# Making a QC incubator



## sweetas (Apr 16, 2012)

The simple solution is to buy an egg incubator. cheap in australia, must be alot cheaper in the US. I bought a 48 egg incubator. Yet to use it.


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## fatshark (Jun 17, 2009)

Try an Ecostat element. I use one of these in my honey warming cabinet and the temperature control is excellent. I've used the cabinet for emerging queens successfully. Just use a plastic box with damp tissue to maintain high humidity. You need to use the queens soon after emergence.


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## Duncan151 (Aug 3, 2013)

I have an old dehydrator that I am thinking of turning into an incubator


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## johng (Nov 24, 2009)

I bought a small reptile incubator mainly because it will heat and cool to keep the inside temp the same temp regardless of the outside temp. I have used a still air chicken incubator with success if you leave it in the same place inside and the outside air temp does not vary much. It was super sensitive to outside air changes. So when I put it in the truck to transport cells out to the bee yard I had to be real careful or it would get too hot or too cold. The new one works great it's small enough to seat belt into the seat and keeps the cells the same temp no matter what.

I only mention this because it would be really cool if you could find a digital thermostat that would work a small heating element or switch over to the cooling cycle on the fridge if the inside air got too hot.

If you don't plan on moving the cells any small digital thermostat or analog thermostat should work quite well. You should not need much more than a very small heating element or small 25 watt light bulb to warm it up especially if you keep it inside the house where the air temps are relatively stable.


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

I bought an Incukit Mini (48 watt) and a hygrometer from Incubator Warehouse. http://incubatorwarehouse.com/48-watt-incukit-dc.html

I installed the heat unit through the bottom a thick eps foam box that I got from a tropical fish store. The bottom became the back of the Incubator. I installed a single shelf made from a plastic grill for a suspended ceiling florescent light. 

The hygrometer powers a small aquarium air pump that supplies air to an air stone in a small container of water.

The volume of the incubator will suit me for a very long time. And I'm satisfied to have accurate controls. 

I might have about $135 in the project.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Is it necessary for the airflow? Say outside are going inside for the air exchange?
Or that the entire box is sealed up?


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## sweetas (Apr 16, 2012)

beepro said:


> Is it necessary for the airflow? Say outside are going inside for the air exchange?
> Or that the entire box is sealed up?


Checkout your ebay. It has temperature control, and can adjust teh humidity. I assume it will heat but not cool. At $65, not worth fidling around. Your price is less than half of what it is no AUD dollars.


48 Digital Clear Egg Incubator Hatcher Automatic Egg Turning Temperature Control

*$64.95*List price: $179.99


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

beepro said:


> Is it necessary for the airflow? Say outside are going inside for the air exchange?
> Or that the entire box is sealed up?


If this was about my post, I don't understand what's being asked.


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## sweetas (Apr 16, 2012)

BeeCurious said:


> If this was about my post, I don't understand what's being asked.


No, BeeCurious, the answer was for beepro


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

So last night I read about some DIY incubator drilling 2 of the 1 1/4 inch holes on the
incubator box for outside air exchange. I meant air exchange to give the 
QCs some fresh air from the outside otherwise it will be stale air inside. Do QCs need
fresh air from the outside?
And thanks about getting a chicken incubator. Will that hold the temperature inside this fridge? It is for
having more space than a small chicken incubator for future expansion so that I don't have to constantly upgrade to
a bigger size. The small fridge will hold more QCs for me to choose the better virgin queens.


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## Phoebee (Jan 29, 2014)

Our mentor started a queen rearing group a few years back. He built an insulated box comparable to your refrigerator. I added a heating element, fan, solid state relay, and a digital temperature controller.

I don't recommend incandescent light bulbs as heaters unless you run a couple in series to increase their life. A light bulb burning out will ruin your run, and I'm not sure the developing queens don't need darkness. E-bay is lousy with things that make good heating elements, many very cheap. Ceramic heaters are commonly available and automatically limit their temperature if the system runs away. Be sure you include a fan to stir the air effectively, or you'll have hot spots and cold spots.

We wound up using about 100 watts, I think. At 120 V the current will be under an amp, so can be run on the internal relay come controllers have, although I prefer an external relay with some guts, or a solid state relay.

E-bay is also lousy with digital temperature controllers. Some are essentially just electronic thermostats. They work OK and can be had for about $10 or a little more. Proper PID controllers are a little more elegant, and can be had for $30-50.

Put a water container in the system to keep humidity up.


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## sweetas (Apr 16, 2012)

beepro said:


> So last night I read about some DIY incubator drilling 2 of the 1 1/4 inch holes on the
> incubator box for outside air exchange. I meant air exchange to give the
> QCs some fresh air from the outside otherwise it will be stale air inside. Do QCs need
> fresh air from the outside?
> ...


How many QC do you want. A 48 EI will hold a lot of queen cells. There are 96 egg holders. Reading the manual you can set the temperature in points of a degree so it should be OK. You can always semi insulate the base for greater control. At $65, I think definitely worth trying. All living things need fresh air.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

For now the plan is 80 QCs per month. Once I got the hang of it then expand to
1000 per month. But again reality will be the judge. Though having a larger incubator
will make things easier besides only incubating QCs. There is the mushroom growing project and 
seeds sprouting with it also.


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## MTN-Bees (Jan 27, 2014)

Beepro: Search through old threads- Lauri was using a Cabela's food dehydrator I believe.


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## sweetas (Apr 16, 2012)

beepro said:


> For now the plan is 80 QCs per month. Once I got the hang of it then expand to
> 1000 per month. But again reality will be the judge. Though having a larger incubator
> will make things easier besides only incubating QCs. There is the mushroom growing project and
> seeds sprouting with it also.



Not to damped your enthusiasm, you have to start somewhere. At $65, worth a try. look at the item below 

http://beesource.com/resources/elem...queen-cells-without-grafting-cut-cell-method/

have fun and goodluck


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

I'm doing my research on ebay now. They already have the cool and heat unit made. And the
temp. and humidity in one unit made. Now is the price and what option is the most cost effect for making one.


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## sweetas (Apr 16, 2012)

beepro said:


> I'm doing my research on ebay now. They already have the cool and heat unit made. And the
> temp. and humidity in one unit made. Now is the price and what option is the most cost effect for making one.


Your climate is a little bit milder than mine. No real extremes. Do you really need cooling if you keep the incubator inside. Try not to over engineer. I found it doesn't always work.

Keep looking for the best solution that suites your circumstances. Cheers


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

beepro said:


> So last night I read about some DIY incubator drilling 2 of the 1 1/4 inch holes on the
> incubator box for outside air exchange.


There was a couple of excellent treads on Incubators and I don't remember anybody drilling large holes. 

My air stone setup provides "outside air" when operating to increase the humidity...


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Our summer temp. can be over 100F for a few months. 
It would be nice to have a cool function built in also. Going to secure a 
better unit if I cannot build this fridge unit. Many you tube vids I saw 
presented different options on diagram and all of the how to. Many you tube vids and diagrams on a
similar unit like mine, a small fridge. Found out I already got
the electric element from a food dehydrator and a thermometer I bought earlier. Got 2 small pc fans ready for
the 12v supply that I took out from 2 old disassembled pcs few months ago. All I needed now is the digital thermostat and thermometer to connect them all. 
Thanks for the ebay tips buying on the cheap. Our grid power here is not that reliable at times, so I also like to put in a separate unit for the back up with 2 - 100 watt light bulbs in case 1 got burned 
out on the solar battery set up. So one for the house power and one for the solar power just in case with so many QCs at stake and time invested. Going to be a good learning experience for me to put them altogether. I would say it is worth it just for trying it out for the learning experience. If we don't flex those brain muscles as we get older our minds will be a bit rusty at times. Without any guidance to assemble them just looking at all the wires is enough to make your frontal lobe itches or give you headache at time. Good for the brain muscles though!



Ronco dehydrator heat element & fans:


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## sweetas (Apr 16, 2012)

beepro said:


> Our summer temp. can be over 100F for a few months.
> It would be nice to have a cool function built in also. Going to secure a
> better unit if I cannot build this fridge unit. Many you tube vids I saw
> presented different options on diagram and all of the how to. Many you tube vids and diagrams on a
> ...



Cooling is a lot more complicated than heating. Is it easier to keep the ambient temperature where your Fridge (QCI) is below 35c (95F) , that way you only have to concentrate on heating and humidity. We have our 40c+ temps here as well but rarely would the inside of the house get anywhere near that (i put the aircon on). If you have 500 QC's at any one time in your QCI that is a very valuable at say $20 = $10,000. Well worth looking after. I wouldn't want to lose 80 at $20 = $1,600.

Rather than one big QCI , would it be better to split you incubators. 

Keep the grey matter moving.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Good point about splitting into different incubators. I will make one and then
hopefully buy a commercial one soon. Either way I will invest this year to graft more
queens from. Many are asking for the cap QCs early in the season here. For each mated queen, the price is
$25 dollars here, 5 more bucks than yours. I know my bees market here. Just like everything else our price is going up every year.
Don't know if your price went up too there?


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## rookie2531 (Jul 28, 2014)

What advantages are there for a incubator?

I don't let my girls emerge in their protective cages. They go in their mating nuc, before they emerge. 

If you are incubating, then you are introducing a virgin to your split? I don't see the advantage?


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

The you tube channel will show you many ways to make an incubator. It is mainly for saving some time and
freeing up your cell finisher. It is for making many more QCs so that you can choose the queen of your
liking too. You can also put the about to emerge QC in the mating nuc to have the virgin emerged inside. The main
advantage is that in a short amount of time you can make lots of QCs for whatever purposes you like.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

For the fridge door, I plan to use Neodymium magnets embedded in the 1" osb
board lined with adhesive weather stripping tape all around to keep it air tight. Plexiglass will be
glue onto the osb board for the window. There will be 2 hinges to hang the door onto the fridge.
Do you think my plan is feasible? Any other suggestion for making an observation door?


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## NSBee (Dec 20, 2014)

quick question about the $65 incubator on ebay , i took a look at it and for the money why not give it a try . it will hold 48 chix eggs so should hold at least that in QC which is more that i would need it to do as a hobbyist . it says it has automatic egg turning every 2 hours . , looking at the add it looks like this feature is turned on and cant be turned off is this the case and if so how did the ones that bought the item get around this , as you would not want to turn your QCs .?


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## BeeCurious (Aug 7, 2007)

beepro said:


> you can make lots of QCs for whatever purposes you like.


How many colonies do you have to provide resources for your grafts? 

And how many mating boxes do you have?


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

dups!


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Doesn't matter this is for QCs making only.
Guess I'll find out once the magnetic window is made.


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## sweetas (Apr 16, 2012)

NSBee said:


> quick question about the $65 incubator on ebay , i took a look at it and for the money why not give it a try . it will hold 48 chix eggs so should hold at least that in QC which is more that i would need it to do as a hobbyist . it says it has automatic egg turning every 2 hours . , looking at the add it looks like this feature is turned on and cant be turned off is this the case and if so how did the ones that bought the item get around this , as you would not want to turn your QCs .?



vERY SIMPLE, TAKE THE EGG HOLDER OUT. Suggest you make a frame to hold QC's . I believe it would hold several hundred.

I've become an expert using the egg Incubator without using it. You've pushed me to use it to really find out.


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## AstroBee (Jan 3, 2003)

My incubator uses an old chest freezer, 3 60 watt light bulbs, a small box fan, and a Ranco ETC-111000 temperature controller. Works very well. This controller is only a single stage, so it only controls heating and not cooling. Make sure you place the probe very close to the cells.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

johng said:


> ....I only mention this because it would be really cool if you could find a digital thermostat that would work a small heating element or switch over to the cooling cycle on the fridge if the inside air got too hot....



An update: 


Found this STC-1000 controller with heat and cool setting on ebay. Should work for my set up now. Also finish cleaning the 
fridge as it was quite a chore. Half way done and the rain came. Cut out the inside door covering and reline the magnetic
strip all around the door again. There were 3 small crevices, one at the top and 2 toward the bottom of the magnetic molding. Good for the
air circulation I guess. Will drill some small holes if needed after the test run later on. 
I also need to install the plexiglass window on the door after the foam and door panel is cut out a bit. How tall and wide should this viewing window be? Can anyone tell me?


Clean fridge:


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## Phoebee (Jan 29, 2014)

The world is full of temperature controllers that can control both heating and cooling. I have a project underway at the moment that uses the SOLO 4896, on a small chamber that cools using Peltier modules and heats with a small ceramic heater. You can probably find something suitable for about a third what those go for.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Good idea on the Peltier modules. Maybe will use one in our hot
summer time one day on the cool side of course.


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## djastram (May 1, 2011)

My incubator project.

https://youtu.be/EJ9WCizDu6g


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## Phoebee (Jan 29, 2014)

beepro said:


> Good idea on the Peltier modules. Maybe will use one in our hot
> summer time one day on the cool side of course.


Be careful with the cooling. The present project is not an incubator, it is a test chamber. It can freeze water. I may freeze frames with it when it is not doing what I'm building it for. A good Peltier cooling module can get a lot colder than you want brood or queen cells to reach.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

An update:

Just finished cutting out and gluing a double pane window on the fridge door out of plexiglass today. Found an old but in good condition
piece of plexiglass from a tropical fish hobby a long time ago. Initially was thinking to use it as one large piece. After considering that it
will cost less to cut it in half so I don't have to buy a new glass. So the most time consuming part is cutting out the metal panel 
for a window opening on the fridge door with an angle grinder. Then gluing both pieces of plexiglass on the door with clear silicone glue. 
Took me almost the entire day to finish this door waiting for the glue to dry out a bit on one side first. Finally it was done just the door though!
The next step is wiring the inside with all the goodies. The STC-1000 is for a backup in case the main controller failed. Added the AL tapes to 
seal off the edges on both sides so it will look neat and clean.


Fridge door done:


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## Phoebee (Jan 29, 2014)

The two high-performance chambers I just built use 5 layers of Plexiglas, spaced with foam strips. The resulting insulation seems to be around R-9.

This would be total overkill for a queen cell incubator, but your two layers will reduce power needs. Working with the lowest power you can will help keep the temperature stable.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Dups!


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Proceed with caution:

I'm so close now to finishing this incubator. So what's delaying me?
I can wire the 2 fans and the heating element to get them working. When it comes to wiring the NTC controller on the heating element, I'm too confused. Mainly I don't know which wire is for the load and which wire is for the power? There is a diagram only.
Can anyone give me a basic pointers here? 

I can identify on the house wall socket that the left side has a wider plug hole and the right side has a narrower plug hole for plugging in our daily appliances. The left side wire hole is for the white wire usually and the right side is for the black wire, usually. Sometime the left side is white color coded on the wire outside. I can also identify the wider and narrower side on my heating element following the wire socket into the wall. With some pointer, I can just trace the plug size with the wires to connect them on the NTC controller.
So which side is the load, the wider or narrower hole? Help! All I need to know is which wire is for the load wire connection.

Another issue is the heat and cool load wiring on the NTC slot is not separated. Meaning I cannot wire a cooling fan and the heating element separately. So how can I
wire the 2 different operating unit together on this NTC controller? Eeewwwl, more confusion here. You mean wiring the heat and cool units into the same slot 1 and 2?
It's alright then I'll just use this unit for a back up connecting to the solar station only. For $10 bucks it is not that bad.


Almost almost, so close now:


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## mgstei1 (Jan 11, 2014)

Hot supply wire to 3
Neutral or Return to 4 ----This powers the controller up.3&4
Jumper from 3 over to 1
coming off 2 to load hot
leaving load back to 4

Hot is the narrow side. Hot is brass on recep.
Neutral or return is Large side. Neutral is bright on recep.
Ground, which is most important is the bottom prong.
It should go to fan frames and or anything metal that you touch with bare hand on load.

Fan should be running constantly to circulate heated air and more consistently maintain temperature. Lots of mass helps also.
Use of a relay off 1&2 could separate your heat from cool if thats what you intended.

A simple indicator light or annunciator could signal loss of controller. Thats a long shot to lose that device.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Thanks for the support!

The heating element has the white wire that I connect to Load 2 port in the NTC, which is
the narrow (hot) right side. The other side of the heating element is the 
wide (neutral) left side has yellow wire in the pic going to connect to the neutral wire with port 4. 
Is this the correct wiring method? 
I'm so close now. Cannot give up!


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## mgstei1 (Jan 11, 2014)

Shouldnt matter if that is an AC element. Id stay with "white" being neutral and yellow being the supply in or load but dont matter so do what you stated above. Just be careful and tighten all connections tightly.
Dont give up as its almost built!


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## Phoebee (Jan 29, 2014)

beepro said:


> Good idea on the Peltier modules. Maybe will use one in our hot
> summer time one day on the cool side of course.


I was interested in using the Peltier modules to both heat and cool, but it doesn't work smoothly with most temperature controllers. They're not rigged to switch polarity when they go from heating to cooling.

You could make it work for an incubator, where you don't need to go hotter than body temperature. Heaters are so cheap I did not find it worth the bother. For higher temperatures, Peltier modules usually have an internal thermostat to keep them from being damaged by their own heat (or should, if you're building your own). You really want to avoid getting them too hot. Usually you put a large heat sink outside the chamber, a smaller one inside, because in cooling mode they have to get rid of more heat than they pump (add in the power it takes to run them). So to reverse the current to use them as heaters, you're using the small heat sink to heat the chamber, making them easy to overheat.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

A. One little success will boost a lots of confidence. Extremely close now.
So the load 2 wire (labeled 2) is connected to the ntc on one end and the other end go back to connect on the heating element neutral wide side. This wire will go to connect with 4 on the neutral wide side with the brown power cord (wide neutral side) coming from the wall socket. 
B. The black wire with white strip labeled 1 is connected to the HOT narrow side on the heating element. This wire will go to connect with 3 on the HOT narrow side with the brown power cord from the wall socket. See 1 and 2 pic. Is this correct?

C. The


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

C. The brown power cord is supplying the power to this configuration.
On the left side is the neutral wide side and to the right side is the HOT narrow side.

The Neutral wide left side connect to 2 and 4 wire.
The HOT narrow right side connect to 1 and 3 wire.
So 2 and 4 wire will bunch up to connect to the brown power cord on the Neutral wide side sharing the white wire nut.
The 1 and 3 wire will bunch up to connect to the brown power cord on the HOT narrow side sharing the red wire nut.

The finished connection is like this:

2 and 4 wire connect to neutral wide left side on the brown power cord. 2 twisted together wires coming from 2, one from 4, and 2 twisted wires on the power cord.
1 and 3 wire connect to the HOT narrow right side on the brown power cord. 2 twisted together wires coming from 1, one from 3, 2 twisted wires on the power cord.

Not sure if it makes any sense to you. Let me know if you spot an errors on the wire(s) connection. Lastly, to connect the sensor wire to the NTC 5 and 6 port, doesn't matter which way. This is both nervous and excitement feelings at the same time. Aghhhh! I'll let you know if there's smoke coming out. I'll wait!


See the pics then:


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## sweetas (Apr 16, 2012)

beepro said:


> C. The brown power cord is supplying the power to this configuration.
> On the left side is the neutral wide side and to the right side is the HOT narrow side.
> 
> The Neutral wide left side connect to 2 and 4 wire.
> ...



Keep going, Cheers


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Keep going is fine. I just want to confirmed it with 
mgstei1 before powering it on. Better be safe than sorry, right. I have a lot of respect with members here.
Without his help my head is still spinning at stage one trying to see the wiring connections before going asleep. Overall I've spent almost $20 bucks on this unit. Bought
one small bag of wire nuts for $3 dollars only used 4. The NTC controller cost $10 bucks. The rest of the materials are from my
left over project before. 

Do you see any issue with my wiring connection?


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

sweetas said:


> Keep going, Cheers


Ran a few more wiring diagnostics over and again to finally turn this unit on:
"Hot supply wire to 3 (bunch up with HOT narrow side of the brown [power] wire coming from the wall socket.
Neutral or Return to 4 ----This powers the controller up.3&4
Jumper from 3 over to 1 (HOT narrow side of wire bunch up with 3 wire on the brown wire coming from the wall socket).
coming out off 2 to load hot (the heating element)
leaving load back to 4 (neutral large, wide side of wire on brown [power] wire coming from the wall socket.
Hot is the narrow side. Hot is brass on recep.
Neutral or return is Large side. Neutral is bright on recep.
Ground, which is most important is the bottom prong.
It should go to fan frames and or anything metal that you touch with bare hand on load."

When plug the brown power cord into the wall socket, the lights in the house flickered along with the NTC led lights.
There was a rubbery smells coming from the NTC controller unit, no smokes. Not quite sure what it was I ran a diagnostic on the
HOT narrow side wiring again. Took out individual wire connection to check them all. Then assembled the wires again.
The heating element is working, warm to the touch. The fans are all on. The NTC unit is picking up temperature difference from the
sensor. All system go now!


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

A recent update:


So today both the backup temp. controller and the main temp. controllers are working properly. I 
mean programming the unit is fine along with controlling the Ronco heating element that come from 
the food dehydrator. All wires and plugs are fine except the 2 fans wire plug that is a bit warm to the touch. After 2 hours of testing, between 
the 2 controllers, the average inside temp. read 95.2F upper limit and 92.2F lower limit. There is a reading difference of
3 degree between the upper and lower controller. On every temp. transition, the average upper limit fluctuation is at 95.7F and
the lower limit fluctuation is at 92.3F. The blue and white color main controller is set at 94.2F upper limit and 92.9F lower limit which controls the heating element. And the reason for having 2 temp. probe is that both the bottom and the top of the fridge temp. can be accurately display. 
In the middle is where I will put the cap QCs estimated should be around 93F somewhere. I also put 5 bottles of water inside the fridge on the bottom. This should help maintain the temp. inside better. Is my temp. programming within range of incubating the QCs? And is there anything else I should pay attention to? 


Main ctrl and backup ctrl:


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

2nd trial run update:

So after almost 3 hours powering on the incubator for
another trial run and temperature readjustment, I've set
the upper limit temp. to 93.8 and lower limit temp. to 93.1 on the
main controller. Difference is only .7 degree.
Now the sensor reading for the main controller is 95.1 upper limit and
92.8 lower limit. The back up controller reads 94.1 upper limit and
92.4 lower limit. Overall, the temp. is stable between 95 and 92.
Still a 3 degree difference. It seems like every time the upper limit and
the lower limit temp. on the main controller adjusted closer the less fluctuation
the temp. inside. The 5 water bottles still on the bottom. Is this enough to keep the QCs warm and developing inside? Does the
inside temp. need to be stabilized at 94F? My concern is the rise and fall of the temp.


Temp. difference:


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Final incubator temp. update:

Today is the last temp. adjustment to the incubator. I manage to get
94.5 upper limit and 92.6 lower limit on the controller setting it at 93.3 and 93.2. This way
the temp. swing is not that wide. Maybe a 3rd thermometer is better for this set up. Cannot wait
to put some QCs in there for a trial run. Is this temp range o.k. for the cells? !


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## mgstei1 (Jan 11, 2014)

Try an SCR controller to get pinpoint temp control. Sounds like what you are using is an on- off controller and has an extreme dead band lag.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Your SCR controller is a bit expensive for me. I will try my set up this season
to see the results. As long as they are within range of 92 degree then the queen cells will
emerge. Many will try to stay at constant as possible. My will be within 93-94F this season.
I'll have to try it out first with a few QCs. Two weeks is not too long to wait.


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## RayMarler (Jun 18, 2008)

Good luck I think it'll work.
Please keep us posted with results and pics of queens!


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## Phoebee (Jan 29, 2014)

mgstei1 said:


> Try an SCR controller to get pinpoint temp control. Sounds like what you are using is an on- off controller and has an extreme dead band lag.


SCR controller? I use PID controllers, which cost a little more than the "digital thermostat" on-off variety. At the moment I'm finishing up a chamber based on the Automation Direct SOLO line, but there are some available for under $40 that work pretty well. The only reason I'm using a more expensive one is it is dual loop for heating and cooling.

I've got one PID Controller that has an analog DC output to control a fancy DC power supply. I use that one for Peltier coolers, to avoid thermal shock.


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## yakand (Mar 15, 2015)

Hi to all friends
I read this tite now and read some posts. its good and very usefull. i have made one incubator last year by neopan body and inner line aluminium with a polyorthan layer among two layers. a termostate controlls temprature level and in my system heat create with a 100w element but out of inner box (only for better heat control and some more beauty) and a fan take air from top of inner box and flow to element and hot air flow from bottom of inner box in system. termocople is front of heater (for technical matters) and a punched layer of aluminium is front of air flow to prevent of direct heat flow to inner box. fan, element and air tube is out of inner box. some thick wires shaped for hanging bars of queen cells to system.





















if any question i present to answer it, if i know.
good luck dears


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

I asked this question before that all living organisms need to breathe on oxygen.
Can you show us some pics of the air intake holes? And how big are the air holes and where are they at?


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## yakand (Mar 15, 2015)

beepro said:


> A recent update:
> 
> 
> So today both the backup temp. controller and the main temp. controllers are working properly. I
> ...



hello
your system is very nice. but when i see your system, remember my first attempt to making my own incubator and its failures in some points. i attempt very ways to reach a stable and invariable temprature all over the system. but i think your system has a small doubt. that is about your fans and this matter that when fans play to work that starts to warm and itselves produces heat and after a time you see your system recieved to maximum temprature and pass it and temprator goes up.
i have this mistake because my system has good isolate for heat. in finish i undrestood that fan is not suitable for me and replace itwith small and low voltage fan that has not heat in work.
if your system has good isolate and fans are 220V and produce heat in work you should replace it.

good luck


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## yakand (Mar 15, 2015)

beepro said:


> I asked this question before that all living organisms need to breathe on oxygen.
> Can you show us some pics of the air intake holes? And how big are the air holes and where are they at?



my aim from ail tube is not that oxygen that is need to breath organisms, my aim from air flow was air cycle and it works same to your fans in incubator that conduce air movement and not stable in system for achieve invariable temprature.

for recieve oxygene to organisms in this system is a small way to exchange air in and out of system. but that air flow get warm air from top of system and brings it to bottom and warm it (if behoove) and flow to system from bottom of punched layer. this way is good for this, we dont let to air that passed from element and was hot and flow to system, stop bottom of punched layer and slowly goes up from holes. if hot air direct flow to queen cells might damage it because take a time to termocople and termostate calculate temprature and off element.

i hope to understood your aim and my words were enough clear that i mean, becaues my english is not wery well.

goodluck


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## yakand (Mar 15, 2015)

I decided to put a simple diagram of my system that i desighned last year.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

A pic speaks a thousand words!
Yes, I understand what you mean. Don't let the cells have direct contact with the heating element. That is why
you put in a layer of holes. Makes sense to me. For me it will be the plastic shell layers of a food dehydrator acting as the hole layer. 
I already plan this out from the beginning when talking to my production technician last year at the planning stage. We got a 
mental picture of the set up only. Did not put the design in drawing like you did. 
So all cap cells go inside these plastic trays to get a more stable temperature and not be in direct contact with the
heating element. The 2 fans outside will be blowing gentle breeze warm air down onto the plastic trays. It will be a few more
run before I can get things straight. What do you think about my plastic trays? Also, different beekeepers use different temperature for incubating their QCs. What is your incubator temperature for these cells? In Celsius I can convert to F. #C X 1.8 + 32 = F.


Cells will be inside clear plastic trays acting as a shield:


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## yakand (Mar 15, 2015)

Hi
I'm happy. Your idea is very good way to recieve stable temprator too. And a nice method.
And about temprator::
Qcs dies in 35c and i set point on 32 for on heater and 34 for off it.
By this method cells alive and become to adult queens.

Goodluck dears


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

At 89.6F to 93.2F that is pretty close to what Lauri said at 91F.
That means at 95F the cells will not survive at all. I set the controller on at 93.0F and off at 93.2. Mine now is between 94.4 and 92.3F. Do you think this is at the correct range?
Also, I have read here that the humidity inside is between 35 to 50. What is the humidity inside your incubator? And what do you use to provide the humidity?
Do you also provide fresh air going in to your incubator? How large is the air holes and where are they located on the incubator?


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## yakand (Mar 15, 2015)

yes my set points on at 32 and off 34. and your sets is correct too but termostate rellay maybe will amortize early. because the termostate switch on, but after some secounds switch to off and this work maybe continue several times in one day and you should stoke system about one week. if your heater current is high or if your termostate relay has a weak rellay you can some wide your range of temperature points (only for more termostate live).

but a point you must attend it, you should test your termostate sensor for true temperature first. because false measure in termostates has heavy results.

i provide humidity by put a small barrel like small cup of water for humidity. for oxygene is a small suture between door and body in bottom of system and in viewing from cells that i open door exchanges whethear.

goodluck


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