# Wing clipped Queens



## PaulC (Nov 20, 2011)

Any advantaged to purchasing a wing clipped queen or is this over kill? Seems like it would add more stress to an already stressful situation.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

In my experience, it's irrelevant. Unless you are in your beeyards everyday at 10:00 am they will swarm anyway (swarm prevention is the reason for clipping). If you ARE in the beeyards every mid morning you can see them trying and possibly intervene, but I'm at work at that time...


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## Steven Ogborn (Jun 3, 2011)

I ordered mine clipped and marked. This actually helped me have any bees right now. I had screened bottoms on my
top bar hives. I suspect that they tried to abscond because of the screened bottoms letting in to much light and air
for the comfort of newly installed packages. I came home from work to find a small ball of bees on the ground in front
of my hives. Then one of them crawled to the top of the pile. She had a white dot on her back. That was my queen.
I picked her up and placed her and the ball of bees back into the hive. when I opened the hive, there weren't any 
bees in it. As I closed up the hive, there seemed to be more flight activity of bees in the area. Gradually they landed
back on the hive and started to work their way back in. I suspect (can't prove) that they were trying to abscond
and when the queen couldn't follow they came back. This happened to both my hives. I had to put one queen
up into the hive 3 times before I found a thread here talking about what might be going on. I cut a 1 x12 long
enough to fit under my hives and they never tried to leave again. Without my queens being clipped, I would
have two empty troughs right now.


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## Steven Ogborn (Jun 3, 2011)

Also, If you're getting packages from R. Weaver, To order your packages without a clipped and mark queen is a special order queen
and the package will cost you 5 dollars more.


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## EmBee (Nov 28, 2011)

Thanks for the info on bottom screen w/o a bottom board allowing too much light & air. I haven't considered getting a clipped queen, but now I will. I'd read to get a marked queen so when you check the hive, she's easy to find & you can be relatively sure your hive isn't being populated by an unknown queen. Now, I'll be sure to add a board below the screened floor when I build one.


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## PaulC (Nov 20, 2011)

That was good information. My first hive so I will be more cautious and get a clipped queen.


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## mike haney (Feb 9, 2007)

in my (limited) experience with clipped queens they were immediately superceded.


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## PaulC (Nov 20, 2011)

mike haney said:


> in my (limited) experience with clipped queens they were immediately superceded.


So you are saying as soon as the colony is established the clipped queen will be replaced??


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## mike haney (Feb 9, 2007)

PaulC said:


> So you are saying as soon as the colony is established the clipped queen will be replaced??


thats been my experience.within a month,they are replaced.


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## EmBee (Nov 28, 2011)

mike haney said:


> thats been my experience.within a month,they are replaced.


I will be ordering my 1st package & queen in a few weeks. So are you saying, in your experience, if the queen's wings are clipped, the workers are more likely to reject her in about a month?


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## Steven Ogborn (Jun 3, 2011)

From what I understand, Clipping a queens wing has nothing to do with them being superceded. I've heard that supercedure
has come from poor mating and long banking has been blamed. Rough handling during clipping,marking, caging is also a possibility.
Poor queens without clipped wings get superceded also.
Some people don't like clipped queens as if it is cruelty to animals or something. Recently it was Texas law that your queens were clipped. 
All of those were in danger of supercedure? All those queens? All those years?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Last estimate I heard from an expert was that the average queen gets superseded three times a year... packages seem to have an even higher rate. That's not taking into account clipping, but my guess is that's a minor issue if it contributes at all...


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## mike haney (Feb 9, 2007)

EmBee said:


> I will be ordering my 1st package & queen in a few weeks. So are you saying, in your experience, if the queen's wings are clipped, the workers are more likely to reject her in about a month?


cant say about packages-MY (did everybody get that? _MY_) experience has only been with requeening established hives.
I'm not trying to sell anything,convert anyone, or make any statements about beekeeping per se.
just trying to contribute by reporting personal observations. sorry


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## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

EmBee said:


> I will be ordering my 1st package & queen in a few weeks. So are you saying, in your experience, if the queen's wings are clipped, the workers are more likely to reject her in about a month?



That is a BIG NO!
They will supersede them if they have been clipped to short. That is exactly what they were doing to my queens when I first started clipping wings and clipped way too short and both wings. Live and learn! 
Once I started clipping correctly (the tip of 1 wing or about 1/8-1/4 of the wing) everything straightened out and I had some colonies that have 3rd season clipped queens in them.
I highly recommend clipping as it saves you a lot of bees and queens, which equal $$.
But since I am starting to sell queens and med. nucs maybe I should not be saying that!? 
My outyards cover some miles and I work a full time job besides being a sideliner Beek so swarm season can take a toll on things, so I started clipping my queens as recommended by my old mentor beek friend.
Now I usually find my swarms hanging out under the bottom boards or plywood on the pallets with the new queen and other half of the colony living above them in the original hive boxes, sometimes even constructing comb between the top and bottom of the pallet.
It is nice to just drive up and sweep the swarm into a nuc box and move them to a new location compared to what I used to do: climbing trees, cut limbs with swarms falling on top of me, or watching my bees fly away to become some other beeks bees.
Clipping does not cause any problems if done correctly and it will make things easier for you and will save you $.
My 2 cents and you will learn from my costly headaches!


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>just trying to contribute by reporting personal observations. sorry 

That's what a forum is for. Nothing for you to be sorry about. You are not the only one with that opinion.


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