# Top Bar Width



## mjdtexan (Feb 17, 2009)

I built a Kenyan style box yesterday. It is only two foot long. I am still confused about the width needed for the bars. Do all of them need to be 1¼ inches or do some of them need to be larger? If so, how much larger?


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## raosmun (Sep 10, 2009)

There is a lot of threads on width/style, just search. In general 1 3/8ths seams to be the norm. However: many use 1 1/4 for brood then 1 3/8 and/or 1 1/2 for honey. So go figure:scratch: I have one TBH (X 4') with all 1 3/8 bars, my other two use 1" bars w/ 3/" spacers.
My two cents worth.


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## mjdtexan (Feb 17, 2009)

raosmun said:


> There is a lot of threads on width/style, just search. In general 1 3/8ths seams to be the norm. However: many use 1 1/4 for brood then 1 3/8 and/or 1 1/2 for honey. So go figure:scratch: I have one TBH (X 4') with all 1 3/8 bars, my other two use 1" bars w/ 3/" spacers.
> My two cents worth.


There *are* a lot of threads with this information and that is why I am a bit confused about it. I *think* I would like to do the 1¼ for brood thing and the 1½ for honey thing. Should this be half for brood and half for honey or a different ratio?

Btw, Thank You so much for responding and helping me. :thumbsup:


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## bigbearomaha (Sep 3, 2009)

in my case, I use the 1 1/4 and 1 1/2 bars. 1 for 1 so equal number of bars.

a 48" long tbh is a rough equiv to 2 deeps. some folks use the 'it takes 1 frame/bar of honey to raise 1 bar/frame of brood. also, if you consider that it will take may 60 or more pounds of honey to survive winter and assuming that each fully drawn and filled top bar will weigh maybe 5 pounds, that's at least 12 bars of honey you need available.

just my own little 2 cent.

Big Bear


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## mjdtexan (Feb 17, 2009)

bigbearomaha said:


> in my case, I use the 1 1/4 and 1 1/2 bars. 1 for 1 so equal number of bars.
> 
> a 48" long tbh is a rough equiv to 2 deeps. some folks use the 'it takes 1 frame/bar of honey to raise 1 bar/frame of brood. also, if you consider that it will take may 60 or more pounds of honey to survive winter and assuming that each fully drawn and filled top bar will weigh maybe 5 pounds, that's at least 12 bars of honey you need available.
> 
> ...


So, what I think one of the things you are trying to say to me is that I need to make by box at least 48 inches long? Is that right? My 24 inch long box will not hold enough honey to support a colony of bees? 

Please, everybody and anybody, if you see me doing something wrong, please jump in and let me know. I've been pricing bees in my area, they aint cheap.

BTW- I am eating eggs, from my own chickens, that have a nice Habanero & Orange hot sauce that I made on them. I am in a good mood this morning, the weather is supposed to bee better today


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## Beethinking (Jun 2, 2008)

I just run 1 3/8" throughout the hive and have few issues.

Regarding the hive length -- I'd certainly look into making the hive a bit longer. Most of my hives are between 42" and 48" and the bees fill them up quite rapidly. A 24" hive will likely fill up very quickly and have issues with swarming and lack of stores. 

How long are your bars? How deep is the box? 

Cheers,
Matt


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## bigbearomaha (Sep 3, 2009)

No, you can make it any size you want, I was just saying that's how I build mine. I also plan to build some smaller 'nuc' size ktbh's as well that are maybe only big enough for ten bars , give or take a couple.

Despite what you might read or hear from time to time, there is seldom a concrete 'right' or 'wrong' in beekeeping. The bees will let you know if you do something they cannot tolerate.

most of it is what fits your style, goals and objectives.

Big Bear


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## camero7 (Sep 21, 2009)

I've had luck using 1" bars and 1/4" spacers in the brood area and 3/8" spacers in the honey area. I think your hive might be a little short and prone to swarming. The advantage to the spacers is it allows you to super the hive quite easily by just pulling out the appropriate # of spacers. Further, you can build a super to fit your hive and use a couple of honey bars to bait the super to get them up into it. I use top entrances and when I super I make the entrance through the super to ensure the bees are in it.


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## mjdtexan (Feb 17, 2009)

I am going to go to Home Depot tomorrow and get me some new wood and make a couple of 4ft ones. I do understand that you can use a smaller one but I want to make mine bigger. The two foot one that I built I built out of "found" lumber and there are a couple of gaps because the wood is not straight. When you run into that what is safe to use to fill the gaps? I could use that one to attract a feral swarm.

Thank Yall all who have replied. I really do appreciate yalls help.


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## raosmun (Sep 10, 2009)

camero7 said:


> I've had luck using 1" bars and 1/4" spacers in the brood area and 3/8" spacers in the honey area. I think your hive might be a little short and prone to swarming. The advantage to the spacers is it allows you to super the hive quite easily by just pulling out the appropriate # of spacers. Further, you can build a super to fit your hive and use a couple of honey bars to bait the super to get them up into it. I use top entrances and when I super I make the entrance through the super to ensure the bees are in it.


:thumbsup::thumbsup:

What got my attention is your use of "top entrances" "through the super", would you elaborate, please. Too many ??, on top or bottom of the super; which end/side of the super; were is the super placed on the 4' TBH, on & on & on. I do not want to be an ***** about this! but there is little pratical information from experenced TBH BK's out there!!

I see two big advantages uasing "long Langs or TBH's." One is weight the other is not haveng lot of PO'ed bees doing hive manipulations.


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## mjdtexan (Feb 17, 2009)

Its been suggested that the brood bars be one length and the honey storage bars be another size. Do you put all the brood bars toward the front entrance on the TBH?

I did manage to find some 1x11's here so I went ahead and built me a 48 inch TBH. I think what I need is a mentor that is currently running a Top Bar Hive..

When will I be purchasing bees to add to my new TBH?

I have not yet built the entrance because I am a little confused about which type to use.


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## camero7 (Sep 21, 2009)

Hi Raosmun,

I use top entrances on all 3 of my hives [Kenyan, Tanzanian and Long hive]. When I super the hive I use the top of the super with it's migratory cover as an entrance. I use regular wood shingles Ala Bush bees to create the entrances on the supers. Works very well. I put the super over the brood nest once the TBH is almost full. I also keep putting empty bars into the brood nest, one at a time, until it's built out to about 2 1/2 supers equivalent. Then when I super I take a bar of honey and bait the super. this plus the top entrance through the super has been successful for me in building bars of honey in the super. I must caution that I am only into my second year of this experiment and not an expert by any means. Also, since the 2nd winter is supposed to be the most deadly to a hive, who knows if they will survive. Been awfully cold here.


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## camero7 (Sep 21, 2009)

mjdtexan,

My bees have "followed the book" and built their brood nest close to the entrance. Usually one bar in... 

I think you mean width and not length for brood/honey bars. I have all my bars 1" and use spacers... some 1/4" in the brood area and 3/8" in the honey area. That has gotten a little tight and I may try 1/2" in the honey area. However, I find that the 1&1/4" spacing in the brood area is about right. Gives the bees the ability to cover the brood well.


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