# Splits/Queens



## BDJ (Sep 27, 2009)

I only have one hive. It is healthy and strong and full of bees. Interesting enough it has done very well for 3 years without any treatment for mites or diseases and I got a real good harvest this year. 

So next spring I want to expand. But I have a large family and very limited budget for beekeeping. I have read about splits and queen raising and wanted to get some input. 

Is it possible to split one hive into five? It has two deep brood boxes and a western super full of bees. In the Spring it usually builds up quickly. 

If I do the splits, is it better to do the splits just making sure there is eggs and young brood in each new hive and let them raise their own queen or should I raise the queens and place the queen cell of the new queen in each hive. 

If I do the splits in late April (all factors allowing) will they have time to build up before fall. I plan on feeding extensively as long as needed. I understand the focus of the year will be bee expansion and I will probably not get any honey. 

Will this method work or should I find the money to buy new mated queens for each split? Lots of questions. Thanks for your input. 
BDJ


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## tecumseh (Apr 26, 2005)

I think??? you have come to the thinking that there are a lot of hazards....undefined in your mind since I would guess you have never done what you prepose before?

I cannot picture your location (east or west of the pacific range?) but a lot would depend on predicablity of the season and how long a season you might expect after splitting for the hives to allow them to recover.

you can of course split a hive into any number of parts (splits). my thinking works like this... if you want to have the hive make their own queens then limit the number of splits per box or if you want to maximize the splits per hive buy mated queens.

another 'way' is to drive the hive with feed early in the season and once their population has grown (and generally here right after you first notice a hive bearding) start looking for homegrown cells. allowed time for cells to be finished and sealed and then split based on the number of cell generated. anywhere in this time slot you can remove the old queen (for me anytime in this interval when I see her) + a few frames of feed and bees and set this aside say at least 30 feet away. if you have some idea of the age of these naturally generated cells you can split when the cell approach maturity but remember that non mature cell need to be handled gently (I would not move these via a truck or automobile or do anything that might rattle these unmature cells).


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## BDJ (Sep 27, 2009)

You are correct, I have never done this before. Good input, thanks.


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## beedeetee (Nov 27, 2004)

I grew up there (Cove). We had up to 40 hives and as I recall by late April they were just getting up to peak expansion mode but were not up to peak population until late May. 

I would think that 5 hives with your own queens would be too risky. Depending on how the spring has been by late April I would make a split with maybe another in late June. Or buy queens for your splits. Or, by the time you buy queens and feed, you will be close to package prices which will be a more sure thing.


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## fish_stix (May 17, 2009)

One other thought. Use queen cells from a queen breeder instead of mated queens. Cells usually cost $2.50-3.00 each; we try to use 2 per split. Advantages: you learn how to build mating nucs; lower cost; break in the brood cycle for Varroa control; takes the onus off the bees about building cells because sometimes, in spite of your best efforts, the bees simply will not successfully build queen cells. Disadvantages: must have a good supply of drones, no problem if there are other beekeepers nearby; takes longer to get an established nuc, which is not a problem if you split just before or during a good flow; sometimes must replenish with capped/emerging brood, real problem if you've split your existing hives into 4 or 5 nucs.


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## KQ6AR (May 13, 2008)

Since you're hive is strong, & no mite treatments for 3 years. I'd say don't buy a queen from anyone you want more of the same bees.

I don't know how many nucs you could split that hive into in the spring, but don't expect honey.


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## mythomane (Feb 18, 2009)

Tecumsah has some good advice for you. The only thing I would add would be to go for less than 5 hives. Wait for the cells. If you can't or don't want to just dutch split 2 into singles and move the queen into her own nuc. Then you have three.


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## BDJ (Sep 27, 2009)

What do you mean by "Dutch Split"? Is that letting the new hive raise their own queen?
BDJ


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## Hampton (Apr 24, 2007)

Sorry for the late reply but ...I guess the question I have is this: How many colonies do you want and how fast do you want them? If you have one good colony and you want 5 then I would take a 5 frame split off of your one colony and let those bees requeen themselves. Depending on the weather you could do this in April. Three to four weeks later you could take another split and repeat the process. This will help your bees in the original colony as a bit of swarm control and you will have your new colonies. It will take time but the bees and queens will be pretty much free. Over the course of spring and summer you should be able to get at east 3 new colonies and you might get the forth by late summer. I'm not really sure how your weather goes. This will still give you a honey crop and you will be able to expand your apiary. This is also not as much of a gamble as doing 4 splits all at once. One more note. Each time you make a split the bees will make more than one queen cell. If you do it right you wil be able to remove a few of the queen cells before they emerge and move them to nucs for mating.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Most of your questions should be answered here:
http://www.bushfarms.com/beessplits.htm

As far as feeding I would only feed when there is no flow. If there is nectar out there, let them gather it. That's usually why people have bees, to gather nectar, and it's what they naturally eat. I would not feed once they have some stores until about fall (beekeeping fall is about August around here) when I'd be checking to make sure they have enough to get through the winter. If they are light, I'd feed more then.


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

I think you can turn it into 5, using your hive you have to get the queens. Getting them to give you the queen cells is easiest for you I bet, but having the queen cells ready to emerge when you make up your splits will reduce loss of brood production during downtime having them make a queen for you in each split.

When the hive gets into strong buildup mode and you've got lots of bees in all the boxes... Make the bottom box be all frames of eggs and just hatching eggs. Choose a time when the queen has gone crazy filling eggs everywhere that brood has hatched out, this will be in a nectar flow time. alternate the bottom box with frames of eggs/hatching eggs and frames of nectar/pollen. The other boxes, move them away to new location, make sure the queen is in the boxes that you move away. 

This will give a strong queenless box with lots of nurse bees and all the field force cut back to a single deep during a nectar flow. They will go into swarm mode and draw out nice cells for you. 

Check them in 9 days and make up nucs out of all the frames in the box, can make up 5 nucs with 2 frames each, a nectar/pollen and a egg/hatching egg with queen cells. If you use wax foundation or natural drawn, then you can cut cells out from frames with many and put into nucs also, if you don't get 5 frames with cells on them. 

Add 1/2 pollen patty, sugar syrup feeder, and fill the rest of nuc with empty frames. Give each nuc a shake of bees from frames of brood out of old hive with original queen. Check back in two weeks to see if new queens laying yet.

I don't know exactly where you are at, but I think this could work. Feed them all year to get them built up, there should be time. 4 brood cycles is 12 weeks, 3 months, end of August should have them strong enough, and you'd still have another couple months for fall flows and more brood rearing.


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