# Frames from Western Bee Supply



## Anthony Ritenour (Mar 17, 2008)

Can anyone give me advice on their frames? Their economy ones are real cheap.


----------



## Broke-T (Jul 9, 2008)

I bought 4,000 of their economy top bars this winter and they look real good. 

Johnny


----------



## Ardilla (Jul 17, 2006)

Generally they are pretty good. My experience (based on three orders) is maybe 2 to 4% of the top bars were warped. Most of the warped ones are usable but some are annoying.


----------



## justin (Jun 16, 2007)

i've been happy with them.


----------



## downhome (Mar 11, 2009)

I ordered about 200 of them. I've put together half. One of them was warped pretty bad. They are SUPER cheap, by cheap I mean they cost half of what everyone else is charging. I'm very happy with them. Received my order within a week. Would definitely buy from them again.

downhome


----------



## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

Browning cut stock in Juliaetta, ID has cheaper frames yet and they advertise them as #1 quality.
See there ad in American Bee Journal magazine. :thumbsup:


----------



## HONEYDEW (Mar 9, 2007)

If I'm not mistaken I believe their wooden ware is mostly Dadant stuff, including their frames..


----------



## concrete-bees (Jun 20, 2009)

we bought a bunch for them - fast shipping - great product - no complaints


----------



## wdcrkapry205 (Feb 11, 2010)

Western is owned by Dadant, that's where all their woodware comes from; strangely enough they also compete with Dadant. I have bought thousands of their frames from either Western or Dadant over the last 10 to 15 years and I prefer the commercial over the budget. Try to buy only when they are on sale, like they say you get what you pay for.


----------



## justin (Jun 16, 2007)

i don't know about ownership, but i do know that western bee makes their woodenware in polson where the office is.


----------



## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

I am putting together Western bee woodware now. The budget frames are plenty good. An occaisional warped top bar. I think they make a huge fraction of everyones woodenware.


----------



## dixie1 (Jun 27, 2010)

I bought maybe 200 from Western Bee last year around June and they went together well...I'd buy them again, except I got in on the "pay no shipping" deal from Mann Lake several times during the fall and winter, and bought their frame parts as well, and have had very good luck with them...I'd check with Mann Lake if you're looking for a good deal. I think their "pay no shipping" is still going on until their spring catalog comes out. You just have to buy over $100.00 worth to get the free shipping.

dixie


----------



## HONEYDEW (Mar 9, 2007)

```
You just have to buy over $100.00 worth to get the free shipping.
```
 Yea like thats hard to do...


----------



## Montana Bee (Feb 1, 2011)

I bought all my gear from them this year. Their woodenware is excellent. I recommend spending a few extra bucks and get their best woodenware. Vicki handles sales and is very helpful. Im getting my carnolian bees from then as well. Good luck. Are you a newbeek?

John Q
Helena, Mt


----------



## Montana Bee (Feb 1, 2011)

Actually Western Bee has a huge manufacturing plant in Polson, Montana. I've been there and they make all their woodenware.

John Q
Helena, Mt


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Recently got a large order of both frames and boxes from them through Dadants. Pricing was almost the same as Mann Lake but they gave me an incredible LTL delivery price that made the decision a no-brainer. The quality so far has been really good, but then I have always been impressed with what I get from them. Not sure that I would recommend buying their economy grade, though, with the savings only about 5 cents a frame just seems like a pretty small savings in the big picture.


----------



## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

We are not all buying in your quantity Mr. Lyon! I think the spread is .22 cents on small numbers and they cheapies look good to me. I bought the commercial boxes and am thinking I could have lived with the budget grade of those. I kept bees in budget boxes thirty years ago and you just put a soup can lid over the occaisional lost loose knot and you had to drill thru knots in some corners, other than that, they were fully servicable too. I think their seconds will last as long as their top grade. good folks


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Maybe we arent comparing "apples to apples" here. The current Dadant catalog shows the economy deep frames at 62.00/100 and their regular frame at $67.00. I wasnt talking economy of scale here at all. Nor was I trying to talk down anyone or anyones equipment just making a recommendation based on the prices I am seeing.


----------



## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

PLEASE! No offense intended. My figures are for Western bee supplies best and beasts! I am surprised you don't get more of a break than that on quantity. The best to you. I am not a stock holder!


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

No offense taken Vance. Didn't say that was the price I got or the quantities that I ordered just taking their lowest quantities listed and assuming that there would be a similar spread in pricing of higher quantities (though typically economy grades are limited). If you can get a .22 cent price savings then go for it. You don't have a monopoly on the soup can lid business either, got a few of those floating around our operation as well. Wishing you the best. Jim


----------



## Radical Bee (Feb 25, 2009)

I'm with JL on this, pay the extra nickle.

Once upon a time the diff. between budget and commercial was size and condition of knots or woodwork irregularities. Now budget gets its own grade of wood, the open ends on the box cuts look like larger cells and more rapid growth.........if you dip your frames might not matter though.

imo its a nickle well spent for the diff. in what i got years ago and what i got last yr.


----------



## Broke-T (Jul 9, 2008)

Current prices at Westernbee.

6 1/4 commercial frame $0.73
6 1/4 budget frame $0.53

Difference $0.20

I am putting together 5,000 right now. That $1,000.00 difference is what keeps me in business. 

Watch the pennies and the dollars take care of themselves.

Johnny


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Current 5,000+ pricing on 6 1/4" unassembled (#1's all): Mann Lake .59
Dadant .60


----------



## Broke-T (Jul 9, 2008)

Jim this is straight from web sites.

Current 5,000+ price from Western Bee is .42 for budget
http://www.westernbee.com/qs30/products.php?pid=13&detail=true


Current 5,000+ price from Mann Lake is .66 for select
http://www.mannlakeltd.com/ProductDetail.asp?idproduct=1618&idCategory=

Western bee makes Dadant frames. With shipping the budget is still 20 cents cheaper. If you want to pay the extra, fine. But don't say that the budget are not way cheaper.

Johnny


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Easy Johnny you are the one that said they were .53 not me. I had to go back to figure out how I touched a raw nerve with some, perhaps I should never have stated that since the Dadant catalog shows a .05 price difference between the two grades it wouldnt be worth it to me except I stand by that statement. Perhaps I shouldnt have quoted the 5,000 prices but I know them to be accurate as of about a month ago (it may have fluctuated a few cents recently) but the only way to find out for sure is to talk directly to them and get a current quote, things can change pretty quickly. Budget/economy grades are always subject to availability and price fluctuations, no doubt if you had known they were going to be cutting prices like this you would have held off on your purchase and saved another $500 but it may be just as likely that their latest lumber purchases graded out better than expected and almost none would be available. As far as the .42 goes it sounds like its probably a pretty good deal but if I might paraphrase Forrest Gump "budget frames are like a box of chocolates you never know what you'll get". Yes I have bought them in the past, sometimes they are pretty good, sometimes they are pretty good if you have have the time and patience to do a little picking, choosing, and extra gluing and sometimes enough of it ends up in the wood stove that it simply isnt worth the price. If this offends anyone then I am hereby issuing my second apology in this thread.


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>If I'm not mistaken I believe their wooden ware is mostly Dadant stuff, including their frames.. 

They used to be two different companies. Eventually (sometime between the late 70's and the late 90's) I believe Dadant bought Western Bee Supply. So Dadant's woodenware is produced by Dadant's subsidiary, Western Bee Supply which also competes with the parent company...


----------



## HONEYDEW (Mar 9, 2007)

also don't forget when pricing anything from Mann Lake that their price includes shipping if the total order is over 100.00, And yes J.L. I am officially offended at not being offended :lookout:


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Better not get started on whole Mann Lake free shipping thing I've already stirred things up enough already  . Anyway glad to hear you weren't offended or were you, now you've got me confused. :scratch:


----------



## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

Browning Cut Stock has 6 1/4" #1 grade frames at $.48 each no matter what on quantity ordered. 9 1/8" #1 grade frames are $.50 each.
Best thing is I can drive about 1 hr. and pick them up.
But I guess I can drive 3hrs. the opposite direction and be at Western Bee as well.
I like the prices on Brownings med. supers at $5.15 each, not bad!
I could not cut box joints for this cheap in numbers!


----------



## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

Jim,
You want me to drop of 10,000 frames on my way through your neck of the woods in May? 
Maybe we can trade those frames for that extra Swinger or Hummerbee you don't use anymore? 
LOL! Mtn. Bee

I can also drop off 1,000-2,000 colonies and come back through this fall and pick them up if you feel like babysitting the girls for me?


----------



## honeyhaus (Nov 12, 2004)

We purchase 22,000 of them in 2010 of which 7-10% were unusable. We have a silver queen uncapper and they are bowed enough to take a knife out. We burned them after being unable to get any kind of a refund or exchange. Most of the warping came after they were put together and it didn't matter what size the frames were, deep-ill.- or 7-5/8. As we run them through the system and before we discard them, we are going to take pictures and post them for others to see. Should have done this earlier.


----------



## Vance G (Jan 6, 2011)

fAIR DISCLOSURE and crow taste in my mouth as a western bee cheerleader. I just put together a small batch of western bee 9 5/8 boxes commercial grade and they are disappointing. The milling is off slightly on the joints and it slows you down having to check to see if things need trimmed before you bang them together. The pre drilled holes to keep the wood from splitting are all over the place. You can't just go on remote control, you have to decide every nail whether to use the hole. If you don't you get a lot of nails out the side. I know the big boys all use staplers and thats not an issue for them. The wood is not the quality I used to get from them. I wonder if it was fire or beetle salvage a year too long in the forest? The budget frames I got are no trouble for a hobbyist, but I guess with automated machinery, some could be unusable becaue of the top bar warp. Nothing like the high percentage some found, but I can see they would cause trouble for part time help. Quality pays if you can afford it.


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Al: Sounds pretty frustrating. One suggestion is to get the new style serrated knife in your silver queen, those warped top bars will go through without catching on the blade. Been there and done that with the old style blade.


----------

