# Number of hives and employee ratio?



## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

Heintz88 said:


> I'm curious how many hives is each employee expected to be able to handle ?


H88, A good question, I think also the supporting equipment that enables a keeper to cover more ground in less time with less effort is equally important.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

....and just how much you are trying to do and how good a job you hope to do with them. In traditional honey production I have always figured its around 1,000. We are a bit higher than that but I wouldnt care to go much higher without some good part time help to get you through extracting and nucing seasons.


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

I'm running 900 or so with one full time seasonal , April to Nov and two or three school kids July to Sept. I could probably use more help in sept. 
And like the fellows mentioned earlier, equipment is that big determining factor


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## busy bee apiary (Aug 7, 2010)

Depends on if your running quality or quantity.


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## rwurster (Oct 30, 2010)

A commercial beekeeper near me runs about 1500 hives and his whole operation is run by himself and his son (hive management). The honey sales are done by the other son.


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## davidsbees (Feb 22, 2010)

One man per thousand ( with dependable equipment and help! )


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## rainesridgefarm (Sep 4, 2001)

Crews of 3 for every 2500 hives.


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## Fusion_power (Jan 14, 2005)

I've seen one heavily automated operation that was one man running 2500 colonies. He was using a truck mounted hive hoist to manipulate colonies. His outyards were located on average 5 miles apart and had about 30 to 40 colonies each. He hired one part time helper for extracting. The biggest factor was spring manipulation which he tried to do at a rate of 3 yards (about 100 colonies) per day. That was pretty much dawn to dark work.

From what I saw, about 1/3 of his colonies were marginal and he made his money from the other 2/3.


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## HarryVanderpool (Apr 11, 2005)

busy bee apiary said:


> Depends on if your running quality or quantity.


BBA wins the trophy!!
Thank you for the winning answer!!


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## The Honey Householder (Nov 14, 2008)

busy bee apiary said:


> Depends on if your running quality or quantity.


My Dad and Mom ran 1200-1500 hives (premite) and produced and avg of 55 ton of honey a year. I now work 800-900 for an avg. 68 ton of honey a year. 

You can work the bees or let the bees work you.:thumbsup:


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## Daniel Y (Sep 12, 2011)

busy bee apiary said:


> Depends on if your running quality or quantity.


That's nice to know. but do you have any numbers for each?


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## Daniel Y (Sep 12, 2011)

If I have to choose between man or machine. I will go with machine without exception. both are a continuous expense machines are more dependable. But the real deal maker is machines do not think.

I know for now I am looking at 1000 hives per person. People selection is critical.


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## jmgi (Jan 15, 2009)

busy bee apiary said:


> Depends on if your running quality or quantity.


Is there a dividing line between the two choices? I understand quantity, but what is quality? I see no reason why you can't have both at the same time with virtually no additional effort.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Let me reemphasize that these numbers are for traditional honey production, at least as I know it. I have heard stories of one man operations willing to constantly relocate and follow flows south to north that have made an insane amount of honey in a single year on 500 hives. If you are concentrating on pollination that number is probably going to be a bit different. Then there is breeding and queen production which is much more labor intensive. The hives per person ratio would be far lower......sort of. Is a baby nuc considered a hive? You get the picture. If you are making a living from your hives then none of this really matters.


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## Markt (Feb 8, 2012)

Maybe the next question should be how frequently you believe it's necessary to open a hive in spring summer and fall respectively. From that individual philosophy it's a lot easier to back figure what one person can run in a given operation.


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## Daniel Y (Sep 12, 2011)

jim lyon said:


> Is a baby nuc considered a hive?


Not in my apiary. but then I have spent some time making up a few definitions. A mini nuc is a colony.which is any amount of bees with a queen. virgin or mated. A hive is a double deep or deep and med colony with a mated and productive queen. I also know that 8 mating nucs equals 1 hive as far as space. labor will not work out that way.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

jmgi said:


> Is there a dividing line between the two choices? I understand quantity, but what is quality? I see no reason why you can't have both at the same time with virtually no additional effort.


Dividing line? No. It's a sliding scale. How many of those hives are producing income. Both our ratio and our percentage of hives producing has increased in recent years with better equipment and automation. But good beekeeping rules still apply and there is always a saturation point where you just can't make the rounds to do what needs done in a timely fashion.


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## Barry (Dec 28, 1999)

The Honey Householder said:


> I now work 800-900 for an avg. 68 ton of honey a year.


I believe you've mentioned that this is a family business, having the help of many young hands.


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## jim lyon (Feb 19, 2006)

Daniel: Make up whatever definition you choose. Mini nucs grown for future honey production differ greatly from mini nucs set up for queen production (or holes as many refer) such nucs require constant attention for restocking and maintaining. Each hole, though labor intensive, can produce a good amount of income but also require drone hives and support hives for bulk bee production. The point I am trying to make with my example is that there is no magic number because there are so many different ways to generate income from bees.


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## Keith Jarrett (Dec 10, 2006)

jim lyon said:


> there is no magic number because there are so many different ways to generate income from bees.


Well said Jimmy....
To further illustrate Jimmy point, one that does pollination requires a lot less labor than one that chases honey production, both can work out fine for the keeper in the end.


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

This is a question new Beekeepers always ask, as they dream ahead into their future venture. It's a question I asked as a beginner. 
But it's a question that can't be answered. Beekeeping is like any other business, growth creates work, the work is managed accordingly by the owner operator.

Like a mechanic shop, got your head mechanic, and a guy or two as they get busy. Once that mechanic gets so busy that he expands out of his reach, he hires a papered mechanic and then growth becomes how well he manages HR and money. 

There seems to be that magic 1000 hive number where as on guy can operate a honey production operation with a bunch of assisting help.


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## Mbeck (Apr 27, 2011)

Heintz88 said:


> What do you think the limit is that a employee could work?


I can't answer your question. 
Maybe a better question to ask is how many hives can I add if I hire one full time employee to help me?

You may only be able to "work" physically 100 hives but with help you can run 1000.
I think it's rare that a beekeeper needs an employee with the skills to run a set number of hives independent of the operation.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Seems like what I have heard from those who employ beekeepers is that they need 500 to justify the employee and 500 more to produce the profit that employee is supposed to produce.

Whatever the number is, it seems to me that having an employee or employees will focus the employer and get them out of bed earlier and make them become more organized/focused.

But, what do I know? I don't have any employees. opcorn:


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## Ian (Jan 16, 2003)

sqkcrk said:


> Whatever the number is, it seems to me that having an employee or employees will focus the employer and get them out of bed earlier and make them become more organized/focused.


Isnt that the truth


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## Heintz88 (Feb 26, 2012)

But, what do I know? I don't have any employees. opcorn:[/QUOTE]
50/50. And I'm your employee hah


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

There is another aspect to be considered in a honey production scenario:, how rich is your forage? If you add hives and add a helper, will you be spending most of your time on the road, due to bee yards being farther away? At what point does the increased mileage , hives and help cost outweigh the added income?

There is often a "sweet spot" level of help, and distance traveled. Unfortunately, that spot seems to be wandering around, due to changing conditions. 

We are very small, intensive, sedentary, and hover closer to the 500 per person. We are also one of the oldest operations in the county. What does that say? My guess is that bigger has more potential, in both directions.

Roland Diehnelt, 5th gen commercial
Linden Apiary, est. 1852


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## grozzie2 (Jun 3, 2011)

I've been reading the forums here for some years now, coming up on 3, and this type of question seems to come up quite regularily. I think the reason it comes up, is that folks are beekeepers first, and business persons second, if at all. And for that reason, folks are asking the wrong question(s), all focussed on beekeeping, with no focus on the business side.

I would stand back, and rephrase the question(s). 

Part 1 - what is my expected revenue increase, if adding an employee? 
Part 2 - what is the expected cost of adding that employee?
Part 3 - Are there any significant cost reductions from adding an employee ?
Part 4 - Is the goal to reduce personal workload, ie, a somewhat intangible result rather than a hard measureable result ?

Hive numbers only come into play, if an increase in hive numbers is required to achieve the revenue increase.

Without knowing specifics of the original posting, it's hard to make any comments, other than I think trying to relate employee count to hive count, is possibly very wrong headed, and should be looked at instead in terms of revenue and expenses, let the hive numbers fall where they need to be, to achieve the revenue targets, within the expense goals. This approach to the question, can result in either increase, or decrease, in the employee count.


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## Double_Bee (Jun 12, 2013)

We have kind of always had the idea that 500 is a good number for one guy to run by himself, but I would say that 3 guys should be able to run 1500-2000 if they work at it.


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