# Deformed Wing Virus & Varroa Coexisting



## Nordak (Jun 17, 2016)

JeronimoJC said:


> Question for TF folks. I understand one TF premise is to allow bees and mites to coexist in the hive. Presumably the bee colony has figured out how to keep the mite population below threatening levels. My question is in such scenario, how does the colony deal with deformed wing virus?


In a case where I saw DWV, I would requeen with bees that have shown resistance. This provides a two-fold solution, a genetically better queen and a much needed brood break from the mite pressure. You would need to give the colony a window of broodlessness before requeening. What I have done in the past is make them queenless, choose a comb from a hive whose genetics I want to incorporate and let them draw cells off of it. Destroy any unwanted cells at capped stage that exist in the DWV hive.

I guess the alternative to this would be to let them ride it out in hopes a supersedure would happen, which some would suggest. Really depends on how you would want to approach it.


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## Fusion_power (Jan 14, 2005)

Read the articles about Ron Hoskins in the UK who has bees that are infected with a low virulence form of DWV. His bees co-exist with both varroa and the variant DWV. I'm more in favor of developing bees with proven varroa resistance than to deliberately keep bees with low virulence DWV.

VSH and Grooming are mite resistance traits. Low virulence DWV is a tolerance trait. Resistance means reducing or eliminating the population of varroa. Tolerance means putting up with the effects of varroa infestation.

http://treatmentfreebeekeepers.co.uk/index.php/ron-hoskins-swindon-honeybee-conservation-group/


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## Nordak (Jun 17, 2016)

I have a hive right now that appears to have a fairly high mite population. They rolled a 6% infestation in July. Lots of uncapped, chewed nearly emerging brood. Spotty pattern. I inspected on a cloudy day, and not having seen young brood/Eggs I presumed they were exhibiting signs of PMS. No outward mite signs, no DWV, or crawlers which made me wonder. Yesterday with my wife, I was going to pinch the queen and introduce a cell I had on hand, and in the sunlight, it was a completely different scene. Where the spotty pattern existed, young larvae in royal jelly pools, eggs. It became obvious then while there were some definite mite issues, the bees by all other appearances appear healthy and strong, great patterns. Lots of stores. No signs of slowing down. Healthy well populated hive. I am going to let them ride it out, but by all appearances, while fairly heavily infested, they are handling it. Would this be an example of resistance or tolearnce? Both?


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## squarepeg (Jul 9, 2010)

i've noticed that when the bees come out of their summer dearth brood break and are beginning their late season brood up, there is more removal of (primarily drone) larvae and pupae. this generally lasts a couple of weeks and then seems to stop. 

i'm guessing this is some variant of hygienic behavior and that they are getting rid of mites have managed to accumulate over the summer. i may see an occasional dwv or crawling worker during this period, but again it seems to be pretty short lived and self limiting. 

overall i've not been seeing much impact on worker brood, nor am i seeing the colonies fail to build a strong enough winter cluser, with the exception of one colony that dwindled to a tiny microcluster a few novembers ago, and that one got shook out.


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## JTGaraas (Jun 7, 2014)

The most recent American Bee Journal, at page 966, (September, 2016), notes an international research group's determination that two (2) variants of deformed wing virus exists - one is more dangerous than the original virus strain. Supposedly, the more virulent strain is probably widespread in Europe, and accounts for different survivor results in regional results.


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## Nordak (Jun 17, 2016)

squarepeg said:


> i've noticed that when the bees come out of their summer dearth brood break and are beginning their late season brood up, there is more removal of (primarily drone) larvae and pupae. this generally lasts a couple of weeks and then seems to stop.
> 
> i'm guessing this is some variant of hygienic behavior and that they are getting rid of mites have managed to accumulate over the summer. i may see an occasional dwv or crawling worker during this period, but again it seems to be pretty short lived and self limiting.
> 
> overall i've not been seeing much impact on worker brood, nor am i seeing the colonies fail to build a strong enough winter cluser, with the exception of one colony that dwindled to a tiny microcluster a few novembers ago, and that one got shook out.


Very interesting and informative, thanks. This hive had pretty much uncapped all of the small patch of drone brood that was left, with the exception of 3-4 cells. Out of curiosity I uncapped them and found no mites. I suppose the lack of drone brood forced the mites to focus on worker brood, where then the bees removed most of them. A theory that makes sense based on your observations, but one that time will tell. This very well could have happened last year, but I am much more observant to what's happening this year. There is still so much variation between my bees, it's interesting to note the ways in which the resistance/tolerance is exhibited between them, as well as other differing behaviors. How can bees that by all accounts should be homogenous, exhibit such differing traits? I still don't get it. Lots to understand about my genetic pool here. I know I have introduced some of that, but not to an extent it should matter from everything I understand regarding bee genetics.


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## JeronimoJC (Jul 21, 2016)

Thank you all for your responses!


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Reduce the mite level and over time the hive will
show a lesser sign of the DWVs. I have not treat the bees since
late winter of last year. And gave them 2 brood breaks (timing is the key) with a new laying queen up to
this point. Noticeably the mites are less in all of my hives. Combine this with the
vsh and grooming bees they are almost mite free now. With the last round of the mated queens to
make some new winter bees the hives will carry through fine. I don't plan to treat with oav until next early Spring time again.
The hives that struggle to build up during the Spring time I know will be heavily infested with the mites. Those will be weeded out off my breeding program. So only select the queens that show a good resistant trait to graft.
Next season I will repeat this strategy again. The mites will always be here with the bees but at least
they are under control somewhat. This is what I wanted to control the mites while allowing the bees to co-exist with them to
build up the resistance. So far so good!


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## JeronimoJC (Jul 21, 2016)

beepro said:


> Reduce the mite level and over time the hive will
> show a lesser sign of the DWVs.


I was particularly curious about this. Thanks for your input.


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## 1102009 (Jul 31, 2015)

Thanks, dar, for giving this terms.


> VSH and Grooming are mite resistance traits. Low virulence DWV is a tolerance trait. Resistance means reducing or eliminating the population of varroa. Tolerance means putting up with the effects of varroa infestation.


I realize i often use them wrongly.

I have a question. If you see dwv could it be damage coming from mites sucking the hemolymphe ( in cell), directly damaging the development of the bee ,or from virus?


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