# new here



## wcnewby (Sep 28, 2014)

Howdy, My name is Wayne, I am a new beekeeper, but have studied a lot about bees. I decided, when I decided to become a beekeeper that I would choose the best hive for my area, which gets very cold... Northern Wisconsin. I read Warre's book "beekeeping for all" and like his observations, but not his attitude about making hives nice. I think you should make a hive the best possible house for your bees. I used cedar for mine. 

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCYujrweVKe7UJM07XOSBMlw

The above is a link to my youtube channel where I have been documenting the progress of my hive. It has observation windows, and I film them. I have the hive suspended about 20 feet from the ground, and have installed anti-ant measures. My quilt is filled with alpaca wool, I made my bars out of dowels, and completely redesigned the entrance setup. No horizontal landing board. There is no solid top board in the hive. Just the quilt full of wool, and a cover designed to dry it.

We are approaching winter here, and I have some questions about what I am seeing through my windows. The bees seem to be moving honey... do they do that? Is it more likely they are just eating it? I have not opened my hive, so I only know what is going on by the windows. I know they are still bringing in pollen, because I can see it on their legs when they come back. I just can't see where they are stashing it. My top box is full of comb, my middle box is three quarters full of comb as well, but the comb in the middle is empty. Looks new... I'm guessing they have more going on towards the middle of the hive. I'm hoping that they are concentrating their stores away from the hive walls and using the empty comb as insulation from the walls.... But I don't know this, and I don't want to stress the colony by opening the hive, merely to satisfy my curiosity. 

The time has come for me to discuss things with people who have more experience.


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## Riverderwent (May 23, 2013)

"The bees seem to be moving honey... do they do that?"
Welcome. Yes.

"Is it more likely they are just eating it?"
Both.

"I don't want to stress the colony by opening the hive, merely to satisfy my curiosity. The time has come for me to discuss things with people who have more experience."
What is your purpose for raising bees? Opening the hive will help you learn more faster and improve your ability to keep bees. You may also see problems that you can ameliorate. Having at least two hives is important for both your bees and you because it will help you deal with emergencies. Guanaco wool or, if you can find it, vicuña, is better for the bees.


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## allan (Jul 7, 2013)

Welcome to Beesource and I to have to ask why do you have your bees 20 ft high


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## wcnewby (Sep 28, 2014)

Bears... I live in Northern Wisconsin and we have bears. Most people use electric fence for bear, but I didn't want deer getting tangled up in it. We have those too. Incorporated into my design is also a way to keep ants out, and mice...


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## wcnewby (Sep 28, 2014)

My purpose in raising bees is to learn, and also to help with pollination and I really like honey. I will be adding to my hive collection. Certainly not against the idea of having more than one. I chose alpaca wool because it is tubular in structure and tends to conduct water rather than absorb it, like sheep wool. Because of the tubular structure it will retain heat even when damp.

I choose Russian bees for my hive because they are resistant to many problems that are deal breakers. It is my hope to have made this hive in such a way that they can take care of themselves without my interference. From what I have read, the inside of the hive is fairly sterile, or it doesn't contain bacteria that is harmful to bees. By opening it, you change the temperature rapidly, allow spores and whatnot in.... plus, it's like a giant came along and ripped your roof off to see what's in your fridge. Bees would almost certainly die, damage to the comb could occur, they would have to reseal their environment. I agree, I could learn more by opening it, but I am trying to balance the importance of knowing against disrupting them. When I think of what could go wrong, because I am totally new at this, I conclude that it isn't worth the risk. Sooo, I have chosen to satisfy my curiosity by asking people with experience.

What I have noticed is that in my top box, the cells by the window were full of nectar. You could see it shining in there. Gradually, the cells became less full. I assume they evaporated down. This comb is always covered in bees, even though they don't appear to be doing much. I have it on video. Now, the comb by the window is empty. I am wondering if it is natural for them to leave empty comb near the walls. The trapped air in the cells would be good insulation against the cold. It makes sense. Or, they are concentrating their stores in the center of the hive where they can reach it without going near the cold walls... or they haven't collected enough nectar to fill that comb out. They sure seem to have the ability to plan... maybe they are planning... Inscrutable little bugs indeed


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## bbruff22 (Dec 24, 2013)

Welcome from NE Kansas Wayne!


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## AmericasBeekeeper (Jan 24, 2010)

Welcome Wayne!


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## Riverderwent (May 23, 2013)

Wayne, you seem to have a good sense of humor, good socialization skills, good craftsmanship, and a good plan. Are you sure that you are on the right forum? (Glad you're here.)


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## wcnewby (Sep 28, 2014)

I hope so.... Bee keepers all have a sense of humor, I think.... We keep stinging insects and are not afraid. The thing that surprised me most, when I started doing research, was the hive. The Langstroth has been around for 200 years and has not been improved. That means it is either perfect, or people who keep bees love tradition... I found that the hive was not perfect, according to Warre, at least not for the bees. So, bee keepers are like plumbers. You figure out what you can get away with and stick to it because it works.

My uncle is a beekeeper, and quite successful with it. He is a traditional guy, and uses the Langstroth, but also feeds, medicates, and looses his bees in the winter. I figure there is a reason for that. One, you can't pretend that sugar and honey are the same... Your kids probably wouldn't mind if you gave them sugar rather than vegetables, but they would not remain healthy. If your house was wet and moldy all the time, and if the children from your family were born in a room black with dirt and fungus, then winter came and it dripped condensation on you with your belly full of sugar, that your race would die out.... Just sayin....

So, I studied what the perfect home would be, I watched videos of how they used their home, I looked into the problems that bee keepers face in keeping bees. Then I started designing a hive that would fix all of this. If your bees are healthy, they can deal with colds and won't require medication. Thermo regulation is incredibly important, that and making sure there is no condensation which also creates fungus. That is why I chose cedar. No wax moths, no fungus. The warre quilt was the answer to condensation, minus a top board and plus some alpaca wool. I did some design tweaking with the top for the purposes of ventilation. And the bottom.... I changed the design of that after watching how bees are attacked by hornets. I have video of how they can defend against them with my design. We have loads of hornets here. There are two nests that I know of within fifty feet of my hive, but they can't get in. In a regular entrance the hornets can get above your bees and then drag them off. The slot is too wide to be defended properly without an army of guard bees. With my entrances, the guard bees are above anything that would attack them. They are defending a small hole that goes through two three quarter inch layers. An invader would have to overcome the guard bees at the opening, crawl through the hole, and then face an entire hive of bees at the end of the tunnel. No wind can blow in my entrances, and the cleaner bees have an easy time keeping the bottom board clean. This design can be mounted on a pole with a flange. I have one of these with a friend in California who is keeping hers that way... that one is an eight bar, but the same design. Mine is a ten bar... I made it slightly larger to provide 22 liter boxes. The eight bar boxes are only 16 liters each. So yes, I do have a plan, but I won't know if it is better till spring. If this hive gets them through the winter better, I'm going to start bragging.... I would like to offer the design as an open source thing, so people can build their own. They take a lot of time, but they are incredibly strong...


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## wcnewby (Sep 28, 2014)




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## wcnewby (Sep 28, 2014)

Right at the beginning of this video you can see a couple of hornets getting thwarted. I never saw this when I was filming it. It wasn't till after I loaded it into my computer I noticed.


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## JohnK and Sheri (Nov 28, 2004)

I would be very concerned about your hive having enough food to make it through winter in St Germain. That colony put lots of resources into building new comb in a year that has been pretty poor, production wise for a lot of Wisconsin beekeepers.
The best way to tell if there is enough food is to LOOK IN THE BOX. Monitoring the status of your bees is an essential part of animal husbandry. The opposite is just neglect, in my eyes. You mentioned elsewhere that you realize you are responsible for the lives of these bees; monitoring their level of feed, parasites and disease is part of that. Whether you chose to supplement or treat when needed is another question but you should realize that left in the wild many (most?) new swarms will starve out and many (most?) of the few that survive the first winter will succumb to mites by the second winter. In the big picture, no big deal, but if it's YOUR colony, well, most people don't want to replace bees every year. 
We have lots of people that feed their bees and they die for one reason or another, (not enough feed,poor housing, poor disease/mite control) but to eliminate the option of supplimental feeding in Wisconsin is a mistake IMO, especially in an area of "big woods". With proper housing and enough feed, it is possible for a healthy colony to survive a Wisconsin winter but winter starvation (and especially with no mite control) is the biggest killer of bees in Wisconsin.

To specifically answer your question, yes, bees move honey but this year in particular I think it is most likely they are eating more than they are moving and have been doing so for some time now. One common problem with wintering hives in Wisconsin is that they may not organize themselves in such a manner that they can access all food stores for the entire year. IE the cluster will start moving up, leaving food under them, which will be too far for them to move to in cold weather. It doesn't do them any good if they can't access it.
I don't want to come across as being totally negative, no matter what you will learn from this year's experience, and the learning is the most important.
Good luck.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>The bees seem to be moving honey... do they do that?

All the time...


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