# Total Loss of my split



## GFWestTexas (Jul 10, 2021)

Possible pesticide poisoning? How are you making your sugar syrup synoviaus?


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## synoviaus (Jul 28, 2021)

1 pint Hot water to 1 pound pure white sugar. Top feeder


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## GFWestTexas (Jul 10, 2021)

Hydroxymethylfurfural (HMF) can be produced when sugar is heated it is toxic bees. I no longer heat water at all, you can use warm water and the sugar it will dissolve. This is a possibility, but I still suspect pesticides.


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## synoviaus (Jul 28, 2021)

Water was just from the tap not at all heated via stove. I’m near a lot of farms and broiler chicken houses. So pesticides is definitely a possible answer. I just had not thought of it. My worry was I somehow created the loss.


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## Marcin (Jun 15, 2011)

Post a picture of the dead bees. Has the queen been accepted and laying? 
While pesticide poisoning is a good possibility, and cwould be my first guess, it could also have been robbing. Or overheated. Nucs have a hard time thermoregulating compared to normal sized colonies.


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## synoviaus (Jul 28, 2021)

I am surrounded by soybeans and chicken farms so pesticides are a real possibility. Nuc has some mesh covered vent openings to help. I’m in Alabama so heat is a factor we consider here. They are under outer edge of big pine for shade too.


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## AR Beekeeper (Sep 25, 2008)

synoviaus; How much syrup did you feed per day, and how much did the bees have stored?


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## ankklackning (Dec 10, 2020)

Unfortunately... if its pesticide poisoning you will have to check your other hives also. And you will likely see a pile of dead bees there also, though it might not be as many. Usually w pesticide poisoning its all the hives in that apiary that get a hit not just one. Its awful to see.

You could also reach out to beekeepers in your same city and see if others are experiencing the same.

I would not do hot water for making syrup. That could be really bad.


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## AR Beekeeper (Sep 25, 2008)

HMF is not formed if the water is heated and removed from the heat source before the sugar is added. It only forms when the sugar/water mixture is allowed to remain on the heat source. Even then the mixture must be scorched for it to form.

The pesticide kills I have seen had dead bees in piles on the ground at the entrance. When the dead adult bees were inside on the bottom board the cause was usually starvation, robbing frenzy kill, or overheating. A strong nuc can over heat with an open entrance if it is in the sun. Comb inspection will show chewing if robbing was the cause.


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## Fivej (Apr 4, 2016)

The sudden death of all of the bees inside the hive is a strong clue. I don't know what did it but it sounds like overheating more than anything else. Did you have a hot, muggy, rainy night right before you discovered this?
J


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## synoviaus (Jul 28, 2021)

Yes it rains most afternoons here. Really hot until sunset then pop up thunderstorms.


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## Fivej (Apr 4, 2016)

Maybe the storms at night prevented them from bearding and the hive overheated. J


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## GFWestTexas (Jul 10, 2021)

I don’t know about all the overheating issues, I do know that temperatures around here normally are triple digits for three months, and I’ve never lost hive in this manner. That said, I am sure humidity plays a huge role in this, I have used vented inner covers since I started, with a solid bottom board, to keep air flow, and moisture from building up (Works in this area). Bee’s are quite good at maintaining constants with in a hive. I am not in any way saying this is not the cause, because I am always hearing about this issue, but perhaps we need to look at how our hives are set up for our climate to prevent such things in the future. As far as pesticides all hives would not be effected, as colonies often forage in different areas, and then there is toxicity level of what ever they got into. Never been to Alabama so I know nothing of climate, but if you believe these bee’s died of heat exposure. I would contact the local bee club and see what others are using in that area to prevent this. Regardless it stinks to loose a colony what ever the reason. Sorry to hear you lost a colony, but now it’s time to insure it doesn't happen again.


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## elmer_fud (Apr 21, 2018)

Fivej said:


> The sudden death of all of the bees inside the hive is a strong clue. I don't know what did it but it sounds like overheating more than anything else. Did you have a hot, muggy, rainy night right before you discovered this?
> J


I was also thinking this. They use water to cool the hive, and if you had to much hot air flow thru the hive I suspect they could have overheated. What material is the hive sitting on (something black that would make it even hotter?)


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## COAL REAPER (Jun 24, 2014)

was there any honey/syrup stoerd in the comb? if not then they got robbed out and the dead bees are from fighting. when you make a split in the same yard all the older 'defense' bees fly back to the original hive location leaving the split vulnerable as the young bees are not mature enough to ward off robbers. vent holes are like a warm pie cooling on a window sill...


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## synoviaus (Jul 28, 2021)

There are four other 10 frame colonies in the same row of hives. This split was in a 5 frame nuc. None of my other hives are affected and all are doing great. 2 have double brood boxes and I plan on adding supers to them soon. The others I'll check to see if I need to add another brood box. I watched them for a while yesterday and there doesn't seem to be any problem with robbing. Peeked under each lid to see tons of bees up on top of the frames. So not sure why this nuc died. Though again I'm a new beekeeper so I'm learning. I looked inside this nuc and the dead bees are still there on the floor. Checked the frames in there and they are not chewed up like robbing frames look. They are all empty nothing in them at all. All colonies are sitting on a wooden slat homemade table about waist height. All of them are painted white. The nuc was sitting in the middle of all the others. So I worried thatt the neighboring hives would be affected too--they weren't.


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## Gray Goose (Sep 4, 2018)

could have been robbed out. several big 1 little, opening to feed, warm feed, empty comb.

GG


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