# OSB Plywood



## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

I was at a home improvement store today looking over the plywood, as I'm preparing to build more migratory covers. An employee walked up and asked if he could assist me, and after explaining what my plans were, he suggested I consider using OSB Plywood. He said that over time he believed it would hold up better than regular plywood because these boards now are made with only exterior glue ... and lots of it. They would be less prone to delamination than regular plywood, especially if they are painted. 

Any thoughts on this? I'm not a lumber expert, and wonder if this might have some merit or if he was just trying to push the OSB. The price is right, but only if it works.


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## tech.35058 (Jul 29, 2013)

I get OSB packing crates for free, & so try it for a lot of stuff.
If you cover it with a water proof membrane such as aluminum flashing, or tin, it will probably last as long as any thing else.
just paint is not enough, after year 2 my OSB covers were sodden, & the hives wet inside.
For vertical surfaces, it is not so bad, but it does delaminate (& look shaggy )
My wife says the 3/4 OSB I used to build NUCs from is too heavy 
Good Luck ... CE


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

That's what I was afraid of. I know the old stuff from years back was terrible for absorbing water and expanding. Didn't know if it was actually better today or not. I don't want to waste my time on something that's not going to last very long. Don't plan on covering it with any metal, just paint.


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## Bees of SC (Apr 12, 2013)

if you build hive bodies out of it may last one summer with out rain. after the first winter the insides will expand and the frames will not fit..JMO


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

Ordinary commodity OSB is a pretty poor performer when exposed to the weather. The worst situation is when the OSB is in a flat orientation. But even in a vertical orientation the panel edges will absorb water and expand the thickness of the board and the various strands will start to flake off. If you put enough paint on it, the semi-protected vertical pieces _can _last 5 years or so. In a horizontal application it might last 2 years with adequate paint.

Advantech is a high-end OSB product that is manufactured with additional resins and wax, and it performs much better than commodity OSB. But Advantech is also perhaps twice the price of commodity OSB. I think Advantech is a great product, and have used it in a subfloor for a house - and paid extra compared to regular OSB. I suggest comparing the price of Advantech to _exterior _rated plywood in your market if you are interested in using it.

There are a variety of Beesource threads discussing Advantech for hive uses, if you want to search for them. Or I can post some links if you ask.


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## Tejones121 (Apr 28, 2015)

If you are considering the 7/16(1/2"nominal) OSB sheathing for a cover it will not hold up. Neither will the low grade 23/32(3/4" nominal) OSB t&g. However, if you spend the money on the high grade 3/4" OSB like Advantech or DRyPly, you will make out better. The high grade OSB is much more water resistant than the cheap stuff.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

@ Graham - Thanks. Now I know what search word to use. I tried OSB and came up with nothing.


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## BeeMoose (Oct 19, 2013)

I have to agree with the above responses, normal OSB (oriented strand board) will not hold up to weather.

They make some that has and extra coating on it and it is sold under various names. It is designed for building houses that will be exposed to the elements for a short period of time.
Usually until the outer covering can be installed.

I have not had any OSB that will stand up against moisture. This being said, if you don't mind them only lasting a couple of years before needing replaced, try it. It may be
cheaper to do this than buy quality lumber that might hold up for longer.

Good luck.


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## Danpa14 (Jun 12, 2013)

I have been using advantech top and bottoms since last year. Look like new still, even the unpainted ones. Mine are not quite 3/4 thickness but I don't remember exactly. More like 5/8th. I also use treated fence boards like John Pluta in Georgia. I have 16 hives now so that is 32 pieces of advantech exposed to the weather. They all look great still.


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## tech.35058 (Jul 29, 2013)

I made some bottom boards and top:; boards out of the packing crate stuff.
I painted the exposed edges and the landing "porch" with titebond 3.
I covered the tops with sheet foam insulation, political signboard or what ever fell to hand.
My original plan was just to use this stuff for bait boxes, but when fresh, it looked better than my actual hives.
I have not used the better grades of it.
After 3 months, the titebond painted areas are "like new".
But Titebond is pretty expensive paint. ... CE


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

Those who use Advantech ... can you use regular Exterior Latex paint, or does it need to be an Oil based paint?


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## Rader Sidetrack (Nov 30, 2011)

From the manufacturer FAQs ...



> _Can I paint AdvanTech panels?_
> AdvanTech panels can be left natural, stained, varnished or painted with oil or epoxy based paints or oil based primer and latex paint. Water seal is not recommended. AdvanTech panels are not recommended for exterior siding or other applications that are permanently exposed to the weather.
> 
> http://myhuberwood.com/main.aspx?pagename=faqs&faqCategoryId=101


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## AAIndigo (Jun 14, 2015)

I would go with MDO (medium Density Overlay) over OSB. This is used by sign makers and boat builder. Specifically made for exterior with 100% exterior glue. Top boards are tough because the water just sits on them. I would angle the top board so water runs off. Paint the end grain with Poly (I use marine grade) and paint the paper face. Its available in must big box lumber stores and can be ordered if the smaller stores dont stock it. http://www.pacificwoodlaminates.com/img/PDFs/PlywoodGuide.pdf

I found this post while researching the use of MDO for Hive bodies. My plan is to outfit 4 to 6 hives next year and I'm looking at the most economical way of doing so. I will be going treatment free so I looking into if MDO lets off toxic gases. I would construct using a locking miter joint.

I have used MDO in the past on construction projects and know it stands up


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

Mike Gillmore; can you use regular Exterior Latex paint said:


> I have been using Advantec for migratory covers, nucs and nuc covers, some bottom boards, for more than 5 years. If you can find it free, (short pieces from construction sites) it will make a nice nuc or bait hive. (photo attached)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## snapper1d (Apr 8, 2011)

Dont go cheap! Get some regular exterior plywood and then you will never have to regret using cheap!


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

For the migratory covers and hive boxes that I have been using for 4 seasons now, I use the
composite particle boards that is made up of many thin wood chips all glued together.
Don't know what it is call but so far they are holding up to the weather and do not wrap.
Sealed it with linseed oil and Thompson water seal before painting it. Had turn those covers into
making my stationary oav gadgets too.


osb, composite particle chips board:


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## rwurster (Oct 30, 2010)

Regular OSB and particle board perform horribly out in the elements regardless of how well you seal them with paint. People seem to have decent luck with the advantech OSB but I have no personal experience with it. It's not sold here probably because of our extremely dry climate.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

Talking about a dry climate. We live in a semi-desert environment all year long.
This is our 4th years of drought. No rain in sight for a very long time now.
If El Nino doesn't kick in soon we will be in big trouble. All the lakes and rivers will
be dry up pretty soon. Sucking water out of the ground reservoir will sink the ground even further.
So my osb (composite chip hives) are still holding up. Every year I gave them
a coat of linseed oil to refreshed their glister.


OSB chips hive:


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## johno (Dec 4, 2011)

I started using Advantech for my nuc and mating nuc lids, the exterior ply lids I used were warping and leaving gaps around the top of the nucs and leaving them open to robbing so I find that Advantech does not warp. Since then I have been replacing my SBB's with solid boards from Advantech and also using the same to make migratory covers and no longer use inner covers. I have been painting them with a latex primer and then a coating of oops exterior latex that I get from Ace Hardware for about $5 a gallon and so far I am happy with Advantech, It is quite heavy so I am not keen on making hive boxes with it.
Johno


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## AstroBee (Jan 3, 2003)

A couple of years ago, I went with Advantech to build tops and bottoms for 30 hives. I tried painting some, wrapping some of the tops in aluminum, and some left bare. The results are exactly as one would expect. The unpainted fared the worst, nearly all with some level of surface delamination, but still solid and very usable. The latex painted are in very good condition, and the wrapped are like the day I put them in service. Bottomline, if you use Advantech, and really want it to last, then put some coating on it.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

Those using Advantech for Covers, do you paint both sides or just the top and edges?


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

Only top and edges. I use them like migratory covers, no inner cover.

I also use Advantec for thru the top, feeder tops. As you can see, most are not painted.











cchoganjr


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

I painted mine on both sides. The outside is cover with a layer of epoxy.
The inside just a layer of linseed oil follow by a thin layer of exterior water base latex paint.
This is to protect the inside in case I forget about it outside and it got rain on.


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## beepro (Dec 31, 2012)

If the 1/4" composite chips board can last 4 years so far without
any water damage or wrap, then how come to use the more expensive and heavier Advantech
boards? Going into my 5th years still in very good shape. No wear and tear anywhere.
One cover has been 2 years now without another linseed paint over it. Those composite boards 4'x8'
are for the roof sidings.


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## texanbelchers (Aug 4, 2014)

Of those using Advantech or HDO/MDO, are you using the flooring or siding? I understand the flooring is smooth both sides and the siding is not, but the siding is square edge and the flooring is not. Then there is the Zip system that has something else on one side...?


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## Cleo C. Hogan Jr (Feb 27, 2010)

I use the advantech that they use for sub flooring. It has a tongue on one side. I just rip it off. 

One 4 X 8 sheet will make 10 migratory tops, or, 10 feeder tops. I am able to get all I need from local contractors for free, but, if you have to pay for it, the sheet is about $31.00. It is 3/4 thick.

Yes, it is smooth on both sides. And as you can see above, I don't get around to painting all of mine. Been running about 125 migratory tops, for over 5 years, and absolutely no problems with Advantec, but, i recommend you use whatever works for you.

cchoganjr


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

Well, I've checked every supplier in the area and for some reason all of them have discontinued carrying Advantech. Looking for good CDX plywood and running into the same problem. Guess I might have to be a contractor to be able to order the good stuff.


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## AAIndigo (Jun 14, 2015)

Mike Gillmore said:


> Well, I've checked every supplier in the area and for some reason all of them have discontinued carrying Advantech. Looking for good CDX plywood and running into the same problem. Guess I might have to be a contractor to be able to order the good stuff.


Not sure what glue they use on other plywoods but you should be able to buy an AC (sanded on both sides) or BC (sanded on one) if your looking for a more finished product. The local big stores should carry MDO (paper faced) but might only be 1/2" a local lumber yard should order what you want but will probably charge a premium. Try the smaller lumber yards and see if they can special order 3/4 MDO paper faced on 1 side or just buy 3/4 cdx, paint and replace every few years.


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## marshmasterpat (Jun 26, 2013)

Mike Gillmore said:


> Well, I've checked every supplier in the area and for some reason all of them have discontinued carrying Advantech. Looking for good CDX plywood and running into the same problem. Guess I might have to be a contractor to be able to order the good stuff.


Mike - I have not checked with every supplier, but have gotten 4 out of 4 that said they don't carry it here.


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## Tejones121 (Apr 28, 2015)

Mike Gillmore said:


> Well, I've checked every supplier in the area and for some reason all of them have discontinued carrying Advantech. Looking for good CDX plywood and running into the same problem. Guess I might have to be a contractor to be able to order the good stuff.


Mike,
Advantech is just one manufacturer's (Huber) premium OSB subfloor. Suppliers routinely strike deals with different manufactures and bring in their version. Louisiana-Pacific makes "Top Notch 350 & 450" , Georgia-pacific makes "Blue Ribbon Sturdi-I", Weyerhaeuser has "EdgeGold", and so on. I'm would imagine that one or more of these is available at the supply houses. I have used all of these at some point in my building career and they all perform comparably.


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## marshmasterpat (Jun 26, 2013)

Wish I would have known that a few months ago when I was buying plywood for tops and bottoms. 

But now I know and many thanks. I know what to ask for. We have lots of L-P and G-P around here.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

Well, I found a lumber yard not too far away that caters to contractors, which carries 3/4" Advantech. Think I'll buy a sheet and see if the covers hold up any better than the plywood I've been using. At $29.00 a sheet for 10 covers it's no big loss if it doesn't work out. Only one way to find out. Thanks everyone for all of your feedback.


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## Tejones121 (Apr 28, 2015)

Thank you for starting a thread that I could finally contribute to as a "seasoned professional!" Hopefully in 20 years or so I can talk about bees!:banana:


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## marshmasterpat (Jun 26, 2013)

Mike Gillmore said:


> Well, I found a lumber yard not too far away that caters to contractors, which carries 3/4" Advantech. Think I'll buy a sheet and see if the covers hold up any better than the plywood I've been using. At $29.00 a sheet for 10 covers it's no big loss if it doesn't work out. Only one way to find out. Thanks everyone for all of your feedback.


Mike - the way my last 5/8" exterior ply has warped even with paint s) and the cost it was at Lowe's that Advantech would be about same price.


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## Phoebee (Jan 29, 2014)

Normal OSB performs poorly when wet. When I did my radiant heat floors, I was talked in to buying a brand called Advantech. The difference is in the adhesive and it is night and day. Normal OSB swells and gets fuzzy and soft if it is rained on. Advantech just sits there and takes it.

I just posted this on another thread. The topic there was if plywood was safe for contact with honey, but the article has some things to say about the properties of the adhesives:

http://www.tecotested.com/techtips/pdf/tt_formaldehydeemission


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## Barhopper (Mar 5, 2015)

I use HDO one side coated. It's a concrete form plywood. It will out last anything out there with the exception of metal topped telescoping covers. All mine have feeder jar holes. The draw back is it is expensive. Last I got was pushing $100 a sheet. But as stated 10 lids to a sheet makes it bearable for me.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

I noticed that Rader set up an Advantech thread in the FAQ section if anyone would like to look through related threads. Thanks Graham.

http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?317916-Advantech-(plywood-alternative)-for-woodenware


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## AstroBee (Jan 3, 2003)

Again, my experience doesn't seem consistent with what others have observed. Perhaps I'm just being picky, but here are a couple pictures of 3/4" Advantech that went into service on March 28, 2013. This piece was used as a migratory top. The edge shot clearly shows delamination. The board still seems pretty solid, but it has substantially degraded from when it first went onto service.


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## Mike Gillmore (Feb 25, 2006)

I'm guessing this was in the group that was left "bare", with no paint. 

Do the edges on the painted covers appear to be in better condition?


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## AstroBee (Jan 3, 2003)

Mike Gillmore said:


> I'm guessing this was in the group that was left "bare", with no paint.
> 
> Do the edges on the painted covers appear to be in better condition?


Yes, that picture came from the unpainted group. The painted tops did much better, but there is still a slight amount of delamination on the sides. Keep in mind that even the unpainted tops are still very serviceable, but its not bulletproof either. Oh, even with the delamination they are not warped like you see with plywood. If you could wrap the advantech in flashing, they would likely last for ever, but that kind of defeats the value of going with the expensive sheathing.


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