# Best SHB trap?



## Bens-Bees (Sep 18, 2008)

What's the best SHB trap in your opinion? 

I was thinking about getting AJ's beetle eater traps, but now I'm not so sure they're the best... I've been seeing a lot of people raving about the one that sits at the bottom. So what's your favorite and why?


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## dixie_beek (Aug 4, 2009)

I have the big bottom board oil pans and the AJ's. I like the bottom board pans much better. The AJ's are very hard and tedious to load cleanly with oil, IMO.


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## scdw43 (Aug 14, 2008)

I have this week built and placed the bottom oil pan traps on two of my hives. You can go to see the 24 hour results in my post in the pest forum. I believe these will eliminate your SHB problem. I had caught over 60 in 24 hrs. You can adapt an exsiting SBB or you can build one from scratch. The web site below might be of help.
Try it, David

http://www.greenbeehives.com/


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## Grant (Jun 12, 2004)

AJ's are not my favorite. I've covered them with a piece of shingle. The beetles hide in between the little teeth and only a few of them actually enter the oil for their fatal swim.

I prefer the sandwich container traps. Plans are listed in multiple locations within this forum. Search the archives. Linda's blogspot is highly recommended. I set my sandwich traps on top of the inner cover, then set an empty super around it to give me the space I need for my outer cover.

Hood traps are a close second. The fit on frames and will sit in the #1 or #10 position in the super. Red wine vinegar and apple cider vinegar work as great baits.

My third choice is the CD jewel case. Knock out the wedges on the sides to present an opening. You can bait it or simply leave it plain. Pull it out of the hive and drop into a cooler of ice water. No chems, no in-hive attractants, no residues. These traps will fit under the inner cover, provide a hiding place for the beetles. 

Grant
Jackson, MO


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## Bens-Bees (Sep 18, 2008)

Grant, I'm a little confused by your post. Are you putting the AJ's beetle eaters in the hive? If you are, then what's the shingle for?

The CD jewel case seems like it's just creating a safe home for them until you remove it and kill the ones in there... and I rarely open up my hives, so that wouldn't work too well for me at all... plus the standard oil traps like the AJ's beetle eater or the oil pan both are organic with no chemicals or anything to worry about in the hive.


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## bluegrass (Aug 30, 2006)

One problem with any of the oil based traps is that the hives have to be perfectly level, which is fine if you are only treating a couple of hives, but if you are doing any more than that it becomes a lot of work.


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## Bens-Bees (Sep 18, 2008)

That's true, but what non-toxic alternatives work?

Also, I see this product called a 'Beetle Board' at kelleybees.com... what the heck is that for?


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## theriverhawk (Jun 5, 2009)

The "beetle boards" are simply the corrogated plastic traps. I have used them recently. So far, I give them a 5 on a scale of 1-10. Some killed beetles, numerous hiding under the board. At least that means the bees are keeping them corralled under there!


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## NasalSponge (Jul 22, 2008)

There is a new one in the latest Bee Culture that looks promising....forget the name and I am not at home right now but they use oil and are disposible plus the hive does not have to be level. I will post the info when I get home.


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## TwT (Aug 5, 2004)

look at these traps

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0mO-cYTZ58


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## jbford (Apr 17, 2009)

those are the Beetle Barn traps. Rossman sells them for about $1.50 each.

I agree with the fellow in the video, propolis does not stick to the plastic they are molded from and it flicks right off.


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## Tim B (Apr 16, 2009)

*Gentlemen and ladies, why wouldn't a trap that killed*

shb's with an electric shock work? Something like the bug zappers that kill night time bugs but working off dc current. Make a box with two contact wires inside. When the beetle climbs in to hide, he hits both wires he is zapped and then falls out the bottom. Power it with a small lithium battery and let hit hang between frames. Something could even be concocted using a small 12 v. electric fence charger in each bee yard with a hot and ground wire run between hives and plug the device in. The only maintenance would be to remove propolis and change the battery. Are there any engineers out there who could work on something like this? So far the solutions I am seeing for shb's are too labor intensive or cumbersome. Those suckers have really cost me this year and I'm determined to find a final solution.


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## Grant (Jun 12, 2004)

SgtMaj said:


> Grant, I'm a little confused by your post. Are you putting the AJ's beetle eaters in the hive? If you are, then what's the shingle for?


The shingle is a mandatory addition recommended by the manufacturer. Some people use vinyl flooring tile. The trap needs something to entice the beetles to enter the trap, and hopefully, enter the oil.

Grant
Jackson, MO


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## Bens-Bees (Sep 18, 2008)

Why would a shingle entice them to enter the trap as opposed to the inner cover? Also, I thought the beetled never wanted to enter the trap but were run into them by the bees chasing the beetles?


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## Barney (Jul 9, 2005)

Can't beat TWT answer! Cheap effective uasy to use!
Barney


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## bluegrass (Aug 30, 2006)

The best and cheapest trap hands down is lots of bees.:thumbsup:


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## Grant (Jun 12, 2004)

SgtMaj said:


> Why would a shingle entice them to enter the trap as opposed to the inner cover? Also, I thought the beetled never wanted to enter the trap but were run into them by the bees chasing the beetles?


Beats me. From what I can detect and deduce from previous posts, the original design for the AJ's Beetle Eater didn't work out as hoped. To enhance the trap's performance, it was recommended rather strongly that you had to cover the trap with a shingle or piece of floor tile.

That's the best I can tell you. This recommendation was coming from the guy who designed it and/or sells it. Go into the archives, search out the topic and read his posts. 

Grant
Jackson, MO


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## Panhandle Scott (Jul 11, 2009)

NasalSponge said:


> There is a new one in the latest Bee Culture that looks promising....forget the name and I am not at home right now but they use oil and are disposible plus the hive does not have to be level. I will post the info when I get home.


Are you talking about "Cutt's Better Beetle Blaster" 

The inventor, Laurence Cutts lives just a few miles away from me. He seels them for I believe $1.00 a piece if you order a hundred and I think 1.50 in smaller lots.

I saw one last weekend, seems to work pretty well. He had a mason jar full of SHB's he had collected using that trap.

Not endorsing his product but it might be worth checking out.


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## hoodswoods (May 15, 2009)

I use both AJ's (which are a pain to fill, locate and since they reside within the hive body - a pain to refill/maintain (unless you like going into the hive every week or so).

I like the west hive design, which is essentially a screened bottom board with #6 or #8 screen (can't remember which) and a well of a rear-removable pan of oil/vinegar...

I didn't like the guage of metal they provided (too flimsey) so I made my own bath pan out of heavier galvanized sheet metal. I also hated replacing my SBB with something without much ventillation so I modified the design by placing a vent box above the unit.

Only use oil in metal pans - vinegar will eat out anything but plastic. This works great for me - but I spent the time to be sure my hive was level from the get-go. Figure out another method to top-vent your hive other than propping up the inner cover - any unprotected space SHB can access is a disaster. Keep your hive compact and free from spaces where SHB can hide from the bees - I had to do a major modification on my top box feeder bcause there were places beetles could hide that the bees could not access (major # of beetles).

The pan also collects other small critters like mites, etc. and I can remove, clean and refill without disturbing the bees.


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## rkr (Oct 30, 2008)

Anyone know what the "bait" is that was used in the "Beetle Barn" type traps that TwT posted a youtube link to in Post#10? I would be interested to know if it was a poison and what kind. I see the place for the checkMite, but he was using something from a tube.

RKR


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## peletier (May 5, 2007)

Judging from the "syringe" being used, I'd say it was either "Combat" or "MaxForce" ......roach poisons. Both use Fipronil as the poison. There is supposed to be an attractant in the mix also which might help lure the beetles into the trap. As I understand it, Fipronil is not approved for use inside beehives but it looks like Australia is considering it.

http://www.rirdc.gov.au/programs/es...lts/project-details.cfm?project_id=PRJ-004606

Fipronil is toxic to bees and has gotten a black eye after being used as a general spray on honeybee forage crops, causing bee losses in Europe and Australia.


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## SlickMick (Feb 28, 2009)

I must admit I am surprised by that. In Queensland there is no such move that I am aware of although I would be interested to know there is anyone with more up to date info on that.

Commercialising a trap such as that mentioned would not necessarily stop beeks from making their own at a discounted cost especially if all it needs is a bit of corrugated board or a cd case

I remain to be convinced that fiprinil within the hive is a good thing

Mick


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

SgtMaj said:


> What's the best SHB trap in your opinion?
> 
> I was thinking about getting AJ's beetle eater traps, but now I'm not so sure they're the best... I've been seeing a lot of people raving about the one that sits at the bottom. So what's your favorite and why?


How many beetles are you seeing in your hives? Are they really a problem or is it just that you don't think that they should be in your hives at all? Just curious.

In general, not specifically in Sgts case, how much of a problem are SHBs in Tennessee?


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## peletier (May 5, 2007)

Small hive beetles don't eat comb, don't kill bees,....heck, I'm not sure they even eat honey. What they do is lay eggs. The larva from those eggs tunnel through the combs, eating honey and leaving feces which cause the remaining honey to ferment. It is a sight to behold. This, of course, grosses out the bees and they leave. What is left is a slimey, wormy mess.

In my experience, the only bees that pay even the slightest attention to the beetles are those in a closely packed hive and they just push them around a little. (Why don't they STING them?)

If there are beetles in the hive, trouble is around the corner.


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## SlickMick (Feb 28, 2009)

I would have to agree with what Peletier has said although I have heard that they will eat bee larva and eggs. The adult shb is simply an egg laying machine and it is the larva that causes all the damage.. no beetles = no larva = no damage, but if they are present you have to manage them or they take over.

From my observations the bee attempts to sting the beetle but is unable to for 2 reasons at least. The beetle has a hard exoskeleton and the bee does not seem able to get its sting far enough under to do any damage.

Fully covered frames seems to be the main way of the bee managing the shb. Human assistance in the form of traps, location in the sun and other things is also important

Mick


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## Bens-Bees (Sep 18, 2008)

sqkcrk said:


> How many beetles are you seeing in your hives? Are they really a problem or is it just that you don't think that they should be in your hives at all? Just curious.
> 
> In general, not specifically in Sgts case, how much of a problem are SHBs in Tennessee?


Well I found 2 adults this year in just one of my hives, no signs of larval damage, and I was able to kill both adults that I did find. We have had absolute crap for weather this year though... I think we've had about twice as many rainy days as sunny days since about July, and as I understand it... SHB love the rain. So no real problem yet, but I want to make sure they keep from being a problem down the line you know?

The hive itself has remained fairly strong (at last inspection it had 10 deep frames completely covered in bees from top to bottom and side-to-side, with a few additional bees (maybe 1-2 thousand) in the two medium supers that are also on this hive).


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## Dr.Wax (Apr 30, 2008)

peletier said:


> (Why don't they STING them?)


They can't sting them because they are basically armor plated.

What I wonder is why sometimes they actually feed them.


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## Rohe Bee Ranch (Feb 12, 2008)

Dr.Wax said:


> They can't sting them because they are basically armor plated.
> 
> What I wonder is why sometimes they actually feed them.



Keeping some of them as pets maybe?


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## notaclue (Jun 30, 2005)

I kept timing out (dial-up) and after four plus hours I was able to get partially through. If memory serves (normally doesn't) he had a bait in the tube, whether that was poison of some type I do not know. Also the center was for a cumaphose strip (?) and that some folks like to use boric acid, which he didn't like because it's too messy. 


Did I get it right?

The video I saw that showed them being fed by the bees, it was theorized that, maybe, they beat their antennae to simulate wings and fool the nurse bees into providing some tucker.


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## Gene Weitzel (Dec 6, 2005)

Dr.Wax said:


> They can't sting them because they are basically armor plated.
> 
> What I wonder is why sometimes they actually feed them.


I have seen some of my bees pull off their wing plates and tear them apart. So far, I have not observed the bees feeding them, but then my bees have been exposed to them for quite a while and I select for the bees that harass and fight with them (it has been my experience that Russians and ferals do this more than Italians, although the MH Italians are better at it than others).


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## SlickMick (Feb 28, 2009)

Seeing the bees tear the wings off the shb must be a wonderful sight. I look forward to the day.

You might have something there Gene if you can breed them up.

Mick


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## Hambone (Mar 17, 2008)

Gene Weitzel said:


> (it has been my experience that Russians and ferals do this more than Italians, although the MH Italians are better at it than others).



I agree. Mine are night and day different on how they handle the SHB. Mine. From best to worst in order.

Feral’s – Virtually no SHB and when I see one during an inspection they are after them.
Weavers – About the same as the Feral’s, but there are a few more noticeable, but they harass pretty well.
MH – More in there than I care to have, but they keep them at a manageable population.
Italians – It’s almost an open invention for the SHB to come on in and party with them.

My Feral and Weaver’s seem to keep a higher population of bees though. Which helps me keep the boxes full of bees. Not stuffed, but full. Which really seems to help. 

I am also going to take you’re advice Gene. I am going to switch to migratory lids with no inner cover.


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## hoodswoods (May 15, 2009)

I've run both AJ's and the west (bottom pan with screen). I can check and change the west type w/o ever suiting up. Altho the AJ's had beetles in them, I'm not willing to go into the hive that often, PLUS if the top entrance to the AJ's gets dislocated from the trap, the trap falls down in between frames and is a pain to recover.

If you use a metal pan, forget any of the vinegars and use oil - vinegar will eat up any metal very quickly.

Keep your hives tight and forget about propping up the inner cover with a stick for a vent, or using a hive-top feeder that is not solid on the bottom - they love nooks and crany's and unprotected spaces.


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## Bens-Bees (Sep 18, 2008)

hoodswoods said:


> Keep your hives tight and forget about propping up the inner cover with a stick for a vent, or using a hive-top feeder that is not solid on the bottom - they love nooks and crany's and unprotected spaces.


Yeah I noticed that when I was making several of the miller hive top feeders, so I decided to fill in those gaps by gluing in little pieces of wood. I thought about using wood filler as well but I'm not sure it would be as durable.


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## Myron Denny (Sep 27, 2009)

Some where on this list I have read that the oil in the pans below the screens needs to be changed daily, is there a reason for this?

I am working on my design for a screened bottom board with a vegetable oil pan, I am hoping to check these weekly, what kind of problems am I going to encounter?


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## SlickMick (Feb 28, 2009)

Myron Denny said:


> Some where on this list I have read that the oil in the pans below the screens needs to be changed daily, is there a reason for this?
> 
> I am working on my design for a screened bottom board with a vegetable oil pan, I am hoping to check these weekly, what kind of problems am I going to encounter?





The only reason you might want to check them any more frequently than weekly is to see if they are doing their job or if you have a heavy infestation. My traps have been in position since 1 October and even though they are getting scungy with dead beetle and cappings they are doing their jobs and the only reason I will do something about them is to filter the oil and re-use it.

Mick


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