# Hive entrance of my combination SBB/Slatted-rack



## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

This is a short, 13 second, so-so video. 

The hives with these also have top entrances that have been used very little.

I prefer to have some congestion to help deter robbing.

http://s275.photobucket.com/albums/jj305/js06807/?action=view&current=MVI_8022.mp4


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## D Coates (Jan 6, 2006)

Interesting, thanks for sharing. What do they look like from the inside?


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

D Coates said:


> Interesting, thanks for sharing. What do they look like from the inside?



Here are a couple of pics:



















I made a couple of stands with pvc pipe for slats.


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## Omie (Nov 10, 2009)

Very nice. Nicely made too. 

I have slatted racks above my open SBBs too, but I just used commercially bought pieces and stacked them.


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

Another short clip from this past week:

http://s275.photobucket.com/albums/jj305/js06807/Hive Stands/?action=view&current=MVI_8081.mp4


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

Someone was inspired by my hive stand idea and made a simpler version for themselves.

http://stonemountaingeorgiabeediary.blogspot.com/2010/02/new-bottom-board-design.html


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## RiodeLobo (Oct 11, 2010)

has anyone tried to cut the slats to make a " V " shape on the top, so that any debris will fall through instead of stopping on the horizontal top of the slats?


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

I've never heard of triangular slats, but I have some stands with PVC pipe as "slats".


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## scdw43 (Aug 14, 2008)

Looks good.


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## valleyman (Nov 24, 2009)

Good pictures. I do not fully understand the benefit of the slatted rack. can you enlighten me? I have adopted one of your concepts in a way. I have put my entrance reducers in and intend to leave them. I might take them out during the heaviest spring flow. I also intend to cut out a 1" X 3/8" notch in the bottom of all my supers for entrances. This will not change the bee space between them. If I need to close them in the late summer/fall to prevent robbing a 2"X 3/4" X3/4"piece of sheet metal angle can be slid between the boxes.
What do you think?


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## raosmun (Sep 10, 2009)

I like the idea of one piece: slatted rack - screen - insert - lower intrance. But how do you clean the screen, or drag out dead bees, mid winter/early spring? Just wondering. :s


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

The screen slides out.


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## David LaFerney (Jan 14, 2009)

I'm trying a similar setup. The slatted racks are made just like hive bodies, and the slats just lay in the frame rests. The slats are made out of pieces that were rejected from making frames - slatted racks don't get extracted so they can be knotty.


















This is a medium nuc I'm using as a cell builder - the entrance through the slatted rack has a piece of excluder over it to keep out lost queens. I've also since put a drone excape cone next to the main entrance. I've just put this out and populated it so I don't know yet if it will work as planned. I swapped it into the location of a full size hive to load it up and it's amazing how many bees can go in and out through that small entrance.


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

I like the small entrances. 

And I like the unusual look as well. 

Some of mine have PVC "slats".


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## Scrapfe (Jul 25, 2008)

RiodeLobo said:


> has anyone tried to cut the slats to make a " V " shape on the top,...


In a previous thread I said I wanted to build a SR with slats 2-2.5 inches tall X .075 inches thick by 12.25 inches long. (8 frame size) But I wanted the slats between the SR side rails at a 45 degree angel, (creating a V shape from every viewing angle). Then leave a bee space of 5/16 inch between the top of the slats and the bottom of the frames provided the hive has a top bee space. Also I planed to use a two 2X4" 12.25 inches long with one narrow edge ripped on a table saw at a 45-degree angle. These two boards are installed flat wise with the wide side up. The fall off from these 2x4s would be triangular when viewed in cross section. These trapezoid boards replace the 1 inch board intended to encourage the queen to lay lower in the brood nest. A bee space of 5/16 inch is left between these 2x4 boards and the bottom of the frames.

Returning foragers would need to go at least 3 1/2 inches deeper into the hive, turn a sharp corner, with guard bees both behind their backs and above their heads, be recognized again, navigate a choak point, then climb a 45 degree slope to access the lower box's frames. Viewed from above this SR would look like a cheese grater or a file. Not only would this give the bees more area to hangout but it would provide the bees a way to organize a defense in depth to hopefully guard better against SHB intrusion. Hornets, wasps, yellow jackets, robbers, bumblebees etc. would be out of luck getting past this SR. During cold snaps in spring brood rearing I would expect to see bees clustered shoulder to jaw between the slats blocking drafts thus conserving warmth. 

Look at some of the medieval castle keeps and remember a dozen or so defenders, (3 defenders at one castle) often frustrated entire armies. 

I am under the impression that bees won’t use a flat board slanted at a 45-degree angel to build comb on, and that this is why long hives are built the way they are. Is this true?

Viewed side on my rack would look something like the crude sketch below.
*—*\\\\\ /////*—*


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

> I do not fully understand the benefit of the slatted rack.


I don't either if they are flat on top. I have heard of some people using dowels. I suppose PVC pipe would work but PVC in the hive?


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## Tia (Nov 19, 2003)

I've said it before and I'll say it again. . .I love my slatted racks. It's quite obvious that ventilation in the hive is greatly improved with slatted racks. . .no moisture in the winter and no bearding in the summer. Last year, instead of entrance reducers, I put robber screens on all of my hives. The girls really seem to like it. . .gives them a sense of security, I guess. They're much calmer when I mow in front of them and when my chickens jump up on the stand they don't get excited anymore like they used to!


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

> It's quite obvious that ventilation in the hive is greatly improved with slatted racks.


OK it is not obvious to me. How does it create more ventilation than an open bottom?


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## David LaFerney (Jan 14, 2009)

Bees tend to congregate on the bottoms of the combs. In a regular hive configuration without a slatted rack there is no space for them to do that. 

If you just gave them the extra space (by using a deep box with medium frames FE) they would probably build more comb on the bottom of the frames, and they they would be back to having no space to hang out. 

A slatted rack gives them space to hang out, but discourages them from building comb in that space. So it helps to prevent swarming and bearding. It also cuts down on drafts. At least that's the theory as I understand it. 

It's not a mite control device - at best it doesn't hinder the function of a screened bottom. Not much anyway.


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## David LaFerney (Jan 14, 2009)

Acebird said:


> OK it is not obvious to me. How does it create more ventilation than an open bottom?


It seems obvious by the behavior of the hives. You can find lots of pictures of side by side hives with and without racks and the hive without has a huge beard. It may not exactly improve ventilation (although you can also use them with a solid bottom in which case it probably does) but it accommodates the behavior of the bees. 

These have been around for a long time and most people who use them believe that they help to prevent swarming. Not scientific, but it kind of is a preponderance of evidence for what it's worth.

Of course lots of people think magnetic bracelets prevent arthritis.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

Thanks for the clarification.



> It also cuts down on drafts.


Well that is the opposite of increased ventilation so I guess it is not so obvious.


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## delber (Dec 26, 2010)

Ok My question. . . If you're using upper entrances instead of lower entrances does it still "accomidate bee behavior"? I've been planning on doing this also and have thought of several different ways. I want to use upper entrances due to skunk / mouse etc predation. Is the bee behavior simply to hang out inside the entrance so if anyone is using upper entrances then the top should be a slatted rack? :scratch:


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## David LaFerney (Jan 14, 2009)

I'm sure not an expert, but I would say that no matter what the slatted rack should go on the bottom if you use one. It's not a matter of the bees hanging out inside the entrance it's the bottom of the comb. 

I think I remember Michael Bush saying that he used slatted racks with hardware cloth stapled to the bottom along with top entrances.


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

It's getting busy at the contemporary ...

http://s275.photobucket.com/albums/...os/?action=view&current=standvideo4_11_11.mp4


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## Joseph Clemens (Feb 12, 2005)

Acebird,
The slatted racks can do both, reduce drafts and increase ventilation. Remember each bee is like a miniature power fan. They are respirating water vapor (increases humidity), metabolizing (creating body heat), blocking drafts with their bodies, and fanning their wings to move air around and through the hive as suits their needs. The slatted rack simply gives them a platform/perch where they can more efficiently perform these duties, and also provides space for bees to congregate in the relative safety of the hive, away from the combs of the brood nest or honey storage combs where their body heat or respiration might interfere with honey curing or brood rearing.


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## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

BeeCurious said:


> It's getting busy at the contemporary ...
> 
> http://s275.photobucket.com/albums/jj305/js06807/Hive%20Stand%20videos/?action=view&current=standvideo4_11_11.mp4



Beecurious - I am having a little trouble understanding the point of your videos - could you help me understand what your are trying to show? To me, it is just bees and an entrance to a hive. Over and over. What am I missing?


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

shinbone said:


> Beecurious - I am having a little trouble understanding the point of your videos - could you help me understand what your are trying to show? To me, it is just bees and an entrance to a hive. Over and over. What am I missing?


What's being shown, is an entrance that is different from most any other. The entrance is in the face of an assembly which combines a SBB with a slatted rack. 

The various short videos show different levels of activity.


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## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

BeeCurious - Thanks for the explanation. Should I be seeing a difference in activity in some way between a standard entrance and the entrance you show? Its a well-built and nice looking entrance in the videos, but I guess I am not picking up on the benefits of the entrance design . . . ?


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

shinbone said:


> I am not picking up on the benefits of the entrance design . . . ?


I made these in an attempt to combine a Screened Bottom Board and a Slatted Rack into one assembly. As mentioned in the first post, I would prefer to have a smaller entrance that is easier to defend against robbers and a 3/8" entrance fits nicely... 

I don't make any claims concerning the usefulness of SSB's or Slatted Racks but I have been pleased with what I built. Some of my "Contemporary Hive Stands" use PVC pipe as slats... 

If I make more (I have 8 now) I'll use 3/4" mahogany or oak for the front and back pieces to simplify the routing of the entrance and the slots for the screen and stickyboard.


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## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

Thanks for the explanation. Reduced entrances make sense to me. I use standard SBB, but I have the entrances reduced to half-width or less year round. I, too, like to see a little crowding at the entrance to ensure adequate entrance guarding. For me, at least, it is a rare hive that has a large enough population to adequately guard a full-width entrance.


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## Daniel Y (Sep 12, 2011)

Shinebone, You probably hit on the number one issue with full width entrances. many believe the typical entrance of a lang hive is far to large for any colony. Seldom do I see my bees so busy they can actually fill up that entrance. In fact about the only time I think I have seen a full width entrance really busy has been during orientation flights. Combine that with the entrances you might find on cut outs or locations of the bees choosing and often those entrances are extremely small. yet there are no ventilation issues. or I assume there is not.

I have started to look at various bottom boards. in order to select my favored one. I have always planed to start beekeeping and spend the first few years trying out different things in the interest of selecting the equipment I want to build entire apiary out of. bottom boards are starting to lag behind considerably. I am up to 21 hives and still have not done much to check out various ones.

I know I want a better entrance reducing system. possibly a small entrance such as this one. stick board and I would even like a method to feed the bees at the bottom of the hive as well.

I am not sure I want a full screen bottom. but a smaller entrance and some additional screened ventilation fro method bottom is probably a part of the entire design.

I am inclined to be more of experimenter than I am a production manager or profitable business type. I am now in the midst of deciding just how to build up my apiary to suit those pursuits wile still having it generate an income to support it.

Beecurious do you have any dimensions or drawings for your design? Making drawings is time consuming and one of the alternative skills that seems to go along with every primary talent. I see innovation as a talent and the ability to create those ideas and share them as the alternative skills needed to get it done. I would be happy to work on drawing in sketch up if I have a clear idea of the dimensions of your bottom board.

If there where some way to add a compartment to put a bowl of sugar water. it is right up there with my all time favorite designs. Nice craftsmanship as well.


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## shinbone (Jul 5, 2011)

A full width standard entrance, with a collection of various length wood strips to reduce the entrance down as necessary seems to allow the most flexibility to fine tune crowding/guarding.

Also, a SBB allows crowding at the entrance and hive ventilation to be adjusted independent of one another.


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## jmgi (Jan 15, 2009)

How about a slatted rack type device positioned on the very top of the brood chambers instead of the traditional bottom of the hive? It would have to be a redesigned slatted rack, different than what is currently sold. The slats would have to be a bee space apart and be approximately the same height as the whole slatted rack itself, so that you would have very nearly the correct bee space above and below the slats. An upper entrance slot (whatever width and height you want to make) would be cut into the front face of the exterior board of the slatted rack, and a bee space would be created behind the front board inside the rack so that the bees could go either upward or downward in the hive unobstructed. You would get extra clustering space between the slats, an upper entrance, and with the rack situated between the brood nest and the supers, it may serve as a barrier to the queen going up into the supers as easily if you don't use an excluder. You would also need to use a sealed bottom board under the brood chambers, or I guess if you wanted you could still have some sort of bottom entrance, I wouldn't in my case because of skunk problems. Any opinions good or bad about this idea?


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

the only thing I would say to watch out for is you don't want the bees thinking the slatted rack is the top of the hive.


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## jmgi (Jan 15, 2009)

Ace, so you would be afraid of the bees plugging out the brood nest with honey and not storing it above? The thought did occur to me too, but the only way to know for sure would be to try it.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

That is why I said what out for it.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>Well that is the opposite of increased ventilation so I guess it is not so obvious. 

Ventilation is limited and consistent. Drafts are gusts of wind that blow through. The right amount of ventilation is a good thing. Drafts are not a good thing as they are never the right amount. They vary between nothing and too much.


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## philip.devos (Aug 10, 2013)

valleyman said:


> Good pictures. I do not fully understand the benefit of the slatted rack. can you enlighten me? I have adopted one of your concepts in a way. I have put my entrance reducers in and intend to leave them. I might take them out during the heaviest spring flow. I also intend to cut out a 1" X 3/8" notch in the bottom of all my supers for entrances. This will not change the bee space between them. If I need to close them in the late summer/fall to prevent robbing a 2"X 3/4" X3/4"piece of sheet metal angle can be slid between the boxes.
> What do you think?


Rather than cutting your supers, you might want to consider building frames from 1 X 2 (or smaller) and putting the 1 X 3/8 notch in them. You may regret cutting your boxes later. It will alter your spacing slightly, but I think will be a better way to go.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>What do you think?

I think you'll regret the holes eventually.


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## Acebird (Mar 17, 2011)

A hole I am for, way easier to plug than an notch.


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