# Chinese Tallow



## Texas Bee

> Is Chinese Tallow a fast crystallizing honey?


Yes it will crystallize... but it does not crystallize as fast as cotton.

Last year I made 5 gals of it... I still have alittle left in a jar, and it has not crystallized yet..

The Tallow trees are still dormant here ( no leaves yet. )

I have heard 1 story bout a beek that had several barrels of it and it fermented and blew the tops off the barrels.


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## Jeffrey Todd

I never had any problems with it crystallizing more than most honeys. I am always happy to locate bees near Chinese Tallow trees.


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## tecumseh

michael palmer writes:
Could be a storage problem at the customer's end.

tecumseh:
could be. if you acquired this from a packer I am informed they move the tallow honey out as quickly as possible to limit loss for the reason(s) Texas Bee suggested.

If my old memory card hasn't gone bad (yet)... it was also the flowering tree tha Walter T. Kelley promoted and his early beekeeping days in Louisiana were concentrated in the Tallow areas. I think it is now illegal to spread or propagate Tallow since it is now considered a dangerous invader species.


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## wfarler

*tallow*

when does it bloom?


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## arthur

according to this, 23% of all trees in the Houston area are Chinese Tallow trees.

http://www.houstonregionalforest.org/Report/Page05

I'm not sure when it blooms, I just know that it produces nectar after most nectar sources have been tapped out.

When I move, I will be giving gifts of chinese tallow saplings to all my neighbors. I won't plant one myself, because they make a huge mess.


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## Texas Bee

Their not blooming yet. Maybe in about 3 weeks.


...


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## summer1052

Mr. Mertz, my beloved (96 yo!!) sweetheart and mentor says the Tallow trees are excellent because they also "make wax". 

The tallow trees got their name from the waxy coating on the seeds settlers used to make soap and candles. They make lots of nectar which promotes comb building.

He says Huisatche (weesatch) is also good for this. I have also heard that wax myrtle (coomon in the south, but not in my neighborhood) is good, too. (?)

They ARE considered to be "trash" trees. They can be brittle, break up in wind storms, are short-lived (15 years) and the leaves and sap can be poisonous to other plants.

On the plus side, they are fast growing, good shade trees, not too big (hence their popularity in urban areas like Houston) and easy care. And bees like the blossoms.

Like any other plant, in the right spot it's a treasure; in the wrong spot, it's a nightmare. Or a weed.  

I am going to plant some here on my place, along with Vitex and a bunch of other things.

Summer


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## Texas Bee

> when does it bloom?


farley, it want be to long now , mine are starting to put on blooms as we speek. I will try and take a picture of them in bloom.


Heres the pictures... http://s276.photobucket.com/albums/kk23/mikemcvey/?action=view&current=0422091859b.jpg


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## julysun

An update, mine are just starting to open flowers, 5/5/2012. Deer Park just south of Houston.


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## Tom Brueggen

I'm in Kingwood, NE of Houston, and my neighbor's Tallow tree has been in bloom for over a week. My bees go straight to it! As for planting them, why bother? I had four saplings sprouting on piece of bark that fell in my yard. A PIECE OF BARK! That stuff will grow anywhere you let it. And it's like a Hydra. If you cut it down and don't destroy the roots, it will sprout back 10 fold.


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## robherc

Tom Brueggen said:


> If you cut it down and don't destroy the roots, it will sprout back 10 fold.


For any who get sick of the "hydra" effect, I've read a few papers that recommend stripping the bark from a 3' section of the tree, all the way around, in order to kill it so completely that the roots don't throw up new saplings. Haven't tried it myself, as I don't much mind the few I have, but I'll prob. do it if I ever have to cut one of 'em down.


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## julysun

In Deer Park they are weeds. We bush hog them down but they come right back. I think Roundup on the sprouts would work. Right now my bees are happy to have them.


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## foresterguy

julysun said:


> In Deer Park they are weeds. We bush hog them down but they come right back. I think Roundup on the sprouts would work. Right now my bees are happy to have them.


We used Imazapyr in forestry to kill these trees. If under 3 feet a foliar application will do the trick and over three feet a hack and squirt method will take care of them. I am currently doing a project on this and am in need of information regarding how much honey can be made from tallow trees on a per tree basis. Would yall be able to point me in the right direction on this?


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## radallo

foresterguy said:


> We used Imazapyr in forestry to kill these trees. If under 3 feet a foliar application will do the trick and over three feet a hack and squirt method will take care of them. I am currently doing a project on this and am in need of information regarding how much honey can be made from tallow trees on a per tree basis. Would yall be able to point me in the right direction on this?


This is a theoretical mathematical problem, that can't be solved collecting data from beekeepers.

You need to go during the blooming, collect nectar from the flowers and then solve some math calculation..

number of flowers/tree
number of days of blooming
nectar composition (water content, sugar content)
active hours of bee foraging during blooming season
.....
.....


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## foresterguy

radallo said:


> This is a theoretical mathematical problem, that can't be solved collecting data from beekeepers.
> 
> You need to go during the blooming, collect nectar from the flowers and then solve some math calculation..
> 
> number of flowers/tree
> number of days of blooming
> nectar composition (water content, sugar content)
> active hours of bee foraging during blooming season
> .....
> .....


Here's the deal. I'm working on a project 6 wk project that is due 12/10. So I kinda need any data yall may have.


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## radallo

foresterguy said:


> Here's the deal. I'm working on a project 6 wk project that is due 12/10. So I kinda need any data yall may have.


Again,
I am not an expert of US flora.. but I guess your deadline window is out of blooming season..

I can't help further, sorry..


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## jim lyon

foresterguy said:


> Here's the deal. I'm working on a project 6 wk project that is due 12/10. So I kinda need any data yall may have.


I don't know the per tree answer. Here is what I can tell you based on experiences related to me by others. They can yield a lot of nectar when conditions are right. I have heard of hives making up to 100 lbs. of honey in ridiculously large yards containing several hundred hives. You can figure bees probably aren't flying over a mile and a half at the most to gather that much honey. I will make a WAG that maybe as much as 15,000 lbs of honey could be gathered in a single location of very heavy tallow concentration. The math on a 1 1/2 mile flying radius gives you a foraging area of 7 sq. miles. Now if you can come up with an estimate of the number of trees in that area you would have something resembling a high side estimate. 
Maybe a commercial tallow "vet" could correct me if I'm too far off on this.


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## foresterguy

Thanks so much yall have been really helpful.


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## Chick

I am surrounded in tallow trees. Yes, my honey has always crystallized fast, and I have trouble getting the moisture content down.


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