# Figuring out when to start grafting?



## Glen H (Aug 17, 2013)

Hi,
How do you know when it is safe to start grafting queens in a given area.
what are the signs or signals that say it's time to start grafting?
Is it when the day and night time temperatures reach a certain mark?
Is it when you see pollen coming in? Is it when the hive you want to graft from has X number of frames full of sealed brood....
I know there has to be drones flying by the time the queen is ready for here mating flights.
I'm having a really hard time finding out when people in my area generally start grafting to produce queens for splits.
I'm just north of Toronto in Ontario Canada.

there is so much info on why and how to graft queens but not when to start specifically. I don't want to start too early or to late.

Glen


----------



## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

Although I can do it earlier, I have the best success when the night time temps are consistently well above 50F.


----------



## 22DPac (Jun 24, 2012)

Haven't grafted yet, but hope to in the near future. I have been told that it is time when the blackberries start blooming.


----------



## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

I would sat to start when the bees start. When you start seeing queens cells started in your colonies, the time is right.


----------



## Glen H (Aug 17, 2013)

Michael Palmer said:


> I would sat to start when the bees start. When you start seeing queens cells started in your colonies, the time is right.


Thanks Mike, In your neck of the woods is that late May, early June time frame?

Glen


----------



## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

I was supposed to start today, setting up cell builders to be grafted into in 10 days…the 20th. I'm putting it off for a few days because of this late spring.


----------



## Glen H (Aug 17, 2013)

OK perfect, Thanks Michael. I'll keep my eyes open for signs of queen cells and get ready to start soon myself.

Glen


----------



## Juhani Lunden (Oct 3, 2013)

It would be nice to know what do you folks in US recon of my definition of the best time to start queen rearing; here in Finland I usually tell beginners on a course that apple blooming is the good time to start. 

Drone rearing must be started two weeks earlier.


----------



## Glen H (Aug 17, 2013)

Juhani Lunden said:


> It would be nice to know what do you folks in US recon of my definition of the best time to start queen rearing; here in Finland I usually tell beginners on a course that apple blooming is the good time to start.
> 
> Drone rearing must be started two weeks earlier.


Thanks Juhani, sound like that is a good sign to watch for!

Glen


----------



## Kamon A. Reynolds (Apr 15, 2012)

I wait till I see drones in the purple eyed stage.


----------



## kramerbryan (Oct 30, 2013)

Purple eyes on drones is when you should start.


----------



## Grasshopper (Apr 20, 2013)

This is just an observation I've made: drone production varies from place to place. I wanted to do a cut down split on a boomer hive I had coming out of winter. I tried to look for drone production in my colonies as a sign that it would be time to make the split. I waited and waited and even when other local beekeepers assured me they had drones walking the frames and even flying, I had yet to find capped drone brood in mine. No drones anywhere. I went ahead and performed the split after talking with a mentor of mine. He said that just because I didn't have drones didn't mean there were no drones available for mating, it simply meant my colonies weren't ready to contribute to the mating process. That made a lot of sense to me. I have at least a decent feral population of honeybees. I've always had bees foraging on dandelions in my yard and pastures in the spring, even before I had colonies of my own. I guess what I'm suggesting is talk to any other local beekeeper in your area and see if they have drones. If they do, it's quite possible you're able to do it sooner than your home colonies indicate.


----------



## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

xxxx



Glen H said:


> Hi,
> How do you know when it is safe to start grafting queens in a given area.
> Timing in beekeeping is everything here.
> You can do a test graft to see how they react to this process. When the weather
> ...


----------



## Joseph Clemens (Feb 12, 2005)

Another reason why beekeeping is so "location" dependent.

Here in Tucson, Arizona. I can raise queens twelve months of the year, most years. About one year each decade (drone populations are drastically reduced), when it gets cold enough, long enough, to make queen rearing difficult, and it's always easier during the spring/summer honey flows.

- - - -
Bottom line is, availability of sufficient drones and warm enough daytime temperatures that both drones and queens can "go out together".


----------



## Glen H (Aug 17, 2013)

Grasshopper said:


> This is just an observation I've made: drone production varies from place to place. I wanted to do a cut down split on a boomer hive I had coming out of winter. I tried to look for drone production in my colonies as a sign that it would be time to make the split. I waited and waited and even when other local beekeepers assured me they had drones walking the frames and even flying, I had yet to find capped drone brood in mine. No drones anywhere. I went ahead and performed the split after talking with a mentor of mine. He said that just because I didn't have drones didn't mean there were no drones available for mating, it simply meant my colonies weren't ready to contribute to the mating process. That made a lot of sense to me. I have at least a decent feral population of honeybees. I've always had bees foraging on dandelions in my yard and pastures in the spring, even before I had colonies of my own. I guess what I'm suggesting is talk to any other local beekeeper in your area and see if they have drones. If they do, it's quite possible you're able to do it sooner than your home colonies indicate.



Thanks Grasshopper! 
That makes sense

Glen


----------



## Glen H (Aug 17, 2013)

beepro said:


> xxxx



Thanks beepro!
I just hit the jackpot of info 

Glen


----------



## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

Joseph Clemens said:


> Bottom line is, availability of sufficient drones and warm enough daytime temperatures that both drones and queens can "go out together".


True, but it's also about raising quality cells, and to raise quality cells you need the resources…both in nurse bees and forage. The bees know when there is an abundance of each, and start their queen rearing at that point. Picking a bloom like dandelion/fruit bloom, which is about when we begin to see swarm preps, is a good guideline on when to start.


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>How do you know when it is safe to start grafting queens in a given area.

If I don't see a lot of drones flying, it's too early. I have a few flying, I have some purple eyed drones, but I don't have enough flying yet... also not enough bees yet...


----------



## Glen H (Aug 17, 2013)

Michael Bush said:


> >How do you know when it is safe to start grafting queens in a given area.
> 
> If I don't see a lot of drones flying, it's too early. I have a few flying, I have some purple eyed drones, but I don't have enough flying yet... also not enough bees yet...


Thanks Michael
I'm in the same stage here, not enough drones yet, will wait another week or two.


Glen


----------



## Clayton Huestis (Jan 6, 2013)

Not to far from MP, planning on grafting on the 24th. Think that would put me @ june 2 for making up nucs.

Clay


----------

