# Shark Tank Last Night - Bee Free Honee



## bean tree homestead (Nov 18, 2013)

its organic artificial honey!


----------



## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

How can they even call it "honee", something that looks like and sounds like the word "honey"? There aught to be a law.


----------



## VickyLynn (Jun 20, 2011)

They must be catering to vegans who think we are cruel to our bees, keeping them cooped up like chickens. :scratch:


----------



## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Funny thing is the bee is needed to pollinate the apple... Lol
Not quite bee free


----------



## kilocharlie (Dec 27, 2010)

Don't you just love it when people are absolutely STUPID on TV? ROFLMAO 

They gave him real money for that? :lpf:


----------



## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

VickyLynn said:


> They must be catering to vegans who think we are cruel to our bees, keeping them cooped up like chickens. :scratch:


Could bee, VickyLynn.

Vegans don't eat honey because vegans don't eat anything that has to do with animals dying. Just having bees means bees die. So honey is one thing vegans don't eat.

You could argue that bees pollinate the apples that this product is made for and since bees die vegans shouldn't eat apples or this "fake" honey.

They could be catering to diabetics too. Producing something that diabetics can substitute for honey when wanting something sweet.


----------



## rwlaw (May 4, 2009)

Donald Watson 1944
"Veganism is a way of living which excludes all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, the animal kingdom, and includes a reverence for life."
So if a orchard was serviced by nothing but feral hives, a vegan could have honey on his nuts and bran and still go to sleep at nite? 
But wait! Never mind. You would still be exploiting the bees by gathering the honey, IMO too many catch twenty twos. I'm glad I still use my canine teeth for what they're designed for.


----------



## Dan the bee guy (Jun 18, 2015)

I


sqkcrk said:


> Could bee, VickyLynn.
> 
> Vegans don't eat honey because vegans don't eat anything that has to do with animals dying. Just having bees means bees die. So honey is one thing vegans don't eat.
> 
> ...


But it's made with cane sugar.


----------



## Slow Drone (Apr 19, 2014)

Hmm apples from Michigan oh okay none of the apple orchards up that way use bees for pollination. I smell a strong odor of BS and I'm not talking Beesource.


----------



## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Dan the bee guy said:


> I
> But it's made with cane sugar.


Didn't look that closely at the product.


----------



## Sunday Farmer (Nov 13, 2013)

Must come a variety of self pollinating apples...heirloom?


----------



## Blackstonebees (Aug 28, 2015)

Nothing against vegans or this product, but saying this "saves the bees" is disingenuous to say the least. I don't know if it was the program or the creators of the product forcing that topical lie upon the viewers, but we found it to be very frustrating. And for one of the Sharks to claim to be a beekeeper, and not pick up on the logical fact that reducing demand for honey reduces demand for bees is rather unbelievable.

Seemed to us that claiming artifical honey "saves" the bees is like one of the presidential candidates claiming that he/she will save the middle class .... by taking away all of their jobs.


----------



## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Truth in labeling laws anyone?


----------



## warrior (Nov 21, 2005)

Is there not an industry group somewhere that could sue just once to make an example if someone?
As it stands folks can say anything they want and make the most absurd claims without consequence.


----------



## Learning2Bee (Jan 20, 2016)

MikeinCarolina said:


> Their pitch was that it helped honeybees made me about want to hurl something at my television. How does fake honey made with a little apples and sugar save honey bees? Unfortunately 3 of the sharks bit on this false hood including one who is supposedly a bee keeper. There were so many things I wanted to tell them to refute their gobbletygook.
> 
> http://www.beefreehonee.com/


My thoughts were the same. It genuinely pissed me off.


----------



## BeeBop (Apr 23, 2015)

sqkcrk said:


> You could argue that bees pollinate the apples that this product is made for and since bees die vegans shouldn't eat apples or this "fake" honey.


You COULD argue that, but that would require logic. We won't be having any of that logic **** here. It's all about *Feel Good Emotion*.

From the companies Saving The Bees page... "_We are a 100% women owned and operated company trying to do what is right._"


http://www.beefreehonee.com/pages/saving-the-bees


----------



## jcolon (Sep 12, 2014)

Aren't we big enough to start a campaign to take these people down?


----------



## BeeBop (Apr 23, 2015)

_"We add a bit of NON-GMO, vegan quality, carbon-neutral, USA grown cane sugar and fresh USA grown lemon juice."_

Could someone please explain to me what makes cane sugar "vegan quality and carbon-neutral" ?


----------



## kilocharlie (Dec 27, 2010)

BeeBop said:


> ...Could someone please explain to me what makes cane sugar "vegan quality and carbon-neutral" ?


Sugar cane without eyeballs and cut by a Hawaiian with a machete.


----------



## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Note that 2016 will mark the end of commercial sugar production in Hawaii ...
http://www.kitv.com/story/30905681/the-end-of-the-sugar-cane-era-in-hawaii

Once that sugar refinery is demolished, it seems unlikely that sugar cane will ever again be a commercial crop in Hawaii.


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

We can all be frustrated because as beekeepers we know how ridiculous this is. In a debate, an articulate beekeeping advocate wins this one hands down. However, this isn't a debate, this is a marketing scheme and the judges on shark tank really do have some business acumen. What applies here is that good marketing trumps logic and perception is, indeed, reality. If you have ever watched an infomercial on tv you (or at least I) walk away shaking my head in wonderment at how easily mislead (dare I say stupid) many consumers are. You don't have to fool them all, just enough to make you a handsome profit. That's what I see here, someone using perverse logic to try to fool some of the people some of the time and walk away laughing all the way to the bank.


----------



## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Good one, Jim.


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Yes Mark. Its not about truth, its about marketing which are two entirely different concepts. The buying public isn't an arbiter of the truth. One need look no further than our current presidential campaign to see this in action.


----------



## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

Publicity in deed, quite the stick! Apple syrup doest not get the same attention. Effective target of their demographic !


----------



## deknow (Jul 17, 2006)

Also, don't forget that from the point of view of a sincere vegan, not eating honey does help rhe bees as much as not eating veal helps mistreated cattle.

I don't agree that the two things are equivelent...they certainly aren't in my mind, but I can understand the sentiment and I cam respect the 'living of one's politics' that is involved...I can even understand the distaste for 'products of the exploited'. ....I would also (and do, with those that seem interested) argue against such beliefs/assumptions....certainly lots of ants, insects, rodents, birds, etc are negatively affected by any agricultural practice...with or without chemicals.

I also admit that the only times I've eaten veal in the last 30 years has been at an event where it was put in front of me..and I'm sure that veal producers would see this as me acting ĺhurting them) on misinformed poorly constructed opinions.


----------



## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Some very devout vegans wear medical face masks so insects won't fly into their mouths. There are extremes of all sorts in the World.


----------



## Bkwoodsbees (Feb 8, 2014)

The so called bee keeper on shark tank did make a statement that showed his in depth knowledge of bee keeping. He said " I have alot of bees on my property, so I know alot about beekeeping. I know if you take more than 20 percent of their honey the hive will crash." So no coincidence he was all in on the bee free marketing gimmick. What's going to happen when they have to shop the world for more apples? Cheaper raw materials come from China. I can hear it now .....they rob the bees of their honey then feed them sugar!!! Now eat our fake honee made with apples and in the fine print cane sugar.


----------



## Flewster (Nov 3, 2003)

I just finished watching it and it made me sick. Proven that it is all about money for these folks. Damons offer went by the wayside and the others didn't say a thing about donating to bee research. So Apples are not pollinated by the bees? They are using a product that needs large commercial beekeepers to pollinate and that is exactly what they are trying to fight. The hypocrisy is stunning.


----------



## jadebees (May 9, 2013)

This product or something like it has been around for decades. Invert cane syrup, and artificial honey flavoring. I think it's called FRAUD, by the Food & Drug Administration. Apples contain Malic acid , it can be used for inverting plain cane sugar. The true part, is that an ingredient came from apple?


----------



## MikeinCarolina (Mar 9, 2014)

I feel like a bee keeping organisation or a number of them should band together to fight this sort of fraud on the general public and let them know what is what. And how there are many who advocate that real honey in its raw form is a much healthier alternative than apple flavored sugar syrup. I will do what I can to educate my honey customers, but some of them may wind up jumping onto this band wagon simply because of the money behind it.


----------



## thehackleguy (Jul 29, 2014)

What you are seeing is the natural evolution of the animal rights movment......get use to it, it is going to get much, much worse.


----------



## challenger (May 27, 2009)

I'll assume everything is as described in this thread and say that this is absolutely absurd. It is lying at best and completely illegal at worst. Folks should be made to pay for this as it is an affront to anyone with a small amount of beekeeping experience. 
If this is "smart marketing" then we are not in this market. 
The vegan principals MUST stand for more than just food. The vegan population should take this and make it known that it is worthless garbage. The vegans may indeed have their personal food consumption beliefs focused on cruelty or misuse of animals soooooo we, as humans, are being cruelty treated by these dip turds on the shark tank. This product may or may not be catering to vegans but either way the vegan population will be lumped in as, "associates" 
. 
Dumber than cow crap beat with a bat. 
Oh, I did learn one thing. If I take 20% of the honey from the bees I'll kill the hive. Amazing TVfeces. From now on iI'll take all of the honey. Or maybe just 19%??? Shoot, I can't decide now. I'll have to wait for the next episode??? 
The whole thing sounds like something from the cover of a magazine found at the super market check out rack. You know, the ones with the aliens that fathered so and sos child.


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

In this country we do have the freedom to stir up a sugar water apple juice concoction and market it, even as somehow 'saving the bees". If this amounts to anything at all (and it probably wont) the industry should certainly challenge them on the use of the word "honnee". Just as an aspiring hamburger chain couldnt get by with displaying something outside resembling golden arches, someone using word play to fool the consumer as to what they are purchasing should be illegal as well. What percentage of the honey buying public is even literate enough in the english language to tell the difference simply from a subtle difference in spelling? 80%? 90%? Is it fair to deceive this minority? This is where we need a single, strong central organization that can speak clearly for the industry when shams like this pop up.


----------



## deknow (Jul 17, 2006)

This seems pretty inconsequential to me. #3 bee packages are not 3#, beer doesn't make you happy, the lottery won't get you rich, a new and better toilet paper will not make your whole family happy, a McDonald's hamburger doesn't resemble a real hamburger, cheese spread is not cheese, yeast extract is code for msg, Dennies does not serve good food, change doesn't always mean what you think it does, the water in flint is safe, chocolate flavor isn't chocolate.

In this case, I think it is clear that they are not trying to confuse thus product with honey...they are taking great pains to differentiate it from actual honey.

If I were asked about it by a customer, I'd simply ask if they like the taste, and tell them they should buy it if they do (and they like the ingrediets). I am not concerned with competition from sugar syrup flavored with apple. I'm guessing that anyone would respond to the imagery of good honey on a fresh apple slice more than anything accurately described as sugar syrup, even if it's just me talking about it.


----------



## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

deknow;1378135....beer doesn't make you happy.... [/QUOTE said:


> Speak for yourself


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Come on Dean. They aren't calling it Apple syrup they named it honnee. Looks like honey, sounds like honey. You really don't think there is some degree of deceptive marketing here?


----------



## Slow Drone (Apr 19, 2014)

$7.20 a lb for that stuff is any of us getting that kind of money for real honey?


----------



## RichardsonTX (Jul 3, 2011)

Texas Law:

SUBCHAPTER E. LABELING AND SALE OF HONEY

Sec. 131.081. USE OF "HONEY" ON LABEL. A person may not label, sell, or keep, offer, or expose for sale a product identified on its label as "honey," "liquid or extracted honey," "strained honey," or "pure honey" unless the product consists exclusively of pure honey.

Amended by Acts 1983, 68th Leg., p. 1884, ch. 350, Sec. 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1983.


Sec. 131.082. USE OF BEE, HIVE, OR COMB DESIGN. A person may not label, sell, or keep, expose, or offer for sale a product that resembles honey and that has on its label a picture or drawing of a bee, hive, or comb unless the product consists exclusively of pure honey.

Amended by Acts 1983, 68th Leg., p. 1884, ch. 350, Sec. 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1983.


Sec. 131.083. SALE OF IMITATION HONEY. A person may not label, sell, or keep, expose, or offer for sale a product that resembles honey and is identified on its label as "imitation honey."

Amended by Acts 1983, 68th Leg., p. 1884, ch. 350, Sec. 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1983.


Sec. 131.084. SALE OF HONEY MIXTURES. (a) A person may not label, sell, or keep, expose, or offer for sale a product that consists of honey mixed with another ingredient unless:

(1) the product bears a label with a list of ingredients; and

(2) "honey" appears in the list of ingredients in the same size type of print as the other ingredients.

(b) A person may not label, sell, or keep, expose, or offer for sale a product that contains honey mixed with another ingredient and contains in the product name "honey" in a larger size of type or print or in a more prominent position than the other words in the product name.

Amended by Acts 1983, 68th Leg., p. 1884, ch. 350, Sec. 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1983.


----------



## deknow (Jul 17, 2006)

jim lyon said:


> Come on Dean. They aren't calling it Apple syrup they named it honnee. Looks like honey, sounds like honey. You really don't think there is some degree of deceptive marketing here?


I dunno jim...obviously they are trying to sell it in place of honey, but everthing they actually say about it (on their website..I didn't see the show) is about how it isn't honey.

But soy milk isn't milk, egg substitute isn't eggs, butter flavor isn't butter, baked potato chips aren't real chips, cranberry juice ****tail isn't cranberry juice.

This isn't rice syrup being passed off as honey to the consumer, and the label and website try to make the sale because it isn't actually honey.

I expect this is about as appealing to a honey lover as a tofurky is to someone that loves turkey.


----------



## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Sure, if the consumer chooses to read the website it's pretty clear but how about when a retailer chooses to display it alongside real honey. In the case of soy or almond milk it's pretty clear to the consumer but honee beside honey? If they want to market it as Apple syrup let em have it, they don't even have to play any spelling games.


----------



## jadebees (May 9, 2013)

There is nothing wrong with making and marketing a product like this. I'm sure it would be popular, and profitable. It is a sad commentary on Ethics in this country, when this marginally deceptive promotion is put on national TV as some good thing, worthy of marketing to the careless. Crisco has fried chicken pictures on the label. But it's a tub of hydrogenated transfat. Caveat emptor!


----------



## hex0rz (Jan 14, 2014)

Their webpage makes me want to vomit! Their section about saving the bees is ridiculous. A lot of it is all just grasping at straws to try and make another ignorant point to buy their product.

I don't even want to go into it much further, because it wants to make me jump down their throats.

I'll bring up a couple points and wash my hands of it:

1: if they're so dead set on saving the bees, then yes, plant more bee friendly plants and stop the mono cropping. But if they think an orchard is going to be able to keep an adequate amount of hives to properly pollinate their crops they're wrong. What are those hives going to do with the rest of the season when the orchard isn't blooming!!! Guess those orchards better start planting those fences...

2: consider why there is a demand for the pollinators in the first place. They Need to pollinate all those things we eat. If they are so against the migratory operation because they treat their bees so inhumanely, then maybe they should reconsider things like drinking all that darn almond milk and drink real milk! All these substitutes these alternative lifestyle people are using is going to help cause more demand. So if they really want to save the bees stop substituting!

Oh, maybe more people should become beekeepers too! That would relieve demand.. Or would it? Muahahaha!


----------



## carolb (Feb 15, 2016)

MikeinCarolina said:


> Their pitch was that it helped honeybees made me about want to hurl something at my television. How does fake honey made with a little apples and sugar save honey bees? Unfortunately 3 of the sharks bit on this false hood including one who is supposedly a bee keeper. There were so many things I wanted to tell them to refute their gobbletygook.
> 
> http://www.beefreehonee.com/


 I saw the show and I was appalled, they sold the Sharks on the idea that this is like real honey only it contains a variety of things including sugar. Hello world, there are people out there who cannot tolerate sugar. Also REAL HONEY as everyone knows can keep forever. If it crystalizes heat it up. Good as new. Not so with processed fake honey, and or those honeys out there that have been manipulated with additives. Pure honey is like music to your taste buds. Those Sharks who signed on should have their heads checked out.


----------



## indypartridge (Nov 18, 2004)

hex0rz said:


> Their webpage makes me want to vomit! Their section about saving the bees is ridiculous.


Agreed.
http://www.beefreehonee.com/pages/saving-the-bees

Telling people that eating real honey is detrimental to bees should be a punishable offense.

They are attempting to capitalize on the public consciousness to "Save the Bees", but they have their facts wrong. Bees are not transported all over the country to make honey as they claim. Eating more honey will NOT cause more bees to be moved around for pollination. And as others have mentioned, they neglect to mention just how those apples get pollinated.


----------



## RichardsonTX (Jul 3, 2011)

Maybe someone should come up with a product and call it Chickin, or Bief............After all, if it's a different spelling the the consumer should automatically know it isn't Chicken, or Beef and the responsibility should bear with them. I'm actually being sarcastic. 

I actually don't agree with giving a different product the same pronunciation as another and using the basis of a different spelling as a way of signifying a difference to the consumer. It's frivolous and deceptive in my opinion.


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I'm so glad they are saving the honey bees by making fake honey! Too bad they didn't consult the bees... I seriously doubt the bees would agree to it...


----------



## jcolon (Sep 12, 2014)

[email protected]

They even have an info email address.... just saying


----------



## FlowerPlanter (Aug 3, 2011)

Fake reviews? They all appear to be written by the same person, every review uses "!" or "!!!"

Can't seem to write a review? 'Says something is missing"

Can anyone write a review?


----------



## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

Slow Drone said:


> $7.20 a lb for that stuff is any of us getting that kind of money for real honey?


I sell at $8 a pound.


----------



## cheryl1 (Mar 7, 2015)

Me too


----------



## jbeshearse (Oct 7, 2009)

RichardsonTX said:


> Maybe someone should come up with a product and call it Chickin, or Bief......


Well, now that you mention it: http://www.mprnews.org/story/2016/01/23/vegan-butcher-shop


----------



## jcolon (Sep 12, 2014)

So if you are a vegan, why you wanna eat things that look like meat? In that case then just eat meat. :ws:
This world is crazy.


----------



## B Steve B (Jun 4, 2015)

jcolon said:


> So if you are a vegan, why you wanna eat things that look like meat? In that case then just eat meat. :ws:
> This world is crazy.


Some vegan fare is actually pretty good. Why anyone would want to be dedicated vegan though is beyond me. The whole thing relies on a lot of narrow vision.


----------



## jcolon (Sep 12, 2014)

>Some vegan fare is actually pretty good. 

And so is dung, according to the dung beetles.


----------



## B Steve B (Jun 4, 2015)

jcolon said:


> >Some vegan fare is actually pretty good.
> 
> And so is dung, according to the dung beetles.


No lie. Some vegan stuff also tastes like dung smells.


----------



## MikeinCarolina (Mar 9, 2014)

There is nothing wrong with folks who make what they think to be ethical food choices. That is their business and they have the right to do so. I myself have been a pescatarian for about 20 years. I chose that life, when I became aware of how modern meat animals are raised and treated and my conscience no longer allowed me to be an active participant in their suffering. 

To knowingly sell a product that is deceptively labeled and then to compound that with the outright lie that by using it you will help save honeybees is ridiculous and should be against some sort of truth in labeling and advertising law.


----------



## EastSideBuzz (Apr 12, 2009)

I have a friend that is a vegan and he eats honey. There sales pitch is all wrong. I saw the episode and kept yelling at the TV how does it hurt bee's. They were morons and are scamming the public with the pitch. It is too bad that you can be a stupid entrepreneur. 

How can you call it honey when it is just ground up apples.


----------



## challenger (May 27, 2009)

I think vegans do not eat honey for reasons described above. 
I feel like if they bought from the non commercial guy it would still fit into the vegan way no? Seems like raw honey is more easily found in small shops etc where there is a locally traceable source. 
Then again it could be purchased from and "urban beekeeper" in which case I think the honey is highly processed dumpster sweets OR from a guy near me that sells honey as "local" yet has 55 gallons drums delivered to him from non local providers. 
BTW - it's a separate issue but I'm getting $8.00/lb and I'm too cheap compared to others selling in my area. $7.00 a pound is so 2013 and earlier


----------



## Bombus_perplexus (Nov 17, 2015)

BeeBop said:


> _"We add a bit of NON-GMO, vegan quality, carbon-neutral, USA grown cane sugar and fresh USA grown lemon juice."_
> 
> Could someone please explain to me what makes cane sugar "vegan quality and carbon-neutral" ?


Carbon neutrality, or having a net zero carbon footprint, refers to achieving net zero carbon emissions by balancing a measured amount of carbon released with an equivalent amount sequestered or offset, or buying enough carbon credits to make up the difference. It is used in the context of carbon dioxide releasing processes associated with transportation, energy production, and industrial processes such as production of carbon neutral fuel.

Basically its cane sugar that is harvested by hand, not machine, and uses no animal products in its production. However, the amount of BS in this wording is probably the same as the large amounts used to fertilize the cane. :lpf:


----------



## Deeg (Jun 22, 2015)

jim lyon said:


> What applies here is that good marketing trumps logic and perception is, indeed, reality. If you have ever watched an infomercial on tv you (or at least I) walk away shaking my head in wonderment at how easily mislead (dare I say stupid) many consumers are. You don't have to fool them all, just enough to make you a handsome profit. That's what I see here, someone using perverse logic to try to fool some of the people some of the time and walk away laughing all the way to the bank.


Was in Thailand recently and spent about 5 hours at the home of an Australian ex pat talking about a host of things. One item that came up was wine. I mentioned that there were many good Aussie wines that could be had in the states, and he said, 'You don't mean the one with the drawing of a kangaroo on the front?" Went on to say that before they repackaged the wine and came up with a neat drawing for the label, it was a poor selling, mediocre wine. Now its a great selling, mediocre wine.


----------



## EastSideBuzz (Apr 12, 2009)

I think we all should post on thier site and clog there email system that they are pho honeeeeeee and they are not saving the bee's. Some vegans eat honey.


----------



## jcolon (Sep 12, 2014)

Fyi they remove any negative reviews. Only leaving the five start reviews that are most likely written by themselves


----------



## charmd2 (May 25, 2008)

they don't reply to emails either..


----------



## Walter Lawler (Apr 12, 2013)

Bombus_perplexus said:


> Carbon neutrality, or having a net zero carbon footprint, refers to achieving net zero carbon emissions by balancing a measured amount of carbon released with an equivalent amount sequestered or offset, or buying enough carbon credits to make up the difference. It is used in the context of carbon dioxide releasing processes associated with transportation, energy production, and industrial processes such as production of carbon neutral fuel.
> 
> Basically its cane sugar that is harvested by hand, not machine, and uses no animal products in its production. However, the amount of BS in this wording is probably the same as the large amounts used to fertilize the cane. :lpf:


Well how about the diesel fuel they use to burn the fields before harvesting. It looks like it is snowing in south Florida at harvest time. Been there saw that!

Walt


----------

