# Finished assembling hives...small hiccup



## Solomon Parker (Dec 21, 2002)

I would think that if you tried to do anything too severe, you break the glue. I'd live with it, but thats me.


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## Jim 134 (Dec 1, 2007)

http://mdmetric.com/tech/cvtchtfdm.htm


Are you talk about 3/32 " or so :s :s


BEE HAPPY Jim 134


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## Mbeck (Apr 27, 2011)

The bees will fix them!


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## Billc (Feb 7, 2012)

Belt sander and then repaint. Let the inside be.

Bill


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## jrbbees (Apr 4, 2010)

2 or 3 mm?

This is a house for bugs to live in!!!

Go get something cold to drink and get out of the sun!


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## Charlie B (May 20, 2011)

Your not building fine furniture, just bee boxes. You're bees won't care and if you drink a few beers you won't either.


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## aschueler (Oct 26, 2011)

As a newbie and amateur woodworker, I can relate. I just put together 8 mediums with most of the frames, and can tell you that there are slightly different ways that people put together hives in the "beekeeping world" versus the woodcrafter/furniture builder world. For example, just before this project I made a work table entirely without hardware, all joints are either half-lap or mortise and tenon, and they are entirely held together with glue. Nails really don't hold nearly as well. These joints will outlast me. 

For some reason, hives have both nails and glue. The nails are overkill, but I used them because I am new and generally I follow tradition when I am new at something, then screw it up later when I think I know what I am doing. When I built my boxes, it was clear that where the wood originated from (I think Iowa, maybe Missouri?) was vastly different in climate from where I am in Florida. It was nicely planed and was mostly likely flat when shipped, but when I got a chance to get them together of course, wood warps and bends. At first, I used a square like the instructions state -- but this clearly caused the boxes themselves to be out of square, because the boards were cupped. What I did instead was to keep them flat, and some of the joints had gaps (no way around it), which I then glued an nailed into place. There is approx 2-3 mm gaps here and there in my construction as well.

If I have built this locally, ie starting with rough cut lumber, planed and jointed it perfectly square, made box joints on my table saw, and made these boxes perfectly square and without any gaps at ALL -- within 2 months they would warp on their own anway, leaving gaps. It's part of the joy/frustration of working with real wood. It doesn't stay put. Painting one side of the wood will make this even weirder, as it will aborb and release humidity at different rates based on which side of the wood is painted.

Adding this all up in my head, I decided as others state above. One, it's not indoor furniture where people are kind enough to point out defects or mistakes I made. Next, beer may indeed help the gaps not matter. Third, gaps are unavoidable and clearly must not affect the function. So I just slathered as much paint as I could on the exposure exterior wood and called it done.


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## Jim 134 (Dec 1, 2007)

rodhassler said:


> Is there any way to fix these without destroying them?
> Thanks to all!



Just DO NOT put up a Bear fence :lookout:

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/259/52054156186416981613316.jpg/


BEE HAPPY Jim 134


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## Rick 1456 (Jun 22, 2010)

View attachment 1243


Notice the tight joints, straight cuts, and the care with which assembly was done. Strict adherence to building codes.
My Southern Maryland Mutt Bees deserve the best. 
The space you describe will be propolized.


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## BEES4U (Oct 10, 2007)

2/10/2010
Try using a 3/4" pipe vise.
1. square one corner.
2. tighten the vise to hold the corner square.
3.nail in two 6d nails to hold the sides and ends in place.
4. repeat the above until all 4 corners are square.
Work your way around the hive body squaring and nailing in a sequence of 1-2-3-4.
5. make any small adjustments needed to square the hive body/super.
6 nail in the remainder of the 6d's.
7. some people use a simple wood workers squaring jig.
http://www.lowescreativeideas.com/idea-library/projects/Squaring_Jig_0808.aspx
http://jansdollhouses.com/jig.html 
Good luck.


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## stajerc61 (Nov 17, 2009)

They will need air when it gets hot.


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## Daniel Y (Sep 12, 2011)

Getting boxes built with tight tolerances is going to take a lot more shop than the average beekeeper is ever going to have. These are boxes and it is not really that important though. I have seen exceptions since some beekeepers are also at least hobby wood workers. I would not worry about a box being a little out of square. You are most likely going to fidget to get a nice even fit now. but that will go away after a while. That they hold frames is more important.


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## rodhassler (Jan 10, 2012)

Jim 134 said:


> http://mdmetric.com/tech/cvtchtfdm.htm
> 
> 
> Are you talk about 3/32 " or so :s :s
> ...


Yeah about that, maybe even less at some points. Sorry for not being too specific, it all depends on how I align the corners so there's a little variation in the measurement.


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## jrbbees (Apr 4, 2010)

Never forget that you are building a box for a bug that loves to live in a rotting tree.
Put a TrySquare on that!

I worry more about the boxes standing level when stacked so they don't develop a lean to one side on the other.


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## rodhassler (Jan 10, 2012)

Billc said:


> Belt sander and then repaint. Let the inside be.
> 
> Bill


I thought about pulling out my belt sander but then I remembered my previous attempts at doing any "fine" tweaking with it and how I ended up with valleys and hills in a previously flat surface, and how much wood I lost fixing my mistake. I have no doubt a skilled woodworker could do it right the first time, but I am thinking by the time I get it right I might have lost 3/8"-1/4" and I don't want to weaken the corner by thinning it too much.


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## rodhassler (Jan 10, 2012)

jrbbees said:


> 2 or 3 mm?
> 
> This is a house for bugs to live in!!!
> 
> Go get something cold to drink and get out of the sun!


Ha! Thanks.


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## rodhassler (Jan 10, 2012)

Thanks for this input. As a newbie I have to balance my desire with everything being right/perfect with the acceptance that I'm going to make mistakes and the best thing I can do is learn from them and do better next time. Like you I try to defer to the common shared wisdom because it's based off of experience, which I don't have. I've read a ton of sources that stress how important making the boxes square is, and others that emphasize the fact that bees will take up residence in trees, walls, pots, etc and the only people that care are the beeks. I guess that's why I'm happy I've got this community to glean advice from. Really the major frustration was that I really took my time and didn't rush the assembly so that I could do the best job possible, and I still messed it up. If I had to find a cause I would say it was from assembling the boxes on a very old table that is not flat at all, so the work surface was encouraging the corners to flex.


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## rodhassler (Jan 10, 2012)

Thanks for the comments everyone!


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## psfred (Jul 16, 2011)

I can get them square, but sometimes they are not flat. A long plane will do that job nicely -- cut the high corners down to fit, it's usually on a very slight amount.

The bees will propylize any gaps, but you do want the boxes to fit flat together -- first, they won't wobble or lean that way, and second they will be easier to get apart. 

You will also find that pre-cut boxes vary slightly in dimension, especially from different suppliers. You must also check the bee space between boxes, it's possible to get too much or not enough, leading to brood comb (usually drones) between the frames or having a propylis happy hive gluing them all up into a solid mass. Varies again with supplier -- Kelley seems to leave all the space above the frame with the frams level with the bottom of the box, the others I have (Brushy Mountain or someone else, got them second hand) seem to split the difference.

Peter


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## guyross (Feb 18, 2011)

If you have a table saw take the high places off with it. Set the saw blades height only slightly over 3/4". I don't think that much would effect bee space but I would still try and use them for bottom brood chambers as my bees form hay stacks on bottom boards any way.


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## Billc (Feb 7, 2012)

Not much sun to get out of around here. When I put boxes together I find the diagonal and measure. For a 19 7/8 x 16 1/4 hive it is 
about 25 11/16. Clamp the long side until the short side is right and then go have a beer. Repeat as needed.

Bill


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## Michael Bush (Aug 2, 2002)

As we used to say when I was doing rough carpentry, "we ain't building pianos..."


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## minz (Jan 15, 2011)

I did the same thing! I cut my fingers a little deep so the cabinet square I had would not fit the outside. Slapped them together and sure enough was out of square by just a bit. I like the box square idea posted here but I will need to leave at least the finger depth on the edges to allow for the extra finger length. I tried clamping them to square but when I relaxed the pipe clamps the boxes sprung right back like they were supposed to. We used to always say “they aint going to see if from the courthouse” still don’t know what the heck that was supposed to mean.


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## Rick 1456 (Jun 22, 2010)

I have never been paid a visit by the Hive Box Police even though I have numerous violations


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## Jim 134 (Dec 1, 2007)

Rick 1456 said:


> I have never been paid a visit by the Hive Box Police even though I have numerous violations



:lpf::lpf:

BEE HAPPY Jim 134


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## Reagan Rozales (Jan 25, 2012)

I am also getting new equipment put together.. currently staining it - and then letting my dad handle the wood working . I'm just hoping I got enough boxes and supers for 2 hives. When I got my first hive 2 years ago, I got all my stuff used from a club member. So this should be intgeresting to see how it all works together. I'm also hoping my dad doesn't kill himself trying to get it too perfect (like he tends to do with everything else LOL).


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## MJuric (Jul 12, 2010)

As others have stated 2-3mm isn't going to be a problem. However if you're like me things like that will bother you until they're fixed. 

What I did when I had this problem was to place the box with the high corner hanging off a bench. Clamped or weighted the corner to the bench and then weighted the corner hanging off the bench. 

I then kept the corners wet and left it there for a while, hours actually.

I had one I fixed doing this that had a good 3/16-1/4" (~5mm -6.5mm) gap.

Might not work as well with a painted box but keeping it wet seemed to keep them from just springing back. 

I would also worry far less about it if it where honey supers than the brood boxes for us in colder climates. 

~Matt


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