# pushing the bees to move up and draw comb



## kwest (May 16, 2009)

I have 8 hives now that i am pushing to draw foundatinless frames and to move up to supers. Last week i discoverd my two hives from the fat beeman which are booming are totally honey bound. so i started pulling frames full of honey ( they are not capped yet so not ready to extract) up to the super replacing them with empty foundationless frames not yet drawn out. it has worked so well that last night i pulled a bunch of frames up replacing them with foundationless frames. I always make sure there is a drawn out frame on each side of the empty foundationless frame. i am pulling many of them from the brood nest area to open up more room for the queen to lay. I have struggeld to get alot of comb drawn the last year it seems as though they draw out two or three boxes then they slow down but they are going gangbusters on the frames that i am swapping. just thought id share my findings.


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## bigbearomaha (Sep 3, 2009)

I don't know if you use a mix of box sizes, but if you use all meds for example, have you thought of nadiring the boxes instead of supering them.

This is the method used in Warre hives and from all I have seen, it works very well as bees build comb from the top down anyway.

Just a thought.

Big Bear


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## kwest (May 16, 2009)

big bear, what is "nadiring" the boxes instead of supering them? Yes i am switching to all mediums. i still have a bunch of deep and medium frames and boxes mixed in and what a mess it makes. Advise to anyone new starting out. if you want to go natural and foundationless. go with only mediums from the start. it makes life easy. pulling a deep frame up to a medium super makes a mess of burr comb under the frame.  great snack if they have have it filled with honey though.


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## bigbearomaha (Sep 3, 2009)

to "nadir" is to put the boxes below the current ones. to "super" is to put the new boxes on top hence honey 'supers'

So , instead of adding your additional boxes on top of the ones already there, you would pick up the existing boxes and place the empty frames underneath.

Big Bear


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## Countryboy (Feb 15, 2009)

Nadir means underneath of. Putting the empty box on the bottom board, and then stacking all the other boxes on top of it is nadiring.

Super means above. Bottom supering (different from nadiring) is a good way to get bees to draw comb. Make sure you give the bees one frame in the middle with foundation or comb to use as a ladder if you bottom super though.


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## clgs (Aug 6, 2008)

Question on the technique of putting a foundationless frame between two drawn out frames - do you use a wax strip of foundation at the top bar? I ask because I need to immediately put in more frames, but have run out of foundation. I was wondering if I could just put in my frames with not wax on them?


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## camero7 (Sep 21, 2009)

glue a Popsicle stick in the top grove for a starter and you'll be fine.


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## clgs (Aug 6, 2008)

Thank you!


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## kwest (May 16, 2009)

make sure your hive is level and the frames are pushing in tight together and they draw it straight.


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## bfriendly (Jun 14, 2009)

I have to question "putting an empty foundationless between two drawn frames" IN THE HONEY SUPERS

It may work if the "drawn frames" are capped or mostly capped, and it is a great thing to pull one frame up to get the bees working on a new box...


However, empty frame works best between two drawn combs in THE BROOD NEST ...OR between two already capped frames in a super


BUT if you put an empty frame between two uncapped honey frames, my experience tells me that chances are they will just extend out the existing comb to fill the space with honey, this can get to be a mess. They won't even draw wax on the new frame, you will not be able to get the frame out without removing all 3 frames together.


I am not sure if you are referring to the brood nest or honey supers, just thought I would point this out so others reading this don't make the same mistakes that I did when I started playing around with foundationless frames.


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