# Refurbishing woodenware



## Dee A. Lusby (Oct 4, 2000)

I've been painting supers all afternoon. Had to put a wire wheel brush into
my handdrill first to take off loose paint and misc stuff. Then had to
tighten nails and/or replace them with either bigger ones or drywall screws
to get the supers corners to tighten down. A few supers, I had to put metal
corners on after puttying in where dovetail ends were needing fill.

Question: How do you all repair supers and equipment? How do you paint them
also? Roller, brush, spray? What type of paint? oil base, latex, stain ? Do
you brand?


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

Howdy Dee -

The only repair I've had to do to my supers are paint them. I started this summer with a few of them. Painted them in the field with a brush but next time I'll use a mini roller. I use acrylic house paint.

As you know, I'll be starting soon to make about 30 medium supers. That equates to 300 frames. Care to describe how you make your frames? I think you said you use 2X4 stock, and just rip 3/8" strips off it for the frame sides? I have a 14" band saw that I'm going to set up with a 1/2" aggressive blade and try it. Should be easier than using the table saw as the kerf is so small. Do you taper the bottom halves of the frame sides? Do you leave the top bar ends square or cut outside corners off? Questions, questions.

-Barry


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## Don (Nov 9, 2000)

I read in Dave Cushman's site about using vaseline on abutting surfaces to minimize sticking with propolis. Anyone do that here?


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## Dee A. Lusby (Oct 4, 2000)

This is in reply to Barry's post of 11-29-00 at 12:30 AM

Barry wrote:

Care to describe how you make your frames? I think you said you use 2X4 stock, and just rip 3/8" strips off it for the frame sides? 

Reply:

Yes, you can use 2 x 4, 2 x 6 or larger 2 by stock, and just rip 3/8" strips off it for the frame sides, just like cutting meat or Italian bread.

Barry further wrote:

Do you taper the bottom halves of the frame sides? Do you leave the top bar ends square or cut outside corners off? 

Reply:

Yes, the bottom halves of the frame sides can easily be tapered with a jointer or table saw or even a band saw.

We square cut the top bar ends and then run a coarse file on the outside corners to blunt them.

The grooves on the ends of the frames are done by use of an adjustable dado blade on a tablesaw with the wider groove where the top of the endbar would be.

Now also to mention, we use solid bottom bars and do not cut a groove in them but instead mount the foundation about 1/4" inch or so of the bottom bar. The reason for this is to eliminate egg laying for wax worms, as this is one of the first places they lay given a chance. Practice this with solid bottom bars and wax worm troubles will be lessened quite a bit.


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

WeDee asked what kind of paint others use.The local hardware store accumulates 'mis-mixed' paint.I go in and check from time to time and buy all their exterior acrylic latex for 5 bucks a gallon.This is top of the line stuff.I dont worry about color as we dont keep bees in hot country,but just mix it all together in a 5 gal.bucket then slop it on with a brush.
I like to make my own frames when there is time.We use med.honey supers and I like to use 9 self spacing frames,the end bars sliced 3/8" thick off of 2by4 stock.I prefer the end bars square without a taper.I drill 2 holes in each end bar then use wire.I also use a solid bottom bar,with a grooved top bar.A crimp wired 4 3/4" wax foundation is then electrically embedded.In a good flow the bees will pull these 9 frames out all the way to bottom bar.We also have factory frames that we use 9 to the box after they are drawn.I dont like these as well because they have to be hand spaced and never seem to be just right like the wider end bar frames.All our hives are in a single deep brood chamber during the summer,and the mediums are stacked above an excluder(usually).


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

WeDee?sorry Dee,a typo.


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## sailingcat (Nov 4, 2000)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Don:
*I read in Dave Cushman's site about using vaseline on abutting surfaces to minimize sticking with propolis. Anyone do that here?*<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hi Don and all
I am reading the notes on the forums about smearing Vaseline on the edges of the supers to make them easier to separate when removing. When you make the super, just make a small rabbit on the bottom of each super. This rabbit is on the outside edge, about 1/8th inch high and about ¼ inch deep. It only has to be about 1 and 1/2 inch long. Make one on each side of the super. On the inside, the bees do not know it is there. On the outside you see a small 1/8th inch groove 1/4 inch deep. Place your hive tool in the groove and pry the super off. This should bee faster then Vaseline.
Thank you 
Forrest Zielke


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

I should point out that if you move your bees around to catch various honeyflows,having everything glued together with propolis is a good thing.It keeps your lids from sailing off the load and going through the radiator of the Mercedes behind you!If the weather is warm enough to be pulling out frames,the propolis on the frames is usually no great hindrance.What I am trying to say is I see no reason to go to any extra effort to keep equipment from getting propolized.just my opinion.


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

Hi Dee,You mentioned putting on corner braces.I saw these in the picture of your hives on the cover of one of the bee magazines awhile back.I remember thinking thats a useful item.Where do you get them?Do you have them custom made locally?Another useful item I like are the metal frame savers.


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## Dee A. Lusby (Oct 4, 2000)

This is in reply to loggermike's post of 12-03-2000 at 11:10 AM

Mike wrote:

Hi Dee,You mentioned putting on corner braces.

I remember thinking thats a useful item.Where do you get them?Do you have them custom made locally?

Reply:

Well Mike, I make them myself. I go to the local hardware store and buy rolls of aluminum tin sheeting 4" wide and then cut it to length and bend the corner in a bending brake. 

Then all that is left to do is nail with long frame nails to the corners, bending the points of the nails down inside, so the corners don't come off. Then if the corners need filling to level again the woodenware, it's easy to fill the gap created between the metal corner and the wooden super with putty or silicone sealer. Finish with painting.

Hope this helps you.

Sincerely,

Dee


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

Thanks Dee,that is information I can use.


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## nothaker (Nov 29, 2000)

Dee,

As for the use of drywal screws, I would recomend deck screws. Drywal screws will rust quite quickly where as deck screws are made to be outside. They look very much like drywal screws, but can be bought in various lengths and diameters. Galvanized would be best.
Gene


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

Hi Dee, Mike -

I went ahead and posted a photo Dee sent me showing the corner braces/repairs on one of their hives. See it here: http://www.enteract.com/~bbirkey/corners.htm 

-Barry


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## sailingcat (Nov 4, 2000)

Hi Dee
Your Quote
(Well Mike, I make them myself. I go to the local hardware store and buy rolls of aluminum tin sheeting 4" wide and then cut it to length and bend the corner in a bending brake.) 

In the building trade, we use a product called corner strips. This is a metal strip eight or ten feet long, used to brace the outside corner of drywall installation. It is only about one dollar per strip. It comes at the 45 degree you use. All you have to do, is cut it to length with a tin snips. It also has the holes to drive screws.
This may save you some work.
Thank you, Forrest


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## Dee A. Lusby (Oct 4, 2000)

This is in reply to Sailingcat's post of 12-07-2000, 09:32 AM

Sailingcat wrote:

In the building trade, we use a product called corner strips. This is a metal strip eight or ten feet long, used to brace the outside corner of drywall installation. It is only about one dollar per strip. It comes at the 45 degree you use. All you have to do, is cut it to length with a tin snips. It also has the holes to drive screws.
This may save you some work.
Thank you, Forrest


Reply:

Tried using these, but the drywall corner strips were not wide enough to cover the dovetails, or at least the ones sold in our local area and the holes were not positioned properly for a super for nailing. 

Have used 2" galvanized corner flashing with good results though, but have found the rolls of 4" aluminum to be cheaper to use. Bought an inexpensive bender brake from Harbor Freight to bend the corners with, after cutting to length with aviation snips.

Thanks for your reply though.

Dee


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## Dee A. Lusby (Oct 4, 2000)

Hi figured I add my thoughts about using vasoline on woodenware,especially on surfaces inside the hive.

Now I do not want to be disrespectful to those using vasoline or petroleum jelly on wooden surfaces to keep honeybees from propolizing, but I do not find this a very healthful practice for beekeepers to do.

I believe this because propolis is used by the bees to shellac all the surfaces of the inside of the colony to keep viral,bacterial, and fungal diseases under control and is an intergral part of their keeping a steril environment and therefore healthy bees and therefore wholesome products to harvest.

To smear vasoline or petroleum jelly is to smear an oil based product that only serves to catch and hold dust and dirt and hive contaminates in my point of view, that can only add to colony distress and disease incidences.

Comments on other points of view!!

Dee


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## Dee A. Lusby (Oct 4, 2000)

Well, though I will still be painting and repairing supers thru the spring months, I am now fixing tops and bottoms and inner covers for a change of pace.

Right now I am replacing bottom runners on tops and bottoms with 2x4 stock for more support. I start with tops, then those that get older and can no longer be used for tops, I convert to bottom boards.

Besides using 2x4 stock for replacing old, more narrower bottom runners, on the tops I am converting to bottom boards, I am making new side rails (3/8") for the supers to set upon.

In doing so, I am going from 1 by to 2 by slices of wood, to give the supers more suport when set down; Also, so if there is any shifting on the bottom board, the stacks will not open a gap so readily or todder so easily.

Cracks and holes in wood I'm filling with 15yr silicone sealant and then putting a thin strip of aluminum over. I am also changing out loose nails for either bigger ones or drywall screws to get everything tight.

Inner covers I cannot repair, I am converting, from solid to wire screen centers, for use now as division boards. 

All inner covers are being altered, so that they can be used as inner covers or solid division boards (or even emergency bottom boards or top covers). I want ample division boards of both types (solid/screened center) ready for spring(since both are used differently). I am stapling with # 8 wire.

How do some of you repair your tops and bottoms and inner covers?

Dee


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## joelz (Dec 16, 2001)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dee A. Lusby:
*I've been painting supers all afternoon. Had to put a wire wheel brush into
my handdrill first to take off loose paint and misc stuff. Then had to
tighten nails and/or replace them with either bigger ones or drywall screws
to get the supers corners to tighten down. A few supers, I had to put metal
corners on after puttying in where dovetail ends were needing fill.

Question: How do you all repair supers and equipment? How do you paint them
also? Roller, brush, spray? What type of paint? oil base, latex, stain ? Do
you brand?

*<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

forget trying to rip 2x4,s to make frames at less than one dollar per frame, let dadants make them and witha few basic tolls make a frame jig and assemble 10 frames at a time. if you only take on suggestion , remember what im about to say, if you buy used equipment you are most likely buying someone elses problems, with the cost of a completey new hive 2 9-5/8" deep bodies at approx 60 dollars, it doesnt make a whole lot of sense to deiscover you have a case of afb from your used equipment, if you monkey with used equipment you will become a beliver in what i am saying. joel johnson


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## joelz (Dec 16, 2001)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dee A. Lusby:
*This is in reply to loggermike's post of 12-03-2000 at 11:10 AM

Mike wrote:

Hi Dee,You mentioned putting on corner braces.

I remember thinking thats a useful item.Where do you get them?Do you have them custom made locally?

Reply:

Well Mike, I make them myself. I go to the local hardware store and buy rolls of aluminum tin sheeting 4" wide and then cut it to length and bend the corner in a bending brake. 

Then all that is left to do is nail with long frame nails to the corners, bending the points of the nails down inside, so the corners don't come off. Then if the corners need filling to level again the woodenware, it's easy to fill the gap created between the metal corner and the wooden super with putty or silicone sealer. Finish with painting.

Hope this helps you.

Sincerely,

Dee*<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

using any type of silicone or putty on your hive equpment is asking for at a minimum lost customers and possibly worse, never use any paints, putty, sealers ect on any parts inside your hive, this is one of the golden rules of beekeeping keeping you honey pure fit for human consumption


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by joelz:
*never use any paints, putty, sealers ect on any parts inside your hive,*<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hello Joelz -

I didn't see anything in Dee's remarks that would indicate she uses any of your mentioned items INSIDE the hive. I gave a URL in a previous post showing the repair corners mentioned. Please have a look. All the repairs take place on the outside of the hive.
http://www.enteract.com/~bbirkey/corners.htm 

Regards,
Barry


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## joelz (Dec 16, 2001)

hello barry sorry my mistake, i thought inner covers, top and bottom boards were inside the hive and as for buying materials to fix a worn out corner on a hive body you have done exactly that, fix ed a worn out hive body and what do you have? a worn out hive body i dont know about youn but with the price of a commercial hive body around eight dollars i will spend my time managing my hives, finding new markets and not working on equipment that should be repalced... joel

[This message has been edited by Admin (edited December 22, 2001).]


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## Dee A. Lusby (Oct 4, 2000)

Joel wrote:
hello barry sorry my mistake, i thought inner covers, top and bottom boards were inside the hive

Reply:
They are inside a hive and that is why the paint is on the outside surfaces only. and also why metal covers are placed over anything detrimental, whether flat surface or corner.

Joel also wrote:
and as for buying materials to fix a worn out corner on a hive body you have done exactly that, fix ed a worn out hive body and what do you have? a worn out hive body i dont know about youn but with the price of a commercial hive body around eight dollars i will spend my time managing my hives, finding new markets and not working on equipment that should be repalced.

Reply:
Sorry, but I can repair many supers in a days time to make it well worth the cost. after all it doesn't take even one hour normally to fix an old super. Besides our equipment has never seen chemicals, essential oils and acids, etc and after years of usage, I consider it better then freshly cut lumber that is often treated, not cured and of lesser quality grained wood then that sold years ago. 

Super properly kept and maintained keep and service for several decades. Further, the bees themselves seem to prefer them better.

Regards,

Dee A. Lusby


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## joelz (Dec 16, 2001)

freshly cut lumber is treated?? with what air? and your bees prefer old supers? how can you tell?? painting and cleaning bodies and supers for sure trying to repair damaged corners and hole with putty and sealants, sound nice to sit around on a rainy day smearing putty and sealant on your equipment but its foolish

[This message has been edited by Admin (edited December 22, 2001).]


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## loggermike (Jul 23, 2000)

Joel,Didnt you ever hear the saying"waste not,want not"?An old farmer once told me the way to get good equipment cheap was to pick it up after the young farmer who thought he had to have all new equipment went broke.That is the economics of agriculture in general and beekeeping in particular,and isnt going to change until the dollar weakens and we are no longer drowning in cheap imported honey!-Mike


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## joelz (Dec 16, 2001)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by loggermike:
*Joel,Didnt you ever hear the saying"waste not,want not"?An old farmer once told me the way to get good equipment cheap was to pick it up after the young farmer who thought he had to have all new equipment went broke.That is the economics of agriculture in general and beekeeping in particular,and isnt going to change until the dollar weakens and we are no longer drowning in cheap imported honey!-Mike*<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

sorry to disagree, back when i was a new beekeeper i purchased cheap used equipment from a old beekeeper, and later that year i had a outbreak of afb from the used equipment, luckily, due to regular hive inspections, i was able to quarrentine my bees and avoided a major outbreak, beekeeping in particular is quite different than other types of agriculturial farming, sur use old bargin equipment, beware afb spores can survive over fifty years,personally i dont compete with cheap imported honey, there is no comparison to the honey produced here in the u.s., that is the main selling point of locally produced honey, joel


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