# Old bee hives



## squarepeg (Jul 9, 2010)

the biggest risk of using the old boxes is that they might be contaminated with american foul brood (AFB) spores. i believe that some have shown that you can kill these spores by baking them in an oven for two hours at (i think) 270 degrees. new boxes are relatively inexpensive compared to the losses you could have from this disease. welcome to the forum.


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## DaveShuck (Nov 26, 2011)

Thanks for the help. I'll bake a set and have a local keeper look at them for me. If I wanted to buy a new set of frames, where is a good place to look. (Sorry if I'm not supposed to ask questions about specific stores. Some forums don't like people doing that.)


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## squarepeg (Jul 9, 2010)

i think those kind of questions are no problem here. shipping costs add a lot to your price, maybe your local folks know of a supplier within driving distance.


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## beehonest (Nov 3, 2011)

There are several companies offering free shipping, there's a thread about black friday specials or something like that. Mann Lake has free shipping all the time, min $100. order. Brushy mountain has free shipping Monday and again in December with $100 order.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

DaveShuck said:


> I'll bake a set and have a local keeper look at them for me.


Where? In your wifes' oven? Oh yeah, she'll love you for that.

To quote Pres. Bush the Elder. "Nope, wouldn't do it. Not prudent."

And, your local beekeeper won't be able to see anything one way or the other.

Burn the frames and scorch the supers either by building a stack of supers, dribbling kerosene down the insides and setting on fire. Then knocking the stack over and putting out the fire before it burns thru the hand holds. If you can't scrape much charcoal off of the insides, you didn't burn enuf.

You could use a hand held torch. Or the same burn pile you burned up the frames on. That's the best way to avoid the possibility of AFB.

There's no such thing as a free kitten.


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## mac (May 1, 2005)

Ask the person who used them why they had them stored for 10 years and ask them if they ever had or treated for foul brood. If they say no just use them.


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

That'll work. If the owner is still alive. Widows don't usually know much.


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## Steve10 (Nov 19, 2008)

I'm with Mark. You're just asking for trouble and it's not worth the risk. Think of them as free firewood.

With all the free shipping deals on now, buy a complete hive or two. It's the smartest money you can spend and they'll last a lifetime. If you like to build things, reverse engineer the hives you buy. Odds are even with your free labor, you can't build them as cheap. But, if you like to tinker, have at it. I like to build stuff, but I buy the standard stuff (boxes, bottom boards, covers, frames) and make the special stuff (division boards, feeder shims, mating nucs, etc.)

The American Foulbrood spores are impossible to kill, short of a bon fire! Cook some hot dogs and drink some beer while they burn. Beekeeping is fun!


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## DaveShuck (Nov 26, 2011)

mac said:


> Ask the person who used them why they had them stored for 10 years and ask them if they ever had or treated for foul brood. If they say no just use them.


I'll ask him about foul brood. The farmer I got all the equipment from stopped having bees because he and his wife retired. Doesn't make sense to me, but that is what he said. My guess is that he stopped loving the bees and lost interest. He did ask me if I could put some of the hives on his soybean farm. He has 200 acres. I don't want to put them there if he used pesticides, but there are acres of unmowed cow and horse fields all around his land. 

By the way, here is a list of the parts he gave me:
14 deep boxes
140 deep frames
3 short boxes
30 short frames
5 hive stands
5 queen excluders
6 hive bases
7 hive lids (telescoping?)
7 raised covers
6 front feeders with jars and lids

There was more, but it had dry rot.


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## Roland (Dec 14, 2008)

I vote with SQKCRK. Although this is pre CCD, we have found used equipment to not be worth the expense of using it. We are trying to replace anything "used" as fast as we can.

Crazy Roland


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## Mtn. Bee (Nov 10, 2009)

Scorch the inside of the boxes with a propane flame thrower and get rid of the frames.
Worked for me!


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## PFCBeetleBailey (Apr 28, 2011)

Burn the old stuff and call Brushy Mountain!! It's just not worth the risk of AFB. I'm with Steve on the bonfire -- only make it dark 8 year bourbon!
Beetle Bailey
Brushy Mountain Bee Farm - Home Office
610 Bethany Church Road
Moravian Falls, NC 28654
1-336-921-3640


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## Scrapfe (Jul 25, 2008)

Mites may have driven him out of beekeeping, or like others hinted it could be something else. But if the equipment is free there is no reason for him to lie to you. 

I recommend that you make 3 or 4 neat stacks with the empty boxes, setting ever corner of each lower box on a brick or similar object to allow air flow. Unwind a garden hose, and be sure the nozzle is attached, then turn on the water, test for water pressure and flow before proceeding. Next loosely stuff 8-12 sheets of dry newspaper in the bottom box of each stack. Put a lit match beneath each stack of boxes. Allow the fire to burn out or char the inside of each stack of boxes. Use the hose to put out any blaze that threatens to consume the boxes. Be doubly doubly sure that all fire is out before storing the boxes. 

As for the frames I think it is a good idea to to get new ones if for no better reason than the old ones may be rickety and come apart on you during your first inspections. Keep the jars and the tops, boiling them for a spell will sterilize them, but toss the entrance feeder bases. If you don’t wish to use a propane torch to sterilize the tops, excluders, and bottom boards, I guess baking them in the oven will work.  If you are married and your wife gives you her blessings to use your family’s oven in this fashion, don't let that woman get away, you hear? She's a keeper!!! :lap:


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## ldh1006 (Nov 12, 2011)

he said he just....y call him a liar...use the equipment...lucky u


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## ldh1006 (Nov 12, 2011)

just quit...no diseases


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## Hoskee (Nov 1, 2008)

Just use the equipment and see what happens. Starting out you have a lot less to lose than an established beekeeper who could lose his entire apiary or operation. I have used old equipment lots of times and never got AFB. Rotten boxes that still have structural strength can be repaired by cutting out the rotten parts and splicing in scrap wood. I put hive bodies on their side and give them a push. If they move they become bait hives in trees but if they resist my push they get refurbished.

Hoskee


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Sure, go ahead. What could you loose? You certainly will learn something either way. Forwarned is forarmed.

I gave my opinion earlier, based on experience, but, also, I will say, it won't have any effect on me should you develope AFB. And, statistically speaking, one more case of AFB or two won't mean alot to all the healthy hives where you live.

AFB does not spread like the plague. If it did, I would have nothing but AFB infected hives. At one time AFB levels were epidemic in many States in the US. Thus the advent of the Apiary Inspection Programs.


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## kilocharlie (Dec 27, 2010)

I was out in the Mojave desert last year - no bees around to be seen - and I keep thinking that I'd like to get a bunch of used hives out there and take all my "bad bees" that I would normally cull and give them a case of AFB on purpose. Any survivors would be of interest as possibly AFB resistant. This is probably better done on an island off the mainland >20 miles out.

I'm not about to actually go do it...I don't have the time or the money.


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## beegineer (Jul 5, 2011)

Dave good to have you on the forum there is a man-lake rep in overland park he is very helpful and you can pick your stuff up right from his home . Do you all ready have bees for your hives ? That would be a major factor in my view , if not i would go with new stuff at least boxes and frames


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## DaveShuck (Nov 26, 2011)

I have 2 hives that I picked up a few months ago. They are doing well. 

If I do use these new hive parts that I just picked up, they'll not live on my land.


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## millerwb (Oct 31, 2011)

I would use them and see what happens. I would hate to destroy/throw away perfectly good wooden-ware out of fear.

Start them with a split in the Spring with a new queen. Little invested and they could be fine. If they are not, little lost but time. We all have lots of that anyway.


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## kilocharlie (Dec 27, 2010)

Hey, Dave, I just got 3 used hives myself! The only difference is they have bees in them. The diseases present included Varroa mites, wax moths, Small Hive Beetles, and sac brood.

I set them on a screened bottom board and shook powdered sugar on them...too many mites to count! I then did the unthinkable...I saved their collective @$$es with a harsh chemical miticide (they would NOT have survived), fished out all the wax moth worms and beetles I could see, and fed them fresh, clean 2:1 syrup with essential oils (Honey B Healthy) and Nosevit, and a pollen/sugar/lard/HBH patty. I'll let you know if they make it through winter. 

By the way, they are in a quarantine yard far from my other apiaries. Also, they're meaner than a SWAT team of rookie cops in bad shoes and damp undershorts. I will be inspecting them often as we have been having some mild weather here in So. Cal. this winter and I am watching for those sunken brood caps (that indicate American Foulbrood) and poking a tooth pick into anything that looks sunken! 

A buddy of mine warned me about setting fire to a live colony with AFB - make sure they can't escape the fire! they will take the AFB with them and expose other feral colonies in the area. Another old beekeeper says to use Tylan and let them deal with it...in a quarantine yard! Good luck.


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## heaflaw (Feb 26, 2007)

sqkcrk said:


> Burn the frames and scorch the supers .


Why not scorch the frames as well?


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## fish_stix (May 17, 2009)

The frames are where the AFB would have developed, not on the boxes, it's American Foulbrood, not American Foulbox. The spores will be in every hive, live or dead, but they need certain conditions to evolve into the brood disease. Burn the frames and scorch the boxes, you just need to get the wood hot enough to kill the spores, not turn it to charcoal. I use a brush/weed torch after scraping the big deposits of propolis and comb off. AFB is not the problem it once was. See this post for a good treatise on AFB, http://www.beesource.com/forums/sho...-Foulbrood-(afb)&highlight=American+Foulbrood.


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## heaflaw (Feb 26, 2007)

I was given some hives secondhand from a source I know nothing about. What can I use to scorch the supers (about 20)? I tried using a yellow MAPP torch, but it would take way too long.


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## Adrian Quiney WI (Sep 14, 2007)

Heaflaw, see post #14. It seems like a good idea.


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