not catching swarms - what gives?



## JWChesnut (Jul 31, 2013)

Nucs are too small per research by Seeley and my own experience. Dr. Seeley says 40 liters volume. I say 2 nucs stacked. The volume is equivalent. Open space is important, I use one smelly old brood comb in the center and wired, but open frames on the sides. The lower box can be left open, with frames only on the top box. I use a deep and a medium or 2 deeps interchangeably. 

A trap of 2 nucs volume will catch 4x the number of a single nuc, more than making up for the extra hardware.

If you don't catch, move the trap, or put out another in another location. Some spots are better than others -- and good spots, just like fishing holes, will catch and catch and catch.


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## mathesonequip (Jul 9, 2012)

less swarms due to bad winter die-off also is a factor.


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## minz (Jan 15, 2011)

Curiosity got me this year so I picked up a heat gun to try also. Like most of the stuff I get from HF I took it home and put it to use right away. I found on high it started the smoker in a jiffy!


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## Mr.Beeman (May 19, 2012)

Winter die off this year was the worst it's been in 30 years. The hives located in heated buildings (homes and businesses) did ok. Feral hives not heated....... :ws:


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## NY_BLUES (May 14, 2009)

i second that a single 5 frame deep nuc box is too small for most swarms. I used to use 2 5 frame medium nucs stacked, giving about 1/3 more space to a swarm, but still didnt catch to many using that configuration. The ones I did pick up were usually small swarms. Try a single deep or stack 2 nucs for more room.


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## Northwest PA Beekeeper (Mar 28, 2012)

As others have said, a Nuc is really too small for a large swarm. While they may come and look, if they find a larger area to occupy than your Nuc, they will go to the larger area.
So far this year, I have captured 5 swarms. Out of those 5, 3 were in regular deep hives and 2 were in cardboard boxes - the size a carton of copy paper comes in. The hives were baited with drawn out comb - 2 or more frames plus frames with foundation and lemongrass oil, and the cardboard boxes were baited with 1 or 2 frames of drawn out comb, or 1 frame drawn out comb / 1 frame of foundation plus lemongrass oil.

Out of the 5 caught, 1 swarm was a gangbuster swarm - filled the whole hive which I believe came from a wild hive in a tree. The other 2 caught in hives had about 3 full frames of bees. Both of the cardboard boxes were smaller swarms which leads me to believe the 2 frames takes up too much room and larger swarms pass them up. I think from now on, I will just put one drawn out frame in the cardboard box. (Cardboard boxes were shrink-wrapped with plastic and or an extra larger cardboard box placed over it with just the entrance hole matching up to protect from the weather.) - Note - using the cardboard boxes, you really need to watch them closely, if you get a swarm you want to get them into a regular hive quick - they draw comb quickly attaching it to the top of the box and the moisture the bees puts off makes the cardboard soggy.

I have not noticed feral colonies weakened or dead from the extremely cold winter. Out of 5 feral colonies - 3 in hollow trees, 1 in the wall of an abandoned house, and 1 in the soffit of a lived in house, 4 survived the winter - and the only reason the one in the hollow tree didn't make it was the top of the tree blew over in December exposing the colony. Otherwise I think they would have survived as well.

I will say swarming season was behind. Here in PA our usual swarm season is May and June. This year I didn't hear of a local swarm until in June, and my last swarm just happened to be last week - July 2nd.

Put up a double Nuc and see if that doesn't help. If not, move it - perhaps to a slightly higher location or in a slightly different area. Out of the 5 swarms in swarm traps, 1 was caught in a deer stand - 20' high, 1 was caught on the top of a step ladder - 5' - 6' high, 2 were 4' high, and 1 was only 1' off the ground.

If possible, locate the traps where they get the morning sun, but get afternoon shade.


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## BeeGirl1982 (Jul 17, 2014)

I keep having swarms from my hives too. Traps don't seem to be working for me, even with the lure pads. Is there not something I can do to catch the swarm before they cluster in the tops of our trees?


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## Jaseemtp (Nov 29, 2010)

I agree with JW,
According to Seeley it is 40 liters. So what I have been doing is making 10 frame deeps out of 3/4 inch plywood. They have been working so far. The reason for the plywood is some times I may or may not have permission to place then where I do. If they get found or destroyed by vandals then I am not out much.

So the 10 frame deep box with some old comb in it. Some foundationless frames and only a 3/4 inch hole for the bees to use as an entrance / exit. Solid top and bottom and hope for the best. Good luck

Jason


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## BeeGirl1982 (Jul 17, 2014)

I found this swarm catcher on the internet called the swarm bandit. Would you guys tell me if it will work like it says? Thanks.

http://orrbeesupply.com


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## mathesonequip (Jul 9, 2012)

catchy names and internet claims are cheap. post #10 looks good to me. a lure or a few drops of lemon grass oil is a real good idea. the major bee supply houses and some posters on this site offer good lures at modest cost. there are also recipes to make your own. for a start, better to get some somewhere. getting a little past maximum swarm season in a lot of areas.


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## BeeGirl1982 (Jul 17, 2014)

I've had two swarms here in July. I thought our swarm season was over already. I may try one of these swarm bandits. Wouldn't catching one on the hive be more simple and sure to catch the swarm? The lures don't seem to be working for me, and definately not a "sure thing" to catch my swarms so far. Maybe it's the placement of my traps as I read above. Anymore advice?


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## mathesonequip (Jul 9, 2012)

I was curious and looked at the swarm bandit post. it is a swarm preventer not a swarm trap. other advise: be patient and try some other locations, like a few miles away.


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## Saltybee (Feb 9, 2012)

If the pressed paper worked and the nuc does not, I think I would give the paper another try.


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## BeeGirl1982 (Jul 17, 2014)

I was able to speak to Mr. Orr earlier today, he assured me that I would be able to capture the swarming queens with his device and would be able to move the swarms to a new hive within minutes after the bees settle down. The trap houses a sliding door on the back which allows me to trap the swarming queens during the swarm. The swarming bees return to the queen and cluster to the trap for my collection. Once you trap the queen,you collect the swarm cluster in the new hive, then move the trap to the new hive opening in front and open it back up to allow the queen to enter and go to work.


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## fieldsofnaturalhoney (Feb 29, 2012)

Saltybee said:


> If the pressed paper worked and the nuc does not, I think I would give the paper another try.


:thumbsup: Me too!
Katmike, wow! 100 ft, why so high?, but if it works.


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