# making splits question



## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

When I make my nucs/splits that I add a queen or queen cell to, in the Spring in SC, I start with two frames of bees and brood and a frame of honey. In this 5 frame nuc, two frames are foundation. If there is a decent nectar flow on those frames of foundation will get drawn pretty quickly. Especially if there are enough bees in the nuc box.

You mentioned mating nucs. That term, "mating nucs" might mean something different to you than it does to me. To me, most of the mating nucs I am around are medium depth frames wit a top bar one third the usual length. They fit in boxes fit for their size. I imagine you mean something else?


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## Harley Craig (Sep 18, 2012)

Im guessing by 2 frame you are talking deeps like what is common in a 4 way queen castle. I can't answer for deeps, but I use 4 standard medium frames to mate a queen and can do so at the end of june and build them up to 4x3 by winter. What I like to do with these little nucs is once the queen is mated and starts laying, drop in a frame of ready to emerge brood. I call them bee bombs and they really make a little nuc take off.


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## BigBlackBirds (Aug 26, 2011)

beestudent said:


> Here this season we had 4 hives coming out of winter, and now we have 11 total, with all but those 4 growing new Queens. My question is, can a 2 frame mating nuc draw comb out into, say, a 4-5 frame nuc? That is, if I move them into a new box and let em go with feed. And also, how long for that if it is possible. And for those who don't know, I am located in central MI.



Most likely they will be able to grow into a 4-5 frame nuc without major issue BUT we don't have enough info to really tell you how quick they will move along. Here are some general ideas:

Starting this time of year in your locale, a nuc made with a cell for mating out of a deep frame of honey/pollen and two deep frames of bees/brood should be able to grow into a double deep by fall and probably make one medium full of honey using drawn comb. You won't get the same outcomes with foundation but you should have the opportunity to get many frames drawn over the course of the summer. However, that depends on weather and circumstances. Starting with only two frame nuc, you will be behind. The difference in one frame doesnt seem like a big deal but it amounts to alot of bees and resources. Making two frames splits works alot better when done early in the year; meaning further south than what you are located. 

There is also a big difference between what I have written above (what sqkcrk said also) and what you are doing. The methods which Sqkcrk and I refer to are based upon using queen cells (as in from grafting). But I suspect you are using swarm cells or emergency cells from something like a walk away split. When we drop a cell into the nuc it will emerge in a day or two. She will wander around 3-5 days and leave to mate if the weather is good. A few days later she is laying. In this case the break in the brood cycle isn't huge depending on how the nuc was made. But if you are pulling cells from a swarming or queenless hive there generally is very little brood left by the time that queen starts to lay. That will cause them to have fewer resources to feed brood, gather pollen/nectar so the growth rate will be reduced. 

Still think you won't have issues with them turning into 5 frame nucs but you probably could have made fewer but stronger nucs and been farther ahead.


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## Billboard (Dec 28, 2014)

I just broke my hives down in April and put 2 frames of bees and brood in nucs and some 3 frames. Started April 16. Today those nucs built comb and grew that they are on their second 5 frames on top. I put second box on yesterday. Everything is going good and seems to be going faster now. Gunna have to keep a close eye on them. Queens were released on the 16th of April so basically one month. It was slow going the first two weeks but as brood emerged it sped up. Oh they are in deeps too.


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## beestudent (Jun 10, 2015)

Ok, so what I did was may 5th I removed the queen and 2 frames brood. On the 13th I took some capped queen cells and made 3 splits, of 2 deep frames each 1 brood and 1 feed. The cells I added I cut off the bottom of a FL frame, checking them today, none have queens, no cells on 2 but one new capped on 1 split... so idk... also, I looked at the org. Hive they had 5 queen cells, 1 hatched, killed 3, and I saw 3 more on the opposite side of the frame. Moved it to a nuc, they have a nice virgin now. So, idk... but the org. queen filled out 4 new frames since I made the split with her on the 5th.


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