# To Glue, or Not to Glue



## waynesgarden (Jan 3, 2009)

Can't imagine what the problem with gluing would be. I glue everything (and shoot 18 ga brads) when I assemple boxes, frames, bottom boards, etc.

There no doubt will be someone with a horror story about using glue, but I think you'll find lots of happy gluers who have been doing it for decades.

***But DO NOT GLUE if you are less than skillful with cutting and often have to take things apart to reassemble them correctly.*** Ask me how I learned to measure twice, cut (and glue) once.


Wayne


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## peacekeeperapiaries (Jun 23, 2009)

we glue everything, frames, boxes, lids, sbb's...everything... we use Titebond III. We shoot everything with staple guns either 1/4 inch crown or 7/16 inch crown. I cant imagine any problems or concerns with glueing and i think I read somewhere that Titebond III which is waterproof is also recomended for food grade applications. Good luck and keep gluing.


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## rafterdog (May 20, 2010)

I use glue in my boxes and frames and have done that since 1971. I think once there was a problem with OSB (fomaldehyde glue) from China. Heck, one of my hives is a topbar hive made of America-produced OSB. No problems with it. the bees are doing great.


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## wolfpenfarm (Jan 13, 2009)

waynesgarden said:


> Can't imagine what the problem with gluing would be. I glue everything (and shoot 18 ga brads) when I assemple boxes, frames, bottom boards, etc.
> 
> There no doubt will be someone with a horror story about using glue, but I think you'll find lots of happy gluers who have been doing it for decades.
> 
> ...


EVERY woodworking shop needs a heat gun in it. That way when you totally hose up something, you can separate the parts by heating the joint up that is glued.


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## Neal 48 (Jun 28, 2010)

waynesgarden said:


> Can't imagine what the problem with gluing would be. I glue everything (and shoot 18 ga brads) when I assemple boxes, frames, bottom boards, etc.
> 
> There no doubt will be someone with a horror story about using glue, but I think you'll find lots of happy gluers who have been doing it for decades.
> 
> ...


:lpf:


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## Fuzzy (Aug 4, 2005)

Glue, glue, glue


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## brushmouth (Jan 17, 2010)

Glue and air gun are your friends.:thumbsup:

BM


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

We glue everything.
I have a friend that makes laminated oars and gun stocks.
He uses no fasteners.
He has been hounding me for years to assemble an entire hive, boxes and frames using no fasteners. glue only, with the promse that he will replace the entire outfit if one single glue joint fails.
Just havent ever got around to doing it.


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## Adrian Quiney WI (Sep 14, 2007)

I was wondering the opposite when it comes to boxes; Modern glues are so good (I use Titebond 2) that I was wondering if nailing deeps or mediums was redundant. Is there anyone out there not nailing.:scratch: ?
In addition to being an extra step, the nail holes are another place for the box to split.


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## Adrian Quiney WI (Sep 14, 2007)

Do it Harry, do it!


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## brac (Sep 30, 2009)

The reason we are gluing is not what you think. I make batches of 25 or 50 boxes at a time, I would need a pile of clamps to do 50 boxes without staples. I use 1/2" crown 1 1/4 staples, but mostly so I don't have to clamp. The glue will do the job, so the staple is kinda overkill, but I like overkill.


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## HVH (Feb 20, 2008)

I agree - the fasteners are there to hold the joint while the glue dries. The larger guns also will force a joint together somewhat if it isn't too warped. When I build furniture, I typically try to avoid fasteners and use clamps instead to hold the joint while the glue dries. I wouldn't dream of building any outdoor wood projects without glue. The goal is to exclude moisture from the joints and a good glue and paint are needed to keep the water out.


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

GLUE GLUE GLUE!!!

I would not recommend just using glue. Most boxes I get (commercial grade) are too warped and need at least 6 screws to a corner. Lately i have been using almost all screws b/c they are so cheap where I get them. Then I fill in with nails. I have been getting deck screws in bulk at 3.69 a pound and nails for $1 and change a pound at the local lumber dealer. With some titebond 2 or 
3 on top of that, the box will rot before it will wobble. 
On frames, I use 3/16 crown 1 inch with titebond 2. 

Mike


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## rwlaw (May 4, 2009)

When wood get wet, wood expand, when wood dry out, air space. Air space collect mold, more moisture etc. Mold like to keep moisture where live, invite wood rot, bad mold! Glue,glue and more glue, that's my motto and I'm stickin to it (well not actually, I'm not that slow).


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## WI-beek (Jul 14, 2009)

If you like it when new frames fall apart when you pry them out dont use glue. Glue is stronger than the nails or staples and will hold your equipment together. Staples and nails back out.


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## honeyman46408 (Feb 14, 2003)

I have never glued a frame and never had one fall apart, I do over kill with 1/4" X 3/4" crown stapels, dont need no stinkin glue on frames everything else gets "TB3"


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

Staple *behind the ears* and glue and that frame will not come apart. I have had some glued ones that did not have those staples behind the ear and they still fell apart. 

Mike


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## Neal 48 (Jun 28, 2010)

honeyman46408 said:


> I have never glued a frame and never had one fall apart, I do over kill with 1/4" X 3/4" crown stapels, dont need no stinkin glue on frames everything else gets "TB3"


Stinkin glue? Never thought about taking a wiff


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Must be doing something wrong here, No glue on frames, roofs, bottom boards, or supers. We have some supers from 1946 that are still in service. Most of the roofs we are repairing(reusing Gal sheet) are from the late 1930's. We use double dipped Maze nails. We do use glue on the innercovers, but are looking to change the design.

Roland 
Linden Apiary, Est. 1852


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## WI-beek (Jul 14, 2009)

I bought some assembled frames that were only stapled and nothing makes me madder than prying out a frame of honey and ending up with a top bar. I have been gluing all my frames since. Maybe you can get away without glue by adding an extra staple under ear or whatever but I cant imagine it takes any more time to add a dab of glue then an extra staple. The end bars will crack or split before the glue will let lose from my experience. Say it how you like but there is nothing wrong with glue.

I dont think any wooden ware will last 65 years that you buy today.


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## Rick 1456 (Jun 22, 2010)

Glue AND screw,,,,,use to glue and 1 1/4 brad nails w/ air gun. Still had a few boxes and frames separate after a couple of years. I was looking to put 10 frames together cause I needed them in a pinch. Didn't have my gun set up and the only nails I had were 1 1/8 twist nails that u use to put metal joiner strips down between floor transitions. Believe it or not,,,they work great! Start them straight and they twist in straight. Rare they come out the side. Little glue on the joints and they will not separate now IMO works for me

Rick SoMd


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## HVH (Feb 20, 2008)

Discussing glue/no-glue without a mention of moisture can be misleading. Also, box vs. frame construction makes a big difference. 
Water in the joint and especially sponged up by end grain is what tears the joint apart. Glue alone or fasteners alone can work just fine (although glue is stronger) if you can keep the water out. I use urethane glues on boxes, which are a pain to work with, but the foaming past the joint acts as a water barrier. Titebond III has been shown to be stronger but it does not foam (good choice for frames). 
For boxes, with box joints, there is a ton of long grain which makes for a very strong joint. If the glue fails with that much long grain something went wrong. The edge near the rabbit (frame rest), however, can warp away from the sides and cause the frames to fall off the rabbit in extreme cases. I add extra glue at the rabbit corners and try and get the 2" long 7/16" crown staples as close to these corners as possible. After the glue sets up (O/N) I paint with one coat of Kills ext oil base primer followed by a 50/50 mix of Kills plus an oil alkyd and lastly the oil alkyd neat. The 50/50 mix sets up much faster than the oil alkyd due to the hardeners added to primers. The last coat usually takes a week or two to be completely dry. Stacking the boxes on pallets, with tile spacers between, makes box painting and separation much easier. Also, I add water filled internal frame feeders to the top box, as weights, to make painting with a roller easier and to keep the wind here from knocking the stack over.
Four beekeepers equals 5 opinions.


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## Rick 1456 (Jun 22, 2010)

HVH
Man I admire your ability, and talents,,,,,I'm sincere,,,but I ain't got those talents. If I can get them together square and level,,,my world rocks. Butt joints

Rick SoMd


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