# Are there specific hints and/or signs that occur before a swarm moves into a trap?



## soarwitheagles (May 23, 2015)

Hi all!

Been catching swarms last year and this year.:thumbsup: In our locale, catching of swarms appears to be occurring significantly later in the season due to much more rainfall than usual during our winter and spring months.

I have had our swarm traps up since Feb. Once the rain began to let up, we began catching one swarm after another.

Here is my $million$ dollar question:

*Are there specific hints and/or signs that occur before a swarm moves into a trap?*

Example: recently, I have noticed what appear to be large numbers of scout bees checking out our swarm traps, then, within a day or two, sure enough, a swarm moves right in.:applause:

Is the presence of 50+ scout bees a hint/sign that a swarm is soon to move in? For me, it seems to be a pattern now. I am a total newbie, but I am beginning to see what seems to be a pattern where a large number of scout bees enter/exit check out the swarm trap, then, within 1-3 days, there is a swarm in the trap.:applause:

Last question: Last year, I always saw the large "bee beard" outside the swarm trap for a few hours. This year, I haven't seen one "bee beard." But I will notice large numbers of bees entering/exiting the swarm trap and when I take the swarm trap down, sure enough, there are a number of frames filled with bees. Do most of you bee swarm catchers actually see the swarm move in and see the "bee beard?" Or, are there other people like me, where maybe we missed actually seeing the swarm, but discover the swarm inside the trap after seeing massive traffic entering/exiting the trap?

Please help me out if ya can. I am trying to figure this one out.

Oh, one last question: how long do most of you leave the swarm in the trap before moving it to a beehive box?

Thank you!


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## ToeOfDog (Sep 25, 2013)

Go to Youtube and google Dr. Tom Seely.


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## Eikel (Mar 12, 2014)

I've had two swarms move in while I was trying to attach the box to the tree but most arrive when I'm elsewhere. I only use 1 or 2 drawn frames and 3-4 foundationless frames so I only leave them 5-6 days. if they decide to build wonky comb, they can make a mess even in that amount of time.


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## Fishmaster50 (Apr 30, 2015)

It seem like within a day or two of setting out I got 1 to 2 hundred lookers ( scouts). After that it's a few here and there. Set one at bro in laws and he swore there was a swarm in it the second day but it was just scouts. I have one at my house that I've been keeping eye on so I'll see if I get a lot of scouts then a swarm move in. If one does.


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

Fighting and killing each other scouts are a good sign.


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## soarwitheagles (May 23, 2015)

Thanks for sharing Frank! I just noticed one of the swarm traps had the scouts fighting ferociously. Most of the other traps, I did not see that...


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## crmauch (Mar 3, 2016)

soarwitheagles said:


> Example: recently, I have noticed what appear to be large numbers of scout bees checking out our swarm traps, then, within a day or two, sure enough, a swarm moves right in.:applause:


Seeley was mentioned before. If you haven't read "Honeybee Democracy" by Seeley, I would recommend it. It's not specifically about swarm trapping, but has an incredible amount of useful information for swarm trappers.

You're observation is correct. From reading Seeley, Scout bees scout out potential sites, and return to the nest and 'dance' similar to the dancing for nectar. The original scout/s gradually lose interest, but if the site is good, more and more scouts get recruited until a level of scouts is reached that meet a 'quorum' and the scouts then communicate to the swarm that a site is chosen.


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## clong (Apr 6, 2015)

Mr. Frank,

This is driving me crazy! I've put up 8 swarm traps all over my area. Most were in place by early April. Many of them have had dozens and even hundreds of witnessed scout visits. But no caught swarms. I'm using lemongrass in wax pucks and an occasional booster spritz of Swarm Commander.

Last week I put one up on my long gravel driveway where it intersects a gully which has flowing water 1/10 days. Since Sunday, there has been increasing activity. 2-3 bees at a time on Monday, 5-10 at a time yesterday. Today I'm told there were 20+ bees buzzing around and in the entrance. Yesterday, amongst all the activity I noticed a bee clinging near the entrance that didn't move for 5 minutes. It was breathing, but that was it. I've seen bees boxing each other a few times. Last night, I popped the lid to look in - nothing.

Do scout bees just tour the local neighborhood looking at nesting spots for no good reason? Could they be bored bees from my own hive? Are they just taunting me?


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## odfrank (May 13, 2002)

>". I'm using lemongrass in wax pucks and an occasional booster spritz of Swarm Commander."

>"I noticed a bee clinging near the entrance that didn't move for 5 minutes. It was breathing, but that was it. "

Over baiting. The clinging bee has been overcome with SCL fumes.

One or two spritzes at the get go.


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## clong (Apr 6, 2015)

Thanks for the diagnosis. Hopefully, the SCL will dissipate quickly.


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## flyin-lowe (May 15, 2014)

I use 1 frame of drawn comb and then put starter strips in the remaining frames. They always draw them straight that way. All the swarms I caught last year I just moved all the frames from the trap to the new hive. 

Mine are not on my own property so I don't get to check them daily. Every week or so I check them so I can't say what kind of activity they have before a swarm moves in.


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## soarwitheagles (May 23, 2015)

Wow, caught 3 swarms in the last 4 days. Not sure what is going on...never seen this before. I built, then placed a new swarm trap 1.5 days ago, came home today, and found a swarm on the inside and the outside of the new trap. The outside bunch of bees appear to have taken geometry classes...they made a near perfect pyramid. So strange. So wonderful. So sweet.

Never seen so many swarms in my life. The eucalyptus forest just began to bloom...wondering if this has anything to do with it.

The swarm today was the largest swarm I have ever seen or caught. By nightfall, the pyramid of bees was hanging down so far, that when I barely touched em' they fell right into the box nearly as a whole.

Second surprise was when I opened the trap. There seemed to be even more bees inside the box than outside the box.

Wow, I sure hope they want to hang out in our bee yard.

I am wondering if they are feral or if some commercial beekeeper recently moved lots of hives nearby...these bees did not come from our yard. I am fairly certain none of the swarms we caught this week are from our yard. Trying to figure out why the sudden turn of events...catching nearly a swarm a day. Never had this type of catching spree ever before...


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## clong (Apr 6, 2015)

Yeeeha! I Caught my first swarm ever in the driveway trap. The Lord is good. They moved in sometime yesterday. It rained hard before it cleared off. My oldest girl checked the trap a couple times during the day, but no one saw the swarm enter. 

My wife asked if they might have come from the one hive in our beeyard. It has a broodminder W in place, so it was easy to see whether there was a sudden drop in weight. There wasn't. Finally, new bees without having to buy a package.


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## soarwitheagles (May 23, 2015)

clong said:


> Yeeeha! I Caught my first swarm ever in the driveway trap. The Lord is good. They moved in sometime yesterday. It rained hard before it cleared off. My oldest girl checked the trap a couple times during the day, but no one saw the swarm enter.
> 
> My wife asked if they might have come from the one hive in our beeyard. It has a broodminder W in place, so it was easy to see whether there was a sudden drop in weight. There wasn't. Finally, new bees without having to buy a package.


clong,

Congrats on catching your very first swarm! May it be the first of many!

Here, the swarms are coming in so fast, we cannot keep up with them. I realized today, we are completely out of frames, boxes, tops and bottoms. So we began to build more immediately. 

This morning, I drove to work, and look what was waiting for me in the parking lot [40 miles away from our ranch]:









The Lord truly does answer prayer!


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## clong (Apr 6, 2015)

Yes, He does.

Last night the trap was moved to the beeyard, and a new trap went in its place. Now to learn how to catch a homeless swarm.

So, did you catch the one in the picture? How high was it? If so, how did you do it?


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## Phoebee (Jan 29, 2014)

Eikel said:


> I've had two swarms move in while I was trying to attach the box to the tree but most arrive when I'm elsewhere.


Were you using a swarm pheromone lure?

Just wondering. Using old comb as a lure, I usually had a few bees check out our swarm trap, but no takers (other than a hoard of wax moths).

This year we're using pheromone lures with a little clean comb and some foundationless frames. We've seen no scouts. One of the hives almost swarmed last weekend ... we found the queen and "artificially swarmed" her ourselves.


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## clong (Apr 6, 2015)

I'm sorry this is related, but a bit off-topic.

Ok, so my swarm trap has been moved to the beeyard last night, 200 yards away. A new one was put up in its place.

Grass was stuffed into the entrance, and a board leaned up in front of the hive. Apparently, the bees have finally tunneled their way out. The bees had to navigate several inches either left or right to avoid the board in front of the trap. I've been told that 30+ bees have starting accumulating on the new trap where the old entrance used to be. This trap has an entrance on the side, instead of the front. How do I deal with this? Can I play the queen pipe and lead them back to the beeyard? Should I go there at night, scoop the bees, and try to return them to the yard? Will they find their way back?

I don't know what to do. Help.


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## soarwitheagles (May 23, 2015)

Here is a swarm trap that I opened up last night...after leaving it up in the tree with a swarm for nearly one week.

Bad choice, but I simply did not have any time to remove it...

Wild comb and burr and the bees had filled my nice black comb with eggs, larvae, honey, and pollen...


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## Sniper338 (May 1, 2017)

I aint seen one dang swarm yet this year.


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## Eikel (Mar 12, 2014)

5-6 days of constant rain here, filled the drawn comb, 4 foundationless and built 4+ nice straight comb off the cover.


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