# Assembling Frames



## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

What size staples? Got a small square?


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## Robbo (May 11, 2008)

i made a small movie on that - hope that helps  :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvUe5ikCwec&list=UUEmkkUDGiNsLyGUoxb17-hg&index=1&feature=plcp

My advice is do a bit each night rather than all in 1 go


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## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

If you use narrow crown staples...use only one staple + glue per end of top bar. Two will damage the wood enough to create a weakness in the wood and the ears can break off.


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## carlinmo (Jun 6, 2010)

I assemble the top bar and two side bars exactly as shown in the video (except 1 staple). I remove the three-sided frames from the jig and lay them angled across the top of the jig. I then glue up the bottom bar and install the foundation and then staple on the bottom bar. This will save a tremendous amount of time in the long run and your foundation will lay nice and flat.

Carl Korschgen


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## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Michael Palmer said:


> If you use narrow crown staples...use only one staple + glue per end of top bar. Two will damage the wood enough to create a weakness in the wood and the ears can break off.


What a gem of a tip! Thanks Michael!!! A little late on about 150 frames I've done...but, more to do!!!...with one staple!! 

Thanks again!!!
Ed


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## Live Oak (Oct 11, 2008)

I have found this works best for me. I can build, frame, and wax 40 to 60 frames per hour when I am on a good roll. 

You can make your own or buy one (frame nailing device):

https://kelleybees.com/Products/Detail/?id=3336333233313331&grouped=1

I use the N Style Frames:

https://kelleybees.com/Products/Detail/?id=3336333533363330&grouped=1

I use Elmer's Wood Glue, use your preferred glue. I use 1 1/4 " finish brads in a air stapler to nail frames together tight until the glue sets up.

Assemble pretty much as per the video only no wiring or melting wax into wire

Choose your preferred cell size. NO HOOKS. Buy in bulk and save. 

https://kelleybees.com/Products/Detail/?id=3336333133383334&grouped=1

Slide in the sheet of foundation.

Use Suppor Pins instead of wire.

https://kelleybees.com/Products/Detail/?id=3336333233323338&grouped=1

Carefully insert pins. 

You are done.


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## max2 (Dec 24, 2009)

"Use Suppor Pins instead of wire."

Do you find that the pins hold the foundation as well as wire - not having any support in the center?


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## Robbo (May 11, 2008)

Gee the support pin looks like a good idea. Unavailable in Australia I suspect though. Wouldnt mind giving them a try.


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## max2 (Dec 24, 2009)

Robbo said:


> Gee the support pin looks like a good idea. Unavailable in Australia I suspect though. Wouldnt mind giving them a try.


I just did a search - unfortunate name - pins and badges come up - but nobody in Australia seems to stock them.


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## Intheswamp (Jul 5, 2011)

Use what the ladies around here call "bobby pins" or "bobbie pins". Brown looking clips to hold their hair in place. I had a rep at one of the larger bee supply houses recommend these but I haven't tried them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_pin

Ed


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

Max..Robbo...Live Oak...Inthe swamp..... Been using Bobbi Pins for years. If you want to hold the foundation straight until the bees attach it, go to Dollar General Store, Wal Mart, etc. and Buy Bobbi Pins, Yes, Ladies Hair Pins. They are longer than the pins sold to hold the foundation, and normall are 100 for $1.00. Much easier to insert, much longer than pins, much cheaper. 

I went in to the local Dollar Store not long ago and picked up 15 cards, (1500 Bobbi Pins), the clerk said, "You don't have that much hair". I laughed, then told her what I do with them. Be prepared to be laughed at. Better yet, let your wife pick them up for you.

cchoganjr


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## max2 (Dec 24, 2009)

". Been using Bobbi Pins for years"

I can't quite picture how the Bobby Pins are used? I assume that they are pushed through the holes but the BP seem to be to large?
I would appreciate some further explanation. Thanks.


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## BEES4U (Oct 10, 2007)

Re: Support pins.
The support pins that I used to purchase were for making comb honey in shallows. I have seen hair pins used. They will not provide the strength that frame wires do.
I use a wide crown staples for top and bottom grooved wooden ware and snap in a sheet of plastic foundation.
Hint. Soak the tips of the frame wooden ware for about a minute and then assemble.
Try to purchase select quality frames that have straight wood grain. You will find out quickly how a nail or a staple will follow the wood grain. So, keep your fingers out of the range of staples when you pull the trigger! 
Good luck,


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

max2..bees4u...I will try to get the camera out today and post a photo of how the bobbi pin inserts. I use them all the time. In brood frames, I use wired foundation, and the bobbi pin is long enough to reach all the way across the first vertical wire in the wax. Commercial support pins will not do this. The bobbi pins will hold the foundation straight until the bees knit the foundation to the frame

Bees4u is right. Support pins or bobbi pins will not provide the strength that cross wiring does. However, I quit crosswiring, several yearsw ago , and do not have a problem with sagging combs or blown combs while extracting. 

It is a matter of preference, but, I like the wedge top bars, and wired foundation in the brood chamber with 4 bobbi pins to hold the foundation straight until they draw the comb. In shallows, I like wedge top bars, and use two bobbi pins to hold the foundation. No wire in the shallows. If I extract first year shallows, I go a little slower on extractor speed until the frame is partiall slung, then increase the speed to get all the honey. It is easy to blow comb on first year foundation, without wire, if you spin too fast. cchoganjr


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## Live Oak (Oct 11, 2008)

max2 said:


> "Use Suppor Pins instead of wire."
> 
> Do you find that the pins hold the foundation as well as wire - not having any support in the center?


The wax foundation comes with wire already impregnated in it that runs vertically which provide good support to the center, the support pins hold horizontally. This works pretty well for me. I have not had any foundation blow outs in my extractor but then again, I am using an 18 frame radial extractor. 

This set up allows for much easier replacement of the foundation.


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## BeeGhost (May 7, 2011)

I just use brads and tite bond glue and a jig. I also fire a brad in at an angle from the side bar into the top bar just as a prevention. The brads actually hold the frame together while the glue dries...........wood glue is extremely tough/bonding. I had a top bar snap in half longitudially, I glued it, clamped it and put it into use in the brood chamber and its holding up with no problems!! I would glue every joint possible and then I let the frames sit for a day before installing the Rite Cell foundation.


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

PHOTO OF BOBBI PINS AND SUPPORT PINS........ Here is a link to my photobucket acct. The first photo shows a deep, wire embedded frame, supported on one end by Bobbi Pins, and on the other end by Support Pins. Notice that the Bobbi Pins overlap the first verticle wire. I like that. The Support Pins are not long enough to overlap the verticle wire. Bobby Pins are 1 cent each, Support Pins are 7 Cents each. Both work. I just like the Bobbi Pins better, and they are cheaper.

http://s841.photobucket.com/albums/zz339/cchoganjr/


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## max2 (Dec 24, 2009)

Thanks for the photos - love the look of your apiary! About the pins. I'm using plain wax foundation. I don't htink it would work with only pins. Good idea if you are using wired foundation. Not common in Australia.
thanks


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

max2 I use them with plain foundation in honey supers. It just holds the foundation straight until the bees knit it to the frames. If you handle the frames easily , you don't need them, but, if you load up supers, or deeps, and bounce them around getting to bee yards, it helps to keep them stright. For making comb honey, they come right out. cchoganjr


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## max2 (Dec 24, 2009)

thanks cchoganjr ! I will have to try it.


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## seal62 (Apr 17, 2011)

I went with this . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvUe5ikCwec&feature=related


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