# Using Formic Pro/Apivar



## beemandan (Dec 5, 2005)

AlanInNJ said:


> I have Apivar strips which I was instructed to introduce when I close the hive up for the year.


I can't speak to the application of formic but Apivar is a 6 to 8 week treatment. I would not place them in hives for any longer than that.


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## Repsag (Jan 29, 2018)

I am a first year beekeeper and used Formic Pro for the first time a few weeks ago once the temps went below the accepted range. FP can be used in two 10 day cycles or in one 14 day cycle. The 10 day cycles use one strip for each of the 10 days. The 14 day cycle used both strips for 14 days, which is what I used on my hive. My hive set up is 2-10 frame deeep Langs for the brood boxes and I had on two medium honey supers. I have a lot of bees so I added a deep (frames with foundation but no comb) on top of the honey supers to give them a little extra room. I placed my two strips between the two deeps. I did not see any issues with the queen or other issues that have been reported by some others. I had some rain after the first day so I put some political signs on top of the outside cover (thank you Nancy) and that gave them a safe place to hang out. It also states to not use any other treatments for 30 days after the treatment is complete. The instructions are also on their website and on YouTube and area easy to follow. And when in doubt, call the manufacturer.

And did you do a alcohol wash or sugar roll to see where you area at with a mite count? If not you should to see if you need to treat and also a couple weeks after to see how effective the treatment was. 

Good luck, Paul


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## wildbranch2007 (Dec 3, 2008)

AlanInNJ said:


> I have a quick question about using Formic Pro which I plan to apply for the first time this weekend to my first year hive. My hive consists of three deeps.


My hives are three deeps, I tried the one formic pro, followed 10 days later by the second pad not to be totally effective. If I was to do it again, I would try the two pads under the top deep, at least that's what I'm going to try next august.


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## enjambres (Jun 30, 2013)

I also run three deeps and have had issues using the older formulation (MAQS) of the product, particularly when used in the summer when I am more likely to have brood in all the brood boxes.

Since I only use formic acid (which these days would be delivered with the Formic Pro strips) in the summer what I have tried are three things:

1) What Wild Branch suggested: putting both pads under the top box of the three;

2) Putting one pad on top of the middle and one on top of the lower one;

3) Physically moving the brood frames to consolidate them into just the two lower of the three boxes just [prior to treating and then putting both pads between the lowest and the middle boxes in the stack. (This mimics the placement in a two-box stack.)

All of these methods seemed more effective than arrangements depicted in the instructions when dealing with my extra tall hives. (Sometimes at the time I want to use formic acid my hives are actually four - occasionally five - deeps as I use deeps as supers.)

If you are planning on wintering in just three deeps, it's likely that the top box now has (or should have) only honey, sort of like a winter "super" for the bees. And the brood may now only be in the two lower boxes, so I would suggest Option #3 above (after verifying that's the way things are.)

Please read the FP instructions closely and follow the hive ventilation instructions carefully. That may present a challenge if you're close to or in robbing season and want more-reduced entrances. The treatment ventilation requirements should trump everything though. Particularly at this time of year when queen loss due would be very hard to recover from, if you even knew it had happened.

I would NOT install Apivar and then leave it in over winter. It should be removed after 6 weeks. Leaving the strips on for months exposes the surviving mites (and there are always surviving mites in every treatment scenario) to chronic low levels of the chemical that remain in the strips and which in the long run may promote resistance and a loss of effectiveness for the treatment.

Actually, I think I just would do the Apivar, starting now if you've got your honey off, and skip the Formic this year. (It will keep until next summer, if stored according to the instructions.) Its main use, IMO, is when you want, or need to treat with supers on in the late summer. You'll be able to get the Apivar strips off before it's too cold. 

And then I would recommend doing a one-shot, broodless-period, OA treatment in mid/late December to clean things up before winter. If you had the gear for OAV that's what I would do. But if not, then do an OA Dribble. OA (in some form) during the early winter brood pause is the most critical - and effective - treatment of the whole year, IMO. Especially up here in the north where we have an extended flightless period, when no new mites are brought into the hives. It sets you up for starting next year at the lowest possible mite level. Starting so low has a remarkable retarding effect on the exponential increases over the summer.

OA, like formic, is an organic acid chemical class of treatment, so you'd be getting the same change-up-the treatment benefit as you would by using Formic and then Apivar. But without the some of the risks of treatments too close together, materials left on for too-long, and possible late queen loss.

Nancy


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## AlanInNJ (May 14, 2018)

Thank you all!!! 

Alan


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## JConnolly (Feb 21, 2015)

beemandan said:


> I can't speak to the application of formic but Apivar is a 6 to 8 week treatment. I would not place them in hives for any longer than that.


Yeah, you need to follow the Apivar instructions. My Apivar went in mid Sept. It will come out at Halloween.


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## Storm (Apr 6, 2017)

Ahhhh - ever consider actually reading the directions on the label? Formic Pro is acid and not to be messed with without proper PPE.


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## Dan the bee guy (Jun 18, 2015)

Storm said:


> Ahhhh - ever consider actually reading the directions on the label? Formic Pro is acid and not to be messed with without proper PPE.


:applause::applause::thumbsup:


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## AlanInNJ (May 14, 2018)

Helpful, thank you.


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

Dealing with calendar dates is as hard as math with tape measures. I have 30 sites and hives on different schedules at some sites so I made a Google sheet spread sheet that automatically computes the removal date for me. I made it on my computer but can see it on my smartphone in the field. I am behind and this spreadsheet will help me catch up.


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