# A journey of my first Hogan trap out



## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

This just shows the inside of the adapter with the hole in the cardboard and a lady loaded down with pollen already using it.









After attaching the adapter I used "Great Stuff" (it really is!) in between the cardboard and the adapter. This serves two purposes for sealing. First it obviously seals between the adapter but it also expands pushing the cardboard better into the caulk against the tree. I then put up the stand that the body of the trap will sit on. Here is where i realized my first mistake. The platform is the size of a hive body yet the entrance to said hive body isn't in the middle nor does it go completly into the adapter. I'll let you figure out why this is a problem.


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## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

Not really sure why my pictures are posting sideways :scratch: oh well...









Now you can clearly see the error i made in the platform. oops. It'll work though. I fit the trap body into place. It is advised that you leave the adapter in place for a while so the bees can get used to using it but the weather is gloomy here and almost all the bees were inside so there wouldn't bee any field bees coming back not knowing where to get back in.









I put a lit on and used a ratchet strap to keep it all together. Ill check back in a few days to see if they are using the frames.

Things i would change so far... wider platform obviously. Drawn frames: being out of the game for 3 years means i have only rite-cell foundation in the frames. The supports for the platform: instead of screwing them in the bottom of the platform, drill a hole all the way through and use bolts with wingnuts so i can easily take them apart and put back together during transport.

Anyone else have any ideas/suggestions/improvements?


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## GaryG74 (Apr 9, 2014)

You might want to put a 2x4 under the front to take some of the weight once the foragers start filling the comb. It will get heavy fast and might cause issues the way the supports are at an angle. Maybe not, but a little insurance. 
Put the 2x4 straight up under your platform, attach a foot to it that runs horizontally. It will take a lot of weight, if you need the extra support. Good looking set up by the way. My biggest problem with trap outs is never getting the queen, even when I used a frame of young brood. Good luck and I'll be looking forward to your progress!


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## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

Thanks. I may just do that. I put a good deal of weight on the platform and it was pretty sturdy but i would really hate if they started filling it with nectar and it came crashing down. I am hopeful for getting the queen but not betting the farm on it. Ill have access to more queen cells than i could want in a few weeks though so it's not really a problem.


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## Stlnifr (Sep 12, 2010)

Very interesting keep us informed on your progress.


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## GOHoney (Jun 19, 2013)

Looking good. I have one setup and ready to start, but with the cold and windy weather over the last week I have been hesitant to trap any bees in my box. Have seen multiple nights in the low 30's and below. I am hoping to attach the box tomorrow.


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## popeye (Apr 21, 2013)

Nice looking trapout. They may chew through the cardboard and Great Stuff? I had to use some #8 hardware cloth(or you could use metal window screen) with black plastic over it attached with roofing nails on one I did last year. They chewed through the Great Stuff. It was going great for two weeks till farm hands burned tree and my trap "out". It was in a 130 year old graveyard next to farmers field.I didn't ask for permission from landowner either. It was secluded I thought. Well they pulled up their spray rig near graveyard and claimed the bees stung them. Lesson learned on that one. Sorry to ramble on on your post.


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## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

Thanks for the tip popeye. Ill keep an eye on the great stuff to see if they chew through it. They have a version that is supposed to stop insects. Maybe one day ill try that. Not sure if it is an insecticide in it that will kill them or a bitterant of some kind that they tastes bad. Anyway, I went out and checked the trap. It's been 24 hours and this is what i drove up to...

View attachment 17530


This picture was actually taken after I had opened the trap to see if they were crawling on the frames and what not. Very few were. There were actually more bees on the outside of the hive when i first got there. I was a little worried they were swarming when i first pulled up but i didn't see the queen and they were acting more confused on how to get home than swarmy. I put everything back together and i will leave them for maybe a week or so. We are supposed to have some good flying weather this week so maybe they will draw out some of the foundation. Im thinking maybe of ordering some HBH and spraying the frames with a sugar water/hbh mix.


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## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

*Re: A journey of my first Hogan trap out - update*

So I went and took a peek at the trap yesterday. When I first pulled up they were festooning on the top cover near the entrance. I slowly took the lid of and shook them in the trap. The bees did end up chewing a small hole through the cardboard so I put some screen mesh over it. I have a couple pictures but I'm not sure how to upload them when posting from my cell. 
Anyway, they have not started drawing any comb on the frames. I really wish I had some drawn comb and a brood frame. This may prove difficult. I did however spay the frames with some homebrew hbh so maybe they will draw some. I put in the cone to activate the trap. I will remove it in 3 days and hopefully some comb will be built. I figure they will have to so the foragers have storage room since they can't get back in the hive. I will try to get a brood frame from my neighbour and install it this weekend. If I can get a decent amount of nurse bees I will activate the trap again for 3 days then make a nuc with the trapped bees, any brood left in the frame and another borrowed brood frame with eggs so they can make a new queen. If all goes to plan, I'll be back in the bee business by this time next week!


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

*Re: A journey of my first Hogan trap out - update*

jayoung 21... It is very difficult to get the Hogan Method to work without a couple of frames of drawn comb in the beginning, and later a frame that has unsealed brood on it, (NO bees, just brood).

The theory behind this system is to fool the bees into thinking the trap is another brood chamber, just horizontal to the feral colony, not verticle. Without brood comb, (and plastic foundation makes it even harder) the bees will not normally move out into the trap until they need the room. Even then, they will most often use the trap as a place for storage of surplus honey. As long as they have ample room to expand in the original colony, there is no reason to move out into the trap. It may very well be that you will have to have some unsealed brood to get the nursebees, cleaners, fanners, housekeepers to come out into the trap. By now the guard bees should be at the entrance to the trap since this is the only entrance/exit. In the absence of drawn comb, and the introduction of unsealed brood, the hive will need to expand. As it does, you will have some cleaners come out to clean the trap and your frames.

You really need to find a couple of frames of brood comb. The brood comb will entice some field bees to store pollen and nectar in the trap, rather than take it all the way back into the feral colony. As a few starts doing this others will follow suit. At this point you may get some waxbuilders come out and start drawing on your foundation.

If you don't get bees to move out into the trap, there is one other way to speed this up. Install the funnel so that all bees that leave the trap have to stay in the trap, cannot get back to the original colony. Let this stay in place for a few days, (3 to 5) then open the funnel back up. By that time you should have lots of pollen and nectar in the trap and this will help to draw other bees out into your trap.

Check and see if there is a bee club near you, and try to get a couple of frames of drawn comb, and make arrangements for a frame that has some brood (no bees) on it. After you get your first hive established you will have drawn comb and access to unsealed brood. You should be able to get 2 to 4 starts each year from a good colony, even more with a big colony.

By the way, where is Martin Tennessee?

cchoganjr


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## Jcarlton (Jun 22, 2014)

Martin, Tn is close to the kentucky line east of Obion county.


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## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

Cleo, thanks for the advice. I've done quite a bit of research and read lots of posts you have written about your method. I did install the funnel 2 days ago when I sprayed the frames with home brew hbh. Figured it would force them to build comb in order to store pollen/nectar. We do have a bee club here but I'm not a member. There are very few beekeepers in this part of Tn. My neighbor just happens to be another one and I can get a brood frame from him but I am planting corn until dark every day so it's just a timing thing right now. I plan on getting a brood frame and installing it this weekend. 
Martin is in the NW corner of Tn, just south of Fulton Ky. It's flat and there's corn everywhere. It's like a little Iowa that doesn't get as cold. Lol


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

jayoung21

I sent you a Private Message.

cchoganjr


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## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

Im sorry Cleo but I don't see that I have a new PM. Maybe it's because I'm on my phone, I'm not sure. My email is [email protected] if you would like to email me.


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

I have sent you an e-mail.

cchoganjr


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## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

It's been a little while since i have updated so i figured i would check in for those that are following along at home. Last week I obtained two drawn frames and put in the trap. If you remember i didn't have any comb so i am trying unsuccessfully with foundation. So i put in the comb and activated the trap. I came back two days later just to kind of see what was going on and wow! They had completly filled 2 deep frames, every single cell, with nectar in less than 48 hours. Bees were everywhere. I went ahead and deactivated the trap to let the field bees back in the hive. 

This is a nice strong colony. This is one heck of a flow we have going on here. All the rain is paying off. Im almost starting to think i should just start putting supers on and collecting honey! ha. Anyway, i was digging about through some of my stuff and found a couple more frames that had some drawn comb on it. I went back yesterday and put in the comb frames and activated the trap again. I figure if nothing else i'll have several frames of nectar/honey to use if i do get to pull a nuc from this colony. I arranged to get a brood frame this week so hopefully in a couple days ill have some nice young nurse bees in the trap and will be able to start pulling nucs.

I do have a question though. I can easily capture several pounds of field bees, move them to my apiary and put in a new queen or ripe cell. Would be field bees revert back to house duties when the new queen started laying? Im thinking it would be kind of like a package installation but i have never made up packages. I assume they try to get nurse bees in them?


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## Jayoung21 (Jun 22, 2010)

It's now been a month since I started my trapout. The brood frame that i put in the trap really did the trick. The house bees came right out and started making queen cells on the frame. I pulled all the frames out of the trap and placed them into a sealed up hive and brought them home. There are several pounds worth plus they will have a new queen in a couple weeks. Ive got a feeder on to keep them going until they get going good. I am going to keep pulling starts out of the the tree for the time being and when they get weak ill go for the queen. It's been a great learning experience. I'm glad I am keeping bees again. I missed it more than i realized.

Gotta give a special shout out and thank you to Cleo Hogan, for his help and advice.


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## biggraham610 (Jun 26, 2013)

That's great man. I have one getting ready to start myself. I spoke with Mr. Hogan last week and he sent me his PDF. I'm going to attach the adaptor this week and give em a few days to get used to it. Wish mine was that low, Its about 15 ft up on a Old Farmhouse. Next to the chimney, so I'm told. Stopping by to put eyes on it tonight. Great to hear of your success, I'm looking forward to trying myself and will keep you posted. G


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