# HoneyComb Cassettes



## davlanders (Jun 20, 2004)

Have any of you used the ready made comb packing systems like the ones at www.beeosphere.com ?

If so, how do you like it? Any comments?


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## BeeMiner (Aug 8, 2003)

Hi!

Check out the Equipment/Hardware Review forum. There's a current thread of discussion about the Bee-o-Pac's there with about 58 replies. Quite a few members are experimenting with the Bee-o-Pac's.

Mark


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## carnica bee (Jan 11, 2004)

Beeminer, how did you get your name.The reason im asking is that I gold mine, & also keep bees. Just curious......


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## BeeMiner (Aug 8, 2003)

Hi, carnica bee!

I used to do a little hobby prospecting in some of the rivers of the Cascades using a small 4' dredge. When I started beekeeping, getting into the hives to see if the bees made any of that "liquid gold" reminded me of the feeling I got while prospecting. I thought to myself, "Hey, I'm a bee miner!" 

Mark


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## BeeMiner (Aug 8, 2003)

davlanders,

Did you locate the Bee-o-sphere thread? Just in case you didn't, here's a link to it - http://www.beesource.com/ubb/Forum12/HTML/000259.html


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## davlanders (Jun 20, 2004)

I found it; thanks so much.

Does the square cassette system sold by Dadant basically do the same thing as this?


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

It is a similar concept in some respects and not in others.

Essential concepts of Bee-O-Sphere:

Works in a standars sized, unmodified super.

Is a 4 oz package when done.

The bees build the comb in the package.

It's a half comb meaning the back of the package is the "midrib" of the comb.

The package is the thin clamshell kind of plastic material so it takes very little plastic to make the container.

The Dadant is basically a Hogg Half Comb system and it had the following characteristics:

Requires a special modified super. Not a standard depth and has other hardware in it.

Is an 8 oz package when done.

The bees build the comb in the package.

It's a half comb meaning the back of the package is the "midrib" of the comb.

The package is the heavy plastic material so it takes more plastic to make the container.

To contrast these let's also look at a Ross round:

Requires a special modified super. Not a standard depth and has other hardware in it.

Is an 8 oz package when done.

The bees build the comb in the package.

It's a FULL comb meaning the "midrib" of the comb is in the center of the box. You can cut the comb out of the box and put it on a plate.

The package is the heavy plastic material so it takes more plastic to make the container.

Since it is round there is no problems getting the bees to fill in the corners.


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## davlanders (Jun 20, 2004)

Wow, that was a great comparison. I just bought a ross round super and was thinking about trying the beeosphere system next year or the dadant cassette, so I wanted to know the difference. 

Do you think any of them would be more advantageous for a beginner over the others?


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## Dee (Apr 22, 2004)

i was going to buy the stuff for the RR (Ross Rounds) but i went with the BOP (bee-o-pac) because if i decide that i dont want to do comb honey i wont have the extra equipment laying around.
also to buy the covers i see that the minimun to be able to buy is 200 count. i didnt have the extra cash to be able to do that, not to mention the foundation you have to buy to put in and the modified super

i did a comparison money-wise and the BOP's are cheaper by far, as well as a better profit.

The BOP is about $60 WITH shipping for 128/4oz comb containers and lids, then the medium super for $9 (of which i already had). So the total for the BOP is around $69 shipping including.

now the RR, for sake of ease you buy the RR complete set-up giving you 32/8oz containers for $53 (at Dadant) plus shipping (but i would be able to do a pickup myself), then you have to buy the foundation for $8 (minimum of 28 sheets/box), then you have to buy the covers minimum of 200 for $27 - granted you'll be using 2 per comb. So the total for the RR is around $88 PLUS shipping.

No cost of lables so far, but i do believe the RR's need some sort of label or tape to hold the two covers together and according to the BOP website the lid should snap in place (i dont know yet for sure).

For the RR the going selling price (i think) is around $4.50 so net profit is $56.00 and shipping still needs to apply (32 x $4.50 = $144 - $88 = $56)

For the BOP they say the going selling price should be around $3.00 (dont know yet) so the net profit is $315.00 shipping already included (128 x $3 = $384 - $69 = $315)

just my 2 cents worth, hope it helps
Deanna


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## oregonsparkie (Apr 12, 2004)

WOW...

Fellow prospectors/beekeepers..

It is a small world.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

The Bee-O-Pacs are much less of an investment. They fit a standard medium super with no special equipment.

But I've only bought them this year and haven't got any filled yet. So I can't say for sure.

The best for a beginner is probably just cut comb. It's easy enough.


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## Guest (Jun 28, 2004)

Deanna said:

> i did a comparison money-wise and the BOP's are cheaper 
> by far, as well as a better profit.

What Deanna forgot to consider was that her own math shows
that the initial investment in Ross Round gear is recovered 
with the first harvested crop of comb honey, and for subsequent 
harvests, the profits are much larger. The subsequent harvests
require one to only buy foundation and covers for Ross Rounds.

For the Bee-O-Pac, one must re-purchase the entire kit with
each harvested crop of honey, and one never makes a larger
profit.

If 200 covers are bought for $27, then the price of covers
"per filled super" would be ($27 / 200) * (2 * 32) = $8.64

If 28 sheets of foundation are bought for $8, the cost of 
foundation "per filled super" would be ($8 / 28) * 8 = $2.28

So, in the second year, one sells a full super of Ross Round
combs with a "cost" of only $8.64 + $2.28 = $10.92, while the
Bee-O-Pac system will cost you the same amount each year ($69.00)

To go further, any unfilled sections in the Bee-O-Pack are
very expensive "waste", as one must destroy the "frame" to be 
able to sell any filled sections. With the Ross Rounds, one's 
"cost of waste" is much much lower, as one has only wasted 1/4 
a sheet of foundation, and has not wasted any covers.

Further, if a 8 oz Ross Round comb sells for $4.50, how does
anyone expect to sell a 4 oz Bee-O-Pac comb for $3.00 ????

Further still, will the bees fill all 128 Bee-O-Pac sections ? 
I dunno - my Bee-O-Pac order arrived far too late for our main 
honey flow, and therefore cannot be given a fair trial until 
next spring.


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## Dee (Apr 22, 2004)

its not that i "forgot"
i was doing a comparison as if you would not do any more comb the next season and i know its not much difference but the every yr expense would be $60.00 - knocking off the $9 for the super

as long as your customers never bought the 8oz RR they wont know any difference from $4.50 to $3.00 for 4oz

i as well dont know how they will sell i'm just like everyone else trying it out but also i was writting my oppinion being i've never tried ANY comb honey and since i dont know if i want to continue with it next year that is why i did a comparison price-wise and went with the BOP instead of the RR for sake of extra equipment laying around example being (don't take this personally-not picking on anyone) http://www.beesource.com/ubb/Forum7/HTML/000201.html 
Deanna


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## Guest (Jun 28, 2004)

There are NO business decisions that can
be based soley upon the relative up-front
investment when the two figures are so
close to each other.

It is true that if one's customers have
never seen comb honey before, one could
charge whatever one wanted for a 4 oz
section. It is also true that one could
charge whatever one wanted for an 8 oz
section! Regardless, one cannot claim 
that the price of an 8 oz section is 
somehow cast in stone while claiming that
one could somehow "charge more" for the
4 oz simply because it is new.

My problem with the Bee-O-Pac is that it
appears to violate several basic concepts
of comb honey production that have been 
studied to death in attempts to better 
understand how to make more comb honey.

1) There are no movement paths around the
comb super for non-comb making bees to 
use.

2) The sections are square. The problem
with the old basswood (square) sections
was that the corners would not get filled,
which led to progress in the form of 
round sections. Why go back?

3) The "foundation" is plastic rather than
wax, something that has been debated for
years, with the best that can be said 
about plastic being "the bees can be
convinced to draw it out".

That said, compress a colony into a small
enough space during a good enough nectar
flow, and they will draw comb no matter
what barriers they face. The questions in
my mind are all about how MUCH comb honey
I can make per hive in a season, and what
advantage might be offered by this new
product, if any.


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## Dee (Apr 22, 2004)

your right in the way of long term investment $$ for the RR, i'm not arguing with you there, i was going to buy the RR myself until i heard of the BOP on this site

From my wallets' view point this year i was hoping for less cash out and more cash in (provided all 128 DO get filled, i myself was questioning that)

also, like you, i wanted to try it out


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

>My problem with the Bee-O-Pac is that it
appears to violate several basic concepts
of comb honey production that have been 
studied to death in attempts to better 
understand how to make more comb honey.

>1) There are no movement paths around the
comb super for non-comb making bees to 
use.

True. I guess we'll all find out how that effects it.

>2) The sections are square. The problem
with the old basswood (square) sections
was that the corners would not get filled,
which led to progress in the form of 
round sections. Why go back?

But they did cut the very corner so they aren't perfectly square. Of course they aren't round either.

>3) The "foundation" is plastic rather than
wax, something that has been debated for
years, with the best that can be said 
about plastic being "the bees can be
convinced to draw it out".

We'll all have to see how the bees like it, but it means less wax in the comb honey. It also (as all half comb systems) means you have to scrape the comb honey out of the container. I'm fond of cutting off a slice and laying the slice on my toast. For that you have to have a full comb like you get in RR or cut comb or section boxes.


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## Bman (Jun 10, 2004)

Ive heard that comb honey producers often feed the colony to fill the comb. I think they do this with honey. Heres any idea i would like to try, how about feeding the bees fruit juices? Say orange juice, then grape, then strawberry......would this change the color/flavor of the honey? Maybe the beeopacs would look like a rainbow from the back.


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## John Russell (Aug 8, 2003)

NOT a good Idea.
The bees would end up with dysentry at the very least even if they took up the fruit juice. To many impuritys and their digestive systems are not ment to sift or filter out much more than simple and complex sugars.
I wouldnt recomend it.

John Russell


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