# Suggestions



## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

Tape a piece of #8 hardware cloth over both holes when it is cold and the bees are not flying. Take the tank back to your apiary and uncover the holes. Do not allow the tank to roll. You have all winter to think about how you are going to cut one end of the tank off and cut out the comb this Spring. Be sure to treat them with some OAV when you get them home.


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## squarepeg (Jul 9, 2010)

stuffing a piece of steel wool in the holes for the transport is another option.


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

Don't waste your time on it. There are so many easier ways to get another colony of bees.


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## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

Buy them from Charlie?


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

Walk away split, swarm cell split, bought queen split, baithive, buy a package.....
If your time is worth nothing, get out the blowtorch or cutoff saw. I have better things to do in my life.



JWPalmer said:


> Buy them
> from Charlie?


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## The Everything Bee Vacuum (May 1, 2018)

I'd be concerned a torch would kill much of the colony. If you move it, keep it in the shade, that metal will act like an oven even in mild sunlight.

I like the cutoff saw idea. If it's too much work, you don't have to cut all of the hole in one shot. 

That is going to be one heavy tank. Just last week I brought home a purple martin house that weighed about 100 lbs. I still need to cut it out, but I know they have plenty of honey right now!


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## Alex Madsen (Aug 26, 2018)

swarm trap?


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## little_john (Aug 4, 2014)

odfrank said:


> Don't waste your time on it. There are so many easier ways to get another colony of bees.


I thought that was a a rather harsh comment ... until I saw the pictures. Personally, I wouldn't bother. Some you win, some you don't. Could try a Hogan-style trap-out I suppose, or leave 'em be and hope they survive and then swarm.
Looks like the tank might be worth saving, rather than the bees ...
LJ


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## Eikel (Mar 12, 2014)

This isn't about the economics of obtaining the bees, it about the trip/experience of retrieving them. We've all been there, done that, still doing it in some cases; that's why we know about the economics of the retrieval. 


As already mentioned - personal opinion is wait until spring, maintain the tank's current orientation, recip saw, bring a large bucket of water, your empty frames with rubber bands and string - wear your veil.


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## little_john (Aug 4, 2014)

Eikel said:


> This isn't about the economics of obtaining the bees, it about the trip/experience of retrieving them.


How do you know that ? Are you a mind-reader ?



> We've all been there,


"All" ? What - every single beekeeper on this forum ? How do you know that ?
LJ


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## GregB (Dec 26, 2017)

Set this thing on your property, in some corner, and let them be as-is.
Capture swarms from them IF they live.

Absolutely no need to follow this pattern of "cutting bees out" - no need to cut anything out.
Somehow every random bee-tree, bee-tank, bee-barrel turns in to a cut-out.
No need for cutting into an every random, poor bee colony, in fact.

Nothing wrong with a "feral" bee-tree on a property... 
I mean a bee-tank. 
I'd take them in a heart bit and keep as-is in the weeds.

Here is a guy in Western Ukraine purposefully keeping several log hives on this apiary.
He never does anything with them, except capturing swarms from them.
One of his statements (in loose translation): "those top bars are impossible to remove now since the last time this hives have been opened 5-6 years ago". 
That is exactly his point - feral bees directly on the property.
Video shot on March 9, 2016.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssV0sBaB0Zo


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## Eikel (Mar 12, 2014)

Almost clairvoyant when using hindsight. Oi vey, mea culpa, I should have used many of us rather than all.


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

I have been in the landscaping business for 45 years selling labor. So I always do a cost/profit audit on these kind of proposals before getting involved. So many beginners are so anxious to expand their hive count they get involved in these silly "save the bees" projects without thinking about the economics. If you are not making the same pay as your day job you are wasting your time. In this case the time of your friends also. Bees already on frames are so easy to increase why start moving/torching/sawing a steel tank with only a partial chance of success?




little_john said:


> odfrank said:
> 
> 
> > Don't waste your time on it. There are so many easier ways to get another colony of bees.
> ...


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## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

Ollie, don't take the fun out of it. Sometimes the economics do not matter. It is the experience that counts. I had a bee tree trapout 23 miles from my house. I visited the site at least 8 times and ultimately did not get a single bee. I would do it again, with the hopes of being a little more successfull the next time around! Meanwhile, the splits I made did much better percentagewise. I hang swarm traps too. Several hours of work and no hits this year.


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

You are right. I don't know why I give my knowledge hard earned over decades to beginners like Charlie and Ray in an attempt to teach them to use their time efficiently. They just become competition reducing the honey market for me.
Go for it! Waste ten times what it takes to divide a hive. You are making a better world for me, I appreciate it. 



JWPalmer said:


> Ollie, don't take the fun out of it. Sometimes the economics do not matter. It is the experience that counts. I had a bee tree trapout 23 miles from my house. I visited the site at least 8 times and ultimately did not get a single bee. I would do it again, with the hopes of being a little more successfull the next time around! Meanwhile, the splits I made did much better percentagewise. I hang swarm traps too. Several hours of work and no hits this year.


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## little_john (Aug 4, 2014)

I think it's important to always bear in mind that people keep bees for different reasons - which is why I object so strongly whenever anyone assumes that others must have the same motivation as themselves. Some people keep bees for the challenges it presents - others just want to get on with the business of keeping bees with as few 'challenges' as possible.

Perhaps the most important factor to take into consideration is whether or not a person places any value on their time - some don't - I most certainly do even though I'm a hobbyist, and not in beekeeping for financial reasons.

Even though it's very time-consuming, I build my own non-standard woodenware primarily because I get enjoyment and great satisfaction from doing so - even though it would make far more economic sense to buy standard stuff ready-made. 

But - would I open-up (what appears to be) a perfectly sound tank in order to extract some bees ? No. 
Why ? Because it's 'a pig in a poke' - you have absolutely no way of knowing beforehand what the status of that colony is. It might be a tiny caste swam, it might even be queenless.

In the time it would take to open-up that tank, you could have made half a dozen swarm boxes which will be good for use over many years. In contrast, cutting open that tank is a one-off - and a one-off which may end in failure.

But - a personal choice, depending upon motivation.
LJ


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## Riverderwent (May 23, 2013)

If it’s an itch you gotta scratch, move it to your yard. Wait till early spring. Connect the main entrance to a Hogan style box with a hardware cloth corridor. Put a frame of young brood, some capped honey, and drawn comb in the Hogan box. Use the second hole to smoke and BeeQuick the bees out. Put a one way cone over the entrance. Later, open the entrances and let the bees rob it out. Or use a modified version of my wife’s recipe for cooking duck, which is dig a hole, bury the duck, then buy a chicken and cook it.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>Don't waste your time on it. There are so many easier ways to get another colony of bees.

The voice of experience. I guess if you don't mind a lot of work for little return for the experience of it, then I would wait until spring and use a sawzall to remove one end and go from there. The bees usually are not very happy once the sawzall starts vibrating everything...


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## Charlie B (May 20, 2011)

odfrank said:


> You are right. I don't know why I give my knowledge hard earned over decades to beginners like Charlie and Ray in an attempt to teach them to use their time efficiently. They just become competition reducing the honey market for me.
> Go for it! Waste ten times what it takes to divide a hive. You are making a better world for me, I appreciate it.


:v:


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## mcr (May 5, 2018)

Using a torch on this kind of tank is a bad idea for the bees and the person cutting. You will expose yourself to Galvanic poisoning from the galvanized metal. Not a fun thing to have. The heat will harm the bees. Cutting with a saws all may work or not depending on the blade and getting it started. I think a trap out would be the way to go. Or just leave them for pollination.


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## little_john (Aug 4, 2014)

I'd say to decide beforehand what the object of the exercise is: is it just the bees that are wanted, or the bees AND the combs ?

If it's the bees, then go for a trap-out - but - if you're after the combs as well, then I reckon cutting-off the end won't work too well ...

Why ? Well think about it. There you are with the end removed ... then what ? The combs will no doubt run down the length of the tank, but won't be dead straight, and so you'll only be able to see along the first inch or two of them. Cutting those combs away (bearing in mind that there'll be bees all over them) will be no picnic. My guess is that they'd come out in pieces, a few square inches at a time.

Much better - if you really MUST get involved with this (but personally, I'd caution against it) is to cut the tank open with an angle grinder fitted with one of these modern ultra-thin zip disks, which slice through steel like a hot knife through butter. With care you'll only penetrate a millimetre or two into the tank itself. Where to cut ? Well - think of that tank as if it was the Earth - and cut around it's Equator. It's a much longer cut of course, but with the bottom removed the combs will then be fully exposed.

When would I make this cut ? In deepest winter, when the bees are tightly clustered. Then, wrap some adhesive tape around the tank to hold it together, and wind a length around the cut to seal it until Spring - which is when I'd finally pull off the bottom for extraction.

That's my suggestion - take it or ignore it - but if it were my situation I'd settle for either a trap-out - or do nothing at all.

Best of luck with whatever you decide.
LJ


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## Saltybee (Feb 9, 2012)

I beat Odfrank in a swarm trap competition!!!

But now you know he was just distracting you to leave more business for himself.


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## Saltybee (Feb 9, 2012)

The grass is always greener; Always want the bee you do not have.
And sometimes that new bee is actually better.


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## Charlie B (May 20, 2011)

Saltybee said:


> I beat Odfrank in a swarm trap competition!!!
> 
> But now you know he was just distracting you to leave more business for himself.


He is a very crafty opponent


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## westtnbeekeeper (Oct 26, 2015)

Yall are funny. :applause: :lpf:

That thing looks heavy and galvanized. I would think it would have to be located in very shaded location or it would indeed get very hot in there.

I have attempted trap outs before with limited success. Usually due to the inability to limit the bees to one entry and exit point but that would not be a problem here. I don't think I would cut on this thing without a good water source handy. If sparks and heat from cutting metal ignited the wax combs inside that tank then you have a catastrophe.

If you just want the experience... I would see if they survive the winter and in the meantime study up on the hogan trap out method as mentioned above and trap you some bees during spring buildup to add to weaker hives or make splits with.

I also like the idea of puffing them with a little OAV and setting up a swarm trap nearby.

Honestly... I kind of agree with the too much trouble folks but I have more hives than I can take care of effectively so I really need to scale my operation down a bit.


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## hankstump (Jul 30, 2014)

I agree with the trap out approach/Hogan style. Set them up now, and in the spring you can add the comb of eggs when you have spare. Who knows, if your trapout box is better insulated than what they have, they may move over now. Give them some comb to move onto, as they won't make much comb for the next few months. 

Cheers, Phil


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## CLSranch (May 15, 2017)

I would take the tank and put it my woods and leave it. That being said torch bad idea for bee's unless your very experienced. As mentioned Zip disk would work better. I wouldn't worry about the galvanized. But still say you have the bee's even if they are still in the tank. The will pollinate and cast swarms for you. I say don't worry about the galvanized as someone who regularly welds on it. Fitter/Welder by trade on industrial sized scale. A glass milk of will fix 1 days over inhalation and that tank is not big enough for over inhalation.

Just my 2cents. And Happy New Year.


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## clyderoad (Jun 10, 2012)

Bee fever does strange things to the brain. Best to cure it quickly.


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