# First attempt -walk away queen rearing-pics and experiments



## Rube63 (Jun 28, 2010)

Hi
When these small cages are put over the cells are there worker bees trapped inside with the cells. If so how many do you try to have in the cage?


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## Guest (Jan 25, 2012)

I actually tried not to have workers in the cage with the queen cell. No reason for it at that point. I may have trapped some or some may have hatched out under the cage. I truthfully don't remember.


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

Those cells look like they are built on new comb. If the hive was fed well (a flow) I'll bet those queens are of good quality. New comb is easily torn down and rebuilt into queen cells.

Jay Smith, from Better Queens

"It has been stated by a number of beekeepers who should know better (including myself) that the bees are in such a hurry to rear a queen that they choose larvae too old for best results. later observation has shown the fallacy of this statement and has convinced me that bees do the very best that can be done under existing circumstances. 

"The inferior queens caused by using the emergency method is because the bees cannot tear down the tough cells in the old combs lined with cocoons. The result is that the bees fill the worker cells with bee milk floating the larvae out the opening of the cells, then they build a little queen cell pointing downward. The larvae cannot eat the bee milk back in the bottom of the cells with the result that they are not well fed. However, if the colony is strong in bees, are well fed and have new combs, they can rear the best of queens. And please note-- they will never make such a blunder as choosing larvae too old."--Jay Smith 

Quinby seems to agree:

"I want new comb for brood, as cells can be worked over out of that, better than from old and tough. New comb must be carefully handled. If none but old comb is to be had, cut the cells down to one fourth inch in depth. The knife must be sharp to leave it smooth and not tear it."--Moses Quinby 

C.C. Miller's view of emergency queens

"If it were true, as formerly believed, that queenless bees are in such haste to rear a queen that they will select a larva too old for the purpose, then it would hardly do to wait even nine days. A queen is matured in fifteen days from the time the egg is laid, and is fed throughout her larval lifetime on the same food that is given to a worker-larva during the first three days of its larval existence. So a worker-larva more than three days old, or more than six days from the laying of the egg would be too old for a good queen. If, now, the bees should select a larva more than three days old, the queen would emerge in less than nine days. I think no one has ever known this to occur. Bees do not prefer too old larvae. As a matter of fact bees do not use such poor judgment as to select larvae too old when larvae sufficiently young are present, as I have proven by direct experiment and many observations."--Fifty Years Among the Bees, C.C. Miller


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## David LaFerney (Jan 14, 2009)

Very cool experiment - one that I've never seen before.

You could use this method to get a look at all of the queens once they emerge, cull any that don't look to suit you (or select for a particular trait like cordovan color) then remove any remaining extras to their own mating nuc, while leaving the best one in the original nuc where she is most likely to be accepted. 

If you could make up the other nucs out of frames of bees that were in the one that they all originally emerged into maybe the issues of introducing a virgin to a new nuc could even be avoided. For example if the cell builder hive were a larger strong hive that was made queenless for the purpose, and then split into mating nucs *after* the queens emerged. You would have to make sure there weren't any uncaged cells of course.

In any event thanks for sharing - this is certainly something to think about for someone who wants to raise a few good queens.


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## spunky (Nov 14, 2006)

I went to Mason jar top feeders like yours ( my homemade tops ) and it cut down on the robbing some, had to go to a 2 bee width entrance though


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## lakebilly (Aug 3, 2009)

I have heard of mother/daughter combos, but not sisters. 

Is it possible that they cannot tolerate each other as virgins, but can tolerate each other after their mated?

What is the benefit of two queens in one hive anyway?


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## really_so_sorry (Feb 23, 2012)

I like the cages, and have used them myself, but I'm curious if you had any workers "digging" underneath them to get into the cage. If so, how did you deal with that? I found it a bit frustrating.


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