# Large Beekeepers and Treatment Free



## Robbin (May 26, 2013)

woodedareas said:


> I noticed a large beekeeper that sells to many sources and indicates he does not use"chemicals" in his hives. I am totally treatment fee and I have only 10 hives but I have significant losses. How can a large beekeeper afford to replace bees and be treatment free or is there a difference between treatment fee and stating no use of chemicals in his hives? I visited a large beekeeper last year and he told me that if he did not treat his hives he would go bankrupt because he could not afford to replace them.


If you have the right genetics, you can be treatment free and not suffer huge losses. But the only way for the hobby beek to get there is to buy some varroa resistant queens and build from there. It’s very difficult to buy generic bees and stumble into some that can survive long term. If he claims he doesn’t treat, and he sells bees, start by buying a couple of NUCs from him…..


----------



## Danpa14 (Jun 12, 2013)

A western Ky beekeeper who runs a few hundred hives is treatment free. I believe that he plans for a 30% loss each year. And keeps nucs as replacements and then sells what he doesn't need. I also know he gets and sells pkgs each year that do not come from his stock. So if you want his bees you have to be aware of this.


----------



## StevenG (Mar 27, 2009)

When you say significant losses, what is significant? I've been TF since reentering beekeeping in 2005. My annual losses range from 6 to 20%. However, this past year I was devastated with a 30% loss. I felt a little better when I found out larger beekeepers (who also treat) suffered 60% losses. Weather was a huge factor this year. 
Regards,
Steven


----------



## woodedareas (Sep 10, 2010)

I lost 100% last year, but the weather had a big role.


----------



## StevenG (Mar 27, 2009)

I would say that is more than significant! Do you mind if I ask what kind of bees you had, and where you got them?
Regards,
Steven


----------



## Oldtimer (Jul 4, 2010)

woodedareas said:


> I noticed a large beekeeper that sells to many sources and indicates he does not use"chemicals" in his hives. How can a large beekeeper afford to replace bees and be treatment free


There are several issues here and to know how it all works it would be helpful to know who it is and ask him.

However in lieu of that, here are a few thoughts. There is at least one large TF beekeeper who sells to many sources, it is BeeWeaver and how they do it is on their web site. Other than that, he could be prepared to run at a higher loss rate if he gets a premium price for his treatment free bees, or he may be prepared to make less money because he believes in the principle of being treatment free.

The other beekeeper who told you he would go broke if he did not treat would probably also be correct, the reason being that commercial hives used for honey production and pollination are exposed to far more stressors than bees in a different type of operation and losses would be huge if they are not treated. 

There are also some who say something like "I don't use chemicals in the hives I just use essential oils", just check he is not one of those.


----------



## woodedareas (Sep 10, 2010)

You are correct. He does use some products for mite treatment but refers to them as organic. He also move bees to the south for the winter. I have learned there is a big difference between treatment free and "no chemicals". A great learning experience. I am now using sugar syrup and then fondant for the colder months, and some insulation.Hopefully I will have better results this winter. I also am looking for a source of queens and I will try this source on some of my hives next spring. Thi


Oldtimer said:


> There are several issues here and to know how it all works it would be helpful to know who it is and ask him.
> 
> However in lieu of that, here are a few thoughts. There is at least one large TF beekeeper who sells to many sources, it is BeeWeaver and how they do it is on their web site. Other than that, he could be prepared to run at a higher loss rate if he gets a premium price for his treatment free bees, or he may be prepared to make less money because he believes in the principle of being treatment free.
> 
> ...


----------

