# Busy Bees Apiaries



## beardcrumbs

I wanted to continue a thread about the delays those of us who ordered packages from this supplier are experiencing. Originally it existed in the for sale section but had gone off topic and it was suggested that the conversation be moved here.
Please post any information you know or receive about this.


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## beardcrumbs

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

This is the first e-mail from Busy Bees Apiaries announcing the delay sent on Wednesday, March 23, 2011 11:34 AM

Due to queen shortages resulting from employee errors all shipment are on a 
1 week delay effective immediately- so starting with today's shipment of 
Mar. 24. We apologize for any inconvenience this causes. If you have any 
questions please call 814-715-2297.


Thank you,

Tanya Boleware
Busy Bees Apiaries


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## beardcrumbs

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

This is the second e-mail I received on Thu 3/31/11 10:57 AM 

Hello,

This is Tanya and Rory with Busy Bees Apiaries. We are contacting you to inform you there will be another delay in the package delivery due to adverse weather conditions in Georgia as it has been storming for several days now and is continuing today. Bees are not shaken in the rain. We are sorry but we have no control over the weather. We try to keep our delivery schedule on time throughout the season. However, keep in mind that this is greatly dependant on the weather. We see and have been traveling in the North where they are having snow and freezing temperatures, so this may work out to your benefit. 

Friday the weather is forecasted to be clearing up. However there will be many distributors waiting to get their bees and they won’t be available in the quantities that they desired, including us. So we will have to wait until we get a full truckload before we make any deliveries. This may take a few days. 

We thank you for your patience. Please check our home page on our website where we will be posting the latest information on package bee shipments. 

Sincerely,

Tanya & Rory Boleware

www.busybeesapiaries.net

814-715-2297


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## beardcrumbs

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

This is the third e-mail received on Mon 4/04/11 8:13 AM

We are experiencing problems with our supplier of package bees. All our dates that we had reserved have been changed to later dates of which have not been confirmed. We are working on this problem and hope to have a equitable solution as soon as possible. Due to this we may not be able to give much notice of when your package bees will ship as we will be trying to get as many orders out in whatever manner we can. 

We appreciate your patience as we work with our supplier.

Sincerely,

Rory Boleware

Busy Bees Apiaries


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## Stephen

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Here's the 3 I got. Originally scheduled for March 29th delivery. Never got the one about the weather being bad.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

*03/24/2011 8:37 a.m. est*
Due to queen shortages resulting from employee errors all shipment are on a 1 week delay effective immediately- so starting with today's shipment of Mar. 24. We apologize for any inconvenience this causes. If you have any questions please call 814-715-2297. 

Thank you, 
Tanya Boleware

*03/24/2011 6:22 p.m. est*
Forgive me if this is a repeat, but I learned that the system did not email to everyone this morning and I'm sending this again. This time hopefully to everyone---

We are sorry but all package bee shipments are on a 1 week delay effective immediately- starting with today's shipment (Mar. 24) There is a queen shortage due to employee errors. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause. If you have any questions feel free to call me.

Tanya Boleware
Busy Bees Apiaries
814-715-2297

*04/04/2011 8:07 a.m. est* (received days after getting a phone call from Tonya discussing where to meet for pickup on 04/06/2011)
We are experiencing problems with our supplier of package bees. All our dates that we had reserved have been changed to later dates of which have not been confirmed. We are working on this problem and hope to have a equitable solution as soon as possible. Due to this we may not be able to give much notice of when your package bees will ship as we will be trying to get as many orders out in whatever manner we can. 

We appreciate your patience as we work with our supplier.

Sincerely,
Rory Boleware
Busy Bees Apiaries

----------------------------------------------------------------------

The delay sucks for sure, but I'd be happy to forget about it if I could get the bees that were ordered in the next week or two. It bugs me though to watch the fruit trees bloom and the bees miss out. I can totally understand if there's a delay, but being a business owner I'd give my customers a bit more explanation and a definite time frame. I'm sure there's circumstance we don't know about but we're just kinda left hanging at this point and I'm afraid with bees so hard to find this late if Rory and Tonya don't come through this will not be my first spring with bees.


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## JeffG

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

I picked up two packages from them on 3/19 and installed the on 3/20, they are doing very well. It appears they are making an effort to keep their customers informed by sending the email updates. The weather is going nuts everywhere. It snowed here on 4/1, then it was 71 and clear yesterday, and now its 33 out today.

JeffG


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## Pyrotechnician

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*



Stephen said:


> The delay sucks for sure, but I'd be happy to forget about it if I could get the bees that were ordered in the next week or two. It bugs me though to watch the fruit trees bloom and the bees miss out. I can totally understand if there's a delay, but being a business owner I'd give my customers a bit more explanation and a definite time frame. I'm sure there's circumstance we don't know about but we're just kinda left hanging at this point and I'm afraid with bees so hard to find this late if Rory and Tonya don't come through this will not be my first spring with bees.


Same here, I would forget ANY and ALL hard feelings and give them another shot in the future at my business if I get my bees asap or at least some better communications from Busy Bees Apiaries. I too have missed out on the fruit trees polinations. I ordered from this company specificially cause they said they could deliver on March 24th.


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## festus

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

yes this is disappointing, there are reasons for ordering early and if they soon dont pull thru those reasons will be lost. and where do we stand are they filling orders from 2 weeks ago first or are they trying to keep up with up to date orders and we fill in as they can. oh well this is the nature of the beast, lesson learned


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## The Honey Householder

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

I've never transported from BBA, but all the package suppliers in the south are in delay mode.
Been buying and transporting package bees for over 17 years now. Over the last 4 years the delays have been getting worse. Just seeing what the suppiers have to do to supplier the demand many are even lucky if they get bees let aloan delayed shippments. With the cold weather in the south I would bet there is going to be a lot of short load being shipped, meaning not all are going to get bees this year.:doh: I know of one supplier that over booked 1000+ packages just hoping for the best. If the weather don't get better some will start seeing check coming back instead of bees.


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## timbo501

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

I also have a order i with Busy Bee thats now been delayed twice. I spoke with Rory yesterday on the phone and he told me he was going to GA yesterday afternoon to speak with the supplier in person because even he was getting the run around on the phone. I do understand that shaking bees can't be done in the rain. And Tanya and Rory have been doing a great job keeping in touch with all the unhappy customers about the delays. But i think this problem falls totally on the shoulders of the suppliers that have been becoming more and more greedy lately. I understand that in a business your in it to make money but you also should be in it to keep your customers happy. And over booking orders HOPING that you have enough is a bad business practice in my opinion. Hopefully Rory will give me a shoat tomorrow and we know where we're going from here.


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## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Please lets keep this on topic to the ones who have delays! 

All thes extra comments will lead to a locked thread, or deletions.


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## beardcrumbs

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Speaking of the supplier. In my phone conversation with Rory, before I ordered, he stated that these packages were coming from Gardner's.
I understand that we are at the mercy of the weather. But when the weather in Baxley, GA has been warm and clear for the last four or five days and is forecasted to be warm and clear for the next ten days, then using the rainy weather as a reason for the delay is sounding more like an excuse and not the real reason.
It is becoming clear, through this conversation, that this has nothing to do with Busy Bees Apiaries. It seems that they are giving us as much information as they have. 

I have seen two other individuals selling packages from Gardners reporting delays to their customers.

Tony Rimkus at 
http://rimkust.web.officelive.com/default.aspx

and Jerry Mattiaccio, who posted an update to his for sale thread here on beesource, copied below.
http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=246728

All, 

To those beekeepers who have ordered package bees, we apologize but are now experiencing a delay from Gardners. We were supposed to get our shipment this week. We have received one shipment, which has been distributed. A seperate email will be sent to everyone who has purchased packages. 

This will not affect our Nuc sales. 

I apologize for the inconvenience, but was informed by Ginny at Gardners this morning that bad weather combined with a large scale theft at one of thier beeyards has caused delays. I should have an update within 72 hours. I will post it here and I will forward emails to everyone who is owed packages. 

Please know that customer service is paramount to us at Rock Hill and it pains us to have communicate this situation to you. We are working to resolve the situation and provide you with a quality product. The initial shipment of bees provided to us has been well received by our customers. I expect the second shipment, which has already been delayed one week, will have the same high quality stock as the first. There is no word on a delay for the third shipment as of yet. We will keep you posted. Thank you. 

Jerry Mattiaccio


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## StevenG

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*



timbo501 said:


> I also have a order i with Busy Bee thats now been delayed twice. ... But i think this problem falls totally on the shoulders of the suppliers that have been becoming more and more greedy lately.


mmm I just _love_ those greedy suppliers! Let's see, hurricanes, tornadoes, rising fuel prices, crazy spring weather, mistake by employee, theft, certainly all those things and more make life extremely easy for greedy suppliers. Sad that one wants to help his customers that he overbooks, thinking he'll be able to produce enough queens or packages... wonder how many of us have never been guilty of miscalculations? Misjudgments? Our hopes exceed our abilities? 

We tend to forget beekeeping is farming, with all the implications thereof. Are there greedy farmers? yep. and greed in beekeeping, but to tar them all with such a broad brush is irresponsible. I learned from my mistakes, and planned last summer for this spring. My plans are working out, except for 5 of my colonies - two now queenless. So I scramble to find what I need, but don't blame the supplier. Just a simple fact of nature. In fact, the weather was apparently good in south Texas, and my supplier is ahead of schedule...going to start a thread about that now.
Regards,
Steven


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## dmpower

I just got this one!

Dear Customers,



Ship Dates:

Current shipping dates from Georgia for package bees will be April and May. Our supplier has imposed a 10 day shutdown of package bee shipments to allow his supply to recover. At this time there is at least a 10 day delay on all shipments due to the abnormal weather conditions in Georgia. This delay is necessary to provide quality packages to our customers. As shipments resume each customer will be contacted to discuss delivery on each order.

Delay Explanations:

The delays we’ve had so far from our supplier were farther reaching than was realized at the time. The first delay experience was a 7 day delay caused by a shortage of queens for package bees. Next there was 3 ½ days of local rain in southeast Georgia along with sustained cooler nighttime temperatures which has caused our supplier and others to delay package shaking to allow time for the bees to build up. But before the rain the quantities of bees was not as high as they should have been for normal shaking thus compounding the problem. 

All across the country many people have experienced adverse temperatures and extended cold snaps this past winter and spring. This even holds true in Georgia. The results of this are that the queens shut down production of brood when it falls below certain temperatures. 

We are down here in Georgia now as there has been confusion about what was going on. Now that we are here we see the shortage of bees across the board as all distributors are being delayed as we are and hear talk of other suppliers dealing with the same issues. For example it was 39 degrees here last night. The bees are currently being stimulated with nutritious feeding and warmer weather is forecasted. 

We appreciate your concerns and feel for your disappointment in not having your bees yet. However we must remind you that you are participating in a form of agriculture whose outcomes are highly subject to many variables which can be very rewarding as well as frustrating for all involved.


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## timbo501

This is still pretty confusing. 10 days. So that means we have to wait another week and a half till we find out what and when we might receive our bees.


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## rrascal

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries and Gardner*

Hope you all can read the chart below. If not then just look up the weather history of Baxley Ga. on the internet.
Make your own judgements of the stories told to all about the weather.

Further facts stated by the supplier and the distributor involved are as follows:

Rory:
Some of the workers of the supplier move their nuc boxes and their bees swarmed.

The workers put the nuc boxes where they weren't supposed to and the bees absconded.

The weather was cold and rainy.

We are still sending out packages for those who wanted them shipped via he mail.

I am getting some next week.

The supplier seems to be shipping with other folks but not me.

I will fill orders with my own bees.

The supplier is not telling me anything.

We should get some packages because the supplier ships out 600 - to 1000 per day.

I will call you every day with an update. (NOT)

The supplier has a ton of my money and I can't get any bees.

Gardner:

The weather has been bad. You know its agriculture.

Rory is difficult to work with - He is new at this.

Rory is moving and it seems to be interfering with his schedule.

We are still shipping to Michigan. 

Someone elses employees messed up and moved our bees.

Someone stole our bees and even though we have cameras, the thieves also replaced the cameras sd cards.
(No police report was filed).

Etc. etc. etc.

Bottom line no excuses should be having to be made. Forget the agriculture. This is business. Contract are contracts. 
Money has changed hands. Communication is paramount. Provide the option via communication for people
to make an informed decision with the truth. People will either stay put or go elsewhere. But, people need to have
the truth communicated to them on a time critical basis. Peoples money should not be held hostage - nor should they.

If you can't do the job then let people go elsewhere or do what they choose to do. Quit taking orders when you can't deliver. 
If you can't do the job then tell people and quit extorting them with feeble excuses. The bottom line is that someone over extended
for whatever reason and the supply chain is at a halt with no communication. It is a terrible business practice by all concerned.

Contracts are contracts. All parties need to abide by their agreements and make all other parties whole. Tell people wehere they stand. 

Seems both parties are having growing and plain old business problems hiding behind the agriculture excuse. 
This is being escalated by both parties delaying their requirements to communicate to the ultimate customer. They don't want to loose any of the money
already paid. Don't believe it - ask for a refund of your money - if you can get a hold of anyone.

Anyone notice other orders being filled from the same supplier? Do a search - it is easy to see. The big boys do have clout.

Gardner bought Spell Bee and Rory is just starting out. It is a mess. Hopefully they get their stuff together really fast
because this is interstate commerce and via the mail system in alot of cases. In case they don't know this could get big time
ugly really fast. 

All people really want is open and honest communication from all parties and a solid date for delivery.
These are reasonable requests. People should also be given the opportunity to do business elsewhere with a refund of their
money pronto if they so desire. If you can't deliver, let people go elsewhere.

Lastly, with all of the rushing around to catch up, what is the quality of the product going to be like. Another huge worry
for the buyers. Search last years reports from the supplier. Not great in many cases. Some reports of no problem.
What happens now with the rush to catch up if and when the product is ever delivered and is of inferior quality. How would this be rectified? 

It appears that nothing is going to occur to make the end consumers in this case whole. No words of anykind about the current orders
none the less a perk for somebody sticking with them. Man, every business and farming activity I have ever been involved with
makes sure the end customer is communicated to honestly, quickly, and openly. If our business is at fault we make it right
by the customer.

I hope these folks do the same.

Please post any further develops for everyone's sake to keep them informed. I hope all the best in this messy situation.
Yes its agriculture, but its also contract law, interstate commerce, business law, and most of all common courtesy, respect,
and common sense. 


Mar 2011
Temp. (°F) Dew Point (°F) Humidity (%)	Sea Level Press. Visibility (mi)	Wind (mph) Precip. (in)	Events
high	avg	low	high	avg	low	high	avg	low	high avg low high	avg	low	high	avg	high	sum 
6
70 59 48 61 52 38 87 67 47 30.04 29.91 29.80 10 10 4 21 12 30 0.02 Rain 
7
62 50 37 42 37 33 85 62 39 30.19 30.11 30.03 10 10 7 18 4 23 0.00 
8
75 59 43 54 47 40 89 65 41 30.27 30.22 30.18 10 10 9 15 7 22 0.00 
9
78 68 57 59 56 53 93 71 48 30.21 30.10 29.97 10 7 1 30 9 38 1.06 Rain , Thunderstorm 
10
62 55 47 58 49 33 93 66 39 30.10 29.98 29.93 10 10 4 28 10 36 0.01 Rain 
11
61 49 37 36 30 23 85 54 23 30.20 30.15 30.10 10 10 10 21 10 29 0.00 
12
73 52 31 44 33 28 92 56 19 30.30 30.22 30.15 10 8 2 13 2 16 0.00 
13
79 60 40 48 43 38 96 61 26 30.28 30.21 30.17 10 9 5 12 3 16 0.00 
14
80 63 45 54 45 37 93 58 23 30.22 30.18 30.11 10 7 1 12 3 16 0.00 
15
80 63 45 52 48 43 93 63 32 30.23 30.16 30.09 10 9 2 15 6 21 0.00 
16
77 63 49 59 51 39 100 64 27 30.24 30.18 30.14 10 7 0 17 7 22 0.00 Fog 
17
81 62 42 49 44 39 96 60 23 30.34 30.27 30.24 10 9 5 9 1 12 0.00 
18
85 66 47 53 47 41 100 61 22 30.30 30.24 30.15 10 6 0 12 4 16 0.00 Fog 
19
90 71 52 56 50 44 83 52 21 30.22 30.18 30.12 10 9 6 12 4 18 0.00 
20
80 70 59 62 59 54 93 74 54 30.38 30.31 30.22 10 8 2 17 8 26 0.00 
21
84 68 51 59 54 50 100 67 33 30.38 30.32 30.19 10 5 0 9 2 15 0.00 Fog 
22
88 71 53 60 49 34 93 54 15 30.17 30.09 29.97 10 7 0 15 5 21 0.00 Fog 
23
85 72 58 61 57 50 97 65 32 29.99 29.91 29.78 10 7 2 21 10 31 0.00 
24
85 73 60 63 47 24 87 49 11 29.91 29.81 29.76 10 10 7 25 11 36 0.00 
25
74 58 42 43 37 34 86 56 25 30.02 29.96 29.91 10 9 7 13 4 16 0.00 
26
83 64 44 64 52 42 93 70 47 29.95 29.89 29.78 10 4 0 21 7 28 0.01 Fog 
27
83 70 57 69 64 56 93 74 55 29.94 29.85 29.79 10 8 2 22 8 28 0.15 Rain 
28
57 53 49 56 51 46 100 93 86 30.09 29.97 29.89 10 4 1 9 4 14 0.65 Rain 
29
58 52 46 54 49 44 93 85 77 30.19 30.11 30.07 9 5 2 8 4 12 0.00 
30
65 61 57 63 59 54 97 92 86 30.06 29.85 29.71 10 5 0 21 3 26 2.12 Fog , Rain , Thunderstorm 
31
70 62 54 64 58 50 97 85 73 29.78 29.68 29.58 10 6 1 18 4 25 0.08 Rain 

Apr	
1
71 57 43 49 43 40 89 62 34 29.91 29.81 29.72 10 10 5 22 6 29 0.00 
2
77 62 47 51 45 41 89 60 31 30.07 29.98 29.91 10 10 9 18 5 25 0.00 
3
83 63 42 49 41 34 100 59 18 30.18 30.10 30.04 10 7 1 12 4 17 0.00 
4
88 72 55 66 57 44 84 62 40 30.08 29.96 29.81 10 10 10 21 10 29 0.00 
5
76 60 43 67 52 28 93 60 26 30.09 29.84 29.71 10 9 1 36 11 52 0.65 Rain , Thunderstorm 
6
72 55 39 40 35 30 93 61 24 30.26 30.18 30.10 10 9 2 8 2 - 0.00


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## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

Well my $183 bank check was cashed yesterday. 

This is proper and ethical protocol right before shipping. 

I ordered for the April 5th mail shipment. 

Maybe I will have good news to report.


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## festus

they cashed my check as soon as i sent it to them, was scheduled to receive packages march 27


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## timbo501

Plumber, how are they gonna ship your bees if the supplier is shut down for 10 days. Thats why this is getting confusing did they shut down for 10 days last week or is that starting today. Big difference. And as for cashing your check they cashed mine over a month ago.


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## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

Timbo,

I called the last Monday and Tuesday of March and verified with Tanya that bees were still available for the April 5th shipment. Monday she said they were, and Tuesday she said they were still on schedule. So I ordered Tuesday, for the April 5th shipment. Sent them my money order that Wednesday.


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## Stephen

Got the same email as dmpower posted.

Concerning rascals chart. The following are easier to read. Thanks for bringing it to our attention and I hope the post stays.

*March 2011 *
http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KAMG/2011/3/6/MonthlyHistory.html#calendar

*April 2011*
http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KAMG/2011/4/6/MonthlyHistory.html#calendar

This isn't my business (there's no way in the world I'd let a supplier jerk me around or ever leave my customers in limbo like this. I have and expect a really high level of customer service from everyone I deal with), but after looking at the weather record I'm bugged a bit. Do we look else where or keep our fingers crossed? My $167.00 bucks might be the price of a lesson if someone doesn't step up.


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## timbo501

Well all I'm saying is mine and others on here had orders scheduled for weeks ago and they don't have bees for those orders why would they have bees for newer orders. I spoke with Rory two day ago and Tanya today and they both told me on the phone that there supplier(Gardners) did not have bees ready to ship.


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## timbo501

I'm looking for another company that i can get bees from but that isn't going very well. Everything that i'm finding is much more expensive then the ones we ALREADY BOUGHT. And I you wouldn't be able to get them till well into May. I'm in a pretty crappy position since I'm relying on these bees for pollination on my farm and i'm already behind schedule as it is.


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## Stephen

NorthernIllinoisPlumber said:


> Timbo,
> 
> I called the last Monday and Tuesday of March and verified with Tanya that bees were still available for the April 5th shipment. Monday she said they were, and Tuesday she said they were still on schedule. So I ordered Tuesday, for the April 5th shipment. Sent them my money order that Wednesday.


She called me last Monday (3/28/11) to set up a pickup location for today. I ordered around the 15th of March for March 29th delivery. No bees, only emails.


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## lavert5

Their website says a 10 day delay now. I havent had much luck getting any communicastions from them.


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## twd8711

im curios has anyone actually received bees, sent $500 in february for march 27 delivery, glad i went with different distributors, they are 11 days late already and now (for what its worth) they are telling us another 10 days, i always allow for mishaps but this is getting tight, these were meant to fill last contract.


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## matt1954

I will tell you what this has taught me. I have already placed my 2012 order with Gardners. However, I am placing a backup order with WIllibanks as well. I am going to split the orders to make sure I am not in a situation like this again. I have nearly 200 Nuc orders to fill by June 10 and this has put me behind quite a bit. In addition, my customers have pollination contracts and it is killing me to hear the dissapointment in their voices. This is an expensive lesson.


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## Pyrotechnician

Dear Customers,



Ship Dates:

Current shipping dates from Georgia for package bees will be April and May. Our supplier has imposed a 10 day shutdown of package bee shipments to allow his supply to recover. At this time there is at least a 10 day delay on all shipments due to the abnormal weather conditions in Georgia. This delay is necessary to provide quality packages to our customers. As shipments resume each customer will be contacted to discuss delivery on each order.

Delay Explanations:

The delays we’ve had so far from our supplier were farther reaching than was realized at the time. The first delay experience was a 7 day delay caused by a shortage of queens for package bees. Next there was 3 ½ days of local rain in southeast Georgia along with sustained cooler nighttime temperatures which has caused our supplier and others to delay package shaking to allow time for the bees to build up. But before the rain the quantities of bees was not as high as they should have been for normal shaking thus compounding the problem. 



All across the country many people have experienced adverse temperatures and extended cold snaps this past winter and spring. This even holds true in Georgia. The results of this are that the queens shut down production of brood when it falls below certain temperatures. 

We are down here in Georgia now as there has been confusion about what was going on. Now that we are here we see the shortage of bees across the board as all distributors are being delayed as we are and hear talk of other suppliers dealing with the same issues. For example it was 39 degrees here last night. The bees are currently being stimulated with nutritious feeding and warmer weather is forecasted. 

We appreciate your concerns and feel for your disappointment in not having your bees yet. However we must remind you that you are participating in a form of agriculture whose outcomes are highly subject to many variables which can be very rewarding as well as frustrating for all involved.





Thank you,

Rory Boleware

Owner Busy Bees Apiaries

814-591-7475

[email protected]

*This is what I just received via Email..:s*


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## Stephen

I really wish Rory or someone from Gardner would pop in here and chime in.


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## SRatcliff

Yeah, 10 days from when?


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## The Honey Householder

Matt1954: As a Wilbanks dealer I say good luck, and get in line. If you are needing bees in late May they might be able to work you in if you are buying by the load. My early load was backup a week and they shoken them between rains. They got me all 800 packages on. They could have cut me short and then I would have had to sent check back to my customers. This thread is why suppliers deal with dealer and not the beekeepers.:no: Back in the days suppliers did, but they don't have to anymore. The demand is to big!!!


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## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

The Honey Householder said:


> This thread is why suppliers deal with dealer and not the beekeepers.:no: Back in the days suppliers did, but they don't have to anymore. The demand is to big!!!


I disagree, this a legitimate complaint.


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## Pyrotechnician

SRatcliff said:


> Yeah, 10 days from when?


Great question!!!:applause:


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## timbo501

Well now I just got off the phone with gardners and I was told that they aren't shut down and if I was going to pick up my packages I could buy them today! But they aren't shipping anymore through the mail this year. So I have no idea what's going on now. I'm trying to get in touch with busy bee this morning to get the run around again probably. Always fun.


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## Pyrotechnician

Sorry guys/gals but I jumped ship on this transaction, asked for paypal refund and will be meeting J & J this weekend in Lexington for my bees! Good luck to all those who were waiting with me on your packages!

**AMEN rrascal**


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## winevines

matt1954 said:


> I will tell you what this has taught me. I have already placed my 2012 order with Gardners. However, I am placing a backup order with WIllibanks as well. I am going to split the orders to make sure I am not in a situation like this again. I have nearly 200 Nuc orders to fill by June 10 and this has put me behind quite a bit. In addition, my customers have pollination contracts and it is killing me to hear the dissapointment in their voices. This is an expensive lesson.


If you don't already do it, maybe you could consider learning how to make summer nucs that you overwinter and use those as your new hives the following Spring (with locally adaptable queens) as another lesson instead of only relying on packages?
We are having a great talk THIS Sunday practically in your back yard.... on The Sustainable Apiary... Consider joining us.
http://www.PWRBeekeepers.com


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## winevines

Stephen said:


> Got the same email as dmpower posted.


Sent you a pm or see my post at end of this thread


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## Southridge

twd8711 said:


> im curios has anyone actually received bees, sent $500 in february for march 27 delivery, glad i went with different distributors, they are 11 days late already and now (for what its worth) they are telling us another 10 days, i always allow for mishaps but this is getting tight, these were meant to fill last contract.


Dear all,

I was one of the lucky ones who received delivery on March 19. I noticed Rory's 34’ long horse trail was very full. I placed a purchase order and paid to Busy Bees Apiaries for 10 packages on Jan 26 for over $800. I was concerned about delivery time and quality, so I used Paypal. 

However, 9 out of the 10 packages were short in weight, even when dead bees were included. 2 packages have a shortage rate over 20% each. Only 1 package meets 3 LBs mark. The other 9 packages have a weight shortage rate ranging from 1% to 22%. Total of 2.5 LBs short. Details are as follows:

Package # weight/ounce	% short
No. 1 47.5 1.04
No. 2 38.4 20.00
No. 3 42.1 12.29
No. 4 37.4 22.08
No. 5 49.0 ok
No. 6 46.1 3.96
No. 7 44.0 8.33
No. 8 44.5 7.29
No. 9 46.2 3.75
No. 10 45.8 4.58

I tried to communicate with seller about the product weight issue. Tanya's *original reply *is as follows:

"I contacted my supplier (gave them your report) and was told this: “that the packages weigh over 3 pounds when they are packed. Wet bees weigh more than dry bees. The shipping process takes them out of their environment- they are not eating as they would in their natural environment and therefore will lose weight. A bee will consume in a day’s time a large portion of it’s body weight. We were also running fans on them to keep them cool in transit and that would naturally dry them out. We only contacted our supplier for further confirmation for your benefit, however Rory knew that virtually all living things whether it be fruits, vegetables, or living animals lose weight in the transportation process. We just began hauling bees, but for example we hauled truckloads of potatoes for years and were weighed at the farm and then again at the factory we would deliver to. The weight was always less at the factory even after just one day. ...Hopefully you understand now how the shipping process affects the weight of bees and that they weighed over 3 pounds when they were packed."

Within one day of shaking, the bees lost weight by an average of 8.33%! I understand it was the supplier who messed things up in the first place. Busy Bees may be a victim too, who passed the loss to me. They do not answer my emails any more. They would not take responsibility for the loss although at their website under "Title; Risk of Loss" about "Terms and Condition of Use" it is declared that "*Loss or damage that occurs during shipping by a carrier selected by Busy Bees Apiaries is Busy Bees Apiaries's responsibility*." See Seller's website on "Title; Risk of Loss": http://www.busybeesapiaries.net/terms.html

I totally understands that bees may die in shipping and some loss in weight is acceptable. But a loss as high as 22% per package is not excusable at all. It is very vulnerable for the bees to develop. As of this writing, the 2 hives with over 20% weight shortage are doing VERY POORLY, compared to the other 8. 

As buyer, the fact is I have paid for 30 LBs of bees, but only 27.5 LBs (dead ones included) were delivered to me. I did not get in full for what I have paid for in full. No matter what excuses, we need to honor a contact that is signed and paid for. A contract is a contract. 

I made a complaint to Paypal, in the hope that they would allow me to file a dispute. But Paypal was no help. According to Paypal, the transaction is beyond the 45-day time window and they will not interfere, even though the delivery was made 50 days after the payment.

Lessons learned hard. For those who are still hopefully and impatiently waiting to receive your packages from Rory, *the gross weight of each package upon delivery should be at least around 113 ounces before you remove anything off the package. *Any package less than 113 ounces means you are likely to get less than 3 LBs of bees (dead ones included). See my gross and net weight details below (in ounce):

package #	gross net 
No. 1 113 47.5
No. 2 104 38.4
No. 3 109 42.1
No. 4 109 37.4
No. 5 113 49.0
No. 6 110 46.1
No. 7 108 44.0
No. 8 108 44.5
No. 9 113 46.2
No. 10 113 45.8

Sorry for the long story. I was one of the early ones who were unhappy. I had intended to post sth here, but being nice, I thought they would do better. Unfortunately it is getting worse. I feel so sorry for all of you there. Thanks for reading.


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## Pyrotechnician

This is why I filed a dispute with paypal 3 days before my 45 days was up! If I had waited the "10 more days" then it would have been too late, NOPE!


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## Southridge

Pyrotechnician said:


> This is why I filed a dispute with paypal 3 days before my 45 days was up! If I had waited the "10 more days" then it would have been too late, NOPE!


Good for you! 

After several communications with paypal, now it is telling me that it will not be responsible for any transaction of *any live things.* . Why then did it allow such transactions to happen in the first place?! Consumers need to protect themselves and each other. Paypal is not always a pal.


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## Pyrotechnician

Southridge said:


> Good for you!
> 
> After several communications with paypal, now it is telling me that it will not be responsible for any transaction of *any live things.* . Why then did it allow such transactions to happen in the first place?! Consumers need to protect themselves and each other. Paypal is not always a pal.


Well, If I dont get my money back then he will still owes me 2 packages and I can live with 2 more hives!


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## Southridge

I forgot to report that one of my packages received did not even have any holes in the sugar can that was supposed to be feeding the bees during shipping.


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## matt1954

timbo, I am not sure where you got your information from. As soon as I saw your posting I contacted Gardners and was told they are open, but they filled one order only because he was already enroute and they could not tell him to turn around. I was told that they were not shaking bees because of the temperatures and the bees were not producing what they should. When I inquired about a potential forecast when they would start shaking bees again, they told me I would have talk to Mike Gardner.


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## Stephen

Nevermind... Though possibly a mistake I'm going to refrain from posting or commenting any further until I hear something from Rory.


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## johng

All I can say is WOW! Relax guys it is only the first of April. I have only been keeping bees a short time myself but, I always thought it was an unwritten rule to not expect your package of bees on these early ship dates. You guys stopping payment may end up with no bees. I'm sure all of you will get your bees but, it is going to take some time. I have no relationship with any of these dealers or sellers. But, have been reading and watching the bee bus. for a while. It is no seceret that there is a shortage of package bees every spring. And I'm sure that some of the big boys do get their bees ahead of the smaller orders. But, thats just the way it is. I live in the South and could not get my package before May last year. Gardners have been around a while and I'm sure they will get you your bees, just be patient.


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## Birdman

I agree with johng. The weather every where is bad for bees this year. I wanted to start putting supers on for honey by now. I did super one hive but they over wintered in three deeps. They will come it's hard to shake bees when there are none to shake.


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## The Honey Householder

rrascal: Beekeeping is what I do for a living. I've had a standing order with my supplier for the past 15 years. Why wouldn't I get mine before you. It dealer like me that has kept the suppliers going over the years. Hobbies come and go, and it the dealers that keep taking care of the suppliers, vs the supplies take care of the dealers. 
I would say the delay really sucks, but the weather in the north is just as cold.:doh: 

No the big guy don't alway win out. Last year I was backup because the bees wasn't ready and smaller orders was filled before me.  10 days late getting bees and honey flow came in early and we still produced 81 ton. :applause: Things almost always work out for the best! Life is short don't sweat the little things.opcorn:


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## lavert5

I ordered for march 29 th and the only info i can get is on here from u guys. I am not happy with their communication on this.


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## MDS

There is a delay in getting our bees which come from California. Weather prevented mating. Feeling your pain but at least they gave notice.


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## florida_beekeeper

I was at Gardners today. For all those that think the big boys are standing in line loading bees forget it. It is like a ghost town all the workers are out feeding the bees. No bees shipped out of there. They are not shaking for another week if all goes well. They can shake over 1000 packages a day. They ship about 50,000 packages a year and over 200,000 queens. That says alot in itself. The Farm Bureau reported over 100,000 new backyard beekeepers last year and that number is going to be more this year. Figure how many of the new beeks lost there bees and now ordered replacment packages this year. Not to mention Michigan is reporting over 55% winter losses. There is a system overload!

They are still shipping queens while waiting for the bees to recover.

If you want to order a package today you will have to arrange pickup after April. They are not shipping new package orders by mail anymore this year.

As for the greed and criminal statements. I don't think any supplier is going to keep money if they don't provide a product. The deposit and payment process is setup to protect the supply chain. I know small suppliers that don't get deposits only to have people cancel there orders.

Gardners packages are the lowest published price. This is a simple supply and demand problem. Suppliers made one big mistake and should have charged more money to reduce the demand. The oil companies do it everyday.

50,000 packages at $59 = $2.9m
36,000~ packages at $82 = $2.9m this would allow two extra weeks for weather. Your retail price through a dealer would be $100-$120/package.

Would you be happier with a more accurate deliver date or lower price? I know nuc suppliers that have plenty of stock do to the higher price they charge.

My recommendation is to work with your dealer. All of the suppiers are maxed out. This is peek season.


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## Risky Beesness

I have two nucs ordered from Busy Bees and have been reassured that the delays do not effect them. They are still on schedule for an early May delivery.


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## timbo501

Florida Beekeeper. To be perfectly honest with you I would rather pay a little more and get a more accurate delivery time. As stated by many so far all the people waiting aren't backyard beeks. I am worried about pollinating my crops on my farm and others the same or have pollination contracts to fill this spring.


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## SRatcliff

I don't know, but I think suppliers should take into consideration that bad weather, pests, and other falacies can all occur. Put a lower limit on how many total packages you can sell to distributors until you find out how many packages you have. If you end up with way more than you sold, then sell the rest of them. 

Never count your chickens before they hatch.

With prices like these, you'll sell your surplus fast.


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## volleypc

*Re: March & April Package Bee Sale*

I am a bit nervous. Can anyone vouch for this company? I searched online for a beesuit and ended up buying from them. I tried to make sure the hood was included and thought it was but now I see it say hood not included (I really am not sure that wasn't added after I ordered.. plus the hood is included in a couple of the photos). I got the suit without the hood so I ordered a hood and paid $25 priority mail on March 21rst yet I still have not received it. I was supposed to receive my bees in late March and the first email I received said they would be late due to employee error, then I got another email saying late because of unsual conditions and something about a 39 degree nights, etc. Did this company overpromise and under deliver? Anyone have any luck with them? Unless I get some positive reviews in the next couple of days I am going to get my money back and look elsewhere of just do without bees this year. I hate poor customer service and excuses. Just do what you say you are going to do.


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## GageFamilyBeekeeping

I got their first shipment about three weeks ago. The bees were in fantastic shape and are doing well. I got them right on time. I met Rory and is wife when I picked up the packages and they were great folks. The weather is bad and let's face it, we are in the agriculture business and weather affects us. Let's all be patient!


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## volleypc

GageFamilyBeekeeping said:


> I got their first shipment about three weeks ago. The bees were in fantastic shape and are doing well. I got them right on time. I met Rory and is wife when I picked up the packages and they were great folks. The weather is bad and let's face it, we are in the agriculture business and weather affects us. Let's all be patient!


You received them 3 weeks ago? When were you originally scheduled to receive them? Mine were supposed to ship three weeks ago is why I ask.


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## GageFamilyBeekeeping

I got mine, 36 packages, right on time, the exact date they originally planned


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## dmpower

A new email just in . . . 

To all Customers Awaiting Orders,

We are sending out another general email to everyone because we are still getting bombarded by phone and email and we cannot respond to all individually. The facts of the matter are the supply of the bees is low right now. We were told as of April 7 there would be no more shipments for 10 more days. This is to allow build up of the bees to a safe level for shaking. We have not been given a date when we, as a distributor, will have bees to distribute. We hope it will be the week of April 18th. As soon as we get the new schedule we will begin scheduling shipments to each of our customers. We and the supplier are more concerned about the quality of your packages than when you’ll get them. The ! idea is that they will survive and thrive for you.



To reiterate: We have no more information than this. We still have people asking for a date. We don’t have a date until the supplier gives us one. Presently stock hives are being fed. We have warmer weather now and anticipate healthy bees after this period of recoup. Please understand the situation we are dealing with is that suppliers have overextended themselves in trying to meet the great demands for bees and the weather has worked against them and they have not been able to produce their maximum. However do not get mad at them- if it weren’t for the big commercial producers of bees the vast majority of us would have no source for bees at all. Our supplier is not unique in this predicament, r! ather is typical of many suppliers across the country.


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## jmgi

dmpower, are we still talking about Busy Bee Apiaries package orders when you refer to this email?  John


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## Pyrotechnician

Received my refund today and picked up my packages from J & J, I am a happy camper!!


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## Hivey

Pyrotechnician said:


> Received my refund today and picked up my packages from J & J, I am a happy camper!!


I'm not happy,no replies on emails or phone messages(countless),these people have just stonewalled me from the start.I been requesting a refund for a week now and have only gotten the so-called automated emails with more excuses.
I've now had to file a dispute/fraud claim to my credit union to stop payment on my credit card I used.
Busy Bees won't get a dime of my money if I can help it.


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## dmpower

jmgi said:


> dmpower, are we still talking about Busy Bee Apiaries package orders when you refer to this email? John


 Yes


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## Hivey

Well it's now day 9 since I've requested a refund for package bees from Busy Bees,and have left countless messages on their phone as well as emails and they haven't tried to make contact even once.
Talk about kicking your customers to the curb,these people are pros at it.
Hopefully my credit union will retrieve my money for me.:doh::ws


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## volleypc

Let me know if you get the refund. I requested my refund this morning for my bees and some misc supplies I needed that I ordered back in March. I am going to give it a few days before filing a complaint with my bank to get the money back. I will let you know if I get the refund in the next couple of days. Hope it works out.


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## Hivey

Will do vollypc,sorry to hear they got you as well.

IMHO Busy Bees Apiaries are a *DISGRACE TO THE INDUSTRY*

There's no telling how many unfortunate others out have been trapped in their snare.


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## No-sage

My bee's aren't even late yet and I've received 3 communications from them giving me status updates. I do expect they'll arrive later than I had hoped, but not too late to be of use to me. We've barely seen any sign of spring here at all.

I'm happy to wait to make sure I'll get a good product instead of bee's thrown together just to meet a deadline.


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## Hivey

No-sage said:


> My bee's aren't even late yet and I've received 3 communications from them giving me status updates. I do expect they'll arrive later than I had hoped, but not too late to be of use to me. We've barely seen any sign of spring here at all.
> 
> I'm happy to wait to make sure I'll get a good product instead of bee's thrown together just to meet a deadline.


At least they have one happy customer!!!


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## dragonfly

Hey guys- I love the passion, but let's try to keep the thread on-topic and include more experiences with the business addressed, and less small-talk/chatter/insults. Thanks!


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## depdogdave

I'm trying to stay positive about this. I ordered a two three pound packages to be "delivered" on 4-5-2011. They did not come I have call 5 or 6 six time. Also I have sent about 12 emails. With no response! Has anyone gotten any of your orders and if you did how late were they.


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## giant pumpkin peep

If you read the entire thread some people have gotten their bees.


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## SRatcliff

I'm pretty sure those who got theirs, were for scheduled dates before the 24(ish?). And maybe some a few after that who ordered for mail delivery. Those of us who didn't get them yet are ones that are to be picked up at a certain destination on a certain date from a truck load

We should get a new date around the 18th to pick up our packages via truck.


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## Hivey

Update on my dealings with Busy Bees Apiaries.

Finally got to speak to a "live" person today,Rory Answered(after 10 days of leaving email and phone messages) and after a short heated discussion he said he would refund my money.This was around 9am today,and I've yet to see the charge credited back to my account.He assured me I would get the refund,but as they say "only time will tell"k:waiting:


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## timbo501

Has anyone gotten any update or further info since we got the 10 day shutdown email. That was the last info I received. I'm getting my bees mailed to me so I'm not sure if there going to mail orders before the truck shipments or the other way around. Any updates would be great.


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## Hivey

Update regarding my dealings with Busy Bees Apiaries....
Just checked my bank account today(Thurs. 4/14) and still(no surprise at all)do not see where Busy Bees has credited my refund back to my account,despite contacting(he accually answered the phone again)Rory at Busy Bees yesterday evening(Wed. 4/13)asking why he didn't refund my money.He preceded to tell he had been too busy and hadn't had time to do it and promised to take care of it as soon as he got back to his office yesterday.
I can't help but to wonder if this company has failed and is going out of business and taking my refund down the drain with it.It's showing all the warning signs,not returning customers phone calls and emails,breaking promises and still taking orders(not just bees beekeeping supplies as well) but not delivering product.
I hope my credit union has better luck than I do recovering my money,because as it stands right now I don't believe I'm going to ever see a refund from Busy Bees Apiaries.:ws::doh:


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## Birdman

I don't think he's going out of business, like most of us he has to work also. I also have bees ordered from him and I am still waiting just like the rest. I have noticed that most of the complants are from new beekeepers. Welcome to the world of beekeeping, Where the weather play the largest part on bees which will be one of the things you will soon be learning.
If you all have a full proof plan on how to get bees to start building up in bad weather/ to cold, rain or what ever else nature throws at you. Please let the rest of us in on it because I would like to pull some honey next week.


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## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

I dont think so Birdman...it has been over a week since Rory cashed my check, and two weeks since Tanya from Busy Bees took my order and twice said the April 5th shipment by mail was on time. Yes, I called twice to confirm that the dates on the website were correct, and there were no delays mentioned, or listed. Tanya told me this even after they had been having delays of up to two weeks. So what do you make of that?

And sure enough, right after my check was cashed, the new delay went up on the website. There was/is no reason for my check to be cashed.

Explain how the weather is involved in my situation.


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## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

Hivey said:


> I can't help but to wonder if this company has failed and is going out of business and taking my refund down the drain with it.It's showing all the warning signs,not returning customers phone calls and emails,breaking promises and still taking orders(not just bees beekeeping supplies as well) but not delivering product.


You bring up some good points. But bad things do happen to good people. They should get on here and explain whats really going on. 

They can save the business and be better prepared for next year.


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## volleypc

Just an update on my dealings with busy bee. First, not only did I have bees ordered but I had some supplies that I ordered on March 21rst paying a premium for priority mail and still had not received it as of April 12th. The bees I ordered were supposed to ship in March as well. I contacted my bank on the 12 let them know what had happened, shared the dates, the emails I sent, and the emails that were sent to me. The funds were issued back into my account on Wednesday. I have ordered a few supplies I needed through another company on Tuesday and per UPS tracking they are being delivered today. I also ordered my bees through someone else and will pick them up on either the 22nd or 25th. 

What I learned from this - If you contact someone looking for bees and they say they do not know what they are going to have until March and for you to give them a call back then you should save their contact and that is who you should be dealing with (I saved two contacts that gave me similiar comments). If you contact someone and they ask which date you want your packages shipped you should be wary. I have learned not to use paypal to order bee packages since it will usually be paid more than 45 days before you could file a claim and I think they have issues with ordering "live" purchases as well. And lastly, I have learned to do a little research before I buy from a company I am not familar with. This last one is the one I am really kicking myself over. It doesn't matter if I am buying trees, seeds, etc I have always done my research before purchasing and then when I ordered bees I just seemed to forget everything I have learned over the years. 

Lastly, if I felt there was a legitmate excuse such as bad weather, cold temps, rain etc I would be willing to accept that. I live in MS and the beekeepers that I have talked to here are having one the best years ever (in regards to weather and early honey flow). I just can't buy that excuse.. expecially when a fair amount of my order was merchandise and should have no regards to the weather (ordered at a different times than bees so shipping was paid seperate and was not shared). I gave them plenty of time to contact me if the items were on backorder or they were having problems with inventory etc. I hope they do find a way to fill everyones orders, learn from their mistakes and do well in the business. I have no ill feeling towards them. I am just glad it is over and I was able to move on. Good luck everyone.


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## Hivey

Haven't updated in 2 days and still have yet to see my refund credited back to my account from Busy Bees Ap.,despite speaking with Rory,who on the last conversation said he canceled my order.And on Wed.(Apr.13) and Thurs.(14th) I received 2 emails one from Tanya and one from Rory both stating that my order had been cancelled,but I've yet to see it on my bank records.Sometimes I've seen where it takes up to 3 days to post,most times I see a pending transaction very quickly,but as of date I've not seen one from Busy Bees Ap.
I'll wait until Mon.(4/18) I'll be fair and give them that much berth,and check again to see if it's posted,if not I'll just before I call again and ask(again) why they're not keeping their word(again).
I would like to add one further thing that Ive seen what most here complain about Busy Bees Ap. is not returning emails and phone messages,unless of course you count the "maybe this will keep them quiet":scratch:automated emails.I feel it shows them grossly understaffed and completely unprepared to handle the volume of sales they took orders for.:no:


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## jmgi

Finally got an email from Busy Bees yesterday saying that package bee shipments may resume this coming week, they were feeding the bees and letting them build up bee populations before shaking any more packages. BB said they will let me know when they receive the new shipping dates. John


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## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

Hmmm...imagine that, another delay after the 10 day delay expires. Buys more time. I have sent several emails concerning a refund, no answer.


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## twd8711

im still trying to get them to respond to cancellation of packages, you would think if he cant deliver the merchandise he would try to keep customer service up and running, didnt take him long to answer when i ordered and it didnt take him long to cash the check.


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## Hivey

twd8711 said:


> im still trying to get them to respond to cancellation of packages, you would think if he cant deliver the merchandise he would try to keep customer service up and running, didnt take him long to answer when i ordered and it didnt take him long to cash the check.





NorthernIllinoisPlumber said:


> Hmmm...imagine that, another delay after the 10 day delay expires. Buys more time. I have sent several emails concerning a refund, no answer.



I've found that Busy bees won't respond to emails(they haven't responded to the multiple emails I've sent since Apr. 2),you're wasting your time trying.I just kept calling the main number(pretty sure it's Rory's cell ph.)early in the mornings and late in the afternoon,eventually they will answer,I did talk to them 3 times last week regarding my refund.


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## mythomane

Called this one: http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?248641-Limited-Time-3-lb.-Package-Bee-Super-Sale&p=598297#post598297

When you scroll down on the link above you will see that his experience lies in the trucking industry. I have seen this happen a few times. They see these huge checks passing hands when they deliver bees and want to hop on for the ride. My personal experience with him was when I went to try to order some boxes that he had advertised on the forum. After 3 emails and just before I was going to send the money, he backed out and said that he could not fulfill the order. He took the ad down a day later. I originally was interested because his prices seemed very low (red flag) and that he was located fairly close to me in Epps, Louisiana, which is where he states where he is located on the forum. It looks like he is actually based in Pennsylvania, with the bees coming from Georgia, and maybe just has some hives in Louisiana. I do not think (hope not anyway) that he is trying to defraud anyone, but that he is just inexperienced and bit off way more than he can chew. Having a background in logistics, when I first looked at his trucking schedule it seemed insane -- or at the very least overly ambitious. Weather is only one variable here. Good luck to those getting their bees in May!


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## Hivey

ok just got home from work and checked my bank account and do not see a refund from Busy Bees Apiaries.What a shock guess I'll just have to call them(again the 4th time via phone call)and ask why they haven't refunded my money back to my account.When I talked to Rory on Thurs.(April 14th)he said I would be getting my refund as soon as his system(he said was slow but I wasn't thinking "pony express)was a little slow refunding orders.I feel now I've been lied to again by Busy Bees Apiaries.


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## dmpower

This just in from Busy Bee:

All customers awaiting delivery of package bees may now get a shipping update at www.busybeesapiaries.net. Shipments are now about to resume and will be limited at first but will recover in May, per the latest information from our supplier. As new updates are communicated to us we will make a new posting on our homepage. When we know that a shipment will be available to any given customer we will then be in contact with you to see if you can receive your package! s at the appointed time.

Thank you,

Rory Boleware

And from their site:
Current shipping dates from Georgia for package bees will be April and May. At this time shipping will resume in small quantities on or about April 23rd then again on or about May 1st. These dates are set by our supplier who is in full control of our current supply. We are told that by mid May shipping numbers should be back to normal. If this is the case at that time we may be able to fill all current orders and soon will be able to fill new orders after delayed orders have been filled.

As soon as we know your specific shipping date we will be in contact with you. It will be pointless to contact us for any more information about package bee orders at this point as this is all the information that we have for now from our suppler. We would appreciate it if everyone would remember that we are running a family business. Please allow us to get other productive work done while we are waiting for shipping to resume by refraining from contacting us for information that we are just not able to provide. Rest assured that we want to get your package bees to you ASAP.

*The time has come to be patient and grateful for any amount of bees that you will receive.* Many people seem to be only interested in catching a spring flow. I view this as a serious mistake as more people are needed to focus on helping to simply keep bees alive and build local stock for stronger bees in the future.

Many people who are interested in provident living are part of the reason for the supply issue. There is about 100,000 new beekeepers coming on board this year. I have talked to many of them who understand they have a rocky future ahead and honey bees are a part of their security that they desire for their families. It would be prudent for all to spend some of the time during this shipping delay to look at other areas other than bees for things they need and need to do and allow us to do the same.

On a side note I am smiling big-time with all of the new people signing up for a few stings as this will further spread the bees around the country. I believe this to be a big plus for the bee stock for their safety. Lets face it we need bees for pollination but we need to shield our bees from some of the crops they otherwise would be foraging. This will be the natural insulation process with some new beekeepers. We should take note of the areas where bees are found to have a higher degree of survivability. 

Based on the current information from our supplier we feel it is safe to go full forward with new orders with undated shipments in May at this point and time. If this changes a refund can be credited but to secure a order you must make a purchase. So order here and elsewhere that you may be able to secure package bees.
(I bolded the font)


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## Grant

winevines said:


> If you don't already do it, maybe you could consider learning how to make summer nucs that you overwinter and use those as your new hives the following Spring (with locally adaptable queens) as another lesson instead of only relying on packages?[/url]


This comment is right on. As this thread is dedicated to those having trouble with Busy Bee Apiaries, the idea of making summer nucs needs to be brought up and discussed elsewhere. I would love to hear what your bee club is doing in this regard.

But let's take it to another forum.

Grant
Jackson, MO


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## Hivey

Grant said:


> This comment is right on. As this thread is dedicated to those having trouble with Busy Bee Apiaries, the idea of making summer nucs needs to be brought up and discussed elsewhere. I would love to hear what your bee club is doing in this regard.
> 
> But let's take it to another forum.
> 
> Grant
> Jackson, MO



Sorry to disagree ,but I fail to see where this applies to those of us the"new bee keepers" that it does us any good at all if we don't "have" bees to do summer nucs,and were depending solely on Busy Bees to deliver our bees"ontime" so that we might have a chance to make summer nucs.


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## JimK

What a rip off. Who needs packages Two Months Late.
And almost no way to get your money back. I could have gotten packages local for a little more money.
Oh Well. One learns.


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## Grant

Hivey said:


> Sorry to disagree ,but I fail to see where this applies to those of us the"new bee keepers" that it does us any good at all if we don't "have" bees to do summer nucs,and were depending solely on Busy Bees to deliver our bees"ontime" so that we might have a chance to make summer nucs.


Once burned, twice shy. The "customer service" you received ought to be the lesson learned for taking your beginner status to the next level of sustainable apiculture. You don't want to be in this position next year as you make plans to expand or replace your winter dead-outs. You shouldn't gamble on your beekeeping future with these kind of variables. 

Grant
Jackson, MO


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## seal62

Kelly bees are out of bees for over a week .I ordered 18# a couple weeks ago with a May 14th shipping date . When i saw they ran out i called..my order is good .


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## twd8711

this business and the owner should be shunned out of the bee business, to be treated like this is plain wrong, report him to the bbb it doesnt do alot but its not good, if i dont soon get a response he will be speaking to an attorney,even though i know an attorney is more than the 500 he owes me it is the principle, what about the new beekeepers and others who dont have the money to reorder until there money is returned.
i ordered from another guy who is having trouble and emailed him to cancel because i found another source and he refunded my money in days, next year if i ever do packages again he will be the first one i call. (excellent business practices) 
one bad apple


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## Hivey

Anyway for my final update of my experience(I can think of a few better suited choice words than experience)with Busy Bee Apiaries,I just checked my bank account and Busy Bees finally refunded my money.But not after multiple emails(total waste of time)and phone calls since *April 2nd*,*17 days* I had to waste my time dealing with Busy Bees and all I wanted was a refund.
After seeing that they have only been beekeeping for three years(per his profile here) tells me the whole story.I wonder if their lack of experience played a big role in all the dissatisfied,frustrated customers like myself,by not communicating with them and only sending out shotgun automated emails to "all" their customers only leaving all of us involved to wonder.
As the old saying goes "Fool me once shame on you:no: Fool me twice shame on meinch:.Well the latter won't happen,because in no way will I ever deal with Busy Bees Apiaries again.

*Good luck to the rest of you that are still waiting for both bees and refunds*


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## giant pumpkin peep

Hivey, per your profile I see this is your first year beeking. Thats fine. Im not sure understand that bees is farming and that you never know whats going to happen and everything revolve around weather. Does the customer service have issues? Yes. But Im sure you are one of hundreds that have been making rorys phone explode, wondering were the bees are. Don't blame busy bee's for really bad weather.

Also, I think pyro was attempting to help others find a source of bees this late in the game not being off topic.


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## lavert5

I know they are at least reading their email. I sent one telling them they mispelled the Douglas, Georgia they had Gouglas. Today its spelled correctly! I am still hoping for my bee's giving them the benefit of doubt.


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## BeeCurious

I'm curious, are these all the same Rory Boleware?

http://www.allbusiness.com/companyprofile/Rory_Boleware/1AF1CA2CB585E13064CB240191A32107-1.html

http://www.localharvest.org/better-boy-poultry-M26547

http://www.netprospex.com/people/Rory-Boleware/25918975


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## dmpower

Yeah it looks like it, with Tanya as his VP
There is a guy in SC that has been going by Busy Bee Apiaries for quite some time, boy is he in for a surprise! Should he be warned lol Seems the NC Busy Bee had some good press: http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?234706-Need-help-Call-Busy-Bee-Apiaries-in-NC!


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## nc_beekeeper

I called Rory about a refund on 4/11 and was told i'd have it back in my account by the end of the day. When friday 4/15 rolled around and i still hadn't seen it I filed a dispute with my credit union. Logged in to check this morning and my $800 is now sitting safely back in my account. 

Good luck to the rest of you guys. Luckily I found some nucs locally for $85 and picked them up on Monday.


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## twd8711

resolved


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## Yuleluder

twd8711 said:


> i ordered from another guy who is having trouble and emailed him to cancel because i found another source and he refunded my money in days, next year if i ever do packages again he will be the first one i call. (excellent business practices)


Thanks Tim!

This package season has been a complete mess, however some suppliers seem to be making their orders in a timely fashion however they certainly are not the big boys. I was stressing out about my supplier being late, but heck what can you do?


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## SRatcliff

On their website it says "updated 4/22/2011 11:00am".

What exactly was updated?


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## hotrod6779

Looks like he lacks the business experience to know that the consumer has a more emotional tie to what it is they're into this week than a 17 year old school girl knows about being fickle. For those first year beekeepers who are waiting for there packages, I really feel for you. But hey, on the bright side you just learned your first hands on lesson in beekeeping, or any ag business at that. Patience is a virtue. Be easy on the guy. He screwed up. Heck, if I had 575 of you calling me 9 times a day I'd quit answering the phone too.


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## No-sage

Anyone waiting for bee's should check your account. I've received a refund as of 4/21. 

I didn't ask for a refund. I was willing to wait until the middle of May before I wrote it off and asked to be credited. The credit just showed up in my account. I didn't rceive a communication as to when or why I got a refund instead of my packages.

Going to be ordering local from here forward.


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## jmgi

Has anyone who ordered packages from Busy Bee received a recent email saying that their bees have been shipped? I have six packages ordered, originally were supposed to arrive in late March, now that has been delayed a couple times so far. Just wondering if they are communicating with purchasers like they said they would when the bees are shipped. John


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## Stephen

I said I wasn't going to say anything else on this matter until I heard from Rory. Well I've changed my mind. Today I notice I was once AGAIN billed for the bees I paid for on March 15 and the 22 but still haven't gotten. So I call the number on the website and get his voice mail and I can't leave a message because the box is full. I log into his site and check my order and it's still just for 2 boxes of bees that I've not received but paid for twice. No mention what-so-ever on his site or my account of the reason he charged me again today. I've sent off an email but I'm not sure it'll even be read. I've already contacted my bank and if I don't hear from Rory tomorrow the bank is going to handle it. They take illegal unauthorized charges pretty durn serious. What really really bugs me is this guy has the card number on hand obviously if a month later he bills me again. Extremely not happy about this. This has been the biggest hassle. If I would have known this would end up this way I'd have gotten in my truck a month ago and driven to Georgia myself and gotten the bees.


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## Stephen

Just as an update... Rory called me today and the issue has been resolved. I asked that he cancel my order and both sets of charges (2 from March and the 2 yesterday) already appear in the bank account as pending credits. I wish him good luck as well as everyone else that was/is his customer.


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## Birdman

I didn't have any problem getting a hold of him called left a message called right back. I was told the load comming to Indiana should load monday.


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## dmpower

FYI
Busy Bee is now taking orders for 2012. You can order your 4# bee package for $97 and choose a shipping date starting in early April 2012.


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## dmpower

Update via email today:
Ship Dates: Updated - 4/29/2011 12:55 AM

Current shipping dates from Georgia for package bees will be May 2nd, 15th, 21st and 28th. We are hoping for over 500 packages for the May 2nd load however this may be affected by yesterday's heavy rains, as loading schedules are very tight and packages are still in short supply at the moment. May 15th will be 600 packages. The balance of our order will be filled on the May 21st and 28th ship dates. These dates are set by our supplier who is in full control of our current supply of packages. We will have a limited supply of packages available at this time for new orders that will be available after back-orders are filled.

As soon as we receive a firm package count on our May 2nd load we will be contacting each of our customers to inform you of your package ship date and when you can expect them. It will be pointless to contact us for any more information about package bee orders at this point as this is all the information that we have for now from our suppler. We would appreciate it if everyone would remember that we are running a family business. Please allow us to get other productive work done while we are waiting for shipping to resume by refraining from contacting us for information that we are just not able to provide. Rest assured that we want to get your package bees to you ASAP. I will be back at my suppliers place of business today for the third time this week.
. . .


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## ChristopherA

May 15, 21 and 28th, wow....hope they build up well before the summer hits, or it will be a season of feed feed feed.


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## dmpower

Since the May 2nd is only a few hours away and 500 packages are set to be delivered in the next 2 days, has anyone had an email from Busy Bee with an expected delivery date/time? This seems to be about 1/3 or 1/4 of their volume and I'm guessing there are some of those people on this thread. Please post if you've heard any delivery, or non delivery information.
Thanks
Maybe we need to start pool. I'm guessing the May 2 delivery will be postponed by 1 week - then possibly again. So my bet is May 2 becomes May 9th.
Good luck


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## Barry

Let's back off with the "minute by minute" postings. This isn't a group scheduling chit chat forum. You are to be sharing _your_ experience, not asking other members what's going on with them.


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## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

I got a refund by check last week from Rory. Keep in mind I paid by cash. Cash is BY FAR the hardest to get a refund for (if a company is dishonest). 

My problems had nothing to do with the weather, as some would like to tell us. You can research my old posts concerning my order if you like. 

Good luck to all this season!


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## dmpower

I picked up my bees this morning!
They look pretty good and the queen is a nice size.


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## Birdman

Recived an email from Tanya Telling me my bees were shipped. I had them installed 2 hours before I recived her email. Nice package's


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## libhart

Picked up my BBA package yesterday in the terrible weather, installed it this morning. Bees look good, queen was nice and fat. The only thing I'm a bit upset about is that fact that I weighed my package before and after, and I only received 2.25lbs of bees, drones included. I emailed Rory and Tanya and suggested that they take a small but accurate digital scale w/them and QC a few packages before they leave with them. They should be at least 7 1/2lbs when accounting for the package/can/lid.


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## Corvair68

I am hoping that everything has caught up and going well for Busy Bees. I am waiting anxiously for a package to arrive from them. I haven't received a notice from them stating there was a problem, but I stumbled upon this tread a few days ago and it really has me freaking out


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## Paul McCarty

Last I heard they changed suppliers, and the Carnie-Italians they were offering have now been changed to straight Italians. I cancelled my order last week, as I was seeking Carnolians and it's getting a bit late in the game for me. Everyone who has an order placed for the previous Carnolian hybrids will see a refund credit mysteriously appear as that shipment is now cancelled, and then will be billed for the new Italian package when it ships. So if your money was refunded out of the blue, you may still have a package headed your way. Check with them and watch your credit statement.


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## Corvair68

I wish they would at least let me know what is going on. I'll have to call them tomorrow and see if they answer the phone, cause the e-mail thing isn't working. I am getting tired of looking at an empty hive and all I've seen flying in the gardens so far is one bumble and lots of mosquitoes. If anyone is looking for a package of mosquitoes I am quite sure I could make up a few 3# packages for you for free. All you need to pay is shipping and handling.


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## Risky Beesness

I have been reading this topic since it started, and trying to maintane a good attitude. I have not been able to get any information through email since March and last time I tried to call, their voice mail was full and wouldn't accept any messages. I have two nucs that were supposed to be shipped or delivered "Mid May". I will be leaving town for 10 days, next Thur. Sure hope they make it before I leave. If they would return my email, i could discuss my options, but they have not. I was told in March that the delays with the packages would not effect deliveries of nucs.


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## FindlayBee

I have been following this thread and I would like to comment.

1. I do not have any bees ordered through Busy Bee Apiaries.

2. Busy Bee Apiaries is not a package producer.

3. Busy Bee Apiaries is a package reseller for package producers.

4. Busy Bee Apiaries has no control over delivery of packages into their inventory.

5. The package producers are behind due to weather and other variables.

6. Until the package producers can fill Busy Bee Apiaries' orders, bees will not be shipped to the end customer.

7. Places like Busy Bee Apiaries order packaged bees based on the paid orders they receive.

8. Places like Busy Bee Apiaries uses the money from these paid orders to place orders with the package producers.

9. Delayed shipment of bees causes Busy Bee Apiaries to take the blunt of the complaints due to delays from the package producers.

10. Package producer will be the last to refund money to places like Busy Bee Apiaries.

11. Places like Busy Bee Apiaries will be the ones refunding delayed or canceled packaged bee money to the end customers, even though that money has been paid to the package producer.

12. Places like Busy Bee Apiaries will still have to take delivery of packaged bees when they become available as they are a paid order.

13. Those that have been refunded by places like Busy Bee Apiaries end up with extra unpaid packages due customer cancelation from delays that have been out of their control. These would probably be used to fill some orders early, or be left over for the package reseller to deal with (making nucs).

14. Everyone is mad at places like Busy Bee Apiaries because of delayed shipment of honey bee packages.

15. People start calling for the business to close down. They call the business very poorly run, and just about any name they can think of.

16. Places like Busy Bee Apiaries become overrun with complaints on their voicemail, email, and places like this forum. These complaints all stem from a product that is produced by someone else, dependent on good weather, good honey bee populations, on time queen delivery, proper mating, and many other variables.

17. The company does the best it can to inform customers of delays, refunds, and status of the orders.

18. The same customers keep calling and emailing to ask for updates, refunds, etc. Please sit back and ask yourself if you could handle 100's of calls and emails a day asking the same questions over and over and having to sort through everything over and over. A notice is posted/emailed on delays, etc., but you still get the same calls and emails daily all the while still trying to run the rest of the business.

A good business can fail due to supply issues. The delays are a supply issue and until Busy Bee Apiaries gets its inventory from the supplier, they cannot fill customer orders. Customers that cancel will have to hope someone else can deliver packaged bees. Some customers that canceled may find that their order would have been filled late, and now that they have gotten a refund, there are no more companies to fill orders.

I hope everyone gets their bees this year. Delays make no one happy. This is my take on how things might be going for the business that is the focus of this thread. It is my opinion only.


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## beemaster01

What a breath of fresh air. Someone that understands logistics.


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## Birdman

They don't care.


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## twd8711

busy bee apiares got into the trouble they did for several reasons, not knowing the business, trying to take to big of a piece of the market, and there very poor customer relations, knowing your product and the people who buy it is a very big part of any business.


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## libhart

I'd also like to comment, and in the interest of disclosure I did order a single package form them only because I thought I could have it early. I've received my bees, albeit the package was extremely light.

This company is a broker. Yes, they're not the producer, but they take full payment for the package, and therefore are ultimately responsible for it. The fact that we know that they're not producing them doesn't make them less responsible. If package brokers want to disavow all responsibility for the packages, then we need a different system, one where we, the customer, make the package payment to the producer, and a shipping payment to the shipper/broker, in this case Busy Bees. When the packages are late, the producer would then have hundreds of people calling him and would be more likely to fulfill this order since it wouldn't just be the one guy who's running Busy Bees complaining to the producer.

My wife works for a company that brokers plants to greenhouses. This is an agricultural product, albeit grown in a greenhouse, but still susceptible to disease and pests and the like. If a customer orders a product, and the grower promises that product by a certain date but then cannot deliver, the customer has the option of canceling the order, or my wife's company, the broker, will search for other growers that can deliver the product. So giving all the money to the producer up front before any delivery is made is also not a good practice, but one we've all just come to accept.

Busy Bees has a new idea for next year since they plan to be in the south by then. They want you to order next year's packages this summer, as in next month. For every package ordered, they will create a hive when it's ordered, meaning this summer. Your package will then be the first shaken from "your" hive and you'll get the queen from that hive. They'll shake the package even if the hive becomes inviable after shaking. This is a very interesting idea, and I applaud Rory for thinking outside the hive body on this one, but I think he'll have a lot of challenges getting people to order next year's packages so early on. What if all my hives winter over well, I don't want packages, but if I lose a lot, then I will. I can't make that call now though.

I wish luck to Busy Bees, but I also believe when you take a package order and take full payment, you become the producer, whether we know you shake them or not.


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## Corvair68

The issues is the lack of communication from Busy Bees. The only information we get comes from complaint on Bee Source. They could send out e-mail updates to everyone with very little effort if their computers are set up properly, or have a place on their website for updates so people are not left to worry. Oh wait! I just received an e-mail saying my bees have been shipped! Have I said how much I love these guys yet? Woohoo! Now if they get here healthy and happy I'll be thrilled. Stumbling upon this blog though really put me in panic mode. They need to improve communication with their customers to avoid threads like this from starting.


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## CharlieN

FindlayBee said:


> I have been following this thread and I would like to comment.
> 
> 1. I do not have any bees ordered through Busy Bee Apiaries.
> ----snip----
> I hope everyone gets their bees this year. Delays make no one happy. This is my take on how things might be going for the business that is the focus of this thread.





beemaster01 said:


> What a breath of fresh air. Someone that understands logistics.


"Can't shake bees in the rain....." What my uncle used to say all the time. Even with all the technology available to "forecast" and track, we still can't control the weather.


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## mythomane

"For every package ordered, they will create a hive when it's ordered, meaning this summer. Your package will then be the first shaken from "your" hive and you'll get the queen from that hive. They'll shake the package even if the hive becomes inviable after shaking. This is a very interesting idea, and I applaud Rory for thinking outside the hive body on this one, but I think he'll have a lot of challenges getting people to order next year's packages so early on. "


Um, yeah...So what if I order in November? What if I order right now (middle of summer) and the hive does not build up? What if they die over the winter? Who is going to take up the slack? If experience with these guys is any indication, it looks like the Buyer will. Here it is nearly June and people are still waiting for their bees...

"The time has come to be patient and grateful for any amount of bees that you will receive. Many people seem to be only interested in catching a spring flow. I view this as a serious mistake as more people are needed to focus on helping to simply keep bees alive and build local stock for stronger bees in the future."

So I should be happy with getting my bees in the summer? How is getting package bees AFTER the spring flow helpful to anyone? How is starvation going to fortify my stock?

"Many people who are interested in provident living are part of the reason for the supply issue. There is about 100,000 new beekeepers coming on board this year. I have talked to many of them who understand they have a rocky future ahead and honey bees are a part of their security that they desire for their families. It would be prudent for all to spend some of the time during this shipping delay to look at other areas other than bees for things they need and need to do and allow us to do the same."

What kind of security can I expect from package bees (a light 3lbs from previous posts) that I hive in June? Having to feed my family means not over-extending myself so that I can meet my obligations. It might be prudent for Rory to take some of his own advice and learn the business and the consequences that follow, before he leaves his customers high and dry. I have been in the bees for 20 years and still learn something new every day. You want to jump in and take a risk after 2 years of puttering around in the yard, go for it, but making your customers take the hit when you fail is not good business.


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## matt1954

Here is a simple answer to your problem. If you dont like it, become a broker and see how easy it is. I only sold 850 packages this year and was hit with the same backlog. Some people dealt with it better than others, and some new beeks just could not understand why I did not have bees in a warehouse somewhere. It is a symptom of our "add water and stir" society. I appreciate that people pay for a product and expect delivery. However, it is difficult when you are trying to run your hives, send packages, deal with the phones and post on your website that you are shipping on a certain date only to have someone call you and ask you at 7:00 a.m. on the day of shipment if you have a tracking number yet. 

Having said that, I agree that communication is important, and I have taken some knocks upside the head myself. Some times you cannot get to people fast enough. But altough every year has its challenges, this one was really tough and I bet next year will be just as difficult as people try to play catch up from what they missed this year. And of course, we have no idea what the winter will be like. I have people asking about 2012 orders already and although I have placed my standing order, I am just not ready to deal with 2012 when 2011 has not finished for me yet. 

I purchased 150 packages from Busy Bees this year who got his from Garders. Quite candidly, Rory kept me informed of what was going on. I got them all. I will not source bees next year that come from Gardners. This is no reflection on BB Apiaries, but, I have been feeling the pain of Garnders packages and superseding queens for the past three years. Some of my customers have also felt the same as I send out emails asking for feedback as part of our quality assurance review process. I also ask for hive photos from various people around the country to check the bees which I source. 

This is a wonderful business and my greatest addiction in life. I have no others. It is tough, and sometimes it frustrates me. As much as people are upset about the delays, I am certain they could not be helped. No one wants to sit on stock. We are not in the "lets aggravate our clients" business. If the bees were available, they would be shipped ASAP. 

Rory is trying some new things. Will they work? I dont know. Maybe due to the location he is in he has a chance. But if the guy has to respond to 250 calls a day and a like number of emails, he wont ever get an opportunity to implement his business model.


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## Corvair68

As I said before, it is all about communication. Keeping folks informed, and explaining the issues is key. With hundreds of folks waiting it can be difficult to respond to all calls and e-mails, but it would only take a few minutes to update a page on the website to keep everyone in the loop. It would have likely avoided this thread, and a lot of canceled orders. If what they say is true there are a lot of other sellers having the same problems, but they don't have a 13+ page blog of complaints on bee source. If my bees come in reasonably close to weight and are healthy and happy I may order again next year, but I'll be sure to get my order in much sooner. Unless of course the bees do well enough to split the hive next year. But then again I might be totally addicted and want several hives. My comments and reaction to this thread were due to the fact that this was the only place I was getting information. Good news travels fast but bad news travels faster.


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## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

Corvair68 said:


> but it would only take a few minutes to update a page on the website to keep everyone in the loop.



You said it all right there.


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## FindlayBee

The latest update on their website is from 5/10/2011.

_Ship Dates: Updated - 5/10/2011 9:25 PM

Current shipping dates from Georgia for package bees will be May 13th, 18th, 19th, 20th, 21st, 24th, 25th, 26th, 27th and 28th. These new shipping dates are not from our previous supplier that has been causing all of the delays. The new 3 pound packages come with a Italian queen. Anyone wishing to wait on their original package orders with Italian / Carniolan crossed queens may do so as we still get packages from this source but much below the demand._

Additional information I found on the package bee order page and appears to have been either updated or added on 5/10/2011.

_When selecting one of the below shipping dates when placing your order, please understand that this is only to allow us to know the earliest date that you can have your package shipped. Any posted date may be booked at the time of your order placement. We will contact you to allow you to discuss any complications with an actual shipping date that we assign you after receiving your order. _


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## Stephen

FindlayBee said:


> The latest update on their website is from 5/10/2011.
> 
> _Ship Dates: Updated - 5/10/2011 9:25 PM
> 
> Current shipping dates from Georgia for package bees will be May 13th, 18th, 19th, 20th, 21st, 24th, 25th, 26th, 27th and 28th. These new shipping dates are not from our previous supplier that has been causing all of the delays. The new 3 pound packages come with a Italian queen. Anyone wishing to wait on their original package orders with Italian / Carniolan crossed queens may do so as we still get packages from this source but much below the demand._


It's nice to post current info from their website Findlay. But there was nothing of the sort weeks ago. It went from a week, to 3 weeks, to we don't know when, to if you get them you're lucky. That's not to mention the unanswered emails, phone calls (if you could leave a message), and double charges (in my case). I'm curious, why even bother if you have no vested/monetary interest in them? Is there a point you're trying to make?


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## FindlayBee

It appears, from the posts in this thread, that there has been communication updates: 3/23, 3/24, 3/31, 4/4, 4/22, 4/29, 5/10. These appear to be updates from automated emails and from information on the company website.

Supply issues happen. From the looks of things, there were updates telling of delays. Everyone can cancel an order and get a refund. It appears that those wanting a refund got theirs. It is unfortunate that you got billed twice, but it appears that the issue was resolved quickly, albeit not as fast as some would have liked it. I would also be very upset getting billed twice for something. I would be even more upset if it caused a cash flow issue on my end and I have been in that situation with non bee related companies before. I have had credits take a few weeks to show up in my bank account as well. My bank now shows credits and debits that are pending when I login to my bank. I use to just have to sit and wait and start calling if I didn't see the credit.

I posted the information above as there have been 10 days since that 5/10/2011 update. Since that update on their website, there have been several complaints that they don't update their website to let everyone know what the status of packages is.

Guess what I am trying to say is this...

We all expect our packaged bees to get here on time. I am darn lucky that I got mine from a local package reseller on time and within a day or two of the original date of availability. My biggest advantage is that I only have to drive 50 miles round trip to pick them up. However, when I place my order of bees, I have to give 3 dates that I would be willing to accept my bees. This means that I may have to wait for a month to get my bees, even though my first 2 dates have come and gone. 

This is direct from the fellow I get my bees from:

March 30 April 13, 2011 April 27th, May 11 and May 25th is sold out for 2011.

I can choose from any of those dates and depending on who is in front of me I may get them on the first available date. I gave the dates of March 30, April 27, and May 11. I got lucky and got mine on March 30th. However, I may have had to wait until May 11, and in an extreme case, May 25th if a delay or shortage happened. I only order 1 or 2 packages so I can see getting myself bumped to another date. If a date comes and goes without a phone call, I know I have been bumped to the next date.

Perhaps Busy Bee should do something similar, this way people know right up front the earliest date may just not be available to them.

Once again, I hope everyone is able to get some bees this year and that there is time to have them build up well to overwinter. Perhaps I am not getting my point across correctly.


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## oldenglish

A supplier or reseller will never make everybody happy. Communication is in the eye of the beholder.
I ran the website for a reseller this year, they drive down pickup the bees and have in store only pickup (clearly posted on the website in big bold letters)over the next few days. When orders are placed we have a best guess date posted on the site, if you call your order in or go into the store you are told the same thing, this is the date we are aiming for, about a week prior we will send out an email confirming the pickup date, we do not call, making 700 plus calls is just too time consuming, check your email.
With that clear instruction given. This year our date slid one week, emails went out and yet we still had people show up on the estimated date, folks asked why they did not get a call, we constantly feilded phone calls about the date due to people not checking the email. We had folks ask when we were going to ship their bees (instore pickup only) we actually got no out of state orders this year, last year we were getting orders from all over the country, folks just cannot be bothered to read what is printed before them.
When all was said and done we handed out 750 packages, not one complaint, but it sure aint easy


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## lavert5

Busy bees allowed the delivery dates to pass with absolutly no communication whatsoever. Phone calls and emails were the result of bad business practices.


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## FindlayBee

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Apparently March 23, 2011 people started getting emails about delays. Guess I would have thought that was an update on the status of packages. See the 1st 3 posts of this thread. My point being there was communications from BBA, but people chose to complain about the delays and then started complaining that updates as to the status of the orders did not come fast enough.

Not sure how many updates people need when a shipment is delayed a week. Day to day updates for the week? When another delay was encountered, BBA emailed again about the delay. Yup, there have been many delays. One delay was for at least 10 days, how many updates does one need within that 10 days? Need a countdown from 10 to 1?


----------



## Stephen

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Findlay... You're kinda beating a dead horse. Playing internet detective using a single thread on a message forum and what's CURRENTLY on BBA's website isn't helping anything or Rory. You stated you didn't order anything from him so I'm curious why you're seeming to make it sound like those of us who did were over-reacting when we didn't receive email updates regularly enough to our liking. You're missing so many pieces of the puzzle. You can't condemn people for having average (actually mine are lots higher) customer service expectations.

Fact of the matter is this. I run my business with a EXTREMELY high level of customer service. Maybe I'm a bit of a brat for expecting other business to follow suit. But who's to judge how myself or anyone else reacts when someone we've paid for something doesn't deliver in our expected time frame?

And... Since Rory and I are done business wise I'm going to do the same with this thread. Don't want Barry to break his delete/edit button.


----------



## lavert5

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

I have yet to recieve any of these so called email updates you speak of. And they didnt update their website until this thread was at least 3 weeks old and im sure their inbox was full!


----------



## timbo501

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Well i finally received my bees on Thursday. I was glad to finally get my packages that were two months late from there original delivery date. But I ordered marked Carniolan queens and what I received was unmarked Italian queens. This isn't a big deal but i spoke to rory last week and he didn't say that the orders were going to be changed. And the other problem I had was that i paid over $54 for shipping and the price on the label was $24. And two of the packages were the most aggressive bees i have ever handled. I've never gotten stung while installing a package before, well I ended that streak with 6 stings from one package install, not to fun lol. But I have a call into Rory so hopefully I can finally have this whole transaction behind me.


----------



## The Honey Householder

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

I've been a dealer for another supplier for the last 12 year. The last two year has been hard. The business has change a lot over the last year, and its got me thinking if I will deal anymore. With the shorage of bees the supplies only need to deal with the dealers anymore. That makes them fewer headaches. Each year I sell more and more packages for my supplier and each year my price from my supplier keeps going up, because of demand. I'm so sick of my customer complaining about the price. Who is the one that takes all the risk. I have one customer tell me I have to sell to him, because I am a dealer for the supplier he wants bees from. He complained when the shippment came in a week late on April 1. For this customer I say good luck getting bees next year. I talk to other dealerthat aren't dealing anymore because of all this. Where do the beekeeper get there bees without the suppliers and the dealers?????:scratch:


----------



## FindlayBee

lavert5 said:


> Their website says a 10 day delay now. I havent had much luck getting any communicastions from them.


That post was on 4/6/2011. One day after this thread was started. Like I said, updated were provided via email or _website updates._

The company ran into delay, customers got upset, customers started calling and emailing wanting to know what was going on. The company appear to have sent out at least some emails (I would have thought most of these would have been mass mailings), and updated their website. Delays go worse and people start calling for the company to be sued and closed down. I guess that is what caused me to post on this thread in the first place. A startup company has issue that are out of their control, and 23 people contribute to a thread wanting them gone rather than try to help them get through a rough time in the honey bee industry. Yup, that includes genuine complaints, ideas that might help prevent these issues from happing in the future, and asking for refunds. Not this sue happy world we live in.

Done!


----------



## Corvair68

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*



The Honey Householder said:


> Where do the beekeeper get there bees without the suppliers and the dealers?????:scratch:


At risk of sounding like a total jerk... chances are for every seller or dealer that hangs up their hive tool there will be a dozen others waiting to take their place. I see this as being a positive learning experience for everyone. I have learned alot from it, and if come next winter I feel I need to purchase more bees, I am not opposed to giving busy bees a call again. Sellers need to improve communication, buyers need to be a bit more patient. I know from my business if I let my customers know in advance that there is an issue that causes a delay they may not be happy, but they do understand things happen that are beyond our control.


----------



## thomas

I and a freind ordered five packages from rory for march the 18th and the 19th my bees where here and they were fat packages and now they have honey supers on them and full of good looking bees. i met rory and his wife they are good people and if i need more bees i will get them from them the bees are gentle and work hard the type are italian and cross with carni's but i have this type of bees but my queens are carni's mated with italians but i have no complaint things happen so lets think about the good instead of the bad.

thomas


----------



## Daddy'sBees

Mother nature has made it difficult for many beeks this spring. But, Cory delivered my bees on time and they are doing excellent!!! I would definitely do business again. I think we need to consider that many things can effect us. Bad weather and human errors just happen. We can learn and correct mistakes generated from human error. I just wish we could have some influence on the weather!


----------



## The Honey Householder

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Corvair68 Not after this tread!!!


----------



## Risky Beesness

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

So I don't see anything on their site about delays or shipping for nucs. My two nucs were supposed to be delivered a week ago. I was told in March when the emails went out concerning packages, that this would not affect nucs because they are company stock. Now, I am 4 days away from leaving town, and I have not had a response from emails, phone messages, or on-line contact form since March. If they would at least respond, i would gladly discuss options such as delaying shipment until my return. My fear is, they are not reading or listening to messages and they will ship them anyway, where they will sit at the post office for 10 days. I am about out of options.


----------



## Corvair68

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Update.... My package arrived there were a solid layer of casualties in the bottom, but I guess that is expected. The queen was alive and the rest of them look good also. I weighed the package before and after the installation, and I am quite happy with the results. The starting weight was 6lb 11.4oz, the after shaking it was 3lb 15.6 oz and there were still several bees in there who just refused to leave. I also managed to avoid getting stung. I cant say the same for my dog who I thought would learn after one sting. She got hit on the nose at least 6 times trying to smell them. But over all... I am happy with the package.


----------



## FindlayBee

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Have any of you waiting on bees tried their order status page?

https://www.fortune3.com/rorywb/orderslogin.cgi

If you don't want to click on that link, go to http://www.busybeesapiaries.net/ and click on "order status" at the bottom of the page.


----------



## Risky Beesness

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

No luck. It only shows the invoice and where the charges were ran on my credit card. No updated info.


----------



## signalten

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

I got mine today from them. Looked good. I didn't have any issues with Busy Bee . That being said. I ordered mine after people cancelled orders because of the delays. I was adding hives and I had already purchased bees locally. I'd do business with them again but I'll buy local first. Hope it works out for everyone!


----------



## Vfox

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

When did you guys place your orders; those of you who are now receiving their packages. I placed mine on the 12th for shipping on the 18th. I didn't realize they were still having delays on the new supplier and expected them to have arrived already. Anyone know any general ETA for your new packages and not those from march/April?


----------



## signalten

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*



Vfox said:


> When did you guys place your orders; those of you who are now receiving their packages. I placed mine on the 12th for shipping on the 18th. I didn't realize they were still having delays on the new supplier and expected them to have arrived already. Anyone know any general ETA for your new packages and not those from march/April?


I ordered mine on 4-28


----------



## Vfox

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*



signalten said:


> I ordered mine on 4-28


Yeesh almost a month, fingers crossed it won't be that long. I'm beginning to get worried mine won't be able build up in time for the nasty winters here in PA.


----------



## Corvair68

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

I ordered mine on May 3rd, with a shipping date of May 15th. Then I found this thread and started to panic. The 15th was a Sunday so I knew they couldn't ship, but on Monday I started checking the status a few times a day to see if there was a change. I shot them a few e-mails and tried calling just because I was freaked out buy all the complaints on here. On the Friday I received an e-mail from stamps.com saying that they were on the way, and yesterday morning at about 7:15 I got a call from the post office to say they were there. Give them a a few days. You'll get an e-mail as soon as they are ready to ship. I am happy now that it's over. This thread definitely can get you worried. I installed the package yesterday and they look good today. There were a hundreds of workers doing orientation flights, and a several came over to visit me. I have to admit I was a bit worried but still no stings.


----------



## CharlieN

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

We had a break in the rain with a a bit of sun so I helped a newbie install 2 packages from Busy Bees this morning. I normally would have waited until evening, but storms supposed to roll in again this evening. 

She had ordered them mid April and they came yesterday. She had asked me a week ago the reason it was taking so long to get the bees and I told her as much rain as everyone was getting this spring - we had almost 6" yesterday with more forecast this evening and record amounts this spring - it's a surprise anyone is able to get packages at all. Just wait and see and if they ended up not coming I'd help her out with a couple splits or something.

Bees were in fairly good shape, the queens looked good (as far as that means anything  ). I showed her how to install the first package without smoking and how to direct release the queen and I let her do the second one. It was fun (especially since no one got stung), with her 5 year old looking so serious in bee garb, really fascinated with the bees. I told her I'd be back in a week or so to show her how to check everything out.

I think if they don't mold from all the rain  they'll do fine...


----------



## Vfox

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

So it says on their site that shipping was updated on the 25th...and below that it says they are doing one more shipment June 4th. Does this mean they sent some out on the 25th and will also be shipping on the 4th of June or does that mean only June? I'm getting exceedingly worried at how late in the year this colony will be started. Fingers crossed that things shipped on the 25th but if anyone knows otherwise please chime in.


----------



## lavert5

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

My bees finally arrived! Shipped on the 24th picked them up the 26th. The bees looked good there wasnt a lot of dead in the bottom. Queens looked good only not marked as requested and paid for but hey after after bein 2 months late ill take it. I can find a queen just wanted em marked in case of supercedure anyway. Nothing wrong with there product ppl just there service!


----------



## TIMER

Looks like Busy Bees have made a nice recovery here:applause:
Unlike some other suppliers I have read about here that just flat keep taking money.
I agree that people need to be more patient. Especially those who are new to beekeeping otherwise they will be very dissappointed.


----------



## Beau

I bought Bees and hives from Rory at Busy Bees Apiaries. Money was paid first of year, he said he would ship 2nd week of May. No bees NO word I sent alot of emails ask for my money back,and called alot of times,He will not reply,said he was busy and diden't have time to answer emails.well he had time to take my money,


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## jtow

Same here, order was supposed to ship 4/11, since then no reply's to emails or someone answering the phone to let me know if they still have my order active. Now afraid, assuming they do send them, going to end up having to feed them all summer - fall - winter and into next spring.


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## Beau

At this point I wonder if he ever inteded to ship.He told me two weeks ago he was working on nucs and was going to ship,I wonder if he has even shiped any packages.He was very egar to talk last winter but now he;s busy.I told him he was not the only one frying fish,to please give me a shippin date. Or give me my money back. NO reply


----------



## FindlayBee

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*



Beau said:


> At this point I wonder if he ever inteded to ship.He told me two weeks ago he was working on nucs and was going to ship,I wonder if he has even shiped any packages.He was very egar to talk last winter but now he;s busy.I told him he was not the only one frying fish,to please give me a shippin date. Or give me my money back. NO reply


Going to say by the following that he has been shipping bees as of 3 days ago. That is May 24th and can be viewed on page 16 of this thread.



lavert5 said:


> My bees finally arrived! Shipped on the 24th picked them up the 26th. The bees looked good there wasnt a lot of dead in the bottom. Queens looked good only not marked as requested and paid for but hey after after bein 2 months late ill take it. I can find a queen just wanted em marked in case of supercedure anyway. Nothing wrong with there product ppl just there service!


Packaged bees and bees in general are all behind this year. Seems we have had a very wet and cold spring. Here in Ohio I have yet to see a field of corn or beans. The only thing I see is wheat and weeds. Read some of the other posts on this forum and others and you will find that honey bees have not been doing well either with all this rain, flooding, and cold weather. I have been hearing about entire queen breading yards destroyed, 500 or more hives having to be moved before the flood waters move in, and 100's of hives under water. This has not been a good year.

Queen breeders close to me are delayed until at least the first part of June. I am waiting for two starter hives (10 frame medium, bottom board, inner cover, outer cover, 5 frames of brood and bees) that were originally scheduled for late May availability. Last i heard from my supplier is that they are two weeks behind. Since then, the weather has not been good at all and I expect further delays. I also know he is very busy trying to get caught up.


----------



## lavert5

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Yes he is apparently shipping as i now have my bees. But the first communication i had from them after many emails and phone calls was on the 25th and that was "Your order from Busy Bees Apiaries has been shipped". Order was originally to be shipped march 29.‏


----------



## FindlayBee

Lavert5: my post was mainly directed at Beau for his/her comment.



Beau said:


> At this point I wonder if he ever inteded to ship.He told me two weeks ago he was working on nucs and was going to ship,I wonder if he has even shiped any packages.He was very egar to talk last winter but now he;s busy.I told him he was not the only one frying fish,to please give me a shippin date. Or give me my money back. NO reply


Beau: I am sure you are either going to get your bees or you money back. From this thread, I do not see anyone that has not either been given their money back or gotten their bees. Bees are not packaged and placed on shelves in warehouses for just in time delivery. If all goes well, shipping dates are normally very close and everyone is happy. When the weather doesn't cooperate and honey bee production gets behind, everyone gets stressed and worried about getting "their bees". This has not been a good year and the writing was on the wall just a couple months back that things were not going to go smooth this year for many producers and suppliers of honey bees.

It does appear that BBA has a communication issue and I hope they are working on improving it.


----------



## Beau

Findlaybee I hope you are right,I ordered bees allready installed in hive.They was supposed to have been put in hives in Feb.to get an early start. I live in Georgia,we got rain yesterday first measurable amount in six weeks. He may have problems other than rain. I bought four packages in Ocilla,Ga .H&L Bee farm in . I hope you're right and everything is fine. I don;t know where his suppiler lives.but douglas is close to Ocilla.


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## FindlayBee

I did let BBA know about this thread as I am sure other people did as well. As far as communication goes, I have not heard back on the subject of this thread with unhappy customers. I sent my message 3 days ago.


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## Beau

I am very aware bees are not on a shelf in a wearhouse, I srarted putting bees in hives in 1968.


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## sqkcrk

Beau said:


> I started putting bees in hives in 1968.


Before most of your customers were born I suspect. It must be tough trying to keep everybody happy.


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## Beau

Have you heard anything from rory @ busy bees?


----------



## Beau

Have you heard from rory @ busy bees?


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## Vfox

So I noticed there is no longer a place to contact them via email any longer. I cannot get in contact with them at all. I also see they are no longer mailing nucs this year and I hope that does not affect the 3# packages. If they ship on the 4th that is fine and dandy but if not they are going to be in deep- with many of us.


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## FindlayBee

http://www.busybeesapiaries.net/contactus.html


----------



## Vfox

FindlayBee said:


> http://www.busybeesapiaries.net/contactus.html


Tried it twice now without a reply.


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## Risky Beesness

> I also see they are no longer mailing nucs this year and I hope that does not affect the 3# packages.


Where did you see that.


----------



## Vfox

Here:

http://www.busybeesapiaries.net/Package_Bees-3_Pound_Bee_Package.html


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## Risky Beesness

OK thanks.

I ordered and paid for two nucs on 1/12/11. I was told by Rory in Feb, that i would receive them in mid May via USPS. In March I emailed Tanya to find out if there would be any delays due to the problems being experienced in delivering packages. She replied that the nucs would be delivered on-time because they were from company stock. In May I began trying to get shipping info. I have emailed on numerous occasions both to Tanya and Rory, called and left voice mails at least 3 times, and filled out the contact form on the website twice. i have received no further communication about the delivery of my two nucs since march. Now I read on their website that they will no longer be shipping nucs due to the weather and the USPS' means of handling of the bees. 

Fortunately, Bee Weaver has acquired some Italian nucs that I will be able to pick up here in Austin. This has been a learning experience and I wish I had ordered all my bees from them in the 1st place. It is comforting to know that there are suppliers out there that function in the 21st century, communicating and delivering as promised. Now we will see if I ever get my refund from Busybees. Either way, we are done. Unforseen circumstances such as weather can happen, but a lack of communication is inexcusible.


----------



## lpruss

I ordered from Busy Bees recently. I ended up cancelling as I was able to get my bees elsewhere. When I talked to Tanya she said I would be refunded my money. I had sent her money via PayPal for two Nucs. It's been a few weeks now and I've not received my refund. Like others, I have emailed, called (their voice mail is full), and filled out the contact forms. I've even offered to take the two Nucs if it's to difficult to refund my money. Lack of communication is unacceptable. I'm trying to be patience and flexible, but the folks at Busy Bees owe it to their customers to at least let us know what's going on. I'm a first time beekeeper and this isn't how I wanted to start my hobby. Does anyone else know what's going on with Busy Bees? I'm trying to give them the benefit of the doubt, but I'm starting to question it.


----------



## lpruss

Nick,

I've not received my money back from Busy Bees. Do you know the folks at Busy Bees? Have you heard from them recently? I'm willing to work with them on a solution, but they need to be willing to communicate with me. I'm really hoping they are on vacation or something and not avoiding their customers. Thanks.


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## FindlayBee

A paypal refund should not have taken very long. You can file a dispute with paypal and get your money back. However, the transaction cannot be longer than 45 days.

I also have not received a reply to the message I sent them. Not sure what is going on. They should at least be communicating with people either by a mass mailing or by posting better information on their website.


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## signalten

If you used a credit card through Paypal and it has been over 45 days, file a dispute with your card holder. Its actually called a charge back. I had to do this with items I bought on Ebay. It may vary from credit company to credit company but it has worked for me. It will take a while to get your money but you will get it back.


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## Risky Beesness

Since I purchased mine 5 months ago, I have filed a claim with my credit card company. They instantly credited the money back to my account, but pending a resolution. 

I am really hate all of this and all I really want is my bees. I am lucky in that I have already acquired some bees from other sources. I especially feel sorry for anyone who purchased their 1st bees soley from these guys, and are now having trouble getting started this year. I wish Busybees the best of luck but they are going to have to start by improving their communication skills and the way they handle a crisis. Nobody wants to deal with controversy day after day, when things are not going well, but that's the time it is needed the most. You can't just hide your head in the sand.


----------



## BoilerJim

My 10 year old daughter had a huge interest in beekeeping. She was so interested she used her own $120.00 she had saved from birthdays, chores, and Christmas. Ordered a 5 frame NUC on March 2nd. She still has no NUC. I got a hold of Rory 2 weeks ago and he said he was close to mailing them out. Now he won't answer emails nor phone calls and his voice mailbox is full and won't take messages. Hard way for a child to get started in beekeeping.


----------



## lpruss

So sorry to hear about your problem Jim. I also bought bees from them as my kids are interested in beekeeping as well. I was fortunate in that I was able to get some bees from someone else, whom apparently order from Busybees early in the year (so I know they can deliver them) and picked them up from the BusyBees location. I've started the dispute process in PayPal to get my money back for the order that I submitted directly to them weeks ago. I hate to do that, as it's possible they have something going on in their family, on vacation, or something else - but there's a limit to when you can submit a dispute with PayPal. The lack of communication from BusyBees is frustrating. At a minimum they should update their website and return emails if they happen to be on vacation or something.


----------



## Vfox

I've filed a claim with Paypal. The June 4th shipping date came and went and no bees have arrived. I'm going to try and get my money back and be done with it. Their communication is appalling and I hope they have learned something from their business venture. I certainly have...buy local, drive hours if need be, but buy local. If you can meet the person in real life and not on the internet you're much more likely not to get stiffed. Good luck everyone.


----------



## libhart

Vfox said:


> If you can meet the person in real life and not on the internet you're much more likely not to get stiffed.


Not to change the subject....but only sort of true. Paying them on the internet via paypal is the only reason you have the option to dispute. Had you paid in cash straight to them, you'd not have any way to get it back short of small claims court.


----------



## Vfox

libhart said:


> Not to change the subject....but only sort of true. Paying them on the internet via paypal is the only reason you have the option to dispute. Had you paid in cash straight to them, you'd not have any way to get it back short of small claims court.


Oh I'm well aware of that, it's why I used paypal to begin with instead of a check. I've been buying and selling coins on eBay for years and I know it's always risky to deal online. I was hoping beekeeping would have been a little more easy to deal with. So like with my other purchases/interests I'm going to stay more local.


----------



## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

libhart said:


> Had you paid in cash straight to them, you'd not have any way to get it back short of small claims court.


I paid cash (which I rarely do) and recieved a refund a week after I requested it. I dont think they are crooks.


----------



## Lennes

Looks like they updated their website. Took their phone number off. Email not working, no way to get in touch with these people. Looks like I am out of my package bees and money.


----------



## Desert Viking Ranch

It is so disappointing to hear of so many companies selling bees that seem to be having issues communicating with their customers. It seems like almost every day I can find someone blasting a supplier on these forums for not being able to contact them.

In this day and age there is NO excuse for not staying in contact with your customers...none, zip, zero, ziltch. If you cannot contact your customers in 48 hours or less then you should not be in business. If you disagree let me know and I will gladly point out several ways you can accomplish this for free and/or using the resources you already pay for. :thumbsup:

I understand that you can't just pick bees off a stockroom shelf and everyone buying bees should realize that delays (even long ones) are a part of the "beesiness". Ofcourse orders should not extend to previous seasons - that's a bit too long. That being said, if you have to tell your customers repeatedly that there are delays then DO IT. Removing your phone number or not responding to emails does nothing but generate suspicion and doubt. :no:

I have started to compile a list of companies mentioned here that people have a hard time communicating with (not delays in receiving orders). This is for my own use right now but I may provide it on the forums at a later date.


----------



## Desert Viking Ranch

Just to be fair I have also been maintaining a list of companies mentioned here that buyers have had positive experiences with too :thumbsup:


----------



## kard99

I've been watching this thread all along from the beginning - I'm in the same boat with everyone else. Ordered 1 package in March, sent a check, got all the mass emails about the delays, waited patiently, finally sent emails - no response, can't call as the voicemail is full, and no bees. I waited (without much hope) for the June 4 date as stated on their website, it's come & gone with no bees and no response to email requests for a refund. I looked at the website yesterday and if you clicked on ordering a 2011 package, it stated that packages were only available now for pickup in Douglas, GA. So obviously no bees will be delivered to anyone who is waiting. Now today I do see they've updated the website. In addition to removing their phone number, they've added options for refunds and credits for next year on packages and nucs. If you click on 'Customer Survey' in the left hand column, you now apparently have an option to 'purchase' a refund or credit towards next year for 1 cent! Unbelievable. I've been patient and I understood the delay problems but I don't like being jerked around like this and I'm fed up. This has to be the worst business transaction I've ever been involved in. It galls me no end to give them even 1 penny but if that's what it takes to get my refund I'll do it. I'm skeptical that 'ordering' a refund will get my money back... we'll see. They must be nuts if they think anyone is going to trust them for a credit towards next year. Lesson learned.


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## lpruss

Glad you received your money back. However until I receive mine, I'm going to remain skeptical. It's been a couple weeks now and still no refund. No returned calls, no emails, no nothing.


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## kard99

Well, I didn't get my money back yet - about an hour ago, I 'ordered' my refund for 1 cent from their website. I paid my penny via Paypal. I'll post here again when/if I do get my refund in this manner. They never replied to any of my emails either and have not contacted me at all since the last 'update' mass email about delays which was April 29.


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## Risky Beesness

Well, I guess I don't get it. Are you paying .01 to get your money back, or are you paying it to use the credit for the nucs that were not delivered this year, on 2012 nucs? I guess I will let Visa sort it out with them.


----------



## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

That is bad, no phone, email etc. Maybe thats the only way to contact them for a refund....buy one!


----------



## Risky Beesness

Things that make you go HMMMM! Just noticed that their Italian / Carniolan Nucs that I paid $120 for back in Jan, are now listed at $175, with shipping starting June 2011.


----------



## FindlayBee

Caught this from a cached Busy Bees Apiary Page.
http://www.fortune3.com/rorywb/Products-Gardner_s_Apiaries.html

Busy Bees Apiaries 
775 Green Willow Dr. 
Douglas, GA 31535 
United States 
Ph: 814-591-7475 
e-mail: [email protected]


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## kard99

As ridiculous as it sounds - Yes, I am actually paying them 1 cent to get my money back. I figured it was worth a try since I'm getting nowhere with them otherwise, since they absolutely do not respond or communicate in any way. This is for a 3 lb package, not a nuc.


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## mythomane

NorthernIllinoisPlumber said:


> That is bad, no phone, email etc. Maybe thats the only way to contact them for a refund....buy one!


I guess I do not understand why someone would have to ask for a refund when the seller cannot deliver. Why is he just not issuing everyone a refund that did not get their bees instead of posting a "Where is my refund?" button on his website? Answer: He does not have the proper bookkeeping records and therefore does not know -- in addition to hoping that many people will just give up and not put in for a refund so that he gets to keep the money. If he really had more orders than he could handle, he has enough money to pay someone to man the phones, get the paperwork in order and clean up the mess. How are you going to run a business without a phone line? Instead of apologies, all I see are veiled threats and excuses from this guy. Time to call the DOJ.


----------



## Risky Beesness

So how many people on here actually got their bees from them, how many got a refund, and how many are still trying to get a refund? 

Also when was your last communication with them, other than the mass emails.

I am still owed money and I haven't received any replies since March. They are still selling the same nucs that they couldn't deliver to me, for $55 more than I paid, showing availability June 2011. That really burns me.


----------



## kard99

Risky Beesness - I am still trying to get a refund. They never communicated with me personally; I only got the mass emails that were sent out to everyone.


----------



## sqkcrk

Nice looking website and pretty ambitious for a beekeeper w/ only three years experience. He stated that he overbooked. An understatement from the way it looks.

I noticed that the $175.00 nucs are supposedly Small Cell. Does that account for the price or is it all demand?


----------



## Lennes

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Looks like they updated their website again. Now there is no penny charge for refunds. Wonder if I will get a refund of my penny with my package refund? LOL Seems like they can take the time to update site but not contact customers or explain anything.


----------



## PCM

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Pay a penny for your refund ??

I'm not a attorney, however I believe that penny maybe a legal continuation of the written/oral contract, possibly a legal out for them.

Something don't make sence.

PCM


----------



## Desert Viking Ranch

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*



PCM said:


> Pay a penny for your refund ??
> 
> I'm not a attorney, however I believe that penny maybe a legal continuation of the written/oral contract, possibly a legal out for them.
> 
> Something don't make sence.
> 
> PCM


It could also be something as simple as their webstore software requires an amount in order to "add it to the cart". In this case they opted to make a store item called "refund" and they had to put an amount for it other than $0.00 because it wouldn't be accepted.

I am just speculating, I don't know for sure. They use Fortune3 for their webstore software and I am not familiar with it. I know I wouldn't do that on my web stores as there are other methods, but sometimes its not as easy.

...as of this morning it appears that the "refund item" is now set to $0.00


----------



## lumberb

I only found this thread on Monday and it has given me piece of mind not to be in this boat alone. I placed my order on March 9th, spoke to Rory twice in March, sent a check for over $500, and never heard from him since. I'm relieved to hear that he is in business and making some sort of effort to refund monies and deliver product. I sent numerous emails, made phone calls to him, as did everyone else after a month went by with no contact. I was quite sure I had been swindled; it is unimaginable to me that someone couldn't call back a prepaid customer for over two months!
I just placed an 'order' for my refund on his site. I teach customer service amongst other things and this has turned out to be an abysmal experience, one that I am sure to cite come Spring Semester.
I am willing to ease back a bit and give him the Benefit of the Doubt for another week before my certified letter gets mailed.


----------



## Risky Beesness

Got a mass email today. It offered several options for undelivered nucs and packages, one being a refund. Filled it out and got an automated confirmation.

Here's the email in case you didn't receive it.



> We are contacting you to let you know that we interested in working with you as a customer to help you achieve your beekeeping goals. Some of our customers have been or are still effected by the trouble we were having filling some of our orders. Problems originated with our package bee supplier delays compounded now by late shipping dates which we have found temperatures too hot to ship. After several losses we've decided not to ship anymore bee packages, nucs or hives this season.
> 
> It has been our desire to provide bees to our customers as soon as they are available. So for this reason we are offering a credit for next season to customers who wish to not spend any more money on next season's assured higher prices and have their bee order locked in now. Despite whatever feelings some new or hobbyist beekeepers have based on only part understand of the dire situation our nations bee supply has been in, we all need to bare some of the burdens if we plan to save our bees on any reasonable level to meet the demand. I have talked to some suppliers that are cutting back this next season, I view this as a good thing if they will focus an extra effort on improving the quality of their stock. However is will surely put a further strain on supply.
> 
> This season we had only one package bee supplier who had long delays which caused other operational problems and increased costs. Next season we will be producing some of our own package bees of the highest quality and will also have at least two other suppliers. This will help avoid the major delays experienced this season. Select from one of the options below if you still have open order issues and select the choice that will best meet your needs on how you'd like your order filled.
> 
> If you are one of our many customers that did receive your bees please let us now how things are working out. This is very important to us as we have hived some of the same packages that we shipped to you from our first lot in March. All of those queens superseded and others followed as well until we re-queened with new stock from another supplier. We need to know if this was only due to early queens or if there may have been a poor production issue later in the season as well, as we need to further evaluate this particular supplier. eMail: [email protected]
> 
> Lastly I wish to paint this next issue with a broad brush as I do not want to point any fingers or offend anyone. On the home page of my website all season I have had posted this statement, (We offer great products with good old down to earth friendly service). I wish to continue to post this statement but to do so some changes are in need in part because of the demands of the customers ordering one to four packages. I have realized that it is impossible for me to do so as a family man by myself. From this time forward I will have to devote most of my time to production and quality product delivery. I must insure a higher standard from our own bee stock that can live in the difficult world of mites and pesticides. I will have hopefully good employees that will meet the need for the (good old down to earth friendly service).
> Our change in business operation is the reason for next seasons sharp increase in prices. I realize that I will loose may customers but when it is learned that our bees thrive compared to those that die, we aim to win many back with our bottom line cost. One more thing on this note, the wholesellers across the board are saying that their prices will rise again next season. Their prices for this season where hiked $5 to $10 across the board while distributors healed fast for the most part. So look for everyone to be raising prices on next seasons bees.
> 
> 
> 
> Credit for 3lb Package 2012 Season
> Package Replacement
> 
> Credit for Nuc 2012 Season
> Nuc Replacement
> 
> 
> Credit for Hive 2012 Season
> Hive Replacement
> 
> 
> Credit for Bee Hive Equipment
> Hive Equipment
> 
> Customer Refund
> For Package Bees, Nuc, Hive or equipment.
> 
> Bottom line its time to look to next season as the commercial pollinators are, the hobbyist should as well. Because hobbyist beekeepers suffer from distractions and discouragement, this can do more damage then mites and other things that commonly plauge bees. You need a system that operates a year ahead of schedule for assuring you have an overstock of bees, supplies and knowledge to achieve you objectives.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> 
> Rory Boleware
> Busy Bees Apiaries


----------



## steventerry11

The reason I am upset is that I called them and got ahold of them around may 15 asking if they still had bees and they told me they did and the best way to order was online. Then they disappeared off the face of the earth for a while. I wish I would have found this forum first. Meanwhile Paypal was really easy to call up and get a refund with!


----------



## JimK

I guess I wonder if there are a few impatient people out there. I have found that in Beekeeping for over 35 years that patience on one of the needed things needed for this endeavor.
I ordered two packages of bee's they were late. Ok this happens.

Rory, 
Refunded my money without me even asking.

Later he called me to ask if I still wanted them. I did.

He met me and delivered the packages. Last two on his trunk. I think he made a special run to deliver them to me.

The packages were as ordered, hardly any loss and the bees are doing well even if late.

Am I happy with his service. YES.
Will I order from him again. YES.

Good Bee's and Good Price.

I think the problems with weather and the fact that Rory is fairly new to the field added to the late delivery. 

In this "I WANT IT RIGHT NOW" Generation some people have not learned to relax, watch your bee's and follow their lead. 

Just My thoughts.


----------



## steventerry11

I don't think anyone is upset about delays in getting bees I have been very fair and patient with busy bees and if they would call me back and say "I am sorry but we can't ship bees anymore this year" I would've still been satisfied, but instead they just avoided me. That shows me that they are either ripping me off or they are just as responsible and accountable as a 5 year old.

I think most of the older generations realize that in a world of telephones and cell phones and email there is never an excuse for someone running a business (that already has your money) to not communicate with you.

And of course your happy you got bees specially delivered to you.. I would be very happy with his service if that was my case. Unfortunately you are the minority here.


----------



## casper_zip

*Busy Bee Apiaries Thankyou !!*

Kudos to Rory and Tanya of Busybee Apiaries. I got my package of bees from them, and as I installed them, my queen was dead in the cage. Only one live bee in there. 

I called and talked to Tanya, and told her my problem. She stated a queen would be shipped ASAP. This was on a Tuesday, and Friday, I placed my new queen in her cage into this hive.

These people are super to do business with and are honest. I am greatly impressed, and will order more bees from them. Some of my friends here have been ordering them on my recommendation. By the way, these are the most gentle bees I've ever encountered, and they are super workers, even tho we are in a sever drought down here.

All the best,

casper_zip


----------



## LtlWilli

*Re: Busy Bee Apiaries Thankyou !!*

Sounds like really good folks to me. Not all are as nice. For the most part, anyone who's been around a while will know to be cordial...It's good business.
LtlWilli


----------



## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

"In this "I WANT IT RIGHT NOW" Generation some people have not learned to relax, watch your bee's and follow their lead."

Read the posts before you. Then you will know what the problem is.


----------



## Lennes

*Re: Busy Bee Apiaries Thankyou !!*

Seems you are one of the few that got what was paid for. Many, many more of us still waiting for orders placed in march and april.


----------



## CharlieN

NorthernIllinoisPlumber said:


> Read the posts before you. Then you will know what the problem is.


I agree. After reading all the posts it's very apparent what the problem is.


----------



## CharlieN

I've helped several newbees install packages from Busy Bees this year. In all cases but one, the packages were in exceptionally good condition and are building up very well although they were received later than was planned.


----------



## steventerry11

Peoples I am so stoked... I couldn't get bees from busy bees. But I just caught a swarm last night!! I then installed them. They were fast asleep this morning. These are my first bees.. I know this is probably not the right place but if you have any advice let me know!!


----------



## Vfox

steventerry11 said:


> Peoples I am so stoked... I couldn't get bees from busy bees. But I just caught a swarm last night!! I then installed them. They were fast asleep this morning. These are my first bees.. I know this is probably not the right place but if you have any advice let me know!!


Cool man, I just got a Russian Nuc last night myself. As for BBA, still no refund...


----------



## Risky Beesness

steventerry11 said:


> Peoples I am so stoked... I couldn't get bees from busy bees. But I just caught a swarm last night!! I then installed them. They were fast asleep this morning. These are my first bees.. I know this is probably not the right place but if you have any advice let me know!!


Looks like we have 3 things in common. I couldn't get my bees from Busybees either, I caught my 1st bees this year as a swarm, and I will be in UT in a couple weeks. Staying in Sundance for 3 days then headed to Vernal to raft the Yampa River.


----------



## Lennes

Just checking- has anyone gotten refund with the last email that was sent from Busy Bees? Placed my refund request on the 8th and havent heard a word from them either way about refund.


----------



## Risky Beesness

No, but I got notice from my credit card that they have creditted my account for the claim I filed with them a week ago.


----------



## lumberb

I got an immediate response in terms of them sending me the equipment part of my order. Equipment that I already sourced from somewhere else (it has been over three months since my original order). Stuff that I wanted refunded now, was sent to me and included over $60 in shipping!!! No one contacted me, they just sent it. I put in for a full refund and now things are worse.
Rory might be a realy nice guy, but this is ridiculous


----------



## lpruss

I've been waiting a few weeks for a refund. Talked once on the phone, left messages on the phone before their voicmail filled up, offered to work something out wuth them, etc. Still no response and no refund. Finally pursing a dispute with PayPal.


----------



## Lennes

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

UPDATE, seems Busy Bees took thier refund link off of website. Seems like he was getting way to many requests for refunds. Still have my original request in for refund and nothing yet to date. No money and no email responses.


----------



## mythomane

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

For all those that paid with a credit card or paypal, just file a dispute. You will get your money. He cannot provide evidence of delivery.


----------



## Vfox

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*



mythomane said:


> For all those that paid with a credit card or paypal, just file a dispute. You will get your money. He cannot provide evidence of delivery.


I got my refund through paypal yesterday. Still absolutely ZERO communication from Rory. He has burnt so many bridges with his lazy attitude towards his customers. I don't wish him ill but I would never recommend anyone ever using him as a supplier. Bad supply chains didn't ruin things for him, his lack of communication and disregard for his patrons did.


----------



## Lennes

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Three weeks from last email from Busy Bee and still no word from them on refund.


----------



## lpruss

Never received any response from anyone at Busybees other than a mass reply a few weeks back. Palpay credited my account after pursuing the dispute. PayPal tried contacting them with no response; thus Paypal processed the refund.


----------



## kard99

Same for me; I ordered my refund on June 6 - so far no refund, no response other than the same mass email and an automated email receipt for my refund 'order'. Unfortunately I originally paid them by check rather than credit card/Paypal.


----------



## twd8711

sounds like the man spent to much money from the refunds and doesnt have it to pay back, what a shame, this year has sure changed the bee business, some people see big dollars and just have to get in the market not understanding or caring about the product or the customer. and then there are decent suppliers who are so overwhelmed with business and they seem to have communication problems as well as timely shipping, im not one to complain much and i understand that things happen in the ag business but no communication leaves people up in the air on how to plan. my lesson this year is the smaller the operation the more likely your order will be on time and a quality product.


----------



## Lennes

Seems to me if he is still selling nucs for the summer he would have money for the refunds. I understand all problems with being a business. But like you said, with no communication how can you plan?


----------



## Beecatcher1

I placed an order for a nuc in spring for possible March/June delivery and received a confirmation of payment. Then received no further e-mails.I tried to check the status of my order with little or no information provided at that page.The phone # given for contact is disconnected in Pa. and the #given on their website for Ga. is 000-0000.I have sent several e-mails and got no response.Finally in mid June I found a page offering a refund or early re-ordering for 2012 spring season.I chose to re-order against my basic instinct which is telling me that this might not be a legitimate business.I had hoped to establish a business relationship with them in order to introduce some new genetics into my current bee population.I've been fortunate enough this year to have captured two swarms and have located two existing hives for extraction next spring so the only detrimental effect not receiving my order has had is that I'm out the money.I still have had no rep. contact me by phone or e-mail concerning my order and to date(7/20/11) have nothing to show except a new order confirmation with a new date.I am trying to be hopeful that my order wont be lost and will arrive in spring 2012.


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## mythomane

I wouldn't hold my breath. Reverse the charges on your card and order from a reputable supplier. Avoyelles is not that far from you.


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## Lennes

Still nothing from this guy


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## kard99

Same here. Nearly 2 months since I 'ordered' my refund on his website - nothing, no refund, no response.


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## Beecatcher1

Still no contact whatsoever from BBA,but I see they still have a website up and running.No success with PAYPAL on refund,something about 45 day limit.Hmmm,I bet BBA knew about that. Would explain the stalling and lack of communication.


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## Risky Beesness

Sorry to hear about your misfortunes. I filed a claim with the credit card i used, and they refunded the money immediately, pending further investigation. I suppose unless they (BBA) can prove the charges were legit and that they delivered the product as advertised (not happening), the refund will stand. Got two more nucs through Beeweaver and closed this chapter.


----------



## Stephen

Beecatcher1 said:


> It Has come to my attention through govt. law enforcement authorities that BBA is an offshore /overseas op/scam. As of today the website is still up and running. If there is any way to get the word out to the beekeeping community about this scam it should be done. Anyone with the ability to reach out with this information please spread the word.The positive posts about BBA are either fake or are about the other BBA that I don't know anything about. Good luck to all and lets keep watching out for each other.


I call shenanigans. I was one of the lucky few to get my money back but I don't believe Rory and his wife had intentions of scamming folks right out of the gate.


----------



## hpm08161947

775 Green Willow Dr.
Douglas, GA 31535

I wonder if there is anyone close to this Address of BBA who could confirm or deny their existence?


----------



## Beecatcher1

I don't really have time to be spreading rumors and would have preferred not to be involved in this at all.


----------



## beemandan

I suspect that 'busybee' is about as common in beekeeping as Smith is in the US.
Frankly, I was concerned that there might be others with my apiary name.......


----------



## dragonfly

Beecatcher1 said:


> I don't really have time to be spreading rumors and would have preferred not to be involved in this at all.


If this is the case, then I would suggest posting your personal experiences with the business in question, per the title of the thread. If you have some kind of link or other proof of the experience with legal authorities as you stated, then you might consider posting it so that others can make up their own minds.


----------



## Beecatcher1

good morning to all, Let me try again. I ordered 1 nuc from BBA of Pennsylvania on 4/10/11 @ 12:21 PM at a cost of $166.43 which was promptly drawn from my personal account via debit card.I then received no further communication from BBA of Georgia or BBA of Pa. On 6/15/2011 @ 8:40AM I went to their website to see what I could find.I found a statement explaining various delays and reasons for lack of shipment and a brief paragraph chastising those who were impatient about their orders not being shipped.Keep in mind I had had no communication with or from BBA of Ga. for over 60 days. I believe I had been patient. I also discovered a page offering refunds for your order or an opportunity to place an advance order at no extra charge for the 2012 season. So being patient and understanding of the agricultural situations and the nature of the business I placed my order for the 2012 season. Later I then discovered this forum. Still all the while no communication from BBA of Ga. not even a confirmation.Some posters suggested I might be a tad gullible. That's my story


----------



## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

I have spoken with Rory and his wife. I paid cash, and received a refund. Check out my problem posts from earlier.


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## Lennes

Just wish I could talk to them and get a refund. Have tried everything to get one.


----------



## Lennes

Sad news, looks like Busy Bees web site isn't coming up.


----------



## cgriffin

Yeah, main site is down. The place then renamed itself Liberty Bees Apiary, and went cash/check only. They still use the same payment clearing services up and running though. My bank refuses to refund me because I waited longer than 60 days. (I ordered in early March and got strung along by Rory until June)


----------



## cgriffin

I have left word with Gena at http://www.fortune3.com/ who is their hosting provider. Hopefully something will happen, I left my name and number with them for Rory Boleware in case he wants to resolve this as just a misunderstanding. 

Note that buybeesnow was registered to a Huck Fin

If I do not get some resolution I will contact Level3 who is their providers provider and have the IP disabled.


----------



## libhart

Actually it's registered to "Huck Finn Inc." which some more searching shows to be Rory's original trucking business, so the registration isn't really bogus.


----------



## cgriffin

Although fortune3 doesn't have the best reputation, I know level3 will take interest in this. 


I have collocated with them before and they have a fairly active abuse department.

I will give it a couple of days for fortune3.com to act


----------



## Lennes

A direct quote from his web page after you select an item to purchase " Liberty Bees Apiary is pleased to introduce for the 2012 bee shipping season a solution for the long list of beekeepers who have not gotten their packages as they have wished. Until now there has been no reasonable assurance of desired delivery dates despite what any of us say (suppliers & distributors). Who's fault is it? I have given this question much thought and have decided that it is the fault of the beekeeper for desiring just-in-time-delivery without considering or paying for a system to deliver on demand. Who's fault is it? It has also been the fault of the supplier because of over booking packages with too many shakes from a limited number of hives."

Blaming the beekeeper when he isnt worried about the ones he stiffed by not delivering product.


----------



## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

That quote is amazing...further down is this: 

"If you the beekeeper will persist with your demands and expect to acheive your objectives in the coming years then you must take matters into your own hands and drastically over stock and over winter extra hives or let me and others that will follow provide a custom service just for you."

...but if you do (let me provide), and dont get bees, then its your fault.


----------



## NDnewbeek

So.....if I pay a plumber or electrician (in advance) for a 'custom service' and they never show up to do the work - that is my fault. Do I have that right? 

That is deeply flawed logic.

Two points:

1. I can't imagine that, regardless of what someone puts on a website, that any court or legal entity would find any validity in that statement. If you agree to provide a service and take money for providing that service, you are legally and contractually bound to make good.

2. Going forward, I would think that you would have to be crazy to buy bees from this company (given those conditions).

But I will definitely include this information in my annual package and queen supplier list.

Mike


----------



## cgriffin

Thanks Mike, 
Please continue to do whatever you can to make it hard for this guy to "do business". Ripping off one struggling beekeeper is too much and this guy has done that to many more than one.


----------



## Risky Beesness

Let's see how that business model works for him. Never owning up to his mistake, and blaming the buyer. Where is the money he was paid. I was one of the lucky ones that paid by credit card, filed a claim, and was reimbursed by the credit card company. Fortunately there are many reputable sellers out there, and thankfully there are forums like this where these bad dealings can get reported.


----------



## Lennes

Even more from Rory, quote from web site "NOTE: Items are not refundable"


----------



## libhart

I wonder though if that's a defendable position on an item that he never delivers. Oh well, something tells me he'll have a lot fewer customers to worry about next year. (In the interest of full disclosure, I was one of the lucky ones who received my package, I believe because I'm local and could drive to get it. I won't be ordering again after all the stories.)


----------



## Ben Franklin

If you really dig deep and read the terms you will see that you can't visit his/her site without being liable for not following his/her contract. Yes you have a contract if you visit or browse his/her site.

WOW talk about user friendly.

They are off my Christmas Card list for sure.

BTW I was in business for many years and never saw such a Unfriendly site.


----------



## Stephen

Seems to me he's covering his tail this time... After getting away with it the first time. I'm glad the bank was able to get my money back. He sure had great customer service when my banks fraud agent called him. I sure hope no one else gets suckered.

He taught me a lesson about packages for next year... If I can't get them local or within resonable driving distance I don't get them.


----------



## FindlayBee

File complaints with his State Attorney General for "failure to deliver". Packaged bees had 2011 delivery dates setup, and those dates have clearly passed. Product was not delivered within a reasonable time frame. Even if he has legal wording on his website stating that you agree to his terms by visiting his website, by purchasing 2011 packaged bees, it was implied that those bees were to be delivered in 2011, and not some future year. By not delivering, he has breached his contract with his customers.

I gave his company the benefit of the doubt. Time has come to issue refunds.

Georgia State Attorney General's Office:
http://law.ga.gov/02/ago/home/0,2705,87670814,00.html


----------



## Lennes

We just need to keep reminding people of his business practice. Hopefully it will cost him more in future business than what he ripped us off.


----------



## StevenG

There are several extremely reputable companies from which to buy both packages and queens that aren't local. They can be trusted, and will ship. As long as we are willing to cut some slack due to the weather. I've personally dealt with R. Russell and B. Weaver, and would highly recommend them. 
Regards,
Steven


----------



## Lennes

We all need to find when he has a run next spring and show up at his stops and demand our money back.


----------



## Ben Franklin

Good Idea


----------



## Lennes

Looks like he filed bankruptcy, got my letter today. Changed name of business and then claimed bankrutcy. Slick operator.


----------



## Stephen

Lennes said:


> Looks like he filed bankruptcy, got my letter today. Changed name of business and then claimed bankrutcy. Slick operator.


I also received a letter. My bank refunded the money so I'm not sure why he named me as a creditor. Unless they are still after him for the funds they credited me.


----------



## sqkcrk

Why aren't these two Threads combined into one?


----------



## cgriffin

Got my letter as well and it appears buybeesnow.com is down.


----------



## gdog

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

I ordered bees (paid for them up front)from Busy Bee Apiaries of Georgia, May 23 ,2011. Was later advised the bees would not be shipped until the end of June because of weather. Well that too was changed they sent a email to apply for bees which would be shipped next spring (2012). I sent emails to Rory and Tanya Boleware and never got a response back. I was looking for their web site recently and now find that it does not exist. I am now out my money because I have no way of contacting them. Does anyone out their have a current phone number or email or know how I can get my money back?


----------



## nodrone

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Anyone in these 27 pages of threads stilled owed anything? I know there are several to be sure. Don't roll over on this thing! As sickening as it is to deal with get the system to work for us who got robbed. Whether you got a chap 7 letter or not contact the clerk or trustee in the case, but do it before Oct 18th. Let's make sure he doesn't get away with being a terrible business person. He never made any effort to make things right by me, that's for sure. Who other than a crook would remove all contact info from their web site?????, but still keep it open for new orders?


----------



## Risky Beesness

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

If you paid with a credit card, file a claim with them. That's how I got my money back.


----------



## cgriffin

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

I am still owed about 240$. He string me along for 60 days before I tried getting my money back and by then my ability to do so had run out. I got my bankruptcy letter earlier. It looks like it wants all info presented in person. What should I do and is there really a point anymore?


----------



## Risky Beesness

*Re: Busy Bees Apiaries Package Delay*

Probably more a matter of principle, at this point, since the bankruptcy. On the bright side, I see you are in Austin, and we have a very good responsible supplier here, where you can drive to their house and pick up your bees in person. Beeweaver


----------



## cgriffin

Ya I went with my local bee club group buy from Beeweaver. They would never than rip a club member off.


----------



## NorthernIllinoisPlumber

Anyone figure the new company name out? I am sure there will be one.


----------



## Lennes

Only thing I could find is this http://www.facebook.com/people/Rory-Boleware/100000463377248


----------



## mythomane

Glad to see there are others watching...


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## thomas

Tried him on face book and we talked and he said he would not be selling bees this year he was working on a more better bee to sell i do not know why he did the things he did do not get me wrong i am not trying to take up for him i mean it was wrong but i and a freind got packages from him and they were in great shape but all died and only one lived and i am building them up to split this spring.

thomas yancey


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## matt1954

I dont believe that Rory is a criminal as much as he was inexperienced about what he was encountering. I believe his heart was in the right place and perhaps he wasn't an experienced businessman. When he was confronted with what happened, he genuinely did not know what to do and had already spent the money. To his credit, I ordered 100 packages from him and all were delivered. 

I sell packages and the money stays in an escrow account until it is time to put a deposit down with the seller and make final payment to prevent any issues. This makes sure the money you take in is spent for what it is meant for. You don't want to play around with escrow money or Other Peoples Money OPM in Virginia. They will lock you up here in a heartbeat. Inexperienced or not, if Rory had his business here, I believe he would be doing the duffel bag drag to the penitentiary, bankruptcy or not. Incidentally, here in Virginia and probably elsewhere, bankruptcy doesn't protect you from a criminal charge. 

I like Rory, and wish him the best. Hopefully, everyone will be able to recover from this shortly.


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## Fishman43

His phone number is listed on this website. 912-303-7550


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## signalten

Wow, I had to leave a warning/comment on his Youtube page. We'll see how long that stays up there until he disables commenting...


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## StevenG

deleted by poster, error.


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## Risky Beesness

Still getting Bankruptcy notices as of today. I guess I am on the books as a creditor, although I got my money back.


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## cgriffin

got a notice of hearing today

case No 11-50789-JSD
Judge: John S. Dalis
Chapter 7

Debtors: Rory W. Boleware and Tanya Boleware

Feb. 23, 2012 @ 9:00 am
U.S. Courtroom, 3rd Floor, Federal Building, Carswell Street, Waycross, GA

Samuel L. Kay, CLERK
United States Bankruptcy Court
PO Box 8347
Savannah, GA 31412


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