# Sticky  Chalkbrood advice.



## crofter

Do you have the hard mummified larva on the bottom board and outside hives? Are the areas of nicely laid eggs progressing to evenly capped cells? Just trying to find out at what stage of development that the cell contents are terminating. 

If there is hardly any honey being capped perhaps those queen cells are supercedure cells not swarm cells. Destroying them might not be best.


----------



## GregB

missgeneralidea said:


> even replaced the queen to help change the genetics but it doesn't seem to work.
> ..................
> What else can I do to eradicate this problem?


Since the genetics flip did not purge the issue (this would be my move too), I'd try a complete reset of this colony.

Just shake them out onto completely new frames in a different box.
Restart them as a small nuc while there is still time.
They should rebound well (with your help).

Assume all the brood/frames/box is "infected" and is a loss and reset it all (dump and clean out - even though the chalkbrood agent is supposed to be present everywhere at all times).
If feel adventuress, you may give the chalkbrood-ed frames to your other hive(s) and most likely they will be OK - at your own judgement.


----------



## crofter

Combining or transferring frames has never been a good experience for me except combing small (but healthy) nucs for wintering purposes. I would not put healthy colonies at risk by using them to test a diagnosis.


----------



## Some Bloke

Chalk brood is a fungus. If the hive is cool and/or damp it makes it easier for the xhalk brood to establish. Is the hive in a different position to your others - a shady spot? A slightly lower elevation? Next to water?

Does the hive have a larger volume above the queen excluder? The nurses have to keep brood around 35C, if they struggle then you can get opportunistic infections like Chalk Brood.


----------



## GregB

The only instance I had this issue (chalkbrood) was a case of crappy genetics, I feel.
They had this issue where it was totally uncalled for.
I did perform a colony reset (I shook them out into a different hive to do the reset from scratch).
But also immediately reused the "infected" hive/frames elsewhere - no issue at all.


----------



## RayMarler

Chalk has always been a genetics issue for me. Try changing your queen supplier, try to find one that has VSH queens. They tend to have better resistance traits to the brood diseases that beehives get. If the infestation is in advanced stage then change out the infected brood combs as well.


----------



## crofter

GregB said:


> The only instance I had this issue (chalkbrood) was a case of crappy genetics, I feel.
> They had this issue where it was totally uncalled for.
> I did perform a colony reset (I shook them out into a different hive to do the reset from scratch).
> But also immediately reused the "infected" hive/frames elsewhere - no issue at all.


This would seem to indicate that there is no need to take precautions of spreading by transferring combs! I doubt that "once" is enough to validate advice that is contrary to most recommendations?


----------



## GregB

crofter said:


> This would seem to indicate that there is no need to take precautions of spreading by transferring combs! I doubt that "once" is enough to validate advice that is contrary to most recommendations?


Like I said - do these things *"at your own judgement".*
As for me I would do it again specifically with the chalkbrood and not loose any sleep.


----------



## Roland

I would shake them on wax foundation and give them a feed pail, just like if they had AFB.

Crazy Roland


----------



## crofter

GregB said:


> Like I said - do these things *"at your own judgement".*
> As for me I would do it again specifically with the chalkbrood and not loose any sleep.


In this case the thread originator has already changed out the queen to no avail. Perhaps the comb is the continued repository of the fungus. Induce a brood break getting rid of all existing and incipient chalk mummies; start with new queen and frames and get the hives up off the ground if they are on pallets. If the other colonies are unaffected, all the more reason NOT to transfer equipment.

I have had some conversation with a person from an area where it is fairly widespread issue that while not devastating is a real drag. Kind of hurts nuc sales.
I questioned the OP on some of the symptoms to ensure the diagnosis was 100% chalkbrood; we have not heard back. 

I am having some experience with Sacbrood which has some of the same results though not the same appearance of the dead larvae. Infected frames can indeed be reused if depopulated and given 5 weeks or more lockdown. I can guarantee that combining is not the right answer: most definitely it also was not when the unbeknownst villain was EFB in 2017.

Consolidating bees and equipment is a good move when a bear visit is the cause of your grief.


----------



## GregB

crofter said:


> In this case the thread originator has already changed out the queen to no avail. Perhaps the comb is the continued repository of the fungus. Induce a brood break getting rid of all existing and incipient chalk mummies; start with new queen and frames and get the hives up off the ground if they are on pallets. If the other colonies are unaffected, all the more reason NOT to transfer equipment.
> 
> I have had some conversation with a person from an area where it is fairly widespread issue that while not devastating is a real drag. Kind of hurts nuc sales.
> I questioned the OP on some of the symptoms to ensure the diagnosis was 100% chalkbrood; we have not heard back.
> 
> I am having some experience with Sacbrood which has some of the same results though not the same appearance of the dead larvae. Infected frames can indeed be reused if depopulated and given 5 weeks or more lockdown. I can guarantee that combining is not the right answer: most definitely it also was not when the unbeknownst villain was EFB in 2017.
> 
> Consolidating bees and equipment is a good move when a bear visit is the cause of your grief.


Reset the colony - exactly what I suggested.

But, let me re-quote myself (I know - people pay no attention; me neither):


> *If feel adventuress*, you may give the chalkbrood-ed frames to your other hive(s) and most likely they will be OK - *at your own judgement*.


Which applies to me.
I tend to be that way - no secret.

Anyway, the "right" bees promptly cleanout the *chalkbrood mummies* - and that is that.
We are talking of a situation where there is one outlying colony affected by the issue (just like here).
Meanwhile, there are others right next to it and appear totally normal.

PS: clearly, I misspelled the "adventurous"


----------



## GregB

crofter said:


> If the other colonies are unaffected, all the more reason NOT to transfer equipment.


I personally would NOT even suggest transferring the brood in most all cases at all - due to mite cross-infestation (first and foremost).
This is exactly what is suggested on exact forum right and left and all over again.

But whatever people want to do - it is their bees and their common sense.


----------



## RayMarler

I'm with GregB,
I never ever put questionable bees or combs, whether it's chalk or anything else into good hives. I keep my good hives good and rebuild up from them when needed.


----------



## crofter

GregB said:


> I personally would NOT even suggest transferring the brood in most all cases at all - due to mite cross-infestation (first and foremost).
> This is exactly what is suggested on exact forum right and left and all over again.
> 
> But whatever people want to do - it is their bees and their common sense.


Thanks for clearing that up. 
Personally I would not be quite as neutral on peoples freedom to take the low road when the results can have impacts beyond their own yards. I have been less than squeaky clean at biohazard control amongst my own hives and have probably paid a price. My EFB experience could very likely have been nipped at several colonies instead of 6 or 7. I am a bit more on guard now but it seems there is always something new or coming around again to sneak up on us.


----------



## RayMarler

RayMarler said:


> I'm with GregB,
> I never ever put questionable bees or combs, whether it's chalk or anything else into good hives. I keep my good hives good and rebuild up from them when needed.


But I have in the past. That's how I learnt not to do it now. Anything suspicious and it does not get joined with any other one. Same thing with moving frames from one to another, only if I'm sure nothing is wrong health wise.


----------



## Jack Grimshaw

I had a severe case of chalk many years ago and tried requeening to no effect.
I finally eradicated it by shaking onto foundation twice.
A waste of my time,a waste of foundation, and the colony was a dink for that season.
I would have been better off killing it from the get go,tossing the comb and sterilizing the woodenware and then making a split from a healthy hive.
This was also the last time I bought a nuc.(it was a reputable supplier too.)


----------



## missgeneralidea

Thanks everyone for the responses. A few things to clarify;

1- I don't want to transfer the equipment to my other hives. If anything, I will decontamination the equipment first by freezing it, and then I burn it with a blow tourch/ wash out with bleach and put wax on the cleaned equipment. If the equipment is a goner it gets tossed.

2- I could hit "re-set" but I don't have any built wax foundation frames on hand now and low on supers. I would have to introduce new starter frames (wax strip ). Do you think it's too late to do this? Also, If I do this would I just split the hive? Take the queen with the 3 good brood patterns/ with bees and 1 frame of honey and start a new hive in a new brood box? And leave the rest of the bees in the same box with the queen cells?

3.) I don't have much land space (urban beekeeper). I would have to put this "re-set" hive right beside the current weak hive. Would this be redundant as the bees might go back into the known hive. I'm not sure.

Yikes.... I'm not sure. I'm heading to take a look again tomorrow morning and I will come back with some photos.


----------



## GregB

missgeneralidea said:


> Thanks everyone for the responses. A few things to clarify;
> 
> 1- I don't want to transfer the equipment to my other hives. If anything, I will decontamination the equipment first by freezing it, and then I burn it with a blow tourch/ wash out with bleach and put wax on the cleaned equipment. If the equipment is a goner it gets tossed.
> 
> 2- I could hit "re-set" but I don't have any built wax foundation frames on hand now and low on supers. I would have to introduce new starter frames (wax strip ). Do you think it's too late to do this? Also, If I do this would I just split the hive? Take the queen with the 3 good brood patterns/ with bees and 1 frame of honey and start a new hive in a new brood box? And leave the rest of the bees in the same box with the queen cells?
> 
> 3.) I don't have much land space (urban beekeeper). I would have to put this "re-set" hive right beside the current weak hive. Would this be redundant as the bees might go back into the known hive. I'm not sure.
> 
> Yikes.... I'm not sure. I'm heading to take a look again tomorrow morning and I will come back with some photos.


Simply move the existing problem hive aside.
Set a new rig in its place.
Move the queen.
Shake the bees in.
Rest of the bees will return to it.
Reduce to have them tight.
Maybe give a couple of frames of honey/bee bread (from clean hives).
Feed - they will be able to rebuild fine until the seasons end.
That's pretty clean start, right there.
While at it - treat for mites.

As for the discontinued stuff...
Probably just melt it all and torch the wooden ware - to take the safe route forward.


----------



## crofter

The link below is in regard to Chalkbrood infection on nesting materials but the methods also apply to honey bee equipment.

Chalkbrood in Honeybees and Leafcutter Bees • Ecrotek 

*Heat treatment*

The safest option for the alfalfa leafcutter bee is heat treatment. Use an oven or kiln that is made to circulate heat. Heating nesting material to 93 degrees Celsius will kill chalkbrood spores.

*Bleach treatment*

For this treatment, you will need bleach or sodium hypochlorite at a five-per cent strength. Dilute 100ml of bleach in 2000ml of water then spray or dip the nest boxes and other equipment in the bleach solution to kill off spores.

Replacement of the queen and the combs

Requeening and replacing the comb is a good treatment option for honeybees. Burning the comb is recommended by some beekeepers as a safe way to ensure the fungus is eradicated. The requeening process should introduce a stronger and more resilient brood population.


----------



## missgeneralidea

Hi there,

I need some advice from the masters! I have a hive that is battling chalkbrood an don't know what to do;-( 
From the beginning of the season, I've noticed the disease and tried to take the necessary steps to help fight it, but I believe it's gotten worse as the season as progresses. I have changed out my supers and bottom boards and even replaced the queen to help change the genetics but it doesn't seem to work. At the beginning of the season there was a handful of evidence of dead white larvae and now my bottom board is full. 

I did an inspection yesterday and the hive isn't doing well. The brood pattern on my bottom super is very erratic and loads of drone comb that seem to have an strange pattern as well. I located the new queen on the second brood box (2 large supers in total) and she looks like she is laying normally on 3 frames only(nice patterns), everything else look poor. Barely any honey, erratic drone cells and sloppy brood comb. The eggs look fine but only on the 3 frames suggested above. Also, there is lot's of queen cell building on the frames. I didn't destroy the queen cells but was planning on going back tomorrow and destroying them. I just want to see what people suggest I do in this case.

What else can I do to eradicate this problem? My other hives have no evidence of chalk brood yet. 

Thank you all!


----------



## crofter

Do you have the hard mummified larva on the bottom board and outside hives? Are the areas of nicely laid eggs progressing to evenly capped cells? Just trying to find out at what stage of development that the cell contents are terminating. 

If there is hardly any honey being capped perhaps those queen cells are supercedure cells not swarm cells. Destroying them might not be best.


----------



## GregB

missgeneralidea said:


> even replaced the queen to help change the genetics but it doesn't seem to work.
> ..................
> What else can I do to eradicate this problem?


Since the genetics flip did not purge the issue (this would be my move too), I'd try a complete reset of this colony.

Just shake them out onto completely new frames in a different box.
Restart them as a small nuc while there is still time.
They should rebound well (with your help).

Assume all the brood/frames/box is "infected" and is a loss and reset it all (dump and clean out - even though the chalkbrood agent is supposed to be present everywhere at all times).
If feel adventuress, you may give the chalkbrood-ed frames to your other hive(s) and most likely they will be OK - at your own judgement.


----------



## crofter

Combining or transferring frames has never been a good experience for me except combing small (but healthy) nucs for wintering purposes. I would not put healthy colonies at risk by using them to test a diagnosis.


----------



## Some Bloke

Chalk brood is a fungus. If the hive is cool and/or damp it makes it easier for the xhalk brood to establish. Is the hive in a different position to your others - a shady spot? A slightly lower elevation? Next to water?

Does the hive have a larger volume above the queen excluder? The nurses have to keep brood around 35C, if they struggle then you can get opportunistic infections like Chalk Brood.


----------



## GregB

The only instance I had this issue (chalkbrood) was a case of crappy genetics, I feel.
They had this issue where it was totally uncalled for.
I did perform a colony reset (I shook them out into a different hive to do the reset from scratch).
But also immediately reused the "infected" hive/frames elsewhere - no issue at all.


----------



## RayMarler

Chalk has always been a genetics issue for me. Try changing your queen supplier, try to find one that has VSH queens. They tend to have better resistance traits to the brood diseases that beehives get. If the infestation is in advanced stage then change out the infected brood combs as well.


----------



## crofter

GregB said:


> The only instance I had this issue (chalkbrood) was a case of crappy genetics, I feel.
> They had this issue where it was totally uncalled for.
> I did perform a colony reset (I shook them out into a different hive to do the reset from scratch).
> But also immediately reused the "infected" hive/frames elsewhere - no issue at all.


This would seem to indicate that there is no need to take precautions of spreading by transferring combs! I doubt that "once" is enough to validate advice that is contrary to most recommendations?


----------



## GregB

crofter said:


> This would seem to indicate that there is no need to take precautions of spreading by transferring combs! I doubt that "once" is enough to validate advice that is contrary to most recommendations?


Like I said - do these things *"at your own judgement".*
As for me I would do it again specifically with the chalkbrood and not loose any sleep.


----------



## Roland

I would shake them on wax foundation and give them a feed pail, just like if they had AFB.

Crazy Roland


----------



## crofter

GregB said:


> Like I said - do these things *"at your own judgement".*
> As for me I would do it again specifically with the chalkbrood and not loose any sleep.


In this case the thread originator has already changed out the queen to no avail. Perhaps the comb is the continued repository of the fungus. Induce a brood break getting rid of all existing and incipient chalk mummies; start with new queen and frames and get the hives up off the ground if they are on pallets. If the other colonies are unaffected, all the more reason NOT to transfer equipment.

I have had some conversation with a person from an area where it is fairly widespread issue that while not devastating is a real drag. Kind of hurts nuc sales.
I questioned the OP on some of the symptoms to ensure the diagnosis was 100% chalkbrood; we have not heard back. 

I am having some experience with Sacbrood which has some of the same results though not the same appearance of the dead larvae. Infected frames can indeed be reused if depopulated and given 5 weeks or more lockdown. I can guarantee that combining is not the right answer: most definitely it also was not when the unbeknownst villain was EFB in 2017.

Consolidating bees and equipment is a good move when a bear visit is the cause of your grief.


----------



## GregB

crofter said:


> In this case the thread originator has already changed out the queen to no avail. Perhaps the comb is the continued repository of the fungus. Induce a brood break getting rid of all existing and incipient chalk mummies; start with new queen and frames and get the hives up off the ground if they are on pallets. If the other colonies are unaffected, all the more reason NOT to transfer equipment.
> 
> I have had some conversation with a person from an area where it is fairly widespread issue that while not devastating is a real drag. Kind of hurts nuc sales.
> I questioned the OP on some of the symptoms to ensure the diagnosis was 100% chalkbrood; we have not heard back.
> 
> I am having some experience with Sacbrood which has some of the same results though not the same appearance of the dead larvae. Infected frames can indeed be reused if depopulated and given 5 weeks or more lockdown. I can guarantee that combining is not the right answer: most definitely it also was not when the unbeknownst villain was EFB in 2017.
> 
> Consolidating bees and equipment is a good move when a bear visit is the cause of your grief.


Reset the colony - exactly what I suggested.

But, let me re-quote myself (I know - people pay no attention; me neither):


> *If feel adventuress*, you may give the chalkbrood-ed frames to your other hive(s) and most likely they will be OK - *at your own judgement*.


Which applies to me.
I tend to be that way - no secret.

Anyway, the "right" bees promptly cleanout the *chalkbrood mummies* - and that is that.
We are talking of a situation where there is one outlying colony affected by the issue (just like here).
Meanwhile, there are others right next to it and appear totally normal.

PS: clearly, I misspelled the "adventurous"


----------



## GregB

crofter said:


> If the other colonies are unaffected, all the more reason NOT to transfer equipment.


I personally would NOT even suggest transferring the brood in most all cases at all - due to mite cross-infestation (first and foremost).
This is exactly what is suggested on exact forum right and left and all over again.

But whatever people want to do - it is their bees and their common sense.


----------



## RayMarler

I'm with GregB,
I never ever put questionable bees or combs, whether it's chalk or anything else into good hives. I keep my good hives good and rebuild up from them when needed.


----------



## crofter

GregB said:


> I personally would NOT even suggest transferring the brood in most all cases at all - due to mite cross-infestation (first and foremost).
> This is exactly what is suggested on exact forum right and left and all over again.
> 
> But whatever people want to do - it is their bees and their common sense.


Thanks for clearing that up. 
Personally I would not be quite as neutral on peoples freedom to take the low road when the results can have impacts beyond their own yards. I have been less than squeaky clean at biohazard control amongst my own hives and have probably paid a price. My EFB experience could very likely have been nipped at several colonies instead of 6 or 7. I am a bit more on guard now but it seems there is always something new or coming around again to sneak up on us.


----------



## RayMarler

RayMarler said:


> I'm with GregB,
> I never ever put questionable bees or combs, whether it's chalk or anything else into good hives. I keep my good hives good and rebuild up from them when needed.


But I have in the past. That's how I learnt not to do it now. Anything suspicious and it does not get joined with any other one. Same thing with moving frames from one to another, only if I'm sure nothing is wrong health wise.


----------



## Jack Grimshaw

I had a severe case of chalk many years ago and tried requeening to no effect.
I finally eradicated it by shaking onto foundation twice.
A waste of my time,a waste of foundation, and the colony was a dink for that season.
I would have been better off killing it from the get go,tossing the comb and sterilizing the woodenware and then making a split from a healthy hive.
This was also the last time I bought a nuc.(it was a reputable supplier too.)


----------



## missgeneralidea

Thanks everyone for the responses. A few things to clarify;

1- I don't want to transfer the equipment to my other hives. If anything, I will decontamination the equipment first by freezing it, and then I burn it with a blow tourch/ wash out with bleach and put wax on the cleaned equipment. If the equipment is a goner it gets tossed.

2- I could hit "re-set" but I don't have any built wax foundation frames on hand now and low on supers. I would have to introduce new starter frames (wax strip ). Do you think it's too late to do this? Also, If I do this would I just split the hive? Take the queen with the 3 good brood patterns/ with bees and 1 frame of honey and start a new hive in a new brood box? And leave the rest of the bees in the same box with the queen cells?

3.) I don't have much land space (urban beekeeper). I would have to put this "re-set" hive right beside the current weak hive. Would this be redundant as the bees might go back into the known hive. I'm not sure.

Yikes.... I'm not sure. I'm heading to take a look again tomorrow morning and I will come back with some photos.


----------



## GregB

missgeneralidea said:


> Thanks everyone for the responses. A few things to clarify;
> 
> 1- I don't want to transfer the equipment to my other hives. If anything, I will decontamination the equipment first by freezing it, and then I burn it with a blow tourch/ wash out with bleach and put wax on the cleaned equipment. If the equipment is a goner it gets tossed.
> 
> 2- I could hit "re-set" but I don't have any built wax foundation frames on hand now and low on supers. I would have to introduce new starter frames (wax strip ). Do you think it's too late to do this? Also, If I do this would I just split the hive? Take the queen with the 3 good brood patterns/ with bees and 1 frame of honey and start a new hive in a new brood box? And leave the rest of the bees in the same box with the queen cells?
> 
> 3.) I don't have much land space (urban beekeeper). I would have to put this "re-set" hive right beside the current weak hive. Would this be redundant as the bees might go back into the known hive. I'm not sure.
> 
> Yikes.... I'm not sure. I'm heading to take a look again tomorrow morning and I will come back with some photos.


Simply move the existing problem hive aside.
Set a new rig in its place.
Move the queen.
Shake the bees in.
Rest of the bees will return to it.
Reduce to have them tight.
Maybe give a couple of frames of honey/bee bread (from clean hives).
Feed - they will be able to rebuild fine until the seasons end.
That's pretty clean start, right there.
While at it - treat for mites.

As for the discontinued stuff...
Probably just melt it all and torch the wooden ware - to take the safe route forward.


----------



## crofter

The link below is in regard to Chalkbrood infection on nesting materials but the methods also apply to honey bee equipment.

Chalkbrood in Honeybees and Leafcutter Bees • Ecrotek 

*Heat treatment*

The safest option for the alfalfa leafcutter bee is heat treatment. Use an oven or kiln that is made to circulate heat. Heating nesting material to 93 degrees Celsius will kill chalkbrood spores.

*Bleach treatment*

For this treatment, you will need bleach or sodium hypochlorite at a five-per cent strength. Dilute 100ml of bleach in 2000ml of water then spray or dip the nest boxes and other equipment in the bleach solution to kill off spores.

Replacement of the queen and the combs

Requeening and replacing the comb is a good treatment option for honeybees. Burning the comb is recommended by some beekeepers as a safe way to ensure the fungus is eradicated. The requeening process should introduce a stronger and more resilient brood population.


----------



## missgeneralidea

Hi there,

I need some advice from the masters! I have a hive that is battling chalkbrood an don't know what to do;-( 
From the beginning of the season, I've noticed the disease and tried to take the necessary steps to help fight it, but I believe it's gotten worse as the season as progresses. I have changed out my supers and bottom boards and even replaced the queen to help change the genetics but it doesn't seem to work. At the beginning of the season there was a handful of evidence of dead white larvae and now my bottom board is full. 

I did an inspection yesterday and the hive isn't doing well. The brood pattern on my bottom super is very erratic and loads of drone comb that seem to have an strange pattern as well. I located the new queen on the second brood box (2 large supers in total) and she looks like she is laying normally on 3 frames only(nice patterns), everything else look poor. Barely any honey, erratic drone cells and sloppy brood comb. The eggs look fine but only on the 3 frames suggested above. Also, there is lot's of queen cell building on the frames. I didn't destroy the queen cells but was planning on going back tomorrow and destroying them. I just want to see what people suggest I do in this case.

What else can I do to eradicate this problem? My other hives have no evidence of chalk brood yet. 

Thank you all!


----------



## crofter

Do you have the hard mummified larva on the bottom board and outside hives? Are the areas of nicely laid eggs progressing to evenly capped cells? Just trying to find out at what stage of development that the cell contents are terminating. 

If there is hardly any honey being capped perhaps those queen cells are supercedure cells not swarm cells. Destroying them might not be best.


----------



## GregB

missgeneralidea said:


> even replaced the queen to help change the genetics but it doesn't seem to work.
> ..................
> What else can I do to eradicate this problem?


Since the genetics flip did not purge the issue (this would be my move too), I'd try a complete reset of this colony.

Just shake them out onto completely new frames in a different box.
Restart them as a small nuc while there is still time.
They should rebound well (with your help).

Assume all the brood/frames/box is "infected" and is a loss and reset it all (dump and clean out - even though the chalkbrood agent is supposed to be present everywhere at all times).
If feel adventuress, you may give the chalkbrood-ed frames to your other hive(s) and most likely they will be OK - at your own judgement.


----------



## crofter

Combining or transferring frames has never been a good experience for me except combing small (but healthy) nucs for wintering purposes. I would not put healthy colonies at risk by using them to test a diagnosis.


----------



## Some Bloke

Chalk brood is a fungus. If the hive is cool and/or damp it makes it easier for the xhalk brood to establish. Is the hive in a different position to your others - a shady spot? A slightly lower elevation? Next to water?

Does the hive have a larger volume above the queen excluder? The nurses have to keep brood around 35C, if they struggle then you can get opportunistic infections like Chalk Brood.


----------



## GregB

The only instance I had this issue (chalkbrood) was a case of crappy genetics, I feel.
They had this issue where it was totally uncalled for.
I did perform a colony reset (I shook them out into a different hive to do the reset from scratch).
But also immediately reused the "infected" hive/frames elsewhere - no issue at all.


----------



## RayMarler

Chalk has always been a genetics issue for me. Try changing your queen supplier, try to find one that has VSH queens. They tend to have better resistance traits to the brood diseases that beehives get. If the infestation is in advanced stage then change out the infected brood combs as well.


----------



## crofter

GregB said:


> The only instance I had this issue (chalkbrood) was a case of crappy genetics, I feel.
> They had this issue where it was totally uncalled for.
> I did perform a colony reset (I shook them out into a different hive to do the reset from scratch).
> But also immediately reused the "infected" hive/frames elsewhere - no issue at all.


This would seem to indicate that there is no need to take precautions of spreading by transferring combs! I doubt that "once" is enough to validate advice that is contrary to most recommendations?


----------



## GregB

crofter said:


> This would seem to indicate that there is no need to take precautions of spreading by transferring combs! I doubt that "once" is enough to validate advice that is contrary to most recommendations?


Like I said - do these things *"at your own judgement".*
As for me I would do it again specifically with the chalkbrood and not loose any sleep.


----------



## Roland

I would shake them on wax foundation and give them a feed pail, just like if they had AFB.

Crazy Roland


----------



## crofter

GregB said:


> Like I said - do these things *"at your own judgement".*
> As for me I would do it again specifically with the chalkbrood and not loose any sleep.


In this case the thread originator has already changed out the queen to no avail. Perhaps the comb is the continued repository of the fungus. Induce a brood break getting rid of all existing and incipient chalk mummies; start with new queen and frames and get the hives up off the ground if they are on pallets. If the other colonies are unaffected, all the more reason NOT to transfer equipment.

I have had some conversation with a person from an area where it is fairly widespread issue that while not devastating is a real drag. Kind of hurts nuc sales.
I questioned the OP on some of the symptoms to ensure the diagnosis was 100% chalkbrood; we have not heard back. 

I am having some experience with Sacbrood which has some of the same results though not the same appearance of the dead larvae. Infected frames can indeed be reused if depopulated and given 5 weeks or more lockdown. I can guarantee that combining is not the right answer: most definitely it also was not when the unbeknownst villain was EFB in 2017.

Consolidating bees and equipment is a good move when a bear visit is the cause of your grief.


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## GregB

crofter said:


> In this case the thread originator has already changed out the queen to no avail. Perhaps the comb is the continued repository of the fungus. Induce a brood break getting rid of all existing and incipient chalk mummies; start with new queen and frames and get the hives up off the ground if they are on pallets. If the other colonies are unaffected, all the more reason NOT to transfer equipment.
> 
> I have had some conversation with a person from an area where it is fairly widespread issue that while not devastating is a real drag. Kind of hurts nuc sales.
> I questioned the OP on some of the symptoms to ensure the diagnosis was 100% chalkbrood; we have not heard back.
> 
> I am having some experience with Sacbrood which has some of the same results though not the same appearance of the dead larvae. Infected frames can indeed be reused if depopulated and given 5 weeks or more lockdown. I can guarantee that combining is not the right answer: most definitely it also was not when the unbeknownst villain was EFB in 2017.
> 
> Consolidating bees and equipment is a good move when a bear visit is the cause of your grief.


Reset the colony - exactly what I suggested.

But, let me re-quote myself (I know - people pay no attention; me neither):


> *If feel adventuress*, you may give the chalkbrood-ed frames to your other hive(s) and most likely they will be OK - *at your own judgement*.


Which applies to me.
I tend to be that way - no secret.

Anyway, the "right" bees promptly cleanout the *chalkbrood mummies* - and that is that.
We are talking of a situation where there is one outlying colony affected by the issue (just like here).
Meanwhile, there are others right next to it and appear totally normal.

PS: clearly, I misspelled the "adventurous"


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## GregB

crofter said:


> If the other colonies are unaffected, all the more reason NOT to transfer equipment.


I personally would NOT even suggest transferring the brood in most all cases at all - due to mite cross-infestation (first and foremost).
This is exactly what is suggested on exact forum right and left and all over again.

But whatever people want to do - it is their bees and their common sense.


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## RayMarler

I'm with GregB,
I never ever put questionable bees or combs, whether it's chalk or anything else into good hives. I keep my good hives good and rebuild up from them when needed.


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## crofter

GregB said:


> I personally would NOT even suggest transferring the brood in most all cases at all - due to mite cross-infestation (first and foremost).
> This is exactly what is suggested on exact forum right and left and all over again.
> 
> But whatever people want to do - it is their bees and their common sense.


Thanks for clearing that up. 
Personally I would not be quite as neutral on peoples freedom to take the low road when the results can have impacts beyond their own yards. I have been less than squeaky clean at biohazard control amongst my own hives and have probably paid a price. My EFB experience could very likely have been nipped at several colonies instead of 6 or 7. I am a bit more on guard now but it seems there is always something new or coming around again to sneak up on us.


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## RayMarler

RayMarler said:


> I'm with GregB,
> I never ever put questionable bees or combs, whether it's chalk or anything else into good hives. I keep my good hives good and rebuild up from them when needed.


But I have in the past. That's how I learnt not to do it now. Anything suspicious and it does not get joined with any other one. Same thing with moving frames from one to another, only if I'm sure nothing is wrong health wise.


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## Jack Grimshaw

I had a severe case of chalk many years ago and tried requeening to no effect.
I finally eradicated it by shaking onto foundation twice.
A waste of my time,a waste of foundation, and the colony was a dink for that season.
I would have been better off killing it from the get go,tossing the comb and sterilizing the woodenware and then making a split from a healthy hive.
This was also the last time I bought a nuc.(it was a reputable supplier too.)


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## missgeneralidea

Thanks everyone for the responses. A few things to clarify;

1- I don't want to transfer the equipment to my other hives. If anything, I will decontamination the equipment first by freezing it, and then I burn it with a blow tourch/ wash out with bleach and put wax on the cleaned equipment. If the equipment is a goner it gets tossed.

2- I could hit "re-set" but I don't have any built wax foundation frames on hand now and low on supers. I would have to introduce new starter frames (wax strip ). Do you think it's too late to do this? Also, If I do this would I just split the hive? Take the queen with the 3 good brood patterns/ with bees and 1 frame of honey and start a new hive in a new brood box? And leave the rest of the bees in the same box with the queen cells?

3.) I don't have much land space (urban beekeeper). I would have to put this "re-set" hive right beside the current weak hive. Would this be redundant as the bees might go back into the known hive. I'm not sure.

Yikes.... I'm not sure. I'm heading to take a look again tomorrow morning and I will come back with some photos.


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## GregB

missgeneralidea said:


> Thanks everyone for the responses. A few things to clarify;
> 
> 1- I don't want to transfer the equipment to my other hives. If anything, I will decontamination the equipment first by freezing it, and then I burn it with a blow tourch/ wash out with bleach and put wax on the cleaned equipment. If the equipment is a goner it gets tossed.
> 
> 2- I could hit "re-set" but I don't have any built wax foundation frames on hand now and low on supers. I would have to introduce new starter frames (wax strip ). Do you think it's too late to do this? Also, If I do this would I just split the hive? Take the queen with the 3 good brood patterns/ with bees and 1 frame of honey and start a new hive in a new brood box? And leave the rest of the bees in the same box with the queen cells?
> 
> 3.) I don't have much land space (urban beekeeper). I would have to put this "re-set" hive right beside the current weak hive. Would this be redundant as the bees might go back into the known hive. I'm not sure.
> 
> Yikes.... I'm not sure. I'm heading to take a look again tomorrow morning and I will come back with some photos.


Simply move the existing problem hive aside.
Set a new rig in its place.
Move the queen.
Shake the bees in.
Rest of the bees will return to it.
Reduce to have them tight.
Maybe give a couple of frames of honey/bee bread (from clean hives).
Feed - they will be able to rebuild fine until the seasons end.
That's pretty clean start, right there.
While at it - treat for mites.

As for the discontinued stuff...
Probably just melt it all and torch the wooden ware - to take the safe route forward.


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## crofter

The link below is in regard to Chalkbrood infection on nesting materials but the methods also apply to honey bee equipment.

Chalkbrood in Honeybees and Leafcutter Bees • Ecrotek 

*Heat treatment*

The safest option for the alfalfa leafcutter bee is heat treatment. Use an oven or kiln that is made to circulate heat. Heating nesting material to 93 degrees Celsius will kill chalkbrood spores.

*Bleach treatment*

For this treatment, you will need bleach or sodium hypochlorite at a five-per cent strength. Dilute 100ml of bleach in 2000ml of water then spray or dip the nest boxes and other equipment in the bleach solution to kill off spores.

Replacement of the queen and the combs

Requeening and replacing the comb is a good treatment option for honeybees. Burning the comb is recommended by some beekeepers as a safe way to ensure the fungus is eradicated. The requeening process should introduce a stronger and more resilient brood population.


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