# Pricing Honey



## rmdial

I am venturing into the realm of supplying a local retail kitchen supply store with my local honey. I am trying to price it at the wholesale level and assume the honey prices in Bee Culture and Bee Journal are what I should go by. If I look at the recent issue of Bee Culture it says wholesale case price of 2# glass jar is $97.62 and retail is $10.47 per jar ($125.64). Of course, the retailer will decide what to price it at. Will other publications agree or do they differ? What about the USDA or Honey Board? Is there a better source than others? 

Am I figuring this correctly? If not, I would appreciate your comments.

Thanks in advance.


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## My-smokepole

In my market I see a lot of honey sold for more than what they print. You know the old saying what the market will bear. What type of market is it being sold in. 
David


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## danno

I charge 2.75 a pound plus 1.00 for the container. This is a price that all of us lic. producers in my area agreed to. For 12oz bears we get 3.00 and one pound jars are 4.00 Markets mark it up so the prices may very alittle but are all in the same ballpark.


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## rtoney

I sell quarts for 12 and pints for 7 to a health food store, I think there price is 19.95 & 13.95.
All depends on your market area.


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## beemandan

danno said:


> This is a price that all of us lic. producers in my area agreed to.


I don't know that I'd state that publicly.


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## sqkcrk

Cost of production plus cost of container plus cost of cap plus cost of labels equals your total costs. Add to that what you need on top of that to keep in business and that is your personal wholesale price. Forget about what it says in the Magazines. Sell that to your retailer and let them mark it up as they see fit. That's my advice.


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## sqkcrk

danno said:


> I charge 2.75 a pound plus 1.00 for the container. This is a price that all of us lic. producers in my area agreed to.


I think you just admitted to price fixing or collusion. You might want to Delete that statement before someone w/ a badge calls on you.


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## Daniel Y

Mark, actually just adding your cost does not get it. Certainly not for a small timer. Now if your costs are high enough you can track them individually. but for the small time operation that is usually not economical. It is also whee the small timer looses it.

You say add the bottle cap and label. Did you search up those bottles caps and labels for nothing? did you design the label or just select an off the shelf one for nothing? Did you earn anything for all calculating ordering and receiving of them? What about washing them, extracting the honey, placing that cap on the bottle and applying the label? Did you pay for the computer, the electricity you use, The internet connection and was shipping added to the order? And you are still only at the point you have a bunch of bottles setting around where nobody can buy them. The honey in the bottle is worth what it is worth simply because it is honey. Keep in mind you did some sort of work to earn the money that purchase those bottles,caps and labels as well. Are you just going to settle for getting back money you already had?

A formula for a small timer that helps cover all that additional "Stuff" is this. Anything you pay out for you triple when you price it for resale. A 50 cent jar then ads $1.50 to the cost of the final product. ANd here is why.

1. is simply to get the money you spent back.
2. pays for all those internet connection bills and electricity blah blah blah.
3. is your businesses income. so that next time you can buy another type of jar. maybe a different size. shape do a Christmas gift jar special or whatever. It also covers losses due to broken or damaged containers. Or goes toward the cost of promotions. You want to be very careful to keep that money working. gaining customers or providing perks for your product.

Notice you still have not been paid for your time or effort in any of it. you figure that separately and that also gets added to the price of the final product.

Materials times 3 plus your labor. If you cannot keep you price competitive wit that formula you need to shop harder or smarter. reduce the cost of the materials or work faster.

Here is an example. I have very nice bottle for a Holiday Special I am doing. Total cost of the bottle was $2.51. I Then add a honey dipper for another dollar. The work in making up these bottles is pretty high so I add another 2 dollars for labor. this makes a grand total of $9.50 I charge just for the bottle. My target price was $15.00 each when I add a lb of honey to the bottle at $6.00 a lb it comes out at $15.50 per bottle. I am eating the 50 cents and working to reduce the time it takes to put the bottle together.

Almost half where sold before I even got them ready. But how to do that is another post. I suspect the other half will sell over the next week or so and I hope to turn it around and do it again. My problem is I am running out of honey.


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## sqkcrk

Then maybe your price is too low?


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## Daniel Y

No, The price is right. I actually polled a few people to see where I needed to land the price. and the bottle was selected to land on that price. $20 seemed a bit high and $10 to low. $15 is proving to be a good number. Now keep in mind I was polling with a specific reason for people to buy the honey.


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## sqkcrk

My point is that were the price higher your supply would not run out as fast.
Plus, you would make more profit. Does that make sense?


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## Daniel Y

I know what you are saying Mark. What I don't know is why you think it is selling to fast. I made these up to sell now. I am doing it by increasing my price by more than double. So much for that whole if the price is to low it sells to fast thing. How did I make my honey sell faster by raising the price? It just is not that simple that is how. My price is also helping keep my honey around for my customers until next June and is doing that just fine. 6 months and we have sold just about half of it. When we sell these it will push us over the line just a bit but I prefer to run out a month or two short. What I did not want was to be telling my customers I was out 6 to 8 months before the next harvest. so far that is not going to happen. So like I said I think my price is right where I want it to be. Doing just what I need it to do. I am not out of honey I will be out of these special items that I made up with the intent that they be a holiday thing limit in supply and temporary. They are selling just about exactly the way I want them to. My plan from the beginning w to have the money from these bottles by the end of December. I have other things to do with it.


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## sqkcrk

If you are happy that's what counts. It just seemed like you were saying that your honey stock would be gone soon and you would not have any more to sell. So I suggested raising the price. If it is right for you then that's fine.

Other people, not you Daniel, often have a "get rid of it" attitude or think that their honey has to be lower priced than someone else or it won't sell. All along not realizing that if their price was higher than anyone else that not only would they have it longer but they would make more profit per lb sold. 

I want to pace my sales so I have honey all year round. I have cut back on my outlets. Not only do I not have the honey to keep them stocked all year round, I wasn't making profit serving them.

During the years I sold honey to outlets across the Adirondacks I found that every time I raised my price I sold more honey. Figure that one out for me.


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## Daniel Y

Mark, If it was as easy as just lower price (Not saying you are saying that) Then what is all this money spent on advertising about? Marketing is so complex that many people make careers out of it. I am not running out of honey. I will run out of these special bottles I made up. People are talking about me making up a second batch of them. I am not sure I want to because then it will cause me to start running short on honey for the year. Yeah it is tempting to get the money now. but I also realize how hard I worked to get my customers as well. do I want to do that again next year?


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## sqkcrk

How r u selling your honey? At work? Farm mkt stand?


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## Daniel Y

Word of mouth. I also do not have a lot.


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## woodedareas

Daniel
Your 3 times cost process actually does work not only for honey but I have use the same simple process for a professional service business for 40 years. I have a question however, what would you sell 8oz and 12oz plastic honey bears for? I am costing these out and your thoughts would be appreciated.Another question is very simply after considering all costs what does a pound of honey sell for?


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## brooksbeefarm

I sell quarts (3 lbs.) for $14.00, chunk honey quarts, $16.00, pints $7.50, 12oz. bears for $4.00, with no complaints, and usually sell out by the end of the year. I sell at the local farmers market and out the door at home.


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## sqkcrk

My prices are loosely or roughly based on $3.00/lb. plus a little to make the math easier. My wholesale prices 8oz. jars @ $2.50 each, 12oz Bears @ $3.25 each, 1lb jars and Invert containers @ $4.50 each, 2lb jars @ $8.00 each, and 5lb jars @ $19.00 each. All sales by the case. Direct store delivery.

Customers who come to the house pay a little more, closer to retail.


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## Daniel Y

I cannot recall what I paid for them but my 1lb plastic bottles sell for $7 and the honey itself is 6 of that. I price my honey at $6 a lb no matter the volume for now. that will change this year. I am not quite doing the cost of the bottle times three and that is due to other factors at that time that have no been corrected. such as a bottle with a label that looks good enough. An 8 oz or 12 oz I do not do yet but would price them just the same. if it is up to standard and looking professional the cost of the bottle gets tripled and the price of the honey is added.

Now in the case of the higher priced stuff. In that case I am not just selling honey. I am selling the bottle a honey dipper and the honey. You would have to see my customers reactions to see what that is absolutely true. I do not not have the bottle priced at X3 by 50 cents. I can live with that. the honey is bumped up a bit on the per lb price and the honey dipper I sell at my cost. it is part of the label. It makes a bottle that has as much appeal to look at as the honey itself has. It sells at $15 for a 1 lb jar.




woodedareas said:


> Daniel
> Your 3 times cost process actually does work not only for honey but I have use the same simple process for a professional service business for 40 years. I have a question however, what would you sell 8oz and 12oz plastic honey bears for? I am costing these out and your thoughts would be appreciated.Another question is very simply after considering all costs what does a pound of honey sell for?


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## Riskybizz

Farmers Market pricing here is right at $10.00 per lb. I sell wholesale by the case (12 lb. jars) at $72.00. I have several 50 case a year accounts. Next year i'll probably go up a little. For me its a process of educating my accounts regarding the merits and benefits of local, unprocessessed honey. Bottom line is that that thype of honey is becomming more scarce. So much junk honey on the market and people in my area are educated enough to realize it.


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## jredburn

What people pay for an item is based on their need and their perception of worth. People believe that the honey you have for sale is of of higher quality than the junk they find in a store. They are willing to pay more for what they believe is a better value. Your success will depend on how well you market your product.
Remember that the prices in Bee Culture are averages.
Rent a space in a craft sale or farmers market. Price the honey at an exorbitant level, When one in three walks away without buying, you are to a little high. Lower the price until only one in five walks .away.


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## Honey-4-All

sqkcrk said:


> I think you just admitted to price fixing or collusion. You might want to Delete that statement before someone w/ a badge calls on you.


Mark, If you are not already familiar with it the Sherman Anti trust laws are not applicable to farm producers. Never were. The logic is that the number of market makers are so large that the collusion would never reach the point of effecting price. If you beg to disagree show me the law....


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## Rader Sidetrack

Honey-4-All said:


> Mark, If you are not already familiar with it the Sherman Anti trust laws are not applicable to farm producers. Never were. The logic is that the number of market makers are so large that the collusion would never reach the point of effecting price. If you beg to disagree show me the law....


Its not that simple, in my opinion.

The Sherman Antitrust Act, and related laws, such as the Clayton Antitrust Act, are federal laws, but as such only apply to interstate (& foreign) commerce. 



> *Constitutional basis for legislation
> 
> *Congress claimed power to pass the Sherman Act through its constitutional authority to regulate interstate commerce. Therefore, Federal courts only have jurisdiction to apply the Act to conduct that restrains or substantially affects either interstate commerce or trade within the District of Columbia. This requires that the plaintiff must show that the conduct occurred during the flow of interstate commerce or had an appreciable effect on some activity that occurs during interstate commerce.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sherman_Antitrust_Act


Assuming the 'cartel' that _Danno _is a member of is comprised of Michigan honey producers, selling to Michigan consumers, it would be _Michigan _laws that would apply.

And no, I don't know what Michigan laws might be applicable to such a circumstance. My guess is that regardless of whether any Michigan laws apply, the chance of prosecution is _slim_.


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## Honey-4-All

http://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/antitrust

"Second, the Clayton Act exempted labor unions and *agricultural organizations* from the Sherman Act's reach."


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## Rader Sidetrack

Well, we _*both agree *_that Sherman/Clayton Antitrust Acts do not apply in this case. 


But that is not the end of the matter. Michigan law also likely applies in this case, and neither of us has [apparently] researched what/how specific Michigan laws apply.


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## deknow

I think there is an advantage to rounding up prices for retail and making the math easier....but for wholesale? I don't see a single advantage to doing this for wholesale. Might as well round up to a higher odd number...no wholesale buyer expects or gains any advantage to round numbers.

You dont want to make change for a $7.63 jar of honey at the farmers market 100 times on a sunday, but the buyer is going to cut you one check or give you one bundle of cash anyways.

Deknow



sqkcrk said:


> My prices are loosely or roughly based on $3.00/lb. plus a little to make the math easier. My wholesale prices 8oz. jars @ $2.50 each, 12oz Bears @ $3.25 each, 1lb jars and Invert containers @ $4.50 each, 2lb jars @ $8.00 each, and 5lb jars @ $19.00 each. All sales by the case. Direct store delivery.
> 
> Customers who come to the house pay a little more, closer to retail.


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## sqkcrk

deknow said:


> no wholesale buyer expects or gains any advantage to round numbers.
> 
> Deknow


The wholesale seller does. Don't have to carry a calculator.

What's wrong w/ making the math easier for oneself whether you are wholesaling or retailing? Making sales to a store or to an individual customer at a mkt or your house?


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## deknow

There are all kinds of voluntary taxes that are applied to people that can't or don't want to do math. I'd rather do the math than pay the tax.

Deknow


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## Rader Sidetrack

Hmmm. :s


Mark didn't say anything about _avoiding _math. He simply chose to use a "_hands free_" calculator.


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## deknow

I don't know how others wholesale. Our wholesale customers generally order by the case. I generate an invoice in my accounting software which has my products, prices,and wholesale discounts. I'm not terribly organized nor is our setup sophisticated. If I were to generate invoices by hand, it would not only mean doing the math by hand, but it would be more work to eventually enter the invoice into a computer or a green sheet.

As to carrying around a calculator, you can buy them at the dollar store, and even a 10 year old cell phone has a calculator built in.

Business is math.


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## sqkcrk

deknow said:


> There are all kinds of voluntary taxes that are applied to people that can't or don't want to do math. I'd rather do the math than pay the tax.
> 
> Deknow


Huh? When do you pay a tax when selling honey? And who said anything about not doing math? I just try to make things easier for me. Do you think I should figure out what every single part costs down to the penny and then add a dollar or something for the profit and sell one pound jars for $4.78 each wholesale? Seems silly to me when I can simply round up to $5.00.

I don't know why you quoted me earlier anyway.


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## sqkcrk

deknow said:


> I don't know how others wholesale. Our wholesale customers generally order by the case. I generate an invoice in my accounting software which has my products, prices,and wholesale discounts. I'm not terribly organized nor is our setup sophisticated. If I were to generate invoices by hand, it would not only mean doing the math by hand, but it would be more work to eventually enter the invoice into a computer or a green sheet.
> 
> As to carrying around a calculator, you can buy them at the dollar store, and even a 10 year old cell phone has a calculator built in.
> 
> Business is math.


Do you have items which you sell for $X.73? None of my items, sold by the case, are sold by dollars and cents, only dollars. I like having dbl zeros in the cents columns. I add up my hand written receipts w/out a calculator. Maybe I am not the businessman others are. I often find I am not. But my bee business is not a hobby. Not that anyone said it was.


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