# Ross rounds vs hogg system



## grwaskom (Nov 7, 2016)

Would like pros and cons for each from people that have used them pluse what each product is retailing for in your area


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## mathesonequip (Jul 9, 2012)

both are real expensive to use. it is hardest to get the hogg squares completely filled
and perfect, consider the old style basswood squares.


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## DPBsbees (Apr 14, 2011)

I use the Hogg system and have had pretty good luck with it. You need to have it on a strong hive. I save ones that aren't completely filled and when I get 40 of them I'll combine them into another super of them. I sell them for $12 a piece so the return is pretty good.


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## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

mathesonequip said:


> consider the old style basswood squares.


Or cut comb


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## RudyT (Jan 25, 2012)

what is the weight on a finished hogg?


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## billabell (Apr 19, 2010)

Michael Palmer said:


> Or cut comb


or these: http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?216644-Romanov-frame-with-sections-for-comb-honey-production


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## DPBsbees (Apr 14, 2011)

RudyT said:


> what is the weight on a finished hogg?


Typically 12 oz.


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## mathesonequip (Jul 9, 2012)

:thumbsup:


Michael Palmer said:


> Or cut comb


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

I have known many people who have been one year and done on the rounds. There are folks who produce them reliably. They sell for $8 to 12 each here.

I have not produced the hoggs system but from using the bee o pacs from dadant I would give this advice. Using a small brush or feather I coat the bottoms with capping wax and spray a little 1:1 syrup on them. Do not put them on a colony unless it is strong enough to immediately enter and occupy the frame and most important be on a good flow. 

Separating the plastic can be hard or even changing its position on the stack. A fine wire tied to two handles to pull between boxes to separate them helps prevent damage to combs. I sell the little 4 oz combs for $3.50 each. They are really low wax content premium comb honey.


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## Clayton Huestis (Jan 6, 2013)

My experience is mostly with Ross rounds and cut comb. With a section system you trade labor for more cost. With cut comb you have more labor less costs. The costs are in packaging and and dealing with the comb. No matter what way you go all require strong colonies. Back when I did RR I averaged about 5 section supers per colony. Things to consider is if you have help or are you doing all the work alone. Do you have limited time do to a day job, etc.


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## ShrekVa (Jan 13, 2011)

billabell said:


> or these: http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?216644-Romanov-frame-with-sections-for-comb-honey-production


I've made up 2 supers of the Romanov frames to try in 2017, the link is nice but I haven't seen any reviews if you know of any please share.


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## ABruce (Dec 27, 2013)

ShrekVa said:


> I've made up 2 supers of the Romanov frames to try in 2017, the link is nice but I haven't seen any reviews if you know of any please share.


I made up four supers last year, but I fought with getting the thin wood to bend around them. I could not get bass wood, just clear pine, things got busy and I just didn't get them done. What did you do do for the wood frames? Any tips?
We did one super of Ross Rounds to try. The bees filled them perfectly, I have never seen them for sale locally to know what the going price is.


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## ShrekVa (Jan 13, 2011)

ABruce said:


> I made up four supers last year, but I fought with getting the thin wood to bend around them. I could not get bass wood, just clear pine, things got busy and I just didn't get them done. What did you do do for the wood frames? Any tips?
> We did one super of Ross Rounds to try. The bees filled them perfectly, I have never seen them for sale locally to know what the going price is.


For the thin inserts I followed the suggestions from his page. For the few I've made so far I soaked them in water scored a line with a knife and put the cuts to the outside, they didn't break.


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

Mr ShrekVa would you be so kind as to post the demensions of the Romanov boxes in language an olde man can decipher please; English not metric. I plan on making some and will get there but YOU CAN SAVE A TREE! by keeping me from having to guesstimate till I get there. Thanks in advance kind sirrah. hopefully. Happy New Year in any case. I mean the comb boxes themselves please.


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## ShrekVa (Jan 13, 2011)

It's a standard shallow box, you can either modify shallow frames or build them. Notch the top bar every 4 1/8" with your table saw and install 1/8 dividers. The thin inserts are 1/16 take a measurement of the inside of your divided areas should be 4 1/8 x 4 or 4 1/8x 4 1/8 cut a block to the correct dimension. Soak the 1/16 strips in water then lay the block starting at one end score with a knife along the edge, roll the block, repeat till you have 4 sides. Then with the cut side out fold it around the block and stick it in the divided section. That what I did anyways, hope that helps you.


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

Thankyou, how long are the 1/16" strips and how wide did you make them?


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## davpress (Mar 8, 2005)

Vance G said:


> Thankyou, how long are the 1/16" strips and how wide did you make them?


Vance check this out, the original info about these frames

http://www.beebehavior.com/romanov_comb_sections.php


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## ShrekVa (Jan 13, 2011)

Vance G said:


> Thankyou, how long are the 1/16" strips and how wide did you make them?


If your section measure the same as his 4 1/8 all around the the strip will be 16 1/2. Mine came out 4 1/8 x 4 so my strips are 16 1/4. They're the width the top bar should be or about 1". I've not uses these yet this is just my interpretation of his design.
Off subject
Also I wanted to say I use the lid design you shared with me a while back it's the only ones I make with a couple changes, thanks.


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## mathesonequip (Jul 9, 2012)

the last i knew kelley had all the basswood square stuff available.


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

As usual MP has great advice. I tried basswood squares 40 years ago. I tried Ross Rounds 35 years ago. With both these systems it is hard to get the bees to work them and you end up with unfinished product. A few years ago I had cut comb in plastic boxes and rounds next to each other on the processing table and concluded the cut comb looked better. The rings hide the honey and you only see the capping. I had put some cut comb back on the hive to have the bees remove the cut honey, and concluded the wet look was more appealing to me. 
Cut comb eliminates all special system purchasing. I just put marked foundationless frames between drawn extracting combs. Any that are not fully capped just end up in the cappings spinner, no hard to deal with unfinished product. All honey and wax easily becomes part of the crop. Now it became even better. Since I do not have a good market for retailing comb honey, I sold most this year to other beekeepers IN THE FRAME!!!! This eliminates most of the work. I weigh the comb and boxes before and after and get paid upon return. I got $9.50 - $12.50 a pound for all the comb with the boxes and frames returned. Some medium frames came to more than 4lbs a frame of product. At my scale this was only a few boxes, but it sure was easy money.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Any cassette method (Hogg Half Comb or Ross Rounds or basswood sections) requires a lot of manipulation to get the bees to make honey in the small boxes. Crowding, cut down splits etc. You can get good comb honey to make cut comb anytime you have a strong flow and you get it off while it's still white and soft.

The differences between the Hogg Half Comb and Ross Rounds is mostly about the fact that the Hogg system is "Half" comb. In other words you have to scrape the comb out of the box as it is only half of a comb so every cell is broken when you do this. I other words the "midrib" of the comb is the plastic bottom of the box. With Ross Rounds you have complete comb. You can cut a chunk of comb out with the cells, other than the cut ones, intact. This stays on your bread/biscuts better and stays nice and fresh. I would eat either, but prefer the whole comb. Of course with cut comb honey you get a whole comb as well...


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

Thanks and that cover may not be the best but it is easy to make, cheap and works fine. 

So basically one needs to make frames with 1" side. How many of those frames do you envision running in your super? 

davpress thanks also and I have read that location in detail for a couple years. I get closer every year to actually building a box or two to try. I was pleased enough with the bee o pac from Dadant that I bought six more when the freight was free at Christmas. I cut some comb honey every year but am not that happy with that process either. The only misgiving I have about the bee o pac is that they only produce 4oz combs. I wonder if people will buy one of them and have their comb honey or several. The market will tell.


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## ShrekVa (Jan 13, 2011)

I run 10 frame equipment, so I had though 8 section frames with extracting combs on the outside. Usually in my cut comb supers the outside combs aren't drawn out as well and I have to shuffle the frames to get them drawn evenly.

Vance the covers are the best for me I don't like them for bottoms but they have that option, I have them on all my full size colonies and built several more to grow into. They don't look exactly like yours but pretty much the same.


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## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

Thank Mr Black, an old mennonite beek who retired at 85 in 1976. His patent in thos days before forklifts.


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