# Mann Lake Frames



## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

I will NEVER buy any mann lake frames again. For one the wood is not a pine so it is not near as strong as western/dadant's. 
For 2 the top bars are WAY to thin. I loaded the jig full of end bars, nailed the top nails into the end bars, but when I went to nail behind the ears ALL the staples went through the end bars and into thin air. I had just finished a lot of dadant frames so I was used to their top bar. In the end i had to take all the frames out of the jig and staple the ear staples frame by frame.
On the other hand, mann lake boxes kick dadants out! They are really good...the commercial grade is like Dadants select!
Bottom line I will stick with dadant frames and mann lake boxes!!! 
Mike


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## beez2010 (Dec 9, 2009)

Thinner top bars increase winter survival rates by lessening the distance between honey stores when the cluster has to move up into the next box. I would prefer thinner top bars even though they might not be the easiest to assemble.

Maybe you could have lowered the regulated air pressure to your stapler?


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## acbz (Sep 8, 2009)

Just use shorter staples for the crossways staples under the ears. I used 1.5" for top/bottom and 1.25" or 1" for the ends. The length of that end staple doesn't matter for strength purposes. Just finished assembling 6500 of them so I'm familiar with the product. No complaints from me.


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

No...there aint any wood for the staple to dig into on the other side of the end bar....


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## FarmerJ (Feb 23, 2011)

if you look at the way the assemble them in the factory, they go the opposite direction. Can't say I agree with that move either.


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## Risky Beesness (Dec 29, 2010)

This topic is interesting to me because I just completed assembling my 1st 100 (ever) frames, which I got from Mann Lake. I only have one other manufacturer's frames to compare. I was just thinking last night how much better these frames are than the other brand. IMO, the Mann Lake's were far superior to the other brand, that I will not name. Stronger, thicker, and a much better cuts. Of course that is the extent of my experience in assembling frames and I have not purchased any from Dadant, yet. Lots to learn.


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## oldenglish (Oct 22, 2008)

I guess to each his own, but I use mann lake frames and like them a lot. I have never had an issue with the staples I use. I just use 1" for the whole frame. They are well made.


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

Does anybody have a good way to staple under the ears on the ML frames using Ross aka My Old Tools' jig?
mike


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## acbz (Sep 8, 2009)

Yes there is. You just have to angle the staple so that it shoots in at an angle. Your jig must allow room for you to do this. If it doesn't, the side pieces of the jig are too tall.


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## NDnewbeek (Jul 4, 2008)

I have a lot of different frames in my boxes - but I will say that it has been a LONG while since I bought Mann Lake frames (or any other woodenware from Mann Lake for that matter). I will still buy other products from ML, but nothing made of wood. 

I have found that the frames don't hold together as well as Dadant frames (I have frames from Kelly and Betterbee too - which I have also liked better than ML frames). I also got a couple of really poor quality supers from ML. Now, this order (frames and supers) was received several years ago, but the poor quality I received along with the ambivalent customer service (I called ML about the supers - nothing was done) convinced me that I was better off buying woodenware from other suppliers or building it myself.

That was just my experience.


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

Their wood appears to be a poplar or something like that. Its not pine thats for sure. It breaks much easier than Dadant/westernbee pine. The supers are great...the commercial grade is better than dadants select...
mike


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## The Honey Householder (Nov 14, 2008)

I just had them ship me 100 of there pre assembled, and the top bars are thinner then I remember. I marked the date on them and we'll see how long they last. Better try 100 before ordering 5000.


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## Riverratbees (Feb 10, 2010)

The best frames I have used is from kelleybees.com they are solid and strong and they are a little narrower than brushy mountain frames this is the only places I buy from had great luck with these frames. Strong top and bottom.


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## gregstahlman (Oct 7, 2009)

we have bought well over 150,000 deep frames from Mann Lake over the last 7 years. only had problems with their frames one year when they made the bottom bar really wide. for the most part, can't complain about the prices or design of the frame. personally i think it is the best frame on the market


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## Brent Bean (Jun 30, 2005)

I will have to vote the same as gregstahlman, when I buy frames I don’t even look at any other suppliers. I assemble mine with a brad nailer and glue all frames. And so what if they aren’t western pine? There are many other wood that are suitable for this application.


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## G B (Nov 6, 2009)

I have heard that they had some quality problems in the past, but several friends have used alot of them and so I went on their recommendation. I bought 7500 this year ,small potatos for alot of you guys but alot for me. Guess I wait and see. I purchased the assembled ones as I just dont have time to do it all myself...


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

They seem like good frames. I just cannot seem to get a staple safely into the top bar without shooting the legs below it. Guess i will have to redo my jig. 
mike


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## acbz (Sep 8, 2009)

Kingfisher Apiaries said:


> They seem like good frames. I just cannot seem to get a staple safely into the top bar without shooting the legs below it. Guess i will have to redo my jig.
> mike


Yes. Clearly your jig is the problem if you can't angle the nose of your staple gun up. if you get the right angle but the staple Pokes thru the top bar, you're using too long of a staple.
Sending this from a taxi in Qingdao china. How's that for global tech support?


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

We have been using 1.5 inch staples...guess i will switch back.
mike


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

Ive had it with these frames. The staples when in ok, only about half of the frames have legs sticking through the top. Problem is the top bar keeps compromising with 4 staples in each top corner....GRRRR....I have had about a 5-10% blowout rate....They just keep snapping. Their design clearly has flaws. On their part, a penny saved is NOT a penny earned. 
Mike


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## HONEYDEW (Mar 9, 2007)

Kingfisher Apiaries said:


> We have been using 1.5 inch staples... mike


 Theres your problem, I use 1.5s for building hives not frames. 3/4 inch with 1/4 crown for the top bars and bottom bars and 1/2 inch for the wedge and tight bond glue as well for everything..


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

Well the 1 inchers did the same thing....3/4 is too short...have had bottom bars drop on me :O
mike


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## gregstahlman (Oct 7, 2009)

when we use to assemble our own frames we used 18 ga staples that were 1 1/8 long and 1/4 in crown. put 2 staples side by side in the top bar and 2 side by side in the bottom bars. so that would be 4 staples in the top and 4 staples in the bottom. we have never put staples under the ears or glued anything and the frames last a lifetime. also helps to soak the tips of the end bars in water for 10 minutes or so


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## Kingfisher Apiaries (Jan 16, 2010)

Greg, I did not think to not staple under the ears....I have ALWAYS done it as I have pulled way to many top bars off frames....
Thanks


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## bevy's honeybees (Apr 21, 2011)

I have ordered frames/woodenware from 3 different places. I have a carpenter friend who helps me assemble, or rather I help him, and he said Mann Lake were the best out of the 3. I also am very pleased with the customer service. They get my highest vote on both of these and I've ordered different things from 3 other companies.


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