# Easy 5-frame nuc plans



## Mark in Kansas

Very nice. I might have me a weekend project now !

Dimensions on the entrance hole ?


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## Aram

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Does the Scrap (2) get used also?
Where?
Thank you,
Aram


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## throrope

:applause:Nice! This is the best nuc I've seen yet. I like the quick way you made the frame rest.

At a buck four bits it beats the pants off cardboard and paint can't cost more than shipping.:thumbsup:


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## D Coates

Mark in Kansas said:


> Very nice. I might have me a weekend project now !
> 
> Dimensions on the entrance hole ?


Under the respective pictures there's a brief description. I make the entrance 2" x 1/2". By slotting it I've found critters aren't interesting in making their nest in there.


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## D Coates

Aram said:


> :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
> Does the Scrap (2) get used also?
> Where?
> Thank you,
> Aram


The scrap is used on the ends of the top. The one's I use are 1/2" x 8". It keeps the top from easily sliding front to back.


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## Mark in Kansas

D Coates said:


> Under the respective pictures there's a brief description. I make the entrance 2" x 1/2". By slotting it I've found critters aren't interesting in making their nest in there.


"DOH!" Big "duh!" on me ! SHoulda scrolled down !


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## Adrian Quiney WI

clever.:thumbsup:


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## Reid

:thumbsup:
Simple, functional, and inexpensive.
Very nice.


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## kathygibson

Nice job...thanks for sharing with all of us! :applause:


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## Batman

I like it, except I thought the glues used in plywood, cdx and particle board were suppose to be toxic to bee?

Craig


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## SamG347

I hope not as my hive roofs are all plywood


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## AmericasBeekeeper

If you are worried about the adhesives coat the inside with propolis or roughen the wood and the bees will coat it.


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## mherndon

Do you have a template of how the 4X8 should be cut without wasting any of it? Do you cut out the parts the same way every time or do you just start cutting out parts randomly?

Mark


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## Steve10

Thank you very much for sharing this design and the pictures.


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## Happy Honey Farm

Looks nice and easy was going to make some nuc boxes this weekend and I'm going to try your way this time:applause:


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## Batman

Well if you're using plywood and the bees are still alive, maybe its more of a cdx/particle board issue since the glue would be more exposed and on the surface? Guess I'm off to Lowe's tomorrow morning.

Thanks,
Craig


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## slickbrightspear

really nice nuc thanx for the idea


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## D Coates

mherndon said:


> Do you have a template of how the 4X8 should be cut without wasting any of it?


No template, (though I should) but I focus on the sides first top to bottom. They consume a lot of material. Then I focus on the tops and bottoms. At that point I then focus on the fronts and backs. I use the remander for the end caps and scraps. I have the wood cut in half at Home Depot as my Expedition can't handle an 8' x 4' but it can handle 2 4'x4's with no problem.


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## D Coates

Batman said:


> maybe its more of a cdx/particle board issue since the glue would be more exposed and on the surface?


I guess ignorance is bliss. The first ones I made are from exterior chipboard I tore out of my garage that the previous owner had used as shelves. Some of the shelves even had motor oil soaked into it. I was a little concerned about it thinking they would reject it and obscond. Nope, they don't seem to care and lightly propolised over it like everything thing else in there. I've used scrap and new plywood on the remainders with no problems. With the places I found and seen bee's make hives I've come to the conclusion they are quite hardy


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## Naturegoods

Looks great and I happen to want a bunch of these!
Perhaps I didn't notice it but it seems the hardest part of dealing with 4x8 sheets is the initial rips to get sized down to something managable and avoid a big scrap factor.
Are they there someplace? 
It's scary but photobucket already knew who I was and copied the pics to my folder 

After thought - any small cheap hinge to attatch the lid along the side could be handy


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## D Coates

Fully agreed. I have the 4x8 cut in half at Home Depot. Dealing with 4x4 is no problem on a table saw.

No problem, add a hinge if you want. I don't so I can add or take away tops that have feeder holes in them or if I want to stack another nuc body (without a bottom) on top of that I can. For me the hing makes the unit less fexible


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## Naturegoods

It seems the rips could be at 9.0, 10.25, 10.25, 9.5, and 8.5 adds up to 47.5.
Seems that a 2feet x 4 feet piece should get me one and still fit in a compact car!:thumbsup:
I know the prices on a 4x8 are better but ...... we do what we must.


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## Ben Brewcat

Naturegoods said:


> It seems the rips could be at 9.0, 10.25, 10.25, 9.5, and 8.5 adds up to 47.5.


You also have to account for the kerf (the width of the cut). Add the 5 cuts at .125 inches and you're over 48".

For cutting down sheet stock, if you don't have feeder stands, get an inexpensive 8' straightedge (it breaks down in 2 pieces) for drywall that comes with two clamps. Measure, clamp it so the kerf will be dead center (on the footplate on my circular saw it's 5"), and use a skill saw.


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## Kieck

Don't forget to add 1/8 inch for the blade width on each cutting pass (that 1/8 inch is converted to saw dust). Based on the way I figure, you could still get the rips out of 48, but barely. Keep in mind that you will have 4 kerfs between those dimensions.


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## D Coates

Never even heard of a kerf but I know what it is now. However you choose to cut it, when you're done and you got 4 nucs off of a 4x8 there's not much scrap left.


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## SamG347

Just wanted to say I picked up a sheet today. Going to make 4 Medium nucs out of it!
:thumbsup:


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## standman

Thanks for the pics. My son and I made 20 today out of 4 sheets and a little scrap I had laying around. Really easy. Might build some to sell to our local beeks. Can't wait to fill mine up with swarms and splits.


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## slickbrightspear

I guess I have just missed it where do the two small pieces of scrap go.


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## RDY-B

they cleat the top


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## slickbrightspear

thanx


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## fuzzybeekeeper

I can see how the double end pieces for the frame rests add some strength, but I don't see how the box would be strong enough to use as a super to add to the top of a nuc. The bottom adds a lot of strength and a "super" would not have a bottom for that strength.

Fuzzybeekeeper


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## Ross

I make a similar one, but do a couple of things different. I use 3/4" material on the ends and cut a dado around 3 sides to make the frame rest and recess the end grain of the sides. For the entrance, I just drill a 1" hole. I screen the bottom of mine and they are plenty strong.


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## mherndon

Built this yesterday. I did step up a grade of plywood. The plans were great. I did cut my strips 10.25, 10.25, 9, 8.5 and 7.5 this left a 1.75 strip for the end cleats. Looks good and very strong. I may end up cutting 2" holes with screens for ventilation in the bottom. I will probably cut a jar lid hole in the top for a feeder lid. I plan on using them to start queens or for spare queen nucs. I don't see any problem with stacking them, they will be plenty strong. I went ahead and put bottoms on all mine. I had a friend that used to make cabinets and he was set up with equipment. Table saw, radial arm saw, brad nailer, a square mounted to his work bench helped pop these out in a little over an hour. I slowed him down though.

Mark


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## Monie

Holy Hannah!! That's the best (A.K.A. easiest) nuc plan that I've seen!! Thanks for sharing!!:thumbsup:


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## Ben Brewcat

OK everyone, just because I have some time on my hands and SWMBO is out all day, I tried using Sketchup for the 1st time to figure out these cuts. I'm sure once I'm familiar with it it'll go smoother, still it's pretty slick. Forgive the fonts, that seems to be an element I can't figure out. 

I think it makes more sense if the long cuts go first. Something like this.

Ben's sketchy Sketchup diagram.

For some reason I get a lot more waste than others (the rightmost 5 pieces except for the center row that made the lids and migratory cleats). Am I missing something?


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## Monie

I think it looks pretty good. The only thing I would add is to account for the width of the saw blade; typically, 1/8". Of course, I'm anal and have to have everything spot on.


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## Ben Brewcat

True and good to point out. I specifically excluded the dimensions of the waste pieces and included only the dimensions of the work pieces for that reason. That means, for those not familiar with allowing for kerfs, that you can't just put a pencil line 10.25" under the first 10.25" and have it work out. You need to mark and cut the first, CUT IT, and then mark and cut and so on or each cut will be short by 1/8".


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## D Coates

fuzzybeekeeper said:


> I can see how the double end pieces for the frame rests add some strength, but I don't see how the box would be strong enough to use as a super to add to the top of a nuc. The bottom adds a lot of strength and a "super" would not have a bottom for that strength.
> 
> Fuzzybeekeeper


I didn't think so either but the end caps end up really seem to strengthening it up. I use the same glue and nails either way. Will it stand up to being dropped on a corner? I doubt it, but I treat them no differently than any of my other hardware. I have to remind myself that full, it's 1/2 of the weigh of a 10-frame deep. It's pretty light to handle. It works if you've got a nuc that's getting to big for it's britches but you don't want to put them in a deep.


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## Dubhe

I made about 10 similar nuc bodies (mediums) last season and while they seem to be holding up well, they are bowing out in the middle. I think 1/2 inch plywood works much better with the bottom attached to prevent this.


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## oldenglish

I stopped by lowes today and a 4 x 8 15/32 was $29.97 
The had exterior grade OSB particle board ($9) but I dont think it will hold up well.


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## odfrank

Help me with the math....if i make it out of 3/4" plywood do I have to make the sides top and bottom 1/2" longer?


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## USCBeeMan

With 3/4 you wouldn't need the end caps. You can cut out 3/8 of the inside ends for the frame rests. Just like you would with 1" (3/4") wood. That would give you a larger cleat imprint on each end of the top. If you put the cleats on the outside edge of the top instead of flush underneath the edges the length of the top could be shorter.


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## standman

oldenglish said:


> I stopped by lowes today and a 4 x 8 15/32 was $29.97
> The had exterior grade OSB particle board ($9) but I dont think it will hold up well.


My Lowes had three options in 1/2" plywood. I chose the middle one (about $15). It is not exterior grade, but I plan to paint well and don't plan to keep the nucs forever.


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## D Coates

I've done it out of the exterior chip board. It's held up well by the top bends when I pry it off and I had difficulty getting the nails just right to avoid splitting. Otherwise it worked well. I couldn't find it at HD in 1/2" or 15/32". It was more along the lines of 5/16 or 3/8. I just checked my HD receipt and I paid $12.46 for my 15/32 4x8 plywood. It was the chip board that I looked at but passed on that was going for over $9. Sorry for any confusion this created.


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## Sundance

Really nice and well done!! Thanks...


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## tnmx

Lowes 15/16 plywood 14.99 I bought glue and used staples I already had. In abought 2.5 hours I had 4 new swarm traps. Is is a nice afternoon project and it is fun wood work. I had lowes rip it in half. I ripped each half 10 1/4, 10 1/4, 9, 8 1/2, 7 1/2. I will do it again next weekend.


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## Kieck

These look like a great idea to me! I view them more as a way to send a box with a buyer, less expensive and more durable than a cardboard box, so that I wouldn't have to worry about getting my nuc boxes back.


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## Sundance

Kieck said:


> These look like a great idea to me! I view them more as a way to send a box with a buyer, less expensive and more durable than a cardboard box, so that I wouldn't have to worry about getting my nuc boxes back.


My thoughts exactly.......... I wonder how much labor
to cut, and assemble each one if you did 100? 200?

It would certainly be an selling point with Nuc sales too
and you could easily "justify" the extra $10 or so over the
"competition".


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## johng

I tired this also this weekend. But, I got the wrong size plywood. What I got was closer to 3/4in and it caused the frames not to fit length wise. Next time I will read the directions alittle better. It is a great design though!!


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## paul.h

tnmx said:


> Lowes 15/16 plywood 14.99 I bought glue and used staples I already had. In abought 2.5 hours I had 4 new swarm traps. Is is a nice afternoon project and it is fun wood work. I had lowes rip it in half. I ripped each half 10 1/4, 10 1/4, 9, 8 1/2, 7 1/2. I will do it again next weekend.


You took home two sheets of 4'X4'?


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## 11x

I am carpentry challenged. can some one give me the deminsions to use if i plan od making mine to hold medium frames?


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## D Coates

SamG347 is working on exactly that. You may want to PM him for those measurements. If I remember correctly you need to remove 2 7/8 from the height for the sides, front and back and you're good to go. Check the height difference between a deep and a super and subtract the difference from the heights I specified.


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## SamG347

Yes I'm working on it...don't have measurements or hives built. I had a question for all of you who use a Mason jar feeder on the lid. How do you make it so no water is getting in when you have the jar on and when you have it off? And do you just make the hole the same size as the jars or just a little smaller?
:thumbsup:


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## D Coates

I've done that 2 ways. One I drill out a hole the allows a top to fit tightly in the hole then put screen on the inside. Water does get in until they propolize the jar to the screen. The other I simply drill out a hole and set the jar on top. The jar on top isn't as secure and the bees can get to you if so inclined when you change the jar. Water doesn't seem to get in as easily with the 2nd design, unless the jar blows off. Six or one half dozen of another.


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## Hambone

11x said:


> I am carpentry challenged. can some one give me the deminsions to use if i plan od making mine to hold medium frames?


You and me both.

I printed his plans the other day and quickly did the math for mediums. Sides 7-1/4" high and front and back 6-1/2" high. Everything else should stay the same. Though I don't know my measurments are correct.


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## tnmx

paul.h said:


> You took home two sheets of 4'X4'?


That is correct I took home 2 pieces 4ft by 4ft. Lowes will cut it at no charge. I ripped each half 10 1/4, 10 1/4, 9, 8 1/2, 7 1/2. 
They are very easy to take home if your not in the truck. This also makes them easier to rip on the table saw.


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## 11x

built some today to hold meduim frames. the deminsions for length stay the same and the deminsions on the bottoms and tops stay the same. the sides are 7.25 tall and ends are 6.5 tall. works great


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## Chick

The kerf is the wood lost to the cut. Normally, you will lose 1/8". They are making really narrow blades these days, that lose less.


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## Joseph Clemens

Here is a link to a SketchUp plan, inspired by this thread, in a Medium depth, without covers or bottoms, since I simply use pieces of styrofoam insulation for those parts. I also substituted pieces of 1x2 for the cleats. I like the feel of the more sizable cleats.

I am very impressed by the way the recess for the frame-rests is designed into this Nucleus plan. A very unique conservation of materials and at the same time using the 15/32" plywood results in a nice, light-weight, economical Nucleus box.

Standard medium frames are 5-3/4" between the underside of the top bar to the outer edge of the bottom bar, with 6" between the edge of the frame rabbet and the bottom of the box, this leaves a 1/4" bee space beneath the frames. Just how I like them.

I have now finished two additional SketchUp plans that are layouts for cutting sides and ends from 15/32" plywood. One 4'x8' sheet of plywood will make 32 side pieces, 6-5/8" H x 19-1/8" L, with enough pieces left over that the cleats could easily be made from the scraps (I prefer cleats made from 1x2 stock, myself). Layout plans for end pieces, 6" H x 7-1/2" W, shows that 42 can be cut from a half sheet (4'x4') of plywood, which also leaves left-over pieces that could be used elsewhere in these projects or in others.

The layout plans allow for 1/8" kerfs between components.


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## Mike S

I bought 2 sheets of 15/32 plywood yesterday morning and used one sheet per D Coates plan to cut out 4 boxes, I had some scrap left over and plenty for the four. Cut all four out and assembled two in about 3 hours, they all came out real nice. Thanks Coates for posting a good, simple and great working plan.


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## Pink Cow

Top Bar Too?

It occurred to me after building my first from these plans that it could easily be tweaked for use as a top bar nuc or swarm trap. You could of course, reduce the overall length to fit your bars but that would limit its use to only top bars. I was thinking of simply adding a bar far enough back from the front wall where the fronts of the bars would rest, just like a regular frame would on the designed void. It will hold five 1 3/8 inch bars. If done with small screws, this would be easily removable to return the nuc to "Lang style" duties.

Sound reasonable? Am I overlooking any gotchas?


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## 11x

link to the pictures of the nucs i made yesterday
http://s699.photobucket.com/albums/vv356/11x11x/hive plans/


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## Hambone

11x said:


> I am carpentry challenged.


You weren't kidding where ya. 

Messing with ya. Looks good. I like the sbb addition.


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## 11x

i always said i wasnt building a rolex, just a timex. it will do the same job. lol powertools are dangerous in the wrong hands


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## D Coates

I did 4 of mine with SBB's. They are nice for overwintering but don't seem to work well as traps. I'm guessing too much light? I will also cut a hole in the screen to do a combine with a queenless hive that needs a boost. It's easy enough to repair the screen once finished.

I did forget about the cut open bottom one time when putting the nuc in my Expedition. That was an attention getter and took me a little bit to realize what was going on. Needless to say, my next vehicle will be a truck.


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## Batman

Spent the morning finishing up some frames and cutting the plywood for the nucs. All the wood is cut and even got one assymbled before it was tinned to go to work. Guess I can get the rest done tonight or tomorrow on my day off. Thanks Dcoats, great post!

Craig


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## 11x

i saved the pieces i cut out of the bottems to put back in so i could us them as swarm traps.just putting the cut out piece back in there wont block all the light but if i seal it with duct tape it should be plenty dark in there. at least that was my thinking


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## D Coates

I thought about doing that but the plug I cut out wasn't near as nice as what you did. I put corrugated cardboard cutouts unside the box that fit the bottom tightly. No luck for me with those but it may have simply been luck of draw.

I've also added a couple photos to the album that shows how I make an easy feeder for the top. I have full tops and feeder tops that are interchangeable depending on what I need.

http://s196.photobucket.com/albums/aa190/Drew454/Nuc plans/


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## Mike S

I have built 4 now on your plan, came out nice. On your feeder lids what about rain going inside around the jar lid, does this hurt ? Also what do you do for ventilation in hot weather, looks like it would get awful hot inside? I thought about drilling a 1/2 or 3/4 hole in the back wall and covering with screen, do you think they need it?


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## D Coates

I was concerned about rain getting around the lid too. I taped up around the joint to avoid this in the beginning. The tape failed. I watched and worried and found they didn't seem to care. They propolize the edges pretty heavy to stop any airflow, this apparently stops water as well or lets in so little it doesn't cause a problem. 

When the jar is not on there and I'm using a "feeder" top I simply put the brick I use to weight the nuc down over the hole. I did the SBB over my concern of them getting too hot my first 2 years. Last year I didn't get around to making them SBB's and those nucs acted just like the ones with the SBB but the queen laid all the way down to the bottom of the frames too. I don't put them in all day sun. They get shade about 1 pm in the dead of summer.


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## Pink Cow

D Coates said:


> I was concerned about rain getting around the lid too....


The plans could very easily be modified to accept an entrance feeder and get around this problem. 

Take 3/8" off of the bottom of the front panel and make your entrance span the entire width rather than a smaller center opening. Then, make your bottom board 1" longer so it will hold the feeder on the landing board, and you're all set.

No leaks, no hole to cover and you can stack them with feeders in place should you need to go Condo.


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## DaveinDeal

what are the measurments for these boxe's

i only have my blackberry to look at and the photo's on Pbucket are small and when zommed in you can see black smudges were your measurments and marking are :scratch: (all i can make out is what each part is where you have wrote top, bottom etc)


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## odfrank

I have entrance disks on all my nuc boxes because I use them primarily for bait boxes, and the disks make them so much more secure for closing up and moving. I used the plastic ones first, but they are already deteriorating after a few years from ultra violet light. I bought the sheet-metal ones from Kelley this year which will be a lifetime purchase. They are also small for shallower nucs and to stay out of the way of the handle cleat I add to all my boxes.

Side note: never stack bait boxes laced with lemongrass oil in close proximity. It confuses the bees and this swarm divided itself up into three parts.


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## USCBeeMan

Have 3 of the 4 built with 2 coats of primer and 1 coat of paint. Now if I could just cut a straight line with my skil saw I would be doing okay. 

Decided to just take some 4 X1s and split them into 2X1s then cut them in lengths of 8.5 inches to use as the cleats under the ends of the top.

Have split some treated 6X2 to 6 x .5 X 20". Will screw each one to a different nuc to use as a swarm trap. Will drill a hole in the treated wood near the top using a door knob drill cutter. 

Put a nail in a tree about 5 feet up and then hang the trap on the nail through the large hole.

Put some old comb and comb frames in the trap and just walk away. Come back in a couple of weeks and either I will have a swarm or not. Haven't heard of any swarms in my area yet. Little early but should be long. 

Have already hung one up (not one of these four). Hopefully will hang up 2 more over the weekend. One at a house that has bees in the wall for over 3 years. Will do a cutout when it gets a little warmer but will have the trap there in case they swarm before the cutout.


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## My-smokepole

A tip for you in making straight cut with a skill saw. Take a piece of 1/4 plywood and make a strip say 2" wide glue and staple it to a piece that is say 14" wide re cut bottom piece Lay your new straight edge on good ply wood mark your cuts clamp and cut For your first cut use what ever you have that is straight. 
*****_____
_____l l____
l______________l
7 2 2
so on the end view it will look like this. I have made them for all of my saws with two spring clamps they work great. I hope this make sense. 
David


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## Mtn. Bee

Excellent plans, Thanks for sharing!
I am definitely planning on making a bunch!:thumbsup:


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## USCBeeMan

Thanks David for your suggestion. But I can't get it straight in my mine's eye. I am a smart person but I do have ADD and even with meds sometimes things just don't jump out at me. And this is one of those. Do you have a picture?

Ken


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## Hambone

USCBeeMan said:


> Now if I could just cut a straight line with my skil saw I would be doing okay.


That's why I buy caulk by the case.

Case and point.  











I have D's plans printed and plan on making a few this weekend. 
We shall see How I do.


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## Joseph Clemens

I went and got myself two, 4' x 8' sheets of 15/32", 5-ply, exterior grade plywood - they were almost $15.00 each. Initially I cut along both long sides of one sheet creating two strips 19-1/8" wide and 8' long. I took the remaining central piece and cut it down to a 7-1/2" width, then I cut this 8' x 7-1/2" piece into fifteen 6" x 7-1/2" end pieces on my band saw, enough for seven and one half nuc boxes. Then I began cutting 6-5/8" strips off the 19-1/8" wide pieces, creating 6-5/8" x 19-1/8" side pieces. I also cut 8-1/2" long pieces of 1x2 to use for cleats. I used a hand-held circular saw to cut enough side pieces to assemble three nucs, which I did assemble using 1-1/4 inch nails and Titebond III. I haven't painted them yet, but they went together very well, some of the nails did not drive straight, poking out of the sides of the plywood, but they and the glue are still holding well. But all the corners are square and the sides and ends are straight. I plan to cut the remaining and future side pieces on my smaller table saw.

The smaller pieces of plywood, left over from cutting out the ends and sides is wide enough and long enough to make cleats from, so I will use some for the cleats on the next one I build. I like having cleats of 1x2, but will try the plywood cleats to see if they will suffice. It would be an even more efficient use of the material. It seems difficult to find other uses for the thinner scraps.








Thank you again, D Coates


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## Pink Cow

Hey Hambone - Ugly Works! You've got your proof right there in the picture. Nice going on that catch.


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## oldenglish

Last year I got a 10" table saw for $40 off craigslist, yesterday it got a new blade and I was able to get the 15/32 plywood for $12.47 at Home Depot.
I had them cut the sheets (2) in half as my shed is small, even then 4 x 4 was almost too big.
I am able to get 2 boxes out of each half, with a little left over. I made my first one last night, it took me a couple of hours just becuase I had to figure out which cuts to make and I also made up a little jig to hold the box while I glue and staple.
In future I will cut all the wood and then assemble last.
The box came out very nice and was maybe the easiest thing I have built yet.


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## kathygibson

Here's an endorsement. I have never built anything from scratch before. I needed a few nucs...saw the plan and how simple it appeared to be and decided to give it a shot. Went to Home Depot and got the plywood. It took me quite a while to sketch the plan onto the sheets, but finally got there. Cut the pieces and then assembled. I did adjust for medium frames (as I have all med. equipment). The only snag I ran into was my lack of planning for the cut width, which caused some of the pieces to not fit together as snugly as they should have..which was corrected with a little homemade wood bondo. Mine look a little like Hambones...but with a coat of paint....they'll be fine. Not bad for an absolute rookie. Thanks again for the plans! 

http://picasaweb.google.com/kathy.e.gibson/Nucs#5453316776541120418


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## My-smokepole

Ken No I don't have a photo. Basely it is one piece lay-ed on top of another. The strip lay-ed on top that is glue to the bottom piece off center. The shoe of the saw rides on the plywood with the upper 2" strip edge working as A straight edge. Make every thing bigger than the shoe of your saw mine run about 1.5 for the one way and 7.5 the other way. When you make your fist cut down your straight edge you will be cutting it to size for that saw. I use two spring clamp to hold the guild in place when cutting something. I hate posting photo and I know I would lose someone the first time. I hunted all over the net for a drawing or a copy of the show for you. I saw it first on Ask this old house with tom I think it was in 5 season show # 25 but I lost it and drove myself nuts looking


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## Joseph Clemens

Okay, I assembled four more 15/32" nucs and used 15/32" scrap plywood for the cleats. I have been converted, I will use plywood for future nuc cleats.


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## johnhewitt09

Here is a link for a circular saw guide. They work very well. I have one that is 4 foot long for cross cutting and one that is 8 foot long for ripping. Hope this helps.
http://wayneofthewoods.com/circular-saw-cutting-guide.html


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## Axtmann

When I build 5 frame nuc boxes I always have a small compartment on the back for inside feeding. I make the box 10cm (3inch) longer and put a sheet inside, a little bit lower so the frames sit on. Advantage: no bees from other hives can rub food, easy to fill and check, no jars. 

On this website is a picture from a 3 frame nuc box (mini plus). My have space for five frames and it works great. 
http://www.tischlerei-herler.com/Sonder Anfertigung.htm


----------



## My-smokepole

John thanks that is the one but I just use 1/4" plywood.
David/toledo


----------



## Hambone

Posting this for beesource member Chick. (He is having a problem posting pics.)












Chick said:


> I got 3 of these bait hives out on one sheet of 1/2" plywood. They are basically 8 frame hives. I settled on the size, as it gave about a 39.25 liter size box. USDA and Cornell University say that 40 liter is the optimum size. The box is 12" wide and 10 1/2" tall, inside, and standard length. They are strictly for swarm capture.


----------



## BEES4U

Joseph Clemens said:


> Okay, I assembled four more 15/32" nucs and used 15/32" scrap plywood for the cleats. I have been converted, I will use plywood for future nuc cleats.


You could rip some old supers or pallets for cleat stock
Ernie


----------



## Joseph Clemens

Ernie,
Thanks for that thought - I have several stacks of old supers that occasionally catch a stray swarm, but most of them are slowly weathering away. It shouldn't be too difficult to salvage the solid parts of them and cut them into 1x2 cleats. Sure beats watching them gradually rot away to nothing.


----------



## Elwood

Thanks for the post D


----------



## 11x

just a update. i was woried about the lids comming off so my solution was i went to my local hardware and got some 1 1/2" hinges. i put 2 on a nuc. it works great. the lid hinges over real nice.


----------



## Chick

On the bait hives I made, the lids attach with wood screws. The hives will be out for awhile, and they are not for actual raising bees, so, the lid is attached securely.


----------



## fuzzybeekeeper

Ok, DCoates,

Somewhere in some little cubicle office some nerd ordering guy is sitting there wondering why all of a sudden there has been this big rush on 15/32 sheets of plywood!!!

I bought two sheets yesterday and built 4 boxes out of the first one last night while my wife was watching two episodes of Private Practice.

SO EASY!!!

And I have wanted some of these for so long but thought it would take a lot of money and time!

I'd like to know how many of these Nucs have been built this spring since you posted this thread!

Three thoughts.....

1) I bought #4 galvanized nails and had some splitting. I am going to try to find some #3 galvanized nails today.

2) I can see where (if you were going to build a BUNCH of these) it would make things so much easier to nail the sides to the bottom to build a box just a LITTLE smaller than the finished box so you could just lay everything on top of and to the side of the guide box to keep things square.

3) I set my table saw for the correct width and cut the entire sheet as a rip for the widths designated by Ben Brewcat in post #36 of this thread. Maybe my saw blade is a little wide giving me extra wide kerfs (see, I learned something! I didn't know what a kerf was), but I didn't have the 1 7/8 inch strip left over. I only had 1 3/4 and not even the little scrap he shows. It worked ok, though because the 1 7/8 strip has lots of room to give.

Fuzzybeekeeper


----------



## mothergoosemagic

FuzzyBeeKeeper, whenever I'm working with thin wood or ends, I ALWAYS pre-drill the hole, using a bit a little smaller than the nail. Takes a few more minutes, but it saves a lot of aggravation that way.


----------



## Batman

D,

All I can say is with as busy as I have been around here chasing swarms, I'm glad you posted these plans. Hell, I barely got them built, I didn't even get to paint them yet and now I have to build more, guess that's why the weather is crappy right now. Slow down the swarms til I get more equipment built, I have 2 hives, 2 nucs ready, but need frames, bought 85 week ago and just have not had the time to build them.
So thanks again, I'll raise my next pint in your honor.

Craig


----------



## EastSideBuzz

So where is the best place to put these traps. 

At the Edge of a field or in the woods?


----------



## D Coates

I'm sincerely glad that those who have used these plans have enjoyed those nucs as much as I have. I felt the simplicity allowed for novice woodworkers like myself to inexpensively make them and modify them for their personal preferences.

I just transfered one of my overwintered nucs out of one of those into a drawn deep that has a full but queenless split underneath them for a newspaper combine over lunch. I've now got 8 of these nucs ready for swarm season as catch boxes, swarm traps, and queen mating nucs. I think I've got 14 of them now with 4 currently occupied. Here's hoping for a good swarm season (not out of my hives though)

Personally, I like to put them just inside brush lines. I like for them to be in the about 6 to 7 foot off the ground and in the shade the majority of the time


----------



## Dubhe

I think this thread has officially gone viral. Thanks for the plans D.


----------



## Dave360

built 8 last weekend used 3/8" sheathing $12.28 per sheet used tite bond 3 glue and 1" 18ga staples and per someones idea from another thread painted "end" wood with tite bond 3 painting now had to adjust bottoms to 8 1/4" wide 

turned out great 


!!!!!!!!!THANKS FOR THE GREAT PLAN !!!!!

also the layout post

David


----------



## hipifreq

Joseph Clemens said:


> Here is a link to a SketchUp plan, inspired by this thread, in a Medium depth, without covers or bottoms, since I simply use pieces of styrofoam insulation for those parts.
> 
> Standard medium frames are 5-3/4" between the underside of the top bar to the outer edge of the bottom bar, with 6" between the edge of the frame rabbet and the bottom of the box, this leaves a 1/4" bee space beneath the frames. Just how I like them.


First off, MANY THANKS to D Coates for first posting his awesome project, and then more thanks to Joseph Clemens for working out medium size. :applause:

Checking out the medium size, shouldn't the Nuc have bee space on the top too? I "ran the numbers" from a standard medium frame to get slightly different numbers on the plans. Here's my measurements that include 3/8" bee space between the frames and walls on the sides and bottom and 1/4" between frame tops and ceiling.

Sides: 19 3/8 x 6 7/8"
Front/Back: 7 1/2 x 6 1/8"
Top: 22 1/4 x 9"
Bottom: 20 1/4" x 8 1/2"
End Caps: 8 1/2 x 2" (same)

Being proficient at AutoCAD (and admittedly a bit anal about drawing up plans) I just threw together a cross section to measure it out. Here's my first take at making the original plans into a 5-frame medium nuc.
View attachment Easy5FrameNuc-Medium.pdf


----------



## scdw43

Good plans,will be good for selling nucs.


----------



## Broke-T

I would increase depth of nuc to give 1" clearance under frames. If you use these to move frames with queen cells into, the cells often are on bottom edge and extend bellow frame 1/2 to 3/4 inch. If you only have 3/8 bee space you destroy queen cell.

Johnny


----------



## jrbbees

Naturegoods said:


> I know the prices on a 4x8 are better but ...... we do what we must.


Don't buy the smaller pre-cut peices. buy the full 4x8 sheets
Have them at Lowes make cuts. They will tell you there is a cut charge. $0.25 per cut. Who cares! that is so much cheaper than the cost of the smaller pre-cut peices.


----------



## PeterC

Thanks for the Plans.  :thumbsup:
There has been some discussions about using a bottom board or not for stacking and whether it will take the weight. Could you just use a hole saw and put some holes in the bottom to let the bees move to that box? Keeping the scrap holes or using some metal to cover the holes when you wanted to use it as a standalone?

Anyway. again Thanks.


----------



## dixiebooks

Ben Brewcat said:


> OK everyone, just because I have some time on my hands and SWMBO is out all day, I tried using Sketchup for the 1st time to figure out these cuts. I'm sure once I'm familiar with it it'll go smoother, still it's pretty slick. Forgive the fonts, that seems to be an element I can't figure out.
> 
> I think it makes more sense if the long cuts go first. Something like this.
> 
> Ben's sketchy Sketchup diagram.
> 
> For some reason I get a lot more waste than others (the rightmost 5 pieces except for the center row that made the lids and migratory cleats). Am I missing something?


Ben, have you tried the Sketchup using two 4' x 4' pieces? I'm thinking if you get a sheet at Lowe's or HD and have them cut it in half for you (I think they will both do the "first cut" free), it would be easier to work with. Thanks. -james


----------



## chemist20

I went to Lowes yesterday and bought one 4x8 sheet and had them cut it into 3 sections 32" wide. They didn't charge anything for the cuts. I have a small hatchback so it's the only way.

I got 4 medium nucs made out of those with wood left over in case I made a mistake cutting, etc.. Easy to handle on the table saw with a small piece of plywood 32" x 48". 

Great plans!!


----------



## metrosean

I am not to swift with a table saw, but with this Easy Nuc Plan it was simple. This is genius and they came out perfect. How about Easy Medium Super Plan?......Thanks Again


----------



## D Coates

dixiebooks said:


> Ben, have you tried the Sketchup using two 4' x 4' pieces? I'm thinking if you get a sheet at Lowe's or HD and have them cut it in half for you (I think they will both do the "first cut" free), it would be easier to work with. Thanks. -james


Personally, I like the 2 '4 X '4 pieces as they are easier to handle and get clean cuts with, but I have no drawings. Also, Ben are you taking into account the material that will be consumed with the curfs? 

I'll be make some more of these without bottoms this winter from something I tried this year. I have 2 1" x 1/2" entrances on opposite end corners. Place on a solid sheet bottom cut to size with a feeder top. Put a separator in there and use it as a double queen rearing nuc. When the season is over and the queens have been removed, add a drawn frame, combine the bottomless nuc on top of a queenright nuc and you've got a 10 frame vertical nuc. It also gives you a cheap quick answer if one of your nucs needs more space ASAP.


----------



## Marc

Broke-T said:


> I would increase depth of nuc to give 1" clearance under frames. If you use these to move frames with queen cells into, the cells often are on bottom edge and extend bellow frame 1/2 to 3/4 inch. If you only have 3/8 bee space you destroy queen cell.
> 
> Johnny


I too was wondering about this space issue that Johnny brought up... could anyone that has built and used the nucs so far talk a little about it? I am getting ready to build some this winter and can easily built them either way. What do you think about Johnny's suggestion?


----------



## NewbeeNnc

Quote:
Originally Posted by Broke-T 
I would increase depth of nuc to give 1" clearance under frames. If you use these to move frames with queen cells into, the cells often are on bottom edge and extend bellow frame 1/2 to 3/4 inch. If you only have 3/8 bee space you destroy queen cell.





Marc said:


> I too was wondering about this space issue that Johnny brought up... could anyone that has built and used the nucs so far talk a little about it? I am getting ready to build some this winter and can easily built them either way. What do you think about Johnny's suggestion?


Bump. Curious about this as well.


----------



## D Coates

Go ahead. It should be no serious problem. The worst I could see happening is you'll get some bur comb.


----------



## NewbeeNnc

Thanks D for responding.


----------



## Tom Fran

*Damaged queen cells on bottom of frames*

Making the nucs deeper makes sense. Here in this video that I was watching on youtube the other day, the beekeeper removes a frame with (6) queen cells on it. He discovers that in the process of removing the frame, (5) of the queen cells were destroyed.

The video is rather lengthy, but if you move ahead to 19:15 in it, you will see where he finds the damaged cells.

I thought this might aid in the discussion on this matter. I am am new at beekeeping, and happened upon this segment in my quest to learn more about beekeeping.

Hope it helps!


----------



## Russ

Thanks for posting the link to the Video Tom. Very informative on doing a shake down. I am going to have to try that. Dale


----------



## Jaseemtp

woot. Thanks Coates I made 4 of these today.. pretty easy for a white boy with no wood working skill.


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## dcross

I have a nuc box with an extra inch or so of depth, the burr comb is a huge nuisance. I'd sooner have a rim that I could add below when needed and keep the boxes at a standard depth.


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## Joseph Clemens

I make mine all medium depth, if I made them an extra inch deep, it would be annoying when I grow the nuce to two or three deep. Having some rims, as suggested, sounds better, but hardly seems necessary. I rarely, if ever, use natural queen cells that I leave on the bottom edge of frames - I predominantly use cultured queen cells I raise myself. It sounds like that extra space would create queen cell protrusion problems rather than solve them. How can these kind of queen cells be grown if the space for them weren't there in the first place?

I especially like nucs made with these plans, because by using 15/32" plywood nucs I can offer my customers the nuc in its own box for transport (with a piece of screen stapled on top), at a very reasonable price. This also reduces queen damage that can sometimes occur after transferring to a mostly empty hive with many new frames, then immediately transporting them.


----------



## Kingfisher Apiaries

I always make mine deeper. Just b/c a new frame fits does not automatically guarantee that an older slightly warped frame with burr comb will not touch the bottom, and that new queen will not be on the bottom bar 
So, I make mine with 1/2-3/4 space on the bottom. My end on my nuc is 10.5 inches long. I also run the frame dado (or with this plan the end block a little shorter) a little deeper so that I can get a patty on the top bars.'

mike


----------



## Will O'Brien

I think that is is very important to get your plywood for the product from Lowe's. It is much more appropriate for this use than the plywood from HD.


----------



## NewbeeNnc

Could it be your prefer one over the other because you live/work in the area where Lowe's Corporate is based?


----------



## Kingfisher Apiaries

Mr O'Brien, you want to raise sales at lowes? Lower prices. I do not go there anymore for lumber, I have found that I can save on average 25% buying from the local lumber yard. Sometimes more, depends on the product. 

My .02

mike


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## minz

*Question: Lets rank the best location for the traps*

Found I had a ½ sheet of ¾” plywood and a half sheet of ½” T1-11 laying around. I used the ¾ for the two ends and all of the rest from the thin T1-11. Freaked out a little when I found the bottom did not match the length of the sides so the photo’s posted really saved me. Started at noon, took lunch at 2 and still had both completed by 3:30.
:s
Question: Lets rank the best location for the traps
•	Hobby apple farm (10 miles away in agriculture) 
•	Right here by my bee yard on the 1 acre lot (where I have seen a swarm pass through before).
•	Or at a friend of mine (closer in town with huge gardens).
I only had enough material for two traps.


----------



## Jaseemtp

I made several of these and opted to make a 3/4 inch hole for the entrance. Does this sound ok? I also made one with two 3/4 inch entrances. I wanted to post a pic but cant seem to figure it out.
Jason


----------



## Shazam

Decided to make up some 8 frame medium nucs. I'd been leaning that way, and started a thread to ask if the tendency to 5 frames in mediums had a purpose or was just a default as people were used to 5 frame deep nucs.

Adapted this setup and figured I'd put up the layout pics for folk. I didn't include the small edge/scrap pieces for the top. For some reason the software was having issues with them. I was planning to use foam for the top initially, but decided to do a layout with wood top, as its easier to do a top feeder with wood than foam I've found. Because of the wider dimensions you can only get 7 of them out of 2 sheets of ply, so not as efficient as the original design obviously. Drop the tops off and you can easily get four per sheet.

I've included images of the layout for folk, and set it up on 4 sheets of 4x4 as a # of folk indicated that's how they bring their plywood home.

Enjoy

http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv274/spamfooler/Beekeeping/8FrMedNuc1of4.png
http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv274/spamfooler/Beekeeping/8FrMedNuc2of4.png
http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv274/spamfooler/Beekeeping/8FrMedNuc3of4.png
http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv274/spamfooler/Beekeeping/8FrMedNuc4of4.png

Haven't built them out yet, but this should work dimensionally. I'll let folk know when I've actually built a set.


----------



## Mike Tuggle

I haven't built mine yet but I feel I have to post my view of the gross cutting plan. I think that if I start with a 4x8 sheet and have the lumber yard cut four 4x2 footers that will fit in the car. Here is how I think I will cut it.









I will cut it piece by piece, confirming my kerf losses. There should be plenty to spare for the small end pieces.

Mike


----------



## tsmullins

That is really cool! Thanks for sharing those plans. 

Shane


----------



## D Coates

Jaseemtp said:


> I made several of these and opted to make a 3/4 inch hole for the entrance. Does this sound ok? I also made one with two 3/4 inch entrances. I wanted to post a pic but cant seem to figure it out.
> Jason


I didn't use a hole to ensure I didn't have birds or rodents trying to set up a nest in there. Thety did that to me with the cardboard nucs I used originally.

Minz,

I find the best place to put my traps is a place where there are known colonies. I'm not always successful though.


----------



## propet12

Jaseemtp said:


> I made several of these and opted to make a 3/4 inch hole for the entrance. Does this sound ok? I also made one with two 3/4 inch entrances. I wanted to post a pic but cant seem to figure it out.
> Jason


I've had mice move into swarm traps 10 feet off the ground. I cover all my swarm trap openings with 1/2" hardware cloth.


----------



## Jaseemtp

ok, so the holes are bad ideas, but I will get some hardware cloth tomorrow for them. I have painted all 20 of them now and letting them air out. I was looking at setting them out as traps around the first part of March. 
I am kinda stuck though since I do not know where any "wild" hives are.
Jason


----------



## Shazam

Well, one thing you can do is contact animal control or its equiv where you are and ask if they get many swarm calls and how they handle them. Also if there is an area they tend to come from mostly. That's a start. From there you could have them steer some calls to you so you don't need a trap but can use the boxes to put the swarms in. Also could do some beelining to look for wild hives.


----------



## WPG

Nice layout on cutting parts.

You don't have to have them cut the sheet into equal sizes.
You may have less waste with just two cuts at the lumberyard and still get it in your vehicle.
Try something like cutting off a piece 36"x48", then split the rest into a 30"x60" and 18"x60".
Adjust to fit your parts and vehicle.


----------



## Quint Randle

Just want to say thanks to DCoates and everyone on this thread. I am a total bozo when it comes to stuff like this. I was able to put together these nucs on Saturday. A fun project.


----------



## propet12

Jaseemtp said:


> ok, so the holes are bad ideas, but I will get some hardware cloth tomorrow for them. I have painted all 20 of them now and letting them air out. I was looking at setting them out as traps around the first part of March.
> I am kinda stuck though since I do not know where any "wild" hives are.
> Jason


I prefer to think of placing swarm traps in terms of where the smell will go. I find likely places where bees will be in the Spring during swarm season and position the swarm traps where the smell of the swarm lure, lemongrass oil, old brood wax, etc. will be upwind from the bees. I put mine in light cover along natural pathways, pipe easements, edges of ponds, etc.

Great thread on Nuc boxes! Sorry for getting off topic.


----------



## Solomon Parker

Does anyone have the link to those round metal entrance things? Somebody said they were at Kelley, but I can't find them.
Thanks.


----------



## Shazam

Here they are on Kelley's site. You can get plastic ones elsewhere for the same price roughly:

http://www.kelleybees.com/CMS/CMSPage.aspx?redirect=n-3-34f8ff0a-238a-4227-bfc5-0bb9ab9cbef0


----------



## Shazam

WPG said:


> Nice layout on cutting parts.
> 
> You don't have to have them cut the sheet into equal sizes.
> You may have less waste with just two cuts at the lumberyard and still get it in your vehicle.
> Try something like cutting off a piece 36"x48", then split the rest into a 30"x60" and 18"x60".
> Adjust to fit your parts and vehicle.


I did a test with full sheets and similar amount of waste. Can't get 4 8 frame medium nucs per sheet. Now, undoubtedly there is a sweetspot out there where with enough sheets you can get a highly efficient pack, but I'm not going to be making so many nuc 

The other thing is that I may actually lay it with enough edging to try and just run them out on a friend's CNC, though truthfully I think that's only worth it if I plan to do a bunch as it isn't really that much work to cut out one set manually


----------



## kchendershott

Thank you so much! I want some nucs this year and my hubby was dragging his feet with the "I don't have the right tools" song. Even he could make these in a jiffy with his tools!


----------



## Shazam

Two quick things.

1. Thanks to D Coates for this thread. Outside the 'post your bloom dates' threads, this is the most viewed thread on this subforum. Its been viewed as much as many of the Beekeeping 101 threads. So kudos on a great and valued contribution 

2. Since someone asked a question about more efficiently using the plywood for the 8 frame medium nuc layout, I decided to play around a bit. So instead of 7 8 frame medium nucs out of 2 sheets of ply, here is a layout for 8 nucs: six 8 frame mediums, and two 5 frame mediums. Its also out of 2 sheets of ply, and cut down to 4x4. No significant improvement in packing by going to full 4x8 sheets and 4x4 seems to be more accessible for many hobbyists. It has the added benefit that 2 of the 4 sheets are identical which should make cutting even simpler. The sides are interchangeable between the 8 and 5 frames. The rest of the parts are prefaced with an 8fr or 5fr to differentiate them.

http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv274/spamfooler/Beekeeping/MixMedNuc1of3.jpg
http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv274/spamfooler/Beekeeping/MixMedNuc2of3.jpg
http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv274/spamfooler/Beekeeping/MixMedNuc3of3.jpg


----------



## slickbrightspear

I lay out 4 sheets of plyboard on top of each other and put screws in strategic places to hold them together and cut out multiple peices with each cut.


----------



## Jaseemtp

I was cutting two pieces at a time.
Kchendershott, I did all of mine with a skill saw and few clamps. I am very very challenged when it comes to any type of wood work and this was easy as pie. I have since made 20 of these.


----------



## okbees

I had a circular saw and a jig saw to finish the cuts....made 4 of these today....this nuc is so easy and well made...thank you so much for the plans. Will be making more next week. GREAT NUC!!


----------



## geebob

This should be stickied! These nucs are incredibly easy to make, even for someone with modest woodworking skills.

One thing I discovered was that the 15/32" plywood actually works better than larger sizes as it is possible to bend it into true. I made four boxes out of some warped scrap last night and all of them came out very nicely. I'm hoping to put them out as swarm traps.

Thanks again for the excellent plans!


----------



## rmaro

built 4 today for 11.93 plus cost of nails, glue and paint that I already had. Had them built and painted in 3 hours. Had Lowes cut the plywood down to 22 inch strips and finished up on the table saw at home. Great Idea!


----------



## HEV261

go to HD or lowes if you dont have it a 2 3/4" hole saw is just right size and the rim of the lid over hangs and no water will get in thats for a qt jar 70mm lid


----------



## ranchonodinero

This may be sacrilege, but I didn't care for the plywood ones I built, so I found the one on this page that is made out of 1x8 and 1x12 stock. Yes, they are more expensive, but very easy to cut and keep square.


----------



## prisonman

Hi,
Do you use an inner cover at all? Also what would be the requirements for placing vent holes. I was planning on doing a split and overwinter. Thanks


----------



## angryhippie

Would you be able to just drill a 1" hole in the front of the hive or would the frames block the bees from exiting?


----------



## prisonman

What I could do is add a 2-2 1/2" spacer and make vent holes with screen, then the top back on. Just not sure how many 1" holes would be needed.


----------



## angryhippie

I'm sorry, I meant to be used as an entrance, not as vent holes.


----------



## slickbrightspear

I drill a 1 inch hole in the front and put a rotating sheet metal disk on the front. if I need a smaller hole I just rotate the disk a little making it smaller or open it up as needed. I have heard of people having trouble with those disks make sure the screw in the middle is tight so that it does not accidentally rotate and close completly off and kill the nuc.


----------



## geebob

For the most recent ones that I built, I gave them a top entrance by lowering the front panel by 3/8" and putting one of the scrap pieces for the top on only one side so I can close the entrance just by reversing the top.


----------



## Will O'Brien

NewbeeNnc said:


> Could it be your prefer one over the other because you live/work in the area where Lowe's Corporate is based?


NewbeeNnc, It is not at all that I prefer one over the other because I live/work in the area where Lowe's Corporate is based. Not at all...It is that I prefer one over the other because I work FOR the one. 

I am in our Wilkesboro offices on Thursdays if you would like to meet for lunch one day it would be nice to meet another beekeeper.


----------



## Dave E

I'd love to see the plans from this thread put on the front page of beesource, in the "build your own" section.

Dave


----------



## Intheswamp

Dave E said:


> I'd love to see the plans from this thread put on the front page of beesource, in the "build your own" section.
> 
> Dave


It is definitely an excellent thread!!! Thanks D Coates!!!


----------



## Barry

If D. Coates gives the approval, I'd be happy to draw it up and add it.

http://www.beesource.com/build-it-yourself/5-frame-nuc-d-coates-version/


----------



## schmism

D Coates said:


> I also leave the bottom off of some to stack on other nucs to make 10 frame nucs.


here's a tip for those considering building some... .screw the bottom on with screws. then you can remove it at a later date should you want to do the above.


----------



## Intheswamp

As I've stated before, I'm a rank newbee, no bees on the place...they're coming in the late winter/early spring of '12 from about 7 miles away.  Regardless of my newbeeness, I'm pumped up on trying to do some trolling for FREE bees this spring. 

Looking at the Coates nuc plans, I came up with some basic interior dimensions for the nucs (I'm sure someone already had all of this, but...). These are from the plans to which Joseph Clemens (I think that's who it was) added the measurements of the medium nucs. I'm going all 8-frame medium boxes so naturally I want the nucs to also use medium frames. My figuring might be in error, so if they are please point them out to me and I'll refigure things! 

Seeley and Morse at Cornell University did some research in which they used 10-liter, a 40-liter, and a 100-liter swarm traps. They stated that the 40 liter caught more swarms than did the other two...and when they removed the 40-liter trap from the test that the 100-liter caught swarms but the 10-liter did not. They didn't test a 30-liter or a 50-liter so the 40-liter can't be considered perfect but rather more in the "ballpark" than the other two size, I would think. 

Two 5-frame medium nucs will be about 80% the size of the 40-liter trap. It will be lighter in weight, it seems it will be easy to position vertically against tree trunks, and the nucs will be handy for other things...I'll go with the double 5-frame nuc setup.  

I have a question about the measurements/dimensions, though. My plans are to use double medium 5-frame nucs. The question that I have is in regards to bee space....what (if any) change in measurements to the plans should be made to retain bee space between the top and bottom frames? Or is that even important in a trap box?

Anyhow, here are the figures that I came up with in case anyone is interested. Ed

*Interior Dimensions of Single Medium 5-Frame Coates Nuc* 
18.19	Length 
7.50	Width 
7.25	Height 

*Volume of Single Medium 5-Frame Coates Nuc	* 
988.95	Cubic Inches per Single Nuc 
0.57	Cubic Feet per Single Nuc 
4.28	Gallons per Single Nuc 
16.21	Liters per Single Nuc 

*Volume of Double Medium 5-Frame Coates Nuc* 
1977.89 Cubic Inches per Double Nuc 
1.14 Cubic Feet per Double Nuc 
8.56 Gallons per Double Nuc 
32.41 Liters per Double Nuc


----------



## schmism

Mike Tuggle said:


> I will cut it piece by piece, confirming my kerf losses. There should be plenty to spare for the small end pieces.Mike


This is how i cut mine out yesterday. plenty of material left over for end caps and top cleats.

Ill snap i a pic or 2 of the ones i built.


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## dixiebooks

schmism- I think what he was asking is "are you cutting the medium nucs and the medium nuc supers the same size?" (If that is not a good paraphrase of the previous question, then it is an exact phrasing of my own question.)

I, too, wondered about the question of bee space when using the same dimensions to build a "super" that is used when building the main box. Seems to me that if building a box specifically for use as a super (here, any box above the primary brood box) then the height should be shortened just a tad.

I've done a little experimenting in this area, but wondered what other have found.

-james


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## odfrank

I agree, the actual nuc box needs a bit more space under the frames for entrance crawl space than a super which shares the bee space with the box below it. I have converted supers to nuc boxes with a bottom and had to add a shim as some frames scraped bottom.


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## Intheswamp

<chuckle> Well dixiebooks, you stated it a lot more simply than I did. I am indeed curious as to whether there should be a difference between the nuc supers and the nuc bodies.

Thinking about it with my limited mind, regular medium 8-10 frame supers are built to a specific depth and when used as the bottom box in a hive they are set upon a bottom board that has a (usually 3/4") rim around it. With the nucs there is no rim on the bottom board thus it appears that the plans for the DCoates nucs have the "rim" already figured in the height of the front and rear walls/frame-hangers. The plans give another 3/4" above the frame-hanger ledge for the side walls. In a standard Langstroth the rabbet is what, 5/8"? ...so the 3/4" is about 1/8" taller than what would coincide with Langstroth. Maybe the side walls of the nuc could be shortened on down to 7-1/8" and the nuc supers could be built to standard 6-5/8" medium depth with the frame-hanger 5/8" below the top edge?

Or maybe there's so many errors in my figuring that I oughta go back to sleep??

Ed


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## SpeckledPup

I've got my wood. I would like to make these with a sort of SBB but can't find the screen or #8 hardware clothe. 

Places I've checked: 

Locally Lowes, Homes Depot, Ace Hardware, Rural King, Wal-Mart, Tractor Supply. Most of these looked at me like I was crazy when I asked about it. 

Online Dadants, Mann Lake, Brushy Mountain, Kelleys, Rossmans

Does anyone have any other suggestions

Becky


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## Intheswamp

Did you per chance ask for 1/8" mesh wire? You've got to remember that a lot of times folks working at the building supply BBS's may have been working at Wallyworld or Target yesterday selling goldfish (not knocking those folks...somebody's gotta sell the goldfish!)...but, they don't really know a lot about hardware...just what the computer will tell them. If you could find a "mom and pop" hardware store I bet they'd know right off the bat what you were looking for.

Here's a hit at Brushy Mountain...
http://www.brushymountainbeefarm.com/8-Mesh-Hardware-Cloth-1-Linear-Ft/productinfo/539/

...amazon.com
http://www.amazon.com/Redi-Roll-Har...87AE/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1314538789&sr=8-1

Best wishes,
Ed


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## SpeckledPup

Ed, your the man!!

I had asked for Screen, # 8 hardware clothe, a wire like rabbit wire but with smaller holes. Had one girl a Lowes said she knew what I was talking about but that they don't carry it.

I had just left Amazon searching and had found the one you linked but it didn't offer the free shipping, just took me to their site where it was $17.?? plus shipping and a $3 handling fee.

Now I just have to find $5.01 more to get free shipping. Wouldn't you know, nothing on my shopping list or wish list is under 20. LOL


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## Intheswamp

Get some "Fatal Funnels" and make yellow jacket traps from 2-liter bottles. Or a copy of "First Lessons in Beekeeping". Or a bottle of lemon grass essential oil. Or... 

Ed


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## mjfish1975

I just finished making two out of left over T-111 from a chicken coop I made a few years back. One will be for me and one a coworker. These plans were extremly easy to follow, and in couple of hours they were done. Besides what else was there to do in a hurricane.


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## Intheswamp

*Re: vertical BEE SPACE...supers and brood chambers in medium nucs*



Intheswamp said:


> Thinking about it with my limited mind, regular medium 8-10 frame supers are built to a specific depth and when used as the bottom box in a hive they are set upon a bottom board that has a (usually 3/4") rim around it. With the nucs there is no rim on the bottom board thus it appears that the plans for the DCoates nucs have the "rim" already figured<...snip...>Maybe the side walls of the nuc could be shortened on down to 7-1/8" and the nuc supers could be built to standard 6-5/8" medium depth with the frame-hanger 5/8" below the top edge?
> 
> Or maybe there's so many errors in my figuring that I oughta go back to sleep??
> 
> Ed


Ok, so I should've went back to sleep... 

I'm just thinking out loud here and it looks like the differences are very small from the initial medium dimensions made earlier by more intelligent folks than I!!

Simple thoughts on making the medium sized supers and brood boxes match up "bee space-wise"...

The "super" should be the regular 6-5/8" height with the end pieces basically cut 5/8" shorter for "frame hangers". 

The "brood box" sidewalls should be the regular 6-5/8" depth PLUS whatever "floor to bottom bar" height you want. I've seen anywhere from 3/4" to 7/8" shown in plans for the rims, with the most popular rim measurement being 3/4" tall. Thus 6-5/8" plus 3/4" would be 7-3/8" for the sidewall heights.

(Remember that I'm thinking out loud here, so keep that in mind...my thinking is subject to be riddled with errors!!!) 

To leave the 5/8" "rabbet" for the frame hangers the front and back end pieces would be cut 6-3/4" tall. This would be 7-3/8"(sidewall height) minus 5/8" for the "rabbet" on the end pieces. The 2" end caps should work fine to fill in the space above the end pieces.

So, I'm looking at...

Medium Supers:
6-5/8" side walls (standard medium super height)
6" end walls (to create 5/8" rabbet/hanger ledge)

Medium Brood Box:
7-3/8" side walls (includes 3/4" "rim" space)
6-3/4" end walls (includes 3/4" "rim" space, shortens wall to create 5/8" rabbet)

The 2" end caps should be fine.

Am I on the right track or have I taken off on a rabbet trail?:lpf:

Delirious??...yes. :kn:
Ed


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## pascopol

SpeckledPup said:


> I would like to make these with a sort of SBB but can't find the screen or #8 hardware clothe.


My local ACE hardware stocks #8 and many other screen sizes. Try to ask them to order it for you. I paid about 14 bucks for a chunk good for perhaps 6 bottom screens.


----------



## Joseph Clemens

*Re: vertical BEE SPACE...supers and brood chambers in medium nucs*

I tweaked mine from the get go. First, all of mine are medium depth. I cut them tall enough so there is a 1/4" bee space below the frames and I cut the rabbets deep enough so a 1/4" space is above the top bars. Instead of wasting wood making tops and bottoms, I just cut pieces of 1-1/2" thick polystyrene foam board (the kind used for insulating walls, for bottom boards (I don't use bottom entrances). I cut about a 3"x5" opening near the center of the foam bottom board, then cover the entire foam bottom board with a piece of #8 hardware cloth, to screen the opening and to protect the foam from the bees - they would eventually destroy the foam, if they could access it from inside. I use thinner pieces of foam board for covers and slide them back a little to create top entrances, if/when I stack a second nuc super, I switch the entrance from the very top, to a gap between the two supers.


----------



## geebob

pascopol said:


> My local ACE hardware stocks #8 and many other screen sizes. Try to ask them to order it for you. I paid about 14 bucks for a chunk good for perhaps 6 bottom screens.


Do it best is where I got my hardware cloth from. They shipped to a nearby hardware store and I picked it up there. A good resource for people in places where Walmart and Lowes have taken over the hardware business.

http://www.doitbest.com/Poultry+netting-Do+it+Best-model-746113-doitbest-sku-746113.dib

As for my nuc supers, I've just used the normal dimensions. The excess beespace doesn't seem much worse than the variance in boxes and frames that I buy from the major suppliers. On my next batch, though, I'm going to add a cleat to the bottom of each end to overlap the top cleat.


----------



## Intheswamp

The link I listed above is $10 cheaper and eligible for free shipping from Amazon.

I've been thinking ofthe cleats, also. They would help line things up and stabilize them. We had better be careful or we'll do away with the simplicity of Dcoates design, eh? With cleats it would also be easy to securely attach the supers and brood chambers together with hive staples or even screen door hooks (easier separation). Ratchet straps would work in a pinch, too.

Ed


----------



## tecrench

I got the # 8 hardware cloth at the farm co-op's for about $1 a linear ft x 3' wide.


----------



## SpeckledPup

Didn't think to try Co-Op. I got a 10 foot roll thru Amazon and that should last me for a little while. Found 100 foot roll somewhere but it was $350 which was more expensive the 10/10 foot rolls. 

I'm going to keep my eyes open and maybe I can find it somewhere locally.


----------



## dixiebooks

Intheswamp: I think you are right on with those measurements for the "supers". You may have been delirious but it is so simple it really is a "duh!". I guess I was overthinking it, as usual. For deep 'supers', I will just use the same principle.

Joseph: If you have 1/4" beespace below and 1/4" beespace above and you stack them, won't you have 1/2" space between the two boxes? Will they not fill that with burr comb?

-James


----------



## Intheswamp

BTW, Lowe's plywood is junk....kinda like my woodworking abilities!!!!! 

With a little duct tape to seal some light leaks I think they'll do. Gotta put some frames together today/tonight and hopefully get the traps put out tomorrow....naturally we're supposed to have rain for the next five days (but we *really* need it!). Not sure how the rain will affect scout bees...

Ed

ETA... One thing I did on the supers was to use a full 6-5/8" x 8-1/2" piece of plywood for the end caps. The end cap on the brood box creates somewhat of a ledge sticking out that I figured might catch rain water...with the full sized pieces of wood for the end caps the ends of the supers will be flush with the end cap of the brood box and should help the rain shed on off. Also, I'm thinking of maybe screwing a couple of cheap screen door hooks into each end to secure the two boxes together being as these will be used as swarm traps and hopefully will need moving with bees in them. If I catch bees I'll be putting a strap around them, too.


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## rharlow

I just run a strip of wood 3/4" by 3/4" along the two long edges, and that side is now the top. Screw and glue. This helps unbow as well as prevent bowing


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## angryhippie

I just put a couple bricks or a cinder block on mine. The weight and weather seem to straighten it out eventually.


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## pascopol

I tried to make nucs out of plywood with mediocre results. 7/16 plywood is too thin, it warps and soaks moisture in, perhaps beeks in less humid climate have more luck with plywood.

So I got some cheap cypress odds/scraps in local mill.

Cypress is light, resistant to elements no painting necessary, I am sure it will outlast me.


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## fordtractornut

Another suggestion on controlling cost.
Big industries use 1/2 inch plywood as a divider for shipping. Example would be JD and Cat finished/machined castings are shipped from a contract machine shop to the end customer. Some of the dividers are 36 inches by 32 inches square.
Find the person that supplies the dividers to the machine shop and ask them what they do with the waiste.
You may be able to get it for free.
In my case, for now i have an endless supply of 1/2 inch thick plywood that is 1 foot wide by 8 feet long. and the best part is, it's free. 
I currently have two stacks in my garage that are 7 feet high. 



Thanks


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## Joseph Clemens

dixiebooks,
Sometimes I get some burr comb, but usually only after they've been established in two nuc supers and when a flow is on. I feed with pollen substitute patties and the extra room helps with that. Though they will, sometimes, eat the patty out of the wax paper and fasten the wax paper onto the top bars with burr comb. It still scrapes off easily with a hive tool.


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## dixiebooks

pascopol said:


> I tried to make nucs out of plywood with mediocre results. 7/16 plywood is too thin, it warps and soaks moisture in, perhaps beeks in less humid climate have more luck with plywood.
> 
> So I got some cheap cypress odds/scraps in local mill.
> 
> Cypress is light, resistant to elements no painting necessary, I am sure it will outlast me.


Did you try it per the instructions of DCoates and the recommendations on this thread? Did you try it w/ 15/32" plywood? did you glue using Titebond II or III? Did you "paint" the ply edges w/ Titebond III? Did you prime with a good exterior primer then paint with a good quality exterior paint? I've had some out all summer and going into winter with no warping, yet. -james


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## Daniel Y

Nice design, creative and efficient with materials. I also like the frame rest solution. The entire design does not take much more than a saw nails and a hammer. I could see doing these with hand tools if necessary.

I was trying to work out the dimension as to how they would fit over a standard longstroth hive. Are they designed to do so? They seem very close to me but the math is just not working for me this morning. I am very interested in starting my bee efforts by focusing on wintering over nucs each year rather than trying to buy bees for lot hives each spring. So far my favorite ideas are the stacking nucs on top of productive hives. 
In all very nice and thanks for sharing it. A nuc this cheap can either be used to sustain or be sold as is making life very easy on the keeper.


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## pascopol

dixiebooks said:


> Did you try it per the instructions of DCoates and the recommendations on this thread? Did you try it w/ 15/32" plywood? did you glue using Titebond II or III? Did you "paint" the ply edges w/ Titebond III? Did you prime with a good exterior primer then paint with a good quality exterior paint? I've had some out all summer and going into winter with no warping, yet. -james


Sorry I misquoted 7/16 plywood, I meant 1/2 inch plywood which is thicker than 15/32.

I followed most of above recommended steps, but one, I did not "paint" the edges with Titebond, just with primer.

However in my experience of trying plywood for nucs and all the extra 
"treatments" required which are cost and labor extensive my personal verdict is:

Why bother with plywood? I doubt if plywood nucs will outlast pine not mentioning cypress.

Cypress does not need to be treated or painted in any way. 1 inch thickness assures excellent thermal insulation.

I want to hear from anybody if plywood nucs will last more than 4 or 5 years especially in humid and wet south.

My cypress lumber cost me less than plywood.

After I tried plywood and then discover inexpensive cypress why would I want to go back with plywood and bother with excessive treatment and labor required to "wheather proof" it?


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## dixiebooks

Pascopal- good points, there. Considering your location, plywood may not last long at all. If you are in one of those very humid areas, I would even think twice about plain ol' pine. I can see why cypress is your wood of choice, especially if you can get it cheap (which I can't). -james


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## SpeckledPup

It's that time of year again. Time to make those swarm traps or 5 frame nuc for the splits. I made 1 set of these last year and about to get the plywood to make a few more sets for this year. 
Only thing is DH doesn't care for my oops paint. They are hot pink with white lids. LOL Hey the ladies don't mind


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## Beeboy01

Just finished cutting up a sheet of plywood and assembling 4 of these Nucs. Can't say enough good things about the plans, boy were the nucs fun to build. The only changes I made in the plans was cutting one end 1/2 inch shorter and used that space as an entrance for the box. As recommended I pre drilled the holes along the edges of the plywood and used 1 inch drywall screws and a tube of Liquid Nails to hold them together. The liquid Nails worked great filling in any small gaps and voids in the plywood and really made the boxes strong. Two coats of discount shelf paint and I'm ready to go. I'm setting two up as swarm traps and the others I will use for nucs in my yard. Thanks for posting the plans


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## Tom Fran

Beeboy01 said:


> I'm setting two up as swarm traps and the others I will use for nucs in my yard. Thanks for posting the plans


Are you drilling a 1 1/4" hole for an opening on your swarm traps, or using the opening prescribed in these nuc plans?

Is the hole opening an important issue on swarm traps?


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## Beeboy01

I didn't used the design for the entrance that the plans show or drilled a hole in the end of the box. Instead I cut one end 1/2 inch shorter which gave a 1/2 inch high entrance that goes across the entire front of the hive. I don't know if that entrance will work for swarm traps, I might close it down to around 2 inches. I could always close it off completely and drill a 1 1/2 inch hole in the end but I don't think that the bees care that much about the entrance shape. I've seen hives in cinder block walls with an entrance hole about twice the size of a pencil and hives in hollow trees with an entrance the size of a soft ball. 
I used to hang one of the swarm traps that looks like a paper flower pot but I never had a lot of luck transfering the bees into a regular deep. I'm thinking that a nuc box with deep frames in it will act as a swarm trap and I won't need to disturb the bees moving them into a box.
It's worth a try, my hives swarmed at least twice last year and had some smaller after swarms, most got away.


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## WhiteOakAcres

Great design D. Coates! Cut out the parts for (28) nucs this weekend. Had time to nail one together and it went together perfectly. Thinking of adding some screened holes for ventilation. Has anyone else added vent holes?

Thanks,

WhiteOak


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## jtow

Here in Ok, most nucs I've seen have screened bottom boards.


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## Joseph Clemens

I've recently assembled twenty of these deep plywood nucs, using 15/32" exterior grade plywood of 5-ply layers. I made several small adjustments to the plans; I make my bottoms of cardboard salvaged from old boxes, I cut them to fit the nuc bottom, then cut a small 2x3" vent window in one end of the cardboard, then staple a piece of #8 hardware cloth over the opening, I then melt beeswax into the surface of both sides of the cardboard, then I staple it onto the bottom - I place a thumbtack on the rim opposite the screened vent (to indicate where the entrance should be). Entrances are upper and on the end opposite the bottom vent screen - I form them by either sliding back the polystyrene cover or the upper super, usually used to provide space for feeding.


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## rweakley

I have been drilling like 1 inch holes in the back of the nuc and then screening that off. Same for the entrance only I don't screen it unless moving. I'd love to get some of those nuc wheels to use, but have been too cheap.


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## Bee Kid

This is an awesome nuc plan :thumbsup:. Very simple. Haven't made any yet but I'm definitely going to eventually. While I was searching around the web I found the plans for this nuc(I believe D Coates made it too). It's a bit like the plans for it on beesource but it has more pages in it. http://robo.bushkillfarms.com/downlo...s5FrameNuc.pdf

BK


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## shadow-cw

Thanks for posting this. I cut out four today in about an hour. Very easy to build.


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## theriverhawk

I made a dozen last summer. I accidently left one sitting outside unprimed and unpainted all summer, fall and winter in an area of no shade. It got pounded by the elements. Picked it up when I went back to that yard a couple of weeks ago. No warping, no swelling in the box or top. That tells me if you will glue well, prime well and paint well, then you could have these nucs for many years.


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## shadow-cw

Here's the four I made. Still have to paint them but I figured about 1.5 hours to cut them out and assemble.


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## rlsiv

Regarding screened bottoms: I made some of these up (16), assembled them, then used a rotozip tool to take out the whole bottom on several (removed the interior dimension of the box, left the rest of the "base" all around the edges and the front porch). Last, I tacked hardware cloth across the bottom interior. I like screened bottom boards, and if I overwinter nucs next fall I'll set them on top of another hive or a board to block off most of the open screen.


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## Beeboy01

I just checked the early spring nuc which I started in one of these boxes about 3 weeks ago. The lid had warped just enough to open gaps at the front and back of the box and robber bees moved in. By the time I got to the nuc it was gone, totally robbed out which is a shame because I spotted capped queen cells in it last week. It must of been the plywood because not only did the lid bow front to back it was also delaminating along the edges even though it had three good coats of paint on it. I can't blame the design, just the plywood I made them out of. Time to pick up some pine for the new tops and pull out some more frames of brood for another nuc. At least the boxes look ok. Maybe I'll luck out and find some queen cells to build off of. Oh well if it was easy everybody would be doing it.


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## dixiebooks

Beeboy: did you "Paint" the ply edges w/ Titebond III prior to painting? -james


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## pascopol

That's why I previously expressed concernns on this thread about using plywood under Fl conditions. But I gave it shoot anyway, with slight mods:

Since tops and bottoms are the first to warp or rot I used Cypress wood for tops and bottoms (scraps and leftovers I had) the rest is plywood. This way I have 8 nucs out of 1 sheet of plywood and still some left for a few medium nucs if I want to make them. Painted and Tibonded. So far they are holding good, full evaluation will follow after summer rains and 1 or 2 years of use.


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## USCBeeMan

I cut some strips of plywood almost the side length and about 2" wide. Nail them to the outside edge on both sides of the top. Helps in keeping them from warping, keeps any gaps covered and protects from rain. Again, I use Cabbot's. Doesn't warp or rot when give 2 - 3 coats. All edges of wood and plywood just suck up the Cabbot's and will not split or rot like paint.


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## rweakley

Since I'm not building TONS of these I modified the lids to be of the telescoping type. I can get 1X for 77 cents for an 8 foot section that will make 1 and a partial. I LOVE these NUC plans, if I can build them with just a circular saw anyone can.

Rod


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## rmaro

have you thought about using this on the tops of these? http://www.lowes.com/pd_12522-205-66014_?PL=1&productId=3050365 this is what I put on mine.. had done a great job.


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## Joseph Clemens

I just cut pieces of this to make bottoms and covers for many of my 15/32" thick nucs -->

​This is 2" thick polystyrene, it's easy to cut with any sharp knife and a straight-edge. I use canvas, old towels, or pieces of plastic trash can liners as inner covers, and #8 hardware cloth to cover the poly bottoms, this keeps the bees from nibbling away the poly. The plastic film covering both surfaces can be peeled away so it can then be painted where exposed to sunlight (over time sunlight will weaken it, unless painted). It helps keep hives cool in Summer and warm in Winter.

I've never had the slightest bit of warping when using polystyrene this way. When the plastic film is peeled away it can also be glued together with polyurethane glue - like gorilla glue, making custom configurations like telescoping outer covers.​


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## BeeGhost

I also just make telescoping covers for my Coates nucs. A piece of plywood that does not have any support to keep its shape WILL warp. I put just a piece of plywood for a cover on one of my trap out boxes and when I checked back after one rain, I had a new top entrance!! I replaced that top with a telescoping cover and have no more problems. I even have a couple covers out there that are not painted at all, just to see how long they will last.


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## geebob

Beeboy01 said:


> The lid had warped just enough to open gaps at the front and back of the box and robber bees moved in. ... I can't blame the design, just the plywood I made them out of.


I secure my nuke tops either with weight (there's a reason there's a huge wind-farm right up the road) or, when I'm using them for swarm traps, nails. I have also found that the quality of "1/2 inch" plywood varies tremendously.


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## Beeboy01

Well I didn't paint the exposed edges of the plywood with any type of glue. There were so many gaps and voids in the plys I ended up using the extra liquid nails scrapped out of the other glue joints in the box to fill the imperfections. The liquid nails filled in the gaps but it looks like it didn't seal the edges, oops. I made two tops with side rails but didn't use them, instead I used the ones without any long side support. We had three days of wet and rainy weather over the weekend which caused the wood to warp, should of put bricks on the ends of the lid but didn't think of it till it was too late. I checked the nuc today and to my surprise there were a bunch of bees still in it on the frame with a little capped brood. Being an optimist I put a 1/2 frame of brood in the nuc along with a good shake of house bees from another hive to see if I can keep it going. I'm not sure if the new queen absconded or was out on a mating flight, both queen cells looked like they had hatched but I didn't see any sign of a queen. There is enough brood in my other hives to keep the nuc going as long as I want so I'll keep swapping frames over till something good happens. I did a split two years ago that took over 2 months to get queen right, the season is still young and the main flow hasn't got here yet.


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## Joseph Clemens

Here are some pics showing how I make the Nuc modifications that I prefer -->

-->Pic 1 
-->Pic 2 
-->Pic 3 
-->Pic 4 
-->Pic 5 
-->Pic 6 
-->Pic 7


Perhaps a cleat across each end (as feet) would help to ensure the vent is not blocked when the Nucs are being transported.


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## snl

Anyone ever made a full deep or medium (not nuc) modifying these plans for 3/4" wood?


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## Joseph Clemens

That could be somewhat tricky, since 15/32" wide frame rests are about as wide as I'd want to get and still have dimensions suitable for bee space between frame End Bars and inside end walls of the hives. 3/4" wood or plywood configured similarly to these Nuc plans would have 3/4" wide frame rests and there would be almost no clearance between the frame End Bars and the inside end walls of the hives, let alone the proper bee space. If you were to use 3/4" lumber and configure it similar to these D. Coates Nuc plans, you would either need to use pieces of 3/8"-15/32" thick lumber (wood or plywood) for the end pieces, so the frame rest would still provide bee space between frame End Bars and inner hive end walls, use customized frames with longer Top Bar ears, or otherwise make modifications so bee space were preserved in all the appropriate places (such as spacers to reduce the width of the frame rests).


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## G.Darby

Im curious to know what the 2" spacer shown on the top is used for? I plan to use these as bait boxes. Is the spacer needed for baiting? Can I fit the nuc with empty medium frames with something attached to the top bar to promote comb building?

Thanks for the great plans. Couldnt have been easier to build!!!


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## Intheswamp

G.Darby, the end walls are a bit shorter than the side walls. The top of the end walls will be the frame holders/rests. The 2" pieces are attached to the outside surface of the end wall and are used to extend the end walls up to the height of the side walls leaving the top edge of the end wall pieces for the frame support.

Ed


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## geebob

They also serve as excellent handles.


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## G.Darby

Thanks for the reply. I should have been a bit more specific with my question. In the link to all the pictures and plans for the nuc boxes, it shows two photos of the nuc with what is a 2" shim sitting on TOP of the nuc with a hole drilled in it. That is the part I am wondering about. Is that needed to use it as a bait box? And can I use empty medium frames for baiting as well?


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## Keth Comollo

If you are building swarm traps then build them bigger than a 5 frame nuc. Yes, many people have caught swarms in 5 frame nucs but research shows they prefer a volume of about 40 liters (slightly bigger than a deep) especially in your northern climate.


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## minz

Well we will see, Paint jobs finished up, one or partial frame of drawn brood, minimum of one frameless, one of plastic with extra wax and just what ever I could scrounge to make 5 in the box. The green is too green, even on a light green moss covered tree, the Moca was real red but the scotch pine (I think that is what it was) actually blended right in.


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## rweakley

I don't know if anyone else had come up with hivetop feeders for these, but I went ahead and built one today just for these plans. Here are 3 pictures:





















I cut the side pieces 20 1/8th inches long, the front, back and divider pieces are 7 inches long, The wood it's self is 1X4 so it's actually 3/4 by 3.5. I painted the part that is going to have syrup with melted beeswax. The section for the bees to come up from below is 1.5 inches wide. The divider piece is the 1X4 that I cut and inch off of. The floor of the syrup compartment is just some plywood I had (less than 1/2 inch I think more than 1/4 inch I used some left over screen from making bottom boards it's the 8 lines per inch stuff. I'm going to paint it tonight and put it on a nuc tomorrow. I have enough material to make 1 or 2 more. Syrup compartment is 7X16X2.5 for 280 cubic inches (not that you would fill it all the way to the top.) According to an online conversion program that would be 1.2 gallons of good stuff. Let me know what you all think.

Noticed when building the other one that I needed to add a rim of plywood around the hole, otherwise they would have a huge top entrance (or entry for robbers) that they just wouldn't need.

Rod


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## Greg Lowe

We built 4 of these Nucs today. Thanks for the plans. I found that 1" brads and gorilla glue worked much better than screws on my plywood.


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## rweakley

You know what's even easier. My new air stapler with 1 1/4 " staples, oh yeah, they never went together so easy. I use the titebond II and paint the edges of the plywood before painting to keep them from delaminating. Check out my feeder on page 11 if you find you need to be able to feed them.


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## Greg Lowe

I like the edge glue idea. For feeding I will likely drill a 1" hole in the top and use a Collin's type feeder. I cut some 1x8 boards about 8" long and used a rotozip to cut a 5" hole into the board. I put the board on top of the Nuc with the holes centered and invert the 2 1/2 quart feeder. Feeds a lot of bees at the same time.


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## Two_cyl

Made up some of these tonight. Even got the 11 year old off the computer/playstation to come out and help me.


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## Nmace

I made 4 this weekend with my skill saw and air nail gun. I used 1X2 for the hive and top cleats. Painted the edges with Titebond III (it is what I had on hand). I also bought oops exterior paint for $7. Showed it to two beek friends and they are excited to make more. Since one of them has a table saw, we are going to make a day of it and knock several out.

It is an awesome plan and a great cost saver. I plan on using several of mine for traps next year.

Just wanted to thank Besource and D. Coates for this.


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## odfrank

Nmace;798587 I plan on using several of mine for traps next year.[/QUOTE said:


> If made for swarm traps I suggest that you make them eight frames wide. The eight framers I made have caught some beauties.
> You can catch a small swarm in a big trap but you won't catch a huge swarm in a small rap.


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## Shazam

I've noticed the hits on the medium nuc plan variants I did have been jumping. Guess it is that season again, just as a relink as it is deeply buried:

http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?238983-Easy-5-frame-nuc-plans&p=621967#post621967

That gets you 6 8-frame mediums and 2 5-frame mediums out of 2 sheets of 4 x 8 (which you can get cut down to 4 x 4 at the store for easier transport)

PS - Nice boxes Frank


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## Nmace

So, to make the 8 frame ones, you just have to make the fronts/backs and tops/sides 4.5 inches wider? Also, I have been looking for the metal disc entrances and have had some trouble finding them. I have some large plastic ones from Brushy Mountain but am worried about photodegredation over time. (which is admittedly optimistic for a newbee).

And great looking boxes.


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## odfrank

Nmace said:


> Also, I have been looking for the metal disc entrances and have had some trouble finding them.


Kelley's item: #279-disc


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## stevedc

hey mr. coates, good job on your nucs. we're on the same page i believe. here's what i've been working on and the good thing is this is all 5/8" exterior material i get free from a storage building builder. http://s1055.photobucket.com/albums/s510/stevedc1/?action=view&current=image.jpg


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## sfisher

Could you please tell me what the measurements on the Front, back, and sides of your nucs would be if they were made for medium frames, instead of deeps. Thanks Steve


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## Desert Viking Ranch

Here is my version using medium frame dimensions:
http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=87de82d68825fb16dcf929bd42c2756&ct=mdsa


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## Solomon Parker

You would reduce the height 3 inches. Everything else would be the same.


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## Daniel Y

odfrank said:


>


Now that is some Nuc material. Just a hint for those with home builders nearby, not that there is a lot of home building going on right now. But you can always get loads of that siding from scraps thrown out from new homes being built.

Nice looking nucs frank.


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## Solomon Parker

I know it's been said before, but remember to put the hole up on the disc so they don't accidentally swing closed.


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## stever

I love visuals, took some scrap last night and put one of those together in 30 min. (no glue, air nailer, table saw.)
Went on line today and found software to layout cuts. Here is a sample. I would move the the front back to the bottom row and end caps beside bottom.
Basiclly 4 rips and a bunch of cross cuts and you are done 4 boxes in no time...


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## Intheswamp

sfisher said:


> Could you please tell me what the measurements on the Front, back, and sides of your nucs would be if they were made for medium frames, instead of deeps. Thanks Steve


Steve here's a confusing discourse I made on this subject...
http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?238983-Easy-5-frame-nuc-plans&p=703340#post703340


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## Beeboy01

I made 4 of them from a sheet of CDX plywood this spring and they worked great. If you are going to use them as swarm traps make the boxes bigger, I had a swarm come and go in one of the boxes I set out. The T-11 plywood would be a lot better than regular CDX for them, I had some delamination from the CDX I bought at Home Depot after only 3 months.


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## Clay

Question: what do you do for winter ventilation with these nucs? I'm wanting to use these to overwinter with. Would a 1/2" hole in the back, opposite the front hole work?


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## rweakley

I've done that with mine, when I remember to cut the hole. Normally I remember after they are full of bees and it's too late. Some people make screen bottoms for them.


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## odfrank

Some of them completely propolize screened holes.


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## Clay

I was just reading a thread by michael palmer about wintering nucs, and he said something about drilling a 3/4" (i think) hole in the back of his nucs. I'm about to make some splits with some nucs I made using D Coates plans, but I'd rather get the vent holes in now before the bees get in . Anyone overwinter well with these nucs? Did you use any ventilation?


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## therub

Shazam said:


> Two quick things.
> 
> 1. Thanks to D Coates for this thread. Outside the 'post your bloom dates' threads, this is the most viewed thread on this subforum. Its been viewed as much as many of the Beekeeping 101 threads. So kudos on a great and valued contribution
> 
> 2. Since someone asked a question about more efficiently using the plywood for the 8 frame medium nuc layout, I decided to play around a bit. So instead of 7 8 frame medium nucs out of 2 sheets of ply, here is a layout for 8 nucs: six 8 frame mediums, and two 5 frame mediums. Its also out of 2 sheets of ply, and cut down to 4x4. No significant improvement in packing by going to full 4x8 sheets and 4x4 seems to be more accessible for many hobbyists. It has the added benefit that 2 of the 4 sheets are identical which should make cutting even simpler. The sides are interchangeable between the 8 and 5 frames. The rest of the parts are prefaced with an 8fr or 5fr to differentiate them.
> 
> http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv274/spamfooler/Beekeeping/MixMedNuc1of3.jpg
> http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv274/spamfooler/Beekeeping/MixMedNuc2of3.jpg
> http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv274/spamfooler/Beekeeping/MixMedNuc3of3.jpg


Thank you for posting these. I built a set with two sheets of plywood and they turned out great.

One measurement was off - the sides should be 9 1/8" but they're marked 9 3/8", making them just a bit too wide to fit a standard frame.


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## jwhiteker

Are there measurements for the pieces somewhere on phtotobucket? All I can see is the photos. 

- John


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## rweakley

There are full plans on the main beesource.com page.


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## jwhiteker

Thanks. I did find them after searching a little further. I was being a bit lazy when I posted I guess. inch:


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## johng

Here's the measurements. I haven't ever saw any plans. Once you cut the pieces out it will make sense on how they go together. They really do come in handy. http://s196.photobucket.com/user/Drew454/media/Nuc plans/2010-03-17205915.jpg.html


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## jwhiteker

Awesome. Thanks Johng. I do appreciate it.

- John


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## Honey man

Very nice thanks for posting pics


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## timgoodin

Minz: Nice looking boxes, how did you do on swarm captures from those shown in 2012?


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## minz

timgoodin said:


> Minz: Nice looking boxes, how did you do on swarm captures from those shown in 2012?


The light green box in the willow I did not hang but set on a tree. It only got mice.
The bottom picture picked up two swarms per year in that location until last year (I changed to Swarm Commander and got none).
The one in the middle was ‘borrowed’ by the guy that sold me my first gear. He was certain his hive was going to swarm and moved it to his yard. I moved it a mile east the following year and always get small swarms there.
I find that when I get a swarm or swarm call one year the next year that area gets a box and almost always produces.


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## souficoufi

Bonjour
Pourquoi il n'y a pas d'aération dans ce mini-nuc ?


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## Earthboy

souficoufi said:


> Bonjour
> Pourquoi il n'y a pas d'aération dans ce mini-nuc ?



Parce que 1) vous pouvez forer un trou de ventilation si vous en avez besoin et 2) généralement, les nuc n'en ont pas besoin. Pour moi, j'utiliserais une planche inférieure filtrée (not sure about this translation).

Because 1) you can drill a ventilation hole if you need one and 2) typically nuc's don't need one. For me, I'd use a screened bottom.

EB


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## ankklackning

D Coates said:


> Here are plans and measurements for nucs I make. I think they are simple and you can make 4 five-frame nucs out of one 4' x 8' sheet of 15/32 plywood that sells for +/-$10 at Lowes or Home Depot. I use them for swarm traps, queen breeding nucs, and I overwinter nucs in them. I also leave the bottom off of some to stack on other nucs to make 10 frame nucs. I use thin 1 1/4 inch nails, titebond III glue, and I paint them to ensure I get many years of service out of them.
> 
> http://s196.photobucket.com/albums/aa190/Drew454/Nuc plans/


Looking back i'm sure you had time to evalute the plywood hives you started on. How long did they last?


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## odfrank

I made mine out of used T111 siding, painted, holding up since this thread started. Be sure to use exterior ply, prime and paint.


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## jkellum

odfrank said:


> I made mine out of used T111 siding, painted, holding up since this thread started. Be sure to use exterior ply, prime and paint.


Im gonna make some nucs out of this Legacy LP 23/32 in. x 4 ft. x 8 ft. T&G OSB Panel-41499 - The Home Depot I made a queen castle out of it last year and its holding up perfectly.


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## JWPalmer

I made a lot of my nuc boxes out of the Advantech subflooring. It is similar to the Legacy product, but has a longer no-sand exposure time (means it holds up better to moisture). It still need to be painted however. Advantech is available at Lowe's for about $34 per sheet. No matter what you get, use a thin kerf blade and you can get 9 deep nuc bodies or 11 medium bodies out of a single sheet. Do not cut the groove off, only the tongue.


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## jkellum

JWPalmer said:


> I made a lot of my nuc boxes out of the Advantech subflooring. It is similar to the Legacy product, but has a longer no-sand exposure time (means it holds up better to moisture). It still need to be painted however. Advantech is available at Lowe's for about $34 per sheet. No matter what you get, use a thin kerf blade and you can get 9 deep nuc bodies or 11 medium bodies out of a single sheet. Do not cut the groove off, only the tongue.


lowes is an hour drive away but HD carries the LP product and is 5 mins away


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## Gray Goose

For all you NUC builders....
3 times this summer I had a frame with nice Swarm cell to put into a NUC and it bottomed out and squashed.
At times the cell will stick way down as it was between two frames, below it.
I ended up adding a 5/8 by 1 inch to my bottom boards to get the elevation needed to never smash queen cells.

IF you use swarm cells make a deep that is an inch deeper, for this reason, or add some side wall to a bottom board.
or build a 3/4 X 3/4 rim NUC size to be able to insure the Q Cell has room.

If you place a Grafted cell on the frame pls disregard.

GG


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## jkellum

Gray Goose said:


> For all you NUC builders....
> 3 times this summer I had a frame with nice Swarm cell to put into a NUC and it bottomed out and squashed.
> At times the cell will stick way down as it was between two frames, below it.
> I ended up adding a 5/8 by 1 inch to my bottom boards to get the elevation needed to never smash queen cells.
> 
> IF you use swarm cells make a deep that is an inch deeper, for this reason, or add some side wall to a bottom board.
> or build a 3/4 X 3/4 rim NUC size to be able to insure the Q Cell has room.
> 
> If you place a Grafted cell on the frame pls disregard.
> 
> GG


I have queen castles with a 1" taller side to handle these situations.


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