# speed controller for a 1/2 hp Dayton ???



## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

Anyone know what controller will work w/ the original Dayton 1/2hp DC motor for a Dadant 33 frame extractor?


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Is it AC or DC?


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## cdevier (Jul 17, 2010)

I don't know if you are looking for an original replacement or a generic.
I have ordered several things from;
SURPLUS CENTER
1-800-488-3407
surpluscenter.com
They also have a catalog.
Charlie


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## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

It is a dc

I bought it from Dadant. They said that it was the same motor that has always been used for the 33 frame extractor.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Are you aware that Dadant sells a speed controller for their DC drive extractors?

http://www.dadant.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=369


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

http://www.zoro.com/g/DC Speed Controls/00008699/None

I have used Dart controls. Cheap and do the job. I don’t know what Dadant does but I would use a drive in current limit mode. It will automatically speed up as the honey is expelled.

More serious drives can do more things. I like Reliance but I see they are bought out by Baldor and I am not sure what products they will phase out. What is the name brand on the drive that you have? Have you looked into fixing it?


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## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

Radar, that is way out of my budget range. thx anyway.

Ace, all I know is that it is a Dayton dc 1/2 hp. it is @ my shop 10 miles from here. I need advice on which controller will work @ on low budget.


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## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

links to sites w/costs appreciated.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

I suggest that you try to find a nameplate on the motor itself (not the extractor), and pass along everything that is on the nameplate.


If you don't want to buy Dadant's solution, the more information you can provide, the easier it will be to suggest an alternative.

Why is that you think you need a replacement speed controller? What problem are you having? Could the issue be with the motor instead?


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

An older thread regarding Dadant motors/controllers:
http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?248466-Extractor-motor-problems

I'd try sending a PM to _BMAC _and ask Brian what controller he used for a replacement, and how it is working since it has been several years.


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Ace, I hate to tell you, but the Dadant control MAY be more than you can imagine. Ours is simple, rugged, yet performs better than a straight up DC drive could. It is a Variac, advanced by a timer motor, that trips a off delay relay, rectified by a bridge.
It is easy to fix, and most parts are generic. 

What does the OP have now? 

I believe that although the OP does not have money for a Dadant control, that anything less would be a waste of money on a product that would be unsatisfactory, and cause more grief than good. Wait and save your money.

Crazy Roland


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## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

The motor that came with it was not factory original, but a VERY small & modified unit. the controller on it will not work w/my new Dayton (from Dadant). 

Roland, when you say "ours" do you mean you work for Dadant or "ours" meaning the one you have?


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## Robinhood & 1Maineguide (Dec 9, 2013)

Lakebilly, You need to talk to "Kent" at Dadant's Metal Warehouse where they make the extractors. I just went thru a problem with ours and he sold us the parts needed for the control. NOT the whole control. We just bought the circuit board and wired the control up ourselves. Works like a charm. Was cheap compared to the control. Nobody else there knew what was going on except him. The Metal warehouse phone number is 217-852-3324, Good Luck.


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## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

Thank you!! will do Monday first thing. I had planned on calling Dadant. It's good to get the right guy& # early.

Which extractor do you have? & what can you tell me about wiring it?


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Roland said:


> It is a Variac, advanced by a timer motor, that trips a off delay relay, rectified by a bridge.
> It is easy to fix, and most parts are generic.


Sounds a bit barbaric but it probably works ok. An extractor has a high start up load so any dc drive you pick out should have a very long accel or better yet be able to run in "current limit" otherwise the motor armature will cook. The variac is an analog device which I have no problem with but it requires more "clap trap" to step it up (the accel). This will also cook the armature if done too quickly.


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## plcnut (Mar 8, 2013)

You did not mention the voltage of the motor, but this one would probably work: http://www.automationdirect.com/adc...s/High_Voltage_(>_50V)_Open_Frame/GSD4-240-5C

The price is right, and A-D is a great company to deal with.


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Lakebilly: I do not work for Dadant. The control belongs to Linden Apiary(my son and I)

Ace- I find your comments revealing a lack of real world experience. These motors are generally oversized, so exactly how are they going to overheat from a starting load? If anything, a slow ramp from zero would be worse, because the motor is a TEFC, not a TEBC. It is best, and in the Dadant instructions, to NOT start the motor at less than 30 percent full speed. That is why a standard inverter with fixed Accel rate is bad. Game over, please try again.

Crazy Roland


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

plcnut said:


> You did not mention the voltage of the motor, but this one would probably work: http://www.automationdirect.com/adc...s/High_Voltage_(>_50V)_Open_Frame/GSD4-240-5C
> 
> The price is right, and A-D is a great company to deal with.


Used these also but you need to order this one to get the 8 second accel. http://www.automationdirect.com/adc.../High_Voltage_(>_50V)_Enclosed/GSD4-240-10N4X
No complaints with these.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Roland go back to school. An inverter is an AC drive, we are speaking DC. They tell you to start at 30% because you are using a variac. At low speed you only have a few coils of the variable transformer taking all the current. A variac is a bad application for a high inertial load. Stick to beekeeping please.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

While the speed control offered by Dadant _is _expensive, one of its nice features is that the extractor speed can be set to ramp up over the entire (possibly 20 minutes or so) extractor cycle. That means you could have it start at say 100 RPM and slowly increase to 350 RPM over the 20 minute cycle, then shut itself off, automatically.

I haven't seen that feature offered in any of the alternatives linked.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Acebird said:


> Roland go back to school. An inverter is an AC drive, we are speaking DC.


Did you miss this part, Ace? :scratch::s



Roland said:


> It is a Variac, advanced by a timer motor, that trips a off delay relay, [HIGHLIGHT]rectified by a bridge.[/HIGHLIGHT]


"_rectified by a bridge_" is shorthand for converting AC into DC via a bridge rectifier. Roland's description will work quite well for controlling a DC motor. 



... back to school ...


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## plcnut (Mar 8, 2013)

Acebird said:


> Used these also but you need to order this one to get the 8 second accel. http://www.automationdirect.com/adc.../High_Voltage_(>_50V)_Enclosed/GSD4-240-10N4X
> No complaints with these.


Ace,
The OP is looking for low cost. I am new to beekeeping, but Industrial automation is what pays my bills, an 8 second accel would be a joke on an extractor. Ramping will have to be done externally. For low cost, use the ~$70 drive with an external speed pot (potentiometer), and you can ramp as needed. In the long run add a motorized pot, or better yet , a low cost PLC with 0-10v output...


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## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd....6_10204081750185982_8013491087803836476_n.jpg


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

I think that _plcnut_'s $67 recommendation in post #16 will do the job for the DC motor nameplate shown in post #23.

It will work with the Dadant DC motor specs, but the speed control will be a knob that you turn manually, not like the Dadant control that increases extractor speed automatically over time. But for $67 vs $800, I would choose the $67 one. As _Plcnut _notes, it is possible to add features to this controller at a later time.


In addition to the time delay options mentioned by _plcnut _in post #22, it would also be possible to use a series of inexpensive timers to substitute in a series of different resistance values in conjunction with the existing speed control potentiometer. Four timers similar to these:
http://smile.amazon.com/dp/B00GIBTQ...TF8&colid=2VEKWVCOVAGXS&coliid=I3QBWOK8AOJ2O7
could be used to setup control start/stop & offer 3 different progressive extractor speeds over the cycle. (Note that the specific timer model I linked has a maximum of 999 seconds, so a maximum cycle time would be 16.6 minutes.)

Such a cobbled-together control would require a certain level of electrical experience (or experimentation) to set up successfully. The good news is that everything is 12 volts, so the potential for personal risk is low.


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## plcnut (Mar 8, 2013)

This drive is compatible with motor you posted:
http://www.automationdirect.com/adc...s/High_Voltage_(>_50V)_Open_Frame/GSD4-240-5C

If you plan to work it hard, then I would add this heatsink:
http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Drives/DC_Drives/Accessories/GSDA-HTSNK-4

For speed control (which you will need) then add this potentiometer:
http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Drives/DC_Drives/Accessories/GSDA-5K

I f you are really concerned about adding 8 seconds to your accell/decel, then add this:
http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Drives/DC_Drives/Accessories/GSDA-ACCDEC-4

You will need to mount all this in an enclosure (which A-D sells) to protect it and you. There are many options for this, so I did not add a link.

If you would rather spend a little more then you could buy this drive instead (the same one Ace posted I believe), and you don't need any of the accessories or enclosure:
http://www.automationdirect.com/adc.../High_Voltage_(>_50V)_Enclosed/GSD4-240-10N4X


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

> For speed control (which you will need) then add this potentiometer:

From looking at the photo of the recommended GSD4-240-5C controller linked, it already has a speed control potentiometer and knob as part of the package (look inside the plastic envelope shown in the "What's in the Box" area).


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## plcnut (Mar 8, 2013)

Rader Sidetrack said:


> it already has a speed control potentiometer and knob as part of the package


You're right. Cool


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Rader Sidetrack said:


> I haven't seen that feature offered in any of the alternatives linked.


Because that doesn't come standard off the shelf as a drive. However any electrical controls engineer could select the right components and do the same thing. I suspect when all is said and done the costs would be similar.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Are you planning to identify those correct components to do that Ace, or just _tease _us?


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

plcnut said:


> This drive is compatible with motor you posted:
> http://www.automationdirect.com/adc...s/High_Voltage_(>_50V)_Open_Frame/GSD4-240-5C


Sure, but if he starts off a little high on the speed pot he will smoke something. It has a fixed accel 1/2 second. That means in a 1/2 second it could pour 20 amps into a motor that is only capable of handling 5 (200% overload for 60 sec.).

What you said before is possible but the OP is not an electrical engineer making his bread and butter on such things. Neither am I but I have a lot of experience on what not to do.
If you want to design the OP something and put it all to gather for him and stand by what you do he might buy the package. Be careful about going too cheap.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Rader Sidetrack said:


> Are you planning to identify those correct components to do that Ace,


No Rader it is not my expertise. I rely on trusted people to do that for me but they don't work for nothing.


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## plcnut (Mar 8, 2013)

Acebird said:


> Sure, but if he starts off a little high on the speed pot he will smoke something. It has a fixed accel 1/2 second. That means in a 1/2 second it could pour 20 amps into a motor that is only capable of handling 5 (200% overload for 60 sec.).


This is why there are current limiting, as well as overload settings on the drive. If you set up the drive according to the instructions, then you won't burn up the motor. It is a drive, not merely a variable voltage DC power supply.


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## plcnut (Mar 8, 2013)

Really want to step it up?

Use this PLC:
http://www.automationdirect.com/adc..._(Stackable_Micro_Brick)/PLC_Units/C0-02DD1-D

with this power supply:
http://www.automationdirect.com/adc...Stackable_Micro_Brick)/Power_Supplies/C0-01AC

and this signal isolator:
http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Drives/DC_Drives/Accessories/GSDA-AI-A

Now with free software you could set up automatic accel, decel, and spin time using the original speedpot that comes with the drive as an analog input to the PLC.
add another $200 for a Cmore micro HMI and you could get real fancy while still coming well under the cost of a replacement drive


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Acebird said:


> No Rader it is not my expertise.


So exactly what _is _your expertise? :scratch:




According to you, hiring an engineer to design an automatic start (i.e., slow speed / speed up / shut off) similar to the Dadant extractor control system should be doable for $800 or so? Design + purchase/manufacturing the various components? Really? Where are you going to get a qualified electrical engineer to work that cheap?

Just how many of these units is your marketing department going to be able to sell to amortize the full costs? :s


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

plcnut said:


> This is why there are current limiting, as well as overload settings on the drive. If you set up the drive according to the instructions, then you won't burn up the motor. It is a drive, not merely a variable voltage DC power supply.


Will it sustain current limit for an extended period? I don't know the drive that well. I know Reliance would run indefinitely in current limit. Having the extended accel would keep it out of current limit or keep it to a minimum.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Rader Sidetrack said:


> So exactly what _is _your expertise? :scratch:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It sounds like PLCNUT is doing it for nothing.


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## plcnut (Mar 8, 2013)

I don't exactly do it for 'nothing', but I am willing to give back some of what has been given to me.

The OP is a fellow beek that is trying to fix his equipment without buying expensive OEM replacement parts. I don't have the money to do it either, and so I build it. That is what the OEM part is: something someone built and engineered to accomplish a goal.
Anyway... I hope he gets it going for a lot less than $800


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Winner, Winner, Chicken Diner: 

Rader posted:

That means you could have it start at say 100 RPM and slowly increase to 350 RPM over the 20 minute cycle, then shut itself off, automatically.

And that is exactly what our control from Dadant does, with an adjustable dwell at an adjustable max speed. 

Crazy Roland


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

plcnut said:


> I don't exactly do it for 'nothing', but I am willing to give back some of what has been given to me.
> 
> The OP is a fellow beek that is trying to fix his equipment without buying expensive OEM replacement parts.


But does he have the skills required to do it on his own? I don't know that. Some how he got a hold of a 33 frame extractor. Was that cheap? There are many solutions he could do if he has the required skills to do them. It is good that you made some suggestions. Can he carry them out?

Roland, the winner is the one that gets him going. I would hope that Dadant is not using a variac in their control today. That is almost laughable.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

The $67 control that _plcnut _that linked to will "get him going", once wired to the motor. The extractor will then work like many other extractors in the marketplace, with a variable speed control manually operated.

The additional features offered by the Dadant control, and the _optional _*PLC *unit identified by _plcnut _are "_nice to have_" not "must have".

What Ace hasn't mentioned at all is that PLC stands for "_*programmable *_logic controller", and any PLC unit will need to be PROGRAMMED before it will do anything other than sit there and look pretty.

Ace has already told us he can't do the programming, and that is a key issue. Either you do it yourself, or pay someone else. After spending hundreds of dollars in the required hardware, how much will a beek have to spend to get a PLC unit custom programmed properly? :s And how will it get reprogrammed if it has a '_hiccup_' sometime down the road?

That Dadant $800 unit starts to look cheap from that perspective. :lpf:



Who cares whether it has a Variac in it or not if it *does the job*?


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## plcnut (Mar 8, 2013)

Although it is not technically proper, it is not uncommon to hear a Pot refereed to as a variac. Many people see a wirewound doughnut with a knob, and think they are all the same thing. I do not know if Roland is referring to a Pot, or a true Variac. I do know that Roland knows about bees  and therefore appreciate his input whether all terms are proper or not.


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

After working with variacs in a lab, and owning one(OK, two, on in control), i am 99 percent certain, it is a variac, and not a variable resistor. I believe it is listed on the schematic as a variac also. Yup, must not be good, it has only lasted 30-40 years?
let's see if you can find your PLC programing software after 30 years. There is a place for finesse, and a place for rude and crude. This ain't rocket science, just a merry-go-round for bee equipment.

Crazy Roland


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Roland said:


> let's see if you can find your PLC programing software after 30 years.


This is where you have not a clue what you are talking about.
PlC's have been around for over 30 years and I personally know they are still in use on very old equipment, however long obsolete. Variacs are a good tool to prove out a system but certainly not meant for this application on industrial equipment. Yes, it is something a beekeeper would do but not a machinery manufacturer.

Didn't the OP's 30 frame extractor come with a drive system? What happened to it? After all it is just a merry-go-round.


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## plcnut (Mar 8, 2013)

Ace,
I have pulled programs from 30 yr old equipment. It is no small task. Have you seen software for a SyMax 50 series? how about a SyMax 10 series? How about a computer that would actually run the software (if you found it)? I had a 50 series programmer, it was made to connect to a tape recorder to hold the program. I would rather deal with a variac than one of those


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Acebird said:


> Didn't the OP's 30 frame extractor come with a drive system? What happened to it?


Funny you don't remember this from post #12, Ace. :lpf: It was the _*motor *_that quit, not the control.



lakebilly said:


> The motor that came with it was not factory original, but a VERY small & modified unit. the controller on it will not work w/my new Dayton (from Dadant).




:gh:

And even though your old 8-track tape player _might _still turn on, you might have a little trouble finding new _*software *_(tape cartridges) to load into the dinosaur.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

> The motor that came with it was not factory original,


Which suggest something happened to it. duh


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

plcnut said:


> Ace,
> I have pulled programs from 30 yr old equipment.


Programs are programs they don't change. Hardware begins to fail long before electrical failures and any program glitch is usually the cause of some hardware failure or mechanical abuse. This area was noted for the invention of magnetic media obsoleting punch tape and IBM cards. Some very cleaver people were building PLC's in their basements long before PLC's became the thing. I can tell you that those PLC's made millions and millions of EKG electrodes. You would be hard pressed to find an automated machine today that wasn't controlled by a PLC. Every car today is controlled by a PLC but they call it a computer. Nobody I know has any problem getting in one where their life it dependent on it.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Ace, here is a sad tale of woe from someone trying to deal with a program on a 30 year old SyMax 10 series PLC the _plcnut _referenced above:

http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=80841

One of the helpful responses ...


> The Sy/Max 50 was made for Square D by IDEC during the 80's. While a lot of the IDEC FA2J (?) hardware is interchangeable the software and programing is not. The Model 50 was obsoleted at least 10 years ago. The software will not run on a Windows based computer, it needs a DOS operating system no faster than about 20MHz.
> 
> http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=80841


Makes the $800 control from Dadant that actually _works_, and has actual _support/parts _available sound better and better .... :lpf:



... who has a 20 MHz DOS computer that still _works _.... :scratch:


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Cell phones are obsolete in two years so should you go back to a rotary dial or just buy the latest and greatest when the one you have doesn't work anymore?

Rader if you want to buy the control buy the control. Does this new control use a variac. If it did I wouldn't buy it. I am not saying 800 is a bad price for a finished package.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Rader Sidetrack said:


> Ace, here is a sad tale of woe from someone trying to deal with a program on a 30 year old SyMax 10 series PLC the _plcnut _referenced above:



Same link:


> a replacement brick style plc from any of several name brand manufactruers can be had for $200.


Why would you waste your time?


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Ace, the part that you are missing -*repeatedly *- is that you cannot buy a suitable _*PROGRAMMED *_PLC for $200! :no: 

:ws:

You have already conceded that you don't have the skills to program that PLC - so it is essentially just an expensive _brick _with pretty lights until is is properly _*PROGRAMMED*_, and once you *pay *someone to program it, then it will have a cost/value considerably higher than $200.

:gh:


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## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

I bought a Grainger unit for 113.80+. (Stu from Grainger said it would work)My best friend is away, when he gets back I will have him wire it. He says he did a lot of it @ the factory he worked at. I have a cycletrol 150 that came w/the equipment I bought used (not from factory). He can wire & test that so that I will have a backup or plan b, if it works. Looks complicated. I can fix most anything for your house. You may be well advise to find someone else to fix most anything else.

I haven't a clue as to most of the dialoging about this. As par usual the answers are not simple to us simpletons. I am glad to see that there are a few techno techs here. Thanks for the input.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Good to hear that your problem with the extractor is on the way to being resolved.


Perhaps you could update the thread later with your impressions of how well it works after you have had a chance to use the extractor, and include the Grainger model# for future beeks that might be in a similar situation.


--------------------------------

The Grainger page with DC motor controllers (these are just variable speed controllers with a knob, not PLC units) is here:
http://www.grainger.com/content/catalogPdf?adobeCompatible=true&CatPage=346

My _*guess *_is the model that _lakebilly _was sold may be the Dart 2M510, which has a Grainger catalog _list price_ of $113.80


.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

lakebilly said:


> I bought a Grainger unit for 113.80+. (Stu from Grainger said it would work)My best friend is away, when he gets back I will have him wire it.


Wiring it is a no brainer, you can follow the instructions. You basically have two ac wires and two armature wires. Reversing the armature wires will change directions. Then you might have three pot wires. If the gearing is correct I would start off with 20% speed and in 6 seconds it should reach that speed. Then raise it to 50% and see if it can get to that speed in 6 seconds. The motor might growl for a bit at the start but is should not continue.

This is an open drive meant to be put in an enclosure. The nema 4 enclosure is what bumps up the price. I recommended the nema 4 version because you will need to clean the extractor and honey and water will make fireworks. If you wall mount the drive and keep it away from the extractor so you can clean it you will be alright. It probably isn't legal but you can run S/O cord to the motor. Ground the extractor!


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## zhiv9 (Aug 3, 2012)

I work in the same industry as plcnut. His advice is sound. I would probably have gone with a fully enclosed drive to save buying and installing in a box:

http://www.automationdirect.com/adc.../High_Voltage_(>_50V)_Enclosed/GSD4-240-10N4X

This way the heatsink is already installed.

Here is another totally enclosed option. I have used KB at work in 3-shift/24 hour continuous industrial applications to good effect:

http://www.galco.com/buy/KB-Electronics/KBPC-240DBLACK


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Rader Sidetrack said:


> Ace, the part that you are missing -*repeatedly *- is that you cannot buy a suitable _*PROGRAMMED *_PLC for $200! :no:
> 
> :ws:
> 
> You have already conceded that you don't have the skills to program that PLC


Ah, really where did I say that? Your slipping Rader. I have programmed vision guided robots which involves programming the camera, a PLC, as well as the SCARA robot. A PLC for an extractor would be a cake walk. Selecting compatible components and marrying them together is a different skill set. Any bird brain can pick components out of a catalog but only experienced technicians pick out the ones that work well together and survive the misgivings of the typical operator who will ultimately use the equipment.

You can be a hot dog all on your own or you can rely on the abilities of others and accomplish so much more.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

It really interesting  that you didn't offer to program that PLC unit when the OP was looking for recommendations, and the subject first came up. 

Ace, would you care to tell us exactly how you intend to establish communication with the PLC so you can program it?


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

zhiv9 said:


> Here is another totally enclosed option. I have used KB at work in 3-shift/24 hour continuous industrial applications to good effect:
> 
> http://www.galco.com/buy/KB-Electronics/KBPC-240DBLACK


This drive has some interesting features. You can change it from speed regulation to torque regulation which I love. What I don't know is if you can switch it on the fly. Set the pot for full run speed and start off in torque mode. I think it would require two pots. Verification would have to come from the manufacturer as to whether this is feasible.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Rader Sidetrack said:


> Ace, would you care to tell us exactly how you intend to establish communication with the PLC so you can program it?


Networking ... find someone like PLCNUT that is using the brand selected and borrow the link or have him PROGRAM it for you. I bet he would be willing to buy it, programme it and send it to the OP to help out a fellow beek. Some people just enjoy a challenge and others stop dead in their tracks. You are making a mountain out of a molehill.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Acebird said:


> Networking ... find someone like PLCNUT that is using the brand selected and borrow the link or have him PROGRAM it for you.


For a moment there - when you opened with "_networking_", I wondered if you were going to talk about assigning a static IP address (vs dynamic IP) so you could talk to the PLC as a network device in order to program it.  Obviously, I was completely wrong on that score.


Maybe you could pay _plcnut _for his programming skills/services with honey!


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>For a moment there - when you opened with "networking", I wondered if you were going to talk about assigning a static IP address (vs dynamic IP) so you could talk to the PLC as a network device in order to program it.

With all the talk in the computer industry about the interenet of things, I'm surprised someone doesn't have an extractor that measures how much it's extracted, tells you when it's done with that batch, maybe even calls your cell in case you fell asleep at the wheel... etc. etc. etc....


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## plcnut (Mar 8, 2013)

Michael Bush said:


> >I'm surprised someone doesn't have an extractor that measures how much it's extracted, tells you when it's done with that batch, maybe even calls your cell in case you fell asleep at the wheel... etc. etc. etc....


It's not an extractor, but I do this every day at work. One of the systems here texts my phone every batch it completes with all the relevant data, so I know what is going on. Pretty cool


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Michael Bush said:


> With all the talk in the computer industry about the interenet of things, I'm surprised someone doesn't have an extractor that measures how much it's extracted, tells you when it's done with that batch, maybe even calls your cell in case you fell asleep at the wheel... etc. etc. etc....


Mike it is only a question of how much can you afford.


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## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

Radar, you are right about the model I bought. The motor that came w/the extractor did not "go bad" It was just too small for the extractor. 2 hours to extract SOME of the honey. I am waiting for a friend to help me install the new one.....& btw I have a "Little Wonder" hand crank that is going to get modified for the .13hp motor that came off the larger extractor. I need to find a gearwheel to adapt to the .13hp unit & make a mounting plate.

I can't believe the dearth of info on converting a hand crank to electric!! lots of threads, not much in the way of useful links/info. folks, I need click by click instructions & lots of pics....I AM NOT SLOW....ok, maybe a little.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

lakebilly said:


> btw I have a "Little Wonder" hand crank that is going to get modified for the .13hp motor that came off the larger extractor.


The thing is your cheapest way out would have been to install a transmission or variable speed pulley system using that .13hp motor even though it would not be a conventional solution.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

My version of "_the cheapest way out_" is to install a DC motor with variable speed controls already wired to the motor, salvaged from a _*free *_treadmill*. 


If you are careful about the way you disassemble the treadmill, and carefully document any wire that you cut to get it all apart, you can reassemble it as a variable speed extractor motor without needing an electrician. The most difficult part of this kind of conversion is mechanical, not electrical.


*(To do this, you need a treadmill with a knob that changes motor speed _electrically_. Some treadmills have an AC induction motor with constant speed and a _mechanical _variable speed control instead of a DC motor. Save that for a different project and look for a treadmill with _electrical _speed control. )

.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

That might be where the .13hp motor and drive came from.


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## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

I need to find a gearwheel to adapt to the .13hp unit & make a mounting plate.

any links to a site for gear parts. I believe it to be a 1/2" shaft.


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Some smaller extractors seem to use worm gears, like the ones shown in this Brushy Mtn instruction/part list:
http://www.brushymountainbeefarm.com/downloads/802_9FrameHandExtra.pdf

If that is similar to what you have in mind, you may need to acquire a both sides of the worm drive as a matching pair.

Boston Gear could very well have what you need, but matching what you have could be a challenge: http://www.bostongear.com/index.asp


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

Rader - Good idea, treadmill motor with control.

try Reid supply. 

crazy Roland


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

lakebilly said:


> I believe it to be a 1/2" shaft.


I am assuming you are going to mount to the hand crank shaft. McMasters 
http://www.mcmaster.com/#timing-belt-pulleys/=t8dscq

A guard would be appropriate.


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