# Cathedral Hive Progress - 17 weeks in



## Pokeyjeeper (Jul 10, 2017)

Looks like there a plenty of bee on the frames in your pictures don't know about the ones on the ground in distress


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## Delta 21 (Mar 4, 2016)

Thats really looking great.:thumbsup:

Do the zombie crawlers have shriveled up deformed wings or any of the bees on the combs? That and K-wing are both symptoms that stem from varroa. 

Having a lot of bees on the ground could also be natural die off. The queen lays up to 2000 a day, sometimes a lot have to die off close to the hive. My hives are on a concrete slab so I see every one on the ground. I'm thinking I might build one of these over the winter.:scratch:


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## g1nko (Jun 16, 2016)

Inspection today with a mentor beekeeper. Lots of deformed wing virus, mite load very high at 32 per 1/2 cup so the MAQS on top of the top bars was ineffective, even with clearing out propolis from the vents. 

Not a lot of brood in the hive so we treated with 2 strips of Hopguard II; one strip at bar #3 and one at bar #8. We'll do another mite count in 3 weeks and see if the Hopguard II is effective. Since it treats phorectic mites only, we'll have to follow up with another treatment. Sucks; thought the bees were doing better than that. 

There are several beekeepers within a few miles of our hive and I know at least one of them is fiercely "treatment-free." Mr. Treatement=Free also loses 75% of his hives every year. The beekeeper who helped us out today feels treatment-free creates "mite bombs" that infest an area increasing the mite load for surrounding beekeepers. There's an incendiary comment if I ever heard one.


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## Delta 21 (Mar 4, 2016)

g1nko said:


> The beekeeper who helped us out today feels treatment-free creates "mite bombs" that infest an area increasing the mite load for surrounding beekeepers. There's an incendiary comment if I ever heard one.


Just like a neighbors dog that has fleas, ticks, distemper, kennel cough, rabies, etc. You have to take care of your pets or their problems will quickly become others. The statement may be incendiary to treatment free beeks but I think there may be some truth to it. My drones (all drones) go gallivanting all over the place, even to other hives. Just like the treatment free beek, I am trying to be as treatment free as possible AND not have to replenish my hives every year. One drone trip to a treatment free hive and now I have a new mite cycle to deal with. 

I was treatment free for the first 7 or 8 months. Until I had more crawlers on the outside of my hives than on the inside. I wouldnt have made it thru the first winter without treating and without the folks here shooting straight with me.

What are your thoughts on OA vaporization? Its quick and easy and knocks the exposed mites down pretty well. Of course I made my entrances too small to accept any OAV wands EXCEPT the Varrox thats 3/8" tall. I've spent less than $45 on parts and pieces for my manual OAV dispenser (aka - crack pipe), wood bleach, and a can of MAPP gas for my torch. Drawback - Its open flames in the bee yard. Proper precautions need to be taken. I really love the Varrox but thats probly next year. You are learning a lot though, using the different methods.


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## msl (Sep 6, 2016)

g1nko said:


> The beekeeper who helped us out today feels treatment-free creates "mite bombs" that infest an area increasing the mite load for surrounding beekeepers. There's an incendiary comment if I ever heard one.


not incendiary at all, the truth. Tom Seeley, Randy Oliver, Mike Palmer, Michael Bush all agree. And there are plenty of studys to back that up If you let you hive collapse from mite and get robbed it impacts the surrounding hives up to 2 miles away https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24772528 
not a huge deal out in the county, but in highdenisty areas it can walop you 
http://scientificbeekeeping.com/the-varroa-problem-part-6b/#mite-bombs-and-drift-of-mites
I was TF and never counted a mite till some one went 007 on bunch of packages in my neighborhood, wiped me out 


> Sucks; thought the bees were doing better than that.


 Its very good you did a roll, now you know the truth rather then come spring wondering what happened


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

If not treating is the issue, then swarms and feral bees would be the bigger problem. When treating isn't working, blaming people who aren't treating won't fix it. It's the mite bombs and the genetics from the "treaters" that worries me. Virulent mites and weak genetics.


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## msl (Sep 6, 2016)

I agree, however the vast majorly of the new TF keeper are buying those same weak genetics and virulent mites, and then purposely letting those hive colaspe because some one in the internet said letting a few hives die in their backyard would some how develop TF bees.
This kind of behavior is a back eye on the TF cause and rightly so is used as ammo against it 
TF or not you need to monitor your mites, delta's experience is a example of a success story, I would hope they try re queening with more resistance stock. but their bees are alive, and they didn't mite bomb their neighborhood.


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## Delta 21 (Mar 4, 2016)

Definitely making no claims of having it all figured out.:kn: 

Two hives within 5' of each other. Both had significant mite drop after after I treated. One didnt have any zombie crawlers or bent wing that I could see. It was very strong. The other was being wiped out. 3 blocks away is a colony in a guys attic he cant get to thats been there for at least the last 4 years without human intervention. :scratch:

My strong hive swarmed and I caught her and re-hived her into my 3rd hive. Her daughter took right over with things in the original hive.:thumbsup:

I have gotten a noticably more amount of honey the first year out of the hive that was hammered with mites. :scratch: It also had a small swarm this year. I messed around with the queen :doh: and ladies replaced her. 

I think I need to get a few traps made up for my friends back yard.:shhhh:


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