# Newly installed queen not laying eggs



## ruthiesbees (Aug 27, 2013)

can you spot the queen to be sure she is really still there? Is this your first package of bees? Sometimes it helps to have a seasoned beek come over and help you look.


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## mharbison0722 (Mar 8, 2017)

ruthiesbees said:


> can you spot the queen to be sure she is really still there? Is this your first package of bees? Sometimes it helps to have a seasoned beek come over and help you look.


Yes, I've seen her. She has a red dot on her back, so she is there.


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## ruthiesbees (Aug 27, 2013)

well let's hope the package producer is using a non-standard marking for his queens. Red would be for a 2013 queen and that wouldn't be good. Are you able to move the bees off the centers of the frames? Usually the queen will lay in concentric spirals, so that the outsides of the frame are the last to be laid up. And the worker bees can be pretty good at hiding the larvae if they are in there thick. Although, after a week of the queen being released, you should see some larger larvae. Have you contacted the package supplier to see if they will replace the queen for you?


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## mharbison0722 (Mar 8, 2017)

ruthiesbees said:


> well let's hope the package producer is using a non-standard marking for his queens. Red would be for a 2013 queen and that wouldn't be good. Are you able to move the bees off the centers of the frames? Usually the queen will lay in concentric spirals, so that the outsides of the frame are the last to be laid up. And the worker bees can be pretty good at hiding the larvae if they are in there thick. Although, after a week of the queen being released, you should see some larger larvae. Have you contacted the package supplier to see if they will replace the queen for you?


Yes, they stated that they do NOT use the standard marking system. And that if there is no change to call them tomorrow and they would ship me a new one. I sure hate to have another failure this year so I want to do everything right!


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## mharbison0722 (Mar 8, 2017)

ruthiesbees said:


> well let's hope the package producer is using a non-standard marking for his queens. Red would be for a 2013 queen and that wouldn't be good. Are you able to move the bees off the centers of the frames? Usually the queen will lay in concentric spirals, so that the outsides of the frame are the last to be laid up. And the worker bees can be pretty good at hiding the larvae if they are in there thick. Although, after a week of the queen being released, you should see some larger larvae. Have you contacted the package supplier to see if they will replace the queen for you?


Another silly question...... is there ANYTHING you can do with a queen that's not laying? Or is it just "off with her head!" ????? I feel bad about it. But I guess that just comes with it.


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## QueenlessDrone (Nov 30, 2015)

I have heard you can take the useless queen and put her in some alcohol to use as a lure for swarms. Not to much alcohol just enough to cover her to make it concentrated.


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## mharbison0722 (Mar 8, 2017)

QueenlessDrone said:


> I have heard you can take the useless queen and put her in some alcohol to use as a lure for swarms. Not to much alcohol just enough to cover her to make it concentrated.


That's a very interesting idea!! I'm trying to catch a swarm now. I have a ton of honeybees in my backyard and I put out an old hive to see if they would take to it.
Thanks for the advice.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

I would put this queen inside a nuc hive both for a new nuc and as a back up in case the new queen does not get accepted. Older queen will
take longer time to start laying if the cells are not plug up with syrup yet. Any queen will need a place to lay. Make sure you are
not overfeeding them. Sometimes the new queen will need 2 week to start laying from the stress while in transit. I say give her more time!


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## Lburou (May 13, 2012)

mharbison0722 said:


> Yes, they stated...if there is no change to call them tomorrow and they would ship me a new one...


That is a good plan. 18 days is long enough to wait. If you have resources to put her in a NUC, that would be okay. In my view, you need another queen.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

I agree with Lee (above), particularly since it appears from post #1 that this is the OP's first and _only_ hive.


... no resources available to make a split ...


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Maybe I have been doing too many little bee experiment here. The split is to hold the old queen temporarily until
the new queen is established. You can cage her inside a small cage and hang it on the side of the frame. Once the
new queen is laying then you can make a split if you want to. A queen like this is a perfect candidate for the I.I. process. Consider
getting another hive to help each other in case of issues.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Lets see ... new package bees ... no eggs laid ... no brood .... no other hive available ... new beekeeper ...
... and you are advising doing a _split_! :scratch: :s

[hr] [/hr]
_mharbison_: Get the seller to ship the replacement queen ASAP, get her installed, keep feeding and don't consider a split unless/until they develop into a booming hive. Each day's delay in getting eggs laid puts them further behind as package bees have a wide age distribution, and some will age out and die every day. Its about 3 weeks before newly laid eggs mature into emerged bees and the hive population can even _begin_ to climb back up.

Its always better to start with two hives (rather than one) as resources can be borrowed from one colony to fix problems with the other. But most of us have to live within real financial constraints.


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## Forgiven (Nov 17, 2016)

How full of feed are those frames? Is there any empty room to lay eggs in?


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## mharbison0722 (Mar 8, 2017)

Forgiven said:


> How full of feed are those frames? Is there any empty room to lay eggs in?


I can say that there is QUITE a bit of feed in the frames. I have now replaced the old queen, who ended up laying a LITTLE BIT...... but they had also created a new queen cell. So obviously the old queen was not holding up to the hive standards. Have I done right?
Thanks for your help!


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## Lburou (May 13, 2012)

mharbison0722 said:


> ...I have now replaced the old queen...Have I done right?...


You did right! Feed them and give them plenty of room to grow. Post some pictures and let us see how things are going.


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## DavidZ (Apr 9, 2016)

Rader Sidetrack said:


> Lets see ... new package bees ... no eggs laid ... no brood .... no other hive available ... new beekeeper ...
> ... and you are advising doing a _split_! :scratch: :s
> 
> [hr] [/hr]
> ...


and I.I. which costs over $125US and upwards of $500US, ok now...


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

The old traditional way of beekeeping is too rigid and restricted. Using tradition but with a focus for future innovation is
the way from now on. My method of splitting (coming from one of my little bee experiments) is to have 2 queens sharing the same cluster of bees in the same bee box separated by a follower board with a #8 hardware wire mesh in the middle of the brood nest. There will be no empty space on both sides of the bee box so that the bees will be warmer with each others. Can this be done? Yep, done it before! Perfected it already. This is how I overwintered my small 3-5 frame nuc hives for the last 3 years.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

David, the I.I. process is not that expensive either. The price of the instrument is expensive because
too many metal parts added to it just to make it more shiny looking. A syringe only cost $2 dollars max. The 4 tweezers, with one holding the stinger while another one opening up the other side only cost .99 cents at the dollar store. The micro capillary cost $17 bucks on ebay. Now the only expensive part is the CO2 tank and connectors around $30 dollars. And the usb microscope is $10 dollars only. The other parts can be homemade with the local materials.


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