# Grafting is easy!



## drlonzo (Apr 15, 2014)

Got some advice, same that I'm going to use myself this coming spring. Use the Jenter system. Put your queen into the grid one morning, she lays up to 110 eggs for you that day, let her out of the box, the bees tend to the eggs for you just fine, then when you need to do your queen rearing, you pop out the cells from the back of the box, insert into holders, put into your grafting NUC and let them do the rest. System is so simple and best of all, no timing box to deal with..


----------



## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

Mbeck,
Keep the breeder queen or queens in a nuc or nucs. That way, when you swap in a drawn frame, four days later or five, you'll have a good pattern of eggs and of course one day old or less larva to graft from. Putting a drawn frame in a full sized hive is much less sure to give you the grafting larva you are after on a schedule you can depend on.


----------



## WBVC (Apr 25, 2013)

How easy is it for a new beek to find the Queen, pick her up without damaging her and get through the hole in the grid system? Does one leave her in for only 24 hours or longer?



drlonzo said:


> Got some advice, same that I'm going to use myself this coming spring. Use the Jenter system. Put your queen into the grid one morning, she lays up to 110 eggs for you that day, let her out of the box, the bees tend to the eggs for you just fine, then when you need to do your queen rearing, you pop out the cells from the back of the box, insert into holders, put into your grafting NUC and let them do the rest. System is so simple and best of all, no timing box to deal with..


----------



## drlonzo (Apr 15, 2014)

WBVC said:


> How easy is it for a new beek to find the Queen, pick her up without damaging her and get through the hole in the grid system? Does one leave her in for only 24 hours or longer?


Easy is what you make of it.  Once a person has figured out how to find a queen in the box, it shouldn't be hard at all from there. The grid system comes with a queen excluder cover that just closes over her once you put her in. Allowing the workers to tend to her as they always do. As for how long to leave her in the grid, an exceptional queen can lay up to 3000 eggs in a day. So even if she was sub par, she should be able to lay up the 110 cups within a 24 hour period. 

This will give you the expected correct age larva with NO guess work at all. I know that I'm going to use it for sure.


----------



## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

1) Yes, grafting is easy with a no graft frame where the
queen will lay directly into the plastic queen cups. Still working on this one.
2) Another method is to confine the queen inside a clean comb frame with the queen excluder on both sides of the frame for the queen to lay in.


----------



## marshmasterpat (Jun 26, 2013)

Beepro - Where do you find an excluder that fits on either side of the frame, or is this something most folks just build on their own?

Thanks

Hehehee - Finding the queen more than three times over the last year in the now 13 hive/nucs would be a big help as well. I will figure it out one day.


----------



## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

I don't know any that don't involve finding a queen, and I hate having to find queens. but if you use an excluder to confine the queen to one box it will be easier to find her and easier to find the right age larvae, and if you make a #5 hardware cloth push in cage you can confine the queen on the frame you want her to lay on and you will know exactly where the right age larvae is. Over time (assuming you will be doing multiple batches of queens) you can either move and confine the queen to a box of drawn empty comb so she always has plenty of room to lay, or feed empty combs into the box she's in so she doesn't run out of room. The other option is to create a small space with only three frames or so for her to lay and have it excluded (usually by cutting a vertical groove to fit a cut down excluder in and then putting another cut down one over that section of that box).

Here is Jay Smith's description of such a thing (in this case he was not grafting, but cutting the comb into strips but the concept is the same):
http://www.bushfarms.com/beesbetterqueens.htm#The Breeder Hive


----------



## WBVC (Apr 25, 2013)

I purchased the system but have yet to use it. It said to put the Queen in the grid by pushing/placing her through a small opening in the front of the grid. I envisioned getting stung and inadvertently squishing her!



drlonzo said:


> Easy is what you make of it.  Once a person has figured out how to find a queen in the box, it shouldn't be hard at all from there. The grid system comes with a queen excluder cover that just closes over her once you put her in. Allowing the workers to tend to her as they always do. As for how long to leave her in the grid, an exceptional queen can lay up to 3000 eggs in a day. So even if she was sub par, she should be able to lay up the 110 cups within a 24 hour period.
> 
> This will give you the expected correct age larva with NO guess work at all. I know that I'm going to use it for sure.


----------



## Mbeck (Apr 27, 2011)

Thanks for all the feedback.

I do have a box with a vertical excluder that confides queen to 4-5 frames. 
Confining the queen can be a hassle SHB etc.

Finding and grafting the correct age larvae isn't the biggest problem it's finding the correct age larvae in a pattern so I can graft quickly. The right frame with the right "band" of correctly aged 
larvae always give me the most consistent results. 

Maybe I'm not giving them enough nice blank comb and enough time to polish it do the queen is comfortable laying one right after another. The queens will lay plenty they are just all over the place filling in spots with different ages.


----------



## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

To get the consistent larvae for grafting you must give them a frame of clean comb for the queen to lay in.
Suggest to get new frames during the frame drawing season to make as many as you can for later grafting purpose. 
This is what I use to get some new larvae to graft.


----------



## Mbeck (Apr 27, 2011)

This is a well done explination of one method.
Looks like the picket is just cut up dadant excluders?

http://youtu.be/uWsWUSCFIxY


----------



## blueskydixon (Jul 9, 2011)

Mbeck,
What I find to help identify the "right" age of larva is to look first for eggs, then expand to the cells around. When you get to the size larva that's easier to see, head back to the egg size. Look to the biggest puddle of royal jelly and in that blob is the hardest to see and scoop, right aged larva.


----------



## Mbeck (Apr 27, 2011)

I'm know the right age I'm just having a difficult time getting the queen to lay in an orderly fashion where the correct age larvae is abundant and in one spot or one right after another. That "ring" between eggs and grub where you can graft one after another. 
I guess I'm having trouble articulating my issue.


----------



## Lburou (May 13, 2012)

Queen grafting excluder frame here. Got one this week, but not pleased with details of construction.


----------



## Mbeck (Apr 27, 2011)

That's kind of a cool idea of course practical application is a whole different standard.

I'm kicking the picket excluder idea that was in the video I posted around in my head.
It seems like bees might maintain cells and feed better with a little bit of everything within excluded area. Brood, pollen stores etc. 

Do you think excluding the queen to a small area could demotivate the bees resulting diminished care of emerging eggs?


----------



## beeman2009 (Aug 23, 2012)

Mbeck,

Go to FatBeeMan's website. He has plans to build your our queen timing box or you can buy one from him. It works great for raising 10 queens or 500 queens. He also has a video to explain how it works. Hope this helps.


----------



## Mbeck (Apr 27, 2011)

Thanks
I've got a very similar set up


----------

