# Feeding With Fondant



## alpha6 (May 12, 2008)

Hey riverdog I think you can get the same results feeding a good pollen pattie and mixing your own. Fondant is made with sugar...you may come in at less then half the price if you can figure out a recipe that works for your bees. I think the trick is to just keep the feed on. I am feeding right now while the populations are still up and they are knocking down a pattie about every 3 days. The price of $27 for 50 lbs runs about .54 per lb which is a bit high. My local City Market sells it to me by the pallet for .46 per lb. and in Junction you should be able to get it cheaper then where I am.


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## Bens-Bees (Sep 18, 2008)

I looked up fondant on wikipedia because I didn't know what was in it besides sugar, and found that it also includes gelatin (or agar in vegetarian recipes) and food-grade glycerine, both of which I would have some concerns over feeding to the bees. It may be fine, I don't know, I've never tried feeding jello or glycerine to bees before, but as for me, I think I'll steer clear of feeding fondant to my bees.


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## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

I think it depends on what you're feeding for. I know beekeepers in MA that feed fondant. They have a hard time getting enough feed stored in the comb, and suffer starved colonies. Fondant is ok for emergency feed. Same for sugar boards. Why not feed 2:1? At least then you'll know what's been stored in the combs for winter.


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## J-Bees (Jul 12, 2008)

I feed it in the spring after I see how low the stores are getting. Seems the girls LOVE it as it goes very fast. I place two 6" squares on the top of the inside cover and it dissapers within a week.


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## Brandy (Dec 3, 2005)

I used Fondant in my mini mating nucs this past season. I'm surprised how fast it dries out. Not sure if that would change with different suppliers or not. The bees still work on it but need small picks and shovels to break it down. It does last quite a while this way and doesn't mold which are two positives. I also thought about using it for some of the small nuc's this winter but I'm not sure yet of the advantages of a small brick on top of the cluster.


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## NC-Bee-Dude (Jun 20, 2009)

I bought a 25 pound bag of sugar at WalMart this week at $13.74, which is over $2.00 more expensive than it was three weeks ago. 

The cost of gas is going down, sugar is going up. Does beekeeping have its own OPEC? 

The check-out girls that see me buying large quantities of sugar every few weeks are beginning to give me the eye. I believe they think I'm running a bootleg liquor operation. It is North Carolina after all!


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## JohnK and Sheri (Nov 28, 2004)

Most commercials are well set up for liquid feed. It is convenient to get in a tanker of HFCS, liquid sucrose or a blend and with migratory lids it is very quick to fill division feeders, which is what many migrators use. Convenient as well to add Fum B at the same time if desired. Seems lately, all the "patty space" is taken up with pollen sub.
Sheri


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## oldenglish (Oct 22, 2008)

NC-Bee-Dude said:


> I bought a 25 pound bag of sugar at WalMart this week at $13.74, which is over $2.00 more expensive than it was three weeks ago.
> 
> The cost of gas is going down, sugar is going up. Does beekeeping have its own OPEC?
> 
> The check-out girls that see me buying large quantities of sugar every few weeks are beginning to give me the eye. I believe they think I'm running a bootleg liquor operation. It is North Carolina after all!


As far as price, blame the grocery stores,
http://www.pulpfusion.com/pulpfusion/uploadfiles/ASA_9/Sugar_Price_Survey.pdf


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## Riverdog (Mar 15, 2009)

Thank you for your thoughts everyone. FYI we do have 2 gal. feeders in every hive and I typically do mix and feed as needed but found it's too time consuming to simulate a flow or keep up with it. Three weeks ago I Placed the fondant in 30 hives. Signs are good and the 5 lbs are not completely depleted yet.(fondant is extremely dense.) The fondant is in plastic with small holes. The specs on this fondant does not show gelatin or other random hurtful ingredients. Also most hives will hoard the the sugar syrup and pack it away, not needed either. This fondant I think is doing what I hope for, they are eating it as needed and feeding it to brood. It will be interesting to see if it works out. I should of weighed a few hives but I did not do that. I'll post some results as I'm quite sure some of you may be interested in reading. I'm doing a 60 day test. I'm trying to take a 6 frame to 10. Aug. 25th-Oct 25th. In Colorado in the desert... uncertain that it's possible at this time.

Thanks for Reading
Chad


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## winevines (Apr 7, 2007)

Riverdog said:


> N I'm finding it for about $32 for 50 lbs delivered to our shop. "


Who was the supplier for you to get a 50 pound of fondant?


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

I just talk to a supplier today about 50# blocks of fondant, he hasn't quoted me a price yet but I am expecting it to be about $38 for 50 pounds, I usually dont feed fondant but I started feeding late and again no fall flow so I am not sure my hives would be ready if we have a long hard winter so I will put about 15-20 pounds on each hive just in case, I also am wintering a couple nuc's and its always good to have fondant on them during the winter just to be safe. my supplier is Dawn food Products. BjornBee set me up with this information today, I seen he used it before and he gave me the info I needed.

here's the site

http://www.dawnfoods.com/Public/Managed/distribution/Locations/Index.asp

they have so many choices, this is the one you want

00071746 Bes-Fond Fondant (A fondant base for icings and confections)

Ingredients: Sugar, water, corn surup.

Net wt. 50 pounds


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## Riverdog (Mar 15, 2009)

Bakemark of Denver. Brand is karps. No cornstarch and is made with cane sugar. It does have some corn syrup. We opperate a small bakery so we have accounts with Dawn foods and Bakemark. Bakemark had a better price. One thing that I'm researching is the density % vs. The types of sugar sryups we use. It takes the bees some time put it away the fondant vs. syrup. I wish I were further along but were in the middle of testing it this year on 50 or so hives. Not many keepers use it. Likely a good reason just haven't found it yet. 

Regards
Chad Ragland


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## winevines (Apr 7, 2007)

TwT said:


> I just talk to a supplier today about 50# blocks of fondant, he hasn't quoted me a price yet but I am expecting it to be about $38 for 50 pounds, my supplier is Dawn food Products. BjornBee set me up with this information today, I seen he used it before and he gave me the info I needed.
> 
> here's the site
> 
> http://www.dawnfoods.com/Public/Managed/distribution/Locations/Index.asp


I will be curious if you are able to get this shipped. Dawn Foods looks like it is George Ruel in Baltimore, the nearest to me, and when I spoke with them, it is pick up only for orders less than $500


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

winevines said:


> I will be curious if you are able to get this shipped. Dawn Foods looks like it is George Ruel in Baltimore, the nearest to me, and when I spoke with them, it is pick up only for orders less than $500


I sure it is pickup for me, because I am 2 hours drive from them it might be pickup for me even if it was over $500 because I would only be a 1 time customer (it would be my luck anyway), but if they have a customer close to me they will give me contact info and then you can prepay or just buy what I need from the their customer, when they ship to their regular customer they will also ship my order and I just pick it up there. but if they don't I will just have to drive and get it,


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## winevines (Apr 7, 2007)

Riverdog said:


> Bakemark of Denver. Brand is karps. No cornstarch and is made with cane sugar. I
> 
> Regards
> Chad Ragland


Is this dry? and if so, how do you make it up


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## jean-marc (Jan 13, 2005)

Chad:

 The reasons beekeepers do not use fondant are numerous. Firstly, all commercial beekeepers have a very efficient system to feed bees. They all have tanks, hoses and pumps. It's fairly fast to feed the outfib especially with migratory lids and feeders left in place year round. No need to cut fondant and then deal with all the packaging.

Secondly it is relatively expensive when compared to HFCS or liquid sucrose even if you get the cheapest brand. Then there are freight considerations. 

Thirdly the distribution system is already in place for syrup. I'm not sure that the fondant makers could keep up with the demand if half the commercial beekeepers switched to fondant.

Making your own fondant (this will be harder than commercially purchased but hey, you get what you pay for)

12345 recipe. 

1 part water 
5 parts sugar
Heat to 234 F, the syrup then becomes clear.
Remove from heat or turn it off. Wait a bit, 2-3 minutes or so.
Add a chunk of of commercially prepared fondant to seed the syrup. This is like seeding liquid honey with creamed honey to make a big batch of cremed honey. Blend the fondant into the hot syrup with a drill, the syrup becomes cloudy after 1-2 minutes. Pour the mixture into molds.

And voila... Don't forget to let it cool.

In my experience this is such a messy, slow and time consumming job. It is best to feed liquid heavily in september and forget about them. 2 guys can easily feed 650 gallons of syrup in a day. I have 2 325 gallon tanks on my truck. The can go back to my home yard and fill the tanks for the next day and still have time for a nap, assuming you have kinda large yards and little travel time. Good luck trying to feed that volume with fondant, and even more luck will be needed to prepare the dry weight equivalent.

If I had to feed the odd colony to prevent starvation fondant could have it's use. I would never try to make my own again, it's not worth it.

Jean-Marc


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## Grant (Jun 12, 2004)

NC-Bee-Dude said:


> I bought a 25 pound bag of sugar at WalMart this week at $13.74, which is over $2.00 more expensive than it was three weeks ago. The check-out girls that see me buying large quantities of sugar every few weeks are beginning to give me the eye.


Yeah, the first time they asked I told them the truth and mentioned bees. They were, like, totally turned off, like, who wants to mess with bugs, man?

So every other time I just mention that my kids like Kool-aid, or that it's for Vacation Bible School and I'm buying it for the church.

Grant
Jackson, MO


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## charmd2 (May 25, 2008)

During the summer I blame hummingbird feeders.


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## Grant (Jun 12, 2004)

Getting back on topic, how and who does one approach to acquire a block/bucket of fondant?

What will my local bakery ask when I inquire about a bucket of fondant? Will they know what I'm talking about?

Grant
Jackson, MO


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

no they want know, you need a fondant base with Ingredients: Sugar, water, corn surup.


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## Skinner Apiaries (Sep 1, 2009)

I wave around my sales tax waiver stamp and make a crack about how it's a shame I dont have to pay sales tax. ruffles those poor girls at sam's feathers.

As to Fondant, I agree with the earlier post, isnt a patty with sugar added effectively a two in one kinda thing?


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## chillardbee (May 26, 2005)

preparing fondant to feed to bees can be finicky at best (not over heating it, getting right amounts of ingredients, ect.). For the most part, if your bees are heavy for the winter there's no need to feed anything, that means anything that was light in the fall was fed syrup to bring them up to a decent weight to over winter too. In cases where late winter or early spring emergency feeding is required to bring a hive through to the first supply of nectar or until you can feed syrup, dry sugar is just find and a lot less hassel then fondant . At that point, the hives must be monitored closly that they do not run out of feed.

Something that is important for dry feeding, whether it be fondant or dry sugar, is the availability of moisture wich in most cases is not a problem in most places during late winter/early spring.


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

TwT said:


> no they want know, you need a fondant base with Ingredients: Sugar, water, corn surup.


well to add to this there are a lot of fondants I found out, cake fondants and icing fondants, you would want a fondant base, the others have additives and I am not sure what it could do to the bee's, you would want the base with just Sugar, water, corn surup.


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## BEES4U (Oct 10, 2007)

Here's my application for making fondant.
one part HFCS Type 55
3-4 parts C & H Drivert
Mix the syrup into the dry sugar so that it makes a thick paste, pour it over about a one inch thick layer of the Drivert, pour more Drivert over the top and knead until the mix is stiff enough so that it does not run.
Place a piece of paper over the hives top bars, place the patty on the paper, replace the super or cover and walk away.
The bees can eat the above patty 24/7.
PS, you could add some Pollen Supplement to the sugar to add nutrients
Good Luck,
Ernie


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## KQ6AR (May 13, 2008)

Talk to you're local baker, They're also a good source for food grade buckets, & they buy bulk honey. 
Good guy to get to know.


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## rmdial (Jun 30, 2009)

*Question re drivert vs fondant*

I have been trying to buy some drivert in one 50 lb bag but am having trouble getting delivery. The local bulk grocery has ordered it but it takes months. They pointed out a fondant sugar and I called the manufacturer. They said it is 96% granulated sugar and four percent corn starch. My question, is this drivert? If I add water and some absorbic acid and mix it up would this be a good supplemental patty? I drivert totally different? I understand it has been altered to be an "invert" so could I do the same while preparing it?

Thanks in advance.

Rick Dial


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## BEES4U (Oct 10, 2007)

Good morning,
Rick,
I saw an Eastern web site that had a photo of the C & H DRIVERT.
Drivert contains about 6 or 7% invert sugar and 0.0% corn starch.
It looks like soap powder, Tide.
I will try to locate it for you.
You might consider checking someone who makes a lot of Wedding cakes.
Ernie


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## Brooklyn (Nov 14, 2009)

Sorry guys for the high price of sugar but you can thank the government for that surcharge. They only allow so much sugar to be imported into the us every year. that is why all the soda and punch companies do not use it any more.

So thank you uncle sam :s:applause::banana: For all the great things you do to keep us under your thumb

Brooklyn


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