# JZ-BZ push in protection?



## HVH (Feb 20, 2008)

If a queen cell is placed in a protector and placed in a weak to medium strength single, what are the odds that the cell will survive and end up replacing the reigning queen? One commercial beekeeper I spoke with thought the queen stings through the side of a queen cell and the workers tear down from the side as well. I can't remember actually ever seeing a cell being destroyed at the tip. Over the years I have had many queen cells torn down from the sides but am not certain if the cell protectors make the demolition team any less effective. How effective is it just to place a queen cell into a queen right colony in a protector and walk away?


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## valleyman (Nov 24, 2009)

I don't know from experience, but commercial beeks recommend putting a ripe cell in a honey super where the queen won't normally go.


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## fish_stix (May 17, 2009)

We virtually always requeen with cells and we introduce cells to our splits. I'm going to guess at about 85-95% good takes. We use the JZsBZs orange cell protectors, and hang them between frames in the brood area on splits and up in the supers (must have numerous bees working in the super) on established hives. On the recommendation of Dave Miksa several years ago we don't bother to find the old queen in established hives, just place a cell and go on to the next hive. I also have a bunch of the JZsBZs push in protectors but rarely use them. They should be placed in an area of open brood. I have never had a cell torn down from the side when in the protectors, otherwise why would anyone want to buy them? After the virgin emerges it's common for the bees to tear down the cells from inside the protector leaving only the plastic cell cup and you usually always find bees head down working inside the cage.


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## Rube63 (Jun 28, 2010)

Hey Stix
Give me a little info on the techinique of getting cells into the protectors. I have both kinds of JZsBZs protectors but the cells I deal with are not small enough to easily fit into the protector...


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## fish_stix (May 17, 2009)

I just gently push them in with my finger on the plastic cell cup. You may have to do a little wax trimming if they're way too large to go in.


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## HVH (Feb 20, 2008)

fish_stix
When you say 85-95% take could that be due to 5-15% not coming back from a mating flight of are some simply rejected for any number of causes? Also, when people say the virgin has a huge fighting advantage over the reigning queen is that before or after the mating flight? It seems really risky for the two queens to fight before the mating flight because the colony would have to start a new queen again if the virgin doesn't make it back. 
Thanks for the answer you gave.


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## Joseph Clemens (Feb 12, 2005)

As soon as the first virgin, or in most production cases, the only virgin emerges and hardens her wings and exoskeleton shes off to track down any other queens or queen cells and take care of them -- permanently. No waiting, and young virgins are powerful queen-killing-machines.


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## fish_stix (May 17, 2009)

HVH; yes a very few do not come back and some return to the wrong hive. Not good to have a $100.00 breeder queen hive invaded by a newly mated virgin! Happened to us last year. This year we painted all our nuc boxes with varied solid colored fronts and had better success with far fewer misdirected queens. We have had no problems with queens fighting and I'm of the opinion that it's a minor problem, if it even exists. I say that because we often find, after requeening, two queens in the hive getting along just fine and sometimes laying on the same frame simultaneously. This will go on for some time, in some cases several months, until the bees decide that one of them needs to go. In 50 some odd years around bees I personally have never seen queens fighting. Have seen, numerous times, a virgin going after pre-emergent cells, but never an actual fight.


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## Rube63 (Jun 28, 2010)

How long does this hardning take... please


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## HVH (Feb 20, 2008)

Thanks Guys -

Interesting; this really encourages me to requeen excessively because raising lots of extra queens is much easier than finding all the queens in multiple out yards. 
I have not seen queens fight either and in fact had an incident with many queens emerging in an incubator and crawling all over the place with no concern for one another. I have also had several hives with multiple queen cells having already emerged and many queens crawling around on the same frame. It would be nice to find a study on this because requeening can be a pain but it is central to our craft.


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