# what ever happened to oxalic acid??



## jdpro5010 (Mar 22, 2007)

I am of the opinion that it will never get registered. It is readily and cheaply available already from different sources so there is no financial gain to be accomplished by doing so. Getting something registered is an extremely expensive process and if there is no financial gains to be made I doubt very seriously anybody will try to push it through!


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## sqkcrk (Dec 10, 2005)

Does it need to be registered? It is not generally used as a pesticide in other parts of agriculture, is it?


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## beekuk (Dec 31, 2008)

We have similar disscussions about oxalic in the uk,extracts below.

. That's like reclassifying and restricting table salt. Don't go there!
Oxalic acid is used by the tonne in ship maintenance and restoration.
If they do reclassify and restrict it I'll just brush up my chemistry and extract it from the hundreds of plants and minerals we use or eat everyday.
I suspect the restriction and reclassification applies to the use, storage and application of Oxalic acid as a Veterinary medicine. But that's my guess.


Which food contains the following ingredients?

Water

Sugar

Cellulose

Flavor enhancer

-E621 monosodium glutamate

Colors

-E160a carotene

-E160d lycopene

-E101 riboflavin

Antioxidant

-E300 ascorbic acid

Acids

-E330 citric acid

-E296 malic acid

-Oxalic acid

Flavourings



A tomato.

Vets may need to stock many tons of it if this happens,as its used extensively in the timber industry among others,vets could be busy with prescriptions.

Oxalic Acid is used
- by those working with wood, timber & wooden beams
- in removing tannin stains
- in removing rust in automotive shops and in restoring antiques
- in rust stain removal
- Those pre-treating stainless steel
- in preparing & polishing stones & marble
- in restoring furniture as Oxalic Acid bleach
- by Fishermen lin maintaining wood on boats & quays
- by Beekeepers - a 6% solution of oxalic acid in sugar can protect against the parasitic Varroa mite
- as a purifying intermediate in pharmacy
- as a precipitator in rare earths processing


Features
- Concentrate crystals removes tannins and water stains from timber
- Ideal for oak frames and beams
- Can be put to many used due to the flexibility of using crystals
__________________


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## JoeMcc (May 15, 2007)

You can use oxalic to clean the frames....if some gets on the bees....well... hopefully they will be ok.



Joe


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## drobbins (Jun 1, 2005)

Guys, let me be more clear
I'm not asking about the ethics of using oxalic acid or the availability
it's not legal to use it (or anything else that isn't registered) for the purpose of acting as a pesticide in a beehive
at one point the American Honey Board or some similar body was trying to get it approved. You're correct, there's no money to be made selling it but they were trying to get it approved since it works well and is used by many anyway
just wondered if anyone knew if they had made any progress

Dave


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## JoeMcc (May 15, 2007)

Randy olivers site says they are still working on it? 

I hope its ok to cut and paste this....

___________________________

From 

http://www.scientificbeekeeping.com//index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=80

Legality

Oxalic dribble is legal in some countries, but unfortunately not registered as a mite control agent the U.S.. Dr. Marion Ellis and Troy Fore have worked to get it registered in the U.S., but the process went dead in the water. No one was eager to step up to the plate to register OA for varroa mite control, since its widespread availability and low cost make potential registrants doubt that they would be able to recoup the costs of registration.

Breaking news! Dr. Ellis reports that Heather Duncan, EPA region 7 administrator, has taken a leadership role in working to make OA available to beekeepers. She is working with a U.S. company that already has ties to the beekeeping industry to register a packaged product that is labeled for use in beehives to suppress Varroa mites. 

In the interim, oxalic acid it is approved as a wood bleaching agent, it can technically be used in beehives to brighten up one's top bars (hey, there’s nothing like having bright top bars, huh?). It’s only illegal if your intended use is for it to kill mites! 
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drobbins said:


> Guys, let me be more clear
> I'm not asking about the ethics of using oxalic acid or the availability
> it's not legal to use it (or anything else that isn't registered) for the purpose of acting as a pesticide in a beehive
> at one point the American Honey Board or some similar body was trying to get it approved. You're correct, there's no money to be made selling it but they were trying to get it approved since it works well and is used by many anyway
> ...


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## drobbins (Jun 1, 2005)

well I guess I'll just continue to have really "brite" topbars
but I sure wish I could get rid of those mites

Dave


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## JoeMcc (May 15, 2007)

I emailed Heather Duncan.... i will let you know if she replies.

Joe



drobbins said:


> well I guess I'll just continue to have really "brite" topbars
> but I sure wish I could get rid of those mites
> 
> Dave


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## wolfpenfarm (Jan 13, 2009)

why not just stick a tomato in there


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## JoeMcc (May 15, 2007)

I guess we will keep having bright sparkly top bars....

From Heather Duncan....

_____________________________________________________
Thanks for your e-mail. 

EPA has funded a grant to the University of Nebraska-Lincoln (specifically, Dr. Marion Ellis) to test the efficacy of oxalic acid for Varroa mite control in beehives. However, to my knowledge, no application for registration has been submitted to EPA Headquarters, so there's nothing to approve. From what I've been able to figure out, it also sounds like USDA IR-4 has chosen to disinvest in their efforts related to oxalic acid because of the economics related to registration. (Their reasoning: getting EPA approval for a new pesticide is extremely expensive and because oxalic acid is so inexpensive to produce, it's unlikely that a company would ever make back the money they spent.) ...................................
____________________________________________________________


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## brendantm130 (Jan 23, 2010)

How would one use it, and what does it do?


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## JoeMcc (May 15, 2007)

It kills Varroa mites during broodless times in the winter. It is carefully added to sugar syrup and drizzled over the clustered bees. Randy Olivers site http://www.scientificbeekeeping.com/ has info about it.

Joe



brendantm130 said:


> How would one use it, and what does it do?


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## Beeslave (Feb 6, 2009)

wolfpenfarm said:


> why not just stick a tomato in there


That will only work on the Italian strain


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## chillardbee (May 26, 2005)

Sorry to here that guys, I didn't even know the it hasn't been registered yet in the US. I've been using the dribble method for 4 years now and I am quite pleased with the results. I purchased a 25KG bag which was under $50.00 and i have barley put a dent in it after treating 100 colonies over these past four years. since it is only a one time treatment for the year(in late fall) it really is just pennyies per hive for cost of treatment. I'm still quite pleased over the results i get too. there is no or very little capped brood at time of treatment so a lot mites are exposed to the OA.


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