# Bees ignoring introduced queen



## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

Several possibilities. One, they just dont like her. Ok, not a real answer. Chances are the bees think they already have a queen. Brood break could be why you don't see eggs or larvae. The queen may not be well mated and producing sufficient pheromones.

I would remove the queen from the hive and put two or three frames of bees in another box for about an hour. Make certain there is no queen on those frames. Then set the new queen on the frames of the new box and see how the bees respond. If they attend to her, you still have a queen in the first hive or a laying worker. If they still ignore her, there may be a problem with the queen.

Good luck and please provide an update when you can.


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## AstroBee (Jan 3, 2003)

JWPalmer said:


> Several possibilities. One, they just dont like her. Ok, not a real answer. Chances are the bees think they already have a queen. Brood break could be why you don't see eggs or larvae. The queen may not be well mated and producing sufficient pheromones.
> 
> I would remove the queen from the hive and put two or three frames of bees in another box for about an hour. Make certain there is no queen on those frames. Then set the new queen on the frames of the new box and see how the bees respond. If they attend to her, you still have a queen in the first hive or a laying worker. If they still ignore her, there may be a problem with the queen.
> 
> Good luck and please provide an update when you can.


Good advice.

Do you know if the purchased queen was laying prior to getting her? This is much more remote than what JWP points out.


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## BigJoe (May 4, 2018)

What a difference 5 hours makes. I opened the hive to split the brood boxes and remove the caged queen. I noticed there was no roaring, the bees were calm, I didn't even fire up my smoker. I pulled the queen out and her cage was covered with bees. They did not appear aggressive nor did it appear that they were trying to sting/attack the screen. So, I put the queen back in, put the hive back together and I'll give it a week or so. Thoughts??


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## BigJoe (May 4, 2018)

Oh, I musta hit send......Thanks for your quick responses and sage advice. I'll put your suggestions in my notebook for next time. No, I do not know the queen's history though I had success with 3 queens I bought from the same supplier a month ago. (Buying queens is expensive and you never know what you are getting - I plan to raise my own queens next summer)


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## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

This is really good news. Had you smoked the hive before trying to install the queen? Smoke could have masked the queen's pheromones initially. If everything looks normal, make sure you pull the cork from the candy end and give her a week or two to get settled.

As far as next years queens, try to do it late spring or early summer for summer nucs. A nice slow moving mated queen makes excellent dragonfly fodder. I had great success this spring and about a 90% failure rate this summer getting my queens back.


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## Richard Cryberg (May 24, 2013)

BigJoe said:


> Opened my hive and found many, many bees, no eggs and no brood. Did not look hard but did not see a queen. While introducing a purchased queen I laid the queen container on top of the frames and the bees completely ignored it. Tried for several minutes but no interest; accepting or trying to kill. Went ahead and stuck queen within the frames and decided to do an internet check. Haven't found much - any suggestions??


This sounds perfectly normal to me. What did you expect the bees to do? Hire a band? I just love the answers you got from people who are instant experts after having had bees a few months! Bloody incredible answers. Those people should run for congress. They would fit right in with the clueless people in Washington.

In fact if the bees had paid a great deal of attention to the caged queen that is a likely sign she could be dead fast if released. What you want to see is either modest attention or little attention and calm. If that is what you get you can likely release her right then if the hive is not a huge boomer. If it is a huge boomer you are better off introducing her to a two or three frame nuc made from the boomer and when she has been laying a week doing a newspaper combine with the boomer. It is always harder to introduce to a strong hive than a nuc no matter how long they have been queenless.


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## JWPalmer (May 1, 2017)

Gee Dr. Cryberg, I think the original poster was expecting the bees to respond to the new queen in the manner that bees typically do, and not have her be "completely ignored." Please note that he did not say that the bees were paying little attention or modest attention. I fail to see what about my responses you find so bloody incredible given only the information provided in the first post. Strange it it may seem, my advice was leading up to the very same nuc combine solution you suggested after having more of the facts and knowing that the situation was already resolved. No going out on a limb there for you. 
I can't figure out to whom you are referring when you speak of an "instant expert after having bees a few months". True, I have not had bees a long time, but to state that has only been a few months is either an ill-informed representation or a deceitful lie. Thankfully, I do not require your validation to consider myself an intermediate beekeeper. That I get from the numerous folks I help, both on Beesource and through my local bee club where I am a mentor.

Have a pleasant evening.


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## 1102009 (Jul 31, 2015)

My thoughts are Dr. Cryberg should be moderated.


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## AstroBee (Jan 3, 2003)

Richard Cryberg said:


> This sounds perfectly normal to me. What did you expect the bees to do? Hire a band? I just love the answers you got from people who are instant experts after having had bees a few months! Bloody incredible answers. Those people should run for congress. They would fit right in with the clueless people in Washington.
> 
> In fact if the bees had paid a great deal of attention to the caged queen that is a likely sign she could be dead fast if released. What you want to see is either modest attention or little attention and calm. If that is what you get you can likely release her right then if the hive is not a huge boomer. If it is a huge boomer you are better off introducing her to a two or three frame nuc made from the boomer and when she has been laying a week doing a newspaper combine with the boomer. It is always harder to introduce to a strong hive than a nuc no matter how long they have been queenless.




Wow. Perhaps you need to reread the original post, where it says: "...bees *completely ignored* it (the new queen). Tried for several minutes but *no interest*..."

A truly queenless colony completely ignoring a new mated queen for several minutes IS unusual! Perhaps you want to post a video showing us "newbees" how bees will completely ignore a new queen for several minutes. Take your time, we're here to learn from you. Oh, BTW, ignore my "Jan 2003" join date, I just got bees a "few months" ago. Sheesh.


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## BigJoe (May 4, 2018)

Had I expected that behavior I would have had my phone out and ready to tape it. Had I stopped to think, I could have pulled my phone out of my pocket and videoed it. In the future I will take a video when I see what I consider abnormal behavior.


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## Saltybee (Feb 9, 2012)

Yep,

That AstroBee is a newby. Hit 4000 posts in a few months. Wouldn't listen to his greenhorn advice.


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## BigJoe (May 4, 2018)

Checked the hive on Monday and the queen had been released and we found a few capped larvae, so all is well.


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## Murdock (Jun 16, 2013)

Good Job Joe! I'm no expert either and I don't have to impress anyone. Every bee hive has it's own personality and every yard too. All bees do not respond to the same stimuli... if you ate a lot of garlic the night before and breathed on the bees you might screw up how the queen smells to the bees. In beekeeping anything is possible and time/location drives all of this. It just happens..you overcame whatever it was and all is well. No one needs to get their panties in a wad.


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## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

Richard Cryberg said:


> It is always harder to introduce to a strong hive than a nuc no matter how long they have been queenless.


Bees are bees. Introduce a queen to a new queenless nuc, that was set up days ago, and see how many queens are rejected.


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## Michael Palmer (Dec 29, 2006)

Richard Cryberg said:


> In fact if the bees had paid a great deal of attention to the caged queen that is a likely sign she could be dead fast if released. What you want to see is either modest attention or little attention and calm. /QUOTE]
> 
> Little or modest attention? This is a queenless nuc, set up the day before. Following morning I added queen. This is what they act like when newly queenless, and are given access to a mated queen. Now, after a few days, after they've begun emergency cells, their reaction lessens...and they often ignore the caged queen. What is observed by one person may not be quite the same as another's. It's about situation.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RX3BgnOkozs


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