# UPSET neighbor, what to do



## J-SiN (Jun 5, 2008)

well my neighbor today informed me that I owe him honey

he said that since I installed my two hives next door
that this year he didnt get a single muscadine

not sure if thats a grape or what it is

but i said are you sure it was honeybees he says yes

said they got every single one of his muscadines he didnt get a single one

im thinking they only get the nectar/pollen

anyone have an idea whats goin on?

and to just for sake of it i will give him some honey


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## Dalantech (Oct 1, 2009)

The honeybees at my mother in law's farm feed on the sugars that the grape vines "sweat" but they don't harm the grapes unless there's already an opening in them (usually caused by a wasp or hornet). He's more likely to lose grapes to a fungus than to your bees.


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## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

I looked up muscadine and it is a grape. I think your neighbor is full of it and is trying to blame his poor crop on your bees. I wouldn't give him a jar of honey. If you are good friends with him then maybe I would give them a little sample of your honey, but for him to accuse your bees for taking all his grapes!!:lpf: I think it was probally raccoon, oppossum, or birds that stole them. If they just didn't grow then maybe it was bad weather or bad gardening.


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## WestTexasBeeKeeper (Sep 24, 2009)

I had a guy come up and knock on my door on evening saying I owed him a new tire for his truck. I asked how he came to his conclusion and he said he had ran over a 2 x 4 with nails in it one the road in front of my house. I told him it wasn't mine and his word were "It has to be, it was in front of your house".




It wasnt like 300 people didnt drive that road every day

I politely told the gentleman that I couldnt help him and asked him to leave. He started to get agitated, so I kindly introduced him to one of my inside dogs, a 105 pound Razor's Edge female Pit Bull

People like that chap my butt. "You Owe me honey; your bees ate me muscadine"


Like your bees have your address tattooed on their Glutius Maximus

Sorry for sounding so confrontational. I hate people like that, which is prolly why I live out in the sticks of West Texas 




Bob


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## EastSideBuzz (Apr 12, 2009)

If you have a neighbor mad at your 4 hives (even number), I would just get 21 more then you will have 25. He can't be mad at 25 it is an odd number. I say if they get pissed off go for broke. 

If they complain just tell them I am sorry I thought more bee's would make it better. I thought they were restless and needed some playmates.  Then give them some honey you will have tons of surplus. Oh yea put up a taller fence. :lpf:

Sorry I re-read your post and you only have 2 hives. I would still increase until he has no more complaints. And every time he complains add a few more.


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## BeeAware (Mar 24, 2007)

I have muscadines here and they mostly fell off the vines before maturing this year due to excessive rainfall. Muscadines have a tough skin and are not damaged or destroyed by honey bees.

Last year a neighbor of mine said that I should give him free honey because my bees were always robbing his plants of nectar. I gave him a one pound jar and told him that I would waive the "pollination" fee for that year only. He hasn't mentioned it again.


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## Fuzzy (Aug 4, 2005)

Where else can you settle a dispute for one jar of honey ?? Give him the honey with a big smile. And then tell him that honeybees cannot steal grapes and that they do not eat them either.

This is a reasonable person.... foolish, but reasonable. Give him the honey.

Fuzzy


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## beenovice (Jun 19, 2007)

Bees have no means to damage grapes so 100% bees are not to blame. Other insects and animals damage grapes and when grapes are damaged only then bees take it. Your neighbor is full of it as someone said. 

If you put healthy grapes into the hive bees will not touch it, but if you put damaged ones then bees will take it all. 

Once grapes are damaged it is good that bees suck it dry. That way disease and rot is not spreading. Talk to your neighbor and tell him that. At the end of the day it is always good to give a jar or two to your neighbors....


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## SwedeBee1970 (Oct 26, 2008)

Be careful with neighbors, they can protest to the village board saying stupid things about their kids getting allergic reactions to bee stings when they're getting stung by other pests in their swing sets. A village board can force the bee keeper to get rid of your colonies by law. 

Besides, nosy neighbors need to be put in their place. Tell them there was none for you much less anyone else. 

Or you could play a trick on them and buy some store bought honey loaded with all kinds of unnatural additives, plus add a few drops of Anise to the honey. They'll spit the stuff out and never ask for more again. Tell them it tasted fine to you....

Oh, and the board with nails in the road story. The road commissioner or city hall owns the streets and all it's problems. Mostly the first 5-7' from the road and in unincorporated areas, up to 35' from it. They could crash a vehicle in your ditch and it's still not your problem.


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## WestTexasBeeKeeper (Sep 24, 2009)

SwedeBee1970 said:


> Be careful with neighbors, they can protest to the village board saying stupid things about their kids getting allergic reactions to bee stings when they're getting stung by other pests in their swing sets. A village board can force the bee keeper to get rid of your colonies by law.


They can try with me. Again that why I live in the sticks with no HOA's or Village Idiots



> Besides, nosy neighbors need to be put in their place. Tell them there was none for you much less anyone else.


Yup they do. Tell them to pound sand





> Oh, and the board with nails in the road story. The road commissioner or city hall owns the streets and all it's problems. Mostly the first 5-7' from the road and in unincorporated areas, up to 35' from it. They could crash a vehicle in your ditch and it's still not your problem.


Its the counties problem. I refuse to live in a city limits. Thats why I was pretty adamate about getting the guy out of my yard. Plus my Pit needed exercise 

Bob


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## winevines (Apr 7, 2007)

J-SiN said:


> well my neighbor today informed me that I owe him honey
> 
> he said that since I installed my two hives next door
> that this year he didnt get a single muscadine


This was a crappy year to grow any fruit at all, grapes included. My husband grows wine grapes and we actually have some concord grapes in the back yard... bees do not visit them until they are PAST ripe and split open, and they must like the juice. This year with the Spring rains, the grape crop sucked, and most fruit split open early. Also, I agree with the other guy, who said that grapes are prone to lots and lots of fungal infections and it is very very hard to grown them well without some sort of fungacide treatment repeatedly (there are many organically based fungacidal treatments). Especially in NC, you would have problems growing good grapes.

Regards,
WINEVINES (believe me, I know about growing grapes!)


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## Ken&Andria (May 2, 2007)

> and to just for sake of it i will give him some honey


None of my business, but in my experience, you let a wanker bully you once, he will try, try again. Shut him down now, or you will have problems with this guy forever.

And BTW, for that opinion, you owe me $0.02. I'll take a check......


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## waynesgarden (Jan 3, 2009)

In addition to yellow jackets, there are a number of other insects in Virgina that affect the grapes including the grape curculio and the grape berry moth. They will damage the grapes and the honey bees, as mentioned, may visit them.

Honey bees do not appear on any list of grape pests in the Virginia Vineyards pages at the Virgina Tech website. Your neighbor should avail himself of the information there.

Wayne


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## Countryboy (Feb 15, 2009)

He may feel you owe him a pound jar of honey, and you feel he owes you $5. Fair trade. 

If you're worried about him throwing a fit to city hall, find a new place to keep your bees, but put two empty identical hives in your yard. When the city inspectors come, act confused and inform them you are storing empty equipment, and that you keep your bees at a different location. The neighbor will end up looking like an idiot.


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## brooksbeefarm (Apr 13, 2008)

Give him the jar of honey, but first stir in about 4 tbs of croton oil, he will be to busy to bother you for a while, and have a better attitude the next time you see him. Jack


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## honeyman46408 (Feb 14, 2003)

> but first stir in about 4 tbs of croton oil,


Now thats not nice


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## waynesgarden (Jan 3, 2009)

honeyman46408 said:


> Now thats not nice


It could also be seen as encouraging the original poster to commit a felony by adulterating food to cause harm. 

Wayne


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## Grant (Jun 12, 2004)

honeyman46408 said:


> Now thats not nice


No, it's not. His initial confrontation wasn't either. But that doesn't mean you drop to his level and engage him on his terms. 

If you want to get along with this yo-yo (and maybe you don't), you cannot escalate the conflict. It has to end somewhere, and yo-yo's like this seldom quit, they just ratchet up the stakes. He started it with you "oweing" him honey. I'll bet he wants the last word, too.

I'd be inclined to ignore him, or maybe invite him over for a neighborly visit to let him blow off steam. Let him "prove" his case.

Grant


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## brooksbeefarm (Apr 13, 2008)

waynesgarden said:


> It could also be seen as encouraging the original poster to commit a felony by adulterating food to cause harm.
> 
> Wayne


Evidently you missed the big grin icon, it was ment in fun. Where i live i give my close friends and neighbors honey, but if he knocks on my door and demands that i owe him a jar of honey for something that stupid, he better be smiling or a big ol'boy. Jack


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## WestTexasBeeKeeper (Sep 24, 2009)

Ken&Andria said:


> None of my business, but in my experience, you let a wanker bully you once, he will try, try again. Shut him down now, or you will have problems with this guy forever.
> 
> And BTW, for that opinion, you owe me $0.02. I'll take a check......


:applause::applause:

I'm of the same thinking


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## sc-bee (May 10, 2005)

As said above --- Honeybees do not cut the skin of the muscadines. They will feed on damaged fruit or fruit after being cut by other incests. 

Arm yourself with the proper info ---- literature on the subject and make a visit. Present the literature or a letter from an ag agent etc. and smile. As you go to leave tell him you have him a gift for being such a good neighbor and present him with a jar of honey.

Depending on the location of you bees relative to your neighbors house --- I believe the jar of honey could be a cheap fix. If you are otherwise on good terms with the neighbor , next year along with him, monitor the progress of his muscadines. You may never know, if you like the muscadines you may come to a mutual agreement and you will have mucadines and honey.

I like muscadines but love scuppernongs!


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## StevenG (Mar 27, 2009)

BeeAware, I like the way you think... I wonder, out of my ignorance, do bees pollinate grapes?

I would be very wary of putting something into my honey to give to a pain-in-the-***** person... Who knows who they might give a taste to, and by word of mouth you've destroyed your honey market. 
Regards,
Steven


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## winevines (Apr 7, 2007)

I am sorry you felt it necessary to turn a thread of helpful advice from your beekeping peers into your own political statement. Why take that sort of turn which is sure to offend some folks who were nice enough to help you? Save it for the tailgator thread.


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## devdog108 (May 7, 2009)

I got the sarcasm....lololol

:lpf::lookout:


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## hpm08161947 (May 16, 2009)

I have a large vineyard of Cynthiana (a wine grape) that we sell to two or three different wineries. I also have a small vineyard of muscadine. We always have problems with the wasps on the cynthiana as we approach harvest date. I have to use sevin to fight them right up until the PHI period (withrawal date). But I have never seen a wasp bother a muscadine - they are truly thick skinned - they do very well in the deep south without fungal treatment (muscadines are native to this state) - not true of the cynthiana, which we have to watch all the time....... most likely your neighbor has not hedged his muscadines in a few years (you don't prune muscadines). I'd still give him a pint of honey (after pointing out how wrong he was) just because he's my neighbor.


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## waynesgarden (Jan 3, 2009)

What is that supposed to mean?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

There are references in ABC XYZ of beekeeping (at least in the old ones) that honey bees cannot chew through the skin of fruit. Yellow jackets, of course, can. He may have seen that. And once the Yellow jackets do, the bees will take advantage of it. You can show him the reference but I doubt it will change his mind. But you may need it if it comes to some kind of arbitration eventually.


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## honeyman46408 (Feb 14, 2003)

> You can show him the reference but I doubt it will change his mind.


Agree :applause:


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## trapperbob (May 27, 2007)

Arm your self with the best info you can find and take it to your neihbor and be nice about it. Tell him after you left I decided to do some research not to prove you wrong but I had never heard of honey bees doing this and you wanting to be a good neihbor wanted to see if there was any way to deter them from doing it again it was while doing your research that you found that the bees only bother the grapes after they have already been damaged so according to the info the bees could have not been the cause. Tell him you would be glad to help him figure out what damaged the grapes oh and by the way I would be glad to share a jar of honey with you anyway. If he gets upset just tell him that you are sorry that he feels that way but the research proves itself and you are sure the bees are not the problem and go home.


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## Mathispollenators (Jun 9, 2008)

Muscudine grape roughly size of nickle if a ball. And he claims your bees got them all? Ok I have some of them and the grapes are bigger than my bees can carry. If your bees can pick up one of those babys and fly away I wanna see it. After that's proven I'll buy each of the hives from you and give you free of charge some that I promise won't steal the neighbors grapes next year. And for your neighbor I'll give him a gallon of honey.

Now that problem solved and on the the next thread.


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## hotrod6779 (Jul 12, 2009)

A muscadine is not a grape as well as a scupenine ( or scupernong) is not a grape. They are the fruit of the south. Yankees eat grapes. The bees wont mess with em anyways. If anything my vines have doubled if not tripled in output since the placement of my hives. No need to be mean about it. Most folks who are mean are mean because theres something wrong with em to make em mean. Hate they life, momma didnt love em, daddy beat em to hard, short minded, or many other things of that sort. Dont be mean cause now you know what folks'll thik of ya.


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## franktrujillo (Jan 22, 2009)

na it wasn't those bees of mine there my favorite too eat.besides i seen some kids in your yard picking all the fruit.when i seen them i chased them off but they ran so fast.here is a 4oz of honey from the flowers in your yard.as you keep more flowers i'll increse the amount of honey you get.If you use pesticides ill give you some honey by the way did you know pesticides enter honey from the flowers you spray.thats for those neighbors that spray so here is your jar for this year. i give all neigbors honey 4OZ of honey
for little to no flowers in yard.no complants i explane it takes 2 million flowers to make a gal of honey.It takes 1 bee its whole life time to bring in 1/12 of a teaspoon.seems they respect the bee more that way.they want me to increase my hives.one neighbor last winter found 3 bees on her door. snow on the ground said did i want my bees back.She had them on the table in a jar feeding them sugar inside i laughed so hard.so i said ok she brought them out and one was dead.She felt so bad she couldn't save it explaned to her that it was ok.they die from old age.as she felt better she went in her house.i went away laughing.


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## honeyman46408 (Feb 14, 2003)

> 2 million flowers to make a gal of honey


2 million flowers to make a pound


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## chandler (May 28, 2009)

I have muscadines as well as a few other varieties of grapes and had a decent crop of them this year. They are about 50 yards from my hives. Now my apple and pear trees didn't do much of anything. Doubt that was the bees eating them though. 

Sometimes it's just mother nature that decides if or when things will produce. I would have definitely asked for proof that it was bees doing it. Even if he had proof, I'd chalk it up to "natures way".


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## trapperbob (May 27, 2007)

I am curious as to how things have turned out.


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## J-SiN (Jun 5, 2008)

gathering all this information and will be visiting his mailbox with a jar of honey within a week or so will update!


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## Beaver Dam (May 27, 2008)

Like the idea of meeting at the mail box. Good luck.:applause:


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## drobbins (Jun 1, 2005)

just stumbled across this thread
just as a data point, I have about 10 muscadine vines
they're covered with grapes every year
have had bees for 5 years

Dave


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

J-SiN said:


> well my neighbor today informed me that I owe him honey
> 
> he said that since I installed my two hives next door
> that this year he didnt get a single muscadine
> ...


Next year and for years after he will owe you a bottle of wine. Not that the bees have anything to do w/ it. Just don't let him in on it.


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## J-SiN (Jun 5, 2008)

Got all the information together and attached it to a nice bottle of honey
placed in his mail box yesterday



looking forward to our next chat


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## dickm (May 19, 2002)

Whenever a thread gets started on this topic, I'm always surprised at the self rightious tone and the lack of compromise that is put forth. The man seemed to believe what he was saying; he no doubt saw some bees sucking on some split grapes. That's just his ignorance and the beeks opportunity to educate him. The bees have mandibles but they work sideways; only good for working wax. 

Jump into the future when someone in his family gets stung. Better yet, when you have a swarm of yours hanging from his porch. Or when, in a dearth, your bees swarm his garbage. Getting pompous with him gains nothing and has a big downside. Face it. Bees are NOT good to be neighbors with.

dickm
PS. You owe me some honey


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## wfuavenger (Dec 11, 2009)

IMO I would ask him to prove it. I would like to see empirical evidence that they are eating his muscadine. Why? If it is true, you have the first set of honey bees in the history of man to carry them off just at the point that they get ripe....

I HATE stupidity and the stupid people who ask for handouts. I would not give him anything due to the fact that next year when he runs out of this honey, he will say you owe him 2 jars because his crop is messed up again and your bees keep coming in his house (or something else ridiculous). By rewarding stupidity, you encourage it.

I would then take the opportunity to show him a list (printed out for him to take home) of plants honeybees DO use as a food source… Get the whole 3-4 pages to him.

And ask him to be more polite when making ridiculous demands and claims. After all, you catch more flies with honey than vinegar!!!!!!!!


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## SwedeBee1970 (Oct 26, 2008)

Neighbors are usually just a nuisance like hornets. Better yet, tell them to show you the picture evidence or ignore them outright. It's funny that for someone who's so close by, you're worlds apart in agreement over uncontrollable circumstances.


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## J-SiN (Jun 5, 2008)

pompous? lack of compromise? your kidding I hope

lol I have gone above and beyond the call of whats right here


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## dickm (May 19, 2002)

Jsin wrote:
>>>>> I have gone above and beyond the call of whats right here<<<<

I didn't mean you. It sounds like you have handled the situation with more grace than most of your advisors on this thread. As beekeepers, in touch with the awe and captivating interest in bees, it's easy to forget the time when we too were ignorant. Most folks give an unconscious shudder when they see bees. They don't discriminate between hornets yellowjackets and honey bees. Most of them don't think their neighbors bees are a desireable addition. To walk in their moccasins a little would go a long way toward advancing beekeeping. NYC is in the process, or has just OKed the keeping of bees in the city. Hobby beeking has just had such an upsurge that suppliers were months behind last year on supplies. More and more beekeepers will have these confrontations country-wide. Many new beeks read these posts on this site. I just thought a little balance was in order.


Dickm


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

SwedeBee1970 said:


> Snip
> 
> Spray them in the face with education electrolytes


Have many members had success with this technique?


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

I'm sad to see that for some, an upset neighbor justifies being un-neighborly back. :scratch:


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## devdog108 (May 7, 2009)

my neighbors, albeit allergic, have paid a little attention to the plite of the HB. Heck, one neighbor brings the beer over so we can go watch them work. There are many things in this world that people get upset about, especially when it deals in ignorance. Men in Black...the movie, there was a quote i'll never forget. 
Edwards: Why the big secret? People are smart. They can handle it. 
Kay: A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it. Fifteen hundred years ago everybody knew the Earth was the center of the universe. Five hundred years ago, everybody knew the Earth was flat, and fifteen minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll know tomorrow.

People are smart, but the masses combined are quite dangerous IMHO. BUT i will say that i know a few who are not smart at all. I am not hostile until it is required, and sometimes I just let the knowledge speak for itself. In this case, I hope the knowledge speaks for itself for you and your neighbor. I may not talk to all of mine, but they know that if they have a concern, not an accusation, that I will listen to them...ONLY if they will listen back. Told 2 or 3 of them that. The only one who seems not to abide by that rule is my wife....and well.....enough said...LOLOL:lpf:


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## StevenG (Mar 27, 2009)

Beecurious, I've had good luck with that... discovered more often than not, it depends on how I respond... kindly, calmly, dispassionately... 

Once I had a man discover I kept bees, said he was highly allergic to them. Got stung on the hand, and his arm swelled up. I replied the second time I got stung my face swelled up, and my right eye was swollen shut. And that's a normal reaction, means my body is working correctly. Turns out less than 1 percent of the population is allergic, and they have what's called an anaphylactic shock reaction, trouble breathing, etc etc and need medical treatment immediately. The more times I've been stung, the milder the reaction, so that now I only cuss once when I get stung the second time on my bare hands while working the bees...

He looked at me kind of strangely, and finally laughed when i said i never have gotten used to getting nailed between the shoulder blades in a sweaty shirt in the middle of August. then I offered to provide protective gear and he could watch next time I worked a hive. He hasn't accepted my offer, but now he sits on his deck and watches me when I work them. They're in the back yard, about 100' from his deck. (He built the house and moved in long after my bees were there). And when I'm done, he'll come over to the fence and we'll visit a bit.


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